{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1.02,"endTime":3.3,"body":"So this week, I've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1.02,"endTime":3.3,"body":"got another guest on the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":3.3,"endTime":7.53,"body":"podcast, I've got Andy Marston,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":3.3,"endTime":7.53,"body":"who's up in Yorkshire to come"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":7.53,"endTime":9.12,"body":"and talk about some of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":7.53,"endTime":9.12,"body":"things that have been in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":9.12,"endTime":13.47,"body":"news about design and technology"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":9.12,"endTime":13.47,"body":"recently. And he was also part"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":13.47,"endTime":17.22,"body":"of the project team for the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":13.47,"endTime":17.22,"body":"redesigning D and T project that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":17.22,"endTime":19.11,"body":"we're running. There's quite a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":17.22,"endTime":19.11,"body":"group of us doing that, well,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":19.11,"endTime":20.94,"body":"actually, they're all running"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":19.11,"endTime":20.94,"body":"it. And I'm in the background"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":20.94,"endTime":24.39,"body":"and Andy's joining in with that,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":20.94,"endTime":24.39,"body":"and contributing to that, which"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":24.39,"endTime":27.9,"body":"is where this discussion, sort"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":24.39,"endTime":27.9,"body":"of started thinking about what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":27.9,"endTime":31.77,"body":"we'd want in a D and T"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":27.9,"endTime":31.77,"body":"curriculum. But before we dive"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":31.77,"endTime":34.92,"body":"into the conversation, Andy, can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":31.77,"endTime":34.92,"body":"you just say a little bit about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":34.92,"endTime":36.78,"body":"who you are, where you are and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":34.92,"endTime":36.78,"body":"what you do?"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":37.68,"endTime":41.01,"body":"Hi, I'm a teacher"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":37.68,"endTime":41.01,"body":"of design and technology and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":41.01,"endTime":45.96,"body":"have been since 1986. I have"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":41.01,"endTime":45.96,"body":"taught in a few different"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":45.96,"endTime":50.55,"body":"schools, but I've been at the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":45.96,"endTime":50.55,"body":"school now, for 27 years. So an"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":50.55,"endTime":55.65,"body":"old timer I'm on I'm getting"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":50.55,"endTime":55.65,"body":"close to retiring. And I've seen"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":55.65,"endTime":58.32,"body":"this object through a huge"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":55.65,"endTime":58.32,"body":"number of different changes,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":59.22,"endTime":63.48,"body":"driven by all sorts of different"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":59.22,"endTime":63.48,"body":"reasons, mostly from top down"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":63.51,"endTime":68.37,"body":"from the government down and had"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":63.51,"endTime":68.37,"body":"to cope with some irrational"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":68.37,"endTime":72.51,"body":"decisions and some really great"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":68.37,"endTime":72.51,"body":"ideas. I love teaching design"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":72.51,"endTime":75.51,"body":"technology, I work by myself"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":72.51,"endTime":75.51,"body":"pretty much in Designer"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":75.51,"endTime":82.02,"body":"technology. And I teach just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":75.51,"endTime":82.02,"body":"about everything you can do. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":82.23,"endTime":85.74,"body":"am not very good at textiles, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":82.23,"endTime":85.74,"body":"have to admit it's a new one on"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":85.74,"endTime":88.74,"body":"me. And I'm kind of struggling"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":85.74,"endTime":88.74,"body":"with that one. But I'm very"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":88.74,"endTime":92.52,"body":"focused on on supporting"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":88.74,"endTime":92.52,"body":"children learning the things"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":92.52,"endTime":95.52,"body":"that they want to learn and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":92.52,"endTime":95.52,"body":"supporting them in their"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":95.52,"endTime":96.15,"body":"journey."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":96.78,"endTime":99.12,"body":"So if you've been"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":96.78,"endTime":99.12,"body":"around since 86, that was pre"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":99.12,"endTime":102.72,"body":"national curriculum. It is."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":99.12,"endTime":102.72,"body":"Alright, because I was doing my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":102.72,"endTime":105.15,"body":"training as a national"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":102.72,"endTime":105.15,"body":"curriculum was coming in. So I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":105.15,"endTime":107.37,"body":"kind of relate to you. Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":107.61,"endTime":111.18,"body":"yeah, I remember"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":107.61,"endTime":111.18,"body":"it. Well, I came in at the end"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":111.18,"endTime":115.8,"body":"of my first year. And I remember"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":111.18,"endTime":115.8,"body":"sitting in a meeting, and I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":115.8,"endTime":117.6,"body":"hadn't really read it in the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":115.8,"endTime":117.6,"body":"summer holidays, I've got to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":117.6,"endTime":120.69,"body":"admit. And the first meeting"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":117.6,"endTime":120.69,"body":"back, my head of department knew"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":120.69,"endTime":123.42,"body":"very well that I hadn't read it."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":120.69,"endTime":123.42,"body":"So he went straight to me. What"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":123.42,"endTime":126.69,"body":"do you think there's national"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":123.42,"endTime":126.69,"body":"curriculum? And yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":126.69,"endTime":131.46,"body":"lovely. But interestingly, the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":126.69,"endTime":131.46,"body":"food teachers were all were all"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":131.46,"endTime":134.34,"body":"over it, because they weren't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":131.46,"endTime":134.34,"body":"included. The first the first"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":134.34,"endTime":140.13,"body":"draft food had gone. And I think"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":134.34,"endTime":140.13,"body":"the government had they'd been"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":140.13,"endTime":141.93,"body":"praying there'd been a lot of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":140.13,"endTime":141.93,"body":"people pushing design"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":141.96,"endTime":144.9,"body":"technology, and had been nobody"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":141.96,"endTime":144.9,"body":"on the food side said anything"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":144.9,"endTime":147.39,"body":"about it. So there's just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":144.9,"endTime":147.39,"body":"ignored it. And ignored"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":147.39,"endTime":152.64,"body":"completely the fact that schools"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":147.39,"endTime":152.64,"body":"basically balanced groups, they"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":152.64,"endTime":155.91,"body":"either in food or or design"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":152.64,"endTime":155.91,"body":"technology, lessons CDT lessons"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":155.91,"endTime":158.7,"body":"it was done. So just from a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":155.91,"endTime":158.7,"body":"practical point of view, could"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":158.7,"endTime":161.55,"body":"could you just couldn't get rid"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":158.7,"endTime":161.55,"body":"of food, because then you'd have"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":161.58,"endTime":164.76,"body":"what the rest of kids do. They"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":161.58,"endTime":164.76,"body":"weren't the facilities for that."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":164.76,"endTime":170.16,"body":"So. But the idea that you would"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":164.76,"endTime":170.16,"body":"not teach food, when every"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":170.16,"endTime":173.88,"body":"single human has to eat, and has"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":170.16,"endTime":173.88,"body":"to have some capacity to make"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":173.88,"endTime":175.5,"body":"decisions about food, even if"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":173.88,"endTime":175.5,"body":"they don't cook it for"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":175.5,"endTime":179.82,"body":"themselves, is quite scary,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":175.5,"endTime":179.82,"body":"really. But just it just was a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":179.91,"endTime":181.98,"body":"an afterthought. They just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":179.91,"endTime":181.98,"body":"tacked it in. And that's, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":181.98,"endTime":186.33,"body":"think, work at food technology."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":181.98,"endTime":186.33,"body":"So it was drafted in to make it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":186.33,"endTime":187.02,"body":"important."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":187.86,"endTime":189.78,"body":"Yeah, there was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":187.86,"endTime":189.78,"body":"kind of quite a lot of debate."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":189.78,"endTime":192.99,"body":"I've written about it in my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":189.78,"endTime":192.99,"body":"doctorate about some of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":192.99,"endTime":196.38,"body":"history about food being in and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":192.99,"endTime":196.38,"body":"being out of design and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":196.38,"endTime":200.4,"body":"technology. And well, it's still"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":196.38,"endTime":200.4,"body":"an ongoing thing, isn't it? Yes,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":200.43,"endTime":203.76,"body":"absolutely. Taking in nutrition,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":200.43,"endTime":203.76,"body":"and food nutrition and no, a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":203.76,"endTime":206.79,"body":"level progression. We just had a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":203.76,"endTime":206.79,"body":"book club last week for the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":206.79,"endTime":209.55,"body":"debates book. And we were"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":206.79,"endTime":209.55,"body":"looking at that chapter does"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":209.58,"endTime":214.71,"body":"does food fit? And some of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":209.58,"endTime":214.71,"body":"discussions are, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":214.71,"endTime":217.41,"body":"they've been around for the 30"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":214.71,"endTime":217.41,"body":"years, we've had the national"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":217.41,"endTime":220.98,"body":"curriculum, really? I'm not sure"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":217.41,"endTime":220.98,"body":"they're going to be resolved"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":220.98,"endTime":224.58,"body":"very easily. But yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":225.06,"endTime":228.42,"body":"I think it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":225.06,"endTime":228.42,"body":"a subject that has a right to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":228.42,"endTime":231.57,"body":"exist without being part of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":228.42,"endTime":231.57,"body":"design technology, if it wants"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":231.57,"endTime":234.66,"body":"to, if it fits in a school, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":231.57,"endTime":234.66,"body":"then it works. Being part of the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":234.66,"endTime":238.32,"body":"same department. That's great."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":234.66,"endTime":238.32,"body":"But it has absolute value in its"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":238.32,"endTime":240.84,"body":"own right, just as any other"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":238.32,"endTime":240.84,"body":"subject that's currently on the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":240.84,"endTime":241.35,"body":"curriculum."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":241.919,"endTime":246.239,"body":"Yeah, yeah. It's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":241.919,"endTime":246.239,"body":"where you see it kind of where"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":246.239,"endTime":249.299,"body":"you got staff expertise and what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":246.239,"endTime":249.299,"body":"what the place of food is seen"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":249.299,"endTime":254.339,"body":"in within that school, whether"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":249.299,"endTime":254.339,"body":"it's a general part of personal"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":254.339,"endTime":257.609,"body":"health education, whether it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":254.339,"endTime":257.609,"body":"part of a school subject in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":257.609,"endTime":259.889,"body":"terms of a qualification, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":257.609,"endTime":259.889,"body":"mean, it's can be both things,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":259.889,"endTime":263.189,"body":"but it's kind of understanding"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":259.889,"endTime":263.189,"body":"that anyway, we digress. We have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":263.189,"endTime":266.999,"body":"a whole conversation, spin off"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":263.189,"endTime":266.999,"body":"conversation about that. But"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":266.999,"endTime":271.439,"body":"really, we wanted to kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":266.999,"endTime":271.439,"body":"talk about the proposals were"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":271.439,"endTime":275.009,"body":"not so much the proposals for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":271.439,"endTime":275.009,"body":"specifically example quite vague"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":275.009,"endTime":280.739,"body":"at the moment from Pearson's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":275.009,"endTime":280.739,"body":"around a proposal for new design"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":280.739,"endTime":283.859,"body":"and technology curriculum, which"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":280.739,"endTime":283.859,"body":"is what we're sort of looking at"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":283.859,"endTime":287.489,"body":"as a group but Pearson has taken"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":283.859,"endTime":287.489,"body":"a slightly different approach."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":287.669,"endTime":291.059,"body":"And you had some some thoughts"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":287.669,"endTime":291.059,"body":"around that and instead, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":291.059,"endTime":293.039,"body":"want to kick us off with what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":291.059,"endTime":293.039,"body":"your thoughts are, and I'll"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":293.039,"endTime":294.029,"body":"follow lead."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":294.33,"endTime":297.51,"body":"I've spent ever"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":294.33,"endTime":297.51,"body":"since I heard of this proposal,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":297.51,"endTime":302.22,"body":"I can just as I said earlier, a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":297.51,"endTime":302.22,"body":"bit irritate aided by about what"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":302.22,"endTime":304.26,"body":"they do, and I couldn't really"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":302.22,"endTime":304.26,"body":"put my finger exactly on what it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":304.26,"endTime":307.08,"body":"was. And there's a number of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":304.26,"endTime":307.08,"body":"things that annoy me about, it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":307.08,"endTime":311.16,"body":"not necessarily the subject"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":307.08,"endTime":311.16,"body":"matter of sustainability. But"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":311.16,"endTime":314.61,"body":"more that they've just launched"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":311.16,"endTime":314.61,"body":"in with a solution without"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":315.51,"endTime":318.51,"body":"involving the people or teaching"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":315.51,"endTime":318.51,"body":"it and actually identifying what"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":318.51,"endTime":321.15,"body":"the problem is. And this is"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":318.51,"endTime":321.15,"body":"something that's happened quite"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":321.15,"endTime":325.14,"body":"a number of times in my teaching"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":321.15,"endTime":325.14,"body":"career where people have solved"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":325.14,"endTime":328.62,"body":"a problem that either doesn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":325.14,"endTime":328.62,"body":"exist in the first place, or"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":329.34,"endTime":333.42,"body":"hasn't really solved a part of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":329.34,"endTime":333.42,"body":"the problem, or it solves it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":333.42,"endTime":338.19,"body":"from a direction that isn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":333.42,"endTime":338.19,"body":"appropriate. And so is that from"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":338.19,"endTime":340.86,"body":"from that point, so it hasn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":338.19,"endTime":340.86,"body":"adopted a design and technology"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":340.86,"endTime":344.64,"body":"type approach to things. So they"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":340.86,"endTime":344.64,"body":"haven't sat down and thought,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":345.12,"endTime":350.34,"body":"what we're trying to do, it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":345.12,"endTime":350.34,"body":"much more a matter of buzzwords"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":350.34,"endTime":352.77,"body":"and saying, oh, sustainability,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":350.34,"endTime":352.77,"body":"that's the thing at the minute."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":352.77,"endTime":356.55,"body":"So let's make a course based on"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":352.77,"endTime":356.55,"body":"that. And, and the devil will be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":356.55,"endTime":360.54,"body":"in the detail, particularly the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":356.55,"endTime":360.54,"body":"assessment and stuff, and the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":360.72,"endTime":363.57,"body":"amount of coursework, the amount"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":360.72,"endTime":363.57,"body":"of exam and all that sort of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":363.57,"endTime":367.23,"body":"stuff. It's it's difficult to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":363.57,"endTime":367.23,"body":"really contribute to this"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":367.23,"endTime":369.9,"body":"discussion, when you've"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":367.23,"endTime":369.9,"body":"somebody's coming up with a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":369.9,"endTime":376.59,"body":"vague concept of a solution. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":369.9,"endTime":376.59,"body":"ignored all the professionals."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":377.31,"endTime":379.26,"body":"Yeah, I mean, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":377.31,"endTime":379.26,"body":"think Phil would say when it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":379.26,"endTime":383.67,"body":"comes to Phil's defence that he"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":379.26,"endTime":383.67,"body":"has consulted with some design"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":383.67,"endTime":386.73,"body":"and technology teachers and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":383.67,"endTime":386.73,"body":"attempted to console, I can see"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":386.73,"endTime":391.2,"body":"him. You know, I'm kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":386.73,"endTime":391.2,"body":"trying to defend Phil's call."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":391.2,"endTime":395.01,"body":"And I've got some concerns about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":391.2,"endTime":395.01,"body":"the approach. But I think what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":395.04,"endTime":398.58,"body":"you're saying is, it's kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":395.04,"endTime":398.58,"body":"like a top down approach, rather"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":398.58,"endTime":401.19,"body":"than really driven and led by"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":398.58,"endTime":401.19,"body":"the community."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":401.73,"endTime":404.34,"body":"Well, it's it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":401.73,"endTime":404.34,"body":"like the, it's going back to the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":404.34,"endTime":407.58,"body":"national curriculum situation"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":404.34,"endTime":407.58,"body":"where there was a group of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":407.61,"endTime":411.06,"body":"vociferous people said, This is"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":407.61,"endTime":411.06,"body":"what we need. And it was taking"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":411.06,"endTime":415.38,"body":"design technology to very much"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":411.06,"endTime":415.38,"body":"more the technology side of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":415.38,"endTime":419.22,"body":"things, engineering, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":415.38,"endTime":419.22,"body":"electronics systems and control"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":419.22,"endTime":424.11,"body":"that type of thing that was seen"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":419.22,"endTime":424.11,"body":"as being the new thing. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":424.11,"endTime":427.26,"body":"taking, and just ignoring the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":424.11,"endTime":427.26,"body":"bits they didn't like, so just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":427.26,"endTime":437.43,"body":"get rid of everything else. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":427.26,"endTime":437.43,"body":"just I think the problem is that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":437.67,"endTime":440.85,"body":"there's recognition amongst many"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":437.67,"endTime":440.85,"body":"people that, that there's a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":440.85,"endTime":443.52,"body":"problem with the subject, the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":440.85,"endTime":443.52,"body":"numbers of students taking the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":443.52,"endTime":446.31,"body":"subject of dropping"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":443.52,"endTime":446.31,"body":"dramatically. And that's, that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":446.31,"endTime":449.55,"body":"an issue that we really"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":446.31,"endTime":449.55,"body":"desperately need to address. But"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":449.7,"endTime":453.33,"body":"the solution for a lot of people"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":449.7,"endTime":453.33,"body":"is that not a lot of people, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":453.33,"endTime":456.66,"body":"some people is to make the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":453.33,"endTime":456.66,"body":"subject give it the greatest"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":456.66,"endTime":460.59,"body":"status. But that's, that's,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":456.66,"endTime":460.59,"body":"that's taking the subject more"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":460.59,"endTime":464.76,"body":"and more academic, and taking it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":460.59,"endTime":464.76,"body":"down a route, where we're trying"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":464.76,"endTime":469.11,"body":"to appeal to the people at the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":464.76,"endTime":469.11,"body":"top, in the hope that they'll"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":469.14,"endTime":473.04,"body":"they'll, I guess, put as part of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":469.14,"endTime":473.04,"body":"the back and give us that sort"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":473.04,"endTime":476.28,"body":"of status. And for me, that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":473.04,"endTime":476.28,"body":"gonna"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":476.28,"endTime":479.73,"body":"happen. No, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":476.28,"endTime":479.73,"body":"think we've moved on, right."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":479.79,"endTime":480.15,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":480.27,"endTime":481.86,"body":"the government's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":480.27,"endTime":481.86,"body":"moved on from it, they've"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":481.86,"endTime":483.75,"body":"forgotten about that. And now"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":481.86,"endTime":483.75,"body":"that they don't talk about the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":483.75,"endTime":486.39,"body":"back, I know, it's a school"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":483.75,"endTime":486.39,"body":"accountability measure. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":486.39,"endTime":489.15,"body":"that's it. Really, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":486.39,"endTime":489.15,"body":"account. It doesn't affect any"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":489.15,"endTime":493.56,"body":"student. I don't, I don't know"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":489.15,"endTime":493.56,"body":"of any courses that the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":493.59,"endTime":497.07,"body":"university that demand any back,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":493.59,"endTime":497.07,"body":"they might give a bit of lip"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":497.07,"endTime":501.39,"body":"service to it. But it's, it's,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":497.07,"endTime":501.39,"body":"we've gone from a situation"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":501.39,"endTime":507.42,"body":"where we've been compulsory. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":501.39,"endTime":507.42,"body":"I think maybe some departments"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":507.42,"endTime":509.85,"body":"and some teachers, maybe all of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":507.42,"endTime":509.85,"body":"us were a bit complacent about"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":509.85,"endTime":512.46,"body":"that, and just accepted that we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":509.85,"endTime":512.46,"body":"just get all the students"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":512.46,"endTime":515.19,"body":"through and we were having money"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":512.46,"endTime":515.19,"body":"thrown at us, and it was"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":515.19,"endTime":521.52,"body":"wonderful. Then we've become"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":515.19,"endTime":521.52,"body":"optional. And now we're not part"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":521.52,"endTime":525.39,"body":"of the back. And we're and I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":521.52,"endTime":525.39,"body":"right thinking saying that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":525.6,"endTime":529.98,"body":"academies can just dismiss"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":525.6,"endTime":529.98,"body":"dissent, disengaged, get rid of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":531.36,"endTime":531.9,"body":"supplies."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":533.22,"endTime":535.44,"body":"For was a dis"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":533.22,"endTime":535.44,"body":"application of designers. Yeah."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":537.42,"endTime":542.37,"body":"Yes, well, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":537.42,"endTime":542.37,"body":"pricing. So. So you've got this,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":542.4,"endTime":547.77,"body":"this a very expensive subject in"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":542.4,"endTime":547.77,"body":"both material costs and teacher"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":547.77,"endTime":554.13,"body":"costs that can be got rid of by"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":547.77,"endTime":554.13,"body":"some schools. So there's a lot"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":554.13,"endTime":556.32,"body":"of benefit from that point of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":554.13,"endTime":556.32,"body":"view. So we're kind of drifting"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":556.32,"endTime":561.21,"body":"down this path, but I think"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":556.32,"endTime":561.21,"body":"trying to become more academic,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":561.54,"endTime":565.59,"body":"is the wrong wrong approach. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":561.54,"endTime":565.59,"body":"I think there's so many people,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":565.62,"endTime":568.26,"body":"so many companies, so many"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":565.62,"endTime":568.26,"body":"businesses desperately want"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":568.26,"endTime":573.87,"body":"students with designed"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":568.26,"endTime":573.87,"body":"technology skills. But we're"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":574.05,"endTime":577.17,"body":"kind of trying to make it more"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":574.05,"endTime":577.17,"body":"academic. And I think that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":577.41,"endTime":578.34,"body":"just a bad idea."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":579.6,"endTime":582.39,"body":"Yeah, I mean, just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":579.6,"endTime":582.39,"body":"the proposals sort of seem to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":582.39,"endTime":586.32,"body":"imply that there'll be a, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":582.39,"endTime":586.32,"body":"know, that there will be less"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":586.32,"endTime":589.92,"body":"opportunity for children to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":586.32,"endTime":589.92,"body":"realise their designs sort of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":590.22,"endTime":594.18,"body":"physically three dimensionally."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":590.22,"endTime":594.18,"body":"That seems one implication"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":594.18,"endTime":597.18,"body":"because there was a there was a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":594.18,"endTime":597.18,"body":"very, very sexy headline and one"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":597.18,"endTime":604.35,"body":"of them wasn't about landfill."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":597.18,"endTime":604.35,"body":"Yeah. So now I know Yeah, well,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":604.35,"endTime":604.41,"body":"I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":604.41,"endTime":606.18,"body":"think you I look,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":604.41,"endTime":606.18,"body":"we look at the amount of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":606.18,"endTime":608.55,"body":"materials going to landfill, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":606.18,"endTime":608.55,"body":"think, yes, there's some"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":608.55,"endTime":610.8,"body":"projects that don't get"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":608.55,"endTime":610.8,"body":"completed, that aren't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":610.8,"endTime":616.98,"body":"completed. Correct my language,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":610.8,"endTime":616.98,"body":"they aren't completed. And Abend"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":616.98,"endTime":621.99,"body":"but but it seems to be implying"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":616.98,"endTime":621.99,"body":"that everything that we're doing"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":622.29,"endTime":624.63,"body":"is a is just rubbish and it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":622.29,"endTime":624.63,"body":"should be thrown away. And we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":624.63,"endTime":626.82,"body":"could do it, we could do it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":624.63,"endTime":626.82,"body":"without doing it. We could be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":626.85,"endTime":633.63,"body":"electronic, and it could be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":626.85,"endTime":633.63,"body":"online. And that's, I don't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":633.63,"endTime":636.27,"body":"know, I just have a lot of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":633.63,"endTime":636.27,"body":"problems with that."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":638.22,"endTime":640.98,"body":"Yeah, well, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":638.22,"endTime":640.98,"body":"would argue that if we, if we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":640.98,"endTime":644.07,"body":"just do things with the head,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":640.98,"endTime":644.07,"body":"that we're missing out using the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":644.07,"endTime":646.44,"body":"body as part of the way we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":644.07,"endTime":646.44,"body":"learn, you know, one of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":646.44,"endTime":650.43,"body":"things we do in DNC is we learn"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":646.44,"endTime":650.43,"body":"through that, that touch that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":650.43,"endTime":652.14,"body":"smell those other senses."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":653.13,"endTime":655.92,"body":"And it's our USP"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":653.13,"endTime":655.92,"body":"at the end of the day, because"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":656.7,"endTime":662.58,"body":"we, if we go do sustainability"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":656.7,"endTime":662.58,"body":"in in geography, I'm sure and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":663.09,"endTime":667.44,"body":"various other aspects and and I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":663.09,"endTime":667.44,"body":"can see, I've been a an examiner"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":667.44,"endTime":672.21,"body":"for written papers for 22 years"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":667.44,"endTime":672.21,"body":"or something like that. And you"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":672.21,"endTime":675.27,"body":"could see how the examples this"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":672.21,"endTime":675.27,"body":"is the kind of the the other"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":675.27,"endTime":678.45,"body":"standard, my irritation, the the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":675.27,"endTime":678.45,"body":"aim for the exam board is to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":678.45,"endTime":681.66,"body":"have an exam paper that's,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":678.45,"endTime":681.66,"body":"that's crystal clear, dead easy"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":681.66,"endTime":685.38,"body":"to mark, it's a one on one"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":681.66,"endTime":685.38,"body":"answer two answers, possibly"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":685.38,"endTime":688.44,"body":"they want the you can see how"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":685.38,"endTime":688.44,"body":"the questions have gone so that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":688.62,"endTime":691.98,"body":"they know the answer. They want"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":688.62,"endTime":691.98,"body":"the students to give an example,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":692.16,"endTime":695.46,"body":"this this last year, a couple"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":692.16,"endTime":695.46,"body":"years ago, and it was there was"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":695.46,"endTime":698.37,"body":"a picture of a pillar drill, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":695.46,"endTime":698.37,"body":"pillar, which pillar drill was"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":698.37,"endTime":700.65,"body":"the only answer that was"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":698.37,"endTime":700.65,"body":"acceptable. So they couldn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":700.65,"endTime":705.66,"body":"just give drill. And I've seen"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":700.65,"endTime":705.66,"body":"seen different names for for"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":705.66,"endTime":708.45,"body":"pillar drilled or a bench"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":705.66,"endTime":708.45,"body":"mounted drills might be called a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":708.45,"endTime":711.45,"body":"drill press. So if the children"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":708.45,"endTime":711.45,"body":"doesn't have that bit of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":711.45,"endTime":716.19,"body":"knowledge, they don't get the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":711.45,"endTime":716.19,"body":"mark. And for me that what you"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":716.19,"endTime":719.58,"body":"want is students to be able to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":716.19,"endTime":719.58,"body":"tell you what they know, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":719.58,"endTime":723.54,"body":"actually be able to explain a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":719.58,"endTime":723.54,"body":"process. So I'd much prefer lots"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":723.54,"endTime":726.54,"body":"of answers to be possible. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":723.54,"endTime":726.54,"body":"for the students to be able to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":726.54,"endTime":730.44,"body":"show their understanding of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":726.54,"endTime":730.44,"body":"processes and designing by able"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":730.44,"endTime":735.09,"body":"to be explaining an answer that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":730.44,"endTime":735.09,"body":"might be different to the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":735.09,"endTime":738.12,"body":"student that's next to them."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":735.09,"endTime":738.12,"body":"Because for me, that's what's so"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":738.12,"endTime":742.23,"body":"exciting, exciting about the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":738.12,"endTime":742.23,"body":"subject. There isn't an answer."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":742.29,"endTime":744.09,"body":"That's the whole thing. I teach"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":742.29,"endTime":744.09,"body":"the children all the time, there"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":744.09,"endTime":747.39,"body":"isn't an answer ever to any sort"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":744.09,"endTime":747.39,"body":"any situation a problem."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":748.14,"endTime":751.02,"body":"There'll be a range of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":748.14,"endTime":751.02,"body":"solutions, and it's up to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":751.35,"endTime":754.17,"body":"different people to decide which"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":751.35,"endTime":754.17,"body":"is the best one for them. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":754.17,"endTime":756.6,"body":"that's yeah, that's what's so"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":754.17,"endTime":756.6,"body":"good about teaching design"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":756.6,"endTime":757.14,"body":"technology."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":758.79,"endTime":761.13,"body":"And if we if we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":758.79,"endTime":761.13,"body":"reduce it to exam questions"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":761.13,"endTime":764.22,"body":"where there's a single set"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":761.13,"endTime":764.22,"body":"answer, I mean, we're relying on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":764.22,"endTime":768.57,"body":"teacher subject knowledge, which"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":764.22,"endTime":768.57,"body":"we know that we, you know, the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":768.57,"endTime":772.08,"body":"amount of subject knowledge"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":768.57,"endTime":772.08,"body":"teachers have to have. We know"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":772.08,"endTime":775.47,"body":"full well that some of the exam"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":772.08,"endTime":775.47,"body":"board textbooks aren't always"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":775.47,"endTime":780.3,"body":"right. And as you say, is it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":775.47,"endTime":780.3,"body":"about naming the naming the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":780.3,"endTime":782.64,"body":"tool? Or is it about being able"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":780.3,"endTime":782.64,"body":"to understand why they're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":782.64,"endTime":784.71,"body":"selecting that process? And the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":782.64,"endTime":784.71,"body":"pros and the cons and the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":784.71,"endTime":788.43,"body":"limitations of it, rather than"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":784.71,"endTime":788.43,"body":"this is a pillar drill or a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":788.43,"endTime":794.28,"body":"bench mounted drill? Or is it a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":788.43,"endTime":794.28,"body":"drill press? Or? You know? Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":794.31,"endTime":797.55,"body":"it's I mean, I'm sure the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":794.31,"endTime":797.55,"body":"examples will come back and be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":797.55,"endTime":798.42,"body":"able to debate"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":798.45,"endTime":801.84,"body":"they did I did,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":798.45,"endTime":801.84,"body":"I'm sure. I wrote to them, it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":801.84,"endTime":803.73,"body":"the first time I ever wrote"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":801.84,"endTime":803.73,"body":"written to the exam, because I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":803.73,"endTime":805.92,"body":"always thought it'd be a waste"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":803.73,"endTime":805.92,"body":"of time. And it turned out it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":805.92,"endTime":811.29,"body":"was, but there was so many"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":805.92,"endTime":811.29,"body":"questions where there was a, I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":811.29,"endTime":813.78,"body":"not gonna name the example. But"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":811.29,"endTime":813.78,"body":"there's one, one where there's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":813.78,"endTime":818.73,"body":"three, three examples of the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":813.78,"endTime":818.73,"body":"same toy. And as an expert"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":818.73,"endTime":820.83,"body":"looking at it, I could see the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":818.73,"endTime":820.83,"body":"three different types of timber"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":820.83,"endTime":823.86,"body":"that used but the question was,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":820.83,"endTime":823.86,"body":"why are they? Why are the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":823.86,"endTime":826.53,"body":"manufacturers Different?"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":823.86,"endTime":826.53,"body":"Different varnishes are"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":826.53,"endTime":831.21,"body":"different finishes? Which they"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":826.53,"endTime":831.21,"body":"hadn't? They, they use different"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":831.21,"endTime":834.18,"body":"timber? And as part of the same"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":831.21,"endTime":834.18,"body":"question is that how would you"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":834.18,"endTime":837.69,"body":"make the hole for the eye in"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":834.18,"endTime":837.69,"body":"this toy, and they wanted pillar"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":837.69,"endTime":843.12,"body":"drill again, for some bizarre"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":837.69,"endTime":843.12,"body":"reason. But it was a divine toy,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":843.12,"endTime":846.81,"body":"it was almost certainly cut out"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":843.12,"endTime":846.81,"body":"on a CNC machine of some"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":846.81,"endTime":850.44,"body":"description. So you wouldn't cut"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":846.81,"endTime":850.44,"body":"the outline out, and then leave"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":850.44,"endTime":854.28,"body":"the hole for the AI to be done"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":850.44,"endTime":854.28,"body":"on a pillar drill. So it's it if"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":854.28,"endTime":856.44,"body":"you know what you're talking"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":854.28,"endTime":856.44,"body":"about. And I'd like to think"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":856.44,"endTime":860.04,"body":"that my yet ninth grade nine"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":856.44,"endTime":860.04,"body":"students would would start look"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":860.04,"endTime":862.71,"body":"at it and think, Well, that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":860.04,"endTime":862.71,"body":"hard. What I would use the CNC"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":862.74,"endTime":865.11,"body":"router to do that. Because of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":862.74,"endTime":865.11,"body":"using a CNC router to cut"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":865.11,"endTime":867.66,"body":"everything else out. Why would I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":865.11,"endTime":867.66,"body":"use a different machine? So if"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":867.66,"endTime":871.53,"body":"they put CNC router, they don't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":867.66,"endTime":871.53,"body":"get the mark. But they know more"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":871.53,"endTime":875.13,"body":"about it than then the examiner"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":871.53,"endTime":875.13,"body":"does because the examiner is"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":875.13,"endTime":878.73,"body":"after a single answer now. And I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":875.13,"endTime":878.73,"body":"know that was when we, when I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":878.73,"endTime":881.49,"body":"first started marking 20 years"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":878.73,"endTime":881.49,"body":"ago, there's a lot of discussion"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":881.49,"endTime":884.55,"body":"about what you'd accept what you"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":881.49,"endTime":884.55,"body":"wouldn't accept. And I guess"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":884.55,"endTime":888.03,"body":"when when the markings done,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":884.55,"endTime":888.03,"body":"there's then a lot of people"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":888.12,"endTime":890.55,"body":"claiming that the marks have"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":888.12,"endTime":890.55,"body":"been missed, and there's a lot"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":890.55,"endTime":893.49,"body":"of Appeals and the appeals would"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":890.55,"endTime":893.49,"body":"be successful because"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":893.94,"endTime":896.19,"body":"everybody's got an opinion."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":893.94,"endTime":896.19,"body":"Whereas if you take it down to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":896.19,"endTime":898.83,"body":"just a single answer, that easy"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":896.19,"endTime":898.83,"body":"you didn't get it right."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":899.339,"endTime":903.959,"body":"Yeah, no I've,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":899.339,"endTime":903.959,"body":"yeah, I mean, I've marked"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":903.959,"endTime":906.779,"body":"example, I've not done it for a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":903.959,"endTime":906.779,"body":"long time. I've only kind of do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":906.779,"endTime":909.089,"body":"it for so long. And I've marked"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":906.779,"endTime":909.089,"body":"coursework and moderated"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":909.089,"endTime":912.689,"body":"coursework and all of that."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":909.089,"endTime":912.689,"body":"Yeah, remember all of those, all"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":912.689,"endTime":917.789,"body":"of those debates, and it is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":912.689,"endTime":917.789,"body":"about making things you kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":917.789,"endTime":921.569,"body":"feel don't do that. It's my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":917.789,"endTime":921.569,"body":"making things simpler to mark,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":921.569,"endTime":923.879,"body":"but it does also make you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":921.569,"endTime":923.879,"body":"realise the power of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":923.879,"endTime":929.069,"body":"examples. Yeah, in controlling"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":923.879,"endTime":929.069,"body":"the curriculum, and telling"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":929.069,"endTime":932.819,"body":"what's taught. And then we end"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":929.069,"endTime":932.819,"body":"up losing the essence of what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":932.819,"endTime":938.519,"body":"the subject is about. I was just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":932.819,"endTime":938.519,"body":"looking at up, you know, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":938.519,"endTime":941.339,"body":"remember reading this paper a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":938.519,"endTime":941.339,"body":"long time ago, and I'll put a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":941.339,"endTime":944.399,"body":"link in the show notes. It's,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":941.339,"endTime":944.399,"body":"it's what's his what's his paper"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":944.399,"endTime":949.799,"body":"title called? Chief examiner's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":944.399,"endTime":949.799,"body":"as prophet and priest relations"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":949.799,"endTime":953.669,"body":"between examination boards, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":949.799,"endTime":953.669,"body":"school subjects and possible"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":953.699,"endTime":957.089,"body":"implications for knowledge. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":953.699,"endTime":957.089,"body":"if you've been long title, but"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":957.089,"endTime":961.829,"body":"the idea but you start to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":957.089,"endTime":961.829,"body":"realise how much these chief"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":961.829,"endTime":968.549,"body":"examiner's or, you know, 13 have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":961.829,"endTime":968.549,"body":"over basically determining what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":968.549,"endTime":973.229,"body":"happens in schools. And just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":968.549,"endTime":973.229,"body":"through the way the questions"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":973.229,"endTime":976.169,"body":"are asked, and they lose the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":973.229,"endTime":976.169,"body":"essence of the subject."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":976.2,"endTime":980.94,"body":"Yeah. Well, that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":976.2,"endTime":980.94,"body":"I think, my my irritation was,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":981.06,"endTime":984.81,"body":"was mostly about with that exam"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":981.06,"endTime":984.81,"body":"paper was the fact that how do I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":984.81,"endTime":988.41,"body":"teach it? How do I teach this"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":984.81,"endTime":988.41,"body":"year's cohort to be able to go"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":988.41,"endTime":991.38,"body":"into that exam? Be confident"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":988.41,"endTime":991.38,"body":"that can answer the questions. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":991.38,"endTime":993.21,"body":"can't just show a picture a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":991.38,"endTime":993.21,"body":"pillar drill and say, What's a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":993.21,"endTime":995.52,"body":"pillar drill? Weld? Only? You"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":993.21,"endTime":995.52,"body":"can answer last year's question,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":995.52,"endTime":998.85,"body":"but but the range of different"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":995.52,"endTime":998.85,"body":"pieces of equipment that could"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":998.85,"endTime":1005.78,"body":"put off and say What's this, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":998.85,"endTime":1005.78,"body":"it just becomes a lottery. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1005.78,"endTime":1008.12,"body":"don't have any more frets, or"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1005.78,"endTime":1008.12,"body":"because I used to, I did a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1008.12,"endTime":1010.64,"body":"perfectly good Fraxel. But it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1008.12,"endTime":1010.64,"body":"got condemned because it didn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1010.64,"endTime":1013.49,"body":"have the right off button."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1010.64,"endTime":1013.49,"body":"That's the emergency stop on."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1013.85,"endTime":1016.55,"body":"And it was more expensive than"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1013.85,"endTime":1016.55,"body":"the machine was to actually"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1016.55,"endTime":1019.49,"body":"replace it. And I didn't, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1016.55,"endTime":1019.49,"body":"didn't use it a great deal. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1019.49,"endTime":1023.81,"body":"I just couldn't afford to have"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1019.49,"endTime":1023.81,"body":"it updated. So it just went. So"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1023.81,"endTime":1026.18,"body":"I'd have a threat source. So"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1023.81,"endTime":1026.18,"body":"students don't use a threat. So."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1026.36,"endTime":1029.78,"body":"So that's the sorts of equipment"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1026.36,"endTime":1029.78,"body":"that a lot of schools have. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1029.78,"endTime":1032.3,"body":"don't have a I don't have a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1029.78,"endTime":1032.3,"body":"sander. Either, that that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1032.3,"endTime":1037.91,"body":"because I can't stand. But but"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1032.3,"endTime":1037.91,"body":"you know, you can and then down"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1037.91,"endTime":1041.9,"body":"to what equipment the schools"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1037.91,"endTime":1041.9,"body":"have, what are the what students"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1041.9,"endTime":1044.69,"body":"use, and how much effort"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1041.9,"endTime":1044.69,"body":"teachers have gone into."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1046.25,"endTime":1050.18,"body":"Showing, like doing Retrieval"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1046.25,"endTime":1050.18,"body":"Practices, and as the frightened"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1050.18,"endTime":1054.17,"body":"the latest phrase, I think, for"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1050.18,"endTime":1054.17,"body":"people to ramming information"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1054.17,"endTime":1056.63,"body":"into the heads with, you know,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1054.17,"endTime":1056.63,"body":"here's the peace agreement, if"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1056.66,"endTime":1059.57,"body":"you've never used, you never"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1056.66,"endTime":1059.57,"body":"need to use in this in this"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1059.6,"endTime":1063.53,"body":"world, we don't have access to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1059.6,"endTime":1063.53,"body":"it in this workshop. So now this"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1063.53,"endTime":1066.62,"body":"is just for the exam. And I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1063.53,"endTime":1066.62,"body":"think teaching things just for"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1066.62,"endTime":1070.46,"body":"the exam is one of the things"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1066.62,"endTime":1070.46,"body":"when I first started teaching"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1070.7,"endTime":1073.61,"body":"was actually written into the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1070.7,"endTime":1073.61,"body":"specifications, that this is a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1073.61,"endTime":1075.56,"body":"practical subject, children"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1073.61,"endTime":1075.56,"body":"should be learning through"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1075.56,"endTime":1078.44,"body":"practical work. And we've"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1075.56,"endTime":1078.44,"body":"drifted I know that will upset"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1078.44,"endTime":1081.65,"body":"some people, given given the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1078.44,"endTime":1081.65,"body":"things I've seen on Twitter, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1081.68,"endTime":1084.83,"body":"then how keen people are to get"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1081.68,"endTime":1084.83,"body":"rid of the practical work. But"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1086.27,"endTime":1090.65,"body":"it's got real value on no mental"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1086.27,"endTime":1090.65,"body":"No, no end of different levels."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1092.3,"endTime":1095.96,"body":"Just mental health reasons, for"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1092.3,"endTime":1095.96,"body":"nothing else much better to make"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1095.96,"endTime":1101.03,"body":"something as valid, so valuable"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1095.96,"endTime":1101.03,"body":"for the students, actually, to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1101.03,"endTime":1101.18,"body":"what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1101.18,"endTime":1103.04,"body":"the essence of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1101.18,"endTime":1103.04,"body":"design and technology is, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1103.04,"endTime":1106.79,"body":"know, because, you know, just to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1103.04,"endTime":1106.79,"body":"play devil's advocate,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1107.03,"endTime":1112.58,"body":"Department for Education and so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1107.03,"endTime":1112.58,"body":"on would argue that, that the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1113.15,"endTime":1115.49,"body":"school subject isn't around"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1113.15,"endTime":1115.49,"body":"children's mental health. I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1115.49,"endTime":1117.26,"body":"mean, I'm not I'm not saying"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1115.49,"endTime":1117.26,"body":"that they belittle children's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1117.26,"endTime":1119.6,"body":"mental health. So let's get that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1117.26,"endTime":1119.6,"body":"clear. But what I'm saying is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1119.6,"endTime":1122.33,"body":"that it's about what what the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1119.6,"endTime":1122.33,"body":"essence of the subject is,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1122.33,"endTime":1126.5,"body":"what's, what's the subject for."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1122.33,"endTime":1126.5,"body":"And I think we get, we get"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1126.5,"endTime":1130.7,"body":"caught up in practical work, not"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1126.5,"endTime":1130.7,"body":"practical work for guessing that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1130.7,"endTime":1134.57,"body":"the reason we do practical work,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1130.7,"endTime":1134.57,"body":"you know, and Richard Kimble in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1134.57,"endTime":1136.73,"body":"case tables would say, it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1134.57,"endTime":1136.73,"body":"about this hand in mind, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1136.73,"endTime":1140.96,"body":"know, we and Eddie Norman would"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1136.73,"endTime":1140.96,"body":"say it's about cognitive"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1140.96,"endTime":1143.3,"body":"modelling that we have these"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1140.96,"endTime":1143.3,"body":"ideas in our head. And then what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1143.3,"endTime":1145.55,"body":"we do is we model them, we kind"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1143.3,"endTime":1145.55,"body":"of realise them three"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1145.55,"endTime":1147.59,"body":"dimensionally, people can't see"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1145.55,"endTime":1147.59,"body":"the fact that I'm hugely"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1147.59,"endTime":1151.13,"body":"gesturing here and three"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1147.59,"endTime":1151.13,"body":"dimensional models in front of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1151.13,"endTime":1155.93,"body":"us. But that's what the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1151.13,"endTime":1155.93,"body":"practical work is primarily for,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1155.96,"endTime":1158.6,"body":"and also for the children to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1155.96,"endTime":1158.6,"body":"learn and understand those"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1158.6,"endTime":1161.42,"body":"processes. So they can make"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1158.6,"endTime":1161.42,"body":"effective design decisions when"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1161.42,"endTime":1164.57,"body":"they're coming up with design"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1161.42,"endTime":1164.57,"body":"ideas. Yeah, it we kind of get"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1164.57,"endTime":1169.1,"body":"we kind of lose to me lose that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1164.57,"endTime":1169.1,"body":"when we start to go down this. I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1169.1,"endTime":1171.65,"body":"never say this word, right? I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1169.1,"endTime":1171.65,"body":"want to say declarative,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1172.22,"endTime":1174.8,"body":"declarative knowledge."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1175.669,"endTime":1181.249,"body":"Yeah, yeah. That's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1175.669,"endTime":1181.249,"body":"basically, yeah. Rubbish. All"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1181.249,"endTime":1184.369,"body":"these posh words that people"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1181.249,"endTime":1184.369,"body":"use. That sounds so clever. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1184.369,"endTime":1188.419,"body":"wish I could do. But it's about"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1184.369,"endTime":1188.419,"body":"half an hour later. That was the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1188.419,"endTime":1192.109,"body":"word I meant to use on that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1188.419,"endTime":1192.109,"body":"situation. Yeah, I think my"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1192.109,"endTime":1199.279,"body":"approach, which I really enjoy"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1192.109,"endTime":1199.279,"body":"when it's the model if I go back"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1199.279,"endTime":1203.149,"body":"a little bit, so had the most"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1199.279,"endTime":1203.149,"body":"recent version was of the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1203.149,"endTime":1205.309,"body":"subject and that the assessment"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1203.149,"endTime":1205.309,"body":"of the subject really wasn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1205.639,"endTime":1211.279,"body":"that there was moves us to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1205.639,"endTime":1211.279,"body":"iterative design, which I think"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1211.279,"endTime":1213.949,"body":"is fun is in many ways"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1211.279,"endTime":1213.949,"body":"fantastic. There's a lot of lots"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1213.949,"endTime":1218.809,"body":"an awful lot of issues with it."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1213.949,"endTime":1218.809,"body":"But the previous version, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1218.809,"endTime":1220.489,"body":"don't know why when this new"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1218.809,"endTime":1220.489,"body":"version was coming in, I had a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1220.489,"endTime":1224.509,"body":"meeting with I got together with"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1220.489,"endTime":1224.509,"body":"lots of local colleagues. And I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1224.509,"endTime":1229.399,"body":"was really stunned that in one"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1224.509,"endTime":1229.399,"body":"school, everybody made coffee"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1229.399,"endTime":1232.339,"body":"tables in other cities, and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1229.399,"endTime":1232.339,"body":"other two schools actually made"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1232.369,"endTime":1236.569,"body":"made them lamps. And another"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1232.369,"endTime":1236.569,"body":"school, everybody made a robot."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1237.229,"endTime":1239.869,"body":"And each year, every year, so"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1237.229,"endTime":1239.869,"body":"people would come in, in year"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1239.869,"endTime":1243.229,"body":"seven, and know what they were"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1239.869,"endTime":1243.229,"body":"making in year 11. And I sat"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1243.229,"endTime":1247.399,"body":"there thinking, I missed"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1243.229,"endTime":1247.399,"body":"something. Because I'd have"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1247.399,"endTime":1252.199,"body":"robots, lights, tables,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1247.399,"endTime":1252.199,"body":"everything, and being where I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1252.199,"endTime":1257.479,"body":"work, trailers and combine bits"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1252.199,"endTime":1257.479,"body":"and pieces. And so I didn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1257.479,"endTime":1260.839,"body":"understand what the kids were"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1257.479,"endTime":1260.839,"body":"making. But they made fantastic"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1260.839,"endTime":1265.219,"body":"pieces of work, which, which"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1260.839,"endTime":1265.219,"body":"mattered to them. And actually,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1265.519,"endTime":1267.919,"body":"the thing I think I'm really"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1265.519,"endTime":1267.919,"body":"passionate about now. And then"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1267.919,"endTime":1270.649,"body":"actually, the more I think"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1267.919,"endTime":1270.649,"body":"about, I mean, sort of had"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1271.309,"endTime":1274.069,"body":"volunteered to do this podcast"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1271.309,"endTime":1274.069,"body":"with a really thought thought"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1274.069,"endTime":1278.779,"body":"through in a way I wouldn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1274.069,"endTime":1278.779,"body":"normally, I'm really keen that,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1278.839,"endTime":1282.919,"body":"that students get an opportunity"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1278.839,"endTime":1282.919,"body":"to, to learn and develop skills"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1282.919,"endTime":1287.029,"body":"that they value that they can"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1282.919,"endTime":1287.029,"body":"see a point in, so that I'm not"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1287.029,"endTime":1288.769,"body":"saying we've just got, you've"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1287.029,"endTime":1288.769,"body":"got to do this. So you can pass"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1288.769,"endTime":1292.309,"body":"the exam. And I spend much less"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1288.769,"endTime":1292.309,"body":"time now saying that to the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1292.309,"endTime":1295.099,"body":"children, because if they want"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1292.309,"endTime":1295.099,"body":"to come along and learn how to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1295.099,"endTime":1298.189,"body":"do 3d printing, or working on"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1295.099,"endTime":1298.189,"body":"the CNC routers, or working with"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1298.189,"endTime":1301.069,"body":"a laser cutter, that's fab that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1298.189,"endTime":1301.069,"body":"can do that, I don't mind. But"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1301.069,"endTime":1304.219,"body":"if they want to do wood turning"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1301.069,"endTime":1304.219,"body":"the can do wood turning. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1304.219,"endTime":1306.589,"body":"not going to say to to other"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1304.219,"endTime":1306.589,"body":"teachers or their colleagues,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1306.769,"endTime":1309.109,"body":"you need to do this as well,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1306.769,"endTime":1309.109,"body":"because this is where I work."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1309.499,"endTime":1313.459,"body":"But what I want is a is an"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1309.499,"endTime":1313.459,"body":"assessment system that allows"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1313.459,"endTime":1316.849,"body":"for that, and that judges"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1313.459,"endTime":1316.849,"body":"children by what they've"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1316.849,"endTime":1322.219,"body":"achieved, and what they've"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1316.849,"endTime":1322.219,"body":"learned, progress have made and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1322.249,"endTime":1324.829,"body":"helps them to better go to an"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1322.249,"endTime":1324.829,"body":"employer and say, Look, this,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1324.859,"endTime":1328.369,"body":"these are skills I've got. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1324.859,"endTime":1328.369,"body":"will you give me a job and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1328.369,"endTime":1332.119,"body":"there's this there's lots and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1328.369,"endTime":1332.119,"body":"lots of jobs out there. And the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1332.359,"endTime":1337.849,"body":"premise of the this, this latest"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1332.359,"endTime":1337.849,"body":"idea seems to be designers need"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1337.849,"endTime":1341.089,"body":"to know about sustainability."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1337.849,"endTime":1341.089,"body":"And I think I'm fairly certain"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1341.089,"endTime":1345.229,"body":"designers know about"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1341.089,"endTime":1345.229,"body":"sustainability. And how many of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1345.229,"endTime":1348.949,"body":"the 86,000 Are we really"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1345.229,"endTime":1348.949,"body":"expecting is 86,000. We've got"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1348.949,"endTime":1354.859,"body":"now taken a subject I've lost"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1348.949,"endTime":1354.859,"body":"track. So of the cohort each"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1354.859,"endTime":1358.129,"body":"year, how many do we expect? And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1354.859,"endTime":1358.129,"body":"how many designers do we need"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1358.189,"endTime":1365.239,"body":"from that? 86,000? And I think"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1358.189,"endTime":1365.239,"body":"there's there's an awful lot of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1365.239,"endTime":1368.749,"body":"plumbers and joiners and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1365.239,"endTime":1368.749,"body":"mechanics in mechanics I just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1368.749,"endTime":1371.899,"body":"discovered, which is quite"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1368.749,"endTime":1371.899,"body":"shocking that a car mechanic is"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1371.899,"endTime":1376.489,"body":"earning more than I am. And I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1371.899,"endTime":1376.489,"body":"think well, I don't have a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1376.489,"endTime":1381.079,"body":"problem with that particularly."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1376.489,"endTime":1381.079,"body":"But, you know, we kind of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1381.109,"endTime":1383.779,"body":"there's this status sort of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1381.109,"endTime":1383.779,"body":"issue, I think with design and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1383.779,"endTime":1388.759,"body":"technology, where we looked out"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1383.779,"endTime":1388.759,"body":"we tend to sometimes look down"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1388.759,"endTime":1394.069,"body":"on on professions, or on job"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1388.759,"endTime":1394.069,"body":"roles that aren't professionals."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1395.359,"endTime":1399.379,"body":"And we want I know when I was at"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1395.359,"endTime":1399.379,"body":"school, I asked what's the best"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1399.379,"endTime":1401.539,"body":"way of becoming a designer? And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1399.379,"endTime":1401.539,"body":"I said, I'll go to law school"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1401.539,"endTime":1405.169,"body":"University, Loughborough Brunel,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1401.539,"endTime":1405.169,"body":"that's what I was told. And I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1405.169,"endTime":1409.489,"body":"didn't, I was a bit. I was 18, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1405.169,"endTime":1409.489,"body":"suppose 1718. And I didn't, it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1409.489,"endTime":1412.519,"body":"was a lot harder to find things"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1409.489,"endTime":1412.519,"body":"out in those days pre printing"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1412.519,"endTime":1416.959,"body":"it. But I kind of I went down"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1412.519,"endTime":1416.959,"body":"that I applied to both those got"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1416.959,"endTime":1419.329,"body":"option got offers from both and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1416.959,"endTime":1419.329,"body":"went to law school university."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1419.719,"endTime":1421.609,"body":"But friends, I was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1421.61,"endTime":1422.9,"body":"waiting to see"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1421.61,"endTime":1422.9,"body":"where you're gonna go, because I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1422.9,"endTime":1425.51,"body":"went to Brunel, because you went"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1422.9,"endTime":1425.51,"body":"yeah,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1425.54,"endTime":1428.24,"body":"well, that was"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1425.54,"endTime":1428.24,"body":"that was the thing. But but the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1428.27,"endTime":1430.85,"body":"the teach that advised me had a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1428.27,"endTime":1430.85,"body":"lot of respect for him and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1430.85,"endTime":1434.36,"body":"everything, but he advised me to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1430.85,"endTime":1434.36,"body":"do that because the school that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1434.36,"endTime":1437.09,"body":"was good for the school, because"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1434.36,"endTime":1437.09,"body":"I went to university at a time"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1437.09,"endTime":1440.3,"body":"when about 10% of the population"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1437.09,"endTime":1440.3,"body":"went to university, it was an ex"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1440.3,"endTime":1443.42,"body":"secondary modern school. So they"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1440.3,"endTime":1443.42,"body":"wanted to, oh, look, we can get"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1443.42,"endTime":1447.56,"body":"all these people to university."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1443.42,"endTime":1447.56,"body":"So I, I should have found out"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1447.56,"endTime":1450.26,"body":"more myself, but you know, so I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1447.56,"endTime":1450.26,"body":"don't have to take the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1450.26,"endTime":1454.76,"body":"responsibility for it. But I met"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1450.26,"endTime":1454.76,"body":"a friend who went to DeMontfort"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1455.45,"endTime":1458.6,"body":"and he didn't do a levels he"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1455.45,"endTime":1458.6,"body":"went he left school at 16 went"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1458.6,"endTime":1463.76,"body":"and did a course at college and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1458.6,"endTime":1463.76,"body":"Art Foundation art. I think he"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1463.76,"endTime":1467.99,"body":"did. And the month had a much"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1463.76,"endTime":1467.99,"body":"better reputation amongst"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1467.99,"endTime":1471.26,"body":"designers. But it was a college."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1467.99,"endTime":1471.26,"body":"It wasn't a it wasn't a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1471.26,"endTime":1477.05,"body":"university. So yeah, so the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1471.26,"endTime":1477.05,"body":"school didn't want to uh, we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1477.05,"endTime":1480.53,"body":"actually had lessons on how to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1477.05,"endTime":1480.53,"body":"fill the university form in and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1480.53,"endTime":1482.54,"body":"they said don't worry about"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1480.53,"endTime":1482.54,"body":"referees will say that. Oh, but"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1482.54,"endTime":1485.57,"body":"don't forget if to make sure you"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1482.54,"endTime":1485.57,"body":"see such and such a teacher for"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1485.57,"endTime":1488.42,"body":"the form to apply for college"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1485.57,"endTime":1488.42,"body":"just in case you don't get to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1488.42,"endTime":1491.36,"body":"university. Those are the those"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1488.42,"endTime":1491.36,"body":"are the words that they used and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1491.72,"endTime":1494.06,"body":"it was for the status of the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1491.72,"endTime":1494.06,"body":"school that they recommended"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1494.06,"endTime":1500.48,"body":"that and the apprenticeships now"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1494.06,"endTime":1500.48,"body":"fabulous. I'm old enough That"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1500.48,"endTime":1502.22,"body":"should got rid of all the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1500.48,"endTime":1502.22,"body":"apprenticeships. And that was"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1502.22,"endTime":1505.91,"body":"kind of narrowed my choices now."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1502.22,"endTime":1505.91,"body":"But, but now we've got these"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1505.94,"endTime":1510.2,"body":"wonderful opportunities for"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1505.94,"endTime":1510.2,"body":"students. And, and we should be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1510.2,"endTime":1512.6,"body":"helping them to make the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1510.2,"endTime":1512.6,"body":"decision that's best for them"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1512.6,"endTime":1517.07,"body":"and have the skills to be able"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1512.6,"endTime":1517.07,"body":"to do that. It's really, really"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1517.07,"endTime":1517.7,"body":"important to me,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1518.15,"endTime":1520.28,"body":"is multifaceted,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1518.15,"endTime":1520.28,"body":"isn't it? I think it's because,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1520.55,"endTime":1522.68,"body":"as you say, you've you've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1520.55,"endTime":1522.68,"body":"recognised the fact and you've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1522.68,"endTime":1526.07,"body":"talked, you know, really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1522.68,"endTime":1526.07,"body":"passionate there about how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1526.49,"endTime":1529.16,"body":"you're wanting to respond to the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1526.49,"endTime":1529.16,"body":"children and where they're at in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1529.16,"endTime":1532.49,"body":"your locality, we talked before"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1529.16,"endTime":1532.49,"body":"we pressed record about, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1532.49,"endTime":1537.2,"body":"know, the size of your catchment"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1532.49,"endTime":1537.2,"body":"area of a diameter of 35 miles."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1538.64,"endTime":1541.46,"body":"You know, and it's quite rural,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1538.64,"endTime":1541.46,"body":"you know, I was comparing it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1541.46,"endTime":1544.19,"body":"with when I taught in, in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1541.46,"endTime":1544.19,"body":"Lincolnshire, and, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1544.19,"endTime":1548.9,"body":"quite a rural community. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1544.19,"endTime":1548.9,"body":"you, you've got, they've got,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1549.08,"endTime":1551.87,"body":"they've got aspirations, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1549.08,"endTime":1551.87,"body":"it's kind of sometimes frowned"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1551.87,"endTime":1554.48,"body":"on Is it their aspirations is to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1551.87,"endTime":1554.48,"body":"go and work for their family"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1554.48,"endTime":1559.88,"body":"business. But also, you do have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1554.48,"endTime":1559.88,"body":"to, you do have a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1559.88,"endTime":1561.77,"body":"responsibility, don't you with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1559.88,"endTime":1561.77,"body":"children to make them look"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1561.77,"endTime":1564.53,"body":"beyond where they're at, to see"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1561.77,"endTime":1564.53,"body":"things from a different"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1564.53,"endTime":1568.28,"body":"perspective. And I think that's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1564.53,"endTime":1568.28,"body":"almost where we do get hung up"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1568.28,"endTime":1572.57,"body":"on about employability has been"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1568.28,"endTime":1572.57,"body":"the purpose of education,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1572.57,"endTime":1575.45,"body":"whereas actually, there's,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1572.57,"endTime":1575.45,"body":"there's more to it than that."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1575.45,"endTime":1578.72,"body":"And so yes, giving the children"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1575.45,"endTime":1578.72,"body":"you know, understanding where"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1578.72,"endTime":1580.88,"body":"they're from, and respecting"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1578.72,"endTime":1580.88,"body":"where they're from, I think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1580.88,"endTime":1582.38,"body":"that's the other thing that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1580.88,"endTime":1582.38,"body":"sometimes doesn't happen, we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1582.38,"endTime":1585.2,"body":"forget to respect where the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1582.38,"endTime":1585.2,"body":"children are, and who they are"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1585.2,"endTime":1588.59,"body":"and their heritage and their"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1585.2,"endTime":1588.59,"body":"locality and their aspirations."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1588.59,"endTime":1590.87,"body":"And that's not to say that we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1588.59,"endTime":1590.87,"body":"shouldn't encourage them to have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1590.87,"endTime":1593.72,"body":"different aspirations or to look"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1590.87,"endTime":1593.72,"body":"differently. But it's kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1594.38,"endTime":1597.86,"body":"it's that tension between both"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1594.38,"endTime":1597.86,"body":"things. And I think, going back"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1597.86,"endTime":1602.39,"body":"to the Pearson's conceptual"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1597.86,"endTime":1602.39,"body":"proposal, and although I have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1602.39,"endTime":1606.26,"body":"seen in the last 24 hours, so on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1602.39,"endTime":1606.26,"body":"LinkedIn, I think on Twitter"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1606.26,"endTime":1609.44,"body":"that, you know, I know, there's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1606.26,"endTime":1609.44,"body":"been some meetings, Pearson's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1609.44,"endTime":1611.96,"body":"with some more teachers with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1609.44,"endTime":1611.96,"body":"some ideas, but again, it's a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1611.96,"endTime":1616.91,"body":"small group of teachers. But it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1611.96,"endTime":1616.91,"body":"is it is an exam board with a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1616.91,"endTime":1623.75,"body":"particular take on design and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1616.91,"endTime":1623.75,"body":"technology. So arriving, this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1624.14,"endTime":1629.3,"body":"curriculum concept, rather than"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1624.14,"endTime":1629.3,"body":"using a kind of a ground up"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1629.3,"endTime":1632.63,"body":"approach of people like"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1629.3,"endTime":1632.63,"body":"yourself, who've been the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1632.63,"endTime":1634.73,"body":"subject for a long time, but"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1632.63,"endTime":1634.73,"body":"also other teachers who haven't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1634.73,"endTime":1637.16,"body":"been in for such a long time, or"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1634.73,"endTime":1637.16,"body":"who have different backgrounds"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1637.16,"endTime":1640.91,"body":"and so on, coming together, in a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1637.16,"endTime":1640.91,"body":"way that's not to meet an"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1640.91,"endTime":1643.79,"body":"example of need, and I can be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1640.91,"endTime":1643.79,"body":"quite cynical about the example"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1643.79,"endTime":1648.41,"body":"of need. Yeah, and is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1643.79,"endTime":1648.41,"body":"sustainability, just a sexy"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1648.41,"endTime":1651.71,"body":"word? We do do sustainability"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1648.41,"endTime":1651.71,"body":"anyway. And didn t even though"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1651.71,"endTime":1653.63,"body":"it's not in the national"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1651.71,"endTime":1653.63,"body":"curriculum, because we weren't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1653.63,"endTime":1656.36,"body":"allowed to put it in? Because"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1653.63,"endTime":1656.36,"body":"it's a political term. You know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1656.36,"endTime":1660.62,"body":"sustainability is there, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1656.36,"endTime":1660.62,"body":"know, in Yeah. Anyway, there you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1660.62,"endTime":1662.18,"body":"go. I've kind of gone off on my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1660.62,"endTime":1662.18,"body":"one there."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1665.21,"endTime":1670.4,"body":"Yeah, it's, the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1665.21,"endTime":1670.4,"body":"thing is, we're all there isn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1670.73,"endTime":1673.73,"body":"designer Technology Association"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1670.73,"endTime":1673.73,"body":"has become much more popular"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1673.73,"endTime":1676.4,"body":"again, it kind of seems to go"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1673.73,"endTime":1676.4,"body":"through waves. But that's the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1676.4,"endTime":1680.6,"body":"closest we've got to a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1676.4,"endTime":1680.6,"body":"representative body. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1680.66,"endTime":1685.22,"body":"Pearson's seem to have kind of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1680.66,"endTime":1685.22,"body":"bypassed them. And not gone"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1685.22,"endTime":1688.37,"body":"along, as far as I understand."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1685.22,"endTime":1688.37,"body":"Because I know that I think it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1688.37,"endTime":1695.69,"body":"came as a shock to, to the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1688.37,"endTime":1695.69,"body":"people at data. And it's a, the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1695.69,"endTime":1699.98,"body":"thing is, I guess that that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1695.69,"endTime":1699.98,"body":"there's so many departments now"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1699.98,"endTime":1703.04,"body":"that have gone down a particular"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1699.98,"endTime":1703.04,"body":"path in what they're prepared"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1703.04,"endTime":1704.93,"body":"what they offer, what they want"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1703.04,"endTime":1704.93,"body":"to offer, and what they see is"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1704.93,"endTime":1708.35,"body":"valuable. And there's so many"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1704.93,"endTime":1708.35,"body":"drivers behind that. Sometimes"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1708.35,"endTime":1711.26,"body":"it's because the teacher thinks"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1708.35,"endTime":1711.26,"body":"of the thing decides that and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1711.26,"endTime":1714.95,"body":"sometimes it's much more"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1711.26,"endTime":1714.95,"body":"pragmatic, responds to the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1714.95,"endTime":1716.81,"body":"situation that in the school,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1714.95,"endTime":1716.81,"body":"because if you've got class"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1716.81,"endTime":1721.52,"body":"sizes of 24 plus, then you"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1716.81,"endTime":1721.52,"body":"there's a limit to what you can"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1721.52,"endTime":1725.45,"body":"do. And I recognise, and one of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1721.52,"endTime":1725.45,"body":"the reasons I'm still at my"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1725.45,"endTime":1730.61,"body":"school is because I have a very"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1725.45,"endTime":1730.61,"body":"good setup. And I get to teach"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1730.64,"endTime":1734.3,"body":"groups where I can do much more"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1730.64,"endTime":1734.3,"body":"experimental work and much more"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1734.33,"endTime":1737.03,"body":"work where they're all doing"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1734.33,"endTime":1737.03,"body":"different things. And as the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1737.03,"endTime":1741.8,"body":"class sizes have gone up here,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1737.03,"endTime":1741.8,"body":"some things I used to do, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1741.8,"endTime":1746.48,"body":"can't do anymore, because it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1741.8,"endTime":1746.48,"body":"just isn't practical. You just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1746.48,"endTime":1750.23,"body":"can't. There's only so much you"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1746.48,"endTime":1750.23,"body":"can do and with with groups,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1750.41,"endTime":1751.52,"body":"they get bigger and bigger."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1752.09,"endTime":1755.3,"body":"Yeah, and that's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1752.09,"endTime":1755.3,"body":"where exams have got to be fit"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1755.3,"endTime":1759.38,"body":"for purpose in terms of they've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1755.3,"endTime":1759.38,"body":"got to be accessible to all"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1759.38,"endTime":1762.2,"body":"schools. And that's where a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1759.38,"endTime":1762.2,"body":"concern around going down the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1762.2,"endTime":1767.51,"body":"CAD route is not all schools can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1762.2,"endTime":1767.51,"body":"afford all of those PCs and not"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1767.51,"endTime":1771.8,"body":"all those children that it will"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1767.51,"endTime":1771.8,"body":"suit in terms of that desk time."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1775.55,"endTime":1776.69,"body":"Learning Styles that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1778.01,"endTime":1779.06,"body":"well that's very"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1778.01,"endTime":1779.06,"body":"last year"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1783.86,"endTime":1785.78,"body":"going down the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1783.86,"endTime":1785.78,"body":"route of but it's back to this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1785.78,"endTime":1788.84,"body":"whole way of learning that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1785.78,"endTime":1788.84,"body":"learning isn't just in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1788.84,"endTime":1791.3,"body":"cognition isn't the brain it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1788.84,"endTime":1791.3,"body":"in the body."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1792.47,"endTime":1795.71,"body":"I went about"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1792.47,"endTime":1795.71,"body":"scenarios I've done to any sort"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1795.71,"endTime":1800.39,"body":"of highbrow lecture type thing I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1795.71,"endTime":1800.39,"body":"went to listen to Howard"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1800.39,"endTime":1805.55,"body":"Gardner, and his different"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1800.39,"endTime":1805.55,"body":"intelligences. And I think the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1805.55,"endTime":1808.4,"body":"thing that took away from that,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1805.55,"endTime":1808.4,"body":"that I think, has been lost a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1808.4,"endTime":1810.2,"body":"little bit, and it's kind of got"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1808.4,"endTime":1810.2,"body":"mixed up with the different"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1810.2,"endTime":1814.37,"body":"learning styles is the fact that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1810.2,"endTime":1814.37,"body":"we value particular types of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1814.37,"endTime":1818.99,"body":"intelligence. And whether that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1814.37,"endTime":1818.99,"body":"true or not about, but it kind"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1818.99,"endTime":1823.25,"body":"of, you know, there's a lot of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1818.99,"endTime":1823.25,"body":"people would definitely show my"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1823.25,"endTime":1826.25,"body":"age, David Beckham, when he"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1823.25,"endTime":1826.25,"body":"first sort of hit the scene. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1826.25,"endTime":1829.43,"body":"he and he could do do with the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1826.25,"endTime":1829.43,"body":"football amazing things. It's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1829.43,"endTime":1832.37,"body":"got amazing goals. But he got on"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1829.43,"endTime":1832.37,"body":"a microphone, and it didn't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1832.37,"endTime":1835.97,"body":"sound at all impressed, as a lot"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1832.37,"endTime":1835.97,"body":"of people put him down. He's got"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1835.97,"endTime":1838.79,"body":"an awful lot of money. He's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1835.97,"endTime":1838.79,"body":"very, very successful. And it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1838.79,"endTime":1846.86,"body":"turns out, he's a really nice"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1838.79,"endTime":1846.86,"body":"guy to meet for I've seen, and I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1846.86,"endTime":1851.72,"body":"think we, we tend to push out,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1846.86,"endTime":1851.72,"body":"we've been taken, education has"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1851.72,"endTime":1856.49,"body":"been taken on a very academic"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1851.72,"endTime":1856.49,"body":"route, where most subjects now"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1856.49,"endTime":1861.14,"body":"have lost any sort of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1856.49,"endTime":1861.14,"body":"coursework. And it's all high"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1861.14,"endTime":1865.19,"body":"stakes, one, maybe two exams"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1861.14,"endTime":1865.19,"body":"students go into, and they've"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1865.19,"endTime":1867.77,"body":"got to remember knowledge and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1865.19,"endTime":1867.77,"body":"got to write down answers. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1867.77,"endTime":1870.32,"body":"there's a certain style of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1867.77,"endTime":1870.32,"body":"answering the question. And it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1870.32,"endTime":1876.2,"body":"very, very good at picking out"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1870.32,"endTime":1876.2,"body":"students who are good at that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1876.2,"endTime":1878.75,"body":"sort of skill. And I think the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1876.2,"endTime":1878.75,"body":"amount of shout out to them to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1878.75,"endTime":1883.4,"body":"famous people, Ken Robinson, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1878.75,"endTime":1883.4,"body":"listened to a TED talk from him."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1883.91,"endTime":1889.01,"body":"And and that sort of, we keep"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1883.91,"endTime":1889.01,"body":"going through education until we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1889.01,"endTime":1895.43,"body":"fail. And that's not not very"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1889.01,"endTime":1895.43,"body":"good for for students to be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1895.43,"endTime":1899.0,"body":"focused and all channelled down"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1895.43,"endTime":1899.0,"body":"that way. Because whatever we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1899.0,"endTime":1902.39,"body":"might think of learning styles"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1899.0,"endTime":1902.39,"body":"and intelligences and stuff like"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1902.39,"endTime":1906.23,"body":"that, we are different, and we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1902.39,"endTime":1906.23,"body":"respond in different ways to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1906.23,"endTime":1908.78,"body":"different things, and we're"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1906.23,"endTime":1908.78,"body":"successful in different ways."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1909.14,"endTime":1913.58,"body":"And not everybody can be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1909.14,"endTime":1913.58,"body":"successful in that sort of I was"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1913.58,"endTime":1915.62,"body":"put into, you know, just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1913.58,"endTime":1915.62,"body":"learning stuff a couple of weeks"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1915.62,"endTime":1919.46,"body":"before the exam, go into the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1915.62,"endTime":1919.46,"body":"exam, get a unspell bounce the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1919.46,"endTime":1922.55,"body":"questions and two weeks, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1919.46,"endTime":1922.55,"body":"couldn't remember any of it. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1922.55,"endTime":1927.11,"body":"what real value is that to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1922.55,"endTime":1927.11,"body":"anybody? It's kind of what"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":1927.14,"endTime":1928.4,"body":"worries me really a bit."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1929.72,"endTime":1931.85,"body":"Well, that takes"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1929.72,"endTime":1931.85,"body":"me back to kind of a point"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1931.85,"endTime":1933.95,"body":"about, you know, we have to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1931.85,"endTime":1933.95,"body":"understand what it is that we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1933.95,"endTime":1938.57,"body":"doing design and technology for,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1933.95,"endTime":1938.57,"body":"you know, we learning that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1938.57,"endTime":1943.82,"body":"retrieval practice of the names"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1938.57,"endTime":1943.82,"body":"of things, is only useful to a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1943.82,"endTime":1947.54,"body":"very small points. And so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1943.82,"endTime":1947.54,"body":"children know what the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1947.54,"endTime":1950.06,"body":"limitations are, what you can do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1947.54,"endTime":1950.06,"body":"with it, you need to adjust the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1950.45,"endTime":1953.3,"body":"speed of the of the drill, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1950.45,"endTime":1953.3,"body":"know, you have to have a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1953.3,"endTime":1955.94,"body":"different size drill bit for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1953.3,"endTime":1955.94,"body":"different size, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1955.94,"endTime":1957.8,"body":"different thicknesses, different"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1955.94,"endTime":1957.8,"body":"types of materials, because it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1957.8,"endTime":1960.59,"body":"might snap, it might Splinter,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1957.8,"endTime":1960.59,"body":"it might, you know, give a rough"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1960.59,"endTime":1963.92,"body":"finish a smooth finish, and so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1960.59,"endTime":1963.92,"body":"on, you know, safe routes, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1963.92,"endTime":1966.47,"body":"know, how you clamp it, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1963.92,"endTime":1966.47,"body":"know, can you drill multiple"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1966.47,"endTime":1969.98,"body":"holes at the same time? Do you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1966.47,"endTime":1969.98,"body":"use a jig? You know, and all on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1969.98,"endTime":1973.34,"body":"all of that, that's, that's the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1969.98,"endTime":1973.34,"body":"richness, so then the children"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1973.34,"endTime":1979.88,"body":"can make pertinent, justified"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1973.34,"endTime":1979.88,"body":"decisions. And that's, that, to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1979.88,"endTime":1985.43,"body":"me is what, what gets lost. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1979.88,"endTime":1985.43,"body":"that's why you do need the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1985.43,"endTime":1988.91,"body":"practical and I'm kind of using"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1985.43,"endTime":1988.91,"body":"that term really loosely. But"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1988.94,"endTime":1992.57,"body":"some of what we learn about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1988.94,"endTime":1992.57,"body":"materials and process is through"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1992.57,"endTime":1996.53,"body":"the handling and experience"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1992.57,"endTime":1996.53,"body":"experiencing of it. And I don't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1996.53,"endTime":1999.14,"body":"mean that is in terms of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1996.53,"endTime":1999.14,"body":"experiential learning. But I do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1999.14,"endTime":2004.42,"body":"mean that in terms of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1999.14,"endTime":2004.42,"body":"seeing, feeling and touching to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2004.48,"endTime":2011.62,"body":"gain to gain that understanding,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2004.48,"endTime":2011.62,"body":"it can't just be bookwork is the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2011.62,"endTime":2013.72,"body":"essence, we lose the essence of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2011.62,"endTime":2013.72,"body":"what the subject is. That's kind"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2013.72,"endTime":2014.8,"body":"of what I keep coming back to."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2015.37,"endTime":2018.1,"body":"I think the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2015.37,"endTime":2018.1,"body":"problem for us all is that we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2018.28,"endTime":2021.94,"body":"we've kind of evolved from"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2018.28,"endTime":2021.94,"body":"woodwork and metalwork and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2023.29,"endTime":2026.26,"body":"needlework. I guess it's the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2023.29,"endTime":2026.26,"body":"other sort of thing that's been"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2026.26,"endTime":2030.46,"body":"brought in. So we're kind of we"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2026.26,"endTime":2030.46,"body":"seem kind of ashamed of that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2030.61,"endTime":2035.23,"body":"background. But it was certainly"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2030.61,"endTime":2035.23,"body":"in my teach Grade has not been"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2035.23,"endTime":2038.44,"body":"that at all. And in an awful"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2035.23,"endTime":2038.44,"body":"long time I've been teaching so"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2038.86,"endTime":2041.86,"body":"we've we've definitely moved on"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2038.86,"endTime":2041.86,"body":"from that. But that but there"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2041.86,"endTime":2044.08,"body":"seems to be a sort of, well, if"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2041.86,"endTime":2044.08,"body":"we still use wood and metal,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2044.08,"endTime":2048.52,"body":"we're still very old fashioned."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2044.08,"endTime":2048.52,"body":"I know when the assistant had"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2048.52,"endTime":2050.86,"body":"brings people around to see the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2048.52,"endTime":2050.86,"body":"school and we're in we're in"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2051.4,"endTime":2053.68,"body":"during the day. And this is our"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2051.4,"endTime":2053.68,"body":"this is the woodworking metals"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2053.68,"endTime":2055.93,"body":"workshop. She loves telling me"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2053.68,"endTime":2055.93,"body":"that and it's like, yeah, that's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2055.93,"endTime":2057.91,"body":"great. And then she goes it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2055.93,"endTime":2057.91,"body":"but she just so and of course"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2057.91,"endTime":2060.94,"body":"you can see 3d printers and CNC"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2057.91,"endTime":2060.94,"body":"routers, and so she does point"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2060.94,"endTime":2064.96,"body":"out the rest of the stuff that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2060.94,"endTime":2064.96,"body":"we do. But even even then it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2064.96,"endTime":2069.55,"body":"not just using 3d printers, it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2064.96,"endTime":2069.55,"body":"it's making that decision about"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2069.55,"endTime":2073.6,"body":"whether it's the most effective"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2069.55,"endTime":2073.6,"body":"way of doing something it might"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2073.6,"endTime":2077.86,"body":"be the student 3d prints a model"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2073.6,"endTime":2077.86,"body":"of something in order in order"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2077.86,"endTime":2080.74,"body":"to then make it in a completely"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2077.86,"endTime":2080.74,"body":"different way. So it might be it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2080.74,"endTime":2084.97,"body":"might end up with something that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2080.74,"endTime":2084.97,"body":"it's been cast, either in metal"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2084.97,"endTime":2089.23,"body":"or plastic and it's it's for me"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2084.97,"endTime":2089.23,"body":"that the great joy of the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2089.23,"endTime":2093.4,"body":"subject is that the students can"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2089.23,"endTime":2093.4,"body":"can learn how to make decisions,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2093.7,"endTime":2097.66,"body":"and then learn from the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2093.7,"endTime":2097.66,"body":"experience of doing that and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2097.66,"endTime":2100.66,"body":"think well, you know that that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2097.66,"endTime":2100.66,"body":"other than way approach the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2100.66,"endTime":2103.3,"body":"problem was a bad one or this"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2100.66,"endTime":2103.3,"body":"didn't work quite right. So if I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2103.3,"endTime":2105.55,"body":"change this a little bit, I can"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2103.3,"endTime":2105.55,"body":"get that. And it's that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2105.55,"endTime":2110.98,"body":"resilience and ability to, to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2105.55,"endTime":2110.98,"body":"actually learn from, from, from"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2110.98,"endTime":2114.01,"body":"what other people are doing as"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2110.98,"endTime":2114.01,"body":"well as what they're doing. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2114.01,"endTime":2116.2,"body":"collaborating with each other"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2114.01,"endTime":2116.2,"body":"and sharing knowledge and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2116.2,"endTime":2118.93,"body":"sharing experience, which is so"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2116.2,"endTime":2118.93,"body":"powerful about the subject. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2118.93,"endTime":2122.11,"body":"it doesn't actually matter what"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2118.93,"endTime":2122.11,"body":"they're making, or what material"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2122.11,"endTime":2125.47,"body":"they're working with. And it"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2122.11,"endTime":2125.47,"body":"should be possible for for two"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2125.47,"endTime":2127.6,"body":"people for a whole group. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2125.47,"endTime":2127.6,"body":"this is what I like about the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2127.6,"endTime":2132.55,"body":"new new curriculum, the new"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2127.6,"endTime":2132.55,"body":"exam, say news for history."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2135.34,"endTime":2137.68,"body":"GCSE specs"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2135.34,"endTime":2137.68,"body":"actually in its 2017."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2141.07,"endTime":2146.35,"body":"The thing with"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2141.07,"endTime":2146.35,"body":"ageing, time flies, but, but the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2147.37,"endTime":2149.92,"body":"that you can not have a start"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2147.37,"endTime":2149.92,"body":"point like space, and you might"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2149.92,"endTime":2152.47,"body":"get somebody out to make a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2149.92,"endTime":2152.47,"body":"rocket. And then you make"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2152.47,"endTime":2155.5,"body":"somebody Well, I want to make"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2152.47,"endTime":2155.5,"body":"something I got mountain biking,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2155.5,"endTime":2157.72,"body":"and I want to have something"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2155.5,"endTime":2157.72,"body":"that I can strap on my back and,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2157.99,"endTime":2161.2,"body":"and it'll help me take the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2157.99,"endTime":2161.2,"body":"things I need to repair my bike"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2161.2,"endTime":2163.9,"body":"in case of Break, break"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2161.2,"endTime":2163.9,"body":"something. Or you might get"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2163.9,"endTime":2166.18,"body":"somebody who decides to make"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2163.9,"endTime":2166.18,"body":"something to be a storage unit"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2166.18,"endTime":2169.63,"body":"on a on a table. And all those"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2166.18,"endTime":2169.63,"body":"people all those are valid"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2169.63,"endTime":2173.86,"body":"responses to a start point,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2169.63,"endTime":2173.86,"body":"which is exactly the same. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2173.86,"endTime":2179.74,"body":"that's, I think, where this is"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2173.86,"endTime":2179.74,"body":"gone is right now. But the exam"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2179.74,"endTime":2184.51,"body":"boards aim is taken us to a sort"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2179.74,"endTime":2184.51,"body":"of, well, we've got to teach"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2184.51,"endTime":2189.28,"body":"this because 50% exam, it's"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2184.51,"endTime":2189.28,"body":"significant. And if we don't get"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2189.28,"endTime":2193.99,"body":"that right, they can go in with"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2189.28,"endTime":2193.99,"body":"a nine for the for the NDA and"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2193.99,"endTime":2199.03,"body":"end up with a six because they"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2193.99,"endTime":2199.03,"body":"completely flop in the exam. And"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2199.03,"endTime":2201.49,"body":"I think that's that's the exam"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2199.03,"endTime":2201.49,"body":"borderline is down at the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2201.49,"endTime":2203.05,"body":"minute. Yeah, well,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2203.53,"endTime":2205.72,"body":"while I'm talking,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2203.53,"endTime":2205.72,"body":"I was kind of nosing around to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2205.72,"endTime":2208.69,"body":"the GCSE specs, because this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2205.72,"endTime":2208.69,"body":"thing about, you know, losing"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2208.69,"endTime":2212.11,"body":"the purpose of design and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2208.69,"endTime":2212.11,"body":"technology. And I've done some"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2212.11,"endTime":2214.96,"body":"work with quite a few different"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2212.11,"endTime":2214.96,"body":"TNT teachers about GCSE. And I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2214.96,"endTime":2220.3,"body":"said, What's the point of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2214.96,"endTime":2220.3,"body":"GCSE? What's it? What's it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2220.3,"endTime":2224.29,"body":"aiming towards, and all of them"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2220.3,"endTime":2224.29,"body":"talk about the GCSE and design"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2224.29,"endTime":2226.9,"body":"and technology enables students"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2224.29,"endTime":2226.9,"body":"to understand and apply"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2227.2,"endTime":2229.96,"body":"iterative design process through"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2227.2,"endTime":2229.96,"body":"which they explore, create and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2229.96,"endTime":2233.59,"body":"evaluate a range of outcomes."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2229.96,"endTime":2233.59,"body":"The qualification enables"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2233.59,"endTime":2236.11,"body":"students to use creativity and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2233.59,"endTime":2236.11,"body":"imagination to design and make"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2236.11,"endTime":2239.59,"body":"prototypes. Oh, that sounds"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2236.11,"endTime":2239.59,"body":"real. And that's when they start"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2239.59,"endTime":2245.23,"body":"off with. And it goes on. But"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2239.59,"endTime":2245.23,"body":"how many teachers look at that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2245.23,"endTime":2248.53,"body":"bit? What we do, and I've done"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2245.23,"endTime":2248.53,"body":"it when I was teaching, we go"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2248.53,"endTime":2250.69,"body":"straight to the content, what am"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2248.53,"endTime":2250.69,"body":"I going to teach the kids we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2250.69,"endTime":2254.5,"body":"lose sight of? This is the big"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2250.69,"endTime":2254.5,"body":"picture and everything is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2254.5,"endTime":2260.11,"body":"working towards that building"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2254.5,"endTime":2260.11,"body":"that in these children. And we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2260.11,"endTime":2263.38,"body":"get caught up in this retrieval"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2260.11,"endTime":2263.38,"body":"practice bits of knowledge"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2263.38,"endTime":2265.72,"body":"without what we're actually"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2263.38,"endTime":2265.72,"body":"doing is from a given these bits"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2265.72,"endTime":2272.02,"body":"of knowledge that they can make"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2265.72,"endTime":2272.02,"body":"connections. Yeah, and yeah, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2272.02,"endTime":2276.73,"body":"so when a new exam board, an"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2272.02,"endTime":2276.73,"body":"example comes up with a new idea"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2276.73,"endTime":2281.29,"body":"for a spec, we've kind of got to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2276.73,"endTime":2281.29,"body":"think about, but what's the aim?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2281.32,"endTime":2285.28,"body":"What's it developing? You know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2281.32,"endTime":2285.28,"body":"as you say, you know, we talked"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2285.28,"endTime":2288.85,"body":"quite a little bit there about,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2285.28,"endTime":2288.85,"body":"you know, the exam. tail is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2288.85,"endTime":2291.28,"body":"wagging the curriculum dog, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2288.85,"endTime":2291.28,"body":"know, what the purpose of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2291.28,"endTime":2293.89,"body":"subject is? And what we haven't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2291.28,"endTime":2293.89,"body":"even touched on I'm conscious of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2293.89,"endTime":2299.5,"body":"time is, this is talking about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2293.89,"endTime":2299.5,"body":"GCSE. This subject is taught in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2299.5,"endTime":2303.34,"body":"key stage one and Key Stage Two"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2299.5,"endTime":2303.34,"body":"early is where does that fit?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2306.73,"endTime":2307.57,"body":"Not talked about? No,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2307.81,"endTime":2316.39,"body":"because I don't"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2307.81,"endTime":2316.39,"body":"know. But But it's, yeah. Be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2316.39,"endTime":2322.42,"body":"careful. I think, years ago. On"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2316.39,"endTime":2322.42,"body":"one of the mayor, iterations of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2322.42,"endTime":2325.06,"body":"the subject, I sat down to my"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2322.42,"endTime":2325.06,"body":"colleague, and we went through"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2325.06,"endTime":2328.18,"body":"the curriculum. And we could"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2325.06,"endTime":2328.18,"body":"actually plan what we've always"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2328.21,"endTime":2330.82,"body":"done in the past and think,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2328.21,"endTime":2330.82,"body":"Well, if we change this a little"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2330.82,"endTime":2333.1,"body":"bit, we do this, we can cover"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2330.82,"endTime":2333.1,"body":"that. So it was quite"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2333.1,"endTime":2337.48,"body":"straightforward. Now it's got to"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2333.1,"endTime":2337.48,"body":"the point where the GCSE spec,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2337.48,"endTime":2340.0,"body":"you look at it and think, Oh, I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2337.48,"endTime":2340.0,"body":"must, what I've done is just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2340.0,"endTime":2343.0,"body":"look at it. Well, I can't teach"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2340.0,"endTime":2343.0,"body":"any of that I can teach bits of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2343.0,"endTime":2346.33,"body":"it. But I can't teach all of it,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2343.0,"endTime":2346.33,"body":"I can't, there's no way I can"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2346.33,"endTime":2351.46,"body":"fit all that knowledge into a"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2346.33,"endTime":2351.46,"body":"two year course. And advising"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2351.58,"endTime":2354.16,"body":"sort of primary schools on"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2351.58,"endTime":2354.16,"body":"helping and supporting primary"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2354.16,"endTime":2358.18,"body":"schools on how they can help"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2354.16,"endTime":2358.18,"body":"prepare students so that they"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2358.18,"endTime":2361.93,"body":"can come into school into"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2358.18,"endTime":2361.93,"body":"secondary school and be more"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2361.93,"endTime":2368.74,"body":"successful. Well, I don't even"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2361.93,"endTime":2368.74,"body":"now expect them to know anything"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2368.74,"endTime":2375.4,"body":"about trees anymore. The the"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2368.74,"endTime":2375.4,"body":"great joy of primary schools is"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2375.4,"endTime":2380.32,"body":"coming to be sort of squashed by"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2375.4,"endTime":2380.32,"body":"English and maths. And and I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2380.32,"endTime":2383.53,"body":"sure it's it's the same in a lot"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2380.32,"endTime":2383.53,"body":"of schools that that they get"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2383.53,"endTime":2386.92,"body":"the picking up children that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2383.53,"endTime":2386.92,"body":"don't have the social skills,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2386.92,"endTime":2391.0,"body":"they don't have the the ability"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2386.92,"endTime":2391.0,"body":"to share and basic stuff like"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2391.0,"endTime":2395.23,"body":"that, that they could get from"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2391.0,"endTime":2395.23,"body":"from actually joining together"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2395.23,"endTime":2400.3,"body":"and designing and making things"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2395.23,"endTime":2400.3,"body":"and that there's There's just"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2400.3,"endTime":2403.84,"body":"this massive focus certainly in"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2400.3,"endTime":2403.84,"body":"the last few years of not, I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2403.84,"endTime":2407.02,"body":"not criticising primary schools"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2403.84,"endTime":2407.02,"body":"for it, but But you know,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2407.29,"endTime":2410.68,"body":"actually understanding where"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2407.29,"endTime":2410.68,"body":"materials are coming from how"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2410.68,"endTime":2416.32,"body":"that affects the choices that"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2410.68,"endTime":2416.32,"body":"they make. And wow, it's just,"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2416.8,"endTime":2420.07,"body":"it feels like it's kind of"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2416.8,"endTime":2420.07,"body":"looking into this massive void"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2420.07,"endTime":2420.94,"body":"and thinking, Oh, God,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2421.809,"endTime":2424.029,"body":"I can just come"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2421.809,"endTime":2424.029,"body":"back from the edge."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2425.23,"endTime":2428.74,"body":"I'm just gonna"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2425.23,"endTime":2428.74,"body":"give up now and have my read my"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2428.74,"endTime":2428.98,"body":"notes."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2430.21,"endTime":2432.85,"body":"Not at all. No, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2430.21,"endTime":2432.85,"body":"mean, I think, you know, I've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2432.85,"endTime":2435.46,"body":"talked to Tony Ryan, the other"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2432.85,"endTime":2435.46,"body":"week at data, and he was saying"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2435.46,"endTime":2439.12,"body":"that, you know, there's been a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2435.46,"endTime":2439.12,"body":"big shift, the membership in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2439.12,"endTime":2443.41,"body":"primary has really kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2439.12,"endTime":2443.41,"body":"exploded, as, and that's really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2443.41,"endTime":2446.86,"body":"encouraging to hear. And I've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2443.41,"endTime":2446.86,"body":"got my got my colleague at the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2446.86,"endTime":2450.31,"body":"university, Suzanne gomersal,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2446.86,"endTime":2450.31,"body":"who is involved in prime"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2450.31,"endTime":2453.67,"body":"education and his adiante"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2450.31,"endTime":2453.67,"body":"specialist, you know, and, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2453.67,"endTime":2455.71,"body":"there is there is more"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2453.67,"endTime":2455.71,"body":"happening, but yeah, the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2455.71,"endTime":2459.34,"body":"pressures we've talked about the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2455.71,"endTime":2459.34,"body":"back of performance measures is,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2459.37,"endTime":2461.68,"body":"is really tough, it's really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2459.37,"endTime":2461.68,"body":"tough for a school to resist."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2462.07,"endTime":2465.43,"body":"And you can completely"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2462.07,"endTime":2465.43,"body":"understand that. And you've also"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2465.43,"endTime":2469.27,"body":"mentioned, you know, resource"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2465.43,"endTime":2469.27,"body":"heavy subjects, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2469.75,"endTime":2473.41,"body":"materials, you know, cost living"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2469.75,"endTime":2473.41,"body":"crisis, you know, energy crisis,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2474.07,"endTime":2476.14,"body":"you know, where you're going to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2474.07,"endTime":2476.14,"body":"make cuts, you can kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2476.14,"endTime":2479.05,"body":"completely get it so and kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2476.14,"endTime":2479.05,"body":"understand some of the logic of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2479.05,"endTime":2482.92,"body":"the Pearsons. But yeah, I think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2479.05,"endTime":2482.92,"body":"you've raised some really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2482.95,"endTime":2485.5,"body":"interesting issues there, Andy,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2482.95,"endTime":2485.5,"body":"that, that I'm sure you're not"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2485.5,"endTime":2489.94,"body":"alone in thinking I'm sure other"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2485.5,"endTime":2489.94,"body":"people have additional views or"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2489.94,"endTime":2492.25,"body":"a bit contradictory views, which"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2489.94,"endTime":2492.25,"body":"I'm hoping they'll come on the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2492.25,"endTime":2498.67,"body":"podcast. Right, we've kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2492.25,"endTime":2498.67,"body":"kind of come back from the void."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2498.67,"endTime":2499.6,"body":"Now, it's not kind of quite as"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2501.79,"endTime":2503.17,"body":"I'm fine. I'll be"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2501.79,"endTime":2503.17,"body":"here tomorrow."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2504.58,"endTime":2506.8,"body":"Good. Good."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2504.58,"endTime":2506.8,"body":"Because those children need you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2506.8,"endTime":2510.61,"body":"in that classroom. You know, how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2506.8,"endTime":2510.61,"body":"many years did you say you'd"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2510.61,"endTime":2511.27,"body":"been there? Again?"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2512.44,"endTime":2515.68,"body":"I've just started"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2512.44,"endTime":2515.68,"body":"my 27th year now. In this"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2515.68,"endTime":2516.1,"body":"school,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2516.46,"endTime":2518.47,"body":"in that school,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2516.46,"endTime":2518.47,"body":"yeah, it was good place to be."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2519.85,"endTime":2522.22,"body":"I visit and see"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2519.85,"endTime":2522.22,"body":"I've talked to other people. I"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2522.22,"endTime":2527.71,"body":"think I had to work there. So"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2522.22,"endTime":2527.71,"body":"I'm staying well, and it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2527.71,"endTime":2529.48,"body":"clear that you're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2527.71,"endTime":2529.48,"body":"not stagnating. You know, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2529.48,"endTime":2531.55,"body":"mean, I think it's a real"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2529.48,"endTime":2531.55,"body":"challenge for people like"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2531.55,"endTime":2534.43,"body":"yourself, where you're the only"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2531.55,"endTime":2534.43,"body":"person in the Design Technology"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2534.43,"endTime":2537.7,"body":"Department to kind of keep keep"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2534.43,"endTime":2537.7,"body":"going, you mentioned that you've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2537.7,"endTime":2541.51,"body":"done the the association"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2537.7,"endTime":2541.51,"body":"sustainability online course and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2541.51,"endTime":2543.61,"body":"kind of doing all that sort of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2541.51,"endTime":2543.61,"body":"stuff. And you joined in with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2543.61,"endTime":2547.96,"body":"the project and everything."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2543.61,"endTime":2547.96,"body":"Yeah, so he just bought a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2547.96,"endTime":2548.56,"body":"number."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2550.48,"endTime":2554.26,"body":"Got to that point"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2550.48,"endTime":2554.26,"body":"where I keep forgetting. So I'm"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2554.26,"endTime":2555.97,"body":"not quite sure what that says"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2554.26,"endTime":2555.97,"body":"about me. Really."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2557.53,"endTime":2563.38,"body":"It is just a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2557.53,"endTime":2563.38,"body":"number. Myself. Yeah. But yeah."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2564.01,"endTime":2567.25,"body":"Now look, it's been really good"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2564.01,"endTime":2567.25,"body":"to talk to you, Andy. And thank"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2567.25,"endTime":2570.79,"body":"you for coming on and talking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2567.25,"endTime":2570.79,"body":"about what you think you know, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2570.79,"endTime":2572.83,"body":"kind of we kind of talked a lot"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2570.79,"endTime":2572.83,"body":"about the Pearson's. We've also"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2572.83,"endTime":2576.34,"body":"talked a lot about other"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2572.83,"endTime":2576.34,"body":"different things. It's always"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2576.34,"endTime":2579.7,"body":"good to get different people's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2576.34,"endTime":2579.7,"body":"viewpoints about what's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2579.7,"endTime":2581.68,"body":"happening in design and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2579.7,"endTime":2581.68,"body":"technology. So thanks ever so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2581.68,"endTime":2582.16,"body":"much."},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2582.19,"endTime":2583.24,"body":"No problems, no"},{"speaker":"Andy Marston","startTime":2582.19,"endTime":2583.24,"body":"problem."}]}