A Vietnam Podcast: Stories of Vietnam

Being An Influencer, Starting A Blog, Break Ups and Dating In Saigon | Frances Fraser-Reid S4 E1

May 20, 2020 Niall Mackay Season 4 Episode 1
A Vietnam Podcast: Stories of Vietnam
Being An Influencer, Starting A Blog, Break Ups and Dating In Saigon | Frances Fraser-Reid S4 E1
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Show Notes Transcript

Recorded pre-quarantine, pre-lockdown this episode was intended to be the first of Season 3, recorded at Waves studio.

As you may well know, season 3 became the Quarantine Season and I haven't been able to record any more episodes yet for season 4.

So to celebrate one year of Seven Million Bikes I dusted down the file off the shelf and am releasing it for your listening pleasure as a bonus episode to start Season 4.

Look out for new episodes as soon as I am able to!

Frances is a travel blogger with the well-know blog So The Adventure Begins. She is also well-known for her pink Honda cub she is often seen driving around Saigon. She has been living in Saigon now for three years and is the first Scottish guest to join me on the show. Don't worry, you can understand us!

We talk about her not being an influencer, why she started a blog, breaking up and dating in Saigon, out homeland and of course Scottish accents.

There is the unplanned ubiquitous shout out as always for Matt Ryan! And his deep-fried Mars Bars.

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Theme music composed by Lewis Wright.
Main Cover Art designed by Niall Mackay and Le Nguyen.
Episode art designed by Niall Mackay

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Host; Niall Mackay  0:17  
Welcome to season three of 7 million Bikes A Saigon podcast, I'm very excited to be back. If you're a regular listener, sorry for the long way between season two and three, it's been exciting 7 million Bikes has kind of morphed kind of naturally into more than just a podcast knows who are no hosting comedy events around Saigon under 7 million Bikes, we have the podcast as well, and maybe some more exciting things in the pipeline. So if you're a regular listener, Thanks for your patience. If you're a new listener, you're listening for the first time thanks for tuning in. This podcast, we interview people from Saigon talk a bit about the background where the from how they ended up here, whether they're an expat, or a local, get to know them a bit. Because there's a lot of interesting people that live here. It's also really exciting to be back because we are in a proper studio for the first time. And I don't even know if people know this, but I actually been recording the last two seasons at home in the living room. And if you listen regularly, you know that this kit is normally sleeping next to me. So she's not here today. But we are in a proper studio thanks to waves who are a new podcast platform studio. They're just new in Vietnam. And so we want to say a massive thank you to waves for supporting podcasts in Saigon. Thank you very much to Ashley for helping set this up. I'm excited to introduce the first guest of season three. She's the first ever Scottish person first ever Scottish guests on 7 million Bikes. She's lived in Saigon for three years. And she also has a quite well known travel blog coder. So the adventure begins. And I had her been called an influencer this week, but she's shaking her head right now. So I'm going to introduce Francis Fraser Reed, thank you very much for coming to 7 million Bikes.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  2:04  
Thanks for having me on. 

Host; Niall Mackay  2:04  
So you're not an influencer, then.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  2:08  
I like to think that social media is a tool for sharing things, and not my main focus.

Host; Niall Mackay  2:15  
None of your friends had it. So Francis came to one of the comedy shows that I was just mentioning this week, and I just showed you two seats were just normal seats, and I held your friends here. Also, this is the influence of lifestyle. Did you hear

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  2:29  
I think that's because she was in the front row is that she was super excited.

Host; Niall Mackay  2:34  
To most people think that that's the worst seat though.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  2:36  
She just want to integrate view that was all right up front can see everything that's happening.

Host; Niall Mackay  2:42  
So tell us a bit about your blog then. So the adventure begin.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  2:45  
So the blog, it was basically started as a passion project. I have many people here, I'm a teacher. And the way that teaching errors are here, you end up with a lot of free time. So I was working in the evenings had all this free time during the day. I'm quite creatively minded and I just needed an outlet. So that was something that had been brewing for a while. And just I decided to launch it when I moved here, because I had all this free time to really like, get invested in it. And then just over the years, it's kind of morphed and become more and more of a, like a sharing platform for Saigon in particular.

Host; Niall Mackay  3:28  
So what's the focus then of the blog?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  3:31  
I will so I've been redesigning it. And it's the idea is now that it is more of an expat and Vietnam travel. So like the travel, I'm trying to get more towards expert travel within Vietnam. So I'm not really looking at like long term backpackers is mostly I want to really show people that while you're living here, and you are working here, you can still be travelling on these, like quick two day getaways these day trips from the city, even just like urban exploration of Saigon. So that's kind of my new angle that I'm trying this year. Because I know I mean, you're part of expat communities here, I have so many friends that don't either love it here. Or they don't really make the most of being somewhere that is this dynamic. And I just want them to, I guess have a tool that they can refer to and be like, Oh, this is a great day like we could do this. We could do this and give them all these different options.

Host; Niall Mackay  4:28  
definitely feel that that's something that's needed here is there is a gap that you saw that doesn't exist already.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  4:33  
Yeah. So that's why I'm sort of edging it towards this way is like being within all these communities for however many years. You can see where the gaps are. So like I started creating these events, posts on Facebook and sharing what was happening in Saigon each week through like, just like Facebook research like all the events bars are doing or, for example, your comedy events, these kind of things and compiling them into one place. So the experts Are you aware of what's going on? there? Were these like art classes are happening, or I guess, like, even like podcast, tutorials and stuff are happening. So it was more just I saw that there was a lot of experts being like, oh, there's nothing to do here. That's a lie. There's a lot to do here, you just don't know where to find it. So trying to provide that,

Host; Niall Mackay  5:22  
I think that's going to be really good. Because I do think it can be difficult to heal to find that information sometimes is a massive, massive city. And so sometimes it can be you forget how much is going on? But I've been here for four years, you've been here for three. So do you think that the amount to do has increased in that time? Do you think it's changed?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  5:41  
substantially, it's completely different, then again, I also have to look at it as in my first year, I wasn't really aware of where to look. Whereas now I'm quite like, I'm honed in and I know exactly where to go for different events, and how to find them. But I think even people coming now, probably, there's definitely a lot more, but even people coming now probably aren't aware of where to find it. So providing them with a resource where they can go to regularly and they know what they're going to get there. That's as needed. Because even even though there are a lot more events happening now, and I'm sure you becoming more involved in like the podcasting, and in the comedy sphere, you're aware of them a lot more. But for outsiders who maybe are new to the city, and they're not in those circles already, it's really hard to come across them.

Host; Niall Mackay  6:33  
That's a really interesting point. Because, yeah, when they're fine, just I feel like there's more events, but maybe I'm just more aware of them. Because when I first came four years ago, we always felt my wife and I we also there's nothing to hear, you know, apart from drinking, which I hear is a common thing for a lot of exposure that like there's nothing to do here but drink.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  6:53  
Well, it's a problem among the communities here is that a lot of people, they they work, they do their teaching, and then they come home. And their go to is to go to like an expat haunt like a bar that they frequent, often, and that is their social is to go to these bars that lots of other people go to and just hang out there. And that was kind of what I my view for the first year was also that I didn't really see that there was that much else happening, kind of why I started the blog as well.

Host; Niall Mackay  7:25  
And I do think it has changed in terms of comedy. For example, I remember when we first got here, there wasn't really much going on and started increase a little bit. And then Saigon funny people kind of took it to the next level. Now there's just more and more shows obviously I'm putting on shows as well, about music as well. I think music is increasing. But this this is a topic that comes up in Saigon quite often and we've talked about on the podcast before and actually their conversation this week with Lawrence young who runs a hochiminh, City expat non troll group if you know that one is no nearly like 10,000 members and how that's been a really great group because you know, his problem with trolling and on Facebook groups, you know, want to do a future episode, I want to find an online troll and see if there'll be interviewed. Oh, that would be and find out like why why do you troll because some of that being that we're getting on a sidetrack. But one of the common things we had the show this week, the comedy show, right? And we had about 17 people there, which pretty good and the shows I've been doing normally between 20 and 25 people. But Lauren said to me said Why is it not more people here? These are great events. Why is it not more people in here we've done meetup groups as well. And we had some good success in the beginning. But then we ended up people weren't coming in. And I said, Well, this is a conversation that we've had before on this podcast with Damian Willis who used to run cargo bar, which was in Saigon before my time so before us, and he was explaining that you know, he just getting people to come and wait come away from their bar, the haunt that you mentioned on boy vn and come to default to come in to you like an international class band is so difficult. And so I don't know, what do you think it is? And why? In a city so bright, vibrant, so big, so dynamic, there's so much art, so much creativity going on? Which maybe again, I'm just becoming more aware of it. But why is it when people come here just like me, they think, ah, there's nothing going on here.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  9:16  
I think it's kind of there's two main parts that is people come away expecting it to or they or they rather they come away and they they are looking for that home comfort, right? The regular sports while they're still like trying to find their feet here is challenging to live in Vietnam because the culture is so so different to I mean, we're both from Scotland is completely different to what we're used to. And I guess also it was a different type of social like, living here. It reminds me a lot of being at university. Because I mean, I don't have like my family around me here. I don't have those sort of, I guess like family responsibilities that I have to like you know, you have to go in To your grandparents, you have to do this, you have to do that. So we don't really have that, which frees up all of our time to hang out with friends, which is very reminiscent to University of me is like, I didn't live at home in your like during University years. So it was just all friends social. And I think experts are also into that. So like, there may be going from living in that home environment with their family around them and having all this stability and stuff. And they're coming here and they're just like, Whoa, I have so much free time. And I'm so lost. And I don't know what to do. And I'm in this foreign culture, and the language is completely different. It's really hard to connect with people. I'm just going to keep going back to that same bar that I saw a couple of people and I sparked up friendly conversation with and it just kind of escalates and that you get stuck in that rut of that's what you do every Friday, every Monday, every Tuesday whatever days.

Host; Niall Mackay  10:49  
And it's just that comfort. And the beer is so cheap. And it's so cheap. Now that I've never heard that comparison before Saigon for expats is just a big college town. It is. Yeah. I never thought about that before. Well, we

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  11:00  
also both live in what would be like the college area if Saigon was like in the dorm area. Yeah, if Saigon was a university, you know, like, we live right in the middle of where all the parties or I guess like social events are happening.

Host; Niall Mackay  11:16  
So what do we what do you think the your blog, also your new website, you think that's going to be a tool then to try and get people out more and get them out of that comfort zone?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  11:26  
I hope so. I mean, when I started it, it was it's been going for three years. So it's like every year, I kind of do like a facelift on it and try and hone in on my target for the year of like, what type of content I want to create. So it kind of started off just being like travel or like trips that you can take and it wasn't really focused on Vietnam so much. And I realised that that is actually the gap in the market is that people don't know what to do at home. They know like, oh, cool, you can go to Cambodia, you can see Angkor Wat, and you can go to Thailand, and islands and all this stuff and stuff. Because a lot of people that come here are travellers, but they then kind of get lost when they're in the big city because it's not quite as easy to think of things to do. I mean, it is it's a huge city. It's like an urban sprawl. And it's I remember thinking way, like years ago, like someone mentioned something about Ben tan about living there. And I was like, I would never would have been done. I don't really know what, what is there to do their I know, I have even just in my head like four or five great days out that you could do and Ben tan. And that's the kind of thing that I'm trying to put down on paper so that people can find it easily. And they can actually go to these different neighbourhoods and check them out and have a great day out there. without feeling this kind of like, Oh, I'm just like in my home city. Like, it's not as exciting as travelling, you know?

Host; Niall Mackay  12:45  
Yeah. And it just it's such a big city. And this has been here for years, and still finding new things all the time in new areas like Nintendo, Little Tokyo, little Japan area, like I only found out maybe a year ago, two years ago, maybe been here for a couple of years. And suddenly it's like, wow, I never knew this area existed, you know, and finding new bars. I wonder though, just how much people are seeking the information. I'm including myself in that. I mean, everyone just gets stuck in the in the Reimer

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  13:12  
this, my vision is to try and push people. Yeah. Because I have built some reasonable social following, which is predominantly people that are based in Saigon, not even just based in Vietnam, like actually in the city. So I'm hoping that they can kind of inspire people to not just get stuck in that rut of like going to the same bars. And literally their only social being drinking, you know,

Host; Niall Mackay  13:37  
we all have days off here, you know, you should make the most of them. I think living here is really interesting, because you really understand the true sense of the world of a developing country or developing city. And I mean, you can physically see it in Saigon, with the buildings coming up left, right and centre. But the Creative Arts in here in terms of English speaking, of course, because I don't speak Vietnamese, but I think even on the Vietnamese scene, as well as developing seems to be more and more happening. So I think that's really exciting terms of podcasting. You know, when I started this last just over just under a year ago, I think there was one other podcast in Saigon and I think that was like six or seven. That's really cool. Same with comedies. Well, when I first came, there wasn't much many shows going on. And no, there's just more and more live music seems to be springing back up. I think it seems to be more and more again, I don't know if I'm just noticing it or it's coming back. What do you think about the music scene here? Um,

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  14:29  
I think Well, I was always aware that there was like acoustic nights and there was sort of open mic things going on around the city. But I do think there's an increase in it. And also the the quality of these kind of events is increasing like the quality of the comedy, the quality of the live music. It's all going up, which is great. And I think what I'm finding really interesting to see is the the lines between the export culture and the local culture. are starting to, like blur a little bit, and they're becoming more and more intertwined. So for example, like, you know, Dana, who does the other podcast the creators in Saigon one, she has a co host now, who is Vietnamese. And it's just amazing that they're now starting to be able to have more reach. And really, I guess educate both English speakers and Vietnamese on the same topics. And the same with a lot of the art things that I've seen. I don't know if it's just I am quite creative, and I'm just finding these things through Facebook that I'm interested in, but like calligraphy workshops run by young saigonese artists or like water watercolours, all these different kind of, like poetry, like throwing Valtteri, all this sort of stuff is not being run by experts, which I actually really, really like, is being run by, like young artists in the city. I think that is so cool that it's just, it's bringing everyone to like a little bit closer together, considering it's super hard for us to really connect, unless English is spoken.

Host; Niall Mackay  16:11  
Do you speak Vietnamese?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  16:12  
By competing? We

Host; Niall Mackay  16:13  
don't know.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  16:14  
I don't understand.

Host; Niall Mackay  16:18  
Yes, I mean, that's the the thing I've noticed is, I feel like the level of English spoken here has increased so much would you would expect by the amount of English teachers that are here teaching English, you would expect to then see that but I feel like I can physically hear it. See it. In the four years I've been here. No, just everyone speaks English, I feel like which makes it I'm lazy. I completely admit I haven't tried, really. And the reason I haven't tried is because so many people speak English. It's hard to even try and speak Vietnamese. Because when you do even try not only is it difficult to speak, and then they don't understand you and you get embarrassed. And I just think it's crazy. So in terms of the art senior can see what you mean by like that blending together. But it's unfortunate because it's the Vietnamese people having to speak English to blend in with us. Right? Yeah. It's not as learning Vietnamese,

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  17:07  
not the right way.

Host; Niall Mackay  17:08  
Yeah.

But it's still I think, as I said, it's developing because we talked about this before with a woman too when she was on here. We talked about comedy doing comedy in Vietnamese, and how difficult it can be because the language is just so different to English, it doesn't lend itself the same way that we use English. For jokes like double entendre, timing and new ones tone of voice all of that kind of thing doesn't lend itself to Vietnamese. But now actually, we know when is an A bunch of others are opening on comedy in Vietnamese, which I obviously haven't been through yet. So I wouldn't be but understand about when you go and see just what what it sounds like. Because what is the enemies comedies traditional, very slapstick and clownish because that's the way you can get the humour across. But no, these guys are all starting to develop, doing comedy in Vietnamese. I'm excited to see how that goes.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  17:58  
It'd be really interesting to just even if you don't understand to go and observe and see how it's received. Yeah. Because I do think that maybe it's Saigon specific, not necessarily the whole country, but, like you said, is developing very fast. And it's because Saigon is so useful, right? Like the majority of the population here, they are young, they are creative. If you go to like, you know, the coffee house, the coffee house brand, I don't know why. But every single time I go into one of their coffee stores, I'm surrounded by these people who are working on their laptops, they're doing graphic design, or like, physically drawing, you know, I feel like our generation are very, very creative in Vietnam, specifically in Saigon. So if you just like super cool, too, I want to even just go and like, see the way that it's done in these Vietnamese events, even if we can understand just to go and like, check out

Host; Niall Mackay  18:51  
a sense of it.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  18:52  
Yeah.

Host; Niall Mackay  18:53  
I've just realised I didn't see this at the beginning. We have to Scottish people. We probably lost half the audience by No, because they can understand what we're seeing. Can't have subtitles on a podcast, can we? I don't know. I

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  19:05  
I feel like, I don't really have an accent. Most people forget. They don't even realise I'm Scottish. They're like, Huh, you know, from the States?

Host; Niall Mackay  19:12  
Yeah. It's very soft. I think mine is as well as I was. I

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  19:17  
say yours is too. But with us talking together.

Host; Niall Mackay  19:19  
It's gonna combat you faster. God, I've read in the weekend. I saw people sign as we speak in a Scottish accent. I can't eat it anymore. But that's

me. I can do it better than Kenya.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  19:31  
Pretend to be my sister. You know.

Host; Niall Mackay  19:40  
If we hadn't lost half the audience, we've lost the other half now already. It's interesting, Rachel. I get it all the time. Right. Can you help me do comedy and I mean, lots of jokes about it. But I mean, two types of people, right, all on a daily basis. Sometimes I'll meet them like next to each other. And one of them will say to me, you got a really strong accent. You know that Am I really? I don't think I do. And have you ever been to Scotland now? Have you been in the UK now? Alright, and then peasant eczema. I was gonna say your accent is really clear and I can understand you really well. And I see did you live in the UK? Or have you been in a black gay? Yeah, I lived there. I could barely understand anyone but I can understand you. So it's interesting. It's all about like, you know, the person listening

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  20:21  
perception. Yeah, like their background, right? Yeah, like lens to it.

Host; Niall Mackay  20:25  
Do you get something similar? Oh, you people can pick up your Scottish accent?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  20:28  
No, I tend not to even get Scottish as tends to be. Where are you from? In the States? Not even Are you from America? Where are you from? And in the States? And then if I'm like, Oh, I'm not from the states like, oh, shoot. Are you from Canada? I don't know, like, completely wrong continent. How did this happen?

Host; Niall Mackay  20:46  
To my my sister is probably sounds more similar to you. She lived although she lives in Australia, she's lived in New America for a bit, took on the American accent quite a bit. So she's got really kind of soft that it's not a strong Scottish accent and a bit like you're a little bit American. And she gets confused for American law. Two of my cousins were actually brought up in the Bahamas, which is all American accents. And for a long time they were they had proper American accents. And now they've come back and it's gone back to Scottish. But when I was last home in July, I was sitting down my grandfather's birthday party to sit next to my cousin, the one I'm talking about, he went new, you still got such a strong Glasgow accent, really. But that's my own family telling me this when

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  21:29  
you go home. So like here, right now, it depends on who you're talking to talking to me, you're probably like a lot more relaxed. Not even, like consciously thinking about your voice at all. But when you're talking to maybe like Vietnamese people who don't speak super, super fluent English, you're a little more conscious, right. And as soon as I find it also, the last time I went home, and just like two days in and I slipped back into a thicker accent just because you don't even think about it anymore. But it was actually funny you say that because I mean, I am a teacher. And I teach a lot of low age groups. And my mom, like a couple of days after I got home, I was like, you can speak in full sentences. Like, we're not we're not babies. We know what you're saying. Like you can speak in full sentences now. Like, I didn't even realise that I was speaking broken English like you want Sit down. Mom's like, you can say like, do you want to sit down?

Host; Niall Mackay  22:28  
You know, before we came to Vietnam, before we became English teachers, we were warned about this by my wife's sister who's worked in the industry for a long time. And she's like, your English will get worse as you teach English because you create your language more. But I had something similar happen again, same trip, I went back home in July. And I saw one of my best friends Gary that hadn't seen in a really long time. And he came in the bar. And I can't remember exactly what I said. Hey, how are you doing? Gary? Good to see you again. And he looked at me when you know I can speak English, right? You do need to talk to me like I'm a foreigner. I was like, Oh, I just didn't even do because I'm normally normally if you are a Gary, how are you going? You're a you're being seen just his face, which is hilarious. The

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  23:12  
other thing I realised a lot was that I use such big gestures now. Everything I do, I'm like, Oh, yeah, like, Can you hear me, like using my hand to really like, tell the story so much more than people do. Normally at home, I just became very aware of it. Like observing my friends at a table. And I was like, Oh my god, I need to like set my hands or something right now like this is too much.

Host; Niall Mackay  23:38  
And part of the reason I bring this up is because we just had a review in Vietnam or a magazine, which was amazing. They reviewed for podcasts. And it's been really cool. I've seen the magazine and a couple of places they'll be now and I've been like looking up and and like see, we didn't take a copy. He's meant he says when you send me the copy, I've got him send him a message. He's sending me a physical copy. But the reason I bring it up and he called my accent unusual sounding, which I thought was harsh. And I told him that I said that's a bit harsh. He said unusual sewn into his ear. And he said that some people have trouble understanding with the thing. Yes, yeah, of course. That's why I'm wondering how people are reacting to listening to to Scottish

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  24:25  
people you may need to subtitle

Host; Niall Mackay  24:26  
Yeah, well, you can do the transcripts. Yeah, maybe we'll do the transcript. But then so I posted that on Facebook. I like a picture of the review. tagged, hey, Susan. And I was like, hey, I've just been told I have an unusual sounding accent. How does it sound to you? And one of the listeners may see it and she's like, no, I can understand you fine. It's okay. So

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  24:46  
she'll be safe, hopefully.

Host; Niall Mackay  24:47  
Yeah, she'll be alright. So what brought you to Saigon then, um,

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  24:51  
I knew that I didn't really want to work in the field that I was studying. So I was looking at options in my last year. University have different things that I could do in different parts of the world. And teaching was the one that jumped out as the best option for me. And I'd been to Thailand a couple of years before that, and really loved it fell in love with Thailand. It was like, Yes, there we go. I got to go back. And I can explore more of Thailand. I can live there and work there. And I have some friends who had just done like Cambodia, Thailand, and Vietnam is like a trio of backpacking countries. And they came back and they were like, Oh, so you want to move to Thailand. And they're like, Francis VMs, kind of better than Thailand. And I was like, Oh, well, I love Thailand. So if you're saying is even better than I think I need to go to Vietnam. And I'd never been here before I was I had a job. I had, like, everything lined up ready to go, and I'd never even set foot in the country and my friends and my family. Were just like, you're a little bit crazy. You don't want to go for like, a couple weeks for like a holiday just to see if you like it.

Host; Niall Mackay  25:57  
Excuse me depends. I mean,

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  25:59  
yeah, I had my job before I even graduated University.

Host; Niall Mackay  26:02  
What did you study?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  26:03  
I studied biology, right? So literally, nothing that I do right now is related to what I studied. And I just I never really clicked with it. I knew that I didn't enjoy it whilst I was studying it. And it was more just I continued because if I left, I had nothing to show for a couple years of work. Whereas if I completed my degree, I had a degree. And as far as teaching, having a degree is pretty important. A mumble was said, you know, it's, it's fine. You got it in your back pocket. It gets you into a lot of things.

Host; Niall Mackay  26:36  
So should you remember your first impressions of Saigon when you when you landed?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  26:41  
I was super overwhelmed.

Host; Niall Mackay  26:43  
Yeah, I think that's probably the most common word to use. Right? Um,

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  26:46  
I remember being like, I had a layover in Doha or something. And I didn't pack very well. So you know, like normally if you're going on like a trip you pack like a spare change of clothes and your carry on just in case something happens.

Host; Niall Mackay  27:00  
No, I've never done that. Wait what?  

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  27:02  
Have you not?

Host; Niall Mackay  27:02  
You bring s spare change of clothes with you?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  27:06  
Yeah , you should like you know, you like keep your toothbrush in your carry on you keep like, whatever it is you want to do in the aeroplane, like a book, your electronics, whatever. And you should keep like a spare change clothes like a pair of like clean underwear socks t shirt, 

Host; Niall Mackay  27:20  
In case you shit yourself?

Unknown Speaker  27:20  


Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  27:20  
This happens what happened to me. All right, go, Oh, my luggage got lost in transit. Right. So I arrived in Saigon, for my like, very first evening in jeans. And like the biggest trainers I owned that were just clunky, and like, really ugly. So I because you know, you don't want to pack all the small things you want to know you don't want to wear all the small things. You want to pack the big things so that they don't take up as much weight, right? So I'm wearing like big thick jeans, long sleeve t shirts.

Host; Niall Mackay  27:50  
I got like a scar. No, no, it was gonna be here that you didn't need any of that stuff.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  27:54  
I mean, I knew but I also was hoping that as soon as I landed, I could change into like more comfortable items. Except they were like, yeah, your luggage isn't gonna be here for three days. So my first three days in Saigon, I was wandering around in this same pair of jeans. And I was like, I have to go and buy some t shirts. I can't wear long sleeve t shirts. I'm literally a puddle of sweat right now. Oh, it was horrible. So my first experience that kind of unpleasant one.

Host; Niall Mackay  28:21  
Well, I've talked about this before as well, because I found it really challenging. in Saigon. Like my first year I hated it here. I wanted to leave I couldn't I was counting down the days. What, in some of the biggest challenges that you've had here? Because you've obviously know seemed pretty settled here.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  28:36  
It's actually funny you say that? Because I was exactly the same. Yeah, after the first Well, it was about a year and a half. And I was desperate to go. I was super like I had itchy feet. I was ready to go and travel. I'd had enough of, of teaching, but I'd also had enough of just the general lifestyle, you know, like going through the same bars and drinking the same places. And it was actually at that point, I went through a breakup with the person that had moved here with

Host; Niall Mackay  29:05  
Oh you had moved here with somebody?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  29:05  
yeah, four and a half years went through the breakup here. So I guess that was the biggest challenge. But it was, it was a really great turning point in terms of self growth, because it made me really reassess what I was doing, who I was surrounding myself with making sure that I was in a place that I was actually happy to be. And it's really funny because I was in that place that you just mentioned where I was desperate to leave. And now I'm like I really can't leave I like so sold and like in love with where I live and the friends that I have and just the whole lifestyle. I don't want to give up. And that was like the the breakup was the turning point where I just had to sit and like reevaluate where we're spending my time here. This is kind of why I want to showcase this other side of Saigon. It's actually not the other side. This side of Saigon that people should really Have as their main Yeah.

Host; Niall Mackay  30:02  
The challenges come back to that, again, I think is where people just get stuck right. We talked about the D7 bubble like I know people that live in D7 they admittedly never leave I know people that live in D2 in the Thao Dien bubble. There was a girl in my building came to one of my comedy shows at one Saigon, which is the other side of D two and that was like far for her. Just the other side of town. dn sorry for calling. Yo, have you ever listened to this, Nicole? You know what I mean? So I think a lot of the experts just get stuck there in him. It's a shame because yeah, I think this is a great city one, but you do need to make the effort.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  30:35  
Yeah, a lot of people do find themselves getting kind of miserable. But it's the same way that they would be miserable working at home living and doing the same things week in week out. And I think variety here is super important. But the other the other side of that is do as locals do, and you'll enjoy yourself way more, instead of only eating at selected Western restaurants or at very fancy places going for cocktails, do what locals do here, go and eat street food and go to the markets and see the sight of Vietnam that is like super alive. You know, go for beers on the side of the canal, like do all those cool things that young Vietnamese people are doing. And it will spark more love for the fact that like, a lot of people live here and they go about their lives as if they were living anywhere else. When really you should be living life like people do here. Yeah. And it will make you enjoy it way more. That's basically what I started doing.

Host; Niall Mackay  31:39  
Yeah, cool. Yeah. No, it's good advice.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  31:42  
Because it's not it's not to say that you shouldn't be going out and maybe going and having some cocktails on a rooftop bar. That's lovely. But I think is finding a balance between, I guess, living a boozy lifestyle and a more local lifestyle and blend the two together? No, you find the right balance for you.

Host; Niall Mackay  32:05  
No, I completely agree. I think that's probably maybe the turning point. Maybe partly, for me, I don't have an exact moment. But I like to think that me and my wife, we do that gamut. In a way we can go out and have a boozy cocktail night and go out to a rooftop bar. But then next year, we can be going to the market and having like 20,000, bar, car, things like that, and getting out there going to different places. And I think it's good advice. If anyone is listening, if they're in a rut or thinking what can I do is just, you just got to get out and see as much as you can take advantage of living here. Because if you do just treat it like a normal like you live. And I know I do know some people that do that. They just treat it like a normal job, the normal life, day to day. And don't take advantage of the fact that we live in this really dynamic, different city.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  32:47  
Well, I like the fact that you arrived with a nuoc mia, I did too. And I think that just goes to show like, those are small things right? Like stop at the side of the road when you're driving past and get yourself some street juice. Because it's great. Like,

Host; Niall Mackay  33:01  
I just had two small things that you can't do that back home, go and get a look me that was 12,000 dong. Depends on what currency you want to use. It's 50 cent right

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  33:08  
for people who don't know what nuoc mia is, it's sugar cane juice. Yeah, you see them like grinding it down on the side of the road. But we don't get that in the UK. We don't get that even in Europe. Yeah. I mean, Latin America, I think you get that. But I don't think you get that in the US. And it's really funny. I was having a pool day the other day with some friends. And I was like, Oh, do you guys want to nuoc mia? I'm getting myself some. And one of my friends was like, Yes. Oh my God, give me two. And the other girl was like, I don't know what you're talking about? Sure. And she's the she's just hit her two years here. She's like, I don't know what you're talking about. I brought her one. And she was like, well, this is great. What is this? And I was like, You literally drive past four or five people selling list every day, on your way to school?

How did you not know this was here? 

And she's like, well, I'm gonna get this all the time. But it's those small things that like if you just, if you scratch a wee bit, and you learn some of the things that you can do like the local foods that you can eat or just the the hotspots that you can go to to so for example, next to that Wam bar that you did your comedy event is a super beautiful sunset spot. And loads of people have now started to go there because it is it's really relaxing. You get to watch the river, there's people making smoothies and all different types of barbecue food. And if you indulge in those things, it makes your experience way more enjoyable here.

Host; Niall Mackay  34:31  
And I'm no like expert because I still get surprised by things and I'm like, Well, how did I not know? What is that? And so I'm not like judging people like if you don't know, but yeah, there are some people like how did you not know about this?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  34:43  
It's more I quite like the innocence of it. And like just seeing the delight in her eyes was like oh my god, sugarcane juice. I'm sold, I'll have this this all the time.

Host; Niall Mackay  34:51  
And it's funny I wonder if Vietnamese people just think that we're all weird that we get so excited by sugar cane juice like yeah, nuts. Just so weird why you get so excited? To go back a step? Does your boyfriend still live here?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  35:07  
He does. So

Host; Niall Mackay  35:09  
ex boyfriends or ex boyfriend of two years time ago, but what I was gonna ask so we know that the expat community's small. Any breakup is obviously difficult. How is that here in Saigon again being away from family? And then also, I would imagine still being in the same circles and things like that.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  35:28  
Yeah, it was kind of convenient timing, because we both already resigned from our jobs. And we were both ready to travel, you

Host; Niall Mackay  35:34  
Oh you called your relationship a job?

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  35:41  
I'm sorry if you're listening.

No, but it was just convenient timing that we were both in a position to leave the city and take some time for ourselves. And we did just that he went off on his trip, I went off of my trip. And by the end of the summer, when we both came back, we were in a much better headspace as far as potentially bumping into each other or being in social events, friends, birthdays, and such. And I mean, time does, obviously help. But nowadays, like I can go for fall with him and catch up based on like, what's happening at home and how work is and stuff. And I think it takes a level of maturity that if I was at home, I wouldn't have if I had been at home surrounded by what I was comfortable with, I wouldn't have been put into a position where I had to be okay with it. I think going through a breakup here is a million times harder than going through it at home, because you really don't have the family support that you crave. It also just depends on your social circumstances, right? Like, how many friends do you have that you would consider close friends.

And I'm very lucky,

Host; Niall Mackay  36:56  
because you can make friends. But there's a difference between like, you know, I mean, my best friends, I grew up with still my closest best friends, even though I don't see them very often, you know,

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  37:05  
which is actually kind of interesting, because I would say my closest friends are now in Saigon. And I think going through a breakup and then having multiple friends go through it, too, has really helped us bond over a shared struggle. And it's, I think, also, I had a moment where I had like a breakdown, not over the breakup, but over feeling alone here. And I was just like, oh my god, I don't actually have any friends, like, what am I doing? And then forced me to go and even though surface level friends to become more intimate with them and say like, Hey, I'm going through this, and I'm really sorry to be a burden on you. But would you mind helping me out a little bit? And those are some of the best friendships that I have now. That's awesome. So I think going through a breakup here is obviously terrible. But there are definitely silver linings in it in the new friendships, and just that you're in like a cool place to where you have this free time you have potentially financial freedom to sit and reassess what takes for you, independently of anyone else? But yeah, I don't know. It's not a fun experience for anyone I

Host; Niall Mackay  38:20  
know. I'm sure. One of the reasons I'm gonna bring it up is because I've talked about this before with other guests on the podcast, is the difficulty of being a female expat in Saigon.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  38:31  
I don't feel it. So more. Yeah.

I don't really see that it's not that different from being a guy here.

Host; Niall Mackay  38:39  
Okay.

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  38:40  
But maybe that's just because I'm confident in myself.

Host; Niall Mackay  38:45  
Well, even in terms of we mentioned trolling earlier, you know, like it to the point where there has to be groups for female experts. And we've interviewed Susan, who's one of the founders of that,

Guest; Frances Fraser-Reid  38:54  
the female expat group who's got a very great energy to it. And I think is, it's unfortunate that there are these trolls. And it's not to say that the trolls are all guys. But I think the female expat group has a lot of a lot of people who rally together and shut people down instead of egging them on. So if anyone does say anything offensive in any of the female groups, the other girls that are there will shut them down and be like, That's not fair.

Like, what are you doing? Instead of in the guy groups? I feel like there's like 10 other people in the back like Yeah,

what are you saying?

like, yo, yo, like, racist, comment, misogynistic comment, like just pile them all on? You know? I don't I don't really see that there's not much difference. I think a lot of people moving here maybe, like a little bit more scared of safety as a girl. never really felt it myself. But maybe I'm just very lucky. I'm quite lucky. Confidence in going out and making sure that nothing stops me. So I don't feel I actually feel very, very safe walking around at night here. Maybe the neighbourhood that I'm in as well.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai