{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":5.73,"endTime":7.89,"body":"Welcome to a"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":5.73,"endTime":7.89,"body":"special guest hosts edition for"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":7.89,"endTime":11.58,"body":"talking D\u0026T podcast, usually"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":7.89,"endTime":11.58,"body":"with Alison Hardy, but today"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":11.58,"endTime":15.0,"body":"with me, Max Paranal are"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":11.58,"endTime":15.0,"body":"bringing you some new voices and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":15.0,"endTime":18.03,"body":"perspectives to add to the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":15.0,"endTime":18.03,"body":"discussion around DT education."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":18.54,"endTime":18.99,"body":"That's correct."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":25.05,"endTime":28.5,"body":"Okay, I think I think we're on"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":25.05,"endTime":28.5,"body":"So welcome, everybody, to the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":28.5,"endTime":32.85,"body":"first of my guest hosts slots on"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":28.5,"endTime":32.85,"body":"Alison's talking D\u0026T podcast."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":33.15,"endTime":35.7,"body":"Thank you for letting me steer"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":33.15,"endTime":35.7,"body":"the ship. Why for a while,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":35.7,"endTime":39.51,"body":"Alison. Hopefully there's no"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":35.7,"endTime":39.51,"body":"icebergs looming on the horizon."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":39.54,"endTime":42.06,"body":"And so with these few few"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":39.54,"endTime":42.06,"body":"recordings, I'm hoping to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":42.06,"endTime":44.91,"body":"present some different"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":42.06,"endTime":44.91,"body":"perspectives on D\u0026T education,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":45.27,"endTime":48.42,"body":"particularly from women who've"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":45.27,"endTime":48.42,"body":"been successful in education and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":48.42,"endTime":51.96,"body":"beyond into the wide world. So"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":48.42,"endTime":51.96,"body":"to start that conversation, and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":51.96,"endTime":55.23,"body":"start with my first guest slot,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":51.96,"endTime":55.23,"body":"I've got my first guest, lots of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":55.23,"endTime":59.25,"body":"firsts. Emily Brook. Emily,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":55.23,"endTime":59.25,"body":"thank you for joining me on"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":59.25,"endTime":63.0,"body":"Alison's podcast. Hello, would"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":59.25,"endTime":63.0,"body":"you like to introduce yourself"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":63.0,"endTime":65.73,"body":"and tell us a bit about you and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":63.0,"endTime":65.73,"body":"how you got to where you are?"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":65.76,"endTime":69.57,"body":"Yeah. Great. Hello."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":65.76,"endTime":69.57,"body":"So my name is Emily Brooke. I'm"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":69.57,"endTime":72.48,"body":"a lecturer at Nottingham Trent"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":69.57,"endTime":72.48,"body":"University. And I'm the year"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":72.48,"endTime":77.25,"body":"leader for BA product design at"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":72.48,"endTime":77.25,"body":"the moment. So steering,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":77.28,"endTime":81.84,"body":"steering the ship, as it were."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":77.28,"endTime":81.84,"body":"And then join me to talk about"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":81.84,"endTime":85.98,"body":"kind of now how I got there, or"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":81.84,"endTime":85.98,"body":"is that going to be leaving?"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":85.98,"endTime":88.11,"body":"Yeah, I think so."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":85.98,"endTime":88.11,"body":"Yeah. So your experience is kind"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":88.11,"endTime":90.3,"body":"of what led you to this point, I"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":88.11,"endTime":90.3,"body":"guess."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":90.33,"endTime":97.53,"body":"Yeah. So I did a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":90.33,"endTime":97.53,"body":"master's at NTU in 2016. And"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":97.86,"endTime":100.83,"body":"really enjoyed it. And from"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":97.86,"endTime":100.83,"body":"there started doing hourly paid"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":100.83,"endTime":104.79,"body":"lettering work, mostly teaching"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":100.83,"endTime":104.79,"body":"CAD. And then from there,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":105.21,"endTime":108.36,"body":"basically loved, loved working"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":105.21,"endTime":108.36,"body":"with the students love getting"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":108.36,"endTime":111.75,"body":"involved with kind of that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":108.36,"endTime":111.75,"body":"learning process. And here I am,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":112.02,"endTime":116.1,"body":"five years later, still doing"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":112.02,"endTime":116.1,"body":"it. I'm really enjoying it."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":116.1,"endTime":117.72,"body":"Yeah. Good, good."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":117.75,"endTime":120.66,"body":"Okay, so So before"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":117.75,"endTime":120.66,"body":"that point for your coming,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":120.84,"endTime":123.45,"body":"becoming aware of Nottingham"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":120.84,"endTime":123.45,"body":"Trent University, where we both"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":123.45,"endTime":128.58,"body":"are your kind of experience of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":123.45,"endTime":128.58,"body":"D\u0026T or whatever you did before"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":128.58,"endTime":131.1,"body":"then how did that How did you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":128.58,"endTime":131.1,"body":"know this was kind of the path"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":131.1,"endTime":132.84,"body":"for you that you wanted to get"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":131.1,"endTime":132.84,"body":"into that masters?"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":133.2,"endTime":137.97,"body":"Um, so my secondary"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":133.2,"endTime":137.97,"body":"school was a Technology College."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":138.21,"endTime":144.84,"body":"So when we did our GCSE is we"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":138.21,"endTime":144.84,"body":"had to choose D\u0026T as a GCSE. So"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":144.84,"endTime":148.11,"body":"you could choose between"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":144.84,"endTime":148.11,"body":"resistant materials, graphics,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":148.38,"endTime":150.69,"body":"textiles, and food tech."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":152.31,"endTime":155.16,"body":"So I chose textiles at that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":152.31,"endTime":155.16,"body":"point. It was something that was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":155.16,"endTime":158.28,"body":"quite interested in. And I did"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":155.16,"endTime":158.28,"body":"that for GCSE."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":159.54,"endTime":162.63,"body":"But they only ran that for about"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":159.54,"endTime":162.63,"body":"three years. So I think the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":162.66,"endTime":165.21,"body":"school year above me and the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":162.66,"endTime":165.21,"body":"school year below me had to do"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":165.21,"endTime":170.43,"body":"that. But then after that, they"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":165.21,"endTime":170.43,"body":"they stopped it. So by the time"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":170.43,"endTime":175.59,"body":"I got to a level, there were, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":170.43,"endTime":175.59,"body":"think maybe 15 people doing"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":175.59,"endTime":178.02,"body":"product design. So I was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":175.59,"endTime":178.02,"body":"thinking about this earlier,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":178.02,"endTime":180.09,"body":"like, it's quite strange that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":178.02,"endTime":180.09,"body":"the whole year group, which was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":180.09,"endTime":184.8,"body":"about 200, people had to do a dt"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":180.09,"endTime":184.8,"body":"at GCSE. And then by the time we"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":184.8,"endTime":188.67,"body":"got to a level that was like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":184.8,"endTime":188.67,"body":"less than 10% Still doing that."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":188.91,"endTime":195.81,"body":"Yeah. And I think it's because"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":188.91,"endTime":195.81,"body":"the only a level they did was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":195.81,"endTime":198.33,"body":"product design. So they're done"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":195.81,"endTime":198.33,"body":"like the four separate kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":198.36,"endTime":202.2,"body":"dt pathways, and then gone"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":198.36,"endTime":202.2,"body":"right, you can do product. And"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":202.2,"endTime":207.84,"body":"that's it. Because I ended up"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":202.2,"endTime":207.84,"body":"doing kind of like fashion and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":207.84,"endTime":211.38,"body":"textiles within product at a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":207.84,"endTime":211.38,"body":"level which was a bit weird,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":211.41,"endTime":216.06,"body":"because everyone else was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":211.41,"endTime":216.06,"body":"designing lamps and stuff. And I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":216.06,"endTime":220.2,"body":"was doing dresses. But all the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":216.06,"endTime":220.2,"body":"theory was still resisting"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":220.2,"endTime":225.96,"body":"materials based. So it ended up"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":220.2,"endTime":225.96,"body":"being a bit strange kind of a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":225.96,"endTime":226.5,"body":"mixture."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":226.53,"endTime":229.47,"body":"Okay, that's"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":226.53,"endTime":229.47,"body":"interesting. But did you still?"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":229.74,"endTime":231.75,"body":"Do you still enjoy that"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":229.74,"endTime":231.75,"body":"experience? I guess he's still"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":231.75,"endTime":234.66,"body":"kind of what made you think you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":231.75,"endTime":234.66,"body":"wanted to carry that on into"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":234.66,"endTime":237.45,"body":"university to you undergrad and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":234.66,"endTime":237.45,"body":"onwards."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":238.47,"endTime":242.97,"body":"So I think for me,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":238.47,"endTime":242.97,"body":"like I'd always been quite"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":242.97,"endTime":245.28,"body":"creative anyway. And I don't"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":242.97,"endTime":245.28,"body":"know if some of it was a bit of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":245.28,"endTime":248.73,"body":"kind of defiance against my"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":245.28,"endTime":248.73,"body":"parents and being like, I want"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":248.73,"endTime":251.79,"body":"to go and do something creative."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":248.73,"endTime":251.79,"body":"And they were very keen for me"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":251.79,"endTime":253.92,"body":"to go and do something like my"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":251.79,"endTime":253.92,"body":"other A levels were English and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":253.92,"endTime":256.59,"body":"geography. So they were like, go"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":253.92,"endTime":256.59,"body":"and do that you'll get a good"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":256.59,"endTime":260.07,"body":"job like, and I was like, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":256.59,"endTime":260.07,"body":"don't think I want to do that."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":261.3,"endTime":264.48,"body":"So I initially applied to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":261.3,"endTime":264.48,"body":"university to do fashion design."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":266.43,"endTime":270.78,"body":"And I think at the point where I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":266.43,"endTime":270.78,"body":"was going to interviews I'd"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":270.78,"endTime":275.13,"body":"realised because I was doing a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":270.78,"endTime":275.13,"body":"product a level instead of a at"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":275.13,"endTime":277.86,"body":"fashion or textile a level there"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":275.13,"endTime":277.86,"body":"was a real gap in my knowledge."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":277.86,"endTime":282.75,"body":"So I then went on to do a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":277.86,"endTime":282.75,"body":"foundation just to get kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":282.75,"endTime":287.19,"body":"those extra skills that I was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":282.75,"endTime":287.19,"body":"missing. And that was"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":287.19,"endTime":289.71,"body":"this still towards"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":287.19,"endTime":289.71,"body":"the effect your fashion angle."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":289.71,"endTime":292.05,"body":"You was thinking to kind of go"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":289.71,"endTime":292.05,"body":"down that route still."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":292.08,"endTime":295.14,"body":"Yeah, so it was an"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":292.08,"endTime":295.14,"body":"Art and Design Foundation. And"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":295.17,"endTime":298.05,"body":"it was a year long but everybody"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":295.17,"endTime":298.05,"body":"on that course wanted to go and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":298.05,"endTime":300.93,"body":"do something creative at uni,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":298.05,"endTime":300.93,"body":"but But like there'll be people"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":300.93,"endTime":303.75,"body":"that want to do graphics,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":300.93,"endTime":303.75,"body":"there'll be people looking at"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":303.75,"endTime":309.42,"body":"like visual communication"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":303.75,"endTime":309.42,"body":"fashion product. That will that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":309.42,"endTime":313.56,"body":"year was really brilliant. Like,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":309.42,"endTime":313.56,"body":"I think when I think back to it"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":313.56,"endTime":316.38,"body":"now, that was probably my"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":313.56,"endTime":316.38,"body":"favourite year of education,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":316.65,"endTime":318.57,"body":"because it was really"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":316.65,"endTime":318.57,"body":"experimental, and you kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":318.57,"endTime":323.85,"body":"just do what you wanted. But all"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":318.57,"endTime":323.85,"body":"of the staff seemed really, like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":323.85,"endTime":326.22,"body":"focused on trying to get you to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":323.85,"endTime":326.22,"body":"find out what you wanted to do."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":326.22,"endTime":328.44,"body":"So I went into that thinking, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":326.22,"endTime":328.44,"body":"want to do fashion, I want to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":328.44,"endTime":331.17,"body":"work with textiles. And then I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":328.44,"endTime":331.17,"body":"think at one point, they were"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":331.17,"endTime":333.99,"body":"like, but everything you make is"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":331.17,"endTime":333.99,"body":"3d, like, what? What are you"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":333.99,"endTime":337.38,"body":"doing, like you're not making"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":333.99,"endTime":337.38,"body":"dresses, or, I don't know,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":337.38,"endTime":340.56,"body":"curtains, or whatever it was, it"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":337.38,"endTime":340.56,"body":"was all kind of big, sculptural"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":340.56,"endTime":344.76,"body":"3d pieces. So they kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":340.56,"endTime":344.76,"body":"pushed me towards product in 3d,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":345.03,"endTime":349.59,"body":"which is then why I applied for"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":345.03,"endTime":349.59,"body":"when I actually went to uni. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":349.59,"endTime":355.02,"body":"that year was great. It was just"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":349.59,"endTime":355.02,"body":"great. We did everything."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":356.31,"endTime":359.22,"body":"Okay, that's, that"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":356.31,"endTime":359.22,"body":"sounds cool. So how, how does"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":359.22,"endTime":362.07,"body":"that great year compare to kind"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":359.22,"endTime":362.07,"body":"of the experience you've had"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":362.07,"endTime":365.46,"body":"before? If you were secondary"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":362.07,"endTime":365.46,"body":"school and GCC, there was all"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":365.46,"endTime":367.77,"body":"these different options. And"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":365.46,"endTime":367.77,"body":"then you came into a level, it"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":367.77,"endTime":371.16,"body":"was just this one option. And"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":367.77,"endTime":371.16,"body":"you had to kind of manipulate"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":371.16,"endTime":375.45,"body":"that to kind of what you wanted?"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":371.16,"endTime":375.45,"body":"How does that experience kind of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":375.54,"endTime":377.28,"body":"what do you feel about that"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":375.54,"endTime":377.28,"body":"compared to you have this year"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":377.28,"endTime":379.8,"body":"that you love? And then the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":377.28,"endTime":379.8,"body":"years before? What's your"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":379.83,"endTime":380.52,"body":"thoughts?"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":380.699,"endTime":382.859,"body":"I think, like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":380.699,"endTime":382.859,"body":"looking back at it now, I think"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":382.859,"endTime":385.199,"body":"the way that the the school"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":382.859,"endTime":385.199,"body":"stuff was structured wasn't"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":385.199,"endTime":387.479,"body":"anything to do with the staff,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":385.199,"endTime":387.479,"body":"it was just to do with the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":387.479,"endTime":390.089,"body":"curriculum that they had to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":387.479,"endTime":390.089,"body":"teach, like they had to get you"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":390.089,"endTime":394.229,"body":"through an exam. And I think for"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":390.089,"endTime":394.229,"body":"me, I found that year quite"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":394.229,"endTime":397.169,"body":"difficult, because obviously my"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":394.229,"endTime":397.169,"body":"my coursework my project was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":397.169,"endTime":401.309,"body":"fashion based. But all of the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":397.169,"endTime":401.309,"body":"theory I was doing was on like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":401.309,"endTime":406.799,"body":"wood. So metals, and like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":401.309,"endTime":406.799,"body":"hazardous materials. So for me"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":406.799,"endTime":409.259,"body":"that yeah, just felt quite"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":406.799,"endTime":409.259,"body":"disjointed. And I think maybe"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":409.289,"endTime":413.249,"body":"other people that did that,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":409.289,"endTime":413.249,"body":"maybe wouldn't feel that as much"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":413.249,"endTime":417.749,"body":"because their project directly"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":413.249,"endTime":417.749,"body":"linked to it. But I find it"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":417.749,"endTime":421.409,"body":"quite strange. Yeah, compared to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":417.749,"endTime":421.409,"body":"then this foundation, where it"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":421.409,"endTime":423.329,"body":"was like, go and do what you"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":421.409,"endTime":423.329,"body":"want. If you want to do painting"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":423.329,"endTime":425.699,"body":"today, then you can do that. Or"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":423.329,"endTime":425.699,"body":"like, if you want to do life"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":425.699,"endTime":427.919,"body":"drawing, we could do that. Or if"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":425.699,"endTime":427.919,"body":"you want to make something out"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":427.919,"endTime":434.549,"body":"of leaves, you can do that. So I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":427.919,"endTime":434.549,"body":"guess it was it just felt less"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":434.669,"endTime":438.149,"body":"structured. But But in that way,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":434.669,"endTime":438.149,"body":"you've got to try a lot more."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":438.179,"endTime":440.639,"body":"And you've got to actually work"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":438.179,"endTime":440.639,"body":"out what you enjoyed. Rather"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":440.639,"endTime":443.639,"body":"than having to kind of follow a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":440.639,"endTime":443.639,"body":"syllabus of like today, this is"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":443.639,"endTime":446.819,"body":"what you've got to do. And you"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":443.639,"endTime":446.819,"body":"must learn about unknown"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":446.819,"endTime":449.099,"body":"injection moulding, because your"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":446.819,"endTime":449.099,"body":"exam is going to be on that."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":449.849,"endTime":452.819,"body":"Whereas the foundation, it was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":449.849,"endTime":452.819,"body":"100% coursework based, and you"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":452.819,"endTime":458.129,"body":"could literally do anything for"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":452.819,"endTime":458.129,"body":"your final thing. So it was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":458.129,"endTime":463.499,"body":"really open, which I think I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":458.129,"endTime":463.499,"body":"enjoyed a lot."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":464.699,"endTime":466.619,"body":"That's good. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":464.699,"endTime":466.619,"body":"So it sounds like it was that"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":466.619,"endTime":469.559,"body":"kind of that freedom, that kind"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":466.619,"endTime":469.559,"body":"of unconstrained or went away"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":469.559,"endTime":473.519,"body":"from satellite, kind of a really"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":469.559,"endTime":473.519,"body":"tight syllabus. And yeah, you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":473.519,"endTime":475.979,"body":"got to do this to pass an exam,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":473.519,"endTime":475.979,"body":"if that allowed you to kind of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":476.279,"endTime":478.979,"body":"progress and develop, but you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":476.279,"endTime":478.979,"body":"still kind of came back to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":479.039,"endTime":482.249,"body":"product design and DMT in"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":479.039,"endTime":482.249,"body":"eventually, which is really"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":482.249,"endTime":486.119,"body":"nice. And good to see. So so"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":482.249,"endTime":486.119,"body":"that was really that's good to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":486.119,"endTime":488.099,"body":"kind of get your perspective of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":486.119,"endTime":488.099,"body":"where you've come from and your"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":488.099,"endTime":491.339,"body":"experience of education, now"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":488.099,"endTime":491.339,"body":"putting your your lecturer hat"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":491.339,"endTime":494.669,"body":"on, and kind of bringing those"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":491.339,"endTime":494.669,"body":"experiences up to kind of what"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":494.669,"endTime":498.029,"body":"you're seeing in our first year."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":494.669,"endTime":498.029,"body":"So you teach to the year leader"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":498.029,"endTime":502.379,"body":"for our first year be a product"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":498.029,"endTime":502.379,"body":"design course. What do you kind"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":502.379,"endTime":505.529,"body":"of see from them? Is there"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":502.379,"endTime":505.529,"body":"anything kind of you can bring"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":505.529,"endTime":508.529,"body":"from your own experiences, to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":505.529,"endTime":508.529,"body":"kind of see that people who are"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":508.529,"endTime":512.759,"body":"kind of weaker or stronger? And"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":508.529,"endTime":512.759,"body":"what do you think their"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":512.759,"endTime":515.519,"body":"education is giving them? Or"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":512.759,"endTime":515.519,"body":"perhaps not giving them that you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":515.519,"endTime":517.649,"body":"think they could be beneficial?"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":518.07,"endTime":522.72,"body":"Oh, I think"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":518.07,"endTime":522.72,"body":"something that is maybe still"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":522.72,"endTime":526.59,"body":"happening and happened with me"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":522.72,"endTime":526.59,"body":"when I was at uni is is like the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":526.59,"endTime":532.23,"body":"representation of staff compared"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":526.59,"endTime":532.23,"body":"to students. So I mean, we're"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":532.23,"endTime":534.93,"body":"quite lucky. I think NTU that we"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":532.23,"endTime":534.93,"body":"have quite a lot of female"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":534.93,"endTime":540.03,"body":"members of staff. And I think"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":534.93,"endTime":540.03,"body":"the students can see that. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":540.03,"endTime":542.43,"body":"we do still get female students"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":540.03,"endTime":542.43,"body":"kind of being like, Oh, well,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":542.43,"endTime":545.1,"body":"there aren't very many girls in"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":542.43,"endTime":545.1,"body":"here. And I'm like, well, that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":545.13,"endTime":547.62,"body":"there are a lot more every year"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":545.13,"endTime":547.62,"body":"I think like there were a few"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":547.62,"endTime":553.74,"body":"more. I mean, we're not like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":547.62,"endTime":553.74,"body":"5050, but it seems to be getting"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":553.74,"endTime":559.71,"body":"less of a like mostly boys and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":553.74,"endTime":559.71,"body":"then some girls. So I think"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":559.71,"endTime":562.2,"body":"that's definitely improving. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":559.71,"endTime":562.2,"body":"I think the representation that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":562.2,"endTime":566.52,"body":"they're kind of seeing is"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":562.2,"endTime":566.52,"body":"getting better. But I think"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":566.52,"endTime":567.69,"body":"there's still room for"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":566.52,"endTime":567.69,"body":"improvement."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":568.47,"endTime":571.47,"body":"Do you think that"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":568.47,"endTime":571.47,"body":"has an impact on the path you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":571.47,"endTime":573.6,"body":"took through your education"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":571.47,"endTime":573.6,"body":"where you said you were kind of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":573.6,"endTime":576.96,"body":"quite textiles based, and then"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":573.6,"endTime":576.96,"body":"you were kind of forced into"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":576.96,"endTime":579.45,"body":"spray levels and then you kind"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":576.96,"endTime":579.45,"body":"of rebelled against that for"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":579.45,"endTime":583.11,"body":"foundation? Do you is there a"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":579.45,"endTime":583.11,"body":"representation factor in that"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":583.11,"endTime":585.75,"body":"that you thought was kind of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":583.11,"endTime":585.75,"body":"what girls do or was it just"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":585.75,"endTime":587.7,"body":"kind of you followed your"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":585.75,"endTime":587.7,"body":"passions and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":588.84,"endTime":591.42,"body":"I think there was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":588.84,"endTime":591.42,"body":"so like my GCSE textile class"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":591.42,"endTime":594.15,"body":"there was one boy in it like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":591.42,"endTime":594.15,"body":"that was all the girls did"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":594.15,"endTime":596.58,"body":"textiles and food tech and all"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":594.15,"endTime":596.58,"body":"the boys did graphics and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":596.58,"endTime":600.78,"body":"resistant materials. But also"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":596.58,"endTime":600.78,"body":"when I did my job So I did my"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":600.78,"endTime":603.81,"body":"degree at Leeds Beckett"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":600.78,"endTime":603.81,"body":"University. It was a really"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":603.81,"endTime":608.31,"body":"small course, which again, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":603.81,"endTime":608.31,"body":"think was quite nice. But there"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":608.31,"endTime":613.89,"body":"were three girls. And everyone"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":608.31,"endTime":613.89,"body":"else was boys. And it was, you"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":613.89,"endTime":617.1,"body":"felt very like I'm the woman. So"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":613.89,"endTime":617.1,"body":"I've got to do like the the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":617.1,"endTime":622.23,"body":"projects that are about women."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":617.1,"endTime":622.23,"body":"On our staff were, there were"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":622.23,"endTime":624.81,"body":"three female members of staff."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":622.23,"endTime":624.81,"body":"But within my first year, one of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":624.81,"endTime":627.72,"body":"them retired and one of them"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":624.81,"endTime":627.72,"body":"went on maternity leave. So it"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":627.72,"endTime":631.2,"body":"wasn't until my second year that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":627.72,"endTime":631.2,"body":"I really saw that like female"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":631.2,"endTime":634.44,"body":"representation of like, oh, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":631.2,"endTime":634.44,"body":"can actually do that. And that."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":635.88,"endTime":639.51,"body":"I don't know. Like, we had a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":635.88,"endTime":639.51,"body":"really, she was a PhD student"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":640.59,"endTime":643.17,"body":"who came to work with us, and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":640.59,"endTime":643.17,"body":"she was looking at renewable"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":643.17,"endTime":646.26,"body":"energy in the Gambia, I think at"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":643.17,"endTime":646.26,"body":"that point, I was like, wow,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":646.26,"endTime":649.5,"body":"like, actually, women do do"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":646.26,"endTime":649.5,"body":"this. And it's really cool. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":649.5,"endTime":655.53,"body":"I think up until that point, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":649.5,"endTime":655.53,"body":"felt very like it was a manly a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":655.53,"endTime":659.43,"body":"manly kind of thing to be doing"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":655.53,"endTime":659.43,"body":"as your Yeah. But I do think"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":659.43,"endTime":662.94,"body":"that's improving from, from what"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":659.43,"endTime":662.94,"body":"I've seen, and even on the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":663.0,"endTime":665.31,"body":"course I did now live. So I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":663.0,"endTime":665.31,"body":"mean, I'm still in contact with"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":665.31,"endTime":667.92,"body":"some people there. And there are"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":665.31,"endTime":667.92,"body":"a lot more female students and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":667.92,"endTime":671.76,"body":"staff. So I think the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":667.92,"endTime":671.76,"body":"representation is getting"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":672.12,"endTime":674.94,"body":"better. But I think there's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":672.12,"endTime":674.94,"body":"still more that we could do."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":675.45,"endTime":678.78,"body":"Hmm, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":675.45,"endTime":678.78,"body":"Yeah. No, it is an interesting"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":678.78,"endTime":682.29,"body":"kind of current topic. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":678.78,"endTime":682.29,"body":"currently sitting on Allison's"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":682.29,"endTime":686.43,"body":"masters comm and do it if you're"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":682.29,"endTime":686.43,"body":"interested in education,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":686.52,"endTime":689.67,"body":"masters. But yeah, there's a lot"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":686.52,"endTime":689.67,"body":"of conversations going on with"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":689.67,"endTime":692.25,"body":"kind of all levels with a voice"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":689.67,"endTime":692.25,"body":"in higher education, and then"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":692.25,"endTime":695.28,"body":"secondary and down into primary"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":692.25,"endTime":695.28,"body":"about different kinds of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":695.28,"endTime":699.21,"body":"representation. decolonizing"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":695.28,"endTime":699.21,"body":"lots of lots of different things"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":699.21,"endTime":701.91,"body":"going on. 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So I know you I'm aware,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":711.78,"endTime":715.11,"body":"you kind of did a project with"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":711.78,"endTime":715.11,"body":"the RCA and things was part of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":715.11,"endTime":718.26,"body":"your undergrad or your masters"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":715.11,"endTime":718.26,"body":"and and that was around kind of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":719.04,"endTime":722.37,"body":"feminine health kind of style"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":719.04,"endTime":722.37,"body":"things. Do you again, do you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":722.37,"endTime":725.88,"body":"think you were was that a"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":722.37,"endTime":725.88,"body":"Passion Driven from you? Or was"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":725.88,"endTime":728.52,"body":"that kind of passion driven from"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":725.88,"endTime":728.52,"body":"kind of, or like something"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":728.52,"endTime":733.38,"body":"society was kind of subtly"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":728.52,"endTime":733.38,"body":"imposing on you, or what gave"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":733.38,"endTime":734.19,"body":"you that direction?"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":734.28,"endTime":738.15,"body":"I think, a bit of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":734.28,"endTime":738.15,"body":"both. So we were given in our"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":738.15,"endTime":742.02,"body":"final year, three RSA briefs,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":738.15,"endTime":742.02,"body":"and one of them was on"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":742.02,"endTime":744.93,"body":"packaging, and reducing"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":742.02,"endTime":744.93,"body":"packaging waste. One of them was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":744.93,"endTime":749.43,"body":"on like upcycling office"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":744.93,"endTime":749.43,"body":"furniture. And then the other"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":749.43,"endTime":754.74,"body":"one was on maternal health care."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":749.43,"endTime":754.74,"body":"And all the girls pick that one."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":755.55,"endTime":758.64,"body":"And one of the guys and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":755.55,"endTime":758.64,"body":"everybody else did like the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":758.64,"endTime":761.16,"body":"other two. And I think at that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":758.64,"endTime":761.16,"body":"point, I was really like, oh,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":761.79,"endTime":764.4,"body":"like the girls are doing the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":761.79,"endTime":764.4,"body":"women like I don't know, it felt"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":764.4,"endTime":767.34,"body":"really like the girls had almost"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":764.4,"endTime":767.34,"body":"taken that responsibility of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":767.34,"endTime":770.91,"body":"like, well, this is a project"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":767.34,"endTime":770.91,"body":"about women. So the women should"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":770.91,"endTime":775.23,"body":"be doing that. I don't know, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":770.91,"endTime":775.23,"body":"did feel like a responsibility"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":775.23,"endTime":779.55,"body":"to choose that brief. Sure. And"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":775.23,"endTime":779.55,"body":"I mean, for me, it did turn out"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":779.55,"endTime":782.37,"body":"quite well. I mean, I won the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":779.55,"endTime":782.37,"body":"RSA award, and then within my"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":782.37,"endTime":786.75,"body":"master's kind of went to, like,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":782.37,"endTime":786.75,"body":"carried on with it a bit. But I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":786.75,"endTime":791.49,"body":"think looking back now, I do"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":786.75,"endTime":791.49,"body":"wish that maybe I just picked I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":791.49,"endTime":794.19,"body":"don't know, something like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":791.49,"endTime":794.19,"body":"really beautiful to do. I think"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":794.19,"endTime":797.91,"body":"I was trying to tackle really"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":794.19,"endTime":797.91,"body":"hard topics. But I guess I felt"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":797.91,"endTime":799.8,"body":"a response, like a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":797.91,"endTime":799.8,"body":"responsibility to do that"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":799.8,"endTime":803.73,"body":"because nobody else was. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":804.99,"endTime":807.21,"body":"It's interesting"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":804.99,"endTime":807.21,"body":"you say that because the other"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":807.21,"endTime":811.41,"body":"end of kind of DMT education the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":807.21,"endTime":811.41,"body":"kind of the final year of our"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":811.41,"endTime":814.62,"body":"undergraduate and I guess kind"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":811.41,"endTime":814.62,"body":"of postgrads you do find that a"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":814.62,"endTime":818.46,"body":"lot of the a lot of the female"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":814.62,"endTime":818.46,"body":"students want to kind of tackle"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":818.46,"endTime":824.7,"body":"these big ethical dilemmas"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":818.46,"endTime":824.7,"body":"safety on the streets, kind of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":824.94,"endTime":827.49,"body":"sorting out the NHS and the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":824.94,"endTime":827.49,"body":"projects and things and it's it"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":827.49,"endTime":830.34,"body":"is interesting, but whilst it's"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":827.49,"endTime":830.34,"body":"really good to have those kinds"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":830.34,"endTime":835.86,"body":"of wider ethical ideas, those"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":830.34,"endTime":835.86,"body":"get those projects are really"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":835.86,"endTime":838.26,"body":"difficult to do and sometimes"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":835.86,"endTime":838.26,"body":"Yeah, is it nicer just to kind"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":838.26,"endTime":841.14,"body":"of do something that's really"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":838.26,"endTime":841.14,"body":"beautiful, but you you something"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":841.14,"endTime":844.35,"body":"for you, it's, it's an"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":841.14,"endTime":844.35,"body":"interesting, dynamic to, to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":844.35,"endTime":848.34,"body":"think about. Okay, so, so with"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":844.35,"endTime":848.34,"body":"the idea then of kind of the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":848.37,"endTime":851.79,"body":"representation changing and more"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":848.37,"endTime":851.79,"body":"kind of women role models"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":851.79,"endTime":854.88,"body":"appearing. And hopefully, these"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":851.79,"endTime":854.88,"body":"this series of podcasts I'm"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":854.88,"endTime":857.52,"body":"running, hopefully produce some"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":854.88,"endTime":857.52,"body":"more of those role models to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":857.52,"endTime":860.46,"body":"show that people are being"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":857.52,"endTime":860.46,"body":"successful in the industry."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":860.46,"endTime":864.57,"body":"Well, how would you for people"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":860.46,"endTime":864.57,"body":"kind of teaching students are"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":864.57,"endTime":867.18,"body":"coming up to hopefully coming up"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":864.57,"endTime":867.18,"body":"to higher education or off into"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":867.18,"endTime":870.33,"body":"the design world in some way?"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":867.18,"endTime":870.33,"body":"Well, if you've got any kind of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":870.72,"endTime":873.24,"body":"advice or things you think they"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":870.72,"endTime":873.24,"body":"could do to kind of help out"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":873.24,"endTime":874.59,"body":"with the the issues you're"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":873.24,"endTime":874.59,"body":"seeing,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":875.16,"endTime":880.59,"body":"Oh, I think it's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":875.16,"endTime":880.59,"body":"it's showing that lots of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":880.59,"endTime":884.49,"body":"different people kind of do do"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":880.59,"endTime":884.49,"body":"this kind of as a job. So I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":884.49,"endTime":887.22,"body":"mean, we've tried to do it a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":884.49,"endTime":887.22,"body":"little bit in our the first"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":887.22,"endTime":889.68,"body":"project we'll do in the first"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":887.22,"endTime":889.68,"body":"year this year. So we get the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":889.68,"endTime":894.27,"body":"students to kind of design a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":889.68,"endTime":894.27,"body":"house hold product in the style"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":894.27,"endTime":898.65,"body":"of a designer, and this year,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":894.27,"endTime":898.65,"body":"we'd kind of opted for like not"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":898.65,"endTime":901.59,"body":"doing it with any kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":898.65,"endTime":901.59,"body":"straight white men just to show"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":901.59,"endTime":906.84,"body":"that like there are other people"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":901.59,"endTime":906.84,"body":"out there. And I don't know, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":906.84,"endTime":909.57,"body":"think stuff like that can be"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":906.84,"endTime":909.57,"body":"really useful just to show that,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":910.29,"endTime":913.89,"body":"that there are people doing"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":910.29,"endTime":913.89,"body":"those jobs that are like you."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":913.95,"endTime":920.22,"body":"And I think the more you can do"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":913.95,"endTime":920.22,"body":"that the better. Really? Yeah."},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":921.39,"endTime":923.4,"body":"That's yeah. Just your"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":923.43,"endTime":926.01,"body":"Yeah, right now, I"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":923.43,"endTime":926.01,"body":"think that's the that's the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":926.01,"endTime":928.47,"body":"start of it, I guess, isn't it"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":926.01,"endTime":928.47,"body":"to kind of Yeah, have good"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":928.5,"endTime":931.92,"body":"examples to show and not not"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":928.5,"endTime":931.92,"body":"fall back to our good old"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":931.92,"endTime":935.85,"body":"Philippe Stark. And yeah, the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":931.92,"endTime":935.85,"body":"old kind of typical people and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":935.85,"endTime":940.17,"body":"Dyson as, as wonderful as those"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":935.85,"endTime":940.17,"body":"people, maybe it's good to have"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":940.17,"endTime":943.77,"body":"some kind of yeah, nice examples"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":940.17,"endTime":943.77,"body":"of people doing things"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":943.77,"endTime":945.84,"body":"differently, or people being"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":943.77,"endTime":945.84,"body":"successful that you wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":945.84,"endTime":948.24,"body":"necessarily think about. So"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":945.84,"endTime":948.24,"body":"that's really good. And yeah,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":948.24,"endTime":951.69,"body":"hopefully we we do that too, as"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":948.24,"endTime":951.69,"body":"well. Okay, excellent. So the"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":951.69,"endTime":953.91,"body":"kind of my final question for"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":951.69,"endTime":953.91,"body":"you, then, is there anything"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":954.48,"endTime":956.61,"body":"interesting that you'd like to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":954.48,"endTime":956.61,"body":"kind of share in terms of"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":956.61,"endTime":959.79,"body":"articles, podcasts, books,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":956.61,"endTime":959.79,"body":"things you've read, that you"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":959.79,"endTime":962.19,"body":"think could be really beneficial"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":959.79,"endTime":962.19,"body":"for other people to read and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":962.25,"endTime":964.86,"body":"kind of think about as they"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":962.25,"endTime":964.86,"body":"develop?"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":965.28,"endTime":968.13,"body":"Yeah, I think as a,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":965.28,"endTime":968.13,"body":"as a design student, I was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":968.13,"endTime":970.29,"body":"really like, Oh, my God, I need"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":968.13,"endTime":970.29,"body":"to know loads of stuff about"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":970.32,"endTime":974.88,"body":"design and like, designers. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":970.32,"endTime":974.88,"body":"I think actually, it's more"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":974.88,"endTime":978.84,"body":"useful to just look at kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":974.88,"endTime":978.84,"body":"everything, which, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":978.84,"endTime":982.05,"body":"if that makes sense. But like,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":978.84,"endTime":982.05,"body":"watching, even watching the news"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":982.05,"endTime":984.0,"body":"and stuff like that, like, I"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":982.05,"endTime":984.0,"body":"think you need to be really"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":984.0,"endTime":986.7,"body":"aware of the world around you to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":984.0,"endTime":986.7,"body":"be able to understand,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":987.03,"endTime":989.82,"body":"particularly as a designer, like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":987.03,"endTime":989.82,"body":"how people work and like you can"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":989.82,"endTime":994.14,"body":"kind of build empathy. So for"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":989.82,"endTime":994.14,"body":"me, though, I listened to a lot"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":994.14,"endTime":998.55,"body":"of podcasts, because they're"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":994.14,"endTime":998.55,"body":"quite easy to digest. And"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":998.58,"endTime":1003.23,"body":"they're good on the tram, which"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":998.58,"endTime":1003.23,"body":"I spend a lot of time doing. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1003.23,"endTime":1005.93,"body":"for me, like, the guilty"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1003.23,"endTime":1005.93,"body":"feminist is a great one. Because"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1005.93,"endTime":1009.05,"body":"I mean, particularly for women,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1005.93,"endTime":1009.05,"body":"I mean, they tackle really big"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1009.32,"endTime":1013.67,"body":"women's issues, but also just"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1009.32,"endTime":1013.67,"body":"issues that are kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1014.33,"endTime":1019.82,"body":"surrounding people that have"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1014.33,"endTime":1019.82,"body":"less of a voice. So I think what"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1019.82,"endTime":1021.95,"body":"they do is very nice. I mean,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1019.82,"endTime":1021.95,"body":"they're every week, and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1021.95,"endTime":1024.65,"body":"sometimes they're like really"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1021.95,"endTime":1024.65,"body":"kind of big feminist topics. And"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1024.65,"endTime":1027.47,"body":"sometimes it's something that's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1024.65,"endTime":1027.47,"body":"like, kind of really small and,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1027.74,"endTime":1029.84,"body":"and everything that they say is"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1027.74,"endTime":1029.84,"body":"really kind of valid and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1029.84,"endTime":1032.69,"body":"important and like educational,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1029.84,"endTime":1032.69,"body":"and quite a lot of the time,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1032.72,"endTime":1035.09,"body":"I'll be still on the tram like,"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1032.72,"endTime":1035.09,"body":"wow, I hadn't even thought about"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1035.09,"endTime":1039.74,"body":"that, like, so that's, that's a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1035.09,"endTime":1039.74,"body":"really good one. And it is quite"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1039.74,"endTime":1042.56,"body":"light. So it's not to like"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1039.74,"endTime":1042.56,"body":"information kind of all the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1042.56,"endTime":1047.87,"body":"time, which is nice. There was"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1042.56,"endTime":1047.87,"body":"another podcast I listened to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1047.87,"endTime":1052.43,"body":"last year, that was put on by"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1047.87,"endTime":1052.43,"body":"the British Library called"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1052.46,"endTime":1055.34,"body":"unfinished business. And that's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1052.46,"endTime":1055.34,"body":"another one looking at women's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1055.34,"endTime":1059.48,"body":"rights. And I think it's only"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1055.34,"endTime":1059.48,"body":"like an eight part thing. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1059.48,"endTime":1062.84,"body":"again, quite interesting to look"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1059.48,"endTime":1062.84,"body":"at that from, like, kind of"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1062.84,"endTime":1065.81,"body":"historical events from a female"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1062.84,"endTime":1065.81,"body":"perspective. So that's, that's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1065.81,"endTime":1067.94,"body":"quite interesting, and wanted to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1065.81,"endTime":1067.94,"body":"have a listen to and it's quite"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1067.94,"endTime":1073.34,"body":"short. And then with, with"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1067.94,"endTime":1073.34,"body":"books, I've been reading some"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1073.34,"endTime":1077.3,"body":"books. At the moment, I've been"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1073.34,"endTime":1077.3,"body":"reading one called The Future"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1077.3,"endTime":1081.35,"body":"Earth at the moment, which is"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1077.3,"endTime":1081.35,"body":"more around the environment and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1081.35,"endTime":1086.78,"body":"sustainability by Eric cope"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1081.35,"endTime":1086.78,"body":"house. But it's almost like a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1086.78,"endTime":1090.8,"body":"future forecast of like how bad"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1086.78,"endTime":1090.8,"body":"global warming could be if we"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1090.8,"endTime":1095.18,"body":"kind of carry on the way we go"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1090.8,"endTime":1095.18,"body":"in at the moment. And that's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1095.18,"endTime":1097.55,"body":"been really interesting, because"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1095.18,"endTime":1097.55,"body":"it's almost like reading like a"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1097.55,"endTime":1101.21,"body":"dystopian future novel. But"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1097.55,"endTime":1101.21,"body":"actually, it's all based on kind"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1101.21,"endTime":1105.74,"body":"of fact, and could potentially"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1101.21,"endTime":1105.74,"body":"happen if, if we carry on the"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1105.74,"endTime":1108.14,"body":"way we're going, which is quite"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1105.74,"endTime":1108.14,"body":"interesting. It's quite nice to"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1108.14,"endTime":1110.15,"body":"look in there for for projects"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1108.14,"endTime":1110.15,"body":"and things that we could"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1110.15,"endTime":1114.44,"body":"potentially be doing with our"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1110.15,"endTime":1114.44,"body":"students. So yeah, there, there"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1114.44,"endTime":1117.8,"body":"are a few things, but it's"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1114.44,"endTime":1117.8,"body":"looking at things around you and"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1117.8,"endTime":1122.6,"body":"not just focusing on that design"},{"speaker":"Emily Brook","startTime":1117.8,"endTime":1122.6,"body":"kind of stuff all the time."},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1123.56,"endTime":1126.23,"body":"Or that designer"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1123.56,"endTime":1126.23,"body":"curriculum or something. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1126.26,"endTime":1129.89,"body":"sometimes squeezed and squashed"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1126.26,"endTime":1129.89,"body":"and forced into a specific way"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1129.89,"endTime":1132.38,"body":"of doing things. And yeah,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1129.89,"endTime":1132.38,"body":"hopefully, hopefully, people"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1132.38,"endTime":1135.23,"body":"listening to this, if anyone is"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1132.38,"endTime":1135.23,"body":"listening. Hopefully those"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1135.23,"endTime":1137.6,"body":"people are kind of here willing"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1135.23,"endTime":1137.6,"body":"to look beyond there and stuff"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1137.6,"endTime":1140.45,"body":"and excited about interesting"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1137.6,"endTime":1140.45,"body":"things like this. And yeah,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1140.72,"endTime":1145.4,"body":"maybe maybe saving the future"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1140.72,"endTime":1145.4,"body":"Earth for on the beach or"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1145.4,"endTime":1148.19,"body":"something where you've got"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1145.4,"endTime":1148.19,"body":"positive outlook around these"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1148.43,"endTime":1151.28,"body":"negative tones. But brilliant,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1148.43,"endTime":1151.28,"body":"no, thank you. Thank you very"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1151.28,"endTime":1154.7,"body":"much, Emily, thank you for your"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1151.28,"endTime":1154.7,"body":"time. So I'll make sure that"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1154.7,"endTime":1158.03,"body":"those recommendations for books"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1154.7,"endTime":1158.03,"body":"and podcasts are in the show"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1158.03,"endTime":1161.93,"body":"notes. And other than that,"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1158.03,"endTime":1161.93,"body":"yeah, feel free, remember to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1161.93,"endTime":1166.16,"body":"share, like and share this and"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1161.93,"endTime":1166.16,"body":"follow Alison and everything on"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1166.16,"endTime":1168.5,"body":"her on her socials and all those"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1166.16,"endTime":1168.5,"body":"other things that she likes to"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1168.5,"endTime":1171.32,"body":"talk about at the end of her"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1168.5,"endTime":1171.32,"body":"podcasts. And now a really"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1171.32,"endTime":1173.21,"body":"interesting chat, really"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1171.32,"endTime":1173.21,"body":"informative hope that was useful"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1173.21,"endTime":1177.35,"body":"for the people listening. And"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1173.21,"endTime":1177.35,"body":"yeah, for myself. I look forward"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1177.35,"endTime":1180.71,"body":"to speaking to you guys and our"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1177.35,"endTime":1180.71,"body":"next chapters of our guest"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1180.71,"endTime":1184.07,"body":"hosts. But I think very much"},{"speaker":"Max Pownall","startTime":1180.71,"endTime":1184.07,"body":"Emily and I'll see you all again"}]}