TubeTalk: Your YouTube How-To Guide

Your Videos Don’t Suck, They’re Just Missing You with SauceStache

• vidIQ • Season 6 • Episode 19

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We talk with Mark from Sauce Stash about blunt feedback, on-camera growth, and building a sustainable creator business without chasing every viral wave. We unpack pivots, sponsorships, community, and the mindset needed to evolve a channel with purpose.

• origin of Sauce Stash and early faceless recipe videos
• the tough feedback that led to on-camera personality
• energy management, multiple takes, and authenticity
• perfectionism in food filming and smarter planning
• success myths vs reality and the creative hamster wheel
• layoff to full-time creator and the early revenue bridge
• AdSense vs sponsorships and long-term brand deals
• brand safety, consistency, and pricing with patience
• evolving from plant-based science to health-focused content
• how to pivot while keeping a working series alive
• testing ideas 10 times with packaging iterations
• building a creator network through persistence
• the biggest beginner mistake: assuming viewers know you
• starting from scratch with relevant 30-day challenges
• closing mindset: fill your cup to help others

Feel free, if you want to, hit that subscribe button

Meet Mark From Sauce Stash

SPEAKER_00

They were a huge YouTuber. And I stopped and I was like, um, I was excuse me. I was like, uh are you from healthy junk food? Later that day he messaged me and he said, um, I started watching your videos. Your videos suck. You're never You're never gonna grow on YouTube.

SPEAKER_01

This is not this is not what you do. Welcome to the only podcast that has more mustaches than you do. I'm Travis here, as always, and I'm here with a very special guest, Mark, from the sauce stash. Two things that I like sauces and stashes. How are you doing? Awesome.

SPEAKER_00

Good. How are you doing, Travis? Thanks for having me.

Origin Of The Name And Early Videos

SPEAKER_01

I'm doing great. We're gonna do a lot of things today that are probably gonna be a lot of shenanigans, but I love that about this podcast. Yes. If you're new here, uh we help you grow your YouTube channel through a lot of different ways. Sometimes we answer your questions and a lot of times we interview other YouTubers that have done it and show you the way forward. Uh and feel free, if you want to, hit that subscribe button. And if you're listening to the audio-only podcast, sit back, relax. We have a lot of information. A lot of information will be in the show notes, so be prepared for that. But with all that being said, let's get into it. Uh, first of all, the name Saustash is amazing. I love sauces and I love stashes. So, how did you come up with that? Um, what what was the the the creation story behind that name?

SPEAKER_00

So the chan well, the the the full creation story. I'm gonna go through as quick as I can. But um my my wife was a uh a blogger at a time. She was uh when we first started dating, she was doing a yoga blog, and uh that was just it was really interesting to me. I was just I was really I thought it was so cool that um she was able to do this blog and she was making a you know money off of it. And and I was like, well, I want to I really want to do a blog. And she was like, Well, you're really great. Every time you cook dinner, you make all these interesting sauces. You should do a blog of all of your sauce recipes. And at the time, uh I think I was like, I was really into YouTube. I was watching Casey Neistat and just, you know, he was he started doing the daily vlog. And I was like, well, maybe I'll do a YouTube channel. I could just do like quick, you know, hands and pants overhead, you know, 30-second sauce recipe videos. Uh so uh uh initially I thought of sauce stash, like the stash of sauces, you know. Um but then we we had a little fun with it and just you know, sauce stash. So that's kind of that's where it came from, sauce stash. And uh the first, I would say the first 15, 20 videos or so were those, they were only sauce recipes. That's all I did. You didn't see my face, it was just hands, it was text on screen, no voice, nothing, just just text and text and recipes.

SPEAKER_01

So when you were doing that, was this based on any particular strategy you had learned, or were you just trying to wing it? And like I think this is what it's supposed to look like.

SPEAKER_00

No, I was just I was really just winging it. Um and it was and it was I was learning to edit. It was the I I I liked playing with video before, but I wasn't like doing anything really deep, you know. Um most of the stuff was just, you know, things I would family vacations and I'd put it to music. Um So it was really just learning some learning some editing tricks and things, but I I didn't know any YouTube strategy. Um I didn't really know much about YouTube beyond the the creators that were I was already watching, which nobody was doing anything like that. I didn't see like a lot of recipe creators. I wasn't watching a lot of food videos. Um I watched food TV, I was really into that. But again, there wasn't a lot of strategy. I just I knew that if I just kind of kept tuning and tweaking and changing that you know I'd be able to grow. Uh so that was really that was the only strategy was let's just throw a bunch out and see what happens.

Brutal Feedback That Changed Everything

SPEAKER_01

What were some of your early learnings in in doing that? So again, like you said, you start off uh faceless basically, and uh you you're doing these recipes. Like what were A, what was your experience like when you uploaded these? Did you expect it to get a whole bunch of views right off the bat? And or were you uh disappointed or did you expect exactly what happened? What did happen?

SPEAKER_00

No, so I mean, really not a lot. I you know, it's when I first started, it was a uh it was a quick learning experience because I realized, you know, I wasn't getting a lot of views. Uh I started looking into, you know, how do I grow on search? You know, I was looking at, you know, YouTube was like the biggest search engine, so let's, you know, let's let's figure out search. Um I was really trying to figure a lot out. And and I actually I got I got pretty lucky. I was going through to a I was at the grocery store one day and I noticed the person in front of me, um, they were a huge YouTuber. And they cooking YouTuber specifically. And and I stopped and I was like, um, I was excuse me. I was like, are you from Healthy Junk Food? And they were like, yeah. And we took a picture together, and it was it was Julia from Healthy Junk Food, and we took a picture. And then later that day, and JP's not gonna mind that I tell this story, we're we're close friends now, but later that day he messaged me and he said, Um, he was like, Hey, he's like, You met Julia earlier in the grocery store. Um, I started watching your videos. Your videos suck. You're never you're never gonna grow on YouTube. This is not this is not what you do. Oh, get your face on camera, add some personality to it, and have fun with it, really was the big thing. Um, he was like, but he was like, get get your face on there and start doing stuff. So the very next video, and I I wasn't installed it because I was like, I was like, this is great, this is this is a great lesson. Like, I'm learning, you know, like and that was really that was the advice. That's all he didn't give me like a deep dive on analytics or anything like that. It was just that advice. And so the very next video I I got on camera and I set a camera up in front of me and I became uh the personality channel, um, and just kind of started growing from there.

SPEAKER_01

It is difficult, I think, first time when you're getting in front of a camera to emote to something that's an inanimate object. How odd or awkward, or or was that, or were you natural when you did that? No, it was really awkward. It was really I was really nervous.

Learning To Perform On Camera

SPEAKER_00

And I I don't remember I remember being very nervous. I don't know why I was so nervous, but it was just like I just felt it was completely different. It was really hard. Yes. Uh it it took a long time to get comfortable. Uh I I read a lot of I read a lot from different people, you know, saying like talk to the camera like it's your friend, or just try to talk naturally. Remember, you're talking to a person. You're not you're not explaining, like, just think about think about ways of how you would naturally speak to someone. And that really helped. Like that, that that was the big thing that kind of helped get me over the maybe not even like the ner like the nerves of it, but also get a lot more comfortable in camera. It was just talking to it just like I was talking to like a friend. Or and a lot of times I'd have to stop myself and say, like, wait a minute, like, let's step back. Okay, I'm being very instructional and being very boring. Let me just, let me just how would I say this to my to my buddy?

SPEAKER_01

You know. Let me ask you if you've had this experience, because I had an experience early on in my content creation career where um I, you know, was saying something in the intro, and then I went back and watched it, and I and I thought, I swore that I said that with a lot more energy. And it just didn't come across. Did you come did you experience that?

SPEAKER_00

Oh, yeah, absolutely. Like it's it you you just you know, you think I mean I still experience that, you know. I still like I'm going through an edit, I'm going like, oh my gosh, I was like so flat like through this whole thing. Like I really swore I was being you know a little bit more alive, or just it's uh sometimes I think that's okay because you're like actually in the moment and that's real, and I think that's like uh like uh helps build like some more authenticity, you know. Um but but no, I I still experience that.

SPEAKER_01

I still get that. It's weird because like people don't talk about that enough. I feel like it's something that you find out after not that it's too late because never too, you can always reshoot something, but you find out and it's really super surprising that um they say you gain 10 pounds being on camera, but really you lose like 30% of your energy through the camera. I feel like too. You feel like you're doing something. So I'm always like 130% to get that 100% that I think I'm getting. Um, and it's it's a skill that you kind of learn after a while.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah. I keep, you know, and I think it has to be drilled in in and I think I mean I think that's with like a lot of anything that you're like practicing, you're kind of like you're not just practicing uh you know, like right now I'm obsessed with running. I'm like doing running and like you know, it's like on my runs, I'm constantly thinking about form. And you know, I'll be 10 miles into a run and just falling apart. And then I've like, wait, wait, wait, hold on, let me bring it back together and start doing it. And in the same way, like I'm helping some friends right now on social media like grow like their Instagram accounts and things. And I keep saying it's like, you know, when you get in front of that camera, when you get in front of the camera, it's it's you plus 10. Like just remember to turn it up, just just a little bit. You don't you don't want to be sound crazy, but just turn it up. And and I do think you kind of have to drill that into yourself, you know, and you don't you don't have to be wacky, you know, it's it's the plus 10 could be in any direction, you know, it could be plus 10 negative, it just depends on what you're trying to get across.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

But it it it it can't be flat, you know. And I but I do think you're right. Like I a lot of people don't talk about that. I think this is the first time in you know, almost almost 10 years of doing this that somebody's asked me that. Like, so yeah.

SPEAKER_01

It's because I came across it myself and I just it's stuck with me. That and another thing, um, I was driving home from work years ago when I worked in downtown Seattle, and um I remember thinking that I know this is gonna sound real odd, but I remember thinking I was smiling. So I looked in the rear view mirror and I had the the RBF face. I I'm like, I thought I was smiling, but I the disconnect between what I thought was happening, what was actually happening, really made me rethink a lot about like how I create content, which includes things like energy and stuff. Um have you ever come across something similar to that where you're like this little silly thing you've realized about yourself, you're like, oh man, I need to really pay attention to that when I'm actually you know making content.

Energy, Authenticity, And Multiple Takes

SPEAKER_00

It's the same, yeah, it's the same thing I was just saying with like running. Like it's you know, when I'm in the middle of filming a video, like you know, you go through the motions and you get through uh, you know, a part of video, and you just kind of have to try to remind yourself, like, oh, let me see if I can bring this one element back. Or, you know, it's uh and that's why a lot of times I I don't know about you, but like I know um I have taught myself just over the years to just constantly give multiple takes of a thing. Uh and and I know sometimes I sound probably crazy, but it's I'll sit in front of the camera, and especially for something that's very scripted. Sometimes I'm sometimes some videos are very scripted. I sit down and I just I'm very analytical on a script. And then sometimes I have videos where it's like this part's scripted, and this part I'm just like, you know what, I just want to naturally experience what's happening. Um and and in the ones where I'm like, okay, I'm just naturally experiencing what's happening, a lot of times I'll try to do it two or three times, you know. A lot of times the first time is the better one because it's like the actual experience. But sometimes I say something in the third version that I'm like, well, that has to go in, you know. Um and you know, it's like everybody, I think everybody does this just in real life. Like you have a conversation with somebody, then later on you go back and you're like, Oh, I I wish I would have said that. So it's it's nice, even if you're not totally scripted, to kind of do those multiple, like, you know, I'm gonna try this a couple times and see what happens because you on that fly you might think of it the third time around, something that's gonna be a gem, you know.

SPEAKER_01

So this might only apply to food creators, probably applies to some other creators too. But uh I've talked to a couple food creators recently, and the the topic of cooking the same thing multiple times so you get multiple takes is has come up. And I'm just wondering, is that something that happens to you? Do you have to create the thing multiple times so that you can shoot it multiple times? So I used to a lot.

SPEAKER_00

Like, I mean, it was uh I've gotten a lot easier on myself over the years. Uh there was a period of time when, you know, uh the views were cooking, the channel was rolling, everything was just cruising. Yeah. And and I was uh a madman. Like I I mean it was I remember uh I did a video, it was I think it was it was like a kind of like an omelet thing, and I made hundreds of them. I mean, just just nonstop for like two weeks, just over and over and over and over, because I wasn't getting like the perfect shot.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And and it I was going a little crazy, but I mean it was just just to get that like perfect I I needed that for the video. Because if it if I didn't get that exact thing, then the video wasn't gonna work.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

Perfectionism In Food Filming

SPEAKER_00

And um, and I remember like when I was being, you know, a lot of there was a period of the channel when I was very scientific. I was using a lot of uh really unique ingredients that I was experimenting with. So it was finding getting them to work just the right ways. And that was so much trial and error. And I and I filmed everything because I didn't want to nail it and then not have it on camera and then have to try to recreate it again. So I have I have hard drives of just terabytes and terabytes of footage. Wow, you know, that is most of it's unusable, but it was just multiple attempts. I I don't do that anymore. Now I'm I'm uh a lot more planned. I'm I'm making there I was making eight videos uh a month for years, and it's just over the years I've been able to take it, like I said, take it a little easier on myself, kind of calm down. I'm gonna I start working on videos that I think are I can't I can get on the first kind of round. Doesn't always happen. You know, I filmed a video two weeks ago, I filmed the entire thing, and when I was done, I it just it the video didn't work. So it's it got canned. Um but yeah, I think I think in food, and I know a lot of food creators, even some pretty big food creators that you know they have prep chefs that help them and cook, and they have to do multiple four, five, six versions of it before they get it the perfect one. Um so yeah, I I think I think it is pretty common in food.

SPEAKER_01

There's there's probably this misconception. Uh well, I know there is this misconception because I talk to content creators all the time about this sort of thing, and they think that once you get to a certain point like of success, that everything's great and it's all amazing. Like you have over 75 million views, you have over 600,000 subscribers, so things are great for you, everything's perfect, you don't dislike anything. But there's got to be something about this whole process that you're just like, I just really don't like you know, it's all it's it's it's all a little so just to kind of go back on like the like the all of the views and the subscribers and everything, it it doesn't change.

SPEAKER_00

Like it's like when you have uh I was actually just talking with someone about that today. Like, and it's the way I look at someone now, like with some of my friends that are like I said, they're trying to grow and they want to grow and they have like a thousand followers and they're like, oh no, we're close yet. And it's like, no, you are there, like you are there, you're just going to keep tuning and tweaking, and nothing's gonna be different. You're already there. You're just you're doing the job.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_00

And it's and yeah, but look at where you're at, and it's I'm not doing anything different than they are, you know. So it's I think that's the thing. I I I remember when I first started looking at channels with you know 5,000 or 10,000 followers, thinking like how different the world would be, or you know, then then when you would get there and it's like, well, now it's the channels with a hundred thousand followers, how different the world's gonna be. And it's like, oh, wait a minute, it's actually it's not. It's right. You you it's it's you so it's you know, and I and I think what happens is you do get a little bit better knowledge of you know what works and it make and it does make it easier on finding the the right ideas and repeatable subjects, but then even then, you know, it's there's a lot of tweening, uh uh, you know, turning and tweaking the dial and changing things and constantly evolving because it's you know it's um it's always changing. So but like one thing that I I I don't think there's any one specific thing, you know. I mean it's for me it's uh it's it's a constant hamster wheel of, you know, I'm I'm come up with the idea, make the video, um, you know, edit, get it out. You know, I I think um I think some of the other platforms outside of YouTube have have changed. Like uh, you know, now there's like a lot of agencies and and company, like management companies that manage like your Facebook and your Microsoft Network pages and you know, people there and they're automatically uploading everything. So like that's that's gotten a lot easier. Um I think distribution is something that just kind of like I don't personally enjoy. Yeah. Uh you know, it's it's if I could just live on YouTube and just that's it, like and everything else just went away, I think that would be great. Yeah, right. So that's probably the thing. Yeah, that's probably the thing.

SPEAKER_01

That's fair. That's actually really fair. And it's funny because I was gonna ask you, uh we'll ask we'll probably get back to that later. But when you um were first starting your channel, what were you doing for like work at the time?

SPEAKER_00

I was uh I worked at a uh university here in Orlando, Florida. Um I was one of their uh like IT um uh I I did mobile device management. So I worked on like the iPhones and iPads. And this was a company that had like 20,000 Apple devices.

SPEAKER_01

Gotcha.

SPEAKER_00

Um so yeah, I I did a lot of that. And before that, I was pretty big into AV. So I I did a lot of um uh music, like audio installations and studio, uh recording studio, things like that.

Success Myths And The Hamster Wheel

SPEAKER_01

So I've always been tech-t-minded. Yeah, I've always been a techie. So in some ways, I mean we've certainly we're very well connected in that. But um in the tech space, uh, I mean, I was in tech for many years. Um, it can pay pretty well. And once you get used to a certain uh paycheck, there's a thing that happens when you're a content creator where if things are starting to work, it starts to match or sometimes exceed what you're making. At what point did you go, all right, this job, this nine to five I have now, is actually impeding the growth of my channel? And what was that discussion like with uh your friends, family, or whatever? So like I think I might have to go all in.

SPEAKER_00

So I I mean, God, I have such a it's I have kind of like a lucky story, I would say. I mean, I feel very lucky. Like I so I the company that I worked for, I didn't really like love working there. It was um, I I kind of fell into IT. I think I'm more of an A V guy and not an IT guy. Uh so like that was a hard position for me. And uh the company was constantly doing rounds of layoffs. And honestly, I was sitting at my desk just going, come on, I'm next. Like, let me be next. And and and I really should have just made the jump myself. But I I was I was working on the YouTube videos, I was doing it, and you know my my buddy that JP from Healthy Junk Food that told me that the videos suck, eventually, like I said, we became friends. Uh, and he was always like, Man, just do it as a hobby. Like, this is a hard job. Like, just do it as a hobby and hopefully it hits, you know. And he was like, But in my head, I was like, no, I I could do this. Like, this is a thing I could do. I just gotta keep finding the path. And um, and I got laid off. And the I at that point, the YouTube channel wasn't making any money. Uh, I just got uh I I mean it was probably making maybe a hundred or two hundred dollars a month. Just got picked up. Facebook was doing a thing called the launch pad program where they were paying creators to uh help them start their video uh library. And so it was like just perfect timing um because that was enough. I mean, it was barely half the paycheck, but it was enough for me to say, like, okay, I I can dive into this full time. I'm gonna give myself a couple of months uh and just do everything I possibly can to make this grow. Um, my wife was my my girlfriend at the time. We weren't even engaged yet, but uh we were we were living together, we were planning on being engaged, and it was a tough conversation. I mean, it was hard because it really wasn't a lot of income, but I I just I really knew and she really believed in me and and we we went at it and I completely passed my timeline, like like it was supposed to be just be a couple of months, and I I probably went for another year. Um but probably by around the three-year mark, which would have been uh a year after I was laid off, uh, is when things started to really match up. That's when my salaries matched. So it took, I would say it took about three years for me to get to that point where I was like, okay, like well now this is it. Like and then and then slowly I would not mean slowly, probably shortly after that, it became steady. Gotcha. You know, yeah.

SPEAKER_01

And was that mainly from like um AdSense and stuff, or did you start to get sponsorships or what was going on there? Affiliates or what was going on?

From IT Layoff To Full Time Creator

SPEAKER_00

It was a combination. I've never really done affiliates, um, not enough to be anything, you know, worthwhile. It was it was a combination of of AdSense and it was a combination of AdSense, Facebook, and um uh brand deals. Um and then slowly the the Facebook stuff kind of went away. They they shifted gears on that. Yep. Uh and then it was just and at that time really YouTube was kind of taking over for me. Um, so that wasn't a huge loss, but it was uh YouTube, brand deals, and AdSense pretty much 50-50 for a while.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah. And now is it more sponsorship deals than it is uh AdSense?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, it's de yeah, it's more sponsorship than AdSense for sure. Yeah, it's um you know it's uh I'd say it's I can't I don't know the pie of all of it. No, because there's there's so many different you know, there's so many different things, but it's it uh uh sponsorship deals is a is a good chunk of it.

SPEAKER_01

When would you say it gets easier to get sponsorship deals? Is it a subscriber thing or is it a value prop? Or what when when did it get easier for you? It's gonna have someone help you do it, or what was it?

SPEAKER_00

No, I have I have a manager and I've had the same manager uh for seven years now. We're about to hit seven years this year, uh, who's been, again, I feel very lucky. I mean, this guy is just a workhorse. Um he's he's phenomenal, and and it really, I I I Owe him so much because he's done uh just did a phenomenal job. Um I I think, and him and I have had this conversation a lot. I think it's consistency. I think once you can kind of show consistency, and you know, we have never, I have never been the guy to be, I'm not gonna call anybody greedy, but I've never been the guy to say, I need I I'm worth so much money, you know, I'm this valuable, you know. I've always just been kind of like, you know what? If you want to work with me as a brand, uh, I'm gonna give you a deal on a couple videos. Yep. And if it works, you know, if my audience likes it, you know, like I'm very like, I I am I am very influenced. Most of the things that I have in my house come from influencer marketing, like other influencers, like, oh, well, let me buy this from Philip DeFranco. Like, I mean, it's it's really it's bad. So I use, I I absolutely use everything that I talk about on my channel. Um, but as long as my audience is okay with it and and it works out for the brand, then we start talking about more like, hey, can you would you guys be willing to sign for six months? Would you be willing to sign for the year? You know? Um, so I I think it's I do think it's just about, you know, if you can keep consistent numbers, like not chasing a lot of people want to chase like, how do I get the hit? How do I get the the viral video every single time?

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

Revenue Mix And Sponsorship Strategy

SPEAKER_00

Versus just, and I know a lot of my friends who did that and they made a good chunk of money for a while, and then you know, it's that's very, very hard to sustain. Where I've been sustaining the same thing for seven, six, seven years, you know, no no problem, same flow of videos, same no interruption in brand deals, you know, when when there's been the adpocalypse and all of that, you know, it just kind of stayed for me steady. Um so I think it's just, you know, if you're a creator and you want to you know earn a earn a decent living, you know, a good living, um just being consistent, always being able to show brands that you're gonna be able to deliver for them, you know, and and use products that your audience is actually going to like, you know.

SPEAKER_01

That's really critical. There's one other thing that was brought up by a friend of mine we had on uh Roger Wakefield who talked about this because I've said this personally multiple times. And for people who are listening, you may not be at the point where you're doing sponsorships yet, but I believe this next section is really important no matter where you are in your content creation journey, because a lot of brands look at your channel and your content and see if it's quote brand safe. Now that can mean a lot of things.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

But it's really critical to understand that if you're going to do highly controversial content, that you are lowering your amount of brands that will be willing to work with you, and you just never know who's watching your content. Like literally on YouTube, anyone could be watching your content.

SPEAKER_00

Has that happened to you? I mean, I've never had an issue with brand safety.

SPEAKER_01

I mean, but I mean, like as a brand even said, like, hey, we really like uh how you're like brand safe or we just like your drive sort of yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I mean it's that that's a thing that I I I've talked to a lot of people about. I mean, it's it's um a lot of different brands with it's it's you know, I'm I'm easy, you know, I don't I don't say anything super controversial. I don't, you know, uh I I mean maybe now I'm kind of getting a little bit more opinionated, you know, just just in general, just on like a lot of the food stuff that's coming out and health. Um but it's still nothing that I think is going to harm reputation-wise.

SPEAKER_02

Right.

SPEAKER_00

Uh you know, and I think in the beginning I was definitely trying to be you know, just always talk like I I would talk to my parents, you know, like I just want things to be easy and everybody can get along and and it just uh you know, if you it's simple, I guess, you know. Um makes it easier for the brands, uh, it makes it easier for the audience, you know, you're less nobody's gonna get offended. Um but I do like to poke fun of the people that poke at me, but I still think that's okay. It's not like hurting brand, you know, like any.

SPEAKER_01

Exactly. Yeah, at that point it's probably it's all good. It's all good. Um let's talk about specifically your content. So you don't just kind of do food content. Uh you have like a little twist to it. Explain people to exactly what it is you do.

SPEAKER_00

Well, you know, so the channel has always it's evolved so many times. There's been uh seven, eight different versions of the channel since I started. And and honestly, there's we're at the precept of of another one that's about to happen in a couple months. Um for the longest time I did uh I was for a large chunk of my channel, I was uh the plant-based food guy. I did a lot of uh plant-based food science. I uh showed how the impossible burger was made when that first came out, how they made the Beyond Burger. I gave you versions on how you can make it at home. Um I went through and turned everything that you can possibly turn into. I turned it into bacon. Um I love bacon. Yeah, yeah. I mean, and there's and there's some of these plant-based bacons which are just I mean, will blow your mind. Wow. Um yeah. No joke. It's it's really crazy. Um over the years, uh I've kind of switched a little bit, and this is just because of me personally. Uh the last four years I've I lost 110 pounds. I've gotten into uh probably the best shape of my life, and and I've really fallen in love with like health and and wellness. Maybe not like wellness isn't the way that people are using the term now, but just in general, uh feeling good. And so the channel has kind of taken a shift in that direction, and I'm having a lot of fun with that. So that's kind of where I'm going now. And and right now the channel is I'm in more of an experimentation mode to see uh like what works, what and like what what's gonna work and what's not going to work. Uh but I I do want to kind of go down the path of um making a lot more videos for myself personally.

Brand Safety And Consistency

SPEAKER_01

Let's talk a little bit about things like pivoting, which is really um can be very painful. Uh if anyone's ever pivoted a channel, it can be very painful. Talk us through your experience uh as you because you said it's gone through multiple kind of revisions. Like what has it been like for you?

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, you know, I mean it's it it's definitely hard, but I you know so I always, and I know this is like a funny thing to say, maybe, but I I I try to tell people when they think about it, it's you know, if you want to constantly grow and you have to evolve, you know, maybe you don't have to. I'm sure there's channels that have found a niche and they stuck with that niche and they never changed, and great for them. Uh I think that is that it's very hard and they're very lucky. Um, but I always tell people you if you if you want to be incredibly successful, you have to be the Beatles, you know. And the the Beatles, when they're if you listen to their very first album, you listen to their last album, and it's it sounds like two completely different bands.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um and it's and that's kind of what I've always lived by is every you know couple seasons, I'm gonna be putting out a new album, and that album is gonna be something that might be completely different than the last. There's gonna be bits and pieces that will sound the same, but for the most part, it's going to, you know, it's it's gonna be uh it's gonna be a new thing. Um but pivoting is hard. You know, it's you're gonna you're gonna lose some people, you're gonna have some people that are mad at you because they they always want things to be the same. People don't like change. Um but I will say, you know, I use The Walking Dead as a great example. You know, how many people have watched every season of The Walking Dead? There was a there was a period where people watched all the way up until Glenn died, and then millions of people dropped off. That's where I dropped off. You know, and it's and it the reason was was because it just the show never changed. It just kind of kept going, you know. Uh so that that's why I think there has to be some twists and turns along the way, you know. And you see some really there's some huge channels that have done that and have done incredibly well, you know, um, keeping bits and pieces of the original. Like, I mean, the the new version that I'm working on now is gonna still have, you know, bits and pieces of the of what's currently happening. Um, but you but anybody that's been watching can see little tests that I'm doing and see where the channel's probably gonna go in the future, you know. Um so it's gonna be like a 50-50.

Evolving Content And Health Pivot

SPEAKER_01

So talk us through um the somewhat can be emotional roller coaster of the pivot that go back to like an earlier pivot where you've done it. Uh and I mean what most creators will find is that initially things just don't work. A lot of times they don't. Sometimes they do, but a lot of times it's a real reality check into how YouTube works. Uh, can you talk us through one of those, what it was like emotionally, and kind of what you did to to finally get it through to somewhere that it worked for you?

SPEAKER_00

Well, I think, you know, so the way I look at it is, you know, you have to you have to kind of constantly be testing, um, testing what's working and and and continuing with like you say, if it, you know, if I have a series um that's that's working really great, I'm going to kind of keep pushing on that one series while I'm slowly putting out tests of something else to see if I can find what the next the next idea could be that I can kind of run with. Um and you know, and in between those pivots, that's like kind of like a good like make sure you have something that's working really well. Don't, you know, if nothing's working at the moment, step back, look at your channel as a whole, and you know, kind of say, you know, what what are things that I've done in the past that have worked and see if I can kind of bring something back, you know. But in the past, when I've done it, it it it is it's taxing. It's it's definitely double the work because what you're trying to do is keep things keep things steady, keep things going while you're finding the next thing that can replace the thing. You know? So that's that's really been the method is is try 10 types of videos. I always say like give it a good round number. For me, it's 10. I'm gonna try 10 of the thing. Because the thing is, is say if you have a great idea for a series or like a great idea for a video and you put it out and it doesn't work, and it's that's always emotionally horrible when it's uh, you know, the 10 out of 10, it's the worst video you've put out in the last couple weeks. It might not necessarily be the concept. It might, it might still be a good concept. It could have been a packaging issue, you know, with thumbnail and title. It could have been a timing of issue, relevancy. That's a big thing. I would say the world's like politics and just everything that's kind of happening in the world can very much play on videos of what people are looking for at a moment. So try 10 different versions of that thing. And if after 10 times, maybe it I talked to another creator that was like, 10, you only need to do it, do it three times, you know. And it's like, however many times you feel comfortable, make a couple versions of it, of that thing, you know, and then if it doesn't work, great. You've tested it, tweak, try something else. But if it some one of those versions works, then you can start finding how to pull out of it and make new bigger versions.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um, but I do think, you know, it's the pivot is hard, but it's necessary. Anything that's worth anything is hard, you know. Um but you will feel it because it's that's when you're gonna get the most negative comments. You know, anytime there's something new, that's when people are gonna really be upset about it, you know. Um and that's when you kind of have to just grind a little bit and and put some emotions aside and just say, you know what, this is gonna be this is what I want to happen in the end, you know. So I gotta figure out how to get there, you know.

SPEAKER_01

You said you've mentioned a couple times how you talk to other creators. I and a lot of the creators I talk to don't have a lot of creative friends, but I think it's actually really important to have creative friends and stuff because it's a very lonely experience as a content creator. Typically, um, family and friends don't really get it. Like they might be supportive of you, but they don't really understand it. You know, you're talking another language. Um, how do you come across creators? Like, what's what's been happening? Like, how are you finding these people to talk to?

How To Pivot Without Crashing

SPEAKER_00

I I I am I'm very persistent. I I yeah so I mean I I you know I think the thing is is just to be, you know, try to be likable. You know, I mean, for early on, very early on, I I if I if I met someone, uh I would automatically, you know, I'm the annoying guy, you're my friend. You know? Um you're now my friend. We are friends now and we're gonna hang out. And and I think the worst thing is is you know, it's not asking someone to lunch or not asking someone to coffee, because if you don't ask them, then you know, they're they're not gonna go. But if you ask them, you know, you never know. You know, they might. Um and that's that's the absolute best thing. And and you know, very early on, I was around YouTube. I left, I was, I was left hundreds of comments on other platform, on other uh channels, on everyone, you know, and anybody that I enjoyed, if I enjoyed their content, I was gonna tell them I enjoyed it.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

And that sparked conversations with a lot of creators. Um and then just over the years, just built that. And then going to, you know, look on Facebook, look on um uh, you know, any of the anywhere where there's YouTube chats, and see if there's anybody's meeting up locally. Um, you know, you wouldn't believe how many, how many creators from eight years ago that I met just in uh you know, like a local meetup or something, which in Orlando, there's not a whole lot of, there's not a giant creator community, but there's there's some there's a few of us. Yeah. Um and and now they're now they're giant creators, you know. So it's like, and now now we have that like uh commonality we both do it for a living, and it's something we met early on. So I think it's just being, you know, you gotta be social if you're on social media, you know. Otherwise, it it can get very lonely because you you are a hundred percent your your your friends and family, they they don't understand it. It's not it's not it's not a job that a lot of people can understand unless they're in it.

SPEAKER_01

Yes, yeah. And with those, I you know, you're talking to people of all different sizes. What would you say um from the smaller content creators you've talked to, what do you say the number one mistake that a lot of them are making?

SPEAKER_00

Well, I think um I think and I maybe this might be like like harsh, but I think the biggest thing is is like nobody cares about you, you know. Like I I mean it's it's that's you gotta make things for people. It's for people. That's that's the whole thing, you know. Um and that's hard to forget. I don't care how big you are. I mean, you're still you it's like you everybody has an ego, you know, and it's just no matter who you are, but it's I I think that's the biggest thing is people think, you know, it's like, well, I'm making this style same style of content I see that everybody's doing and it works, and this guy has millions of followers, and I'm just making the same videos he's making. Why isn't it working? And it's like we didn't see what it took for them to get to the million followers for people to care about them, right? You know, and even still, even at the million followers, they're still chasing the the new people, you know. So I think the the thing that I always tell people, and I and I try to drill it in their head, and I've like I said, I'm helping off a couple friends and you know, help them re-edit their content. It's like, oh, look at this intro you said you got hey guys, do you remember last week? And it's like, no, they don't remember, they've never seen you before. Right.

SPEAKER_01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

They've yeah, that's you're always going for people who have never seen you before. That's gonna be a majority of your views. If you get a viral video, that's all people who have never seen you or hurt. So if you're telling an inside joke, you've lost them. Right. You know, if you if you're saying something that someone thinks that they know you, you've lost them. You know, that's I think that's the biggest thing.

SPEAKER_01

Absolutely. It's uh it's we you hear it every once in a while on like uh YouTube um education, like, oh, people don't care about your own, but it is so true. You have to remember that like and you can look in most people's analytics where it's like sometimes 70 or 80 percent of the people are new to your channel, and that's what you want. I I've talked to many creators, they're like, Oh, that's bad. No, that's how you grow because if it was all your own subscribers, you would go nowhere. Yeah, you have what you have.

Find Creator Community And Network

SPEAKER_00

Yeah, I think I'm I think I sit around 70%. I think that's yeah, that's pretty healthy. Most of my views come from browse, you know, traffic. They're not, you know, it's so it's you know, and that's that's what I want. Like every what I I'm very happy with that, you know. Yeah, um, because that's I'm constantly reaching new people.

SPEAKER_01

Absolutely. All right, so I always do this kind of challenge question at the end. Um, so knowing what you know now, but not having access to any of your current resources and not doing a same channel you're already doing, what channel would you make now knowing what you know? And how would you do it? What would be your first couple videos stuff? What would it be about? What would be your strategy? How would you do it?

SPEAKER_00

So uh I really like it's kind of where I want to go anyways, but I'm probably not gonna do it. But I really like challenge content. I love when people want to learn how to do a thing. Okay. Um so that would be what I would do.

SPEAKER_01

Okay.

SPEAKER_00

Uh what would be a video?

SPEAKER_01

What would be like the first three videos?

SPEAKER_00

Uh so this it would be like I did this in 30 days, you know. Like I was, you know, like one of those types of things. Like I was able to accomplish this in 30 days. I ran a marathon in 30 days, or I um but the trick would be to find something incredibly relevant at that moment. So like if it's, you know, if you're gonna be doing like running content or something, find like one of the biggest races of the season and say, okay, this is the video I'm gonna work towards and I'm gonna do. I ran, you know, uh what's coming up for me, I'm gonna be doing the London. So I ran the London Marathon in 30 days. You know, like um so when that video comes out, that's when everybody's gonna be pecking at it. That's it's gonna be the big thing. Uh and then people are gonna want to see, you know, it's like, how do they get prepped for that? Right. Um I I think that would be the thing. So I'd try to find something that would be super relevant, uh, something that would have like the timing. Um and then yeah, I just I love challenge content. And I think uh with challenge content, you you can only get out so much, so it's not like you can really flood, you know, like with food videos, I can make you know, eight videos a month and even some shorts and stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00

Um so with challenge content with that type of thing, you could probably only do maybe one or two videos a month. So I'd probably find like the one big thing, like the London Marathon, and then probably something small, like um, God, what would be the small video? This is really on the spot.

SPEAKER_01

No, I love it. That's why I would put people on the spot. That's what I do.

SPEAKER_00

Uh you know, it would be can it would be like a can I? Like, can can you can you do something in in two weeks? Like, can you go from couch to couch to 5k in two weeks, you know? Okay. Yeah.

Biggest Mistake: Viewers Don’t Know You

SPEAKER_01

I like that. So I like the fact that you're you're doing something that's completely outside of your niche, but it is something that you like to watch, which also makes it more interesting for you to actually produce. Yeah. Um, you do also have to make sure that it has uh a pretty good uh total adjustable market, so you actually have a viewership, and then also trying to figure out what are those first couple videos because those could be the ones to start to bring in new people. Yeah. Um yeah, super, super interesting stuff. We appreciate Saw Stash for coming on through today. Um, there will be links in the description below as well if you're listening to the audio podcast. There'll be links in the show notes. And uh you should come over and check it out. He's got some really cool videos. We were talking before we went live uh about the Cinnamon Toast Crunch video, which I highly recommend you see because I love Cinnamon Toast Crunch. We've talked about that. Um really cool stuff here. So uh thank you so much for joining us today. If there's anything else that you think people should know, uh let us know right now. What is the what is the tip of the day? What's the coolest thing going on?

SPEAKER_00

Man, you know what? Um you know, actually, it is nothing to do with you do YouTube. Just just in general, just go out and do something for yourself today. Uh that that's been my kind of like thing every day is just, you know, if you fill your cup, you know, you're gonna be able to help fill others. And and I think that's the biggest thing. So go do something for yourself. Wake up and you know, get some energy, go do something.

SPEAKER_01

I love that. That's fantastic.

SPEAKER_00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01

If you're new here, you can feel free to hit that subscribe button. We got all the information in the bottom. And we'll see y'all in the next one.

SPEAKER_00

Thanks, Raven.