Episode 193 - Creative Reset

We're back! In this honest and energizing episode, Kira and Mary open up about the challenges of 2025—from business slowdowns and burnout to rediscovering creative joy. They unpack the emotional toll of a tough year, how it’s impacted their artistry, and why it’s okay not to feel okay. But don’t worry—this episode isn’t all doom and gloom! The duo shares how they're reigniting their spark through new outlets like AI tools (hello, ChatGPT!), personal projects, and fresh business strategies that bring the fun back to photography. Whether you're feeling stuck or just need some inspiration, this is your pep talk to keep going.

👉 Listen now for tips on surviving slumps, finding your "why," and using AI to supercharge your creativity and business!

This episode was written and performed by Mary Fisk-Taylor and Kira Derryberry, produced and edited by Kira Derryberry.

Transcript

GYST Episode 193

Kira: [00:00:00] Welcome to Get Your Shoot Together, the photographers podcast where we discuss studio business life and keeping it all in line. I am Kira DeBerry.

Mary: And I'm Mary Fisk Taylor.

Kira: Hello, long lost podcasting friend. 

Mary: Hello guys. Thank you all. 

Kira: What year is it? 

Mary: I mean, I know, boy, wow. A lot to unpack here. Yeah, it's been crazy, right? Like, I think, everybody, understands. I think that life's been a little wonky lately regardless of where you live or what you, you know, it's just been crazy.

And I guess in all transparencies, Kira and I love this podcast so much, but we just didn't think we had much to add. That would be super positive. Because if, I'm gonna be very, very frank with you guys, like it's been a, interesting year so far. 

I would say it's been an incredibly interesting year and I know we've been intermittent and we took off the summer and it's been, you know, between, the daily atrocities that we go to, but also just in business.

It's been affecting business and not just [00:01:00] with, I mean I can speak for myself, but like with the other photographers I talked to and other business owners in general, I was talking to my accountant. And she's like everyone, all of her clients and herself. Is feeling it, you know?

And I know we're not in a recession, quote unquote yet. But it sure feels like one, you know, 

labeling it. We're not labeling it. Nobody wants to say it out loud. Like, it's like we're in a situationship. Right. We're not gonna label it as a relationship, but I feel like we're kind of in a recession.

And I don't know that that's the right word to use, but we're definitely in a space where spending is a lot more, it's a lot more, planned. You know what I mean? Yeah. And I think in all fairness guys, we need to remember that we had this thing called COVID, regardless of where you live, we all had it.

And then, everything kind of blew up. And I think we were also shocked how well we did during COVID in the year and even two years after COVID that we got kind of really comfortable. And then, we kind of hit this reality again. And I've tried to really go [00:02:00] back and. Evaluate numbers from like 2000 17, 18, 19 and then COVID numbers.

And then, you know, this year, specifically a little bit of last year maybe, but, it's really not that different. I just think that we rode this high of COVID that none of us expected. I mean, I remember when COVID first started, we, we were talking and we were very concerned, like, oh my gosh, this is gonna kill our businesses.

This is gonna, and it did the complete opposite for many, many, many, many of us. It did Total, total opposite for us. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We were just like, holy moly. You know, people are spending money like crazy. The one thing I think we said a lot during that time and we need to remember is, you know, at least for what I do, and I know I, a lot of what you do, a lot of that discretionary spending, it usually goes for holidays and vacations and people weren't traveling right.

So they were definitely spending more locally. Mm-hmm. They just, because they were stuck, they couldn't travel and do the things that they may do on a yearly or buyin or, you know, every other year basis. And, um, we gotta keep it in perspective and I think. Nothing else. Perspective is a really big word, and it sounds super easy, [00:03:00] like oh, perspective, okay.

But it's not, I mean, it's hard to keep things in perspective when you've had two, three solid years of feeling really positive about your business and everything. And I think as creatives as well, and this is something that I think I've struggled with a lot, which will lead me into something I've been doing lately that I'm kind of excited about or very excited about, is.

It's just we take it so personally. Mm-hmm. And I'm not gonna speak outta turn here, but like you, I mean, hopefully everybody knows I have a business partner, Jamie Hayes, and I think most people think Jamie's a very positive and upbeat person. Now you know Jamie on a very personal level. So you've seen a lot more sides of Jamie than maybe Sure.

A lot of people, but it has been. And Jamie would never, I never would've thought of Jamie as struggling with depression or anxiety. This year has been one of the hardest, and I've known Jamie for now for 30 years. 

Yeah. 

So he takes it so personally when he creates the beautiful work and people say no [00:04:00] to it, he's not used to that.

And that's been a lot this year. Or saying no to more of it than normal. 

Kira: Mm-hmm. 

Mary: He takes that to heart. How I, how? 'cause you know me, I'm a little bit. Different. I don't, I don't, I don't base my, my, um, I don't base my worth on what my clients buy. You know, I do base my worth on my bottom line financially or, you know, that, you know, people coming in, i, I, my business perspective, right?

But if they don't buy, I assume, well, you know, they don't owe me to buy what I make and you know, I'm gonna move on. Janie doesn't like, it has been a huge struggle for him this year to the point where. Um, as a matter of fact, just two weeks ago we, or just a week or so ago, we sat down with our good friend Ronan.

And even Ronan brought it up and said, Hey, what's going on with you? And okay, you know, we had a, we had like a three hour conversation with Ronan and, um, he tried to talk to him and, and, and Jamie's fine with me talking about this 'cause him and I have talked about it a lot because I think there's probably a lot of people out there that are in the same place.

He couldn't really put his finger on why he was so angry. But I think somebody else, because me in his ear is like, you know, just like a duck squawking, like a just squawk, [00:05:00] squawk. 'cause it's me, you know? Mm-hmm. But having someone like you or someone like Ronan or someone like that on the outside saying, I'm seeing a difference in you.

I think it was an eyeopener for him and me because I don't know that I put all the pieces together. 

Kira: I saw a difference. I mean, I, you know, um, we just, we just visited of course. Yes. Because we went to, we went to Spain together. We did. And, um, that was so fun. Uh, yeah, I, I noticed a difference in him and, you know, but I kind of thought, you know, it's, it's just, you know, what day after wedding Yeah.

Hangover, kind of, not drinking hangover, but work, working hangover. Yeah. Um, you know, and, uh, certainly not short or anything like that. No. But I, I definitely noticed a, um, yeah, I, I think more easily 

Mary: triggered. Yeah. A little bit more negative than normal. Yeah. And I think what we've boiled it down to is he just put so much of his self worth on.

What people fall in love with and buy and, um. I I, I just wonder out there, and of course I can't ask you, but how else out there is maybe feeling the same way? 

Kira: Well, that's, I mean, that's so true of, I mean, we see it all the time, especially with, uh, people who get really upset over image competition. Right.

Um, my God, yes. You know, we've got, you know, you see the stuff that, that some people post on social media basically thinking that they're, that, you know, they, well, they must be garbage because they didn't merit an image. I'll, I'll let you guys in on a little secret. Uh, Kara [00:06:00] Berry has entered a few times this year.

Just a few times. Yeah. In the MIRI haven't merited guys. Yeah, I haven't merited. It's pretty, and it's a big, it's a pretty big letdown, especially with my, um, my. Accolades behind me in my years of, of yeah. Competition and doing well and being a judge and all that stuff. And, um, it's, it's, it'll get you, like, it'll get you, I've had a couple judges that we know 

Mary: have said the same exact thing.

Kira: Yeah. 

Mary: Not just, not merited, I mean, not some people that I like highly respect as photographers and artists that got no potential. Oh, ouch. Yeah. And, you know, so, and I, I. When I judge and I do the critiques and I see a no potential. One of the things I like to remind people, and I don't wanna go off on MIR here at all, but I do think it's worth mentioning 'cause I saw, I read like three or four this morning and I'm like, oh, these poor people, and.

I don't take it that seriously. I guess I just, yeah, I don't know why. I guess I'm just more of the other side, like worried about business more. But just because it says no potential doesn't mean your clients absolutely love it. Well, it doesn't mean anything like that. It 

Kira: doesn't mean that at all. It doesn't mean that, and let, I'm gonna, and I'll be real honest with myself here and admit that.[00:07:00] 

Am I super surprised? Like after it, it hurt, you know, it burned. A little bit. Mm-hmm. But I had put no effort into it because I just felt, you know, I just felt like, oh, I should be doing this. I should, you know, I probably should enter no effort on my part. Um, and the, the effort, the no effort shows, and you know why there's no effort, Mary is because there's a general.

Malaise. Absolutely a dis a dis excitement. I don't know think that's a word, but a, but a general like fall out of love with the creative process at the moment for me, when it comes to creating and, well, 

Mary: I think that's 

Kira: goes, that's, 

Mary: thank you, because that's exactly what I'm saying. I think when. Our businesses aren't, when we're not hitting our business goals or when we may be losing jobs to quote unquote other photographers that are maybe are cheaper or whatever, or whatever is going on in our business.

Mm-hmm. Right. I think that it just, as creatives, I think it burns that candle out so quickly that we aren't, I'm not putting my best work in MIR, I'm not even entering IPC this year because. I just don't believe in anything enough to enter it. Mm-hmm. And, and honestly, [00:08:00] after last year, after, I mean, look, I did my fellowship.

You did so well. I just, I need a break. Like I just need a break. And, um, I haven't even entered MIR this year. I just haven't even put it out there because, and I'm not, like, I'm not in the same head space as Jamie because I don't crave that as much as he does. Yeah. Or you do. Mm-hmm. Um, but I just haven't had the energy to even.

I hate to say care because that's not the right word, because I love all that stuff, you know? I do. I believe in it. I just. It's been hard. It's just been really, really hard. Um, you know, and I know a lot of people out there who either, you know, have a partner or a spouse that are maybe have lost their jobs or their children are going through job transitions or being, you know, you know, there's just a lot happening right now.

And then regardless of where you feel or what side of the quote unquote aisle use it, whatever, it's all heavy on both sides. Yeah. All sides. Um, you know, all this stuff happening in the news is just a lot. So. Guys, I guess all I'm trying to say is take all that into [00:09:00] consideration and say it's okay that I might not be at my best this year.

It's okay that I might, you know, be a little bit, you know, angry or whatever. It's okay. The only thing that's not okay is if we don't pull ourself out of it and go Okay. Right. I'm gonna move forward because this is temporary. The only thing I know for sure, and I just had a birthday a couple weeks ago, the only thing I know for sure is that this is temporary.

This is not gonna last forever. Mm-hmm. It just isn't, none of it. Not, not politically, not economically, not social. It's not gonna last forever. It, and, and history proves that. Right. We can always base it on that. Right. Um, and it's hard. It is so hard. So, you know. Um, and just to be very frank, again, that's one of the reasons that we kind of put a, we we have talked, you know, should we just end the podcast?

Should we cut? Should we take? So we took a break hoping we would come back, um, with, you know, feeling a little better. I'm gonna be very clear. I don't know that we, we feel pretty good 'cause we just went on a really cool, not vaca. We went, went to a friend's wedding and it was in Spain and we got to go to, we did a lot of fun things, so that was fun.

Mm-hmm. I got to [00:10:00] see, you know, my friends, but, um, I hoped we would come back with a lot better things happening, but. No, that's actually not, I just wanna go back, 

Kira: I just wanna go back to the place where we rode the camels. 

Mary: It was so nice just to escape. That's it. I think we are looking for ways to escape it.

Yeah. And um, and look, you know, not everybody's gonna make some big grand trip to, you know, Spain or Morocco, but you know, maybe it's just, you know, get an Airbnb in the ca in for a weekend in the woods and just go, you know, just go and get away from it. And I do think, do you feel like you came back a little bit more like.

Okay. I can do this now. I can, yeah, I can get in there. Yeah. I came 

Kira: back. I came back and, well, one, I, I, I've been, you know, as you're, you were talking here, we were talking about, you know, it's okay, we're gonna cut ourselves some slack, but I found that focusing on things that excite me more than photography right now Yes.

Is better. Yeah. It's helping me through this time. I think that it's okay to say, Hey, after 15 years professionally and 20 years as a photographer or whatever, you know, I. It's okay to not be super excited about it right now. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like, 'cause are we always expected to just like completely just love doing, especially if we do what we do for money.

Right? So right now, right now I'm in a real like, learning phase of my life. Like I, [00:11:00] I am absorbing a lot of. Of, you know, new skills. Mm-hmm. Um, and um, and taking time to do a lot of like personal, you know, projects. Yeah. And in different mediums. Like I have been painting a little bit, you know, and just nothing to do with, um, photography really at all, but everything to do with, with taking the other skills that I have from being a business owner Right.

And applying them to the new skills that I'm learning. So, you know, I've been, obviously Chad, GBT has been a big part of, you know, what I do for a while now. So I'm, I'm really excited. I'm working on a YouTube channel for some of these tutorials that I'm doing, and that's, that's got like my focus and attention right now.

But also I've been teaching a lot, I've been coaching a lot on chat GBT and teaching those classes, and those are, I look forward to them. I, mm-hmm. It's exciting to unlock, um, these things and other people Yeah. To get them excited about it. And so they go down rabbit holes and, and, um, so, so I mean that's something that I think is really, really.

Been good for me. Yeah. And, and I think it's okay. I'm certainly not getting outta the business or anything. I mean Right. I'm still, I still, you know, booked all week and, you know, whatever. But it's the, it's the volume with which they're purchasing that is lower, you know? Right. They're pur, they're not going, you know, [00:12:00] throw that one in, you know, they're like, no, I just need the one, or I just need that as far as headshot go, you know, and um, and I'm just still turning that stuff out.

You know? Yeah. But is it as far as like me getting excited and creative about doing a fun shoot. Not so much. Yeah. 

Mary: You know, you 

Kira: know. 

Mary: Yeah. So back to your cha. So, you know, if you guys don't know Kira's been offering, are they four week, five week? How, how long are they? They've been six week, but six week, yeah.

Classes. Mm-hmm. Once a week. Right. Once a week. Yeah, it's been pretty cool teaching chat, which you guys, if you're interested, check it out. Um, I mean, I know the amount of time and energy she's put in that, and, uh, definitely check that out. And, and you're building out your YouTube presence, so you're finding your creative outlet there.

But this also ties back in and maybe you guys need to think about it. And unless you're someone like Jamie Hayes who literally is only been a photographer his whole life. You know, Kira has a very strong development in it. Background. That's what she did before she became a photographer. So it's kind of neat that those two worlds have come together for you.

Mm-hmm. You know, not that, not that you don't, you haven't used it in your photography business, but really and [00:13:00] truly bringing you back to when you were actually building websites, you know, on a, you know, for people way back when. Yeah. And now bringing that back in, I could see where that's like, okay, now I have it.

I would call that a creative outlet. 'cause you are developing something specifically for right now, I'm assuming for creatives. It, it certainly could go bigger. Small 

Kira: business owners Yeah. In general. So, um, entrepreneurs, you know, yeah. It doesn't, not limited to photographers writing Right. But Right. But, um, but yeah, so I mean, and, and I think it's just, again, personally, as far as me finding like my spark, it's been, it's.

I, I got, I hit a place in photography as far like that I wasn't absorbing a lot anymore. And I think that's the thing that is huge for me. I just wasn't gaining the new skill or, I mean there's, it's not like I know everything, but it just the desire to, yes. To sponge, you know what I mean? And that was such a driver for me for so long.

That's so interesting. I never thought of that, Kira. I just like learning new things. Yeah, I just like immersing myself in. Like, it's like if, if if languages, I wish it was with languages that I had this desire. Yeah. Me, you know, but like, I would, I, I just like to, I get, it's a little of a hyper fixation to be honest, you know?

Yeah. I mean, I, I, everything in my life, it, my interests have always been [00:14:00] hyper fixations. Yeah. If I'm being real. But, um, you, you know, so I mean it's, it's AI and chat. GBT is, with that focus especially, it has been, um. Hyper fixation for me and kind of giving me that drive again. You know, so it's, I find it to be very exciting.

Mary: Yeah. Um, and guys, if you're not on that, I, I I, I have to assume that most people are using it in some capacity. Well, we've been using it in capacities for a long time. We just didn't call it, we didn't enable it. Mm-hmm. 

Kira: But, 

Mary: um, you know, if you are interested or you haven't done it, definitely, definitely find the resource, because I do think that that has made it fun.

And I also think that. Um, you know, the little bit that I use it, um, has. When I'm feeling down or I'm like, oh, I'm just, I just don't have it in me to write one more email or do this. Mm-hmm. Because I'm feeling like none of my marketing's working, or nothing's working or nothing's working. Um, I'll just go to chat and say, you know, this is where I'm feeling, you know, I built out my avatar with you, you know who my studio is.

And that's a big part of it. And, um, it gave me a great idea recently, and I've been working on it and I'm having a blast with it. So, you know, we talk about ai, we talk about chat in like, you know. Those, those perspectives of, you know how it helps you write things or do things or monitor, there's all these things Chad and do.

But for me, I just [00:15:00] kind of went to it like feeling very, very down, very, very depressed, feeling very upset about my business and I asked it this question and it literally came back and said, well, Mary, you. We know that you love John Singer, Sergeant. We know that's one of your favorites. You, you know, that's something you love, how it knows that about me.

I don't know. It knows a lot about you, but it knows about me. Mm-hmm. And he said, why don't you do an I Am Project and inspired by John Singer, Sergeant? And I was like, oh my gosh. Mm-hmm. Now the important part here, and I know Kira knows way more about this than me, but the important part here is that. It is it, my chat is very much built like my GPT is.

It knows me. It it? Oh yeah, mine too. Yeah. So, yeah, it wouldn't have known that if I hadn't taken the time to cure it, so to speak. But I started that project a couple weeks ago, or I guess it's been almost a month now, and it has been. So much fun. Like I've seen it, I've seen what you've been posting. So much fun.

It's gorgeous. 

Kira: Absolutely gorgeous. 

Mary: Yeah. Thank you. And it's different, I'm painting differently than I've ever painted before. Um, and it's all inspired by, you know, another amazing artist that again, I had so much respect for and, um. People are loving it. Mm-hmm. [00:16:00] It has been shocking to me how many people have called and seen one of my tiktoks or seen something and said, oh my gosh, I love John, senior Sergeant.

I want this. I, you know. Mm-hmm. I just posted one of a nurse, a nurse practitioner last night, and I already had three people call that are in the medical field, and they're like. Oh my God. I love John Singer, Sergeant. I'm a doctor, I'm an anesthesiologist, I'm a nurse practitioner. Whatever. We, I want that.

And I'm like, look, I have chill bumps. Like, aw. And so, but, but I used AI as a tool to get there. Now that's kind of where it ended, you know? Then I just took it over from there. Now, not to say that I might not help, help have it help me with. Write a post or an email or something. Yeah. But that's all I needed was that little nudge.

And I am having the best time with it, like mm-hmm. Um, my, one of my friends, he's, he's an interior designer. He said, can I do that? And I'm like, yeah, sure, let's do it. Yeah. And I go into chat and I say, okay, I have an interior designer coming in. I want it in the style of John Singer, Sergeant and Hazen Fisk.

You know who I am. Give me some inspiration images. It gives me inspiration. I pick the Inspire image I like the best, and then I go in and make it my own. Yep. So that has been phenomenal. Mm-hmm. Like phenomenal for me and it got my studio busy again. [00:17:00] 

Kira: Yeah. I mean, I love that. I love that. And I, and I love what you're saying about using it as inspiration.

I mean, yeah, you can have jumping off points. I mean, there are days where, like I said, I'm not feeling super inspired right now creatively. So I am, you know, I've, I've gotta do all these exciting magazine covers, right? Like, right. And so there's been multiple times where I'm like, okay, I have five women that are coming in.

I am going to. I wanna do a neutral background. I don't really know how to, um, I don't really, I, I don't really have an idea. I, I wanna have some arrangements, you know, with these five women's, can you give me some arrangement ideas? Not posing, but just like, you know, if Yeah. If you were to structure it. And so it gives me like this ballpark of options of like, I'm like, they're all gonna be wearing white and they're all gonna be on white and they're all gonna be whatever.

And it kind of gives me this sort of arrangement of people as an inspire and I'm like. Yeah. Okay. So I'm gonna take these and then I'm gonna move people around to see if it works or if I can take that part that I started from on the image. Mm-hmm. And then with the kind of people, the [00:18:00] size, the age and that sort of thing of the people I ha actually have, yeah.

How can I rearrange it to kind of make it work? And so it's, I I'm actually pretty excited about the next cover that I've, um, done. Um, so it's, uh, it's not out yet. Of Yeah. Um, of the magazine. But I mean, finding inspiration there is not really any different from finding inspiration on like Pinterest or something, you know what I mean?

Well, like you 

Mary: used to do, remember? Mm-hmm. I mean, we've done a podcast. She would tear air out magazine ads and how did that mm-hmm. Like how, and now you're using chat as like your business partner, your, you know, your coworker to help inspire you. And they don't, they're not gonna give you bad advice.

They're not sick. Like, it's just, it's just so crazy how it built out. Because I remember when this first started, all started kind of coming. It's been around again a long time, but when we first started talking about it, we were both a little bit like, eh, I don't know about this. Like, it's a little scary.

And now I don't know that anybody that's embraced it more than you in the industry right now, but, um, even I've found ways. I was like, I don't know, like what am and, and like, I don't know that I would've thought of that project on my own. Um, 

Kira: and well, it seems so obvious though, for you and, and you know why.

Yeah. Well I tell, I can tell you why it helped you think of that. It's because you've curated your chat, GBT, you've taught your chat, GBT, everything [00:19:00] about you. You've customized it, you've mm-hmm. You know, um, it knows your personality and your interest. It knows your brand voice and your story. And so, like to me, it's such an obvious attachment to the kind of work you guys do.

Yeah. Because it was already sort of inspired by that. You know what I mean? Right. Like, I mean, as far as its core values. Yeah. Um, and so it's leading you to an obvious place that you provided it. Absolutely. That's, that's what I mean, you know? And yeah, 

Mary: and I like the way you're saying that. So I think people are like, oh, it's just ai.

It's just No, it's not. Because, you know, not if you use it correctly. Yeah, exactly. Because I've told it, well, who I am, what I, you know how, no, it's got my samples of my, not just my voice and how I write, but also how I. And, you know, it knows that. Um, and there's also, like, I just took a class with Judy Ranford a couple weeks ago with Crea, and if you're not familiar with Crea, definitely check it out.

KRE a.ai. And people are like, oh, that just, you know, auto generates this. No, it doesn't. I have fed the way I paint, the way I photograph everything into it. 

Kira: Mm-hmm. 

Mary: So that it's not just giving me. [00:20:00] Spitting out something, the style of Monet, it spits it out. The style of Mary Fis Taylor. Right. And I think that's what we don't understand about AI right now, is that you can train it to reproduce you.

Not just random, whatever, but like you said, if you don't take the time to train it, it is gonna just spit out random. 

Kira: Yeah. You're just gonna get junk and you're, it's gonna look like junk and you're gonna go, well that doesn't sound like me and that doesn't look like anything I would do and I don't like that.

And then you walk away 'cause you're like, this is garbage. You know, this is cheating, this is whatever. Yeah. And it's, it's just, um, it can be cheating. You know, sure it can be cheating. Um, but if the, in my opinion, if you're, I, I try and tell my students that what we're trying to do is clone all of that internal knowledge that you have about your business.

Out of you. We're just trying to get, pull that information out of you so that you can put it into this so that you now have another person who has that information. Right? Yeah. And so now you, now you're ideating together, now you're bouncing things back and forth with a partner rather. Yeah. You know, that understands your business and, and can lead you.

In the right [00:21:00] way. And, you know, without scope creeping too far, you know? Right. Um, because you're putting in your goals, you're putting in your, your, you know, your story, branding, everything you're doing. Yeah. You know, you're doing it all the, the right way and that creates a structure for it to really give you more customized results.

Mary: You know? Is that what 

Kira: you 

Mary: do when you, when is that like a big part of your class? Is that what you're doing? You're teaching people how to, how to curate their. Their GPT how to curate the chat. 

Kira: Yeah. So what I teach is I teach people how to customize their, not just their global settings. Yeah. But there are customizations you can do within your own project folders.

So you can have a project folder for your business and a project folder for something you volunteer for. And when I have, like for me, I have a project folder for Lucy. Yeah. You know, and, and you can set custom instructions and project files specific to each one of these projects. And that will. Um, give you better results than if you're just like, Hey, I have to write a marketing piece for my company and, you know, here's a couple of my writing samples.

Help me write one. Yeah. And so it just doesn't, it, it's gonna give you something and it'll probably look [00:22:00] okay, depending on how much information you give it. But what I'm teaching people to do is to just, I'm pulling. I'm trying to pull that information out of 'em. I'm trying to use chat GPT to pull all that information out of them and then have them regurgitate it back out so they can give it back to it.

So that's, that's the process with me when in my classes is, is we, we start just in the basic, in the six week class anyway. Um, we start with just like, here's where everything is, you know, and here's, and then we move on to here's how we pull everything outta you. Yeah. You 

Mary: know? And yeah. 

Kira: Because from there, I think people 

Mary: have just gotten stuck on this.

Oh, you just go in and ask it a question? I mean, no, and then you can, you can do that. I don't recommend that. And actually chat people don't recommend that because chat's not Google and it does get things, it's not Google, it's not a research engine. It's, you know, it's i's gonna get things wrong. It's machine learning.

Right. So it's learning from us. So that's what you're trying to do. You're teaching it to be like you, that's the learning piece. That's the whole point of it. Yeah. Not, 

Kira: and not just like you, but know your content. You know, understand your business model. Mm-hmm. You know, [00:23:00] we're putting everything in there.

We're putting, you know, your, not, you know, just your pricing and your, but like your philosophy, your, you know, what your business stands on and you know, so that it knows that everything that it writes for you or everything that it creates for you matches that business model and speaks to the correct audience.

Right. So, you know, all of those things. So that. You can feel more confident using it to answer emails for you or write responses to a bunch of client emails 'cause it's got the same inf it should have the same information that you have if you've trained it right. If you've trained it right. Yeah. 

Mary: Um, and once you do that, do, don't you have to keep doing it?

Or does it 'cause it, 

Kira: yeah, if you've got, if you change, if you change any content, yes. You know, I think it changes. Or if you create content with it that you're like, you know, we should put this in your project files to use as a, as some, you know, something to refer back to. Basically you're just creating, you're giving it a, um, a library of knowledge.

Interesting. Mm-hmm. So the 

Mary: funny thing that you said that when I'm working on a couple books right now, which has been really fun, I got a, and I, it's, I got asked about to do this and I'm, and it's exciting, but one of the books that I'm working on is how to really come to your Why. Mm-hmm. And. That's a big thing.

And I think a lot of people think they know their why. They're like, oh, well I just want [00:24:00] people to have memories forever. Or I want Nope, that's not your why. Yeah. Why did, how did you, so going like to a more of a Simon Sinek, you know, level, your why is so much deeper than that. 

Kira: Mm-hmm. 

Mary: And, um, I think that that goes hand in hand.

I think that because I've told chat my why. 

Kira: Mm-hmm. 

Mary: It, it approach, when I put that piece in, it approaches it so much differently. Like it's so different. Um, and again, my why is not, yes. Do I want people to have, you know, beautiful portraits of their children because in 18 summers that, you know all that, that's all part of my business model.

Absolutely. But that's not my true and my heart and soul. Why? And you know, I kind of hit, I realized mine several, couple years ago when I worked on my SV thesis that was like. The, I finally realized what the why was and what it meant, right? Mm-hmm. And it's so incredibly personal and it has nothing to do with other people or other people's opinion of you or whatever.

And I think a lot of us haven't done that. They haven't really sat down and done, answered those really hard questions and done the work, 

Kira: right? 

Mary: And when you do that, it's crazy. It's crazy how things change. Um, and this is one of the things I've been trying to convince Jamie [00:25:00] of, and he's just, he's got a roadblock to it right now.

I'm not saying he always will, but he does right now. And I would imagine that that's why chat is so spot on with me is because it really probably means more about me than most people. Yeah. To be honest. Yeah. Yeah. 

Kira: I mean, I've put things in there. I've, I did my, I mean, if you wanna be real funny mm-hmm. I did.

Um, it, it has my, um, disc profile, uhhuh, it has my star chart. Uhhuh Uhhuh, like, yeah. You know, can't hurt. It can't hurt. Why not? You know? Yeah. Here's, here's some things about my personality. And so it knows my personality, it knows, it knows that I don't have patience for certain things. Right. You know, and um, and, and you know, like I don't have patience for it to just wax on and on and on and on and on.

Right. You know what I mean? Like to ask you 75 more questions after you told 

Mary: her what to 

Kira: Yeah. Yeah. 'cause I'm, I'm using it 'cause I'm generally in a hurry. Right. You know what I mean? I'm not here to have a day long reading session with it. I wanna, yeah. I'm just trying to get so, but some people like it, you know, my dad, for example, my dad loves to sit there with it all day and talk back and forth about it.

Oh. It's like, would you like that line to 

Mary: be like gray or a medium gray? Yeah. Just make it gray and move on. I don't care. Yeah. Yeah. 

Kira: And you know, and also every time they update it. It, it's something new. Quirky thing Yes. That you don't like happens and, but, so, but the change off is that [00:26:00] somebody great new, I mean this last chat, two B two five mm-hmm.

Was, is a game changer. Yeah. Um, it is just remarkable the kind of new stuff that it's, it's come out with, but that's, that's why that class I do is six weeks because it's too much. Yeah, it's, it's just, you're gonna, um, you know, I do these one day classes and they're a great intro to kind of get you excited so that you can start learning on your own and feel more confident.

Mm-hmm. But you know, the reason I do them for six weeks and just once a week is because you really, you spend one session learning a concept, and then you're supposed to spend the rest of the week applying that I, you know, that concept. Yeah. Absolutely. And then, and then we learn a new thing. And we do that in practice too.

So, you know, it, it's not fast to customize your chat GBT, but if you, if if you stage it out and you're patient with it, you could really get it to be a, uh, an assistant for you in the sense that you've got somebody, especially, you know, I'm, I'm sitting in the dark in my office right now, right. And I'm looking at my little empty desk 'cause I don't have an assistant anymore, you know, and it's like, yeah.

There's no one here for me to just step back and bounce ideas off of. Right. And that's how my John Singer 

Mary: Sergeant Project came out. Mm-hmm. I was just, I was sitting here at my at home. I was at home and I was sitting in this chair that I'm sitting in right now. And it was probably two in the morning and I was feeling so [00:27:00] depressed because I just am like, nothing's working.

I don't know what to do. And I thought, well, what the hell do I have to lose? And I put it in, and that came out and I slept that night. And I got up the next morning and I got on the phone and I, you know, got, got a few people. My niece was expecting a baby at that time. By the way, since y'all talked to me last, I'm now a great aunt.

I mean, I've always been a great aunt, but now I'm actually a great aunt to little Holly Ann, and that's so exciting. But literally got her in, got my other niece in and photographed them, and it just took off from there. And it's just. I've, I've learned how to do cap cut. I've learned how to do tiktoks.

I've started to, you know, I mean, it's just, it inspired me to do a lot of things that I've been dragging my feet on. Mm-hmm. Because I was excited for the first time in months about what I do for a living. Right. And I hadn't felt that way in a while. And I guess if anything, you know, I hope you guys, you know, can find that, and it, it's still hard.

I'm not saying it's not hard. Mm-hmm. But, you know, just. Not taking it so personally because my hair, my stylist, who's [00:28:00] never advertised a day in his life even said, wow, you know, a lot of my clients went away to Florida for the winter and they're coming back and they're not coming in as much. Or they're not coming in.

Or, um, my esthetician or my personal trainer, she just closed her studio down. She's doing only like virtual and home visits now because her business, I mean, it's not just. When I say my personal trainer, I mean I know her and I've used her not lately. Lemme just clear that up. Um, your personal trainer, acquaintance.

Yes, exactly. Um, but, uh, it's everywhere. Dentists, I, I mean, it's not, people aren't going to the doctor guys. Like my, my husband went to, uh, college with our eye doctor and he said, yeah. My business is down. You know, people need eye exams, but they don't have great insurance or whatever. So it's not just us.

If you, if you wanna hear one thing, it's not just us. I'd highly recommend you enrolling or taking, if you're not really using chat to its capacity. That doesn't mean just throwing in there and saying, Hey, write an email or social media post for me. Like, really wanna get trained on it, you know, study with someone like Kira because.

She's getting [00:29:00] it, like she's nailing it down. Um, I do think it's a game changer and that little bit of an investment to learn that and get that. Mm-hmm. I think it could be a major game changer for everyone, especially us small business creatives or small business owners per period, but certainly us creatives.

Kira: Yeah. Oh, well, thank you. Of course. I, I, of course, that's, that's what I believe. And yeah. Um, you know, we've done, I've done three sessions of this class so far, and every single time it, it, the cool thing is that it's different every time is because every time I offer it, they've got, uh, new stuff. Yeah. Last one was like, I was tell the people, some of the people that took the first class, I was like, well, I hate to tell you, but like, there's so many new things since your class.

You know, so, um, 

Mary: well, it's like a lot of things that are new. I mean, it's so new. Of course. It's, it's changing at such a rapid pace. Mm-hmm. I mean, it just, it just is. And, um, it's not gonna replace us guys. AI's not gonna replace us. Yeah. But, you know, people that are using it to the full capacity, people that are studying it, it, it that're gonna replace you.

That's who's gonna replace you. Um, not. Ai, but the people that are embracing it and using it, um, properly. And again, it's not just asking it to write an email. You have to train it. And I think that's the piece that it's [00:30:00] not super clear to most people how important that is. 

Kira: Yeah. And I think, I mean, imagine that you got a camera with, you know, you got a, a brand new Nikon Z nine and you'd never picked up a camera in your life, right.

And you got a Z nine and you were like. Well, I tried to take a picture with it and it was all dark. Yeah. Or I took it, it's like, uh, slow. I put it on, I put it on auto and it's like, Ugh, it's terrible. And then you just set it down. You walked away from it. Right. It's, and said, the Nikon C nine doesn't work and it doesn't work, or I don't like it, or whatever.

And it's like, well, you bought, you bought a, a masterful machine here, you know? Yeah. And all you did was push, uh, the button once. Right. You know what I mean? Like you haven't. You don't know. You don't have any idea what all it can do. Yeah. You know, so yeah, it, 

Mary: it, it's the same. And I, this happened recently, I was talking to one of my past students and, um, they bought a printer.

Mm-hmm. And I was like, how's it going? She goes, it's terrible. I was like, well, huh. I said, it's the same print. It's a great print. She goes, no. I ran something through and I said, well, did you mon, did you calibrate it? Calibrate it, did you run it? Did you run the test? Did you, have you calibrated your monitor?

Well, no. Um, well, I think we found the problem, you know, nothing is just add water, and that includes chat, that includes ca, I mean, it, nothing's just add water. It, it just isn't. Now granted we live in a [00:31:00] world where our iPhone is just add water. It takes a great picture right off the, out of the jump and, and different things like that.

I get it. But in a professional arena. That's not acceptable, but these, these tools chat. Mm-hmm. Nikon Z nine, you know, amazing, you know, Canon printer, those are absolutely phenomenal tools, but they do take time. It's a learning curve. It's like 17 hats. How long did it take you to learn 17 hats? Listen, I'm still, 

Kira: I'm still, this morning I'm setting up work, a workflow in it, and I'm going to chat and I'm working with my Yeah.

You know, back and forth and I'm like, okay, here. I'm stuck here, know Uhhuh, and it's helping me kind of like figure out the best way to do this. But I mean, I've been a, a 17 ADS user for a long time, years time, years, years and years, and I'm still still learning how to the best, the best way to, you know, what mean, most efficient way to, so anyway, it's, you know, it, it's not, it's designed so that you can walk up to it.

On auto and use it chat GBT, right? Sure, sure. Like it's designed so you can do it, but if you want it to work the best way it possibly can, you've gotta invest time to learn it, you know? Right. And, and to train it, you [00:32:00] know? 

Mary: Yeah. And you know this one more example, like I, early on, I was going somewhere and I didn't know how to pack, and I went to chat and I said, I'm going X, Y, z.

What should I pack? You would not believe the, the options they gave me. I was like, you don't know me at all. Obviously I'm not wearing whatever it is they told me to wear. I was like, uh, like, you know, OTs or something. I don't know what it was. I was like. You don't know me or shorts, I don't wear shorts.

Like, and so I was like, I'm not gonna blame Javie for TBT. That's on me. Like I had to explain to them, you know? But I know that sounds silly, but like this past trip, because I knew I was gonna be, I didn't know the temperature or whatever. I could go in and give, have a, give me a packing list. But it knew exactly not to say shorts, say a escort or a, a sundress.

Versus what normal people may think is normal. Well, you know, 

Kira: why not create a style guide PD for yourself that has a bunch of just candid photos of you wearing outfits that you really like. Yeah. With, with, um, never, never Dos and dos. Yep. And make it A-A-P-D-F. Not, you know, don't just upload a bunch of images and, and make that a, a file in a project folder that's just like your closet.

That's a really good idea. You know? And then you can say, look, refer back to my style guide and tell me. [00:33:00] I gotta go to Morocco, you know, at which I wear, at what should I wear, you know? And here's all the stores I shop at. I should do that. Here's all the, you should, you just, here's all the stores I shop at.

Like in your style guide, in your PDF, right? Yeah. You pay, you put in these images. Now it's not great at, um. It's not like if you upload just an image. Yeah. It's not great at seeing that image and being able to remember it's you. But if you put it in a PDF alongside a bunch of text content, okay. That it can look through, oh, you know, like, here's me, here's my age, here's my body type.

You know, just put some basic figures in there. Here's my sizes. Yeah. Here, here are the online stores that I shop at. Yeah. And here is, um, here are the things that I won't absolutely will not wear. Here are the colors that I won't wear. Here's my color profile, you know, and you can just put all, but it needs the text to go with the image.

It needs the text. If you just put the images in, I've learned over time the images don't get read. As much. But if you put it in a, in a PDF and you have it alongside Yeah. Descriptive text about whatever, I think I'm gonna make one of those today actually. 

Mary: That is phenomenal. I didn't know that. Like, that's worth the whole podcast episode for me [00:34:00] because I've definitely uploaded images and now it makes more sense.

I need to add the text to go with it. See, I didn't Yeah. 

Kira: Know that and, and put it in a project folder, like make a project folder. It's just that, just for styling you. And then make it a project file for, in that project folder. So it'll always, it'll always look at that project file for every. Every query.

You don't have to upload it every time. 

Mary: That's phenomenal. That is, so that is, I didn't, okay. I didn't know that part. Like I, I do upload images and I do it, but now that makes sense. Add the text. Mm-hmm. Make it a PDF and upload it as a, that's, wow. Yeah. Okay. And we could do that for our clients too, right?

Like, are you doing that for your client? I guess that's, so something I've thought about, well, 

Kira: the entrepreneurs that I'm working with, I'm teaching them how to do that kind of thing. Yeah. You know, so that's, that's my consulting that I do. Know those. Oh my. So 

Mary: what if, holy shoot. So what if, you know how we do the pre-consult, what if I ask my clients to send me like four images of outfits they like, it doesn't even have to be their outfits.

And then I could feed that in and then it could give me other examples of what it, how it would work. 

Kira: Oh, yeah, a hundred percent. So I have another, like in my, in my studio folder, here's what I do. I do. Um, especially with client clients that I've worked with before. Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I, I have this one client that I have photographed for five years [00:35:00] and she's like.

She, she wants to do, she's, she loves high-end clothing and style, you know, big brands. Um, she wants them to look super fancy, rich, elegant, you know? Okay. Luxury and luxury. It always al luxury. And so it's always in studio too, but she's like, I don't have any ideas. I just don't know what, you know, could you help guide me a little bit?

And so I tell her. I, well, I tell chat, chat, GPT, um, inside of, uh, a prompt. I say, okay, so here's five images like that I've done in the past of, of this family. I need three new options for them with color, color palettes, you know, style options, theme options. Yeah. But it's always gonna be in a minimalist studio.

Right. Right. We're not gonna be doing like big themes. We're not going outdoors with them. Yeah. You know, like, we're always gonna be in a, in my minimalist studio that it already, we're not gonna be outside, we're not gonna be in a grand hotel. Right. And so it gave me three options for her, which I was able to put in, you know, put into an email, like, and go, okay, here's three.

And I named them, you know, like, I like, you know, here's the monochromatic blue, here's the bold colors, here's the whatever, you know, tell me which one you like. And then once I had that, I shopped 'em for her. You know, and then, you know, when she picked one. And so it's, you know, it's, it's game changer for [00:36:00] styling if you, that's that kind of surprise and delight that you can offer.

Mary: Absolutely. Mm-hmm. Holy moly. I, I didn't, I knew that and I, you and I have talked about that part before and I knew that, I know that you were working on some things like that, but I don't know why I haven't thought about adding that to my client benefits. And this is gonna be another one that I need to say, and this is something that I truly believe in, that I understand.

I think all, a lot of our businesses are a little bit, maybe a little bit down this year or whatever. But I do believe people will come back. Nu number one. Number two, the most important thing you can do right now is to add value to what you're offering. Mm-hmm. And that is an added value that doesn't cost any money, that surprise and delight.

And that's what's gonna make them come back around. Or you know, I've had several, I probably have five clients right now who are like. I wanna place this order, but I've gotta wait until X, Y, Z because of a bonus or tax, whatever. Right? And I'm holding on. And that's not normal for us. That's just, they used to just write the check or, you know, put it on [00:37:00] the card.

Um, but, um. That added, that's just such, such a huge game changer. Mm-hmm. I love that. Mm-hmm. Okay, so I'm doing that. Do it. So did you build out a whole separate, do you have a separate, how do you have that separated out? Like you have your studio, you know, obviously your studio GPT, but then do you have a section in your studio, GPT for it?

Or is it a separate whole separate build out? That makes sense. 

Kira: So it would be a for, for that. It's just inside my studio, GBT. Okay. 'cause it's, everything I do for my business is in that. You know, like, so okay, keep it all in one place. Yeah. Yeah. I keep that all in one place. I feel 

Mary: like I've kept mine scattered.

Mine is a little too scattered right now. I need to put it all under one content. Well, 

Kira: I feel like it's always gotta refer back to the same bit core content. You're right. You know, so, um, but you know, there's custom gpt you can create too that, um, that you can put a lot of information into. Yeah. And, and so, but I, I prefer the folder way.

Me too, then. Um, because I, I feel like if, if I want it to truly have everything in my head. That's the best way to do it to me. Okay. That makes sense to me too. So, 

Mary: um, yeah. All right guys, well listen, we're back. We're gonna try to keep moving forward. Um, and, um, you know, again, if you're interested in learning more about Chatt PT, I know Kira won't say it, I'll say it.

Reach out to Kira. I'm sure she'll have another class starting soon. Um. I'm, I'm so excited. I don't have a lot on my forecast right now. I know Kira's gonna be giving a pre-con at imaging USA, so definitely sign up for that if you want a little crash course in GPT. [00:38:00] But that's just a one day, right? Just a, yeah, 

Kira: I've got that coming up.

It's, that's a one day, and it's, we cover a lot in that one day. Yeah, sure. Um, and then, uh, I've got a half day online class with a Maryland PPA Oh, that's right. Maryland in November. So that's a little bit sooner and I can, I'll, I'll get some information up. I just signed that contract like yesterday. Yeah.

So, um, that'll be coming up soon and I've got, I've got a lot more stuff booked next year. Yeah. So, um, this year I think, I haven't posted the new dates for the next session of the, of the, of my big, uh, class. 'cause I'm trying to decide if I'm gonna cut it to four weeks instead of six weeks. Mm-hmm. And just see where.

If that, that might give me a, a better opportunity to cover like, uh, stronger content in each core. Right. You know? Yeah. Because by the six week, we're really just reviewing, you know Right. To make sure that we've got, so I'm wondering if I could do four weeks and then be able to offer it more frequently.

Yeah. That makes within the, you know, makes sense because Right, right now I've, it's about three times a year and then I've got. To catch up with the best rest of my job. So that makes sense. 

Mary: Well, and if by chance you wanna go to London in a couple weeks, we're gonna be offering our first, um, London painting workshop at a, a mansion or a manor house, um, out right outside of London.

Um, but again, it's coming up really, really fast. I think it's October 9th, 10th, and 11th. And, uh, we're gonna [00:39:00] be teaching 'cause we're opening a London studio. That's the exciting thing that we've been working on. And um, so we're gonna go look at the space and all, but we're gonna offer our first class there.

So it's. Kind of exciting, but if you happen to Very exciting, be in the uk, uh, gonna be in the UK in the middle of October, let me know because, um, we'll be there. So it'll be kind of fun. So lots of things going on. So just, the point is, is that even in spite of I, and I'll speak for both of us, both of us not feeling our greatest or feeling our most successful, or I don't know, whatever, these past several months, we are still producing and we are still trying.

And in some days it's harder than others. Um, but no, you're not alone. We're all out there doing it. We're all out there trying. We really, really are. And I do believe it'll come around. It will come around. Nothing lasts forever. So yeah, just try learning something else. Yes, so defer that attention into something that does excite you, whatever that is.

Absolutely. 

Kira: Okay. Alright, well let's wrap this one up. Um, go, you know, you can follow us on Instagram at Get Your Shoot together, follow us on Facebook at Get Your Shoot Together and email us at Girl at Get Your shoot together.com and subscribe to us everywhere where podcasts are played. We will see you guys next time.

Thanks y'all.