Catch Him if You Can
March came from nothing. Now, he’s the 1%. He made his fortune in oil and cryptocurrency. He’s sweet, handsome and charming. It’s hard to believe he’s still single. Only, it isn’t. Because March isn’t real. He’s a border-hopping Canadian con artist who’s tricked women and men out of over a million dollars. He thought he was untouchable, but now he’s messed with the wrong women. From Pink Moon Studio, this is Catch Him if You Can. The story of Marcel Vautour, his survivors' real time crusade to catch him, and the broken legal system that’s allowed him to get away for over 20 years – told in 7 parts. Written and produced by Emilia King and Maggie Reid. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook and Instagram @catchhimpod
Catch Him if You Can
Déjà Vu
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A year has gone by, and now with the pandemic in full swing, there’s been very little new information about March’s whereabouts. Suddenly, a new tip surfaces that could change it all. March has a new con that we haven’t seen before, and this time, he’s in Toronto.
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SPEAKER_16March O'Tour is the 1%. He made his fortune in oil and cryptocurrency. He's handsome, charming, and has a heart of gold. It's hard to believe he's still single. Only it isn't. Because March isn't real. He's a serial grifter and romance con artist who's tricked women and men across Canada, the US, Vietnam, and the Czech Republic out of over a million dollars. And that's just what we know of. His trail of destruction has led to heartbreak, bankruptcies, foreclosures, and even PTSD.
SPEAKER_09How could you not be a psychopath? How could you ruin so many people's lives and not care and walk away? It's dark evil.
SPEAKER_02Romance fraud, business fraud, investment fraud, medical fraud.
SPEAKER_00You know, they say a really good liar puts some truths in there to make it easier and make the story more believable because he has conviction about that because he knows it's true.
SPEAKER_02He goes by Marcel, he goes by Mark with an M-A-R-C, an M-A-R-K. He goes by Andre, he also goes by Dre. We know him to go by Andy, we know him to go by Martin. We know him to go by March. I think he has a character that he's built for each one of them.
SPEAKER_05He doesn't work. This is his job. He is good at what he does. Hey, you know what? Bravo. You're good at what you do. But we're we're good at what we do too. And we're gonna get you.
SPEAKER_16In episode five, you heard the story of Nicola, a 20-something tourist on a work visa from the Czech Republic, who unwittingly met Mark at a hostel in Toronto and ended up homeless on the streets of British Columbia. You heard how Jody and her partner, almost too easily, tracked Marcel down in Nanaimo. You also heard how, despite the warrants and police reports and barrage of evidence, the police did not care, and Marcel escaped by jumping out of a two-story window. That was in 2019. Over the next year and after the media blitz, new tips keep coming in, but none of them are active. People recognize Marcel from a past encounter and get in touch through the Stop the March Madness campaign. Fast forward to May 2020. Remember in episode one when I mentioned coming across that article with that dreadful headline, duped women go after charming alleged con men, and the social media comments that infuriated me? Well, we're about to come full circle. After reading the article and learning more about the case, my pingpoon partners Maggie Evan and I reached out to the ladies, and over the course of the next four months we begin documenting the stories of Marcel survivors from coast to coast. It's now September 2020, and the pandemic is in full swing. Our two weeks to stop the spread has turned into half a year. By this point, we become close with Jody, Kim, and Andrea, and have a private group chat going between all of us. It's a tough time for me personally. My mom had just been through major surgery and is in the hospital when suddenly Andrea messages the group. It's March. We have March. A flurry of text then becomes this frenzied phone call. It's titled We Found March in my notes. And to our dear listeners, this episode is going to be a little different. It's the first time our cameras and microphones were rolling on an active tip. The episode is captured in the moment, so you'll hear variations in environmental sound and audio quality. I took this call in the hospital hallway. Okay, here it goes. The phone call from a dreary afternoon in September 2020.
SPEAKER_04So runs of international students. Fill me in. So okay, so I get an email from this guy, and he says uh they have uh been a victim and are still a victim of this guy, that he's playing with them. Um they lost uh about $1,500 so far. He lost $15,000 more. They're both foreign students, and uh he's part of the um embassy. So the guy that I'm talking to isn't the guy that's primarily his friend. He's just kind of a friend of the other friend. And uh he said that he took his friend to where he worked at the embassy and turned him around. So it makes it so believable. I don't know how he did that, but I'm sure. And he had another woman with him at one point, so there's probably another lady out there being ripped off. And anyway, so he's like he's willing to help us in any way if we want to uh get him to go somewhere or do something. He's confirmed that he has similar tattoos, he's got the tattoo um on his chest, he's got the tattoo on his legs, he's got a whole bunch on his arms, there are so many he's going into the shower or something, so looking at him like he also said he got his fish after he asked for $2,000 more and uh looked at his uh passport, looked up for his ID and found his passport from Marcel Andrew. And he googled it him and found the website and then he contacted me. So what name is he going under right now? Marcel? Mark. Mark. Okay, so um right now he has no idea anybody's on to him, right? Yeah, I guess he buddy sent me a picture. Make sure before we get to it. It's him 100% him. And he said, Oh my god, he took a picture of his ID. His got his passport. Amazing. It's him 100% him. Okay, how do we get him?
SPEAKER_16After a year of no news as to Marcel's whereabouts, we are on his trail once again. The excitement is palpable. Marcel has been pretending to be a Canadian embassy officer and is taking advantage of two international students in Scarborough, Ontario, one of Toronto's six boroughs. We start hatching the plan to catch him.
SPEAKER_04What I think they need to do is tell students that have just got money, if they have another $2,000, arrange to do the $2,000, but have the police already called ahead of time and have the police watching, and then they go to the bank and they can get footage. That's a good plan. Like so Well then how long will they keep him? Okay, so they'll detain him for uh 48 to 72 hours. I'll call my constable. Are you 100% sure about that? Because we need to serve him with the 20 other like everybody else needs to serve the papers. Yeah, but if once they get him, they can detain him up to seven days, my constable told me. No, and they bring him in for 48 hours of questioning and they think that they don't have enough evidence to release. We can have a constable call their police detachment, say, no, we have a bunch of warrants for this guy, and we've got a bunch of charges against him, and we want him detained for longer, they can hold him up to seven days. Hey, dude, to buy some time. I'm just getting some money wired to me just to get and you know what if he knows he's getting money to say, I have to get some money wired to me because I only have so much money. I have to get exactly no, he already knows they don't even have the money. Like remember, right? Yeah, so like he had to go to the bank to get the money. Like he's always taking for people he don't have because they have no recourse. Why don't the guy pretend that he's like I don't have the money, but yeah, maybe I can get this. I don't have the money or something. You know what? Yes, that's what I was just gonna say. We're just gonna get somebody else involved and say, I got this guy who's willing to help the other people, I got a relative that's willing to whatever.
SPEAKER_16After a few more minutes of back and forth, we hone in on a path.
SPEAKER_04Okay, so what's our plan? Like, what should we do? Are we gonna go with this money? What about if Amelia just goes to one of the police stations there and shows them like, okay, this is what we're up against? You got a warrant in Quebec, you got a warrant in Web. Why did I do that? We can fight from other places and trial. Yeah. So that we don't so that we don't appear that they're entrapping him, right? But what if what if we just told them we know exactly his location and then in like as soon as possible get those files to this car to I can just down the street like a trick on anywhere around here, and then maybe they could just go get them. Would that work? Could they just pick them up? No, because it could work last time. Like that last time we called it and they said there's no warrant only in Quebec and in Manitoba. So uh the warrant can require a pickup.
SPEAKER_16We begin realizing this is similar to what happened in Nanaimo and with JB in Nova Scotia.
SPEAKER_04Let's look at this how it's happened in the past. So JB gave him money, and the police said there's nothing they can do about it because he gave them money. Isn't breaking the law. He isn't breaking the law. They have to get him on a phone saying, Are you like, are you gonna pay me back? Like, when do you think you're gonna pay me back? What are you needing the money for? That's the shit that we have to get. That's what we do, and then but then we have to get the money, right? So that's gotta be the thing, and the cops can maybe help us with that. Like, look at we've we've got what if I just go to push people right now and like quickly ask them what here's the situation. What do we do right now? Like, what can you believe? They might look at his work and say, Okay, yeah, we can probably push the Winnipeg warfare and get it extended, and we'll pick him up and transport them to Winnipeg. Winnipeg is a big uh a one that fills the one in code that marble marble. Marvel, yeah, yeah. And then we have other victims there that if they know that if you contain him, they might come forward. They might pick him up because he's right next to our codecs and he's right next to the manifold. They didn't do it last time, why are they gonna do it this time? Because the last time they were in he was in T and Winnipeg, which is three provinces over. We have an interior. We're at the same situation again. It doesn't occur for Amelia to go. Yeah, luckily I have that all on my phone. Yeah, I'm not gonna be able to do it.
SPEAKER_16So I leave the hospital and Uber to the closest police station. I come up to the doors, and to my extreme frustration, it's closed. There's a sign that says, due to COVID-19, you can't just walk into the station. They're closed to the public. It's anticlimactic. As I make my way back to the hospital, I message the ladies in the group chat. From there, everything happens so fast. Kim catches the first flight out from Victoria to Toronto. I head home after a long day at the hospital. It's now the weekend. The next morning, me and Evan, who's our co-founder and in-house cinematographer, and also happens to be my husband, race over to pick up Kim from her hotel room and make our way to Scarborough, where Marcel has been conning the international students. Over back and forth tax, Andrea arranges our meetup, a Starbucks next to where they've been living and where Marcel has been staying. Their names are Fan and Andre. Fan is from Vietnam and Andre is from Ukraine. FYI were excited. So there's a lot of talking at once and a lot of cars whizzing past. We learn a lot from this conversation. Here's Fan telling us how he first came to meet Marcel Andre Vautour.
SPEAKER_08I met him in June. Uh I was in downtown in Toronto because at that time I was walking on the pavement and then I talked to my mom. But I talked um by Vietnamese because he knows Vietnamese. He he was standing right behind me and then he said, Oh, hi, um, he just came to me and said, hi, oh, are you Vietnamese? And I said, yes, I'm Vietnamese. And then uh he he he talked with me by Vietnamese and then and then he he started talking to me by Vietnamese and then we just start talking, talking, talking, and then he told me he worked in Vietnam and then I said, oh wow, he lived in Vietnam, he has wife, he has family in Vietnam. Oh wow he's black.
SPEAKER_16He said he has a family in Vietnam? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_08He's he told me like um his wife always abused him like to take a lot of money from him.
SPEAKER_16So it was a chance meeting in downtown Toronto that put Marcel in fans' path. We asked the guys more about what Marcel told them about himself. The story is different from what we've heard before. By the way, he's going by Mark again. This seems to be his Toronto name. He used it with Nicola.
SPEAKER_11Okay. So for us, he told us that uh he was working, he's working for embassy first of all, for government.
SPEAKER_02In Vietnam.
SPEAKER_11So he's working for Canada but in Vietnam. Okay. Okay. So he was his friend from MBC. They went to just like have fun in Vietnam. They went outside of the city. Right. They went outside the city. And they met some lovely people there. They had like a house, it was in a village. They had like a small party there, they were staying over. He met the owner's house. He had a like a daughter. So basically it's five daughters of the guy they met there. Then they had uh some sort of relationship. She was like family in Vietnam, he fixed it, they didn't know English nothing. So what he told us, he married her because she got pregnant, they moved to Vietnam, and they were staying in the house with basically.
SPEAKER_02So we've always thought that this is time, but he has told other people that it's not. So most of the victims didn't even know he had children anywhere that he'd ever been married. And he's got three children here and actually. So we always thought that this was definitely mixed, definitely, other pictures.
SPEAKER_11Yeah, we only had one picture, though, this was I was really surprised.
SPEAKER_08Yeah, okay, so we start talking and then uh and then he told me he worked in Vietnam everything in Vietnam and then I and then I said oh what do you do in Vietnam? So he told me, oh I worked for InvaC uh in Vietnam. Like he worked like he worked for InBacy in Canada, but in Vietnam. And then and then I really surprised because uh uh and then and then after that he asked me my phone number and then we uh and then he started um chatting to me at that time.
SPEAKER_16Over the next few weeks, Mark and Fan start spending more and more time together. Eventually, Fan introduces Mark to Andri. The guys tell us that Mark then attempts one of his tried and tested scams on Fan.
SPEAKER_11He asked Fan to take a number for his name, take a phone on his name, fan's name. And it was iPhone, 11. But he returned it already. Because I insisted, I told Fan, like, it's risky, you don't know him, you pay for him money, like what if he stops?
SPEAKER_16Andre isn't as trusting as Fan. Fan then tells us Mark wasn't happy when he asked him to return the phone.
SPEAKER_08And then you know the day after, I told him, Oh, uh Mark, I'm so sorry because I'm just afraid anything uh uh bad happens. So I think we should catch up with that. You know, he's very mad at me. He very like seems like breaks it, and then he he told me like I get in trouble, anything, and then it seems like he he makes me feel really bad, like everything is.
SPEAKER_02So he is known to do that with phones. He one time bought ten phones under another guy's a victim's credit cards, got all the phones, and then he started.
SPEAKER_16Mark also establishes his cash flow problems early on, explaining why such a high-level embassy official always needed money.
SPEAKER_08It's like because you know every time he keep he keep asking me money because he has this problem, that problem, yeah, like he he told me oh uh he's war for embassy, like his laid off, so right now he he doesn't have enough money.
SPEAKER_16Oh, he was laid off at the embassy?
SPEAKER_11Yeah, because I met in trouble before he told us he moved from the story is he was living in Vietnam working for embassy. He has family there, everything was really good. Because when coronavirus started, he told us they deported him back to Canada because there is no job in Vietnam, embassy's closed. He's working here now. Yeah. Okay, it was quite realistic anyway.
SPEAKER_16Here's Fan and Andre on why the whole thing felt so believable. One thing you'll realize is that Andre is finding out new information here too. Fan doesn't always let Andre in on everything.
SPEAKER_08He actually took you, tell telling the story how he took you to the office. It's like kind of like the office, like a small office, but you know, like when it was there, he I thought maybe he's just makeup, like in Basic, like he has his name, everything like it makes me feel trusted.
SPEAKER_16Yeah, he had he had an outfit in it.
SPEAKER_08Yeah, yeah, uh outfit.
SPEAKER_16He doesn't he just had a name tag and then just like um dude.
SPEAKER_08It was close to um downtown, but just um small one. I I I don't I don't remember the uh exactly um the address, but because it took me from there.
SPEAKER_16Okay, he picked you up there. Why why did he take you there? What was the point?
SPEAKER_08I don't know, because he he he he he okay, he just told me all I I won't right now if I want to visit because at that time I told him I wasn't done. And then he told me all I won't uh in here, so if you want some um you can I can visit him. So and then he just tell me to go there with it, just to start the outside. You see other people there with name pages as well. Just him. Just him, just him, just him.
SPEAKER_16Yeah, so I'm working.
SPEAKER_08But I I I don't know what exactly he does inside. I just I just stand in there and then I said, hi Mark, that's it.
SPEAKER_16And he was um from the inside, but you didn't see him. Was he working inside, or you just kind of saw him coming?
SPEAKER_11I just saw him.
SPEAKER_16Okay.
SPEAKER_11And he just could have like took him to any building.
SPEAKER_16And then been like, yeah, hey, I'm c I'm just coming out, I'm coming to meet you, call me when you're here, kind of thing, right?
SPEAKER_06Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_16So Mark doesn't just tell Fan he works at the embassy. He shows him. Or so Fan thinks. Fan had very little reason to doubt Mark at that point. There was more to the story about Vietnam, too. More details that Mark shared about his predicament with his ex-wife that made his sudden need for money seem plausible for a while.
SPEAKER_11So the story I didn't finish about Vietnam. So like he told us he moved here, all of his property, all of his flaws, almost everything. He just took it back with his items, everything he left in Vietnam. So he basically only had money. But then because of his wife, he told us he told us he cheated on him or something. So they're again going to through the divorce. She's now asking for money, because like he has a lot of he has a comparation in Vitamin.
SPEAKER_16Apparently the divorce is messy.
SPEAKER_11Okay, and now she asked, she asks a lot of money from him because when because illegally not have a tax divorce, but when they are divorcing in Vitamin, they're splitting all of the all of his items like a condo has to sell it.
SPEAKER_16So he's waiting on this money that's tied up, basically.
SPEAKER_11Basically, he paid her money just to not to do this, but he keeps all his stuff in Vitamin. He doesn't have to sell it, they divorce it nothing, but he has to pay money to make up.
SPEAKER_02Did you get a name for her?
SPEAKER_11He he called her tan.
SPEAKER_02T-A-H-An. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_16Marcel has used the name Tan before with other victims, claiming she was his ex-wife as well. We then asked Fan and Andre to tell us how Mark's scam worked this time.
SPEAKER_11So, like, I have to work a little bit for my own program in order to evaluate it. Right. But I have to, because I'm an international student, I have to apply for work a bit.
SPEAKER_05Yes.
SPEAKER_11I did apply, and uh it usually takes four months to get it proof. I was waiting, I've been waiting for like six months already. For some reason. I and they don't really tell you the reasons, so you don't really know. Yeah. And I was a bit worried. So when I met Mark and he was working empathy, he actually asked me if I need some help. Like he can check my application or something. He can tell me if everything's going alright. And I was like, why not? Friendly thing is good. So he checked me like he doesn't know because like if he doesn't do the thing, he's only working with immigration. If he doesn't improve working with the only best friend, Mike, Mike, yeah, Mike is a common thing best five.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, Mike.
SPEAKER_08Mike is best friend, like working in basically.
SPEAKER_11They were both working in Vietnam, they both came here, they both work here. Mike is working with approving the decline work permits, and Mark, he's just his job in embassy was to be like more customer. He was communicating to people who like he was responding to emails, he was talking to applicants.
SPEAKER_16So Mark can't get the work permit done, but Mike can. And apparently, Fan even met Mike, or someone Mark alleged was Mike at a Tim Hortons, of course. Anyway, Mike could apparently help Fan and Andre.
SPEAKER_11He decided to decided to help me and he offered me to text. So he contacted Mike, and the other day he told me that Mike took took review on my profile. He's also not responsible for my application, there other people are. But Mike told him that it's taking six months already, so it's supposed to be probably most of all it will be decline because it's taking way too long. Usually it's getting decline. And he offered.
SPEAKER_16So Mark says his friend Mike can help Van and Andre. Van wants to get his permanent residency, and Andre needs a work permit. Andre pays Mark six hundred dollars for Mike to check on his work permit application. And Van pays a thousand dollars for help securing his Canadian permanent residency. A few weeks after he supposedly got Mike to look into Andre's permit, it gets approved.
SPEAKER_11That's right, the time is the right way for him.
SPEAKER_16That approval happens early in the guy's relationship with Mark. So it gives him some initial credibility. Kind-hearted Mark even offers to help Fan out of another bind.
SPEAKER_08He he also told me like he know the CEO in uh in Coca-Cola because you know at that time, at that time I've I'm trying to look up the job for Coa. And then because he told me like he worked for InBayC, and then I realized, well, maybe he can help me to find a job because at that time I really need help uh until until right now. I really need help. And then he told me, oh, we uh I know um the manager or CEO in in Coca-Cola, he's named Tony, and then maybe uh I can ask him to in Coca-Cola, they they do co-op job uh relate to my program, and then and then he told me uh he can help me out, and then you know, I just give him my resume.
SPEAKER_16Mark even has fan meet Tony in person, just for an initial chat. The formal interview was supposed to come later. Here's where things get even more interesting. I already mentioned that fan is more trusting than Andre. When you meet him, you immediately get a sense of his deference. He also doesn't like letting people down. It's clear that Mark narrowed in on this right away. Listen to how Mark ends up getting Fan on the hook for even more money.
SPEAKER_11So then Fan asked him, let's tell all of the story. Fan asked him for some reason, without my not knowing that he will make PR for me, permanent residence.
SPEAKER_16Oh wow, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_11So basically, that's what what the rest of the story is. But he didn't ask nothing me yet, yeah. Yeah, just doing it.
SPEAKER_16After that, Mark starts calling Andre, who at the time had no idea why.
SPEAKER_11He was calling me, it was like two weeks, and I didn't really know what's going on. He asked me for four more hundred, and I told him no. I told him absolutely no, I will not pay, man. I don't know, like whatever it is, you know, you can pay for your half. And if case approved, I will pay you back 400. But he told me like he will do it, he'll pay 400 for me.
SPEAKER_16He said that.
SPEAKER_11Yeah, but what actually happened, Fan? He contacted Fan, and Fan paid 400 for me, right? That's how he works. That's how he works. Let me tell you why, because at that time there were a lot of stories that Fan asked him not to tell me. Like he didn't want to make our relationship worse or something. I see Mark, he realized like Fan doesn't really tell me everything, so he can more talk to him, more pressure on him.
SPEAKER_16So, Mark found a way to use Fan's kindness against him and convinced him to pay extra for Andre's PR, even after Andre told Mark he wasn't willing to pay anymore. Kim and I then ask more about where Mark's been staying. First, they tell us Mark claims the embassy covers his living expenses, including Airbnbs. And he stays in Airbnbs a lot.
SPEAKER_11I saw him aired being B account recently. Oh you should show me he showed me his history just just to prove his story of the city.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah, because it says Mark?
SPEAKER_11I didn't know because all I saw is just a screen scrolling with all the history, but it was like in the pair comp in the last couple of months, it was like 30 maybe.
SPEAKER_16Oh my god.
SPEAKER_1130% of the old days, like out of three months, one month in total he's spending in Airbnbs.
SPEAKER_16Andre remembers Mark showing him he had 30 bookings in the last three months. Kim and I then wonder how Mark framed staying with Fan and Andre if he claimed his lodging was covered through work.
SPEAKER_08I I asked him to come. Fan is really kind. Because you know, I at that time I I didn't I I I just trust him. I I I just know him that that that he's working for invasive. So because I I feel I want to kind to him, then I asked him to come. But I didn't know that he's a scammer.
SPEAKER_16Other times, Mark would ask Fan if he could stay.
SPEAKER_08He just told me like uh he wanted to stay just only three days uh in my house because uh at that time he has no place. And then and then three days he told me, Oh, I I still have no place, so just I just extend that to one week, and then he left.
SPEAKER_16So um when was the last time he stayed in your condo?
SPEAKER_08Last Thursday, two days ago.
SPEAKER_16Holy crap, two days ago.
SPEAKER_08Because you know, uh he just he just left last week.
SPEAKER_16He told the guys that despite his substantial salary and having his living expenses covered by his work, divorce costs were making normal living impossible. Mark also partied with the guys sometimes, and when he did, he'd stay over.
SPEAKER_11I had party with our celebrating Independence Day of Ukraine, and it was a time when he was staying like three or four days in a row in our place. I was hoping him to, you know, get out. But I kindly offered him to stay with us if he wants, but he had he he told us he has to go to where? Ottawa, yeah, for some business he job he had. That's why I plan to make party that day because at least he's leaving. Yeah. But he came for the party actually, and we had a good time on the season. After after the party, he offered us to go to strip club or something. You know, he had a party. We had two two women, and one of them had the breakfast in front of me. He was trying to talk to her, she's like 20 years old. He he's he's paying attention to any girl he sees around. Yeah, and you were in in Scarlet Town Center? He was checking out everybody. Every guy, every everybody he likes. He was like, Oh, look at that. Oh my god. Even during the conversation, that's all he does. He's just hunting around.
SPEAKER_16Yeah, the guys say Mark would show off pictures of women he's been with in the past.
SPEAKER_11He showed a lot of pictures from different countries.
SPEAKER_16Yeah, different women.
SPEAKER_11Because he likes women, it's obvious he showed a lot of women. Naked women as well, but mostly like a lot of you know, he's like trophies like this country, that country. Basically, one night stands, usually, but like he just does like he talks about them like trophies. He can describe like what kind of woman she was.
SPEAKER_16Mark was a big fan of Tinder. He even brought a woman over to stay the night at Fan and Andre's. Her name was Tracy.
SPEAKER_08It's c it's probably 2 or 3 a.m. He called me and then he told me like uh tray uh because it's midnight, so TTC is stuck because Tracy's lived so far, so uh he asked me, like, oh, can I pre-bring Tracy to to you to to my place? And then I said, Oh, okay, okay, okay. And then he he just bringed Tracy to go there because uh that time it's my first time meet meeting her. Yeah. Mark told me she's a pilot. She flew with uh Cafe Pacific. I didn't talk to Tracy so much because it's it's very late, and at that time I'm very tired. I'm very like want to sleep, yeah. And then they he just but brought Tracy to my room and then he he kicked me out uh in the late room.
SPEAKER_16The guys recall a bunch of small details about Mark.
SPEAKER_11He likes coffee, he drinks every morning. He showed us pictures of a sealboat he had before. Yeah. There were two jet skis in the very end. So he loves motorcycles, he showed us Harley Davidson he has in Vietnam.
SPEAKER_16Yeah.
SPEAKER_11He's planning to buy one here.
SPEAKER_16They tell us about his vices too.
SPEAKER_11You know what they just realized? Mark never drinks beer? Never. He drank a lot, but like he drinks black rum, he drinks different alcohol, but he told us because I offered him beer so many times he never even took a smell of it. He told us he's getting really aggressive out of beer when I got my work too many proof, they'd call him to sank. I think he was under drugs at the time because his voice was just different. But yeah.
SPEAKER_05Like weed drugs or no, no, no, like hard drugs.
SPEAKER_11He also told he has a brother addicted to drugs.
SPEAKER_02Oh no, now it's a brother. Because it's a sister. He killed his sister off in the last story. So yeah, now he's just killing everybody. He's just killing all his family members off. Oh my god.
SPEAKER_16Mark also apparently had health problems while he was with the guys, as per his usual MO.
SPEAKER_11Oh, so he might he met Mark in the hospital.
SPEAKER_16You met Mark in the hospital?
SPEAKER_08Yeah, but just outside. Because he he called me, like, oh, just waiting outside. I'm from the hospital and then I came here. Yeah, I just wait outside. But I didn't get the inside because that COVID. Why did he get to you in the hospital? Yeah, yeah. Because he said he was sick. Oh, he he has a picture. He showed me his picture.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, this could be a previous. We're not too sure. Like, let can you see her on the screen here? Because he's wearing a mask, so it would be more recent.
SPEAKER_11Yeah, I think.
SPEAKER_02It would be more recent because he's got a wearing mask on, so yeah.
SPEAKER_11I think he's staying around the hospital in that area somewhere. Because I don't know, but for reef reason he's in hospital, but apparently he's actually has some problems with Crohn's?
SPEAKER_02Did he tell you that Crohn's?
SPEAKER_11No, only saying kidney stones.
SPEAKER_02Kidney stones, so that's a kidney stone. That's a new one. So it's usually chest pain or Crohn's disease, so that's a new one, kidney stones.
SPEAKER_16The ladies have been able to determine that Marcel often hops between hospitals, even when in the same city. As a nurse, Kim says you just don't do that because normally you're after a consistency of care. The ladies wonder whether he's after drugs, but they can't be sure because those records are private. Overall, Andre says that Mark is really good at what he does.
SPEAKER_11I don't know how come, but he's very strict to his story. Like he's really he really knows his play good. I don't know. He plays a role amazingly. Even when we were at a party, like he was really drunk, but he's still like, you know, he knows his story so perfectly, nothing evil. Like all the plans he has, he always knows about them, even though they're not real.
SPEAKER_16So we asked the guys how they eventually came to realize who Mark really is. Andre always had his suspicions. But for Fan, it was only after broken promise, after broken promise. He never did get that interview at Coke. And it totally screwed him over at school.
SPEAKER_08He usually promised me like I can get a job in Coca-Cola, and then you know, I until right now I didn't get any uh interview, and then you know, my colleagues keep asking me about a co-op, and then right now I'm stuck, I really stuck every time he promised to me like uh I have an interview, and then you know, at that time he just find the reason like to cancel my interview. He showed me the text from Tony because I don't know if Tony is real or not, but uh but he but he showed me the text from Tony from Coca-Cola.
SPEAKER_16Hi Mark, I'm so sorry to inform you that I will not be able to have our meeting with you and fan as I have a family medical emergency in Montreal. I deeply apologize, but family comes first. I might have to reschedule fan interview as well, as I'm not sure how long I will be in Montreal. There were also a few other red flags that stood out to Fan.
SPEAKER_08He he he spent one week uh to to to live in my condo last week, and then last Thursday in the morning we got uh Andrew um going to war and then I still uh sleep and then uh he he calls me and then he told me oh fan um can can you please give me um to to stay in in my condo like one more one more day because right now I still have no place. I feel really don't like it, but I can't say no. Yeah you can't say no I can't say no, but you know in in my part of my heart I don't like it because I know Andrew he doesn't like it, but I can't say no to him. I told him, okay, Mark, you can come, but I'm but I think Andrew he he doesn't like it, and then and then he he told me like oh just just only one night. I uh just only one night, and then I talked to Andrew, and then I I told Mark like okay, you you can come. And then uh on that day he he just came for a couple of few minutes and then he just left his bag up there and then he gone away.
SPEAKER_16Fan then meets Mark and Andre at an Asian restaurant down the street. While he was at the restaurant, Fan was fighting a nagging feeling that something wasn't right. He calls one of his friends from the restaurant washroom.
SPEAKER_08I have one friend, he's Vietnamese too. He he used to talk to him, and then I I told him, like, okay, um, I need to talk to you because I feel very weird about Mark. And then and then you know, at that day we were in the restaurant and then we tried to talk. Okay. First thing I I really like, I really feel weird about him because if he worked for InbC, invasive. Because um I know people who work for Inbasey, he he doesn't want to show he he he they they don't really want to tell people like oh I work for invasive. But this guy, he meet everybody, like my aunt in here, my broker in here, and then he just said like oh I work for invasive, and that's why I feel very weird about that. The second thing, if he if he worked for invasive, he was born in Canada, but he has no house, no place, no car, always borrow money from me. I think that's why I feel really weird. And then the third the third thing, he promised me anything, but I didn't see it. Yes, I didn't see any conclusion. Anytime he just promised me, and then he told me, Oh, you have to wait, you have to keep patient. I share any kind of story to my friend from Vietnam, and then he told me, Okay, Fan, you have to leave, uh you have to come home early because it's still here, uh it's still here. He's at the restaurant. And then when when it came to my home, I I video called that friend, and then he and then I told him, okay, he left the bag in here.
SPEAKER_16Fan tells us that Mark never left his backpack unattended whenever he was over.
SPEAKER_08When when he when he was living in my room, when he goes to the washroom, he just takes the bag in there. And then I just told him, hey, why you take why why you take the bag in there? You just take the clothes in there, why you take the whole big bag in my washroom, just only take the shower for five minutes.
SPEAKER_16With some encouragement from his friend, Fan takes action.
SPEAKER_08And then that friend told me, okay, try to find the ID, the piece of ID or driver license or anything, and then took a picture. And then at that time, my friend told me, uh, okay, try to try to find the ID. And then luckily, I found the passport.
SPEAKER_16Fan takes a picture of the passport. His friend then googles the name on it. Marcel Andre Vautour.
SPEAKER_08That guy in that, he looked up that name on Google and then and then he found, oh my god, Fan, you have to trust me. This oh my god, a lot of criminal history in here. And then I tried to Google on that time again, oh my god, I he lied to me. Everything he lied to me, and then you know, and then you know, he just came home and then I said, Oh my god, I I I I hey hey, I hey, I I I have I have to I I have to put the passport in uh in his back. It just it just knocked the door and then Fan opened the door for me and then okay, I just wait a minute. Yeah, and then and then I just I set up everything and I just normal.
SPEAKER_16You're acting normal.
SPEAKER_08Yeah, but you know, I acting normal, but inside my body I'm very scared about that. Of course. I couldn't sleep whole night and then I text to Andrew, like, oh my god, Andrew, you have to trust me.
SPEAKER_16Fan says there were other things in the bag he did not expect.
SPEAKER_08He was looking for passport in his bag, he found like 20 credit notes. Yeah, like a bunch of credit cards, but it seems like it's not on his names. Not in his name.
SPEAKER_16As we're sitting there at the Starbucks, Marcel is texting Fan and he's not happy.
SPEAKER_11He was laid off very recently, what he told us, because of Fan. Because of he's he's always taking him somewhere, he's asking him to go for a party. We ask obviously buying him for a party here. He took him to give his cell phone back, and like all these stories he he made against his own. He tried to blame Andre's everything is. I'm laid off because of you, because you take me there, I'm working, I can't, my schedule, like I have to do.
SPEAKER_16So he's trying to guilt trip you into believing it's your fault that he's laid off. So that was in this shitty position, now you gotta compensate. Mark is now putting pressure on Fan to pay him the rest of the money for the work he and Mike supposedly did to secure Fan and Audrey's permanent residencies. Which have not even been approved. The guys are trying to stall. They've told Mark Fan's mom was hesitant about transferring the money, but now is having issues out of the way. At the same time that we get the police interest. The whole situation is so complicated. Remember, we can't just walk into a police station illegally. We actually have no idea what to do. We're now exchanging information with Fan. He's sending us Mark's messages, pictures, emails, and other evidence from his phone.
SPEAKER_11How long is it gonna take to get the documents moved? Because you have a bit stressed relationship now, he's waiting for money. I know, yeah, we are procrastinating the deadline.
SPEAKER_16What we're doing is we're talking to a police officer today at 1 p.m. So we'll be able to find out more of what their recommendation is for like how to move forward.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, like because we have to be careful that we're not doing like an entrapment, or they can't use that in court, like if we entrap him. But what's interesting here is that he's got money from you in the way that he has got money from you.
SPEAKER_11He was pretending to be a government or something.
SPEAKER_02Yes, that's big.
SPEAKER_16That's huge. Maybe if there's any like any text messages from him saying I work for the embassy, or yeah, like if there's any.
SPEAKER_11I recorded I recorded our conversation, it's like a bit more than one hour, a very recent one.
SPEAKER_16Good for you.
SPEAKER_11It was all about the PR and work permits.
SPEAKER_16This was huge. Through Andre and fans' quick thinking, we now have Marcel on tape pretending to be a Canadian embassy officer. Literally in the process of conning these guys. It had to be worth something to the cops. Before we move on to what happens next, I want to play you some of that secret recording. It really brings to life Marcel's duplicity, his commitment to his lies, and his desperation. So it's Mark, Van, and Andre on this recording. Here's Mark trying to convince Van not to cancel his permanent residency application and to pay him back for the work that he and Mike had already supposedly put into securing all this for $2,400.
SPEAKER_15Yeah, because fuck, you're all, you're all, you're you guys are all there, you just have to wait. You're all ready to get it. Legally, normally, without any without any issues, that if we turn around and cancel and November comes, he might not get it, depending on what the safe circumstances are gonna be in the near future, because we don't know about the coronavirus.
SPEAKER_11So that's a thing I don't understand. We understand, but anyway, like this the fact that you asked to make PR for me when I didn't ask for that. That's what I don't like.
SPEAKER_15You understand that PR is not just one thousand or eighteen hundred or two thousand, how much is it?
SPEAKER_10It's like five to ten, man.
SPEAKER_15That's what you told me once. But that's that's what they charge, in between five to ten thousand, right? So for me, because I know you you you you guys were students and don't have a lot of money, what I decided to do, which I told you, was to work Mike's hours. I don't know if you understand that part. I understand. So I had to work 16.5 hours for Mike. Mike makes 4250 an hour. Right? So basically, when I work for Mike, it's like I'm working for free for you, basically. So Mike, Mike said there was a balance of 24, 2400 was the 400. There was 2400, there's still a 2400 balance. So I thought it was 26, but it was 24. So Mia was doing that as a favor for you for later on when you get PR, you could have paid me back. The 2000 would have been okay because everybody would have been settled. That's fine, so I'll work my tower. But with with the whole divorce, my lawyers, yeah, uh finding new work for uh job for your co-op, uh, my life in general. A lot of pressure you're creating for marketplace. It's a lot, a lot on my plate, you know, like don't think me wrong, but it's a lot.
SPEAKER_16Listen to how ridiculously detailed his explanations are, and how matter-of-fact he is in what he's saying.
SPEAKER_15A lot of things that I don't I I don't really need in my life because when when you we apply for when we do PR for someone, this is how it works. The guy comes or the girl, I want to get PR. They pay, they wait, they get, and nothing is said, nothing, they just everything is done, and there's no pressure. They just wait. You know, some people, and they and in Vietnam you can check in Vietnam, you can call in Vietnam and ask many people to get PR in Vietnam. If they're in Vietnam coming to Canada, it's in between 50 to 80,000 US. You can ask anybody, anybody, that's what they pay. Here in Canada, because you are always in Canada, it's less. 5,000 to 10,000. In India, it's 50,000 plus. So Mike, Mike thinks like this. Why am I doing this? Why am I doing this for almost nothing? While I could just get one person uh from India I'd make 50,000. So then I said to Mike, no he's a friend. Uh give him a cheaper price. Well, my friends, remember? He's considered you know close to family. So meeting says, Well, work my hours. If they don't have the money, there's there's a balance of time. 2400 left work my hours to come up to work to to come up with the 2400 so yeah I said okay so I started working his hours so I worked 16 and a half hours until my boss caught me with Mike's computer logged in under Mike's name so when when my boss seen that and the whole cancellation of the phone it it it triggered them you know like why are you working Mike's fall under Mike's name and remember how fan told us that Mark blames being laid off on him here's the logic behind that one and I had to come up with a story in my head I can't say well it's for fun you know so I had to come up with a story to them to say okay listen so me and Mike that's why I had to talk to Mike right away I had to call my coworker to see where Mike was so nobody would know.
SPEAKER_08I had no phone I could not contact my coworkers I could not tell them yo I'm not at work right now but go to my computer I'll give you my password and log in so they know that I'm logged in at least but I was 45 minutes late because you had at the beginning when we went to get the phone fund you said don't worry can I put it on my name I said I only needed for two weeks remember okay there hasn't been two weeks I'm just wondering why why the decision changed so much quick be honest you know you can we can be all honest we're friends you know you'll notice Andre is playing along here sort of being Mark's hype man to make him feel like someone's on his side listen to how much pressure Mark is putting on fans Mark that's so such a lot for you as I told you I'm just afraid something happened like your your credit like um it's getting wrong or something and then the money can't pay them and then they're going to find me because it's undermining. Do you understand?
SPEAKER_15Well you have to say that from the very beginning because I would have never got the phone but for me it created a whole pack of worms it created a lot of problems you know like and then my boss came to me and gave me a written report and he looked at me and says uh two weeks no pay um and he reprimanded you have to go to I have to go in front of a board now to fight my case to keep my job and and I've never in 21 years had this issue at all which is hard for me it's very hard when this all happened Mike and he said you can't work for me anymore just tell them tell them to pay me but you guys can't because you don't have the capital you know you told me you don't have the money to pay talked to Mike last night he's like yo bro I I worked for that man he's like because I told him I said the only option right I said the only option there is is to cancel or pay up the 2400 and you know he told me he's like yo I worked I got it done I don't know why this is happening though.
SPEAKER_16So me is creating conflicts with him for future here's Mark again keeping meticulous records of completely made up figures just like we saw with Jody listen to the conviction and the sleeve so when I calculated everything so if you if you go 16.5 times 4250 700 bucks so basically basically I'm telling you how much I lost okay plus 70 for the SIM card that I had to go buy because of the phone.
SPEAKER_15There's so much there's probably 800 that I worked for nothing that I lost you understand and and everybody works for money you you you work for money you work for money I work for money you know we all need money to live two days ago remember when I September I had these I called me and I said I have to go to the bank because I have to pay my credit 30% 29.99 credit card it's 29% do you understand 29% okay so 29% of 2000 is a lot of fucking money at the end of the month I have to pay back so me I was like holy shit what do I do now what do I do now what do I do now what do I do now what do I do now so I just went and like I told you I have to pay mic because you didn't have the money to pay Mike right you told me I only had $80 in my account right so I had to turn around take my time from work go to the bank on my break take money go meet Mike give Mike the money go back to work no break. You know what I mean it happens a lot so I take a lot of time for you fine.
SPEAKER_16And here's Mark trying to make Fan feel bad for following up on the coke job he promised him through his CEO friend Tony.
SPEAKER_15It's a lot of time and a lot of pressure and and with Tony I can't guarantee that you're gonna have the job with Tony because I don't fucking know. I can't twist Tony's arm like this and say fucking hurt fun. I can't no but I can't I I am trying but I called him so many times you just have to realize no job for you okay unfortunately he tried his best but I called him like almost every second day while his mom was dying in the hospital. If your mom okay so an example if your mom was in the hospital with COVID dying ICU would you care about somebody that wants a job at your work I guess no well that's how he feels so I I you know he tells me yeah I'll be there on Thursday but I'm not sure because you know I have to deal with my mom I'm sorry I'm sorry. No no it's not okay because I need to for you to understand first. And then I talk to him and then he you know he makes me feel like I'm a fucking idiot because I know what's going on. I know his mom is dying so I would not call him every two days you know but but you ask him but you ask him and me you know because I have a nice heart I do it do you understand but at the end it makes me look like a fool because he's like why the fuck are you calling me all the time so when you asked me yesterday or the day before to call him I called him did not answer no text for a whole day and a half you know what I mean? Yeah there's just a lot of things that that that need to be resolved and I'm not saying this maliciously at all.
SPEAKER_08Next he tries to convince Van he's giving him the deal of a lifetime the money part bothering you I need to know what's bothering him for so I can resolve it's just it's just like um I don't have enough money to do in PR. Because at the first time you told me like there's only a hundred PR you can't get it for a thousand I know but because at the first time you told me that I I know but the work permit thousand bucks I I I got you but PR?
SPEAKER_15No there's nobody that would do it for that price no but there's only one person I know that does it is Mike but nobody would everybody would be applying for PR yeah if you cock just he worked 200 bucks just to make your phone and then he only charges 1000 so he only makes 800 he's gonna say fuck that get the guy from India it doesn't make sense so that's why I knew you had no money and I asked you that I know you don't have money for PR so what I'll do I'll work Mike's hours and then we can settle it after that's what I told you from the beginning. That's why I work Mike's hours remember if the PR cost maybe 1000 I can't have sorry it's not you the balance owing is 2400 bucks that's it what's owing now is 2400 the 400 for Angry and the 2000 for yeah that's it because it's 2400 altogether so if I would count the hours that I worked for Mike which comes up to $800 you know with the SIM card and all the bullshit that happened with the the phone then it wouldn't be 2400 it would be 3200 but I don't count that because what's done is done.
SPEAKER_16Mark even asked to talk to fans mom.
SPEAKER_15That's why I wanted to talk to your mom because to explain the situation to your mom that I had to work for Mike to cover you. So it doesn't cost you right away because you told me I don't have money in the student.
SPEAKER_16And the guilt trip continues as do the fake figures.
SPEAKER_15So me now that I can't work for Mike two days ago I had to go to my bank and give him mic. So that money I needed for me to live because my paycheck wasn't that great because I had a hospital and then I came here for four days and then another say what four or five days another I went two times in the hospital another six days in the hospital four days in the hospital six days in hospital that's ten days out of the month plus another three that's 13 plus two days out that's 15. 15 days so I only worked half my salary I only worked for 15 days so 15 days I get 9700 a month divided in two I got a check for 4300 4400 I only got half my check and then I had to give 2000 to Mike for you.
SPEAKER_16And here's Mark lecturing fan on how to be a good friend.
SPEAKER_15It's wild I I totally know you you have a really good heart fun you're a really good person you know what I mean but you have to understand that people some people because it might it might it might and something might happen in in the near future that you know uh like especially with your friends or co-workers that you have to be careful not to ask them too much because it can be very stressful for them you know and for me it's a little bit stressful to be honest like I'm very stressed I'm super stressed right now because I'm doing a lot for you that I shouldn't even be doing you know what I mean you're just uh friends are just friends but the constant constant like I have like PR like basically the PR the job everything that's in the phone right now you're just creating more problems right so for me it's like everything is coming at me like this bang bang bang but I have still my own issues and myself my own problems at work you know my life uh my condo I can't fucking sell I need to buy something here sometimes you you have to put yourself in other people's shoes you know before bothering them you know I mean and not me no it's not me what I'm saying we're friends if we can't say what we truly feel as friends Vietnam they have a different way right okay don't get me wrong but in Vietnam the Vietnamese people have a different way of um communication yes interaction interaction with people communication you know it's always uh oh yeah I invite you for coffee because you're white and I want to have a business deal with you that's how it works in Vietnam right yeah not here here it's the same as Ukraine I invite you because you're my friend there's no business deal but I never do that with I never do that no I know but you make me feel sometimes sometimes you make me feel like that you know I mean because I just woke up two minutes ago and you still asked me yeah the first thing so Tony Tony's gonna be do you know what I mean and I'm not even I don't have a quarter of my coffee finished yet it's just for me for me for me it's like I hope that Tony comes through because I worked so much for this shit to happen but I can't guarantee because he is his own person. Do you know what I mean? I'm trying so fucking hard your intentions were good you have good intentions I think you have to communicate more with people prior when it comes to their life yeah basically no joke is true. Super super stressed super super stressed lawyer time condo I can keep going huh fucking asshole of a boss checks on my shoulder every day.
SPEAKER_16At this point even though Fan knows that he and Andre are secretly recording you can feel the pressure getting to him listen to how Mark tries to work Fan to do his bidding now don't let your mind blow up fan yeah it's really easy it's pretty easy okay think he needs time now but I need time I need time to focus but did you understand everything that's important did you?
SPEAKER_15Yeah you have to think everything oh go get a coffee sit somewhere by yourself think about everything it's so hard for me to make a decision right it's like do I still should I still keep about PR right but if you explain it correctly to your mom I think she would understand and want you to keep PR to be honest because where we're at right now you're already you're already there you're gonna get PR you're already there I don't know why I mean if you want to cancel that's fine it's gonna create a little bit of issues for me but you're already there I know it's a lot of it's a lot of stress but you know how you're feeling right now? Your mind's gonna blow I feel like that every day let's take a break hard conversation it is it is because it needs to be settled and I think it's normal between friends that things are said truly and upfront and right there. Now it's it's affecting me personally so we just need to deal in a different way. If it's the problem of you finding 2000 for your PR maybe in installments I guess. Don't think this wrong Fana it's just so hard for me to make a decision. There's not really a decision to make because the PR is fucking almost there. Do you know what I mean?
SPEAKER_08Yeah yeah yeah I don't I don't scare I just feel stressed but I need time I need a couple of days to to think about it. No. And then yeah I will I will text you later because you know right now I'm also stuck I don't have a job so my my money also running out.
SPEAKER_16Andre thinks Mark was taking pleasure in the deception.
SPEAKER_11The very last conversation we had he was like really like he was enjoying the conversation because he enjoys none of that we are like so stupid And for Fan the whole thing affected him on a deep level.
SPEAKER_08You know I I that day when I realized that uh he's a scammer yesterday I'm also crying I was crying yesterday.
SPEAKER_16You were crying? Yeah you already saw that yeah we've heard so many stories about Marcel's schemes by this point. But this rare in the moment glimpse really demonstrates how Marcel operates and the callousness of his cons. Kim and I are now thinking this might be the smoking gun. At this point we start to piece together our next steps. Although Kim and I have a call with the police soon we know the guys need a way to hold the mark at bay for a little while longer. Here's what Van has told Mark so far.
SPEAKER_08Two days ago he he he asked me to re he he asked Andre to remind me and then I I told him okay my mom right now I asked my mom already and then she's going to transfer money um to my bank accounts but because to today is Sunday um so the bank doesn't work but it it it will be um come to my bank account maybe uh on Monday or Tuesday.
SPEAKER_16We realize though that Mark is expecting the usual e-transfer so really he has no reason to meet Van in person which means we won't be able to catch him because once he has the money he'll disappear here we are brainstorming. What about for is there any reason that he would have to come over if you asked him like for a favor or something? Like what what could you need from him?
SPEAKER_08Like usually uh he he told me like he has no place no food no nowhere to live and then I asked uh I usually told told him like oh if if you still didn't find a place so you can't come here until you can uh find a new place but right now he has a place do you uh do you like make a lot of Vietnamese food because I know he likes Vietnamese food usually I met a lot of Vietnamese and then when I make and then I just take a picture I send it to him and then and then and then I ask him to come and then I can shut him but you know sometimes he comes sometimes he doesn't as we're strategizing fan gets another text from Mark. Okay I will show you my text.
SPEAKER_16Fan do you think that your mom is going to do the deposit and that I will get on Monday as Mike is asking me also I'm not working for two weeks and I'm a bit worried that I won't have anything to eat. I have $50 left fan reiterates the same message to Mark that the money is coming. We tell him to play it cool. He tells Mark that there's some sort of issue at the bank that the transfer should be happening in the next couple of business days. Kim Evan and I say bye to Fan and Audrey I drop Evan off and then Kim and I head over to her hotel to meet with a friend for lunch could be our muscle if we need to do a citizen's arrest. As we're driving she calls her cop connection he tells her we need to contact a detective who is working in fan and Audrey's area so that's what we do.
SPEAKER_02Here's that call and an inside look at what it's like trying to make headway on this case oh hi I was wondering if I could please speak to a detective okay perfect I'm I'm speaking with an actual detective okay um what I um am calling you about is um I just to introduce who I am my name is Kim and I'm from DC I flew in a couple days ago I have been trying to catch a criminal for about two and a half years now and we got a lead on him on Friday from two people that are being defrauded as we see and I I just met with these two guys so this guy if you leave his name the criminal we're talking about he's got warnings about this and right now we're in the middle of returning actually the Canadian embassy worker getting to the point where it's been two and a half years I've been putting my my money and my hardworking services to this and that's why we're going to the media because we need to get into this like we we have a hotline we've been in Chatham magazine we've been in Reader's IJS we've been on C D C T V C D C radio um we've got production companies money to help us um we're working exclusively right now with a production company which I'll help us get some which we're not and we just want to feel like we've got a big break right now and the fact that this is money said she's something we've got and the fact that these guys are doing something like you know he's impersonating a worker at the embassy from the money to an office with a badge and everything. Marcel Andrewich for data birth is September 25th 1975. I would love to give him a nice birthday present really in September two weeks away because what like I said the the window of opportunities will be in the next 48 hours where we're going to be losing we're gonna lose everything okay so what's happening?
SPEAKER_16So we have to get them to call the detective gives Kim the number for the radio room where Fan and Andre need to call to file their police reports.
SPEAKER_02After that we immediately call them so it's we're gonna be calling the Scarborough district 43 is what you're calling and you're gonna want to talk to the radio room and that's where you file a report we need you guys to file a report because they can't do anything without a police report so remember I said to you right now no wait till you're both there together file your report together okay what you're gonna do is let them know that you have a criminal that is trying to defraud you and even extortion. I told the police officer the detective that if we don't get him in the next 48 hours he's gonna take off where he's gonna change his phone number and we won't see him again and we need to get him. So because what I told him about him impersonating a Canadian embassy officer or working there that he's trying to get you guys um uh permanent residents and he's trying to essentially extort money from you by fraud um this is this is huge him and I decided to mess if we're there with fan and Andrew when they file a report in case there's any issues because of the language barrier.
SPEAKER_11Yeah she's one of the victims of this camera and actually I called the police uh because we want to file a report on him but the thing is that it's gonna take like a couple of hours probably for them to come because they don't know when Well yeah, you know if you can if you can we we would be so kind to influence on that somehow so we can talk to them as soon as possible. To like to speed up the process, maybe you can send um yeah, we understand. Sorry.
SPEAKER_14But again, if you you know it's a time of arrival or time. Yeah, I understand buttons or tell an officer to go there now, it doesn't work that way.
SPEAKER_16We wait hours for the officer to show up. Our initial call was in the early afternoon, and when the officer arrives, it's dark already. Definitely after 8 p.m. After the whole thing is done, we're all stunned and emotionally exhausted. It felt clinical and condescending. Here's me recounting what happened to Evan later that night. Oh, and excuse the squeaks. Our dog is obsessed with his rubber ball. Yes, he speaks to Fan, he speaks to Andre, he goes back to Fan, he says, What made you decide to Google him?
SPEAKER_12Why is that important?
SPEAKER_16I don't know, but he asks him, and then he said, Well, because he keep kept he keep making promises, it felt unnatural, etc. etc. Yeah. What did you find when you Googled him? He said, Okay, I found these articles. He's like, which ones? He's like, uh, I found the CBC article. And I had my iPad out just because I knew that this might happen. So uh he s went to the um exact CBC article and he wrote down a date for the article and he wrote down the information of the article. He's like, what does this article say? Unanswered. So fan said that he is a criminal and da da da da. And then I was like, officer, if you like I could provide you the context. I'm like, I'm just here, I'm gonna, I can get the uh main victim, one of the victims on the phone. I was like, I'm a documentary producer, um, and I'm working with the victims uh on a podcast and video documentary. So then he starts asking me questions about my relationship to the women, and I'm just like, I'm a documentary producer. I was like, I've been working with them on the case, we've been putting together information for many months. Um like, so I'm here because one of the victims, Kim, has flown in from uh British Columbia because this is the closest they've come in years after he's uh and I put it really eloquently in the moment, but I was like, but he's devastated the lives of over 12 women and countless other victims. Um and he's like writing down exactly what I'm saying, different types of fraud that he's involved in, etc. etc. etc. He just wanted a high-level overview because he kept telling us there's more important stuff that's happening right now. He's like, I I just want to get this information and get out. What's interesting, but not really surprising, is how the officer changed his tone when he heard I was producing a show. So first he's like, I want to get out. I want to get this information as fast as possible because I have another case. The detective can deal with it. But then when he heard that I was a documentary producer, he goes, I I just I was gonna say that I just want to get this done as fast as possible so I can call the detective who is working on this case so that he could have all the information. So then as he's leaving, so he gets all this information, he goes, I'm gonna call the detective. This is my goal. Hopefully, detective ro is not off his shift yet. And tomorrow, if for some reason he drops in and you know, the detective doesn't get a hold of you, and like maybe he he even said he's like maybe March. He's like, maybe detective the detective will want to um do a sting, uh he didn't use that word, but he said, you know, set him up. I don't know, I'm just the officer who he reports this. Uh he's like, he'll get in touch with you guys, um, like you and Kim. So then he goes, if for some reason he shows up here, this is the number you call, and they'll send an officer. So then he leaves, he turns to me and he goes, Thank you so much for your work. Thank you for being a documentary producer and helping with their case. He shakes my hand. Yeah, because he's so scared about the media eyes on him.
SPEAKER_12What the heck?
SPEAKER_16So here's where the real kicker comes in. On my drive home, I get a phone call from the reporting officer. He's like, I hi, I'm calling you. Uh I know you're a documentary producer. This is a confidential call, you're not allowed to record it. I was like, okay, I'm driving anyway, like I can't record it right now. I was like, no problem. He's like, I just want to let you know I spoke with a detective and he said he said that uh the women have to get a Canada wide warrant.
unknownOh my god.
SPEAKER_12Yeah, no fucking way.
SPEAKER_16No fucking way. I was like, he's like, yeah, you go to the Supreme Court and you get a Canada. Oh, you just go to the Supreme. He's like, tell them to get a lawyer for this, and there's enough information there to get a Canada wide warrant. I'm like, officer, they've been trying to do that for years. Yeah. Years. Um, short of that, he's like, realistically, tomorrow he would be picked up. Let's say they investigate, um, and then he's let go, you know, a few days later or detained, and maybe he's fined. And then it's a matter of like civil court. I was like, but there's two, there's three wards. He's like, I know, I see those. He's like, but unfortunately they're not in Ontario. He's like, that's why you need the Canada wide. I was like, really? Hmm, you don't say. And then he goes, like, if he's got those credit cards that are not in his name in his bag, and they get his bag, you know, that's another story. Maybe there's more grounds, they'll do more investigations. Uh I was like, okay, so if but if for some reason he does show up tomorrow at Fan's house and Fan is concerned for his safety, he's like, Fan is concerned for his safety? I was like, well, probably. I mean, yeah, he told us that. He's like, wait, he never told me that. I was like, I don't know. I'm just saying, I know that to me he was concerned for his safety.
SPEAKER_12Yeah, I would say, like, well, if you think about it, this guy is running a con should be afraid that the person who's been lying to you when they realize that you know the truth might do something dangerous. Yes. Isn't it pretty obvious that's a good thing? Exactly.
SPEAKER_16He's like, yeah, so even if he tells the officer then that they have to assess it at the moment, it depends on the officer. I was like, okay, but officer, so that number you gave us, fan calls it if this person comes to his house and the police are gonna be there immediately. He's like, Well, I can't say immediately. He's like, it depends on who's on duty and what takes precedence. I was like, so you guys might not show up for hours like today? And he's like, uh, I not not not for hours, but I don't know, there could be a shooting. I was like, okay. Think about where you're leaving this kid. Yeah, so, anyways, he said it's all up to the person on duty tomorrow. I'll tell Dan tomorrow if he is t showing up, he has to call the police then and say he's concerned for his safety. And then they'll escalate it.
SPEAKER_12Yeah, I mean, but will they escalate it the right way? Because the thing is, is like we need multiple things here, right? So let's say he comes there empty-handed and he goes, I'm afraid for my life. Please. Please show up. The entire staying in his bus is blown. Like fan is made at this point, so it's over with those guys. And then if he doesn't have his bag or doesn't have anything else that could be verified beforehand, then like he's like he's exactly like he said, it's a catch and release.
SPEAKER_16The detective also tells the reporting officer that the file is being transferred to the fraud office. The next day, Fan calls Kim, Evan, and I while we're in the car. Mark has been texting him and he's getting impatient.
SPEAKER_08He he told me, yeah, he just texted me. Um uh tomorrow is holiday, so I asked him, hey, it's holiday, you can come to visit us. And then and then he told me, okay, I I would think about that. I might uh uh he might uh to go visit me, but I'm still not sure. Because he he told me like um like he wanted to do the laundry, and then I told oh, just come to my place, visit us, and then do the laundry in my house. So he he told me, okay. So maybe to maybe tomorrow he might come to us, but I'm still not sure, but he might.
SPEAKER_05Okay, okay, that's good, that's good.
SPEAKER_02That's awesome. That's so just just try to keep yourself as calm as possible.
SPEAKER_08He just asked me, like, are you sure that tomorrow uh are you going to do transfer to me? And I said, Yeah, I'm sure with you. Just just the the late meet day, I uh I get the money is on Tuesday. Just um, so maybe uh so he just waited until Tuesday.
SPEAKER_16Oh, good, yeah, Tuesday. So we've bought some time and he might be there tomorrow, so yeah, that's good. So just continue being who you are, okay?
SPEAKER_12Yeah, exactly, natural, don't show you. Don't worry about it. Don't stress about it.
SPEAKER_16Okay?
SPEAKER_08Yeah, sure, sure. Sure. I will. I will try my best. I will I will keep asking him to come tomorrow.
SPEAKER_16Several hours later, and we still have no direction from the police. Kim decides to give the case detective another call to see what the holdup is. We accidentally get transferred to another detective from the same division who tells us our detective is in an interview. He seems familiar with the case though. Here's that call.
SPEAKER_13I believe you were given the advice of once it's assigned to the fraud office, you can follow up with the fraud office on Tuesday, is that correct?
SPEAKER_02So in the when the crime's being committed right now as we speak, on the other side of a on a on a uh a text back and forth, we we can't do anything about that? We have our victims texting us everything that they are what's happening with the criminal mark right now. And he's trying to push them to get money out of them for extortion for products that he can't give them. He's impersonating a Canadian embassy government official, and he's committing fraud, and he's doing it right now, and he's trying to push these guys all day long for this money, and nothing's being done. And so, how do we get this guy? He's on the other side of the of the phone. But this is the this is the problem. We're trying to get some some assistance with this. I don't know. This is this is what we kind of hoping that the police system will do for us, the legal system. Like our hands are tied, and it's it's continuing. I've been working on this for two and a half years because I'm so frustrated, you know. 19 victims I found in two and a half years. My own my own money, my own time, my own energy. I did do a trace. I don't know how accurate it is, but I did do a trace on his phone. And he was first in Toronto, downtown Toronto, and now he's in Mississauga.
SPEAKER_13Okay, um this was happening in the DC area, was it not?
SPEAKER_02In the where?
SPEAKER_13British Columbia?
SPEAKER_02No, no, no. I'm from British Columbia. This is in Toronto. We're talking right in Scarborough. This is the victims are in Scarborough, and the the the guy is traveling between Toronto, Mississauga, and um Scarborough right now. And he's trying to get money right now, actively. Yeah, but we have like this guy has got eight provinces that he's got warrants in.
SPEAKER_13So you know who this individual is? Yeah, you have a name and everything?
SPEAKER_02The criminal? Oh, yeah, I do.
SPEAKER_13Okay. Um, and how do you know he's active right now?
SPEAKER_02The victim, the victims are giving us the information. The ones that filed their suit yesterday or their file yesterday, that's actively he's trying to get money out of them. They don't know what to do because if they tell him to go away, if they pay him, they'll keep him around. If they and then they probably won't get their money back, because that's what always happens, because they gave their money away, even though it's for extorting for a service that can't be provided. However, um, you know, he's gonna get away. And then we're back at square one, and you know, I just spent 37 hours traveling from British Columbia to fly out here and drive out here to try to actually get some action because we got a tip on these guys. These victims were strong smart enough to go and look him up after they took half of his money. Here's where things start to get circular.
SPEAKER_13Okay, so I don't want to cut you off, but if if you want something done about this, if the if there's a victim that this is happening to in Scarborough right now, then I'm talking to the wrong person. That victim needs to call police, and then then an investigation starts.
unknownWe don't take third hand information for any kind of a report.
SPEAKER_13If there's a victim and they know that this person is trying to extort money from them, then that person needs to call police.
SPEAKER_02Okay. That's how it worked. Yeah, so but somebody came out yesterday, but we were told that it was gonna take days for this to happen. So what do we do in the meantime? We just let them get away.
SPEAKER_13If we have computer information, it doesn't matter uh as much that it's that a day later they can they can track into the IP address and figure out exactly who this person is and what they were doing. And as long as this victim doesn't give any money today, they they're aware that they're that somebody is trying to extort them. Um obviously they shouldn't be sending money anywhere. I don't understand why they would do that if they know that this is illegal.
SPEAKER_02Because if we don't give him money, he's gonna disappear and then we're back to me now, we're two.
SPEAKER_13But you're gonna turn around and give him money, so you're like that doesn't make any sense.
SPEAKER_16We can barely contain our frustration at this point. I'm squirming in my seat.
SPEAKER_02Okay, so then tell me what makes sense then. So you want them to call you guys because the the criminal um changes his uh ZIM cards out all the time. That's okay.
SPEAKER_13Like we have a computer unit that that can track anybody anywhere. Okay. Um, so that's neither here nor there, to be quite honest with you. But whoever is the victim of this right now currently needs to call police to get a report. Like you're you're coordinating this for other people. We don't do that. We it that is a nightmare.
SPEAKER_02I didn't actually coordinate it, I didn't actually coordinate it for other people. I'm I'm I am trying to uh I know this case better than anybody. These guys are new victims. They're frightened, they're scared of this guy because this guy is intimidating them. They're scared, so they're reaching out to us because I know this guy's MO. He's got a few MOs. I've been following him for two and a half years.
SPEAKER_13Okay, so if they're if they're in a situation where they're being extorted right now, they need to call police and someone will go there, depending on where they live. Doesn't matter if it's in the city of Toronto, we'll send somebody um and take a report.
SPEAKER_02Okay, so what's the difference from them going out to do the report yesterday when it was happening yesterday than today? And nothing was done. The report was taken and it's gonna be passed over. So what's like you just want an extra bit of information? Is that all it is?
SPEAKER_13You you're asking I don't know what you're asking me right now. You're you're saying that somebody is is a victim of an extortion right now.
SPEAKER_02Mm-hmm.
SPEAKER_13And I'm saying that that person needs to call police, and you're saying what's that gonna do?
SPEAKER_02I'm saying that yesterday they did the same thing. They went out and did the report based on the same information, and nothing was being done at that time. So, what does today make a difference? Is what I'm saying. They're still being pressured today. So, do you want the police to go out again today? Is that what you're saying?
SPEAKER_13That information of today's crime, which would be a separate charge of yesterday's crime, uh, would be added to that report of yesterday. We don't want to get half the story, we want to get the whole story. So if it's happening again today, that same victim needs to call again today.
SPEAKER_02Okay, yeah, got it. All right, okay, thank you. All right, thanks.
unknownAll right, bye bye.
SPEAKER_16Kim and I are extremely skeptical about the alleged tracing the detective suggested is possible. This is like so Loomy Tunes. I know. They but also the idea that um they're gonna be able to track a sim cart that's in the garbage is insane. That's not true. Like they could find his latest IP dr IP address, but if he's disappeared, he's disappeared. Yeah. There's n the he they'll track it to a location, yeah, but he'll be gone. Feeling totally deflated, we call Fan and Audrey to tell them not to send any more money based on the detective's advice. Deep down, we know what that will mean for the case. This is not lost on the guys.
SPEAKER_02Police don't want you to give them any more m him any more money. What they do want is you guys to call the police again to the radio room and make another complaint that he's pressuring you guys and show them the the information you have today.
SPEAKER_03You know, yeah, we can make a complaint and you also have proof of that, but the problem is it will completely destroy the relationship, I think.
SPEAKER_02I know. And I told the police officer that too, and he goes, Well, why would you why would you give him more money to stick around? I said, Because you guys aren't doing anything. Like, exactly what else are we supposed to do?
SPEAKER_16The problem is if they send him money now, it's gonna not be a crime because it's voluntary, right? Because at this point they know that you made the complaint yesterday.
SPEAKER_02Like, so it wouldn't be a legitimate crime anymore, it would be probably entrapment because you're willingly giving him money knowing that it's I don't know, knowing that he's a so um if he pressures or pressures, just say, Hey man, like hands are tied, sorry, just it's putting me in a situation, and I just you know I don't have the money, but I just don't have the money, I have to wait till tomorrow and then put it off and then see what the police will do, and then hopefully by tomorrow all the courts are open and the offices are open and everything. Alright, thank you. Okay, so we'll talk to you guys soon.
SPEAKER_16Keep us posted and we'll keep you posted too. Later that day, we get a text from fans saying that Mark told them he might be coming by at 10 p.m. that evening. Kim once again tries to shake the case detective into action, but gets turned down again. So we start laying down the plan for the only thing we can do: a vigilante sting. Here's the call between Kim, Andre, Van, and I. Okay, so basically, we can talk to the police and they're not very interested, but what we think is probably the best route is for you guys to probably call the police in advance, that radio room, and and tell them that you think this criminal from your police report is going to be coming to your house.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, okay.
SPEAKER_16So then what's realistically gonna happen is they are gonna do nothing. And then you're going to one of you, Andre, or you will have to sneak out and call 911 when he's there. Okay? We're gonna be outside with cameras if this happens. Um, so we'll catch the them coming out of the building. But uh, for your safety, obviously, one of you, if he does show up, will have to call 911. So maybe you go outside and you have to take out the garbage, whatever you, yeah, figure it out and and you you do the thing. Fan keeps him occupied, and then um Kim, myself, and Evan will be downstairs with cameras, uh, just so we film it as he comes out. And you guys are gonna be the only ones in the apartment when he's arrested, which means remind the police to take his bag. Say, in his bag, there are credit cards that don't belong to to him. Please check his bag. You know what I mean? You have to remember to check to get them to get the bag.
SPEAKER_03But but what if you he wants car?
SPEAKER_16Then we'll have to figure out tomorrow. I think tomorrow, then you're gonna have to let him down or just stop communication altogether. And the police have the file. You know what I mean? The police have it. And if he ever does show up, then you call 911. The next day, Mark never shows up. We think he could sense something was up. Throughout this entire ordeal, Kim and I had been in touch with Andrea and Jody, who'd been working on the case from their own corners. We update them on the latest status. The next day, Kim is back in BC. We call Nicola to give her an update on the case. But basically, now we're just waiting for the police to follow up from the fraud bureau, which they're not in till tomorrow, because today is a holiday in Canada. So it's sort of just waiting and hoping that they'll take it seriously enough. Yeah, that's kind of where it's been left off.
SPEAKER_02Right? Yesterday they were working hard on the French woman who got taken for 90,000, one of the French women that uh she went to her her station and try to get the warrant extended. And they told her some nonsense that she had to wait to go to the Supreme Court and put it up there. And I said, Isn't that like the legal system's job? Like, you know, you guys see that this guy's criminal, right?
SPEAKER_16And then they said to uh Andrea when she was on the phone with the Quebec police, they're like, Oh yeah, your chance of the Canada wide, he he has to murder someone. Like that's what they said. Nice, eh? Crazy.
SPEAKER_01I'm just wondering what's gonna happen after they're gonna get him. Like uh, you know, what's gonna be the next step?
SPEAKER_02Uh how long he can stay in, I don't know, custody or well if he gets charged on this, he'll be held for a while, and then it might it might require um everybody putting their letters or their police files together and then just uh filing your suit.
SPEAKER_16We're trying to be optimistic, but also don't want to get our hopes up. A few days later, Andre gets a call from one of the fraud detectives assigned to the case. Here's Kim recalling her conversation with Andre.
SPEAKER_03I think the constable part called him, asked him if he was still in communication with uh one today.
SPEAKER_16Yeah.
SPEAKER_03Okay, that's good. I'll call I'll be in contact with you in the next little while.
SPEAKER_16Oh good.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. I left like a three-minute message telling them who I was, what's going on, that I am working with Dan and Audrey and yourself, and that we're um I remote from DC because we got a hit on this guy. You know, we've been talking about for two and a half years, he's got all these dah dah dah da. And I went on and on, and then I said, our concern is that his MO is that he's gonna ditch his phone and uh because he won't get what he's looking for, and then he'll we'll be in have trouble trying to uh he'll he'll go through the cracks again.
SPEAKER_16Exactly.
SPEAKER_03So I think they're pinging their phone right now.
SPEAKER_16Oh my god, that that would be amazing, Kim. After that, nothing. No one, not Fan or Andre or Kim or I hear a single peep from anyone assigned to the case. Fan and Andre tell us that Mark's phone numbers and WhatsApp accounts are all shut down. He's in the wind again. It's deja vu. On the next episode of Catch Em If You Can, Maggie and I speak with the women and share some major updates on the status of the case. Catch 'em If You Can is created and produced by Pink Moon Studio. In partnership with Frequency Podcast Network. It's written and reported by me, your host, Amelia King, and Maggie Reed. Evan King is our post production supervisor. Chris Rennick is our editor. Follow us on Twitter, Facebook, and Instagram at Catch Em Pod.