{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":0.36,"endTime":4.05,"body":"So this week, I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":0.36,"endTime":4.05,"body":"talking to Brendan Anglim, if I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":4.05,"endTime":6.15,"body":"pronounce your surname correctly"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":4.05,"endTime":6.15,"body":"there, Brendan."},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":6.57,"endTime":7.98,"body":"Absolutely"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":6.57,"endTime":7.98,"body":"Anglim. That's right."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":8.399,"endTime":8.579,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":9.43,"endTime":12.25,"body":"I make all sorts of mistakes on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":9.43,"endTime":12.25,"body":"surnames and pronunciation."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":12.25,"endTime":14.8,"body":"Sounds good. I'm glad that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":12.25,"endTime":14.8,"body":"started off. Okay. So with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":14.8,"endTime":18.16,"body":"Brendan this afternoon, and I've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":14.8,"endTime":18.16,"body":"got Brendan on here to come and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":18.16,"endTime":21.49,"body":"talk about his research. I don't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":18.16,"endTime":21.49,"body":"know a huge amount about random,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":21.49,"endTime":24.37,"body":"we've just met through the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":21.49,"endTime":24.37,"body":"design and technology"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":24.37,"endTime":28.54,"body":"associations research strategy"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":24.37,"endTime":28.54,"body":"group, which Matt McLain and Kay"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":28.54,"endTime":37.06,"body":"Stables were talking about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":28.54,"endTime":37.06,"body":"people doing research iand said,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":37.12,"endTime":40.99,"body":"well, Brendan, who is now a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":37.12,"endTime":40.99,"body":"doctor has done some research,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":40.99,"endTime":43.96,"body":"which is really interesting. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":40.99,"endTime":43.96,"body":"when they talked about what it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":43.96,"endTime":46.33,"body":"was, I thought, yes, thank you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":43.96,"endTime":46.33,"body":"very much. That'd be great to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":46.33,"endTime":49.18,"body":"have on the podcast. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":46.33,"endTime":49.18,"body":"Brendan's here to come and talk"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":49.18,"endTime":52.0,"body":"and share some of the things"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":49.18,"endTime":52.0,"body":"that he's learned and some of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":52.0,"endTime":55.09,"body":"the ideas that have come out"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":52.0,"endTime":55.09,"body":"from it. And just to give an"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":55.09,"endTime":57.4,"body":"update on where he is with it,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":55.09,"endTime":57.4,"body":"and and what you're thinking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":57.4,"endTime":61.42,"body":"maybe might happen next. So over"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":57.4,"endTime":61.42,"body":"to you, Brendan, who are you?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":61.42,"endTime":63.28,"body":"Where are you? And what do you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":61.42,"endTime":63.28,"body":"do? Let's start with that?"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":63.28,"endTime":66.13,"body":"Well, so I'm"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":63.28,"endTime":66.13,"body":"I've been teaching design"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":66.13,"endTime":69.4,"body":"technology for 25 years. I'm"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":66.13,"endTime":69.4,"body":"currently a head of department"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":69.43,"endTime":72.97,"body":"and also an assistant head"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":69.43,"endTime":72.97,"body":"teaching and learning. I became"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":72.97,"endTime":78.91,"body":"curious about gender in"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":72.97,"endTime":78.91,"body":"projects, the approaches that"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":78.91,"endTime":83.23,"body":"students had to projects, and it"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":78.91,"endTime":83.23,"body":"didn't ma probably about almost"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":83.23,"endTime":87.82,"body":"20 years ago, when I started"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":83.23,"endTime":87.82,"body":"halfway through the Masters, I"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":87.82,"endTime":91.72,"body":"didn't change school. And the"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":87.82,"endTime":91.72,"body":"school that I came to had a"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":91.72,"endTime":95.77,"body":"really different gender balance,"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":91.72,"endTime":95.77,"body":"different makeups there being"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":97.15,"endTime":102.13,"body":"5050 Boys, girls at GCSE and A"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":97.15,"endTime":102.13,"body":"level gives closer to the 10% at"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":102.13,"endTime":106.69,"body":"a level, and it was a real"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":102.13,"endTime":106.69,"body":"difference. So I became that"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":106.69,"endTime":112.72,"body":"really, that struck home made me"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":106.69,"endTime":112.72,"body":"really think hard about gender"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":112.72,"endTime":116.38,"body":"inequality in design technology."},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":112.72,"endTime":116.38,"body":"And at the time, my children"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":116.38,"endTime":118.54,"body":"were growing up with One boy,"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":116.38,"endTime":118.54,"body":"one girl, and they were treated"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":118.54,"endTime":124.87,"body":"quite differently at school. My"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":118.54,"endTime":124.87,"body":"wife is an engineer by training,"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":124.9,"endTime":129.64,"body":"she was one of four women on a"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":124.9,"endTime":129.64,"body":"course of 120 at her university,"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":130.03,"endTime":133.03,"body":"and all of these things started"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":130.03,"endTime":133.03,"body":"to come together, a down I took"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":133.03,"endTime":138.25,"body":"over a boarding house with my"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":133.03,"endTime":138.25,"body":"wife, which girls, and I started"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":138.25,"endTime":144.46,"body":"to see and be aware of some"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":138.25,"endTime":144.46,"body":"incredibly difficult and awkward"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":145.3,"endTime":149.2,"body":"inequities and inequalities in"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":145.3,"endTime":149.2,"body":"the way that they were treated."},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":149.62,"endTime":153.22,"body":"And so that's that prompted me"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":149.62,"endTime":153.22,"body":"to start my research at doctoral"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":153.22,"endTime":157.15,"body":"level, looking at gender bias"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":153.22,"endTime":157.15,"body":"and gender  inequalities and"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":157.15,"endTime":160.18,"body":"design andtechnology."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":160.17,"endTime":162.784,"body":"So it's yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":160.17,"endTime":162.784,"body":"really interesting that those,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":162.837,"endTime":165.719,"body":"those things that happen to you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":162.837,"endTime":165.719,"body":"and things that you've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":165.772,"endTime":168.76,"body":"experienced. So to give you a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":165.772,"endTime":168.76,"body":"context for a study, I was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":168.813,"endTime":171.428,"body":"really intrigued about your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":168.813,"endTime":171.428,"body":"language about gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":171.481,"endTime":174.789,"body":"inequalities. What did you mean"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":171.481,"endTime":174.789,"body":"by that, when you were started"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":174.843,"endTime":175.59,"body":"to explore it?"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":175.57,"endTime":177.82,"body":"Well, initially,"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":175.57,"endTime":177.82,"body":"just numerically, just as in the"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":177.82,"endTime":180.07,"body":"number of girls doing design and"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":177.82,"endTime":180.07,"body":"technology, just sort of black"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":180.07,"endTime":182.23,"body":"and white, you know how many"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":180.07,"endTime":182.23,"body":"girls are doing it. And I think"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":182.44,"endTime":185.77,"body":"we've seen the numbers in Design"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":182.44,"endTime":185.77,"body":"and Technology decrease over the"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":185.77,"endTime":192.07,"body":"last 20 years or so, once it was"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":185.77,"endTime":192.07,"body":"became, not an optional subject"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":192.07,"endTime":195.25,"body":"at GCSE. But within those"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":192.07,"endTime":195.25,"body":"numbers, the number of girls"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":195.25,"endTime":200.53,"body":"have decreased as well, hugely."},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":195.25,"endTime":200.53,"body":"We've also had girls,  food"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":200.53,"endTime":203.47,"body":"nutrition, the separation of"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":200.53,"endTime":203.47,"body":"design technology, and Food"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":203.47,"endTime":207.1,"body":"Nutrition has made a difference"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":203.47,"endTime":207.1,"body":"to those numbers and math, we"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":207.1,"endTime":209.47,"body":"can talk about statistics, as"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":207.1,"endTime":209.47,"body":"well as the weight and numbers"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":209.47,"endTime":213.28,"body":"are played with. But then you've"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":209.47,"endTime":213.28,"body":"got this sort of latest exodus"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":213.28,"endTime":217.27,"body":"of textiles to art as caused"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":213.28,"endTime":217.27,"body":"issues as well. There's some"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":217.27,"endTime":221.53,"body":"really interesting things going"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":217.27,"endTime":221.53,"body":"on with with girls and design"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":221.53,"endTime":224.83,"body":"technology just in just in terms"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":221.53,"endTime":224.83,"body":"of numbers. Never mind the way"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":224.83,"endTime":227.92,"body":"that girls are potentially"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":224.83,"endTime":227.92,"body":"treated in the classroom. That's"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":227.92,"endTime":229.42,"body":"a whole different ballgame"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":227.92,"endTime":229.42,"body":"altogether."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":230.44,"endTime":232.42,"body":"Yeah, yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":230.44,"endTime":232.42,"body":"think I think it is, I think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":232.72,"endTime":237.13,"body":"what we're almost seeing is a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":232.72,"endTime":237.13,"body":"reversion back to sort of pre"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":237.13,"endTime":243.37,"body":"1990 with the separation of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":237.13,"endTime":243.37,"body":"food, and the cooking and how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":243.37,"endTime":248.2,"body":"that sort of scene. And art and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":243.37,"endTime":248.2,"body":"textiles think that whole that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":248.2,"endTime":251.92,"body":"whole thing's fascinated and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":248.2,"endTime":251.92,"body":"under talked about, and and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":251.95,"endTime":255.04,"body":"under dicussed as what the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":251.95,"endTime":255.04,"body":"issues are, it's almost seen as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":255.04,"endTime":258.94,"body":"well, that's okay, that that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":255.04,"endTime":258.94,"body":"that moves off. So, yeah, so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":258.94,"endTime":261.67,"body":"you've kind of got a personal"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":258.94,"endTime":261.67,"body":"context a kind of political,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":261.67,"endTime":267.4,"body":"national context for your study."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":261.67,"endTime":267.4,"body":"So to total a bit about how you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":267.4,"endTime":270.1,"body":"started and what what your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":267.4,"endTime":270.1,"body":"question what your research"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":270.1,"endTime":271.15,"body":"question was and"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":274.0,"endTime":276.79,"body":"there's sort of"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":274.0,"endTime":276.79,"body":"three strands to it really was."},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":277.36,"endTime":280.93,"body":"The key one was quite"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":277.36,"endTime":280.93,"body":"interesting. I'm an engineer by"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":280.93,"endTime":283.15,"body":"training as well as my wife and"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":280.93,"endTime":283.15,"body":"I both engineers, so I was"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":283.15,"endTime":286.12,"body":"interested in the relationship"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":283.15,"endTime":286.12,"body":"between design technology and"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":286.12,"endTime":290.11,"body":"stem. There's an awful lot"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":286.12,"endTime":290.11,"body":"written about gender in STEM,"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":290.41,"endTime":294.52,"body":"and the literature reviews I've"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":290.41,"endTime":294.52,"body":"got here. It's huge. But the"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":294.52,"endTime":296.98,"body":"amount of stuff that's written"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":294.52,"endTime":296.98,"body":"about gender and design to"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":297.43,"endTime":299.68,"body":"design technology like you've"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":297.43,"endTime":299.68,"body":"just described, there's very"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":299.68,"endTime":302.32,"body":"little talk to that I think"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":299.68,"endTime":302.32,"body":"there's two or three papers, Jan"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":302.32,"endTime":304.84,"body":"Harding's from the 1990s, I"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":302.32,"endTime":304.84,"body":"think is probably the one that"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":304.84,"endTime":309.76,"body":"keeps coming up. But that's"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":304.84,"endTime":309.76,"body":"about it, really. And that whole"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":310.3,"endTime":314.74,"body":"was quite scary for me that lack"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":310.3,"endTime":314.74,"body":"of anyone talking about this"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":314.74,"endTime":316.39,"body":"issue, the fact that we are"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":314.74,"endTime":316.39,"body":"ignoring it."},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":318.04,"endTime":320.65,"body":"That that that was really what I"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":318.04,"endTime":320.65,"body":"wanted to explore. I wanted to"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":320.65,"endTime":323.02,"body":"help. Really, I wanted to get in"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":320.65,"endTime":323.02,"body":"there and find out whether there"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":323.02,"endTime":326.89,"body":"was what was going on in that in"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":323.02,"endTime":326.89,"body":"that gap. Yeah, I think I think"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":326.89,"endTime":328.72,"body":"it's really interesting to kind"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":326.89,"endTime":328.72,"body":"of put a context of what you're"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":328.72,"endTime":331.12,"body":"talking about when it's being"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":328.72,"endTime":331.12,"body":"talked about, isn't it supposed"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":331.12,"endTime":335.32,"body":"to published, those are"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":331.12,"endTime":335.32,"body":"conversations that happen around"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":335.35,"endTime":338.14,"body":"gender inequality and gender"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":335.35,"endTime":338.14,"body":"representation in design and"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":338.14,"endTime":341.77,"body":"technology, you see a quite a"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":338.14,"endTime":341.77,"body":"lot on social media. And I've"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":341.77,"endTime":345.82,"body":"seen that, that people who've"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":341.77,"endTime":345.82,"body":"responded to the survey about"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":346.45,"endTime":348.67,"body":"research and design and"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":346.45,"endTime":348.67,"body":"technology, the issues at"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":348.67,"endTime":351.31,"body":"looking at gender kind of kept"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":348.67,"endTime":351.31,"body":"coming up and coming up,"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":352.42,"endTime":356.77,"body":"throughout. And it's talked"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":352.42,"endTime":356.77,"body":"about the female, that the high"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":356.77,"endTime":360.07,"body":"proportion of females teaching"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":356.77,"endTime":360.07,"body":"design and technology, and that"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":360.07,"endTime":362.65,"body":"these things are talked about in"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":360.07,"endTime":362.65,"body":"that context, but they're not"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":363.52,"endTime":367.03,"body":"researched or written about in a"},{"speaker":"Brendan Anglim","startTime":363.52,"endTime":367.03,"body":"way."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":368.13,"endTime":371.7,"body":"That that is, that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":368.13,"endTime":371.7,"body":"is kind of one of the better"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":371.7,"endTime":376.26,"body":"phrase structured, and, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":371.7,"endTime":376.26,"body":"presented. So yeah, so I think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":376.26,"endTime":380.55,"body":"your work is, is really needed."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":376.26,"endTime":380.55,"body":"So so that's what that's where"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":380.55,"endTime":383.55,"body":"you started. So as I think more"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":380.55,"endTime":383.55,"body":"about your study and what you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":383.55,"endTime":386.97,"body":"did, there was right from the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":383.55,"endTime":386.97,"body":"outset, I need to I'm going to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":386.97,"endTime":389.31,"body":"make it clear now because we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":386.97,"endTime":389.31,"body":"have discussed this already on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":390.0,"endTime":397.53,"body":"it. So I'm white, middle class,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":390.0,"endTime":397.53,"body":"male, doing study into gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":397.56,"endTime":401.13,"body":"inequalities. And of course,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":397.56,"endTime":401.13,"body":"that that's haunted me"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":401.13,"endTime":404.49,"body":"throughout the whole of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":401.13,"endTime":404.49,"body":"project, as it How have I got,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":404.55,"endTime":407.94,"body":"how can I say anything of any"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":404.55,"endTime":407.94,"body":"value that has any worse."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":409.02,"endTime":413.22,"body":"And I found this really tricky"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":409.02,"endTime":413.22,"body":"to deal with. I was talking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":413.22,"endTime":416.58,"body":"before about the need to have a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":413.22,"endTime":416.58,"body":"little mantra written up on the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":416.58,"endTime":419.49,"body":"wall in front of me that that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":416.58,"endTime":419.49,"body":"phrase comes from someone else,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":419.49,"endTime":422.46,"body":"this isn't these aren't my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":419.49,"endTime":422.46,"body":"words, these are from someone"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":422.46,"endTime":426.99,"body":"who another man working in, in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":422.46,"endTime":426.99,"body":"the area of feminist sort of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":426.99,"endTime":430.59,"body":"work, I'm not where they are,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":426.99,"endTime":430.59,"body":"this is not about me. But I can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":430.59,"endTime":433.08,"body":"make a difference. And I am here"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":430.59,"endTime":433.08,"body":"to learn. And I've learned an"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":433.08,"endTime":437.16,"body":"awful lot from my own teaching,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":433.08,"endTime":437.16,"body":"if nothing else, from the whole"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":437.16,"endTime":440.64,"body":"study, my own teaching, I hope"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":437.16,"endTime":440.64,"body":"has improved just a little bit"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":441.24,"endTime":445.5,"body":"in the way that I now treat boys"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":441.24,"endTime":445.5,"body":"and girls and the way that I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":447.18,"endTime":451.83,"body":"talk with them. In the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":447.18,"endTime":451.83,"body":"classroom, I think that's helped"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":451.86,"endTime":453.39,"body":"me and my own teaching."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":454.71,"endTime":456.9,"body":"I think that's, that's really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":454.71,"endTime":456.9,"body":"interesting. I think people"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":456.9,"endTime":460.17,"body":"forget that parts of the thing"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":456.9,"endTime":460.17,"body":"that happens when you do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":460.17,"endTime":465.18,"body":"research is you go through a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":460.17,"endTime":465.18,"body":"change, isn't it, you don't want"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":465.18,"endTime":467.61,"body":"to fall into the trap, I'm going"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":465.18,"endTime":467.61,"body":"to use it go on a journey, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":467.61,"endTime":472.17,"body":"know, you it is quite seismic, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":467.61,"endTime":472.17,"body":"think whether it's a small study"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":472.17,"endTime":475.74,"body":"or like you and I have done a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":472.17,"endTime":475.74,"body":"doctoral study over the several"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":475.74,"endTime":479.49,"body":"years, a long time, a full time"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":475.74,"endTime":479.49,"body":"job. And I can completely"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":479.49,"endTime":483.39,"body":"understand your, your feeling"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":479.49,"endTime":483.39,"body":"of, you know, who am I to be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":483.39,"endTime":489.09,"body":"looking at this in terms of I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":483.39,"endTime":489.09,"body":"a man looking at gender issues,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":489.99,"endTime":492.36,"body":"understand trying to understand"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":489.99,"endTime":492.36,"body":"these inequalities, where they"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":492.36,"endTime":495.72,"body":"come from. But I think on the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":492.36,"endTime":495.72,"body":"other hand, because of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":495.72,"endTime":498.72,"body":"gender inequalities, there is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":495.72,"endTime":498.72,"body":"the potential that because you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":498.72,"endTime":503.37,"body":"are a white male, that what you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":498.72,"endTime":503.37,"body":"say may well be listened to by a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":503.37,"endTime":509.28,"body":"greater audience. And that's the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":503.37,"endTime":509.28,"body":"awful I really Yeah, copying I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":509.28,"endTime":514.65,"body":"said that gave me but that is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":509.28,"endTime":514.65,"body":"awful, isn't it. And but there"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":514.65,"endTime":520.59,"body":"is a Trieste in that. Which is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":514.65,"endTime":520.59,"body":"which is such a shame and that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":520.59,"endTime":524.19,"body":"that's not a reflection to you,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":520.59,"endTime":524.19,"body":"Brendan, at all or so probably"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":524.19,"endTime":526.86,"body":"many of the people were"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":524.19,"endTime":526.86,"body":"listening to you but but that is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":526.86,"endTime":533.07,"body":"a an unacknowledged bias that we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":526.86,"endTime":533.07,"body":"all have over lots of different"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":533.07,"endTime":539.91,"body":"things around gender, ethnicity,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":533.07,"endTime":539.91,"body":"age, disability, that we value"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":539.91,"endTime":544.98,"body":"some voices over others. But I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":539.91,"endTime":544.98,"body":"do really like that quote, and I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":544.98,"endTime":548.16,"body":"asked you to send me a the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":544.98,"endTime":548.16,"body":"details of where it came from,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":548.16,"endTime":551.07,"body":"we could put that in the show"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":548.16,"endTime":551.07,"body":"notes that people can sort of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":551.73,"endTime":553.86,"body":"hold on to that and do what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":551.73,"endTime":553.86,"body":"you've done and print it out. I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":553.86,"endTime":556.83,"body":"like I like that idea. And I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":553.86,"endTime":556.83,"body":"think we all wrestled with that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":556.83,"endTime":562.56,"body":"about who are we to do this?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":556.83,"endTime":562.56,"body":"Right. So So I think it's great"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":562.56,"endTime":564.45,"body":"to put that out on the table"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":562.56,"endTime":564.45,"body":"because you know, I've had"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":564.45,"endTime":567.84,"body":"people on the podcast before"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":564.45,"endTime":567.84,"body":"I'll will recur. And Daniela"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":567.84,"endTime":570.66,"body":"talking about gender and design"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":567.84,"endTime":570.66,"body":"and technology. So it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":570.66,"endTime":572.4,"body":"good to get that out there. But"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":570.66,"endTime":572.4,"body":"it's also good to get your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":572.4,"endTime":577.5,"body":"perspective and what your work"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":572.4,"endTime":577.5,"body":"is. So next bit what you want to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":577.5,"endTime":579.66,"body":"share next. He's talked about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":577.5,"endTime":579.66,"body":"theories. I know."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":582.0,"endTime":585.24,"body":"This is the problem because you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":582.0,"endTime":585.24,"body":"spent so long sort of involved"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":585.24,"endTime":589.71,"body":"in in the literature and reading"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":585.24,"endTime":589.71,"body":"and looking at is knowing what's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":589.71,"endTime":594.93,"body":"of any value to others. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":589.71,"endTime":594.93,"body":"cultural capital has been thrown"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":594.93,"endTime":598.17,"body":"around a bit in the last few"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":594.93,"endTime":598.17,"body":"years, and misunderstood in a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":598.17,"endTime":601.65,"body":"number of ways. But what I quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":598.17,"endTime":601.65,"body":"liked was That Louise Archer has"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":601.65,"endTime":605.88,"body":"worked in terms of she's looking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":601.65,"endTime":605.88,"body":"at the Institute of Physics and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":605.91,"endTime":610.17,"body":"science, capital, not cultural"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":605.91,"endTime":610.17,"body":"capital, but science capital."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":610.59,"endTime":614.1,"body":"And I, I really liked where she"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":610.59,"endTime":614.1,"body":"was coming from this idea that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":614.19,"endTime":617.73,"body":"it's not, it's not what you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":614.19,"endTime":617.73,"body":"know, it's how, you know, it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":617.73,"endTime":623.37,"body":"who you know, it's how you talk"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":617.73,"endTime":623.37,"body":"about it. That's, that's what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":623.37,"endTime":627.18,"body":"gets you places that that that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":623.37,"endTime":627.18,"body":"that has real value. And of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":627.18,"endTime":629.76,"body":"course, there's technological"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":627.18,"endTime":629.76,"body":"capital as well, if you could"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":629.76,"endTime":633.21,"body":"basically apply it to anything."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":629.76,"endTime":633.21,"body":"And I found that so Borges"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":633.24,"endTime":636.66,"body":"cultural capital, which was has"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":633.24,"endTime":636.66,"body":"been sort of misinformed, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":636.66,"endTime":639.39,"body":"it's quite often for years,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":636.66,"endTime":639.39,"body":"cultural capital often comes as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":639.39,"endTime":644.16,"body":"a sort of really stagnant"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":639.39,"endTime":644.16,"body":"reproductive manner. In other"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":644.16,"endTime":649.11,"body":"words, schooling is all about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":644.16,"endTime":649.11,"body":"just implanting our gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":649.11,"endTime":652.98,"body":"stereotypes onto the next"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":649.11,"endTime":652.98,"body":"generation. And I think what's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":653.01,"endTime":656.22,"body":"what Louise Archer was talking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":653.01,"endTime":656.22,"body":"about was making this more"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":656.22,"endTime":660.57,"body":"transformative. In other words,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":656.22,"endTime":660.57,"body":"what can we offer in our lessons"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":660.57,"endTime":663.75,"body":"in our designs and audio lessons"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":660.57,"endTime":663.75,"body":"to everyone to provide them with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":663.75,"endTime":666.69,"body":"the capital to be able to stand"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":663.75,"endTime":666.69,"body":"up for themselves have agency"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":666.69,"endTime":669.33,"body":"and make a difference in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":666.69,"endTime":669.33,"body":"world not just for themselves,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":669.63,"endTime":673.11,"body":"but for the group that they"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":669.63,"endTime":673.11,"body":"represent. And I found that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":673.11,"endTime":675.03,"body":"really quite interesting that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":673.11,"endTime":675.03,"body":"that was that was a really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":675.03,"endTime":678.54,"body":"interesting theoretical, complex"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":675.03,"endTime":678.54,"body":"journey that I went through"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":678.54,"endTime":681.15,"body":"trying to understand that there"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":678.54,"endTime":681.15,"body":"was a couple two or three years"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":681.15,"endTime":681.39,"body":"and that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":682.77,"endTime":686.52,"body":"I greatly admire you listen"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":682.77,"endTime":686.52,"body":"aboard you I tried because I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":686.52,"endTime":689.19,"body":"wasn't sure whether that fitted"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":686.52,"endTime":689.19,"body":"with where I was coming from and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":689.22,"endTime":693.66,"body":"unfortunately, it didn't. But"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":689.22,"endTime":693.66,"body":"yeah, and Louise archers work"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":693.66,"endTime":699.36,"body":"around science capital has been"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":693.66,"endTime":699.36,"body":"absolutely fascinating and quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":699.36,"endTime":702.12,"body":"seismic, in its influence about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":699.36,"endTime":702.12,"body":"the way people think and the way"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":702.12,"endTime":705.9,"body":"people like me as a female,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":702.12,"endTime":705.9,"body":"academic, think and perform. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":705.9,"endTime":707.31,"body":"yeah, what I really like about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":707.31,"endTime":710.49,"body":"her work is, is the practical"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":707.31,"endTime":710.49,"body":"application of it, she, it this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":710.52,"endTime":714.0,"body":"this is not just theoretical, so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":710.52,"endTime":714.0,"body":"it's a there's a lot of feminist"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":714.0,"endTime":719.28,"body":"responses to budget. And you can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":714.0,"endTime":719.28,"body":"Margaret Archer is another"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":719.52,"endTime":722.61,"body":"feminist writer who talks about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":719.52,"endTime":722.61,"body":"sort of produce work and I found"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":722.64,"endTime":725.4,"body":"I found her writing really,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":722.64,"endTime":725.4,"body":"really tricky, but it's very"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":725.4,"endTime":729.9,"body":"abstract. Whereas Louise arches"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":725.4,"endTime":729.9,"body":"were absolutely bang on and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":729.93,"endTime":733.95,"body":"direct. And, and it was all"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":729.93,"endTime":733.95,"body":"about practical applications in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":733.95,"endTime":737.1,"body":"the classroom, across schools."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":733.95,"endTime":737.1,"body":"And that's actually one of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":737.1,"endTime":740.94,"body":"reasons I really wanted to do my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":737.1,"endTime":740.94,"body":"this. This research, it was the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":741.45,"endTime":745.11,"body":"it's a professional doctorate,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":741.45,"endTime":745.11,"body":"not a PhD, and a professional"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":745.11,"endTime":746.82,"body":"doctorate. The idea is that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":745.11,"endTime":746.82,"body":"you're trying to make a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":746.82,"endTime":750.57,"body":"difference to what to your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":746.82,"endTime":750.57,"body":"professional practice. And so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":750.6,"endTime":753.72,"body":"her work was really influential."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":750.6,"endTime":753.72,"body":"And another bit of theory that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":753.72,"endTime":756.93,"body":"came up that I really enjoyed,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":753.72,"endTime":756.93,"body":"that I found really powerful,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":757.26,"endTime":762.54,"body":"was Jacqueline Eccles work on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":757.26,"endTime":762.54,"body":"expectancy value theory. And she"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":762.57,"endTime":767.91,"body":"she was writing in the 80s. From"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":762.57,"endTime":767.91,"body":"from a math perspective, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":767.91,"endTime":771.21,"body":"know, gender in math, which is,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":767.91,"endTime":771.21,"body":"which is always quite tricky."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":771.78,"endTime":775.5,"body":"But because that was her driving"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":771.78,"endTime":775.5,"body":"force, for some reason, women"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":775.5,"endTime":778.5,"body":"don't know that that is the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":775.5,"endTime":778.5,"body":"reason it's stuck. So it so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":778.5,"endTime":783.75,"body":"almost everyone has done studies"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":778.5,"endTime":783.75,"body":"into gender and stem. There's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":783.75,"endTime":786.93,"body":"always there's always a link"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":783.75,"endTime":786.93,"body":"back to ECOSYS work. And I don't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":786.93,"endTime":788.76,"body":"think she's credited for it. You"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":786.93,"endTime":788.76,"body":"know, you're talking about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":788.76,"endTime":792.33,"body":"hidden voices earlier on. She I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":788.76,"endTime":792.33,"body":"think her work is incredibly"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":792.33,"endTime":795.33,"body":"powerful. She's got this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":792.33,"endTime":795.33,"body":"beautiful model allistic model"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":795.54,"endTime":799.95,"body":"of the way that we as teachers,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":795.54,"endTime":799.95,"body":"and society affects the way that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":799.95,"endTime":804.9,"body":"our children in the classroom"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":799.95,"endTime":804.9,"body":"make decisions about the what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":804.9,"endTime":807.99,"body":"they're going to study and how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":804.9,"endTime":807.99,"body":"they're going to study. It's a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":807.99,"endTime":810.36,"body":"beautiful model quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":807.99,"endTime":810.36,"body":"graphically, it's quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":810.36,"endTime":813.42,"body":"interesting as well. Yes, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":810.36,"endTime":813.42,"body":"don't think I don't think she's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":813.42,"endTime":815.91,"body":"had much recognition for that or"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":813.42,"endTime":815.91,"body":"not enough."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":816.569,"endTime":821.189,"body":"Well, she got cited in mind. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":816.569,"endTime":821.189,"body":"her diagram appears in my, my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":821.189,"endTime":824.879,"body":"thumbs up when you mentioned it,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":821.189,"endTime":824.879,"body":"because, like you I love, I love"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":824.879,"endTime":828.089,"body":"her work. And I love the way"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":824.879,"endTime":828.089,"body":"it's graphic, you know, it's got"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":828.089,"endTime":830.699,"body":"that model, it's got a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":828.089,"endTime":830.699,"body":"conceptual framework, and then"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":830.699,"endTime":834.659,"body":"it's been tested over time, her"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":830.699,"endTime":834.659,"body":"work greatly informed mine"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":835.109,"endTime":838.319,"body":"around where our values come"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":835.109,"endTime":838.319,"body":"from in the different types of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":838.319,"endTime":843.179,"body":"values and motivation and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":838.319,"endTime":843.179,"body":"search. Yeah, I just, yeah, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":843.179,"endTime":848.969,"body":"think she's great. And she's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":843.179,"endTime":848.969,"body":"still publishing. Fantastic. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":848.969,"endTime":852.509,"body":"God says Eccles, echoes,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":848.969,"endTime":852.509,"body":"expectancy value theory. What"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":852.509,"endTime":853.259,"body":"else for you?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":854.25,"endTime":857.85,"body":"I got I had a bit of a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":854.25,"endTime":857.85,"body":"sidetrack. So part of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":857.85,"endTime":860.67,"body":"professional doctorate is that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":857.85,"endTime":860.67,"body":"you do the first couple of years"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":860.67,"endTime":864.75,"body":"you do. Effectively. It's a Talk"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":860.67,"endTime":864.75,"body":"series of taught modules. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":864.75,"endTime":868.47,"body":"one of the modules was, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":864.75,"endTime":868.47,"body":"know, pick a topic that you are"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":868.47,"endTime":871.71,"body":"particularly interested in, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":868.47,"endTime":871.71,"body":"looked at neuroscience, and it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":871.71,"endTime":875.37,"body":"was neuroscience in terms of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":871.71,"endTime":875.37,"body":"gender differences. And our what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":875.37,"endTime":880.71,"body":"a what a messy, complicated area"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":875.37,"endTime":880.71,"body":"that was, but I found it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":880.71,"endTime":884.49,"body":"fascinating. I couldn't, I could"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":880.71,"endTime":884.49,"body":"have spent the whole thesis on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":884.49,"endTime":888.75,"body":"that really, I ended up that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":884.49,"endTime":888.75,"body":"that particular chapter shrunk"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":888.84,"endTime":891.84,"body":"bizarrely over the hawk over the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":888.84,"endTime":891.84,"body":"course of the of the doctor"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":891.84,"endTime":895.08,"body":"because effectively it was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":891.84,"endTime":895.08,"body":"starting to get too messy. So it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":895.08,"endTime":897.15,"body":"shrunken trunk control"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":895.08,"endTime":897.15,"body":"conseiller became this tiny"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":897.15,"endTime":900.75,"body":"little nugget sort of sitting in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":897.15,"endTime":900.75,"body":"the middle of it but Did did"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":900.75,"endTime":906.24,"body":"come out when I was talking to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":900.75,"endTime":906.24,"body":"my, to my participants about how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":906.24,"endTime":911.16,"body":"they viewed and perceived gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":906.24,"endTime":911.16,"body":"to be sort of acted in their"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":911.16,"endTime":915.78,"body":"classrooms enacted, they will,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":911.16,"endTime":915.78,"body":"you often heard these little,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":916.02,"endTime":918.81,"body":"these neuro myths, the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":916.02,"endTime":918.81,"body":"differences between boys and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":918.81,"endTime":923.01,"body":"girls. And this idea that girls"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":918.81,"endTime":923.01,"body":"think differently to boys and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":923.01,"endTime":925.71,"body":"boys think differently and have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":923.01,"endTime":925.71,"body":"some really interesting things"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":925.71,"endTime":929.25,"body":"coming out there. And the idea"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":925.71,"endTime":929.25,"body":"of that, but neuroscience says"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":929.25,"endTime":932.13,"body":"that says that this is right,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":929.25,"endTime":932.13,"body":"you can see it, that's sort of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":932.61,"endTime":938.52,"body":"it. And of course, when you're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":932.61,"endTime":938.52,"body":"interviewing in a research mode,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":938.82,"endTime":941.82,"body":"it's it's about gaining"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":938.82,"endTime":941.82,"body":"information. It's about that's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":941.88,"endTime":945.36,"body":"the nonce that you denoting that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":941.88,"endTime":945.36,"body":"you go along with that, as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":945.36,"endTime":947.82,"body":"you're responding to the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":945.36,"endTime":947.82,"body":"participant, which is very"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":947.82,"endTime":951.36,"body":"different, potentially from a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":947.82,"endTime":951.36,"body":"coaching or a mentoring type of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":951.36,"endTime":958.23,"body":"role. And so, but I found myself"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":951.36,"endTime":958.23,"body":"I couldn't, I had to bite my lip"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":958.29,"endTime":961.89,"body":"when I when I was hearing these"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":958.29,"endTime":961.89,"body":"things. I don't know whether you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":961.89,"endTime":964.44,"body":"found the same and you're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":961.89,"endTime":964.44,"body":"interested in that sense of you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":964.44,"endTime":965.16,"body":"want to say something?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":965.699,"endTime":969.779,"body":"Yeah, yeah, there is and kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":965.699,"endTime":969.779,"body":"having to keep smiling when"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":969.779,"endTime":973.019,"body":"somebody's saying something that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":969.779,"endTime":973.019,"body":"you think I just agree with, at"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":973.019,"endTime":976.589,"body":"all I want to, I want to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":973.019,"endTime":976.589,"body":"challenge it mean, I used a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":976.589,"endTime":981.539,"body":"particular type of interviewing,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":976.589,"endTime":981.539,"body":"and called active interviews,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":981.539,"endTime":985.859,"body":"which sort of gave it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":981.539,"endTime":985.859,"body":"permission, for me and my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":985.889,"endTime":989.729,"body":"perspective to be in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":985.889,"endTime":989.729,"body":"interview and, and to do some"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":990.059,"endTime":994.019,"body":"not not shaping, but it was a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":990.059,"endTime":994.019,"body":"conversation. And as much as it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":994.019,"endTime":997.709,"body":"had a framework to it. But ya"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":994.019,"endTime":997.709,"body":"know, mine was more when I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":997.709,"endTime":1000.679,"body":"started to do the data analysis"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":997.709,"endTime":1000.679,"body":"that things came out about what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1000.679,"endTime":1004.099,"body":"people had said was the value of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1000.679,"endTime":1004.099,"body":"science and technology. And one"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1004.099,"endTime":1008.989,"body":"kept coming out that just made"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1004.099,"endTime":1008.989,"body":"me Twitch, you know, made me"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1008.989,"endTime":1014.149,"body":"feel physically uncomfortable."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1008.989,"endTime":1014.149,"body":"And it was all about children"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1014.149,"endTime":1019.489,"body":"learning to cook to sew into do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1014.149,"endTime":1019.489,"body":"DIY. I don't like this, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1019.489,"endTime":1022.669,"body":"know, and I remember sitting at"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1019.489,"endTime":1022.669,"body":"the dining table. At a time when"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1022.669,"endTime":1025.969,"body":"I was candling. My data by bits"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1022.669,"endTime":1025.969,"body":"of paper, I moved on to software"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1025.969,"endTime":1029.809,"body":"very quickly after that, I kind"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1025.969,"endTime":1029.809,"body":"of had to get up and walk away"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1029.809,"endTime":1034.219,"body":"from the dining table because I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1029.809,"endTime":1034.219,"body":"couldn't bear this idea. My"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1034.219,"endTime":1036.499,"body":"perspective changed over time,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1034.219,"endTime":1036.499,"body":"which I think I've talked about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1036.499,"endTime":1042.079,"body":"in a previous episode. But yeah,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1036.499,"endTime":1042.079,"body":"you do get into that. It's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1042.079,"endTime":1044.659,"body":"really difficult to researchers,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1042.079,"endTime":1044.659,"body":"to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1044.69,"endTime":1047.15,"body":"participant voice is so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1044.69,"endTime":1047.15,"body":"powerful, and I really wanted to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1047.15,"endTime":1051.26,"body":"make sure that that came across,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1047.15,"endTime":1051.26,"body":"so I stuck. I stuck as rigidly"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1051.26,"endTime":1055.58,"body":"as I could to their, to their"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1051.26,"endTime":1055.58,"body":"their quotes, basically, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1055.58,"endTime":1060.92,"body":"quoted quite a lot throughout"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1055.58,"endTime":1060.92,"body":"it. But one of the models that I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1060.92,"endTime":1065.69,"body":"used was the sort of critical"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1060.92,"endTime":1065.69,"body":"theory. So not only was it what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1065.69,"endTime":1068.72,"body":"what are the participants"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1065.69,"endTime":1068.72,"body":"thinking? But like yourself,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1068.75,"endTime":1071.51,"body":"what am I thinking about what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1068.75,"endTime":1071.51,"body":"the participants are thinking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1071.51,"endTime":1075.32,"body":"about? So another another layer,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1071.51,"endTime":1075.32,"body":"potentially, of understanding or"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1075.32,"endTime":1080.48,"body":"interpretation of that. And that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1075.32,"endTime":1080.48,"body":"allowed me to basically put my,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1080.54,"endTime":1085.37,"body":"my voice quiet voice into the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1080.54,"endTime":1085.37,"body":"research as well. You talked"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1085.37,"endTime":1088.55,"body":"about a particular type of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1085.37,"endTime":1088.55,"body":"interview technique I, I really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1088.82,"endTime":1095.45,"body":"got into and found quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1088.82,"endTime":1095.45,"body":"exciting that the use of video"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1095.45,"endTime":1099.92,"body":"stimulated interviews, and the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1095.45,"endTime":1099.92,"body":"implicit association tests to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1101.18,"endTime":1104.27,"body":"just stimulate the thinking of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1101.18,"endTime":1104.27,"body":"the participants and to try to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1104.27,"endTime":1106.82,"body":"get a little bit deeper inside"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1104.27,"endTime":1106.82,"body":"their perceptions and their"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1106.82,"endTime":1110.9,"body":"belief systems. Boy did I didn't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1106.82,"endTime":1110.9,"body":"realise quite how powerful those"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1110.9,"endTime":1115.55,"body":"two things were. If not, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1110.9,"endTime":1115.55,"body":"genuinely had the implicit"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1115.55,"endTime":1120.68,"body":"association tests are an unusual"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1115.55,"endTime":1120.68,"body":"technique I didn't some of your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1120.71,"endTime":1121.4,"body":"listeners may have."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1122.09,"endTime":1123.68,"body":"Yeah. Well,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1125.03,"endTime":1128.87,"body":"have you had an MRI, you haven't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1125.03,"endTime":1128.87,"body":"had a go the visit. So Greg"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1128.87,"endTime":1131.39,"body":"Walden Nosek, they've been"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1128.87,"endTime":1131.39,"body":"kicking around for some time"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1131.39,"endTime":1134.51,"body":"now, but it's an idea. The idea"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1131.39,"endTime":1134.51,"body":"is that it's a psychometric"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1134.51,"endTime":1137.48,"body":"test. In other words, things"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1134.51,"endTime":1137.48,"body":"flesh up on a screen, and you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1137.48,"endTime":1140.51,"body":"press some buttons on the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1137.48,"endTime":1140.51,"body":"keypad, the quicker that you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1140.51,"endTime":1145.22,"body":"respond to the words that are"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1140.51,"endTime":1145.22,"body":"flashing up on the screen, the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1145.22,"endTime":1148.52,"body":"more likely you are to associate"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1145.22,"endTime":1148.52,"body":"the two together. So you'll have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1148.52,"endTime":1153.29,"body":"pairs, pairs of words, and it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1148.52,"endTime":1153.29,"body":"will have uncle and male and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1153.38,"endTime":1156.92,"body":"adults, it's really easy to make"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1153.38,"endTime":1156.92,"body":"that connection. But as we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1156.92,"endTime":1162.65,"body":"split up, you'll end up with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1156.92,"endTime":1162.65,"body":"things like liberal arts, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1162.71,"endTime":1166.31,"body":"auntie. And of course, that's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1162.71,"endTime":1166.31,"body":"quite easy to do. But liberal"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1166.31,"endTime":1169.4,"body":"arts and Uncle might not be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1166.31,"endTime":1169.4,"body":"quite as easy and it might did"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1169.4,"endTime":1173.15,"body":"slight delay in the way that you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1169.4,"endTime":1173.15,"body":"respond to these supposedly"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1173.9,"endTime":1176.93,"body":"provides them with a little bit"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1173.9,"endTime":1176.93,"body":"of data, which then can then say"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1176.93,"endTime":1182.39,"body":"that this is your this is your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1176.93,"endTime":1182.39,"body":"gender science bias, but it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1182.39,"endTime":1186.23,"body":"not really bias. It's more about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1182.39,"endTime":1186.23,"body":"your implicit associations. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1186.23,"endTime":1188.87,"body":"I think what what my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1186.23,"endTime":1188.87,"body":"participants found some of them"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1189.41,"endTime":1192.2,"body":"struggle with this concept"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1189.41,"endTime":1192.2,"body":"actually. One really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1192.2,"endTime":1200.96,"body":"interestingly. One, a gay one"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1192.2,"endTime":1200.96,"body":"participant basis basically said"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1201.02,"endTime":1204.98,"body":"this mean, this is farcical, the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1201.02,"endTime":1204.98,"body":"whole process is farcical and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1204.98,"endTime":1210.26,"body":"other words, uncool. It's, it's,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1204.98,"endTime":1210.26,"body":"it doesn't have any meaning to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1210.26,"endTime":1213.02,"body":"me. And I really liked that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1210.26,"endTime":1213.02,"body":"response, I thought it was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1213.02,"endTime":1216.32,"body":"really powerful. 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And also the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1288.35,"endTime":1291.92,"body":"participants really shared"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1288.35,"endTime":1291.92,"body":"information and belief systems"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1291.92,"endTime":1296.72,"body":"that I that I was very surprised"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1291.92,"endTime":1296.72,"body":"by. We had discussions of faith."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1297.95,"endTime":1306.77,"body":"And I'll be honest, that some"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1297.95,"endTime":1306.77,"body":"really interesting that there"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1306.77,"endTime":1314.42,"body":"were two characters who were"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1306.77,"endTime":1314.42,"body":"clearly troubled by the voice"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1314.54,"endTime":1322.07,"body":"and potential for women to be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1314.54,"endTime":1322.07,"body":"and girls to be provided with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1322.07,"endTime":1325.7,"body":"power. Their misogynist, as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1322.07,"endTime":1325.7,"body":"simple as that. And that and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1325.73,"endTime":1328.22,"body":"this, and this is where it came"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1325.73,"endTime":1328.22,"body":"out with it. It came out after"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1328.22,"endTime":1329.33,"body":"having this IoT."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1331.55,"endTime":1334.37,"body":"So yeah, as a researcher, I can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1331.55,"endTime":1334.37,"body":"imagine that's quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1334.37,"endTime":1339.38,"body":"uncomfortable then to listen to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1334.37,"endTime":1339.38,"body":"you. And so your participants,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1339.38,"endTime":1342.02,"body":"they were all design and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1339.38,"endTime":1342.02,"body":"technology teachers, were they"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1343.4,"endTime":1346.13,"body":"one of the focus groups, I had a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1343.4,"endTime":1346.13,"body":"couple of scientists, computer"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1346.13,"endTime":1349.52,"body":"science teachers as well."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1346.13,"endTime":1349.52,"body":"Because just the way that it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1349.52,"endTime":1352.91,"body":"works at that particular school,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1349.52,"endTime":1352.91,"body":"but yes, they were all DMT"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1352.91,"endTime":1356.81,"body":"teachers and in various"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1352.91,"endTime":1356.81,"body":"different settings. So we had a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1356.81,"endTime":1361.43,"body":"single, single sex girls only"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1356.81,"endTime":1361.43,"body":"school, we had a diamond"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1361.43,"endTime":1362.48,"body":"formation school."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1363.65,"endTime":1365.15,"body":"What's the diamond formation?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1365.18,"endTime":1370.31,"body":"Oh, so where boys and girls are"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1365.18,"endTime":1370.31,"body":"separated when they get to year"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1370.31,"endTime":1374.6,"body":"nine. For that, and that GCSE,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1370.31,"endTime":1374.6,"body":"isn't it come back together for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1374.6,"endTime":1379.7,"body":"six, four? I've seen it in a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1374.6,"endTime":1379.7,"body":"few. I've seen a couple of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1379.7,"endTime":1385.04,"body":"times. But the I think the idea,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1379.7,"endTime":1385.04,"body":"and I'm probably oversimplifying"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1385.04,"endTime":1389.69,"body":"here is the idea that actually,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1385.04,"endTime":1389.69,"body":"in terms of adolescent"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1389.69,"endTime":1393.2,"body":"development, that particular"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1389.69,"endTime":1393.2,"body":"period is the most problematic."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1393.35,"endTime":1397.01,"body":"So by separating the genders,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1393.35,"endTime":1397.01,"body":"you're avoiding all the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1397.01,"endTime":1400.49,"body":"problems, you're allowing"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1397.01,"endTime":1400.49,"body":"academic progress to be made,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1400.97,"endTime":1403.25,"body":"which you can then bring them"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1400.97,"endTime":1403.25,"body":"back together afterwards. In"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1403.25,"endTime":1405.86,"body":"sixth form. It's it's an"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1403.25,"endTime":1405.86,"body":"interesting one, isn't it?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1409.76,"endTime":1413.27,"body":"Because there's an assumption"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1409.76,"endTime":1413.27,"body":"that there about the boys and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1413.27,"endTime":1418.16,"body":"the girls that are heterosexual"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1413.27,"endTime":1418.16,"body":"if we're taking it down, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1418.16,"endTime":1422.63,"body":"know, that's one of the that's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1418.16,"endTime":1422.63,"body":"one of the ways that these"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1422.63,"endTime":1427.25,"body":"things are classed isn't around,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1422.63,"endTime":1427.25,"body":"say around gender, or what is it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1427.25,"endTime":1429.95,"body":"around? But yeah, fascinating."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1427.25,"endTime":1429.95,"body":"Okay, well, we're going, we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1429.95,"endTime":1433.76,"body":"going off on down a rabbit hole"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1429.95,"endTime":1433.76,"body":"of that, it's probably another"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1433.76,"endTime":1437.3,"body":"conversation we could have. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1433.76,"endTime":1437.3,"body":"you interviewed these teachers,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1437.36,"endTime":1441.83,"body":"you're interested in their"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1437.36,"endTime":1441.83,"body":"perceptions of gender, in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1441.83,"endTime":1443.42,"body":"context of Design and Technology"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1443.78,"endTime":1446.69,"body":"completely and understand as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1443.78,"endTime":1446.69,"body":"well. So there are a few"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1446.69,"endTime":1449.15,"body":"questions relating to the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1446.69,"endTime":1449.15,"body":"relationship between design"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1449.15,"endTime":1453.98,"body":"technology and stem. And with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1449.15,"endTime":1453.98,"body":"gender as there's the link"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1453.98,"endTime":1460.07,"body":"point, the to. And the analysis"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1453.98,"endTime":1460.07,"body":"you talked about in your own"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1460.07,"endTime":1463.76,"body":"research after that was, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1460.07,"endTime":1463.76,"body":"really enjoyed that process."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1464.93,"endTime":1467.9,"body":"Something that I got to grips"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1464.93,"endTime":1467.9,"body":"with I was I jumped into the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1467.9,"endTime":1475.28,"body":"software as well, and went"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1467.9,"endTime":1475.28,"body":"through multiple interpretations"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1475.34,"endTime":1480.41,"body":"and models and ideas. And that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1475.34,"endTime":1480.41,"body":"was quite, it's quite an a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1480.41,"endTime":1483.83,"body":"creative process, really. And I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1480.41,"endTime":1483.83,"body":"will admit, that was what I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1483.83,"endTime":1488.18,"body":"ended up with is definitely a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1483.83,"endTime":1488.18,"body":"sculpture that if someone else"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1488.18,"endTime":1493.43,"body":"was to take that data, that the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1488.18,"endTime":1493.43,"body":"whatever it was 120,000 words of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1493.43,"endTime":1496.37,"body":"transcripts and take that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1493.43,"endTime":1496.37,"body":"information and analyse it in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1496.37,"endTime":1498.95,"body":"the US probably using the same"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1496.37,"endTime":1498.95,"body":"software, they probably come up"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1498.95,"endTime":1501.11,"body":"with something completely"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1498.95,"endTime":1501.11,"body":"different. I will accept that."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1501.11,"endTime":1505.79,"body":"And I think the fact that it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1501.11,"endTime":1505.79,"body":"took me about, you know, five or"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1505.79,"endTime":1510.14,"body":"six different attempts just to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1505.79,"endTime":1510.14,"body":"make one feel part of it. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1510.14,"endTime":1512.57,"body":"it's not, it's not black and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1510.14,"endTime":1512.57,"body":"white and ever is."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1513.2,"endTime":1516.26,"body":"No, it isn't. It isn't. It's,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1513.2,"endTime":1516.26,"body":"and you're, you're right, your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1516.26,"endTime":1523.01,"body":"your position and who you are"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1516.26,"endTime":1523.01,"body":"and the theoretical lens, and in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1523.43,"endTime":1529.16,"body":"all of that has an impact in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1523.43,"endTime":1529.16,"body":"way you look at your data. I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1529.16,"endTime":1531.44,"body":"wish my master students"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1529.16,"endTime":1531.44,"body":"sometimes would would understand"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1531.44,"endTime":1536.12,"body":"that anyway. Because it's really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1531.44,"endTime":1536.12,"body":"hard to understand and to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1536.12,"endTime":1541.58,"body":"recognise. And so that does mean"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1536.12,"endTime":1541.58,"body":"that the data, may well be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1541.58,"endTime":1544.01,"body":"clustered differently by"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1541.58,"endTime":1544.01,"body":"different people, but the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1544.01,"endTime":1547.13,"body":"analysis, and it's, it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1544.01,"endTime":1547.13,"body":"exhausting to do as well, isn't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1547.13,"endTime":1550.67,"body":"it? I found? And yeah, you can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1547.13,"endTime":1550.67,"body":"have all sorts of arrangements"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1550.67,"endTime":1553.1,"body":"and connotations or white"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1550.67,"endTime":1553.1,"body":"justifications when we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1553.1,"endTime":1558.02,"body":"grouping them like that, or like"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1553.1,"endTime":1558.02,"body":"that. Yeah. And they can change"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1558.02,"endTime":1562.19,"body":"in time, as well. You know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1558.02,"endTime":1562.19,"body":"think about what's my data now,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1562.19,"endTime":1563.9,"body":"I probably group them quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1562.19,"endTime":1563.9,"body":"differently."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1565.04,"endTime":1567.95,"body":"Yes, supervisor was really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1565.04,"endTime":1567.95,"body":"useful at this point, as in,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1568.22,"endTime":1573.47,"body":"it's time to stop. You can't,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1568.22,"endTime":1573.47,"body":"you can't keep going. This is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1573.68,"endTime":1577.1,"body":"year two of the analysis. It's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1573.68,"endTime":1577.1,"body":"like, okay, you need to you need"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1577.1,"endTime":1579.23,"body":"to write something down now."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1577.1,"endTime":1579.23,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1579.29,"endTime":1582.92,"body":"yeah, it's good enough. That's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1579.29,"endTime":1582.92,"body":"the other thing. I was told."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1583.07,"endTime":1586.13,"body":"It's just a qualification. It's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1583.07,"endTime":1586.13,"body":"the start of your academic life."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1586.13,"endTime":1589.37,"body":"It's not the end, you know, that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1586.13,"endTime":1589.37,"body":"was the other. Oh, you're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1589.37,"endTime":1590.72,"body":"thinking at the moment at the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1589.37,"endTime":1590.72,"body":"end."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1593.54,"endTime":1597.44,"body":"Fit? Well, it was that it was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1593.54,"endTime":1597.44,"body":"that? It was it was good enough."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1597.44,"endTime":1600.89,"body":"At that point, it's good enough"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1597.44,"endTime":1600.89,"body":"for now handed in. And it was at"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1600.89,"endTime":1605.33,"body":"that point that that K was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1600.89,"endTime":1605.33,"body":"involved. And I knew I wanted"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1605.42,"endTime":1610.49,"body":"Kate to be part of this somehow."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1605.42,"endTime":1610.49,"body":"So she ended up being my, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1610.49,"endTime":1612.2,"body":"don't know whether I'm sharing"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1610.49,"endTime":1612.2,"body":"too much, actually. But she"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1612.2,"endTime":1619.07,"body":"ended up being my my assessor"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1612.2,"endTime":1619.07,"body":"external assessor. And so she"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1619.07,"endTime":1625.25,"body":"ran the Viva. And, and provided"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1619.07,"endTime":1625.25,"body":"the feedback, and helped me"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1625.25,"endTime":1628.79,"body":"through the corrections and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1625.25,"endTime":1628.79,"body":"guided me and her involvement at"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1628.79,"endTime":1632.93,"body":"that stage was so powerful. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1628.79,"endTime":1632.93,"body":"I know that it was good enough"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1633.02,"endTime":1636.05,"body":"at that point. But Kay's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1633.02,"endTime":1636.05,"body":"involvement made it so much"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1636.05,"endTime":1639.41,"body":"better. And I'm really, really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1636.05,"endTime":1639.41,"body":"grateful to her for her role."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1640.97,"endTime":1643.61,"body":"It's good to have good people"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1640.97,"endTime":1643.61,"body":"like that. Kate, Kate was my one"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1643.61,"endTime":1646.04,"body":"of my externals I had to have to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1643.61,"endTime":1646.04,"body":"because I was an internal"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1646.04,"endTime":1650.84,"body":"candidate at the University. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1646.04,"endTime":1650.84,"body":"I had K and Niall theory, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1650.84,"endTime":1655.04,"body":"know, but yeah, it's good. It's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1650.84,"endTime":1655.04,"body":"good to have those critical"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1655.04,"endTime":1658.85,"body":"people looking at it and, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1655.04,"endTime":1658.85,"body":"making it better. Yeah, when you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1658.85,"endTime":1662.48,"body":"throw in Joe Jackson was mine."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1658.85,"endTime":1662.48,"body":"She was one of my supervisors,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1662.48,"endTime":1666.89,"body":"she's an external supervisor."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1662.48,"endTime":1666.89,"body":"The Insight she gave me over the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1666.89,"endTime":1669.53,"body":"three and a half hours when she"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1666.89,"endTime":1669.53,"body":"comes through my whole first"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1669.53,"endTime":1673.88,"body":"full draft page by page, but"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1669.53,"endTime":1673.88,"body":"wow, wow, it made such a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1673.88,"endTime":1674.69,"body":"difference."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1675.35,"endTime":1681.86,"body":"It was quite rigorous. I found"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1675.35,"endTime":1681.86,"body":"it quite exhausting. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1681.86,"endTime":1687.41,"body":"thankful Actually, I'll be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1681.86,"endTime":1687.41,"body":"honest, in the detail, the level"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1687.41,"endTime":1692.84,"body":"of critique and criticism, not"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1687.41,"endTime":1692.84,"body":"criticism, the level of care"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1692.87,"endTime":1697.1,"body":"that they had put in to reading"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1692.87,"endTime":1697.1,"body":"and and working through my biodh"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1697.1,"endTime":1698.93,"body":"work was fantastic."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1699.59,"endTime":1704.45,"body":"Yeah, it's you feel? Yeah, it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1699.59,"endTime":1704.45,"body":"really, I mean, I've actually"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1704.45,"endTime":1707.21,"body":"done some, I've done some"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1704.45,"endTime":1707.21,"body":"examining myself, I've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1707.21,"endTime":1709.73,"body":"doctorates, and it's a real"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1707.21,"endTime":1709.73,"body":"privilege to be in that position"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1709.73,"endTime":1714.5,"body":"as well. To work with a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1709.73,"endTime":1714.5,"body":"candidate and, and explore with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1714.5,"endTime":1718.04,"body":"them what they've done. Yeah. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1714.5,"endTime":1718.04,"body":"come on, let's get to the juicy"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1718.04,"endTime":1723.14,"body":"bit there. What did you find"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1718.04,"endTime":1723.14,"body":"what what happened? We talked"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1723.14,"endTime":1725.99,"body":"around it, it's been really good"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1723.14,"endTime":1725.99,"body":"to hear about the context. I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1725.99,"endTime":1729.89,"body":"hoping people were fascinated to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1725.99,"endTime":1729.89,"body":"hear about how research at this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1729.89,"endTime":1732.26,"body":"level can be planted in this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1729.89,"endTime":1732.26,"body":"way, gone through."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1732.56,"endTime":1735.86,"body":"So just to clarify from from,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1732.56,"endTime":1735.86,"body":"from what I'm going to say, from"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1735.86,"endTime":1739.79,"body":"here on in, this is only my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1735.86,"endTime":1739.79,"body":"interpretation of that data. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1739.94,"endTime":1742.46,"body":"and there are recommendations,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1739.94,"endTime":1742.46,"body":"but they're they're offered."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1743.06,"endTime":1749.06,"body":"They are they're merely offered."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1743.06,"endTime":1749.06,"body":"These are not things that have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1749.06,"endTime":1752.48,"body":"to be done. Get just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1749.06,"endTime":1752.48,"body":"suggestions, if anything else."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1753.08,"endTime":1756.17,"body":"One of the things I found"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1753.08,"endTime":1756.17,"body":"particularly fascinating was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1756.17,"endTime":1759.59,"body":"this was a confusion from my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1756.17,"endTime":1759.59,"body":"participants about the need for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1759.59,"endTime":1764.06,"body":"positive action. So we were"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1759.59,"endTime":1764.06,"body":"talking about girls only stem"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1764.06,"endTime":1767.81,"body":"clubs in sort of, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1764.06,"endTime":1767.81,"body":"Google, Sony computing clubs,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1767.81,"endTime":1771.38,"body":"and there was some real, it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1767.81,"endTime":1771.38,"body":"raised some really tricky"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1771.68,"endTime":1777.53,"body":"moments in the in the interviews"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1771.68,"endTime":1777.53,"body":"where the word positive"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1777.53,"endTime":1781.76,"body":"discrimination kept coming up."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1777.53,"endTime":1781.76,"body":"In the three or four interviews"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1781.76,"endTime":1784.34,"body":"this this came up and think this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1781.76,"endTime":1784.34,"body":"isn't discrimination, this is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1784.34,"endTime":1787.37,"body":"positive action, but there was a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1784.34,"endTime":1787.37,"body":"confusion there and I don't"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1787.37,"endTime":1793.7,"body":"think it's actually our remit as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1787.37,"endTime":1793.7,"body":"a teacher to provide support for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1793.7,"endTime":1797.96,"body":"those in need. Whatever their"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1793.7,"endTime":1797.96,"body":"grouping, you know, we would do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1797.96,"endTime":1801.47,"body":"it for an EAL students or an SES"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1797.96,"endTime":1801.47,"body":"Students, so why would we not do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1801.47,"endTime":1804.47,"body":"it for girls who were in it, who"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1801.47,"endTime":1804.47,"body":"perhaps haven't had the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1804.47,"endTime":1808.49,"body":"experiences that necessarily the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1804.47,"endTime":1808.49,"body":"boys will have had in certain"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1808.49,"endTime":1812.99,"body":"areas? And yet, as soon as we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1808.49,"endTime":1812.99,"body":"mentioned gender at that point"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1812.99,"endTime":1816.05,"body":"is, oh, no, we can't do that."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1812.99,"endTime":1816.05,"body":"That's discrimination. And so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1816.05,"endTime":1819.68,"body":"there was some, this is where"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1816.05,"endTime":1819.68,"body":"the coaching me I had to sit, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1819.68,"endTime":1822.68,"body":"couldn't say anything until"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1819.68,"endTime":1822.68,"body":"after the whole process. And I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1822.68,"endTime":1825.53,"body":"saying, by the way, you what you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1822.68,"endTime":1825.53,"body":"were talking about was positive"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1825.53,"endTime":1827.81,"body":"action, not positive"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1825.53,"endTime":1827.81,"body":"discrimination. That was tricky."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1827.81,"endTime":1830.24,"body":"And I think there's some there's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1827.81,"endTime":1830.24,"body":"clearly a weakness somewhere in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1830.24,"endTime":1835.85,"body":"our initial teacher training,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1830.24,"endTime":1835.85,"body":"or, or just in terms of schools,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1837.11,"endTime":1840.74,"body":"pushing this forward. So that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1837.11,"endTime":1840.74,"body":"was one area that definitely"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1840.74,"endTime":1845.06,"body":"work has to be done, certainly"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1840.74,"endTime":1845.06,"body":"with the participants I was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1845.06,"endTime":1847.76,"body":"working with. And then there was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1845.06,"endTime":1847.76,"body":"some, and then this is where the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1847.76,"endTime":1852.02,"body":"stereotypes started coming out."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1847.76,"endTime":1852.02,"body":"So conscientious girls, hard"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1852.02,"endTime":1858.89,"body":"working girls, meet girls,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1852.02,"endTime":1858.89,"body":"girls, put in 40 Page projects,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1859.19,"endTime":1865.22,"body":"whenever you need to do 20. That"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1859.19,"endTime":1865.22,"body":"was an area that was consistent"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1865.22,"endTime":1869.48,"body":"throughout. And alongside that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1865.22,"endTime":1869.48,"body":"was then that lack of practical"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1869.48,"endTime":1873.5,"body":"confidence. And this is at this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1869.48,"endTime":1873.5,"body":"point, this is where the royal"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1873.5,"endTime":1875.99,"body":"association of engineering"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1873.5,"endTime":1875.99,"body":"report that's just been coming"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1875.99,"endTime":1878.33,"body":"out or about to come out,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1875.99,"endTime":1878.33,"body":"they've been talking about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1878.33,"endTime":1881.75,"body":"tinkering quite a lot. So there"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1878.33,"endTime":1881.75,"body":"are the risk potential here. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1881.75,"endTime":1886.04,"body":"I think this alignment now of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1881.75,"endTime":1886.04,"body":"some exciting work that could be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1886.04,"endTime":1890.9,"body":"done to make sure that a primary"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1886.04,"endTime":1890.9,"body":"school level, working through to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1890.9,"endTime":1897.38,"body":"key stage three, we can actually"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1890.9,"endTime":1897.38,"body":"help develop greater exposure to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1897.89,"endTime":1903.56,"body":"teaching opportunities really,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1897.89,"endTime":1903.56,"body":"for all people. And possibly"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1903.56,"endTime":1906.65,"body":"even to compensate for those"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1903.56,"endTime":1906.65,"body":"that haven't had those"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1906.65,"endTime":1913.73,"body":"experiences with those in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1906.65,"endTime":1913.73,"body":"inequitable. Those inequalities,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1913.73,"endTime":1916.58,"body":"you know, in other words, we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1913.73,"endTime":1916.58,"body":"provide some extra support for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1916.58,"endTime":1920.06,"body":"those that haven't been it been"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1916.58,"endTime":1920.06,"body":"able to tinker. Those are just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1920.06,"endTime":1921.14,"body":"two of the five things."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1921.71,"endTime":1925.19,"body":"That's really interesting about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1921.71,"endTime":1925.19,"body":"tinkering, because Jamie tinny,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1925.19,"endTime":1928.4,"body":"who I work with, and Sarah"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1925.19,"endTime":1928.4,"body":"Davis, they did some work quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1928.4,"endTime":1931.67,"body":"a few years ago now around"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1928.4,"endTime":1931.67,"body":"tinkering. And it was really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1931.67,"endTime":1935.3,"body":"exciting. It was quite a big"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1931.67,"endTime":1935.3,"body":"movement in the States. And it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1935.33,"endTime":1939.14,"body":"hackerspaces, maker spaces,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1935.33,"endTime":1939.14,"body":"those sorts of things. We're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1939.14,"endTime":1943.61,"body":"kind of talking around the edge"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1939.14,"endTime":1943.61,"body":"of that. And Sarah designed a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1943.61,"endTime":1947.99,"body":"whole project projects. She's in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1943.61,"endTime":1947.99,"body":"quite a lot of work around e"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1947.99,"endTime":1951.08,"body":"textiles. And you know, we had a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1947.99,"endTime":1951.08,"body":"conversation before we started"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1951.08,"endTime":1956.21,"body":"to record around the you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1951.08,"endTime":1956.21,"body":"Desi textiles work, is it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1956.84,"endTime":1960.26,"body":"positive discrimination? Can we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1956.84,"endTime":1960.26,"body":"stereotype and say boys only"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1960.26,"endTime":1963.32,"body":"works in textiles or because of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1960.26,"endTime":1963.32,"body":"it or girls who want to atronics"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1964.25,"endTime":1967.34,"body":"But Sarah broke it down around"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1964.25,"endTime":1967.34,"body":"the fact that about tinkering"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1967.34,"endTime":1971.66,"body":"about making it okay to play"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1967.34,"endTime":1971.66,"body":"around, to try and get the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1971.66,"endTime":1977.45,"body":"circuits to work using flexible"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1971.66,"endTime":1977.45,"body":"materials. And, and Jamie did a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1977.45,"endTime":1980.3,"body":"whole load of stuff up, I'll get"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1977.45,"endTime":1980.3,"body":"Jensen with the details of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1980.3,"endTime":1982.94,"body":"books he was using. And Sarah as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1980.3,"endTime":1982.94,"body":"well, I'll put those in the show"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1982.94,"endTime":1986.3,"body":"notes. Because some people might"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1982.94,"endTime":1986.3,"body":"not be familiar with that idea"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1986.3,"endTime":1987.92,"body":"about about tinkering."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1988.519,"endTime":1991.369,"body":"This is not a material"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1988.519,"endTime":1991.369,"body":"specialist. And that's the whole"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1991.369,"endTime":1992.119,"body":"point is no"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1992.15,"endTime":1996.86,"body":"exactly playing. Yeah. Yeah. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1992.15,"endTime":1996.86,"body":"it's, and it really speaks to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1996.86,"endTime":2001.84,"body":"the heart of creativity and and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":1996.86,"endTime":2001.84,"body":"failure almost, doesn't it?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2003.19,"endTime":2005.56,"body":"Yeah. And so there you go. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2003.19,"endTime":2005.56,"body":"that's the first two right."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2008.95,"endTime":2011.83,"body":"I think I've already talked"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2008.95,"endTime":2011.83,"body":"about the sort of the very"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2011.83,"endTime":2015.28,"body":"unusual approaches to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2011.83,"endTime":2015.28,"body":"stereotypes, even with the small"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2015.28,"endTime":2018.85,"body":"group that I had, and sort of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2015.28,"endTime":2018.85,"body":"sort of this passive"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2018.85,"endTime":2021.7,"body":"reinforcement of gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2018.85,"endTime":2021.7,"body":"stereotypes. In other words,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2021.7,"endTime":2025.72,"body":"it's, you could see throughout"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2021.7,"endTime":2025.72,"body":"the interview, teachers becoming"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2025.72,"endTime":2029.23,"body":"aware that actually they may"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2025.72,"endTime":2029.23,"body":"well be gender stereotypes in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2029.23,"endTime":2031.48,"body":"their classroom and yes, they"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2029.23,"endTime":2031.48,"body":"might have been letting it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2031.48,"endTime":2035.02,"body":"happen or be part of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2031.48,"endTime":2035.02,"body":"process. You awareness was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2035.02,"endTime":2037.51,"body":"actually in the in the one hour"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2035.02,"endTime":2037.51,"body":"interview was actually"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2037.51,"endTime":2041.35,"body":"developing. Then there was the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2037.51,"endTime":2041.35,"body":"quota that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2041.35,"endTime":2045.28,"body":"let's say, Can you give an"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2041.35,"endTime":2045.28,"body":"example of, of what that that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2045.28,"endTime":2047.89,"body":"reinforcement of gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2045.28,"endTime":2047.89,"body":"stereotyping they were sort of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2047.89,"endTime":2050.35,"body":"seeing themselves do or"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2047.89,"endTime":2050.35,"body":"recognise? It was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2050.439,"endTime":2052.959,"body":"little things like, what we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2050.439,"endTime":2052.959,"body":"talked about material"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2052.959,"endTime":2061.599,"body":"specialisms, you know, girls,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2052.959,"endTime":2061.599,"body":"description of girls being a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2061.599,"endTime":2068.469,"body":"being better at understanding"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2061.599,"endTime":2068.469,"body":"the artistic aspects of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2069.099,"endTime":2074.379,"body":"brutalist architecture. You"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2069.099,"endTime":2074.379,"body":"know, one of the participants"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2074.379,"endTime":2077.709,"body":"identified with the project and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2074.379,"endTime":2077.709,"body":"basically said, you can see how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2077.709,"endTime":2080.649,"body":"the girls really understood this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2077.709,"endTime":2080.649,"body":"better because they can draw"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2080.649,"endTime":2084.399,"body":"better they can understand this,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2080.649,"endTime":2084.399,"body":"the artistic aspect much better"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2084.399,"endTime":2089.259,"body":"than the boys can. And then went"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2084.399,"endTime":2089.259,"body":"on when asking them to talk a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2089.259,"endTime":2091.359,"body":"little bit more about it. You"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2089.259,"endTime":2091.359,"body":"could just see them thinking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2091.359,"endTime":2095.649,"body":"actually, have I just classified"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2091.359,"endTime":2095.649,"body":"those grills as being more"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2095.919,"endTime":2100.149,"body":"artistic? Or were they really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2095.919,"endTime":2100.149,"body":"more artistic and you could See"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2100.149,"endTime":2103.629,"body":"that question starting to appear"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2100.149,"endTime":2103.629,"body":"in their faces, as far as, as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2103.629,"endTime":2106.299,"body":"we're talking, and that sort of,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2103.629,"endTime":2106.299,"body":"there are a few moments in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2106.299,"endTime":2110.829,"body":"interviews, genuinely where you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2106.299,"endTime":2110.829,"body":"could divert pauses where the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2110.829,"endTime":2113.079,"body":"interviewer is, you could see"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2110.829,"endTime":2113.079,"body":"this was making them"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2113.079,"endTime":2115.689,"body":"uncomfortable, because actually,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2113.079,"endTime":2115.689,"body":"they had found something else"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2115.689,"endTime":2119.499,"body":"about themselves in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2115.689,"endTime":2119.499,"body":"interview. That picking they"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2119.499,"endTime":2121.269,"body":"weren't expected to be talking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2119.499,"endTime":2121.269,"body":"about."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2122.32,"endTime":2127.45,"body":"But then they would go, what if"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2122.32,"endTime":2127.45,"body":"we all do it that way that sort"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2127.45,"endTime":2131.44,"body":"of treating a group as a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2127.45,"endTime":2131.44,"body":"homogenous group, we are all"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2131.44,"endTime":2132.79,"body":"like that they're not you."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2133.689,"endTime":2136.629,"body":"This is what this is how we have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2133.689,"endTime":2136.629,"body":"to as teachers, if you're, if"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2136.629,"endTime":2140.559,"body":"you're faced with 20 to 30"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2136.629,"endTime":2140.559,"body":"students in a class, you have to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2140.559,"endTime":2144.159,"body":"be making snap decisions,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2140.559,"endTime":2144.159,"body":"absolutely time. And so you have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2144.159,"endTime":2146.649,"body":"to be making judgments about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2144.159,"endTime":2146.649,"body":"particular groups of people. In"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2146.709,"endTime":2151.449,"body":"short, it's inherent in our job."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2146.709,"endTime":2151.449,"body":"The problem is that then that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2151.449,"endTime":2155.079,"body":"then determines everything we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2151.449,"endTime":2155.079,"body":"think about those particular"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2155.079,"endTime":2157.299,"body":"groups of wood, there has to be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2155.079,"endTime":2157.299,"body":"an opportunity for us to be able"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2157.299,"endTime":2159.759,"body":"to step back from those snap"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2157.299,"endTime":2159.759,"body":"decisions that we make in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2159.759,"endTime":2164.019,"body":"classroom. And the interview was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2159.759,"endTime":2164.019,"body":"that so perhaps we as as a as a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2164.019,"endTime":2167.019,"body":"body need more opportunities to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2164.019,"endTime":2167.019,"body":"be more reflective, and have"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2167.739,"endTime":2171.219,"body":"more coaching type conversations"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2167.739,"endTime":2171.219,"body":"with other design technology"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2171.219,"endTime":2172.749,"body":"teachers talk about this next?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2173.47,"endTime":2175.96,"body":"Was that another one of your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2173.47,"endTime":2175.96,"body":"points that came out is about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2175.99,"endTime":2178.72,"body":"teachers having time to reflect"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2175.99,"endTime":2178.72,"body":"and have those critically"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2178.72,"endTime":2182.14,"body":"reflect critically reflective"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2178.72,"endTime":2182.14,"body":"conversations with colleagues?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2182.41,"endTime":2184.6,"body":"Yeah, I think I think I've"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2182.41,"endTime":2184.6,"body":"talked about them as coaching"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2184.6,"endTime":2190.09,"body":"conversations, peer to peer sort"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2184.6,"endTime":2190.09,"body":"of work, because we're all"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2190.09,"endTime":2193.15,"body":"capable, we're all we all can do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2190.09,"endTime":2193.15,"body":"this, we just need time to do it"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2193.15,"endTime":2195.88,"body":"really. Or it needs to be part"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2193.15,"endTime":2195.88,"body":"and parcel of our professional"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2195.88,"endTime":2196.39,"body":"development."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2198.61,"endTime":2200.41,"body":"Okay, so what's next? Well, that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2200.41,"endTime":2202.24,"body":"was only, I mean, I've only just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2200.41,"endTime":2202.24,"body":"talked about the passive"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2202.24,"endTime":2204.07,"body":"reinforcement, because of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2202.24,"endTime":2204.07,"body":"course, you've got the active"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2204.07,"endTime":2206.86,"body":"reinforcement group, but they"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2204.07,"endTime":2206.86,"body":"were the scary ones. They're the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2206.86,"endTime":2210.37,"body":"ones where, you know, this is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2206.86,"endTime":2210.37,"body":"what I believe this is how boys"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2210.37,"endTime":2212.35,"body":"and girls are different. This is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2210.37,"endTime":2212.35,"body":"why they're different. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2212.35,"endTime":2215.38,"body":"therefore, that's why I'm going"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2212.35,"endTime":2215.38,"body":"to treat them differently. Now,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2215.41,"endTime":2219.64,"body":"coaching conversation with that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2215.41,"endTime":2219.64,"body":"particular type of teacher is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2219.64,"endTime":2223.72,"body":"going to be very different from"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2219.64,"endTime":2223.72,"body":"those that suddenly be made"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2223.72,"endTime":2227.05,"body":"aware of something. But there's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2223.72,"endTime":2227.05,"body":"clearly a need for that. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2227.05,"endTime":2230.62,"body":"coaching conversations work with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2227.05,"endTime":2230.62,"body":"both. And then the third group"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2230.62,"endTime":2235.48,"body":"of people with one set, so you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2230.62,"endTime":2235.48,"body":"would sort of expect really, at"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2235.48,"endTime":2237.91,"body":"the sort of active engagement,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2235.48,"endTime":2237.91,"body":"the ones that were willing to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2237.91,"endTime":2242.2,"body":"tackle gender stereotypes, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2237.91,"endTime":2242.2,"body":"bring it forth into the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2242.2,"endTime":2245.26,"body":"classroom into the lesson, you"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2242.2,"endTime":2245.26,"body":"know, now you can't talk about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2246.07,"endTime":2248.68,"body":"shopping trolleys and women"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2246.07,"endTime":2248.68,"body":"pushing shopping trolleys. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2248.68,"endTime":2252.76,"body":"you can't talk about, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2248.68,"endTime":2252.76,"body":"parents and mothers in that way,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2252.76,"endTime":2255.82,"body":"you've got to, they were"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2252.76,"endTime":2255.82,"body":"grappling with these there. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2255.82,"endTime":2258.4,"body":"then and they were describing"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2255.82,"endTime":2258.4,"body":"parts of their lessons, where"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2258.4,"endTime":2260.14,"body":"they were getting, and you could"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2258.4,"endTime":2260.14,"body":"see it there, they were getting"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2260.14,"endTime":2263.08,"body":"animated, in the left of the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2260.14,"endTime":2263.08,"body":"interview in the same way that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2263.08,"endTime":2266.2,"body":"they would in the classroom. As"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2263.08,"endTime":2266.2,"body":"in, I'm not letting this guy,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2267.04,"endTime":2269.02,"body":"you were not walking out this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2267.04,"endTime":2269.02,"body":"classroom. And so we've had an"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2269.02,"endTime":2270.16,"body":"opportunity to discuss this."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2271.75,"endTime":2273.94,"body":"So yeah, it's really nice. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2271.75,"endTime":2273.94,"body":"yeah, that's really awesome that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2273.94,"endTime":2277.27,"body":"you categorise people into these"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2273.94,"endTime":2277.27,"body":"three groups passive, active,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2277.66,"endTime":2279.07,"body":"and action, is that kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2279.97,"endTime":2283.45,"body":"active in your activity, as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2279.97,"endTime":2283.45,"body":"opposed to active reinforcement"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2283.45,"endTime":2284.26,"body":"of stereotypes?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2285.4,"endTime":2288.97,"body":"Hmm, so yeah, so you've got,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2285.4,"endTime":2288.97,"body":"you've got these three different"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2288.97,"endTime":2292.06,"body":"groups now. And I really like"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2288.97,"endTime":2292.06,"body":"the way you've started to sort"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2292.06,"endTime":2297.19,"body":"of think beyond what you've done"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2292.06,"endTime":2297.19,"body":"in terms of the study and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2297.19,"endTime":2299.77,"body":"started to kind of bring this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2297.19,"endTime":2299.77,"body":"into some coaching and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2299.77,"endTime":2302.98,"body":"mentoring. And is that kind of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2299.77,"endTime":2302.98,"body":"where you're seeing yourself at"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2302.98,"endTime":2305.29,"body":"the moment around what you're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2302.98,"endTime":2305.29,"body":"doing in your workplace and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2305.29,"endTime":2307.54,"body":"with, with peers and colleagues"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2305.29,"endTime":2307.54,"body":"around?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2308.11,"endTime":2311.77,"body":"Exactly. So we're to be my own"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2308.11,"endTime":2311.77,"body":"department. We've been doing"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2311.77,"endTime":2314.98,"body":"this for some time now. But now"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2311.77,"endTime":2314.98,"body":"that I've got an opportunity,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2314.98,"endTime":2318.04,"body":"I'm currently working with the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2314.98,"endTime":2318.04,"body":"era career framework in in a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2318.04,"endTime":2320.86,"body":"variety of different guises. But"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2318.04,"endTime":2320.86,"body":"you can see that coaching and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2320.86,"endTime":2324.94,"body":"mentoring as part of that is a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2320.86,"endTime":2324.94,"body":"really important part of that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2324.94,"endTime":2330.46,"body":"development of new teachers. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2324.94,"endTime":2330.46,"body":"that in the school, we're also"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2330.76,"endTime":2334.78,"body":"trying to find opportunities for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2330.76,"endTime":2334.78,"body":"peer to peer coaching, to allow"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2334.78,"endTime":2338.68,"body":"us to tackle some of these"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2334.78,"endTime":2338.68,"body":"problems. We're not starting"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2338.68,"endTime":2341.56,"body":"with eats, we're not starting"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2338.68,"endTime":2341.56,"body":"with gender bias. I didn't think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2342.19,"endTime":2345.4,"body":"I think this if I if I mentioned"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2342.19,"endTime":2345.4,"body":"it in the staff riff one more"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2345.4,"endTime":2348.73,"body":"time. Just they'll just roll"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2345.4,"endTime":2348.73,"body":"their eyes and walk away from me"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2348.73,"endTime":2353.23,"body":"so I'm not I'm not using that as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2348.73,"endTime":2353.23,"body":"the topic yet. But it's the the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2353.23,"endTime":2356.26,"body":"coaching will provide us with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2353.23,"endTime":2356.26,"body":"the tools to be able to tackle"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2356.26,"endTime":2356.74,"body":"it later."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2357.22,"endTime":2360.58,"body":"Yeah. Oh, crikey. Really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2357.22,"endTime":2360.58,"body":"interesting. So so taking on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2360.58,"endTime":2363.07,"body":"coaching and mentoring then I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2360.58,"endTime":2363.07,"body":"suppose if you have you looked"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2363.07,"endTime":2368.32,"body":"at Rachel last houses stuff"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2363.07,"endTime":2368.32,"body":"about lead, Matt. Yeah, so she"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2368.32,"endTime":2374.44,"body":"has a group that a centre,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2368.32,"endTime":2374.44,"body":"they're called. I want to call"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2374.44,"endTime":2377.5,"body":"it collective. I think that's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2374.44,"endTime":2377.5,"body":"right. But she does a lot of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2377.5,"endTime":2379.69,"body":"work around coaching and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2377.5,"endTime":2379.69,"body":"mentoring. She's a professor,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2380.08,"endTime":2383.65,"body":"and they have a coaching and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2380.08,"endTime":2383.65,"body":"mentoring journal. I'm aware of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2383.65,"endTime":2385.78,"body":"it because I was leading a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2383.65,"endTime":2385.78,"body":"coaching and mentoring module on"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2385.78,"endTime":2389.83,"body":"the Masters last couple of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2385.78,"endTime":2389.83,"body":"years. And we used it and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2389.83,"endTime":2393.46,"body":"there's loads of potential"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2389.83,"endTime":2393.46,"body":"within those models aren't there"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2393.46,"endTime":2397.09,"body":"for having those critical"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2393.46,"endTime":2397.09,"body":"conversations and they're not"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2397.09,"endTime":2401.65,"body":"critical as in your role, but"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2397.09,"endTime":2401.65,"body":"they're They're critical all"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2401.65,"endTime":2405.28,"body":"critiquing all way and having a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2401.65,"endTime":2405.28,"body":"mirror. And such. It's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2405.28,"endTime":2408.25,"body":"fascinating, isn't it? Just the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2405.28,"endTime":2408.25,"body":"process of the research"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2408.25,"endTime":2411.49,"body":"interview? Participants think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2408.25,"endTime":2411.49,"body":"differently."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2411.789,"endTime":2415.149,"body":"Yeah, exactly. So if it can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2411.789,"endTime":2415.149,"body":"happen in that when I'm when, as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2415.149,"endTime":2418.239,"body":"an interviewer, I'm not even"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2415.149,"endTime":2418.239,"body":"offering anything I'm literally"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2418.239,"endTime":2422.199,"body":"just did just recording, asking"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2418.239,"endTime":2422.199,"body":"a couple of questions and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2422.199,"endTime":2426.039,"body":"recording. And you know, perhaps"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2422.199,"endTime":2426.039,"body":"a nod of a head or a smile here"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2426.999,"endTime":2429.459,"body":"that there's no coaching going"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2426.999,"endTime":2429.459,"body":"on, on the hardly saying"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2429.459,"endTime":2432.069,"body":"anything. And yet, just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2429.459,"endTime":2432.069,"body":"providing teachers with the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2432.069,"endTime":2436.749,"body":"space to talk, it's often enough"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2432.069,"endTime":2436.749,"body":"for them to work. We're all"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2436.749,"endTime":2439.059,"body":"professionals. This is this is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2436.749,"endTime":2439.059,"body":"part of what we're what we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2439.059,"endTime":2441.909,"body":"about this is, you know, this is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2439.059,"endTime":2441.909,"body":"part of professional"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2441.909,"endTime":2442.389,"body":"development."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2443.95,"endTime":2447.13,"body":"It's obviously been been a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2443.95,"endTime":2447.13,"body":"significant part of your"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2447.13,"endTime":2450.07,"body":"professional development. So how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2447.13,"endTime":2450.07,"body":"has it made you think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2450.07,"endTime":2454.3,"body":"differently about, about this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2450.07,"endTime":2454.3,"body":"topic about gender stereotyping,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2454.3,"endTime":2456.82,"body":"and design and technology?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2454.3,"endTime":2456.82,"body":"What's the key takeaways for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2456.82,"endTime":2458.44,"body":"your way you think about it,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2459.28,"endTime":2465.55,"body":"from a personal, my own"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2459.28,"endTime":2465.55,"body":"teaching, finding space in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2465.55,"endTime":2472.06,"body":"classroom, to step back,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2465.55,"endTime":2472.06,"body":"videoing myself, watching on a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2472.06,"endTime":2478.18,"body":"regular basis, to make sure that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2472.06,"endTime":2478.18,"body":"those slips, the way that I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2478.18,"endTime":2481.3,"body":"talk, little things I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2478.18,"endTime":2481.3,"body":"mentioning, aren't coming"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2481.3,"endTime":2485.65,"body":"through in the wrong way. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2481.3,"endTime":2485.65,"body":"those are the two things I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2485.65,"endTime":2488.77,"body":"trying to separate, finding"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2485.65,"endTime":2488.77,"body":"space in the classroom to think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2488.77,"endTime":2491.98,"body":"about the way that students are"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2488.77,"endTime":2491.98,"body":"responding boys and girls"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2492.01,"endTime":2496.27,"body":"differently potentially, in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2492.01,"endTime":2496.27,"body":"classroom. But we're also"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2496.27,"endTime":2499.6,"body":"trying, yeah, you're probably"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2496.27,"endTime":2499.6,"body":"going to shake your head at this"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2499.6,"endTime":2502.3,"body":"one. But we're also"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2499.6,"endTime":2502.3,"body":"experimenting with, because it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2502.3,"endTime":2508.99,"body":"been an interesting topic, we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2502.3,"endTime":2508.99,"body":"looking at single sex groups."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2509.05,"endTime":2515.14,"body":"Now. At year nine, with, within"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2509.05,"endTime":2515.14,"body":"design technology, computer"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2515.14,"endTime":2519.91,"body":"science and art, actually, what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2515.14,"endTime":2519.91,"body":"we're finding, it gives us the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2519.91,"endTime":2526.72,"body":"space to be able to raise gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2519.91,"endTime":2526.72,"body":"inequalities in a safe space"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2526.72,"endTime":2529.63,"body":"with the students, so we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2526.72,"endTime":2529.63,"body":"being absolutely explicit about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2529.63,"endTime":2533.89,"body":"it. And with the parents, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2529.63,"endTime":2533.89,"body":"with so everyone, the teachers,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2533.92,"endTime":2537.19,"body":"the parents, and, and the girls"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2533.92,"endTime":2537.19,"body":"and the boys in the class, we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2537.19,"endTime":2540.13,"body":"are talking about gender"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2537.19,"endTime":2540.13,"body":"inequality, we're not hiding,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2540.16,"endTime":2542.56,"body":"we're not. We're not just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2540.16,"endTime":2542.56,"body":"sitting there as teachers"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2542.56,"endTime":2544.84,"body":"reflecting on our own, we're"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2542.56,"endTime":2544.84,"body":"doing something about you."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2545.8,"endTime":2548.44,"body":"That's fascinating, then that's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2545.8,"endTime":2548.44,"body":"really exciting, actually,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2548.44,"endTime":2551.98,"body":"because going back to my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2548.44,"endTime":2551.98,"body":"somewhat flippant comment"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2551.98,"endTime":2556.33,"body":"potentially around around single"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2551.98,"endTime":2556.33,"body":"sex, I did a similar thing i i"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2556.33,"endTime":2559.63,"body":"am, when I was teaching down in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2556.33,"endTime":2559.63,"body":"Gloucestershire, that was a long"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2559.63,"endTime":2562.81,"body":"time ago, we did I did the same"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2559.63,"endTime":2562.81,"body":"thing with my year nine. So we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2563.56,"endTime":2568.09,"body":"did boys and girls as two"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2563.56,"endTime":2568.09,"body":"separate groups. Because I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2568.09,"endTime":2571.66,"body":"wanted to explore more about"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2568.09,"endTime":2571.66,"body":"them. Whereas actually, what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2571.66,"endTime":2575.62,"body":"you're talking about this is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2571.66,"endTime":2575.62,"body":"about us as teachers and how we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2575.8,"endTime":2579.52,"body":"communicate and talk and, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2575.8,"endTime":2579.52,"body":"shape that that space, but I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2579.52,"endTime":2584.62,"body":"just love that about being open."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2579.52,"endTime":2584.62,"body":"With the students with parents"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2584.62,"endTime":2587.11,"body":"with each other about this is,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2584.62,"endTime":2587.11,"body":"this is what we're doing is it's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2587.11,"endTime":2590.65,"body":"giving us a safe space to do"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2587.11,"endTime":2590.65,"body":"this."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2591.4,"endTime":2596.86,"body":"And you Castle University, ran a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2591.4,"endTime":2596.86,"body":"really neat, I think they called"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2596.86,"endTime":2603.01,"body":"it ninja course m i n t. And"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2596.86,"endTime":2603.01,"body":"that was it follows on from the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2603.01,"endTime":2606.79,"body":"IOP work, the Institute of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2603.01,"endTime":2606.79,"body":"Physics work on involving the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2606.79,"endTime":2612.37,"body":"parents in the process, and very"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2606.79,"endTime":2612.37,"body":"powerful way of actually trying"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2612.37,"endTime":2615.64,"body":"to make a difference. So"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2612.37,"endTime":2615.64,"body":"although my research was was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2615.64,"endTime":2621.37,"body":"very not hands on, it has led me"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2615.64,"endTime":2621.37,"body":"to making more of a change with"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2621.37,"endTime":2623.47,"body":"my own practice and actually"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2621.37,"endTime":2623.47,"body":"trying to do something about it."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2624.13,"endTime":2627.58,"body":"Yeah, and Eccles, his work"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2624.13,"endTime":2627.58,"body":"around expectancy value that was"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2627.58,"endTime":2632.65,"body":"heavily around parents as well"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2627.58,"endTime":2632.65,"body":"in seeing them as as key. Well,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2632.68,"endTime":2635.83,"body":"it's been really interesting."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2632.68,"endTime":2635.83,"body":"It's been really interesting."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2635.89,"endTime":2638.32,"body":"And I'm hoping to come back and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2635.89,"endTime":2638.32,"body":"talk about your coaching and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2638.32,"endTime":2640.51,"body":"mentoring that you're doing in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2638.32,"endTime":2640.51,"body":"your school when it starts kind"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2640.51,"endTime":2643.3,"body":"of move into that space around"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2640.51,"endTime":2643.3,"body":"gender, because I think, I think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2643.3,"endTime":2646.18,"body":"DMT teachers listening would be"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2643.3,"endTime":2646.18,"body":"really interested to see how"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2646.18,"endTime":2649.3,"body":"that that model is working and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2646.18,"endTime":2649.3,"body":"and some of the things that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2649.3,"endTime":2652.45,"body":"you're thinking about around"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2649.3,"endTime":2652.45,"body":"that. So hopefully the next year"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2652.45,"endTime":2655.66,"body":"come back, because, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2652.45,"endTime":2655.66,"body":"just because you come on once"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2655.66,"endTime":2660.61,"body":"that's not enough to talk about."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2655.66,"endTime":2660.61,"body":"And so I'm going to ask, I'm"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2660.61,"endTime":2663.52,"body":"going to put a link in the show"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2660.61,"endTime":2663.52,"body":"notes to where your thesis is."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2663.97,"endTime":2667.06,"body":"And, you know, lots of people"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2663.97,"endTime":2667.06,"body":"never want to read the whole"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2667.06,"endTime":2669.97,"body":"thing. 40 50,000 words,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2670.45,"endTime":2672.97,"body":"it's about 55,000. Yeah, so"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2673.54,"endTime":2675.49,"body":"we really want to kind of nip"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2673.54,"endTime":2675.49,"body":"through to the conclusion, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2675.49,"endTime":2678.64,"body":"suppose this is the key key part"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2675.49,"endTime":2678.64,"body":"was you say,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2678.97,"endTime":2682.84,"body":"I've got the advantage to get"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2678.97,"endTime":2682.84,"body":"the findings recommendations"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2682.87,"endTime":2686.98,"body":"onto two sides of a4 so 869"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2687.88,"endTime":2691.45,"body":"Okay, right. So we'll put that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2687.88,"endTime":2691.45,"body":"in the in the show notes. And is"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2691.45,"endTime":2694.66,"body":"there anywhere else that people"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2691.45,"endTime":2694.66,"body":"can find you? Can we put a link"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2694.66,"endTime":2697.99,"body":"to your school and people might"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2694.66,"endTime":2697.99,"body":"want to find out more or reach"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2697.99,"endTime":2699.76,"body":"out to you. Is that possible?"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2697.99,"endTime":2699.76,"body":"Yeah, I'll"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2699.76,"endTime":2704.08,"body":"put I'll happily share the my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2699.76,"endTime":2704.08,"body":"email address afterwards as"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2704.08,"endTime":2710.2,"body":"well. And I think it'd be quite"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2704.08,"endTime":2710.2,"body":"up get a link for the IoT. I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2710.2,"endTime":2712.87,"body":"think everyone should have a go"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2710.2,"endTime":2712.87,"body":"at that. Yeah, implicit"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2712.87,"endTime":2715.51,"body":"association test is always"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2712.87,"endTime":2715.51,"body":"entertaining. And it just gets"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2715.51,"endTime":2717.1,"body":"you thinking really? Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2717.43,"endTime":2719.47,"body":"we just start, it'd be really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2717.43,"endTime":2719.47,"body":"interesting. If you had some"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2719.47,"endTime":2722.77,"body":"questions that you could give to"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2719.47,"endTime":2722.77,"body":"people to follow on from that"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2722.77,"endTime":2725.89,"body":"they could go well, why don't we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2722.77,"endTime":2725.89,"body":"in department do this? And then"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2725.89,"endTime":2728.32,"body":"here's some questions that we"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2725.89,"endTime":2728.32,"body":"could use to talk about it."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2729.13,"endTime":2734.35,"body":"Yeah, fascinating. And I'm gonna"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2729.13,"endTime":2734.35,"body":"say on here, I gather at some"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2734.35,"endTime":2738.61,"body":"point you are being arm twisted"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2734.35,"endTime":2738.61,"body":"into writing something for"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2738.61,"endTime":2740.53,"body":"publication so that people can"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2738.61,"endTime":2740.53,"body":"see."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2740.65,"endTime":2747.85,"body":"So you, you write a 55,000 word"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2740.65,"endTime":2747.85,"body":"thesis isn't really palatable"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2747.85,"endTime":2749.95,"body":"for most people. So yes, I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2747.85,"endTime":2749.95,"body":"probably will have to try and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2749.95,"endTime":2753.67,"body":"summarise at least some part of"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2749.95,"endTime":2753.67,"body":"it at some point somewhere, and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2753.67,"endTime":2756.79,"body":"they fight it. But I'm also"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2753.67,"endTime":2756.79,"body":"aware that after getting a paper"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2758.26,"endTime":2761.62,"body":"peer reviewed, is quite a scary"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2758.26,"endTime":2761.62,"body":"process. And that's something"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2761.62,"endTime":2762.49,"body":"I'm quite nervous about."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2763.51,"endTime":2768.79,"body":"Yeah, it is. So I, I would"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2763.51,"endTime":2768.79,"body":"suggest the pack conference is a"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2768.79,"endTime":2771.85,"body":"really nice way. I remember"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2768.79,"endTime":2771.85,"body":"people telling me early on in my"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2771.85,"endTime":2775.21,"body":"career at Nottingham Trent say,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2771.85,"endTime":2775.21,"body":"the past conferences, it's just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2775.21,"endTime":2780.22,"body":"friendly. You know, and there's"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2775.21,"endTime":2780.22,"body":"a whole group of us around who"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2780.22,"endTime":2783.46,"body":"could have a look at staff and"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2780.22,"endTime":2783.46,"body":"give feedback and, and chat."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2783.73,"endTime":2786.13,"body":"I've got to write my abstract"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2783.73,"endTime":2786.13,"body":"for the pack conference as well"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2786.13,"endTime":2790.06,"body":"and, and get my act together."},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2786.13,"endTime":2790.06,"body":"And yeah, the peer review"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2790.06,"endTime":2793.96,"body":"process is, is scary. I shared"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2790.06,"endTime":2793.96,"body":"earlier about my papers being"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2793.96,"endTime":2797.68,"body":"rejected. And now I can't even"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2793.96,"endTime":2797.68,"body":"bear to read feedback from"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2797.68,"endTime":2801.31,"body":"February of this year. Now I"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2797.68,"endTime":2801.31,"body":"have read it, I have my dad just"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2801.31,"endTime":2805.45,"body":"haven't dealt with it. But yeah,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2801.31,"endTime":2805.45,"body":"so no, I think it'd be really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2805.45,"endTime":2811.06,"body":"good to get to get something out"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2805.45,"endTime":2811.06,"body":"there. And to share because what"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2811.06,"endTime":2813.94,"body":"you've discovered, you know,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2811.06,"endTime":2813.94,"body":"just the three different"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2813.94,"endTime":2817.3,"body":"categories of people. And then"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2813.94,"endTime":2817.3,"body":"the recommendations, I think,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2817.63,"endTime":2820.69,"body":"that would just help people in"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2817.63,"endTime":2820.69,"body":"their schools in their practice,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2820.99,"endTime":2823.45,"body":"to to help them think"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2820.99,"endTime":2823.45,"body":"differently and do things"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2823.45,"endTime":2825.58,"body":"differently. So thanks so much,"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2823.45,"endTime":2825.58,"body":"friend, and thanks for your time"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2825.58,"endTime":2827.89,"body":"this afternoon. I've really"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2825.58,"endTime":2827.89,"body":"enjoyed listening and hearing"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2827.89,"endTime":2830.35,"body":"about your work in the"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2827.89,"endTime":2830.35,"body":"conversation. Thank you. I hope"},{"speaker":"Alison Hardy","startTime":2830.35,"endTime":2831.67,"body":"I didn't ramble too much."}]}