Mind Your Own Dog Business

Million Dollar Sales, Egos, Failing Dogs & Employees with Emily Nolan

November 05, 2019 Kristen Lee Episode 25
Mind Your Own Dog Business
Million Dollar Sales, Egos, Failing Dogs & Employees with Emily Nolan
Show Notes Transcript

In today's episode of Mind Your Own Dog Business, Kristen Lee sits down with Emily Nolan, where they talk about the biggest threats to dog trainers in 2020, million-dollar sales processes, and how it's OKAY to fuck shit up and fail while keeping a strong team of employees that will always have your back.

Emily is a strategic badass that has gone from picking up dog shit in kennels to being the owner of one of the most successful and largest dog training facilities on the east coast.

Kristen and Emily both share their thoughts on how the dog training industry needs a more inclusive community, 40k sales weeks and why it's okay to fail dogs and their owners.

Links:

Connect with Emily:

Emily's show: Between 2 Dogs

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/EmilyRebeccaNolan/

Check out more episodes of Mind Your Own Dog Business

Connect with Kristen:

Online: https://thekristenlee.com 

Instagram: @dogwalkercoach

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/kristenleegrassroots


Speaker 1:

You're listening to the mind your own dog business podcast. I'm your host leading expert in dog business strategics, Kristen, late guys, yet ready for your journey, your journey to cutting edge marketing and sales, creating a standout kick ass dog business and brand along with mastering your mindset that's going to smash all of this glass ceilings that have been holding you back and catapult your dog was to the next level with actionable steps you can take right away. We're going to empower you. We're going to grow you as you step into your authentic self, not only as a dog trainer, dog Walker or what ever slice the pet industry you find yourself in, but as that bad-ass entrepreneur, my mission is to disrupt the current norm. Cut through the noise, cut through the bullshit and power the incredible women of the dog business industry to step into the spotlight, reclaim, control, and transform not only their businesses but their lives. It's real. It's raw, it's uncensored, and it's what this dog business industry needs. Let's do this

Speaker 2:

nice[inaudible][inaudible].

Speaker 1:

All right, everybody. Welcome to today's episode of the mind, your own dog business

Speaker 3:

podcast. Hosted by your favorite rebel with the potty mouth that matches Kristin fucking Lee dies. Listen, I'm so fucking excited because I have a special yes, somebody that I want to be when I grow up even though she's like five years younger than me. She is one of the most successful dog training facility owners on the East coast. She is the leading franchise and her dog, a business company. Emily motherfucking Nolan MLA. Hi. Hi Christen. Thanks for having me. Yeah, awesome. Totally. Well thank you for coming on and like legitimately guys like all my listeners are going to be super excited to listen to us because like I said, like I've known Emily for going on about three years as a colleague, as a peer and as just a powerful bad-ass in the dog industry. Like I know it's like you have all these big names out there and then it's my goal to bring these names to the households because Emily, you are such a fucking bad-ass. I'm like so excited to have you on here right now. Thank you Chris, and I'm excited to be here. You know, I look up to you too. You're doing some great stuff out there. I'll stop it. We're going to circle jerk guys for an hour. We can mean Emily's circled jerk for hours. Cute. No, no, you're cool. No, you're bad ass. The circle jerk is real. So, um, I figured I want to try something a little bit new for my guests on here. I want to do a few rapid fire questions. Just tell me the first thing that comes to your mind or the first thing that you think of. So Emily, where are you based? I am in Charlotte, North Carolina. Fuck yeah, you are like, what, two hours South of me? South East of me? Yeah, I think so. I'm pretty close. Nice. And you have a Oh guys, by the way, by the way, I know. I'm already deviating from the rapid fire questions. Go into the Charlotte dog wizards Facebook page. They have the most Epic fucking murals on their OSS. All right, cool. So, um, how long have you been in the business of dogs?

Speaker 4:

About eight years. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3:

It's fucking long time. And you're young too. I am 31. So how long have you been managing employees?

Speaker 4:

Well, that's a great one. Um, five, seven of those years.

Speaker 3:

Oh shit. Do you feel like you were kind of just dropped into like a management role? Like a reluctant management role?

Speaker 4:

I was. I'm also one of those people that just kind of does it, you know, like I'm a bossy person and I sometimes will just take the lead naturally so that upon come by that naturally a lot. Whether people like it or not.

Speaker 3:

Well what are you, you're an Instagram eight, right? I'm an eight. The challenger challenger. Yeah guys, I get it again, deviate. I gotta tell you. So I was at this one time, I was at this one retreat with Emily when I first fucking met her and it was a really intense moment and to really put into perspective Emily's challenger, she fucking stood up in front of a whole group in brand new business, not brand new business owners, but people that just met for the first time and challenge the motherfucking facilitator. And it was the most, a big thing. And then I developed a lady boner for Emily[inaudible]. Oh wow. Thanks Chris. And I forgot about that. Yeah, that was pretty cool. But that's, it really shows who you are. So it's a really fricking crazy. Um, so what would you say your superpower is?

Speaker 4:

Well, actually, probably that, I mean, this is an interesting question. I, the super power question I love, um, because I think that people's super powers are both like, uh, light and dark, you know what I mean? It's not just, Oh, this is what I'm so good at. And it's just always positive. The superpowers can also be like an evil superpower. And it's that challenging aspect of me. Like I see things, I'd have to say stuff about it. It's really hard to temper sometimes that works in my favor and that's great. And it works for other people too and it's like helpful. And then sometimes it gets me in trouble. So,

Speaker 3:

yeah. So I think too, like when you have more of like a D, like a natural, a challenger at notch, it's almost like a rebel style side of you. It's like there's authenticity that like really opens up opportunities, but then if like somebody else has a totally different personality, they take it as like, almost like they like react to it versus observe it. Like I've see that a lot, like a ton of people. They're like, Oh my gosh, she doesn't like me or she's a bitch or whatever. Right. And it, it's like now it's like embracing that but also having the dark side of it too. So it's fun. I can talk about, maybe I'll have you on another episode for a week and talk about the Enneagram and shit like that. Wow. So what is the last thing you accomplish that you are so fucking proud of? Like, tell me about that.

Speaker 4:

Wow. Um, you know, last thing that I was really proud of, the really last scary thing that I was really proud of that I accomplished was I recently bought a property, this was very recent, like a couple of weeks ago. I finally close on a property. It's the first, it's a house and 30 acres of land here in Charlotte. And it was one of the most mentally challenging things I've ever done. Um, you know, I'm 31, I'm single, I carry a lot of responsibility with this business and just going through the like mental work throughs of commitment to that space. Is it right? And I'm sure everyone who's purchased land or property before, uh, experienced that on some levels, but there's so much about this space that was not non traditional. Like I said, it's like it's kind of a weird 30 acre, you know, fairy land and um, and risky in some ways and it still might be risky. Who knows? Like there was no way of knowing, but working up, leading up to it. I mean, there was days when I had to like talk myself off the ledge and I see how hard it is to kind of do something like that, especially alone. So any women out there that are buying a house or moving forward in their life alone, it can be hard sometimes. And I was really proud of myself to make it to the finish line with that for sure.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. So I was, I was there to witness part of it and it was just really interesting to see your, your whole process around it because at first I remember when you were like, it was back in July. And me and Emily connect a lot usually because we're so close to each other. And I remember you're just like, I'm just going to go with it. I'm just gonna go with it. And he's actually to the day you fucking close. You were just like, if it happens, it happens. But then like towards the end you started to getting a little bit stressed, but to see that whole process because I personally know buying a, how I bought three houses over the last couple of years, especially a fucking almost million dollar or$1 million property, I couldn't even imagine. So I feel that is something to be so fucking proud of and yeah, it's just been an honor to watch that process with you too and you sharing it. So thank you so much.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, I mean it was a big deal. I really, um, for, I, I definitely, I've definitely cried about it a couple of times. And here's the joy and stress along the way. So, so I'm going to ask you a question that you probably not gonna like when you earn the first million in the dog training business, what did it feel like? Um, Hmm. I mean, that's an interesting question. You know, I share this business Island business partner, Danielle and I, um, what did it feel like? I mean, we celebrate a lot our successes together and it's not like these nice, you know, it's not, so I'm tripping over the words now. Nope. Attachment to that in number at the end of the year.[inaudible] I don't know if that is good or bad. I think it's actually what keeps me sane probably. Um, we get really excited about, she's like my wife now, you know, they get really excited about things like the property or even smaller, like just little moments of success that we've had and challenges. And that number is never really the big, like it's, we just try to keep it in perspective. Does that answer your question?

Speaker 3:

No, I know it does. It does. Totally. Because like, so this is what I see. I see a lot of dog business owners, dog trainers, like they always have this magical number in their head. Like if it's like the first hundred K or their first quarter million, the first$500,000. And it's like the more you're attached to that specific number, like when you start to base your identity around it. And that's what I wanted to ask you about, cause I know how you feel around it and this is why it's so important to talk about it is it's like the more you don't hit that number, the more people start to beat them fucking selves up. And it's like no, it's like cool. Yeah I hit my first seven figures, but now it's like, all right, that's not the big, it's like the big picture, but it's not the big fucking picture. You know what I mean? So it's like you're not beating your fucking self up if you don't make the sales. I go to that.

Speaker 4:

No, and I, I'm not and um, has to be that way. Cause I think that for me I would get really[inaudible], I would get really kind of mentally imbalanced if I was constantly keeping a toll. Although sometimes I do like challenges just like on a small scale. Like I'll try to do, cause I focus a lot on sales and that's a big part of my day in life. I'll like challenge myself, can I, can I do a 20 K week? Can I do a 40 K week of on sales or you know, whatever with the month or I need to fill some spots, this and that. So I like to do that on a small scale and I don't put it on the big scale. Like if I don't, there's no end number besides, you know, us paying our bills and feeling secure that matters to me.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. Yeah. And that's, and that's also too, something I wasn't planning on connecting with you about, but like Emily guys like Emily's a fucking sales goddess, warrior slash fucking crusher. I had the opportunity to watch her help me with this. She helped me with a sales call a few weeks ago and I was just sitting there, I was like, Oh my God, this is so awesome. I'm like, Emily, can I hire you to do my sales? And it's like, it shows the value. Like, cause a lot of a lot of dog trainers and business owners, like they get really fucking freaked out around the wholesales concept and, but at the end of the day, I think you nailed it really like really good Emily. It's like, Hey, if you're not attached to the number, like yeah, you can challenge yourself, challenge your fucking self, but don't be so attached to number where you're not going either perform or are you going to fucking beat yourself up over it?

Speaker 4:

Yeah. Sales are ballon. Like I was saying this to someone earlier today that, uh, you know, I think that, did you just say that people kind of avoid it or are scared of sales? Did I just make all said that?

Speaker 3:

So going back to sales. So I think what happens and what I've seen with my clients and through grassroots is people get the story work to on their head. But what I see on the outside perspective of people that might be listening to this podcast, you know, people that come to you, Emily as prospective clients, um, that are other dog business owners is they feel like the title in the work goes first before sales.

Speaker 4:

Hmm. Yeah. But really sales is everything.[inaudible] is everything and nothing, you don't need to be attached to it. But like when you can just kind of make it such a fluid part of your life where you understand that this is a part of my day, my life, my interactions with people, that sales is just communication and connection. It's a lot easier. And, and that's what keeps people from burnout around sales. I think when they put this pressure, like this thing that you're talking about, the money, the outcome attachment, like that's where you start that. I think it's like phase one of burnout is when you start talking like that because you have to make sales to have a business. But you have to have a good, healthy relationship with it to stay alive.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. Did you, so I got to ask you, because me and you went through the same sales training, do you feel that was something you've learned from proper sales training or it's something you learned from experience

Speaker 4:

of actually doing sales? I was, I have, um, I think that we, we were exposed to some really awesome salespeople, you and I, and that was very helpful and then it was able, it was something that I was able to bring into my practice and I noticed that, I know we're tangenting on sales now, but like your approach is, is a little bit different than mine. Your personality is different than mine. Your life experiences different than mine. And so all of that is coming across when you're having making these connections with people. And same with me. So I was able to take a lot from our training and then build it into a practice, like I said, and, and um, it's been really helpful and also learn stuff that's not going to work from, for me. From that, you know, like, like other, there's other parts of it where I saw maybe some cracks and it doesn't, doesn't make sense to me. So all of it. Yeah.

Speaker 3:

Fucking Lily. And I think too, I know we're on this the sales rabbit hole and I really want to get into managing employees because I feel like a lot of people want to talk about that. Um, but I feel like with sales, like, and what I see and what I see, and this is what kind of grinds my gears, it's like when I see other, you know, people in the industry, not only just, you know, other dog business coaches, grassroots is totally different. But when I see other people like talk about, you know, selling and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, they're like, Oh, don't sell. Don't get them to say yes every time or sell without feeling sleazy. And the beauty of it, and that's what you've experienced is what I've experienced. That's what a lot of our clients have experienced is that like when you're having that emotional connection but you're not really attached to the yes or the no with them. That's where the fucking beauty happens. And that's where you actually show up and you start to actually see if a client is potentially coachable. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. So it's like,

Speaker 4:

yep, go ahead. No, you're absolutely right. It starts there. The client relationship starts the moment that like, well, I mean maybe even before it, but that first conversation or meeting of however people do it, that's where the coaching relationship starts. So either it starts and ends there and that's it. And you've got like impacted that person's life in that moment or not or whatever. It wasn't a good fit or you're beginning the process, but it's not a separate thing. And I think that that's the point that I try to make a lot with people. It's like this, it's not like, okay, we did sales and now we're doing the cert, the training, or now they're a client, it's their client and it's either the lifetime of that one call or it's 10 years, whatever.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. Yeah, totally. And also too, it's like, I feel like for dog trainers especially, cause I do dog training sales too on a very, very small scale now. But it's like you can actually see if this owner is going to show up and actually do the work. Cause like what a dog trainers complain about a lot of the time or even dog walkers, they complained that people don't do the fucking work and it gets them frustrated. So anyway. All right, cool. I know we went on a long tangent about sales, but I think that was really good. Um, so this is my, this is my question to you. What do you think, and from your perspective as a large facility owner, what do you think and feel that the biggest challenge to dog kinders is going to be in 2020, whether it's economy, whether that's E color bands. Um, what do you think, like what do you feel in your gut and what you have you seen out there?

Speaker 4:

Gosh, I think that, you know, so maybe I don't have the answer in relation to 2020 as it like on a broader scale. The biggest challenge that I see for dog trainers is the lack of community.[inaudible] it's, I[inaudible] I mean it's such a big deal and whether you're a person, it's not about being an introvert or an extrovert or like I have to have friends or whatever. There is a subtle quiet, you know, and loud sometimes war that goes on between dog trainers, right? Like there we're all aware of like schools of thought and camps. Um, there is this mirroring of agendas almost like political, it's almost like looking at like the political, uh, climate. I see a reflection of that in dog training. Like schools have camps, people battling each other, both people wanting essentially maybe even sometimes the same things, but their own egos getting in the way with it. And that is just, it's tiring and exhausting and it, and it's like holding us back. And then on the individual level you feel very alone. I, um, I lucked out maybe in a lot of ways. I'm also just like a community minded person. Uh, so I have like our crew here, I have the grassroots crew. I've connected in a lot of different spaces. I've got like, you know, just you Kristin, like you see people that helped me keep going and have opened up my world as a dog trainer and to not, and I know a lot of people out there don't have that and they're just the solo trainer, you know, working out of their house, trying to get by and it and feeling like, gosh, I know trainers that like won't train in front of other trainers or they won't even ask a question because they're afraid of the, the feedback or the criticism and that's where it is. There's like a shaming that really keeps, suppresses the community across the board in my opinion.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I've seen it too. Like I'm not part of any like dog training groups, like the free groups or whatever that like are like bounced traders or R plus trainers or whatever. But I've seen it like from my clients now, like I've heard it from my clients now. It's, it's like if you go and ask a question or if you post a video for feedback, it's literally like a fucking hazing. And it's like, no, what the hell?

Speaker 4:

Yeah. Yeah. Like those groups aren't really that helpful. I, you know, I've done so many, uh, I've been to different people's talks and seminars. I see the same thing there. I see it. But like, even the people that are out there that are maybe in leadership roles, whether they chose to be or not, uh, that are promoting the idea of this should be open and we should be helping each other. They're even not so much I see them. You know what I mean? Like there's a lack of empathy, uh, that and where does it come from? Is it that people are just insecure in themselves so they can't like, cause I'm going to tell you all right now and whoever, you know, the whole podcast world, I'm not the best trainer. We're not the top of the cream of the crop, but we do good work and our clients love us. We're out here like making what work for people like myself and like I'm the best and I'd want a million gold medals and I know everything. And how could I ever know everything? And when you can take your ego away from it. That ego piece is just so it's getting, it's fucking up. Everybody, in my opinion, that's what's holding 2020 maybe even 2021 I don't know if it's going to go away. I hope it holds. I hope that we're kind of moving away from that.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, I mean I've S you know, I've heard the personal stories from you and from other people. It's like, you know, these people, they get kind of like pushed into these leadership roles or they're, they're establishing leadership roles and I'm like, I'm cool if somebody wants to put themselves in a place of authority, but you can be an authoritative leader, you can be a recognized leader, but you don't have to be a douchebag about it. You don't have to be a fucking con about it either. You know what I mean? So it's like when people, and this again I'm coming from a non dog training background, like yes, I've had dog training businesses for a long time under my belt. But when I see like I feel like a lot of this like you were, you were hitting on it. It's like a lot of these reactions is based like I think on fear, it's based on your own, you know, self like whatever self-worth you have for yourself, your own imposter syndrome and like lot of scarcity and fear as well. And it's just so to me I'm like fuck, I'm like you guys, like it's a, you have to like, if you don't have each other's backs, like what the fuck do you even have? And getting together once or twice a year, it doesn't fucking make it happy. If you're going to go and fucking tear this person down. Like I personally had heard stories and I've seen it at fucking ISEP like you will say this person toward this person and they're hugging, embracing, and I'm like, what the fuck? Like I'm Jersey as fuck. Like I am fucking, if I don't like you, I will fucking tell you. I will respect you. I might not respect you, but I'm not going to be fucking fake. Anyway, that's a whole other tangent. I don't want to go on.

Speaker 4:

Well I think that, so I want to add to this. I think that there needs to be, um, my humble opinion, just an expansion of what is dog training because that's where people get really shut down too. We are like creativity could be so much more open. And I'm talking about in the pet dog industry, I don't do, we don't do competition, we don't do sports work a lot there at all. But in the pet dog world is people are wanting to live with their animals and have a cohesive, comfortable life and that can look like a lot of different things. And I think if we could just can kind of expand our mind around what it is that we're doing. Is it comes to your place? Is that it? Is it E color? Is that it? Is it food? Is that, it is like, you know, the agendas that the trainers are bringing into these conversations with clients is holding them back. It's keeping people from having really cool or maybe whatever better word I want to use, uh, just connecting and meaningful relationships with their clients. Because they have the agenda already. I don't even think it's necessary. And here's my reasoning behind it. There's the logic. So in the medical world, right, we kind of take science as like an absolute, we think like, Oh, this is science says that, or not all of us, but many people, right? Like this is what we do. We get the surgery and this is this, and we have the cure. We don't have the chair. But the quality is when you talk to a doctor or people that work in the medical and science world, they're trying things out, discovering them fucking things up. Oh God. Got some of the most greatest inventions came from complete mistakes in the lab that, you know, didn't even mean to happen. And now they're like, what was it? Viagara wasn't biographer like heart or blood pressures? I think so. Yeah. Yeah. And then it turns out everyone was getting a boner and then this is, this is what it'll be for. But if nobody had kind of put that out there and tried something out and experimented with it, we never would've had the bone or meds, which everyone loves. So I think that is even something as black and white as science, as science isn't black and white at all. So why not all dog training be black and white? Why would we look at it that way? And that's where, where I tried to keep my head, I mean I learned stuff from my, my youngest employee is 21. Uh, she teaches me all the, you know, like there's no, it's 20 years veteran that blah blah blah, like there's no thing or certificate or I went to this school or whatever that is going to like qualify someone to be ready to teach. And if our minds open, that's the biggest challenge for dog trainers in 20 homes isn't opening their minds.

Speaker 3:

Oh fuck yeah. Oh fuck. Yeah. I, you're speaking to the mother fucking prior on that shit because I also too, like, and I think this is what gets me about it. Like the whole thing and it's like I love millennials. I love the younger generation. I'm like in my, I'm in my mid to late thirties and 36 and it's like, okay, cool. It doesn't fucking matter how much experience we all have, but also what you know when I see when dog trainers, dog walkers are kind of fighting amongst themselves. I'm like, what you're doing is you're preventing a new kind of generation coming at near ready, like you're already setting generations up for failure and unsuccess. What are you scared of? We're scared that there's not enough

Speaker 4:

dogs are clients or that you're going to become irrelevant or whatever. I mean like those things let go of those fears of the shame around your own thing and I think that secretly there are dog trainers that have been training for, well, I'm going to stick on this question a cause. I really love it, Chris. Yeah, no, this is good. You know, I know trainers, one of the challenges of being a doctrine or that I've experienced as I've grown in my career, learn something new and I look back and in that retrospection go, I let that I could have done more there. Wow. If I had that dog again, knowing what I know now, things would be different. I've made mistakes with clients and dogs that, you know, it hurts you when you care about your work. It hurts your heart a little bit to think back and go, wow, that maybe, maybe we could have avoided a rehoming if I'd known this, then that's a cha and that's part a. You can't know everything, right? We said that and then, Oh, you're constantly going to a little bit, you dealing with that, um, growth point of the pain of growth. I wish I'd known that you're one of me doing this or so I've had to go through that a lot. If you can't, if you're not ready to drink that pain and deal with it of like, Oh, I fucked up, I let that dog down, then what you're gonna do is constantly like a blind why to it to protect your own ego and then that keeps you stuck. And that's what I see happening a lot too, is people that are like, no, I'm the best. This is the only way because of me that there might be some other better way or different way or whatever. Then they'd have to admit that they might've made some mistakes. Mm. So just let that shit go, dude. We're making mistakes every day and we're also fucking like helping every fucking day too.

Speaker 3:

Exactly. Exactly. It's like sometimes like I think back, it's like the thing is too, it's like this thing, it's like you, okay first you can't want it more than your clients. Even it goes to dog training clients or dog walking clients, but at the same time it's like I always say like mistakes and failures is part of the natural system. It just allows you to fucking refine.

Speaker 4:

Yeah. Yeah. It's unavoidable. I'll tell you right now, I don't care how many dogs you've trained. I don't care if you're like top of the top of your game or you just started, you will be making mistakes. You're still making the same thing except it right now and then live with it and you're going to do great. And that's what people, that's the challenge that I see getting in the way of these strangers. The ego stuff. It's hard, you know?

Speaker 3:

Yeah, it's, yeah, it's fucking life too. It's like, you know, coming from a court record and like I used to see like I came from this really suppressive background. It's like where you have to be consistently performing professionally perfective Lee, but because you're getting rated, you're literally getting rated by numbers. And what that caused me after years of doing that, it's like when I first went into entrepreneurship full time, like I used to be fucking terrified to make a mistake. Like I always had the right answer. And like you see that with me sometimes, like if somebody can't think of something, I usually pop, I pop the answer at somebody thinking because I've just been trained that way for years and it puts so much pressure on people and like I like my husband too, like my husband's a dog trainer and like I just see like the ultimate fucking pressure everybody puts on top of themselves. And that's another part of the burnout. Like, I think a lot of you guys experienced, especially top trainers.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, a huge part of it. That pressure. Oh my God. It's like we're just like killing ourselves because we need the answer. I see. You know, I taught well back to the sales thing and the way that I do sales and just where we're at, as established as we are. I tell him, I wish I had the numbers, hundreds, thousands of people a year. And I talked to them about their experiences with their dog and if they've worked with other trainers, and a lot of people are, I wish that trainers would, and I say this and I, and I practice this. There are times when I'm with my client and I go and were, we've hit a roadblock based around something that the dog was doing or it's maybe something I've not experienced before, whatever it is. And I do my best to never go. Like this is an impossibility. I'm fixing this, an impossibility or changing this or living with this, et cetera. Because other, there's stuff that I continue to not know. And that's what I hear a lot. And I wish dog trainers wouldn't do that because it really, the client of course is going to go, Oh God, the dogs a lemon. It's all, we can't do anything else. Um, you know, and that, and they just stopped looking for help. I might not be the trainer that has all the answers for that particular case. If we could just start, stop saying that's where our clients and like to encourage them to keep looking or you know, not be afraid of saying like my approach to training doesn't work for this or I'd love to work it out with you. Or like whatever the fuck. I dunno. That being something that to just move the industry forward so fast because we're all learning from each other.

Speaker 3:

Oh fuck yeah. Oh fuck yeah. Cause it's the same thing. It's like, it doesn't matter what training quote unquote camp you're on. It's like not every, there's not like one perfect molded trainer that knows everything and it's like the more you try to like pressurize and put yourself in this one mole, the more fucking fucked you get in your business too. So,

Speaker 4:

and it's the older trainers promoting that idea, like more senior trainers saying like this is the way it has to be like this and believing it and I don't and I don't believe it. Like I don't believe that there is a trainer that's like I've trained every dog and it's always a success and it's like no bullshit either coming back to you and telling you that they're still struggling or you're just doing some sort of weird game with your mind. Longer trainers try to mimic that behavior and you know, they're like, well I learned like the X method and so the method and I ha it has to be this method because this other person is telling you that this is the method. You know what I mean? And they're not, they're not creating a more balance. This is even within as we talk, you know, it's not, it's not positive versus you know, corrective based training or whatever the hell a balanced portfolio is. I have, I have methods, tools, approaches. I have ways of teaching a client, you know, that I can bring all of it in. And that balance of like creating this just portfolio of, of things that I've learned across the years. I dunno if I'm just rambling now, but there you go. No, no,

Speaker 3:

fucking perfect. Because like you said, it's a, it's like a fucking financial portfolio. It's a balanced portfolio. It's like you're not going to have all your eggs in one fucking basket. And then it's like when you drop that basket, you're fucked because then you don't have the answers. You can't help the owner, which cause at the end of the fucking day, this is where it comes to and this is what I always fucking preach. It's like, it doesn't fucking matter what you do, the value to anything, the value, what you guys do as dark trainers, dog walkers is your value lies in the transformation and the value that you're going to be giving that person. You know what I mean? So it's like, okay, if you're still, if you're still stuck on one camp or this, if it's like you train like Cesar Milan or you train like Victoria's still or whatever, you know, or you know, whatever you do, it doesn't fucking matter if it's not helping the owner, if it's not helping the owner, give them successful life tools, because at the end of the day, it's not about the fucking dog.

Speaker 4:

Nope, that's, that's what I'm saying. What is dog training? And that's a question I continue to, I'm exploring now and this past year it's been a big question for me. What is dog training? What does that mean? And like, like trying to wrap my head around that. It's not just come sit down Hill and place that much. You know, it's a lot more, and especially in this pet dog industry, it's, it can mean just, it can mean a client that just, I have clients that are, have like perfect, just sharpest shit dogs. I have clients that have kind of sloppy dogs and they, and they're never really gonna get their timing right and they're kind of a little bit loose. But they needed that community. That's all they needed. And to them that was worth 1 million bucks, you know what I mean? And they pay it again and pay it again because they want to have a space where they were there with their dogs. I mean there's just so many variations. What is dog training can be, and it can be just one call with somebody or it can be working with them for 10 years. No fucking dog training. So[inaudible]

Speaker 3:

I'm going to make a fucking personal joke here about what dog training, the philosophical, you know what you should do, you should go do a fucking Iowasca experience with it as well. What is dog training?

Speaker 4:

I'll ask the plant medicine. I want to man, I've heard so many friends that have experimented with that and just the feedback has been phenomenal. I'm just waiting for the right time. I think.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, that would be, that would be pretty Epic question to ask the plant medicine. Like what is dog training? Cause you're going to go fucking deep as hell with that one. Yeah. Nothing. It's all things. Oh my God. And then the next thing is you're going to be on Joe Rogan's podcast talking about it all fucking trip too. That would be UPIC. Um, so I know we kind of spend some time on the questions, but I actually wanted to give the listeners, um, kind of like your story of like, you know, you guys can't tell Emily is like this amazing powerhouse of knowledge. I'm just like, Oh, it's so awesome. But um, can you kind of tell your story of where you went for, like how you went from where you were a few years ago to how you're now this like basically this, I don't like to use the word too much cause I feel like it's overused in the industry, but like basically having an a mini empire and having a multimillion dollar business and having a fucking team of really engaged in place, can you kind of tell your story, share your story a little bit? Well, let's not expand to multimillion dollars. Okay. Okay. It's just grabbing every time. 1.7

Speaker 4:

our Jen, are you guys? Um, no. Uh, I think that's funny. You know, whatever. Yeah.

Speaker 3:

And you're like, let's make the kids know I'm okay.

Speaker 4:

How did I get into this? I, well[inaudible] it should I took me. Okay. I started out cleaning kennels for, uh, for Gretchen who started this, the dog wizard brand and this core, um, like mothership original location right here in Charlotte and I, and that was just a friend of a friend. I got this kennel clean job. Um, 7:00 AM to 9:00 AM seven days a week.

Speaker 3:

I was here cleaning shit out of cannolis,

Speaker 4:

but it was great. I was, I've always been like a worker like that I actually had, so that was like one gig. I had like a main job that gave me a significant amount of hours. And then I went to tutoring jobs at night. I'd babysit your kids, I'd mow your lawn. Anything I could do to get paid. I was, that's how I was operating at that time. So this was my early twenties. Um, and uh, I always loved this place. I liked coming here. I liked the dogs. Obviously there's this what I'm doing, I'm telling you the whole thing. Yeah. Just tell me, just go for it. Um, yeah. Fast forward. I just started picking up more work here, learning more, um, taking on more stuff around different aspects of like running the business. And then it just all transpired me learning about dog training and then buying the business and then here we are. So it was fast but slow. And I had no, there was no agenda there. I didn't, I didn't, I'm not a person that was like, I'm going to be a dog trainer. All of that. And actually I think that that's worked so much in my favor, like more than I could have thought it would have because again, like that attachment to the outcome and the identity and kind of shifting through different spaces and figuring out who I am. It's been hard but good for me to not just be like I'm a dog trainer and this is what a dog trainer means and this is what I have to do. It was just kind of open to that. But I will tell you this, there was this moment early on in taking over ownership of this place where I go, Holy shit, this is what I was supposed to be doing my whole life and it doesn't. And that, and by that I mean being a business owner and being an entrepreneur, I stepped right into the lane of what I was supposed to do. And I, and it felt so right to me. And if you look back at my whole life, I kind of was that person, even as a young kid, just hustling and making money and in a good way doing good things and um, and like trying to make businesses all the time. And so I didn't have the perspective until I got older, but I was like, Oh yeah, this is what I've been prepping for forever.

Speaker 3:

Oh, that's fucking Epic. I love your, I love your story about it. I think it's so fucking, cause it's like, I always feel like there's entrepreneur like true, true, true, true, true entrepreneurs. We're inherently born with it because, and it's like, it's totally cool if you're not a born entrepreneur. Like, I feel that you can learn aspects of it, but like the most successful people I had known from business that like have always, I like to use the word, like it's, you've been mini hustling since you've been a kid. You know what I mean? So it's like you started when you were a kid and then you had some shit that go, you know, whatever went on. And it's like now you're here where you're here. And it's like, you're always meant, it's still funny the way fucking life is like kind of like guide you and like take this direction or this direction or you know, you know, pull this color and this is what's going to happen. So it just, that type of conversation just makes me like so fucking fascinated. I don't know. I'm going off a rabbit hole too.

Speaker 4:

No, I don't think it's cool. And just like if you have a kid, anyone who's listening and you see that really try to encourage it. You know, I got, um, I would try to turn everything into a business when I was younger and, uh, my parents are very, um, for whatever, just for short, they're hippies, uh, for lack of a better word, that was not, that was kind of frowned upon. Like the, I'll do this for this part. Uh, and there was, I remember at like 13 my mom going, um, yeah, you don't want to, she took away all my money essentially. She was like, don't cause I was like hoarding money and like everything is about money. She thought I was a little bit too obsessed, but the reality was it was just about that hustle, I guess. I don't even like that word, but you know what I mean. Just like I'm working on something and to me it's, um, this is my art. Like I'm a little Martus

Speaker 3:

like a fine artist. I'm not an but like building a business, making things happen, uh, being a part of the community like that, there's an art to that. And that's been my passion for a long time. And if you have a kid should encourage that, I think, and make sure that they just have a healthy relationship to their, to the world because money doesn't make you evil. Like you're either evil or you're not. So, you know, if you have a good relationship to the world, then money just helps you be a better person. But it's a little easier. Yeah. Oh God. It's so funny because the way I grew up was I went, my parents were just like regular, you know, suburban, like they're first generation in America. Um, but what's hilarious is like I had a dad that worked for the federal government for almost 55 years, and then I had a stay at home mom. So the, what was drilled in my household and my brains and all the, all my brothers and sisters was that you go, you work for an establishment and then you retire off of it. So yeah. And it was like, I come from the background of you work your ass off and then you get the rewards. And it's like, yes. And there's also other deviations like, so I, I know like that's the kind of school I came from. It's like, Hey, you grow, you go to school, you go, you know, you go to college, you get a degree, then you go, you know, go get a job and you brought there for the rest. And that works well for some people. But like for me it was like, I used to be what I used to get in trouble with. And this is something I get in trouble with two all the time. And you've probably seen me do this too. And like different coaching facets. I'm like, I'm always seeking another answer. I'm always seeking the next iteration of something. And that's what used to get me in trouble at home when I was a kid. Cause I used to be that kid. Like why? Why, why? And I used to get fucking shut down for that shit. And if, if any kid is asking you that, like any little kids asking that, I'm like, no. Oh wow. That shit. Anyway, that was my little round.

Speaker 4:

Yeah, no, it's so true, man. Being a business owner, you're your client, your is your audience like mostly business.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, they're mostly dog. There's a lot of dog trainers and there's also a lot of pack walkers.

Speaker 4:

Oh cool. Well I think that like you guys should really, you're learning how to make something out of nothing. You know this again this is the art, right?[inaudible] creation. You're creating, you're envisioning, you're building your life, you're in charge of it, you're in the driver's seat. It's super fucking scary and hard. But like how cool is that versus like letting someone else take control of everything and not being in that creative space. I think business ownership is like one of the most it can be and especially if you are opening your mind to that so and so like experimental and impactful to your community. All these things and you guys are artists. So think about it that way. Their say.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. And then, you know, I know we were going to talk about an ma in management in facilities, but we can chat about another time this, cause this is a really good conversation is that kind of goes along to the point of, it's like, you know how everybody's been doing business, you know the dog training business for years. It's like, no, Emily has a great point. There is space to actually create something new where you don't have to be a fucking basic bitch of dog

Speaker 4:

trainers. Nope, you don't. Yeah, you can do whatever the fuck you guys want. Really. It's fucking awesome. And it's like the thing too is huh, great and scary probably.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, but also too, it's like look what you've created. Like I'm going to fucking pimp you out right now. It's like, look what you've inherently created down in Charlotte. Like you created, you know the community of dog owners. Like just by doing something a little bit different outside the box. It's like, yeah, sure you have, you know your basic stuff you do do and foundation, which you know will help the dogs. But also it's like, no, look what else there is possibly created. It's like Emily is fucking fantastic at building community around her brand, just artists all around. And then also too it's like you also can look at other things people have done in the group. It's like, Hey, people are taking, you know, dog trainers on fucking adventures where they're going like zip lining and rock climbing with their fucking dog.

Speaker 4:

Yeah. Oh my God. There's some, there's awesome creativity out there. It's been a process of learning and unlearning all at the same time. Then that that's the, that's the challenges, you know like opening your mind, staying positive, keeping like a healthy balance in your life, learning and then not being so like you learned something and not being so attached to it that it becomes the only thing and you like get stuck in it like that. That's what this has been, especially for me buying a business was for many people might, it might seem like um, Oh you got it a readymade situation. It was not like that at all. In some ways it was, I'm not going to lie, like we have those, a client base, we've, there's a name here, but it was like the, the analogy that I've made a lot, it's when you start from nothing, you're building a house. So every piece of it you're putting on there. And when you, uh, for me, I bought a fixer upper, we're here and then we had to like, Oh, every, all the time we're discovering that there's like a crack in the sewer line or there's an infestation or there's this or that, you know, and we've had to like go in and like redo and fix a lot and, and we learn together and with other people and sometimes, and I'm S we have the best fucking crew ever right now. Um, but that's, that was really hard. And it took us a couple of generations of staff to find people that were ready to do that with us. And like, I'll come to them and be like, Hey, I know we've been having, we've been doing it this way, but I need you guys to trust me. We're going to do it this way for awhile and see how this goes. And they're like always like, fuck yeah, let's do this. And I love that about them.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. I feel like you're honestly in the industry right now. You are the pioneer of that. Like actually healthy hiring healthy staff management. Because what I see a lot of people do and people always say, Oh you're anti hiring. I'm like, no, I'm not anti hiring but I'm anti hiring just to fix, just to put a fucking bandaid on the crack sewer pipe cause shit's going to leak through anyway.

Speaker 4:

Yeah. If you're not ready to hire it can be very actually a bad move. Yeah. Yeah.

Speaker 3:

And I feel like it's not a quick fix. So guys listen to Emily on this knowledge around hiring because she is like an organizational master. Like I can't even believe like her employees are so fucking cool. Like I want them to be my friend. I'm like, Emily, let me brand your and boys for you. But like legitimately cause like you literally had to go through a lot of fucking shit and like almost like you said, it's like you had an, I don't think to use the word, it seems so disrespectful, but it's almost like you had a clean house. See what the fuck was working for you, what was working for your brand and what's gonna work for your clients. And I see. Yep.

Speaker 4:

All right. No, go ahead. Go is a fast pace learning process for sure. I think that, um, and it's, and no individual, one person was a bad person there and some of them, but even the whole thing I said at the top of this about looking back, if I knew what I've been, what I knew now, I could have been a better employer for them and could have been a better manager for them. But at that time it wasn't working and I didn't know and it wasn't, it didn't work out. So we had to go part ways. And then, uh, now I'm at a place where, I mean, it's just come together so magically I love them all so much.

Speaker 3:

What I like about you and your management style M is that like you don't just treat your employees like they're there just to do service for you. You know what I mean? They're just there to relieve you. You literally like your employees are so selected and there's such a process. They're part of the culture so much where they're all on the same page but there's no individual agenda behind it either yours or them. So that's what I think is so fucking cool about the dog with the Charlotte dog wizard is this culture you've created versus just throwing people, having warm bodies to work, dogs, walk dogs or you know, clean up dogs.

Speaker 4:

I really try to tap into what each, well, so they are my clients too and not like I am here for them because they are here for the business. So I had to kind of do a shift around that, if that makes sense. Like I, I worked for them somewhat because there that reframe helps and when I cracked that fucking code, I mean so much stuff started to come together, treating them as individuals while still requiring some structure. You know, finding that balance point has been great. But yeah. Yeah. I mean it's been so cool to, to bring in this room.

Speaker 3:

Yeah. I mean guys, like if you're ever thinking about hiring connect with, not connect with her but connect with grassroots and we'll get you in touch with Emily because she literally has cracked the code. Like I fucking need to go to her with some employee stuff. I'm like, Oh God. I'm like, I don't want it. Cause managing people is fucking hard. And it's like you have, like you said, it's like you have to take an account of their individual personalities, but you also have to take an account of the culture as well as your business as well too. So it's just, it's, there's so much stuff around employees and your own ego. Yeah. Got

Speaker 4:

all. I'll have to keep that in check and I continue to make mistakes. We uh, under that thing, we're all making mistakes guys. We had this client come in and she was just doing a tour with us. Um, it was a great compliment that she gave us, but really the other piece of it stuck with her. She was like, Oh my God, everyone looks so happy here. I love the way they're interacting with that dog. Like this is such a great space. And then she, she was kind of an older woman. She's like, I used to have a small business and I had, I hired the best people and she's like, and I treated them like gods and I paid them way too much and I gave them way too much and I do it again in a heartbeat. And that made me feel so good to hear her say that. I was like, Oh thank God. Cause that's like, you know, I wonder, I don't know what the fuck I'm doing but I know that I care about these people and I want them to feel loved and they fucking returned the love tenfold all the time. And it seems so,

Speaker 3:

it's so fucking apparent. It's so apparent. Like I see it every day. I'm like, Jesus Christ, this is so fucking cool. Now we're going to, cause I know you're short on time on wrap this up. Um, so I want to ask you this one question and this is, this is around in place. What's the most common reason for dog business owners to fail or find them? Sucks themselves. Fucked when it comes to employees.

Speaker 4:

Well I think to your point there people hire as a way to get out of things like that when they're starting to get overwhelmed either they are just having a, they've built their business up and they ha and they have a hard time saying no to people. Like it just, it happens. Anyone who's a little bit more established in the industry, you get to this point where you're like, shit man, this dog's coming out of the fucking car. Like there's dogs everywhere. Like I'm shoving walls and bathrooms to get like, it's just, it gets crazy. You know, you're balding dogs, your clients are returning to you. People need it now. Everyone needs training immediately. They don't have the structure around how to provide help in a way that doesn't overextend themselves because they're doing everything in person or hands on or everything's born in[inaudible] or whatever it is. Um, so they think I need help, I need to get another person in here. And maybe they do. I think that, um, one of the first ways to help yourself is to get someone that literally is working to help you, not clients. And you know, if this is contradictory to anything you teach them, sorry, but, uh, you know, like someone that's cleaning your house, someone that's buying groceries, that kind of shit, which is super hard for, for people in general, right? They're not like having some, like I'm like groceries, Oh my God, what am I like the queen of England gives you, it gives you that mental space to stay taken care of, which is important so you can take care of your clients. So that's one of the first things is I think that they hire and they're like, I need help with the things that I'm doing. And the, and then, and then what they don't realize is when you onboard somebody, you have to have time to onboard them there, no matter where they come from, the top, they're from StarMark, they're from this and that, or they've been training for X amount of years. It doesn't matter. They are going to require your time and attention and you're going to have to stop what you're doing on a daily basis adding them and they won't be helpful for maybe three months, maybe six months. I don't really know until they can, uh, depending on what the role is until they can really start, um, actually taking stuff off of your plate. And that should be very piecemeal. It should be a tiered system around, you know, you're going to learn this, master it and then take it over. Yeah. Can't be everything all at once. And so they bring people in, they shove a lot of work. Oh my God, take over this dog, do this, do all your own sales and what, and then another mistake is they create their own competition because this Chinese people to be these little mini versions of them, don't have time to give them attention. A lot of employees get resentful when you're starting out. Um, you know, cause they're starting out. So when you're not around, just be that support because the support, then I'll then the employees figuring everything out on their own and then they realize that and they go, why am I hurting for somebody? Yep. And I have so many stories of people that are like burned by their first employee because they went in that way and they're in this resentful Headspace of like, fuck them, they stole my clients. They laughed, or whatever. It just happens a lot, especially one, I think, um, what they don't realize that they had a, they had a part in that. It wasn't that person's like agenda to come in and then break off. It's just like, it's like, you know, you're your first love. You're not going to get it right.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, yeah. Oh, well, yeah, it's like, you know, you have an employee come in and like for me, I know delegation's hard for me, but like it's like, Hey, if you have somebody come in just to kind of relieve some of the fire from you being so burnt out, it's like this person's like taking on like drinking from the fire hose and they're like, wait a minute, I'm getting paid to do basically the owner shop. Fuck this, I'm out and I'm going to take the fucking list with me. And I see that happen so fucking much when I, you know, I've had clients that had, that happened to in the past and then just co creates this whole toxic ecosystem around like hiring and you know, employee management and stuff like that.

Speaker 4:

Are they an employee or are they a contractor? I think that, I mean there's a certain amount of stress with this job no matter what. But he get to go home at the end of the day and clock out again. He won't. And in some ways you need to like manage that and work it in. But if you're treating your employees like little business owners, that's what's going to happen.

Speaker 3:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. Totally. Okay. Like, you know, for me, I think too, what you hit on a really good point. I'm gonna let you go. Um, but it's like time to, if you want to keep it like, okay, I'll keep a couple more minutes. Um, but I think you hit on a really good point. Like a spot that I always recommend to my clients is it's like, all right, yeah, you have dogs coming out the wazoo, you're consistently busy and blah, blah, blah, blah blah. What's the first thing? No, don't create a mini Emily. Don't create a minute mini Ashley or a mini Kristen or a mini Gina or whatever. You want to just have somebody relieve some of the pressure that's happy to relieve some of the pressure, whether that is going through your inbox, whether that is cleaning your fucking house or shopping for you or make you fucking meals. And I think too, it's like as, especially women, I'm not going to run the whole women business entrepreneur thing, but we're so used to taking so much fucking on and just mastering it all. It's like, no, the first step is just to say, yeah, I need help, but this is where it needs help and there's people in like people too. It's like, I know in my household it was really hard for us to get a house cleaner, cleaner and because my husband had like, it was like, Oh, I don't want people cleaning her house. It's, you know, bottom line, there are people that are happy that do that. There's people that are happy that we'll clean the dog kennels that will walk the dog for you and stuff like that.

Speaker 4:

I mean, yeah, you can't. That's everyone. Yeah. You find the right people and it starts to be really a good team. It's not like these are my servants, you know what I mean? Like, yeah, together it's great. Everyone has their own strengths too.

Speaker 3:

Exactly. All right. Well Emily, thank you so much. Oh my God. We were like going to plan and talk about all this employee and facility management, but I think this is really fucking good. Like this was really good. I felt like dye am almost sweaty now. I'm like, Jesus Christ. Well thank you so much for having me on. I really appreciate it. I love your podcast and I think you're doing good things out there, Kristen. Oh, so[inaudible] where can people find you?

Speaker 4:

Oh, um, well if I'm gonna put anything on this, I just started this new show. It's in its infancy. It's called between two dogs. Um, it is, we're, you know, it's a live Facebook show. I think. I'm gonna bring it onto Instagram too, so you can follow that. It's at between two dogs and that's between spelled out the number two and dogs. Um, there's one episode up and it's, and it's just out there for dog owners, dog business owners. It's, there's not really an agenda yet. I'm kind of experimenting with it and if you guys want to follow along with me, I think it's going to go to some cool places and you'll get to see my face. And a bunch of other pretty people's faces and uh, you know, we're talking about dogs. So between two dogs at between two dogs on Facebook follow us.

Speaker 3:

Awesome. Yeah. And I've watched the first pilot. It was so good. And I do have to say too, I'm going to, I'm going to pimp you out again here that started as a sir, like not a service but like almost like a benefit to a program you were doing with your clients.

Speaker 4:

Yes, yes it did. It started behind the scenes for the past year. Uh, we've been doing this live with, um, our clients and our private group that they get put into just to answer some Q and a stuff and then it evolved into like dog philosophy and how it ties into our life. And sometimes we talk about other stuff outside of dogs. Um, and it became one of the more in like, it's this piece of my job and day or week or whatever that I really loved it. And it's almost, it's nothing, but it's almost everything because of that, you know, sometimes that stuff that doesn't seem like it matters, matters most sounds like.

Speaker 3:

Okay. Yeah. That's awesome. All right, well Emily, thank you so much. And I'll, what I'll do too for the listeners is I will link the Facebook page and the Instagram too as well. And then once Emily blows up because she is going to blow up with between two dogs is I've seen, I've seen the behind the scenes one and I'm just like, damn, this is so good. Um, but it also shows that creative artistic part of you that you can, you have it here or you started small to benefit a little small community. Now you're bringing it to benefit a larger community. So that's the fucking art behind it. Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. Alright, awesome. Well Emily, thank you. Thank you. Thank you so fucking much for coming on. I know you're a busy business owner now. I know you need to go make some sales. I manage a fucking team. Thanks Chris. And thanks for having me. Alright, Emily and I will see you soon to myself. All right, have a good day. Bye.

Speaker 1:

Hey there. Thank you for listening to another bad-ass episode of mind, your own dog business. If you haven't already subscribed, what are you waiting for? Oh my God. Go and subscribe now so you don't miss out on any of our content pack dog business jam sessions plus special offers that I'm gonna only be sharing with my amazing dog business entrepreneurial podcast listeners. Now, if you've enjoyed this episode, be sure to leave a five star kick ass review. So more amazing dog business owners just like yourself can find us and starts to transform and disrupt their businesses and their lives unapologetically. And if you feel so inclined, feel free to tag me on Instagram with a screenshot of this episode and holler at your girl. I'm at dog Walker coach. You can find me dog Walker, coach, and I'll pop up and I'll give you a special shout out. All right guys, til next time. Bye.

Speaker 2:

[inaudible].