#125 BONUS Episode: An Interview with Dr. John Cordle (Letters To Myself)

A single book can change your life, and sometimes it starts with one brutal question: what do you wish you’d known back then? We sit down with Dr. John Cordle, a retired Navy captain, to talk about his new book Letters to Myself and the real experiences behind it, from early doubts at the United States Naval Academy to the pressure-cooker moments that define military leadership.

John explains why he structured the book as letters to his younger self at major career milestones, pulling one core lesson from each phase: technical proficiency, tactical growth, self-care, and even failure. We get into what it felt like to write down mistakes across a 30-year Navy career and turn them into something useful for midshipmen, future officers, and families trying to understand the Naval Academy journey. The conversation doesn’t dodge the uncomfortable topics either, including how fatigue can wreck judgment and why alcohol mistakes can create consequences that last long after the night ends.

If you found value here, subscribe, share this with a midshipman or parent, and leave a review or comment with the lesson you wish you could send to your younger self.

Dr. John Cordle will be hosting a book signing on Saturday, April 18, from 12:00–2:00 PM at Old Fox Books & Coffeehouse.

Old Fox Books & Coffeehouse
 35 Maryland Avenue
 Annapolis, MD 21401
 Phone: 410-626-2020

Book orders are available at: www.stonetowerpress.com/shop

Additional details and updates can also be found on his LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/cordlejp

If you want a slightly more polished/marketing-friendly version:

Dr. John Cordle will be hosting a book signing on Saturday, April 18, from 12:00–2:00 PM at Old Fox Books & Coffeehouse in Annapolis.

Old Fox Books & Coffeehouse
35 Maryland Avenue, Annapolis, MD 21401
410-626-2020

You can order the book here: www.stonetowerpress.com/shop

Learn more via LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/cordlejp

To stay most up to date with Grant, Naval Academy updates, and real estate insights, follow him on LinkedIn

The mission of Academy Insider is to guide, serve, and support Midshipmen, future Midshipmen, and their families.

This podcast is independently produced and reflects the views and opinions of its creators. It is not officially affiliated with, endorsed by, or representative of the United States Naval Academy or its affiliates.

Grant Vermeer your host is the person who started it all.  He is the founder of Academy Insider and the host of The Academy Insider podcast. He was a recruited athlete which brought him to Annapolis where he was a four year member of the varsity basketball team. He was a cyber operations major and commissioned into the Cryptologic Warfare Community. He was stationed at Fort Meade and supported the Subsurface Direct Support mission.

He separated from the Navy in 2023 and now owns The Vermeer Group, a residential real estate company that matches service academy families with trusted real estate teams all across the country.  Text (650) 282-1964 with any real estate questions.

We are here to be your guide through the USNA experience.

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Transcript

Bonus Episode Setup And Purpose

SPEAKER_01 0:00

Hey everyone and welcome back to a bonus episode here on the Academy Insider Podcast. We're doing a quick conversation with Dr. John Cordle, who just released a brand new book called Letters to Myself. It's a really cool read, and I'm just a big fan of his, so I wanted to give him the opportunity to come on and talk about his book, uh, what midshipman could take away from it. And the fact is, he's going to be in Annapolis doing a book signing and handing out that book later in April. So I want to give people an opportunity to get a heads up about that in case they wanted to go meet him and get the book. So um anyway, I hope you enjoyed the listen. Take it, it's a quick one. Uh, I hope you uh gained something from it. I appreciate you all. Let me know if you have any questions. Have a good day. Before we get started, I want to make a quick disclaimer to make sure that everyone knows Academy Insider and myself, Grant Fremier, are in no ways official representatives of the United States Naval Academy, the Navy, andor the Department of War. What I'm doing here again is just trying to provide a little bit of context, perspective, and understanding to the Naval Academy journey. But my use of the Naval Academy and conversation about them does not imply endorsement from the institution. If you ever have any questions directly for the Naval Academy, I encourage you to reach out to them directly and the Public Affairs Office. I appreciate it. Thank you so much, and I hope you have a great listen to the episode. John, always a pleasure to have you on the Academy Insider podcast. Uh, for anyone who doesn't follow me on LinkedIn, again, this is your encouragement to follow me on LinkedIn because I'm more active there than anywhere in the entire world. Uh, but I had a midshipman commenting on one of my posts at about 1 a.m. uh Annapolis time, which then uh required me to tag our good friend Dr. Cordle and uh and highlight the episode that we did about the importance of sleep at the Naval Academy. And uh and so if you haven't listened to him on previous episodes, I highly encourage you to go back and take a listen. Uh a very valued and welcomed guest here, so thank you so much. But for anyone who hasn't listened to previous episodes or not familiar with you, if you don't mind just giving yourself a little bit of background, uh, how you ended up at the Naval Academy and a little bit about your Navy career.

From Rock Band To USNA

SPEAKER_00 2:01

Okay, sure. Um, so my dad was a uh career Navy uh person. He went in World War II, um, enlisted, became an officer back around Vietnam days. So he spent 30 years in the Navy as a Mustang. And uh I was a military brat, mom was a school teacher, we moved all over the place. I think I lived in 13 different spots and then landed in Rome, Georgia. Uh went to high school there. And my dad, when I was 18, I had good grades. I was, you know, in the the choir and the paper and all these things that build up your little uh superlative section for high school, that competition, right? Um but I had no plan. I was in a rock band, I was singing, uh, we had won a couple of uh the battle of the band things, and I'm thinking, hey, I could be the next, you know. Um and my dad, you know, the the ever the grounded person, he's like, you know, John, maybe you should have a backup plan right there at a college. Um and he said, so here's the deal. He goes, You're 18 here in a few months. You can you can live with us as long as you want, but it's gonna be$500 a month for the bedroom that you're in now. Um eat dinner with us every night and be home by midnight on the weekends because we have a life too. He goes, or I've sent off for these applications to Georgia Tech, ROTC, and the Naval Academy. Um now bear in mind I didn't even know there was a Naval Academy, right? Like I thought the Army Navy game was uh was like some Navy folks and sailors that played football. But it was free and it wasn't Georgia, and so I, you know, filled them all out. Um he basically restricted me to the house to like filled everything out and wrote my vision statement and you know, light upon a hill and all this kind of stuff, and um slapped him in the mail and got accepted to both. Um and had my interviews and through my dad was able to get a vice presidential nomination. And so July 7th, 1980, they truck me off to the Naval Academy and uh, you know, they started yelling at me and cutting my hair and and and uh you know I think I mentioned in a in a post I about uh a week later I called my dad from little that back then it was like the payphones, but with the payphones, you know, pumping quarters. I said, Dad, I think I made a mistake. Um and uh and he goes, Well, you're an adult, you know, what do you want to do? And I said, Well, uh, I think I'd like to come home. And he says, Well, we'll support you whatever you do. Just you know, I mean your mother and I are very proud of you. And I'm like, dang it. Um now I have to go back. And so I stayed um and uh ocean engineering major and uh went nuclear power, uh served on uh several two nuclear cruisers, uh did a tour in Germany where I met my wife, um, and it was called the personal exchange program, which I could do in a whole nother episode about. That's a great thing for midshipment to know because it's very it's not well advertised. Uh but I was in the German Navy for two years basically. Um came back, uh served as department head exo on USS Coal uh right before their attack. So, you know, those are my shipmates that were killed in that attack. Um and then um had command of Oscar Austin and uh San Jacinto, a cruiser uh during Operation Iraqi Freedom for the DDG and then for counterpiracy ops, and then retired after 30 years out of Surf Lance. Yeah. Uh Naval Surface Force Atlantic as a captain. Um and just had a fantastic career. Yeah.

A 30-Year Navy Career In Fast Motion

Writing Letters To A Past Self

SPEAKER_01 5:01

Yeah, it's you did have a fantastic career. And you know, I obviously again, a big piece of this episode today is to talk about a book that you've written about your reflections on your career and at different points of your career. And so again, when it comes when it came to this book in general, how was it for you to actually sit there and reflect upon your career in this way? And when you look back at this 30-year career, are are you happy with the choices that you've made in your life's path? Like, give us a rundown on like the behind the scenes of writing this and the reflection that you actually took and how you feel about the decisions that you've made and the path that you that you've chosen.

SPEAKER_00 5:41

Wow. That's a uh that's a lot packed into one question. But I don't have the book yet, but here's a picture of it. I think you can put one up there. That's my card. Yeah um but uh here's what happened. So uh I met a guy named Keith Green back in about 2020 who had written a book called Black Officer, White Navy. And uh and I read his book and it hit me like a gut punch. It was about growing up as one of the few, actually one of the very first black off naval officers. Uh he made it up to XO of a of a of a uh a fast patrol boat. And uh but he overcame a lot of obstacles there. But um the book really did two things for me. One, it it gave me a glimpse into his life, which I thought was pretty cool. But two, it it it it struck me how much difference a book can make. Um I mean, literally his book and then the friendship that came out of it has changed my life. And so uh, of course, the first thing he said was, well then you write a book. Uh and I'm like, on what? He goes, I don't know, write something. So uh for about a year we batted around some some ideas and stuff, and then I looked up on the wall, I don't know if I can move around, kind of down here is a letter from my grandfather uh dated uh like May of 1980 that said, basically, Congratulations about the Naval Academy. You've got a great record, and we're very proud of you. Um and I kept that for you know it's now been 45 years, and uh I always looked at it when I needed inspiration. And and so um I came up with the idea, sort of came I don't know how it came up, but l what if I wrote a letter to myself at each juncture in my career, division officer department, at each tour basically, uh of which I think I had 11 tours, um and told myself what I wish I would have known then at that point in my life. Um and then I kind of said, well, that could be repetitive if it's just you know another letter twelve times. Let's pull like the one thing that you really needed to focus on as a division officer, you know, technical proficiency, department head, tactical proficiency, XO, self-care. Um as a captain, I uh wrote about failure, uh and we could talk about that a little bit. And so I ended up with like 15 chapters. I went on to veteran uh looking for a job because of transition. Um but I tried to speak to kind of the core of of what I now that now that you asked about the process, it was very painful because essentially what I did was I wrote down every screw up and mistake that I did over 30 years, and then tried to extrapolate that to a lesson. Um at the end of it. I'm asked a lot how about Lieutenant uh left cabin, right? Um and uh and some of them were pretty painful lessons, you know. Probably the the low point of my whole career, uh, real quick story was on Oscar Austin. Uh under pressure to get the ship certified and get ready for deployment, uh, we pushed the limit on a boarding evolution where the team is on a small boat and we're trying to maneuver the ship. And uh to try and not hit the small boat that we were boarding, I gave a super strong backing bell which flipped our uh rib, the boat that the people, the sailors were in, into the water. And now it's it's it's like dark, it's raining, it's cold. And I've I put six sailors in the water with an order that I gave. Um and uh and and that really uh that was a low point. Uh and it was about fatigue, it was about not listening to that little voice, it's like, hey, John, you're you're you're pushing too hard. Um so that's sort of the core of that failure chapter, is is uh you know, probably the worst day of my career. But then I go into the best days of my career, like uh choosing Tomahawks during Operation Iraqi Freedom, um capturing pirates on San Jacento. So um, like I said, you know, when I said fantastic career, it wasn't about my performance, it was about I got to drive boats and blow stuff up like my whole life um and get paid for it. So uh it was a it was a very uh interesting experience to kind of write that stuff down and then to pare it down to something that that people would actually have time to read. Um and uh so it's about a hundred pages long total, and uh you know, kind of a two-cup of coffee uh read that I hope will be something people can use. No, absolutely.

Advice For Midshipmen On Choices

SPEAKER_01 9:43

And and what do you think, again, for a young midshipman who may be 18 to 22 years old, what do you think they can take away mainly from this book? And even again, if there are reflections in a letter that you wrote to yourself as a commander or as a captain, like what what uh what takeaways are there that exist for midshipmen as well?

SPEAKER_00 10:03

Yeah, you know, you you made that point about you know, you didn't write one to midshipmen, and I'm like, oh, I shouldn't have thought of that. Maybe a second edition. Um but I have the one for my granddad, so that kind of counts. Yeah. Um I guess if I I thought about this a little bit, if I had myself, you know, like this for a minute, um, a couple things I would probably echo pretty much what my dad said when I joined the Navy. Um, you know, he was in for 30 years and lived through Vietnam and you know World War II and uh and he said, you know, son, the Navy's pretty simple. He says, figure out what you're supposed to do and do that. Um and uh and that sounds simple, but I spent a lot of time trying to get out of it or or not figuring out and just kind of winging it. If I'd have listened to my dad a little more, I think that would have been so that's probably the thing number one. Um thing number two is uh really I was ready to you know to quit. Um my first squad leader basically told me up point blank, I don't think you have what it takes to finish the Naval Academy. Um and I've set about proving him wrong. And so I guess my other point is I wasn't really that athletic uh when I went in there. Um I was very studious, I guess. But uh at the end of the day, I would I would say, look, you know, read the book if I can do it. Any really literally anybody can. Um and I rose to the rank of captain and chief of staff at Surfland. Um through some good leaders that picked me up and carried me through each door, you know. So uh uh I would encourage them to do that. And if I had one final thing that I really uh this is easy to say now, um but uh you'll see this theme a couple times in the book um is uh I overused alcohol a few times. Uh not not you know systematically, not alcoholic type, but bad decisions. Um there's a story in the book where I was uh I went to the great you in San Diego, I think, is that right? I am um what are the bars down there on Pacific Beach that have like free hamburgers if you're if you're drinking beer the whole night? So I decided when I was on the trucks and I think down there as a division officer that I would go eat the hamburgers and drink the beer. And I got back to my car and realized I can't drive, and so I I thought I'll just sleep it off right here on the on the in the parking lot. So I spent the night, you know, in my car. Um had to be at work the next morning because it was Sunday night, so Monday morning. Um had my stuff there, I had on the ship. So and I pulled up to the gate and rolled down my window and the gate guard goes, Sir, you might want to think about parking outside the gate, um, or else I'm gonna have to, you know, do a breathalyzer on you. And I did. And uh um and I, you know, how close did I come? I mean, that guy could have easily grabbed you know, he's like, I just nabbed an officer, you know. Um and uh and so that was reflective of some stupid stuff I did as a midshipman too. Um so alcohol, I think at some point, and you look at some recent events with senior officers, um, that's like the one thing that I would say, watch yourself, Cordle. Um, because you just get stupider when you drink. Um and then you know, later on I learned that when you get tired, it's kind of the same thing. But I guess I would add that one just for good measure.

SPEAKER_01 13:08

Yeah, and I'm gonna double down on that one. I feel like a lot of times people um are not quick to self-admit uh to stuff like that or or want to bring it up because it is sensitive. Um I I think that one's huge, right? And I've had uh close friends, peers, mentors um who have had otherwise impeccable uh careers, lives, whatever the case is, that uh have made decisions that will kind of impact and follow them for the rest of their life because of and over again, not necessarily it not always is like a consistency of overusage of alcohol, but have had an instance of overusage of alcohol that has kind of put them in a in a tough spot, right? And kind of getting away from that and just always being self-conscious and aware of you know the realities of like that kind of decision making. I I think it's a great thing for midshipmen to kind of hear over and over again. And I know it's tough and I know it's part of the midshipman lifestyle at times, especially when you turn 21 and downtown Minneapolis kind of supports the behavior at times. Um that kind of stuff is is really important. And I just um, you know, I I think it's also really interesting. I I think the advice to your midshipmen self is great. Again, you were kind of just like know what you're supposed to do and then do it. Uh like I think that's great advice. I've I've always used I've always used like the phrase like know your role and then embrace your role and then excel in your role, right? Like this in each time as a midshipman, like again, knowing what you're supposed to do, like that's your role at that point in time. And like your role as a team is gonna be different than your role as a firstie, which is gonna be different than your role as an as an ensign, right? But like when you know what you're supposed to do and then you just go do it and you do it well, like it's it's simple, but it's great advice. It's great advice, right? And a lot of people don't, right? A lot of people don't.

SPEAKER_00 14:57

So that's a fact.

SPEAKER_01 14:58

Um, this is uh I I appreciate you saying that. And uh, you know, again, understand that you're having a book signing that's coming to Annapolis as well. If anyone is interested in meeting you and getting your book and potentially having a conversation with you, uh how how can they go about doing that?

Annapolis Book Signing Details

SPEAKER_00 15:18

Great. So uh give me a second, because now I've forgot the name of the bookstore.

SPEAKER_01 15:22

Um the Brown stash copy in the Fox uh I forget like Fox's Den, Fox uh Fox Bookstore.

SPEAKER_00 15:31

It's on my there it is. Okay. Um maybe you can edit that out. Yeah. Uh uh thanks. Yeah, so um I I was working with the Midshipman store and they are gonna carry the book. Um I'm gonna drop off some copies on April 17th, and then hopefully they'll get it in their system and get it on the shelves, and then they're gonna work with the publisher. Um they couldn't do a signing because of the access restrictions, um, but they were very supportive. And so I found a group out in town, the Old Fox Book and Coffee House um out in in downtown Annapolis, that is gonna host me uh from 12 to 2 on Saturday, the 18th of April. So if you're out there wandering around um and uh you know, please stop by. Hopefully we can drive some business to them as well, make it worth their while. But uh I'll sit there and bring some books to sign. And if you don't get a signed copy, I've got little uh signature stickers that I can do. If you order the book, uh let me know that you want one. I can send you a card with a uh with a sticker in it, but that's just pretty much the same thing. So um my goal is to kind of you know I have a box of fifty. I hope and hope I sell them out between that and the in the women's fiftieth. And if not, uh you can order it and I can give you a sticker. So uh we'll see how it goes.

SPEAKER_01 16:39

Yeah, no, absolutely. Go if you're around and in town, again, that's a great place to go on Liberty anyway. I've spent uh plenty of time. So there's a little coffee shop inside old Fox's bookstore called uh the brown must brown mustache. But then obviously, but then obviously when you're uh when you're like 18, there's no better way to say it than the brown moustache with like a little like little jazz to it. And so uh now I can't say it any other way. Uh when I get ready to say the brown mustache, it comes out that way.

SPEAKER_00 17:09

That's fair. Yeah, it looks like they're on Maryland Street, so they're right there downtown.

Final Thanks Plus Subscribe Request

SPEAKER_01 17:13

Um yeah, place is great. Uh I I hope uh potentially some midshipmen get the opportunity to meet you and talk about it. And uh I appreciate you coming on and talking about your book again. Big fan of yours. Wanted to take this opportunity to do a quick bonus episode to kind of talk about this and and highlight the option and opportunity. And again, I think for people who are listening, whether it's parents, whether it is a midshipman, um there's always a lot to learn from the reflection of people's journey, right? And I think this will be a very palatable, digestible way to kind of take some lessons as you get ready to move forward in your life, right? And um I I encourage you to take a read and take a listen. Uh, you know, I I was lucky enough to kind of get a PDF version sent to me beforehand uh for preparation of this, but I gotta read it, right? And there's there are incredible takeaways, and I think there are a lot of things that we overlook as maybe not that important, or especially again, your letters to yourself about self-care and the conversations that we've had about sleep. You know, I think midshipmen, a lot of times we are constantly in this grind of like trying to optimize performance or be uh the elite and perform at such a high level, but we don't realize that like there's a lot of self-care that that is required in order to do that. Um, and I just think there are a lot of good takeaways from the book. So I appreciate you coming on to talk about it. Um, I hope everyone listening gets an opportunity to read the book. And um again, just thank you for your continued uh investment in trying to make again life better in the Navy and Marine Corps for the next wave of people. And um I just I'm I'm grateful for it and thank you for your time today.

SPEAKER_00 18:49

Hey, hey, thanks very much. Um, like I said, like you said, hopefully folks will read it, enjoy it, tell their friends. Um, I think uh, you know, my peers, my classmates and stuff have kids that could benefit from it, I think. And so um, if one person buys the book and comes back and says, hey, this made a difference for me, then uh then it's been a success. So thanks for having me. Thanks for spreading the word and uh thanks for what you're doing as well. Well, I appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 19:13

Thank you. And uh for everyone listening, I hope you have a good day. Since Dr. Quartle brought it up, yes, I am in San Diego, and the way I actually make a living for myself is selling real estate in San Diego. So if you're thinking about coming here and buying a home, recap to me, let me know. Shameless plug. Thank you. Uh anyways, I appreciate the listen. I hope you all have a good day and uh go buy his book. Appreciate it. Thanks. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Academy Insider Podcast. I really hope you liked it, enjoyed it, and learned something during this time. If you did, please feel free to like and subscribe or leave a comment about the episode. We really appreciate to hear your feedback about everything and continue to make Academy Insider an amazing service that guides, serves, and supports midshipmen, future midshipmen, and their families. Thank you.