Career Cheat Code
Welcome to Career Cheat Code, a podcast that explores the stories of everyday people making an impact in the world through their careers and loving every minute of it. Whether you're already on your path or searching for your purpose, this podcast is for you.
Join us every Monday as we uncover the secrets behind successful careers and inspire you to make your own mark. Formerly known as Thank God It's Monday | TGIM, don't forget to subscribe for updates and share with your friends!
Career Cheat Code
067 | Fostering Economic Opportunities with Zoila Del Castillo
What if your journey from an immigrant struggling with English to a top state official could empower countless others? Meet Zoila, the Deputy Secretary of State for Economic Opportunity under Governor Hochul, who shares her extraordinary story and invaluable insights on how to create economic and social opportunities for all New Yorkers. From combating financial crimes at the Attorney General's office to overseeing critical divisions like the Office for New Americans and the Division of Consumer Protection, Zoila's journey is a masterclass in resilience, dedication, and public service.
Tune in to uncover how early mentorship opportunities and a pivotal internship at the Attorney General's office set the stage for Zoila's illustrious career. Learn about the impact of her work, particularly in supporting immigrants and fostering financial empowerment in communities. Discover the versatility and value of a law degree beyond traditional legal practice, and the importance of becoming a well-rounded applicant for law school through disciplined academic performance and extracurricular involvement. Zoila's career highlights the significant role of passion, experience, and financial considerations in choosing a path in public interest law.
Moreover, explore the importance of community involvement and professional growth through serving on junior boards. Zoila shares her perspective on navigating financial stability, the value of mentorship, and giving back to the community. Hear advice on leveraging professional networks, committing time and expertise to nonprofit boards, and staying informed about philanthropic trends. This episode is brimming with career hacks, mentorship tips, and stories of resilience, making it a must-listen for anyone aspiring to make a meaningful impact in government or public interest fields.
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Host - Radhy Miranda
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Producer - Gary Batista
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help communities and individuals who need sort of you know, maybe resources and the tools to be able to educate themselves, be financially savvy and sort of decrease overall the likelihoods of someone falling into these financial schemes. So I began to have those conversations for many months and I took advantage of many programs that were aimed to empower individuals of color, but also, like you know, giving you an idea of where to go next, like the Council of Urban Professionals Cup, which was an amazing program to be part of.
Speaker 1:Through those sort of conversations I got the opportunity to serve in this role. But that's really what I was thinking from going from the AG's office doing financial crimes to now being in this position, and it has been an amazing transition that way.
Speaker 3:Welcome to Career Cheat Code. In this podcast, you'll hear how everyday people impact the world through their careers. Learn about their journey, career hacks and obstacles along the way. Whether you're already having the impact you want or are searching for it, this is the podcast for you.
Speaker 2:All right, soyla, welcome to the show.
Speaker 1:Thank you, Ravi. Thank you for the invitation.
Speaker 2:Of course, I'm excited to talk to you today and learn all about your career and your path. Let's jump right in there. Let's tell the world what it is you do for a living.
Speaker 1:Well, thank you for the invitation, paddy.
Speaker 1:As you know, I currently serve as Deputy Secretary of State for Economic Opportunity at the Department of State for Governor Hochul and in this position, I have the privilege to manage and oversee four state divisions.
Speaker 1:That includes the Office for New Americans, the Division of Consumer Protection, the Division of Community Services and the Office of Administrative Hearings so very diverse in terms of scope, but one key component is that, you know, the goal is to empower and financially empower individuals.
Speaker 1:Specifically, you know, with the work that we do with the Office for New Americans and the Division of Community Services With respect to consumer protection, that is something that I have, you know, quite a bit of experience with with my time at the Attorney General's Office, on and off, and the goal is really to educate and protect consumers, something that I feel very passionate about. And overall, you know, also with the Office of Administrative Hearings, the Department of State licenses 49 professions, from nail salons to barbershops, and the administrative judges hear disciplinary cases where disciplinary action is required. And you know, you and I know how important, you know, our licenses and making a living is, so we take that job very seriously and all of that combined, it's really looking at four different state divisions that do really important work and that touch people's life, so I'm very privileged to be in this role.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. So let's dig deeper. So tell me more about like what does your day look like when you walk in on a Monday? Right, you walk in on a Monday, you're planning out your week. Is your life a lot of internal meetings, a lot of external events and if so, kind of what do they really look like? What are you tasked with bringing to life?
Speaker 1:Absolutely. I think a lot of my life is internal. I have a big responsibility of overseeing approximately 70 great employees and about six of them are direct reports, so I have to be available. I have the opportunity to work closely with them in terms of programming and policy, so I come constantly in meetings with the team to touch base on any given project, especially like specifically.
Speaker 1:Let me give you an example with the Office for New Americans, the.
Speaker 1:That office has done extraordinary work in the last 10 years, is the first statutorily created immigration office in the state and now they have many other offices throughout the nation the Office for the Americans, or ONA.
Speaker 1:They have diverse programming that is aimed to help foster and integrate new Americans in the state of New York.
Speaker 1:So a lot of the work that you know you're seeing right now is the legal services providing assistance legal assistance to migrants and asylum seekers who are seeking to either file for TPS, file for an asylum applications and so on. But the office overall provide a holistic approach, universal approach to all the services that the state is seeking to put forward for new Americans. So this is done through a network of community-based organizations, nonprofits, and the Department of State provides the funding to the nonprofits through a procurement process for them to do meaningful work, whether it's providing legal services to mental health, to workforce development for migrants. So, with that being said, I meet with the team regularly to go over our programming, to develop new programs, to ensure that the programs are doing what they're intending to do. That goes along the way to my other divisions as well, so it takes a lot of meetings, a lot of reporting, briefing also stakeholders not only within the state, but also having constant communications with our grantees as well.
Speaker 2:That makes sense.
Speaker 2:And you know, sometimes, even as New York State and New York City residents, right like we forget that there are just so many folks in the background doing the work that really keeps the state and the city moving right, especially when you see issues come up, right Like I'm an immigrant myself, right? So when you think about some of these programs that are being implemented now, how do we support the current situation? How do we humanize the people that are coming through these doors? How do we make sure that they have the support needed? Right, politics aside, like, let's humanize the thing and then we can talk about politics and programming and whether you agree with the table, let's make sure that humans are taken care of first and foremost. And then your office, you know, the economic opportunity team like, as you said, that's four different divisions that are just out here making sure that New Yorkers are advancing and have opportunities and are given, like, the fair chances and fair, you know just, runway to, to advance economically, right, so I just wholeheartedly, really I'm a fan of your team.
Speaker 2:I think you all are doing remarkable work and you and I have spoken about some of the other programs and I'm sure we'll talk about some of that here, Right.
Speaker 2:But like it's, literally some of the programs that my mom has taken advantage of right, like programs that have helped my family directly, not like a theoretical thing but like literally, programs that my mom has gone through her local nonprofit to get rent assistance or some advice or some support through some programming, like that's all, like they receive funding from you all to do that type of work right.
Speaker 1:and like my mom may never even know that she may never know that you know the state I didn't know the work that I'm currently doing in supporting and, as I mentioned and we talked about this through the Division of Community Services the much needed essential assistance to individuals. It's pretty rewarding to see it firsthand Like oh, this is what community action agencies do. They actually will help you out to pay your rent if you're unable to meet those requirements. And it's very rewarding to see how I have gotten to this place. And if you ask me a number of years from now if I thought that this will be a possibility, it's really interesting how you are sort of put into positions that you never thought you will be in.
Speaker 2:With that in mind, what's your favorite part of your role?
Speaker 1:My favorite part of the role, I think, seeing retroactively, having these conversations and seeing like retrospectively, like how the creation of one program has impacted individuals. Right, I was part of, you know with, with my team in the Division of Community Services, we created a financial literacy initiative and we began those conversations like a few months after I joined the office. It took time, maybe a year, to get the program off the ground right and that was a lot of forethought and conversations and conceptualizing what this program was going to do. To summarize it a little bit, it provides one-on-one counseling to individuals who are seeking to build financial sustainability, so individuals who are taught how to save, how to open up a bank account, how to build generational wealth. That's really the key component to what we were trying to do with this program and it's really rewarding to see some of the nonprofits report on the work and how they have helped individuals directly, and I just love to see it.
Speaker 2:I'm sure, with all of the things that you oversee, right, what are some of the challenging parts of the role that you're like, oh man, this is like, well, like what keeps you up at night, or what do you know is going to be a roadblock when you walk in on Mondays, or what?
Speaker 1:do you know is going to be a roadblock when you walk in on Mondays. You know, with any important role there's always challenges. I think it's the idea that everyone, including the teams and myself, we're all doing the best that we can and, to the extent that we hope, to create solutions to ongoing problems is something that we continue to strive. But sometimes you know it's not an overnight solution, right, there's not an overnight sense of you know this will be fixed within the next, like week or two. You know it takes time to develop these programs and to see the results and it's always thinking that, looking ahead and seeing the impact that you can create over time. But that's definitely something that you know I think about often how can we make the best to effectuate as much change as possible, given the resources or the opportunities that we have?
Speaker 2:How'd you get into this role?
Speaker 1:How so? It's a long story. Should we go all the way back?
Speaker 2:The world is yours, let's do it.
Speaker 1:I started my career as a prosecutor, so I graduated law school. I knew that I wanted to do public interest, one day become a prosecutor and maybe come full circle and work at the attorney general's office. Actually, I interned at the AG's office, the attorney general's office, when I was 16 years old in high school and they hired me after high school and I had the opportunity to work with two amazing attorneys of color who were protecting and serving communities, who were taken advantage of right and I saw some cases where you know it was because sometimes these were immigrants who lack the language speaking skills, the English speaking skills, and they were taken advantage of financially at times. I saw their work, I was inspired and I said maybe one day I could come back full circle and do the kind of work that they're doing at the AG's office. So I went to the district attorney's office in Brooklyn. I tried street level crimes and got the litigation experience when I was able to join the AG's office in the Criminal Enforcement and Financial Crimes Bureau. So at that point I was prosecuting white collar crimes, corporations and individuals who were engaging in practices sometimes financial practices that would take advantage of people, and I had the opportunity to be there while.
Speaker 1:You know, during COVID, which was challenging, I saw a lot of financial schemes.
Speaker 1:I had the opportunity to work on cases involving, you know, individuals who work at nail salons and you know we're not working under, you know, great conditions and there was wage theft happening and I came in with the financial component of maybe they didn't file their sales taxes and that's, you know, a way in which we can help these individuals in the large scheme which we did and so on. So I thought about what if I was, instead of prosecuting financial crimes, what if I was doing financial empowerment, what if there was a way for me to be able to help communities and individuals who need sort of you know, maybe resources and the tools to be able to educate themselves, be financially savvy and sort of decrease overall the likelihood of someone falling into these financial schemes. So I began to have those conversations for many months and I took advantage of many programs that were aimed to empower individuals of color, but also, like you know, giving you an idea of where to go next, like the Council of Urban Professionals Cup, which was an amazing program to be part of.
Speaker 1:Through those sort of conversations I got the opportunity to serve in this role. But that's really what I was thinking from going from the AG's office doing financial crimes to now being in this position, and it has been an amazing transition that way.
Speaker 2:Wow, so that makes a lot of sense. So you know, I have a couple of questions there. One how on earth do you get an internship at 16, right, Like I was working at the staff already serving fries and burgers at that age, right we're going all the way back.
Speaker 1:I see.
Speaker 2:Because you mentioned that you were interning there at 16 and that threw me off. I'm like 16 years old, you had an opportunity to build something towards your career resume, right. And then, also as a follow-on to that, did you intern at the HG's office because you were interested in that type of world or did you become interested because you interned there?
Speaker 1:That's a great question. What came first? So we come from very similar background we spoke about. You know I'm a Dominican immigrant.
Speaker 1:I came to this country when I was 10, 11 years old and my family settled in the Bronx. I came here without speaking the English language. So for me, you know, that was a big transition. I was someone in my native country. I always excelled academically, I always did well in school, yeah, and then coming here and not knowing the language, that was absolutely challenging.
Speaker 1:I would cry stress to my mom like saying how I, you know I didn't understand any given like quick pop test or so on.
Speaker 1:So I was always like trying to look for opportunities to become more engaged and striving to really like integrate.
Speaker 1:And you know I was always very passionate and driven, I think at an early age, due to all the responsibilities that come along with being first generation immigrant. So when you know those internships, opportunities will come around. I was always one of the first to apply and this was part of a, you know, a very unique opportunity provided by Congressman Serrano Jose Serrano at that time to place high school students in government internships to learn the ways of government. And no, I had no idea at that point that that would be something that you know will become my career later on. So it was a very pleasant experience. I was one of four interns who intern at the AG's office and again I became so absolutely amazed by the work that the office was doing to protect consumers, to protect individuals who were being taken advantage of from financial schemes, and I adored and admired the two attorneys who were working on those cases. They have become my mentors for life until this day. We're very close.
Speaker 1:They have written letters of recommendations for me for college, for law school and so on. So through working there I felt like, hmm, maybe I can become an attorney one day. And I say that, you know, in this manner because, again, first generation immigrant college graduate in my family, an attorney I didn't have anyone to look to to think like, wow, being an attorney is a possibility. So it was really nice to see that those examples and people of color that I could one day, you know, do that kind of work.
Speaker 2:Do you feel like going to law school has actually paid off for you in your career?
Speaker 1:Great question Absolutely, absolutely, and I do not hesitate to say this. Because, well, absolutely, and I do not hesitate to say this because, well, I took a different path and many individuals can take whichever path, you know, speaks to them, I knew that I wanted to do public interest. So I, you know, I don't come from, I come from very humble financial backgrounds, you know. So for me, you know, I took all of those things into consideration and I had very good mentors who were really giving me sound advice. So, you know, I went to John Jay and I was working part time at the AG's office. But John Jay was a great school. They provided me with, you know, a lot of financial resources and support from internships.
Speaker 1:I interned with the city council, the assembly, and I was able to work part-time at the attorney general's office, but also with academic support. I was part of pre-law programs that would create a pipeline into law school and I had great mentors telling me if you want to go to law school, you have to be disciplined, you have to become a very well-rounded applicant, you know. So my grades were something that I could control, my extracurricular activity were something that I could control, and then I took that advice and I excelled in that, in that setting. And then I went to a school.
Speaker 1:You know financials were a consideration for me, so I went to Wayne State Law School and I was lucky that they provided me with a full scholarship, so that really helped me pursue my passion, which was government and public interest.
Speaker 1:So that made it easier coming out of law school and I say that it was absolutely worth it to go to law school. One, because I knew what I wanted to do. Two, given what I wanted to do, I was conscientious of where I went to. It had to be a good public interest school and I didn't want to get into debt, so that worked for me. But law school overall is an amazing pathway to many different professions.
Speaker 1:Having a law degree can open the doors to beyond just the practice of law, and I see that now with the current position that I'm in, but also with a lot of you know colleagues who are doing amazing, interesting and impactful work with a law degree. It opens the possibility to very non-traditional roles, so I think that it was absolutely worth it. For me, the mind of a lawyer and the skills that we learn in law school and through our profession are so applicable to so many different professions. You never stop thinking like a lawyer.
Speaker 2:Absolutely, and you know, I think that's one of the things that I appreciate about conversations like this right, you can be a lawyer and be in leadership positions in so many other fields, like you don't have to be in law, you don't have to be in a courtroom.
Speaker 2:But I just feel like when, at least when I was younger I didn't realize that. So to me it's like if you're gonna get a law degree, you're probably going to practice law your entire life, and to me that didn't make sense for what I wanted to do in my career, right. But you know, it seems like if you, just because you have your JD, like as you said, it helps you with the way that you think, with the way that you analyze problems with, and even just the leaders that I've come across there are a lot of leaders that I've come across that have a JD and it all makes sense, right, because those are folks that you probably want to trust with a lot of things. But I just wouldn't have put that together before. So I appreciate hearing people that you know have degrees and use them in different ways.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. And again, you know, there is not only there is not one specific path to follow, right, and although there are many leaders with law degrees, I think that your background is equally compelling, right. But overall, you know, when I speak to a lot of aspiring law students, I do share to be mindful of what you want to do at the end of the day, because you know also, the pitfalls is, you know, sometimes it is said that, you know, law school is very expensive and people don't want to be in debt for the rest of their lives. So that is really a consideration that I always speak about with aspiring law students, especially those who you know share that they come from humble economic backgrounds. It's something that I kept in the back of my mind and again, if you know, nothing else is an object, of course. I continue to say that law degrees are so uniquely situated to the skills that you learn are so applicable to so many other professions.
Speaker 2:That makes sense. Yeah, and I do appreciate the caveat there right, because I have a master's degree in public administration. But I advocate that it's definitely worth it for me. But my situation was I got most of it paid for. So the way I invested was more time right and less the financial strain of having the debt. So you know, it is definitely a personalized decision, but you know, I just I do appreciate when people are get degrees and use them in unique ways. I think that part is is really really interesting to see throughout our careers.
Speaker 1:But look, you kind of figure out along the way what you want to do. Because, honestly speaking, I think the beauty about being an evolving professional is that you know, with any career and I will say this, with in law, you know you can change your mind and sort of explore different paths. It's not guaranteed that you have to practice, let's say, criminal law for the rest of your life. As long as you're developing those skills that you know make you versatile in different settings, you can kind of navigate different spaces. And that's the beauty about like learning new things and finding new jobs and different positions. I think it will be very boring if you stop learning.
Speaker 2:Can you speak a little bit about? This is a. This is the one question that I do tend to ask folks. I want people to know that they can do good and do well. You have a very important position. You have a lot of impact that comes out of your office. That to me, does not mean that you have to, especially when you're attached to a government job. Right Like I want people to know that they can actually make a decent living while doing this type of work, while doing impactful work. Can you give us a range of how much money folks in this level of government can start, can envision themselves making?
Speaker 1:It varies depending on where you are in your career, right, if you're just starting out versus you know someone who is more senior. You know, to be honest, when I started out as an ADA, an assistant district attorney, the pay was low. But you also, you know, sometimes do that kind of work for the experience and because you love and are passionate about what it is that you do. So overall, in government, you have to be passionate and love what you do. Any attorney can tell you that if you go into the big little corporate route, obviously you have the potential to make a lot more money. But as you become more senior, you become more financially stable and I think the pay is comparable. Obviously, if you're seeking to sort of get a better idea of how much the pay is in any given role within government, there's always the information is posted online and you can do your research, but it has worked out for me.
Speaker 1:Again, I am very passionate about what it is that I do and I always wanted to do public interest on profit. So, I knew, going in, I was not going to be making law firm salary, but that was something that I already had in mind when I got into this path.
Speaker 2:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:And you know, I think we all choose kind of what it is that we want to have, the impact that we want to have in our careers, right.
Speaker 2:And then you know, I think, when we talk about, especially like when we talk about things like salary, like I think for me it's more I appreciate specifically New York, right, like if you're applying to jobs in New York, like you could at least get a range of where you should be, and I just know that that's not the case in every state. So, definitely, if folks are like considering going into government, like definitely look at different types of roles, specifically if you're in New York and like compare kind of what that looks like, just to make sure that you land kind of in a comparable place to your peers, because you know, it's one thing if you're searching for a job here versus in michigan that may not have the same laws, right, that may not have to give you some insight, um, but definitely use you know I encourage folks to use things like glass door and just make sure that you right, correct, you know where you're going to land. But you know, I do think there are um some good, well-paying government jobs that are like high in impact.
Speaker 1:You know, and that's what it is for me. But other individuals take into consideration benefits, you know. You know I had friends who you know were very conscientious of. You know, let's say, maternity leave. You know what kind of benefits healthcare benefits individuals get, and I think all of those things are important. I'm ashamed to say that, you know, it wasn't until like later on in my career that I started to sort of like look into sort of like the pension and investing, now that I'm there at all. But I'm glad that you were having those conversations, radhi, because it's so important to have that financial talk. Financial stability is very important. It's something that I feel very passionate about and you know that's why, you know, I worked along with, you know, creating the financial literacy program for individuals who are trying to build economic balance and sustainability and it is important to have those conversations.
Speaker 1:We have grown up to be ashamed of having the money talk right. No one talks about money at the table or you know. But it is important to really have those talks because if money is important to you, then you have to sort of like figure out a path forward. If health insurance or any given benefits are important to you, I don't think that anyone should be ashamed for seeking that. I think we should be actively trying to build generational wealth, if we can.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I love that. I mean, you are the Office of Economic Opportunity for that. You know that kind of tracks, so that makes sense. Can you share with us other ways where you lend some of your expertise and advice to others? Right, like you are on a couple of different boards, right, and you do a lot of like this? It seems to me like you're an actual public servant, like at heart, right, when you're like not just this is my job, but also this is some other things that I'm going to do outside of work. Can you speak a little bit about some of those opportunities and things that you do outside and why you do?
Speaker 1:those. So right now I'm in a little bit of a transition. You cut me at a gap as of last month, but I have been very actively involved with many organizations that I have felt passionate about and you know I try to contribute to my career. It is twofold, right. I have a mentor who says that if you're just doing your job or you're just doing one job, you're not doing enough, for two reasons, right. One, you want to give back to the community, yes, but also it's very important, like you said, to lend your skills and time to other causes because ultimately, like, it should not only be about the current job that you're doing. You should be ambitioning yourself and looking into the future and, in different spaces, put yourself in different spaces for many reasons, but I have been very and, as you know, I have gotten more seasoned in the profession.
Speaker 1:I have been very intentional of the organizations that I get involved with and that I continue to support. You know I have been involved with bar associations to support law students and aspiring law students because, as I mentioned, I'm a first generation. Everything and becoming an attorney was a desire, it was a dream and I was, you know, privileged enough to to accomplish that. But I had a village behind me of mentors who who supported me, so I feel very passionate about giving back in that way. That's why I was involved with the Dominican Bar Association, dominicanos al fin yay, and I was involved with the Hispanic National Bar Association as chair of the Young Lawyers Division and for a very long time, five years as of last month, I was involved with the Latino Justice Puerto Rico Legal Defense Fund leader's board, a young professional board, and I was the co-chair and I will continue to be involved. Again, I have to be very intentional and you know, given I want to be able to allocate the necessary time and resources that I can to these causes and for Latino justice. I was very proud of the work that the organization was doing.
Speaker 1:Not only you know, latino justice as an organization has put forth some of the most meaningful civil rights cases to protect Latino rights, to protect voting rights. They were the first ones to bring forth litigation for bilingual education right that became a right throughout the country. So very important organization. But I was also very passionate about their pipelines to create education and opportunities for college students or aspiring students who wanted to go to law school. So I became involved with the education committee and throughout you know my time with Latino justice, I've, you know, made sure to share the same information that I've been sharing with you, because it's important that aspiring Latinos hear from someone who looks like them, who went through the path and you know.
Speaker 1:If they may see themselves in me, by all means. But I always reinforce that you know, my path is not everyone's path and, again, you have to do what's best for you. But it's so important to have this organization that has an outstanding network of Latino attorneys in place to be able to provide that inspiration and support that is needed. So that's an example of an organization and a mission that I feel very passionate about and has some very exciting projects in the works. But, again, you have to be intentional and have purpose in whatever it is that you choose to do.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. And you know, I think sometimes we tend to sell ourselves short that we have so much more to offer. We tend to sell ourselves short that we have so much more to offer. I remember being younger in my career and being hesitant to even think that I was worthy enough to try to get on a board somewhere. Right, I just happened to have good mentors that they're like. Right, what are you doing? You should be on like at least one board.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I'm like wait what? And I'm like it took a little while to realize oh, I'm actually like gaining some skill sets and I actually have stuff to contribute and I have a perspective of like like some of the boards that I joined were like my immediate community center, like near me, like I am the people that you serve and a lot of the times like that's not even that's not necessarily how the board of that organization looks Me realizing that I actually have that perspective and have more to offer just was something that I had to overcome. Right, and I love what you said, right. Like sometimes some of the folks that you're helping through that are maybe they see themselves in you, right, but also you can help shape the way that these organizations focus, provide resources, funding towards programming, just by your experiences. And you know I definitely encourage folks to to do that and this is also a good way to continue to own your professional brand.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. And again, again, as I mentioned, it's twofold because I have been in those spaces. Yes, I, you know I'm there to support and volunteer my time and engage. I have benefited greatly from being in those spaces. Where I volunteer, there is senior level board members who have gone above and beyond to support me professionally and whom I have learned so much from and, you know, build long-term mentorship relationship with these individuals.
Speaker 1:So when I told you that I have a mentor who says that if you're just doing one job and you're doing your job, you're doing it wrong, and it's really true, because that's how you sort of facilitate what is seeing other individuals in different spaces right Really gives you a vision of what else you could do, what's next for you. And one of the key advice that I always give everyone is to be flexible, adapt and be comfortable with being in spaces that you think you might not belong in, and that's really important. Be comfortable in being in spaces that you think you might not belong in, Because, as I see, some of these mentors have like very unconventional careers. You know, I can see myself maybe potentially like one day, like, oh, this is potentially like that's an option for me, when I would have never thought that way if I didn't go to this conference. For you know X, Y and Z Right.
Speaker 1:I told you when we talked about picking up golfing Right, Like I never golfed before, like you know, three, four years ago and I started putting myself in these spaces thanks to the Hispanic Corporate Responsibility Association, ACIR. You know they do an empower her summit, where they teach professionals in the corporate space or who wants to be in the corporate space about. You know how to golf in a very comfortable setting where you don't feel judged, let's say, because you never golfed in your life. And it's important to be part of those settings that you think you might not belong in because, let's be honest, a lot of the conversations happen in those settings and it's not necessarily professionally related, but it is connected. That's one key advice that I give.
Speaker 2:Absolutely. I love that and, if you're listening, this is your call to action to go, put yourself in a position to figure out how you can get to a board and contribute to a board, at the very least a junior board.
Speaker 1:Obviously, you and I are sort of like in the same space mid-level professionals and it's so important to serve in a junior board even before you serve in the executive board, right, like that's the goal, yes, but like that you can sort of like get an idea of what it is that individuals in a real board do. Right, it's a lot of responsibilities and there is, you know, there are requirements that have to be met and also you're learning in where you might find yourself to be the best fit and where you can apply your talents and give back. But, yeah, junior boards are very essential to your development. I believe in those.
Speaker 2:And all right. My last bit on boards, just because it was another thought that you just sparked. There are a couple of barriers where people kind of stop at. There are boards that require you to donate, there are boards that require a give-get.
Speaker 2:I think for, especially in the earlier part of my career, where I mean I've always been me and I've always been vocal, but I was also able to articulate the value that I bring to an organization without money, without an annual contribution. So I would say those are the things holding you back. These organizations are eager to get young leaders that will continue to be the pipeline for the future of the organization. And the way that I was able to contribute was I was working in city government. This organization very much had to work with city government and had to leverage some of the relationships that I was able to bring to the table. And had to leverage some of the relationships that I was able to bring to the table and had to leverage some of the expertise and insight of working with government that I could bring to the table.
Speaker 2:I was also able to articulate hey, I'm an immigrant, I don't have parents that have money, I don't have friends that are like really advanced, like that, like I'm not really going to be able to do this. Give get thing every year. I could try, but like if that is a standard, then this is not going to work out. And folks were very clear with me like no, we think you bring a lot more than just whatever that looks like and it's absolutely paid off for them in the long run.
Speaker 1:Um, but it definitely merits a conversation and don't let that be a deterrent um to you contributing to work yeah, I mean, the reality is, just, like you mentioned, that some organizations do expect you to contribute financially to support the mission of the organizations. The reality is that nonprofits do need the funding in order to do important work and I absolutely get that. And, as you mentioned, you know, being in the government space, we are limited in many ways from fundraising making sometimes a meaningful contribution as opposed to our private firm's counterparts. But I had an amazing experience being part of the Junior Board of Latino Justice and, as you mentioned, my skill set was, you know, providing them with the time.
Speaker 1:I was very passionate and eager to dive into creating programming. Passionate and eager to dive into creating programming. I would put in a lot of the time to volunteer and I was co-chair at one point, right. So my commitment to doing the work, I think, was not questioned and that's what got me become co-chair in a position that otherwise, as we know, are more suited for individuals who are able to contribute financially with the skill sets that you have. Because, also, you know, I have some of the government connections and I just I've been very intentional about keeping and maintaining my network of mentors who, you know, have always been supportive of lending me a hand if I needed speakers or I needed individuals to come and support the organization. But you can also personally contribute right? I always met my personal commitment to the organization and I will continue to do so.
Speaker 1:That is important because no matter how much money we make, whether we will make enough you think to, like you know, make a big contribution. I think you're building sort of like the consistency and making it a point that you're always supporting something to the level that you're able to do so. So, no matter how big or small the contribution is, I think it's important to still financially support in some capacity.
Speaker 2:Do you have any forms of media? This could be books, podcasts, anything that you've read or consumed that has just helped you personally or professionally.
Speaker 1:Oh yes.
Speaker 1:So as of recently, I not recently I have followed the Chronicles of Philanthropy, which I'm sure that you're very familiar with, and I absolutely love to follow and read because philanthropy is something that I feel very passionate about, but also it's meaningful to see where those connections are being met in order to meet the needs at the moment. It's interesting to see what is being funded, what is the priority for any giving organization, what is the trend in terms of, you know, support. Like you know, it's just very interesting to sort of like read from my perspective in the government space to see, like, what private funders are really thinking about in terms of priorities. And it's also exciting to see occasionally you know I followed the LinkedIn pages for a lot of these foundations to see what kind of initiatives are out there, what is in need of funding and also like what individuals are doing to support any given economic and social issue at the time. It gives you a good idea of what is happening in the world.
Speaker 1:So I stay connected through the Chronicle of Philanthropy, but I also, you know, I like to follow a lot of LinkedIn pages. I'm ashamed to say that I don't really follow the news, so I cannot help you there In terms of like live TV, I think in the past right, that has really stressed me back in the 2020, 2016 era. So, like I kind of like just follow the Washington Post, the Wall Street Journal and like articles such as the Chronicle.
Speaker 2:Is there anything else we have not discussed that the world should know about Zoyla?
Speaker 1:Look, thank you for the opportunity to have this very honest conversation. I, as I had told you in the past, it takes courage to have these open conversations with someone, so I'm glad that you sort of like give, gave me the, the, the safe space to to have them, and I think we should be comfortable having. You know these conversations about financial investment, talking about money, talking about you know, the pros and cons of government space, whether a law degree is, you know, needed, whether it was worth it. So thank you for having me and whatever I can do to support the audience that you're aiming to. I am very passionate about having conversations with people of color, to empower people of color, so thank you for having me.
Speaker 2:I appreciate that. You're an award-winning leader in your field, so we are just here to have a conversation and learn, so that others can hopefully follow in the footsteps and take bits and pieces of your story and apply it to their path. So thank you.
Speaker 1:You're very kind. Thank you for everything that you do, daddy. Of course I appreciate you.
Speaker 3:I hope you enjoyed this episode. If you did and believe on the mission we're on, please like, rate and subscribe to this podcast on whatever platform you're using, and share this podcast with your friends and your networks. Make sure you follow us on Instagram and LinkedIn at Career Cheat Code and tell us people or careers you would like to see highlighted. See you next week with some more cheat codes. Peace.
