dUg Pinnick (Kings X)

Dug Pinnick is a singer, songwriter and bass player who’s played with a ton of great musicians. Some of his projects include Tres Mts. (with Jeff Ament), KXM (with George Lynch & Ray Luzier), and The Mob (with Reb Beach & Kip Winger). Of course his main gig is with King’s X and they have a new album coming out called “Three Sides of One.” In this episode we discuss the new album, a scary car accident, his relationship with Chris Cornell, religion, philosophy and the Tommy Lee dick pic. I had an absolute blast talking to dUg! 

0:00:00 - Intro
0:00:47 - Health & Diet 
0:07:13 - Let It Rain & Led Zeppelin 
0:09:03 - Flood,  Dark Humor, Division & Earth 
0:15:42 - Christianity & Faith
0:17:22 - Give It Up & Death
0:20:40 - Panic Attacks & Car Accident 
0:25:30 - Temple of the Dog & Chris Cornell 
0:30:50 - Beatles Influence 
0:32:30 - All God's Children & Michael Sweet 
0:35:00 - Christian Gay Conversion Camps 
0:41:50 - Life Philosophy & Understanding Each Other
0:45:45 - Gay, Black or Christian? 
0:47:45 - Smoking Weed 
0:49:45 - Brand of Fear & Transgenders 
0:51:07 - Tommy Lee Dick Pic & Mick Mars 
0:54:15 - New King's X Record & Tour 
0:58:45 - Compassion International  

King's X website:
https://www.kingsxrocks.com

Compassion International website:
https://www.compassion.com

Chuck Shute website:
http://chuckshute.com

Transcript

Chuck Shute: 0:00

Okay, you ready for this one, Doug Pinnick of Kings X is back. They have a new record coming out. And of course, we're going to cover that. But we cover so much more. We go very deep. And Doug is an open book, I get his thoughts on religion, politics, social issues, the Tommy Lee dick pic. These are the top issues going on right now, this is not a surface level interview. And after doing like 270 of these, I can't just do the same old thing. I want to talk about deeper issues, and I really enjoyed it. And remember, if you ever want to skip a topic, or just listen to part of this, the subjects are in the show notes. Enjoy. Well, welcome back, Doug, you just did the show six months ago, it was so much fun. We went over so much of your career. But of course, there's so much more to talk about, there's a new album out. So how are you doing?

dUg Pinnick: 0:59

I got no complaints. I just don't, you know, I always have to say that just likes what you make it you know. And all that thing. I don't like let things get me if it ain't got nothing to do with me. Why should I let it bother me? Yeah,

Chuck Shute: 1:13

I saw something on your Instagram. It's like, you're in your 70s. But it said like biologically your 54 Internet test. So I mean, that's, that's gotta be accurate.

dUg Pinnick: 1:22

It was, it made me feel like, Oh, man. So empowering my god. It was like, what? See, I've been doing studies on this stuff. Because then my family lives a long time. And we don't age. Normally. You know, my whole family has been like that. And so I've been aware of it as a kid. And so I've done a lot of research on the body and nutrition and, you know, all the good, the bad. I went down the rabbit hole with the conspiracies and the food and, you know, sugar and salt, no, you know, everything that's bad for everything. And I finally got it down to a science after like, 60 years. And, and literally, what I eat and what I do every day, I got it down to it. This is what my body needs to do to stay fit until it passes. And it's been working really well. It's really great. And then I've learned, I've learned that they say your body doesn't age with time it ages on its own. It doesn't have anything to do with time. It ages. Yeah, it is the talent telemeters that are in your, in your DNA, there's there are lengthening, shortening, shortening as you get older and older and some shortened quicker and some, in some short, don't shorten quicker, you know, it's a genetic thing. I haven't entered 103 Right now, and she's still going and I'm just like, and she and she can sit down and talk to you. She's got all her faculties about her, the only thing she can do is walk, she walks with a walker, because her arthritis gets to her. So I frantically do all kinds of shit so that, you know, my arthritis doesn't get me and I literally use my knees and stuff used to ache and I've been doing a lot of different herbs and stuff. And it's all gone away. Yeah, and I've done lots of tests, you know, on my body and literally, it's a okay, it's really weird.

Chuck Shute: 3:20

That's awesome. You know, did you find as you get older, you had to cut either cut down on things or cut anything out like red meat or alcohol or anything like that, are you able to just cut down or just

dUg Pinnick: 3:32

what I learned a long time ago is you can do and eat whatever you want. Just don't overdo it. And as I learned to set to be satisfied on less, and how much better I felt that was the thing for me is when I don't have a lot of food in my stomach, that's when I feel my best. I have my most energy and sometimes I don't want to eat because I'm gonna go home and eat No, I have to sit down for like an hour and just digest and then go Oh, yeah, but you gotta eat so so so I figure out what what is there that's going to be so nutritious for me, but my body's not going to take so long to digest or it's not going to knock me out, you know, instead of, you know, booster, my sugar, glucose, or whatever it is, and that drop what's going to level it and make me make my body move at its optimum. So that's what I had to learn. And that's what we all need to learn is how to what our body needs and when it needs it and how to work it. You know, so that that we get the optimum out of it. It's a lifetime. To me, it's a lifetime of learning. I'm still learning about things, you know,

Chuck Shute: 4:39

do you think it's different for everybody to like, everyone has different things that affect our bodies differently? Or do you think

dUg Pinnick: 4:44

oh, yeah, yeah, well, yeah. Everybody's different. And you got people have to understand that but one thing that people forget is that or maybe they just don't know that 90% of the food that we all eat right now is generic aqui altered is filled with fat forming cancer causing addictive making substances and we eat it every day. And that is our problem. Real food, you can eat as much as you want, you can get by organic vegetables and learn how to cook them. You can eat it as much as you can, you can eat as much meat as you want, as long as it's organic. You know, it doesn't have all that shit in it. Because remember, back in the 40s 50s, and 30s people weren't fat, they ate the same food. Why is it changed because of the fast food industry. And I mean, we can go down the rabbit hole, but we know that the food industry is the enemy. The pharmaceutical companies are the enemy. You know, it's all designed to keep us fat, and keep to keep us immobile. And to keep us in, you know, the the incurable diseases now that you have to live with for the rest of your life. When Where did these come from? You know, you got to take medication for this. I mean, restless leg syndrome going, what is that? I didn't know people had that. And all of a sudden, I'm finding out all these things that are out there, that now they're pushing, you know, to make money and make money

Unknown: 6:22

off for healthy people. So you got to

dUg Pinnick: 6:25

know there's a cure for cancer. There's a cure for AIDS, we know that

Chuck Shute: 6:30

there's a cure for cancer. I mean, I feel like a lot of it is prevention. You know, I mean, like you said, if you're eating awesome fruits.

dUg Pinnick: 6:37

Yeah, it feels a cure for all this stuff. Think about the billions and billions and billions of dollars. That that that everybody lose that the powers that be and I miss money. I always say follow the money. Whoever's making the most money they they're taking the most from you.

Chuck Shute: 6:58

Mm hmm. No, it's definitely I wouldn't even say that's a conspiracy at this point. I mean, there's definitely a person that does follow the money. See where it goes. Anyway, sorry, we got off on a rabbit hole.

dUg Pinnick: 7:10

Yeah, my last interview, so we're good.

Chuck Shute: 7:13

Okay. Yeah, well, let's, let's get into the music. So I'm sure there's a lot of there's a lot of hardcore fans that really want to hear about this new album. I got to listen. It's cool. I feel like privileged because I got to hear the whole thing. Whereas I think only two singles are out right now for the public. Right? You're at all and the other Let it rain that one? That's a great song. That's such a unique song. It kind of reminds me is that on purpose, the kind of Led Zeppelin riff, like a cashmere kind of thing, or is that just and I just noticed that?

dUg Pinnick: 7:42

You mean in the chorus dad? Yeah, yeah, that's totally Led Zeppelin. I didn't realize when I wrote it. And then when I wrote the song and put it into I was listening to a one day I'm going and that's, that sounds like Led Zeppelin at that part. And I Oh, well. I'm influenced by Led Zeppelin is probably as much as any other band that I've ever listened to. Maybe more Led Zeppelin shit. Are you kidding me? First of all, first real rock. White Rock record I ever heard was Zeppelin too, when I heard a whole lot of love. Right. You know what not I love it. It was a heartbreaker it was arnside. Yeah, I think, well, I can't remember which one. But anyway, it made me get into rock and roll. And I never left it from that point on. So yeah, it's rough rock. I mean, in Booker T and the MGS. Were playing in rough rock like that. And Hendrix. That's where Hendrix got it. And, you know, back in the 60s, a guitar player would play along with the bass player and play that riff. And then why kids got it and turned it on and 12 Yeah, this is how you do it.

Chuck Shute: 8:59

Yeah. Now that one's really cool. And then flood. That's such a it's like a dark song like that. Talk about the lyrics with that one. Because you say, you know, I used to say that all we need is love. But now I think in all we need is a lot of pretty dark.

dUg Pinnick: 9:15

It's a tongue in cheek thing. You got to understand my my dark humor. I have dark humor and a lot of people kind of listen to stand me. And then they think I'm serious. But my point is, you know, on every every line that anybody writes, there's probably a history of lifetime behind that one line. And for me what the reason I said that is because all my life I've tried to solve the problems of the world. I've had the weight of the world on my shoulders in my own mind. How can I get people to just see the middle? How do I just hate division? I hate this. This thing that's always going on. Even as a child I would try to stand up and try to reason With people even though they tell me to shut up and sit down, I'm a little kid. And I'm Anna. And even when I sing about it, even when I was 10, to religion, and everything else, I was still trying to see the balance. What's the balance of this? So I'm turning 70 Look back at my life and my observation of the world, and the nature of human humanity. And I have come to the conclusion that we can we cannot fix this will always be hating on each other will always find conflict with each other. It is who we are, it is our nature. And I took a deep breath and and the pressure left. And I thought, you know, what do I say? Because I don't feel like singing about let's all get together anymore. I just, that's not in my heart. And I started what we need is a flood start this motherfucker over. Saying that all we needed was love. You know, that's what I always said. And now I'm thinking that what we need is a flood. I was like, Yeah, that's what we need. Just drown this kid out and start over again. And then I thought, that is so dark people gonna be upset at me. And I'm thinking, Well, I'm just, you know, this just my humor. Yeah. Laughter about it. Yeah, I think it's

Chuck Shute: 11:17

funny. I like it. Yeah, I didn't. Yeah. You don't want the whole world? And but yeah, I get it, I get what you're saying. Yeah, to the point where like, maybe we should just end it. Like, we're just we're in such a dark place.

dUg Pinnick: 11:29

Yeah. But what I'm saying isn't that we should end it. I'm saying the universe should just start us over again. It's like, whatever is in charge of all this. Good. Yeah. Want to do it again. Or just what nature does, you know, it's like, all we need is another catastrophe, basically, but a flood sounds better because we are, under the belief or scientifically proven that there was a flood in the home, all of mankind was was pretty much wiped out except for a couple of people. So so to say flood, everybody gets what I'm saying?

Chuck Shute: 12:08

No, yeah, that's, that's really cool. That's a it's an interesting perspective.

dUg Pinnick: 12:13

It's funny. We need his immediate

Chuck Shute: 12:18

media or it could be that's what killed the dinosaurs. So who knows, but I think we're gonna do it eventually, that just we're gonna, we're gonna bring it on whether you know, we want it or not, it's gonna happen the way that

dUg Pinnick: 12:29

Yeah, I think the Earth is actually creating some anti fungus to get rid of his, you know, she's whipping up some things to to calm us down, because we are cancer on on this life. That is called under the earth, the earth is a life. To me, it's a life form. I don't know if it has a brain. But it has a ecosystem, it has a life, it survives it, it's self sufficient. And we are one species who has, has really put a we've upset the balance, and has to balance itself back out. And we don't know what the balance is going to be. Because of what we did, you know, and what we're doing. It's like when you scar your body, you know, the scar still is there. You're okay, the Earth, Earth will not be the same, but she will survive and be better than ever, as soon as she gets us back under control.

Chuck Shute: 13:25

Well, yeah, hopefully we're some of us. I'd like to see the next 30 or 40 years, it'd be kind of funny.

dUg Pinnick: 13:31

Yeah. Well, I think you'll make it to that. I don't think it's going anywhere. I think I think it's just going to work itself out. It's going to be different, we're going to have to deal with it. You know, but having we always you know, we've had collegues we've had earthquakes, we've had disasters to manage to manage and, and we keep moving on, it's going to happen here. You know, if we have flash floods, and you know, the valley gets flooded underwater, I'll be standing on top of the house. And if that happens, it's, you know, this is just a part of this. This is why I'm saying I've settled. You know, it's like, it's like, I'll do everything I can to help promote love and peace and survival. But on the other hand, nothing's gonna shock me anymore. And I'm ready. You ain't gonna surprise me. And it's like, you know, I got my backpack. That's

Chuck Shute: 14:21

a healthy perspective to how I love it. Yeah. I feel the same way. I think we're you're you're clearly a middle child, right? You were like 14 Brothers and sisters. You're in the middle, right?

dUg Pinnick: 14:29

On the oldest, or you really have my mother's my dad. But I didn't know my dad till I was 14. And I didn't meet his kid. But yeah, I'm the oldest. My mom skids all seven myths. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 14:43

Okay, so first thing in your middle child like me, because I feel like I'm the peacemaker was trying to and then you've kind of realized to just kind of quit being the peacemaker and give up.

dUg Pinnick: 14:53

I Yeah. I don't know why I've always been the peacemaker. But yeah, The one without responsibility, the one that sees everything that's going around and go, don't get it. If you just do this, you did that, which made him do that. And then you did that. And neither one of you are listening to each other because you all you just emotionally got nothing to do with that. And then you know, and you just kind of go, oh, this is so exhausting how people cannot see beyond their, their world. And me included, you know, I've been in that corner many times, Doug, shake me up and go down. Unless you're not saying this correctly. Stop it and go, oh, oh, God, there you go. You know, you just got to be open to it. Well, you

Chuck Shute: 15:42

have an interesting perspective, too, because you were raised Christian, and you were a Christian. I mean, the band was kind of a Christian band a start, and then you kind of went away from that. And so you've kind of been on both sides of it.

dUg Pinnick: 15:54

Yeah. Yeah. Because we never started out to be a Christian band, we're just three guys were Christians who went to church and, and we put this band together. And I said, from the beginning, and this is we're not going to do churches, we're not going to put Christian on anything that we do. We're not going to do Christian interviews, we're not going to do anything that has to do a Christian, we're gonna go out into the world and make music like any other band, and be who we are, and make music. And that's what we tried to do. You know, people are gonna pigeonhole you, sooner or later. And they did very quickly. But we just kept pushing forward as to who we were, instead of what everybody wanted us to be. I mean, Ty always said, we probably could have been a huge Christian band, if we had just bowed down to the altar, you know, and did the altar calls and did little preaching. During this. During the shows and stuff, we could have ruled the Christian world. We were told that and we know that it's fake. It's not what we're here to do. You know, we have our doubts about faith, and we're trying to figure it out ourselves. You know, I'm not gonna go out there and try to change somebody's mind. You know, about what they're doing. I'm not sure if what I'm doing is right. And so, you know, for me, now, it's fine. You're, you know, and like, I like in this song. Give it up, you know, there's a line that I got the last 1/3 verses, and if you found your groove, hang on to whatever keeps you basically I'm saying whatever gets you through the night. It's all right.

Chuck Shute: 17:36

I love that song, too. That's another one. That's so that's the latest single right, that's so good. It's such a great riff. And then, yeah, it's kind of another one that's a little bit darker. Because you're like, I'm never gonna give it up until the lights go out. I may not know what's over there. I'm gonna stick around until they put me under, and I am all I know. Right? it out until it's over. Like that's,

dUg Pinnick: 17:58

that's so that's so real to me. You know, I don't know what's going to happen when I die. Somebody comes and says, you're going to stand before God, you're gonna have to bump up? What? How do you know anything? Nobody has come back and told any of us what's going on. You can go down the rabbit hole of theories and videos and near death experiences, in a totally believing from whatever your experience is, I still will stand there and say, You do not know until it happens. And no one has come back to tell us what's happened. They have,

Chuck Shute: 18:37

do you think there's something because that's the one thing like my dad wrote a book actually about this. And then

dUg Pinnick: 18:44

my point is, is that whatever is over there, it's over there. And we're gonna get there and find out. The rest of it is a waste of your lifetime, trying to be and live for something that you don't know what's going to happen when you get over there. You spent your whole lifetime not lying, or not having sex outside of marriage or, or not. caring enough for someone or not giving enough or, or whatever your whole lifetime and guilt because you haven't done enough of what you think you're supposed to have done to get to this next place in your life when you die. It's like you spent your whole life and even will die for all these things that you don't know is true. To me. That doesn't make sense logical to me, to me, it doesn't make any sense. It just doesn't. And then I just can't get in. So for me, it's what's my biggest fear. I might not like, what's over there. It's like because I don't know what's over there. I'm going to stick around until I They put me under, it's like, I'm gonna keep on doing what I do and live my life and trying to figure it out until I die. That's it. And all I know is I'm here. So let's keep on going. Right it out, right? Yeah, you know, it's gonna be over before you know it. And that's the other thing about suicide. It's going, Dude, why you want to kill yourself? You know, it doesn't make sense. I mean, it doesn't make sense to me even no matter what you're going through or how hard it is, it doesn't make sense. And I understand there are people that want it done legitimately, probably should, you know, people have terminal diseases, and people are sick. And you know, and I know, when you're having a panic attack, this like, all you want to do is die, and you want it to stop. I get it. My point is, listen to these, this this line, in this song, and in maybe that will give you a few seconds to not pull the trigger.

Chuck Shute: 21:01

That's good. Yeah. Cuz I don't want people to, to just end their lives because of this. I mean, if something could be trivial, a panic attack, right? Temporary, you don't want a permanent decision for a temporary problem,

dUg Pinnick: 21:13

right? Well, you know, when people have problems, they have panic attacks and bring them on. And so the panic attack, the cause of the panic attack is whatever the trauma is going through. And that's why in so compound, you know, the only way to get out of it just ended. And I felt those feelings before. And, you know, I have I have empathy for that, you know, I've had them, you know, how did you deal with it? That voice inside my head, some people everyday, say, half the people in the world have a voice in their head, and the other half, don't, I have a voice that talks to me, never stops talking to me. And when it was happening, says, hang on, you get over this, just hold on, hold on, you're gonna die, you're gonna be okay, just go, okay. And the rest of the time, the world is crashing crashing down on me. But that voice always, I've always had that voice, no matter what's happened in my life, that voice stops and says Just calm down and go into this little world. And I just let it ride out. I remember going over a cliff into a 25 foot by one of my car hydroplaned, going 50 miles an hour down down the feeder Road in Texas. And my car ended up in the water and sunk up to the window. But be about two hours before that it was all the way up to the brim. Because in Texas, the water would always come up 25 feet in the bayou and then would go down. So I was lucky but and I've always had a thing about if if you ever are in your car, and you hit the water, what he's gonna do. And I remember I was going over the going thing, my car was sliding. And I was going into the water and I remember I put my finger on the window and roll the window down before I hit the water. And then I remember when I hit the water, unbuckled my belt and looked around and saw the car wasn't stinking, no lower than the water was almost about to come to the window, it hadn't started to seep to the rest of the car yet. And I thought it's not going to sink. So get out of the car, grab your phone, and I stood on top of the car, and called a record, and a friend of mine, and they couldn't find me at first because the car was so low that you couldn't see it off the highway. And so I'm gonna well, they can't find me. So what do I do? And so I jumped in the water and it was up to my waist, which was lucky. Somebody told me that their water moccasins should have been me. But I walked through the water and back up to the top of the hill and waved the record and the policeman came. And um, but that voice in my head, just kept saying you're okay, because I'm afraid of water and I can't swim. Oh, shit. And I've always had you know, I've always gone over this to my head, what will happen? If you go over that bridge and hit that water? Even you do? And, you know, I in my head, don't panic. Remember, just make sure there's air in your stomach and you float. Don't worry, you know, you'll be okay. You know, there's all these things go miss this. Like I said, all my whole life is worse. It's always talked to me. Wow, that was a lie. Yeah. Sorry.

Chuck Shute: 24:27

That's a cry. Never heard that story before. What year was that?

dUg Pinnick: 24:34

Oh, that was back when I lived in Texas. And actually, no, it was about 10 years ago now because I had moved to LA and I went back to Texas. My brother was living in my house at the time I sold it now. But I went home and I had went out that night Houston, and it rained all day and I was driving home and I had I had just got a different car because I got in the correct. moving to California and I got a new car car and I hit hydro planned in that car went into the water and it was totaled. So within six months, I totaled two cars. Wow. Yeah. And so yeah, but that's the only time it's ever happened.

Chuck Shute: 25:18

Okay, well okay, so anyways, back to the mute. This is crazy. Fun, but I want to get through these. I want to promote the sounds I'm trying to do my job here trying to help you. Yes, I love the songs. What was the one though? That sounds like? Because I heard you say that you are a fan of Temple of the dog. And I thought nothing but the truth had a little bit of that sound. Do you agree with that? No. I don't know for some reason.

dUg Pinnick: 25:48

Nothing. Nothing but the truth is my purple right? Oh, yeah, I could see that too. That's what I was thinking about. I want to hear from you. Not me. It's just it's totally Prince. Yeah. In my in my opinion, tempo and dog is I love that record. And what blew my mind about that record was that when Jeff Amon put probes and together, they will come Mookie Blaylock and they did not have a record deal. And they went to the studio and did a demo and he sent me a cassette of it. And inside to have it was simple and now I had never as bad motors finger hadn't come out yet. So I had only heard the first couple Soundgarden records all I knew Chris Cornell as a screamer. And, and I hear this song. This whole it was like five songs by template dog. And I wonder who is this singer and I am jealous. And I have some competition here. I really that was the first time I ever heard a singer, a singer. And in that time, then I'm going whoa, this guy's kind of going where I go. You know? And he's got this soul and this kind of thing, and I'm gonna Wow. And I wanted to hear more. And then I found that it was Chris Cornell later, and I told his wife to tell him that and we have become friends after that. I'm a big fan of you, right? Yes, we both fans of each other huge fans. But I remember when I heard the dog when I heard reached out and picked this guy up I thought Robin Trower. I mean, I don't know. That kind of sounds like and then when he's saying. So that's it. You even reminded me of Robin Trower. And Robin Trower singer had this soulful kind of fat voice like Chris used on that album. So okay, so so all those things went through my mind when that song Yeah. Yeah. Unbelievable. Yeah. And I was speaking to Curtis Mayfield also. Okay, so

Chuck Shute: 27:57

I thought the one I thought kind of sounded Soundgarden. Actually, I would call this Soundgarden meets Red Hot Chili Peppers. Watcher. I thought that song kind of had a Soundgarden riff.

dUg Pinnick: 28:08

Yeah, but it doesn't look good. I love it. You know, I love Soundgarden. But Soundgarden kings X came out at the same time in Soundgarden and kings x, we're doing the weird tuning things at the same time, right? And me and Chris would talk about that stuff at the same time. I even even in 19 719 85, ty popped up before we got a record deal, and wrote Pleiades and it was dropped detune and he played it for us. And when I heard this drop, the thing that I had never heard before the Beatles gone Black Sabbath kind of vibe. I went home into my guitar down and, and the first Kings X record was dropped deed completely, and I had never heard anybody really had done that much before. I mean, later on, I found out other people have done that. But at that time, it was something new to me. And when Soundgarden Oh, and when hanging out with Kim fails, he told me 1985 He had introduced drop D tuning to Chris Cornell same year. And me and Chris, I think both took those that that that idea inland with it. And we laughed about it. We talked about the different tunings that we've used on different songs. And and so so there's, it's, we're running neck and neck a lot of ways I think we pushed each other in many ways, and we've seen each other live. We've been wild by each other. And every time Chris would see me He kissed me on the lips no matter where it was. He walked offstage. I'm big old kids. Yeah, all the time. I love that guy.

Chuck Shute: 29:51

Wow, that is so cool. You guys had a really special one. That's so sad. Yeah,

dUg Pinnick: 29:57

we didn't hang up very often. We didn't talk Very often and you know, I'm not like I would never say we were best friends or anything. But when we were together, it was a very, very, very deep, special moment of time that you just don't forget. We were in like each other's bubble. And it was always amazing time.

Chuck Shute: 30:18

You never wrote a song together though or did music.

dUg Pinnick: 30:21

I asked him to sing on my strong sumup record and he couldn't find the time. And when I did give him the record, he says this record you want me to single and going? Yeah, because I'm sorry. The next time okay. No problem. No, and then, you know, our lives move on.

Chuck Shute: 30:41

Yeah, tragedy. I hate that one. And Chester Bennington. I mean, it's just the list is too long. I hate it. I

dUg Pinnick: 30:46

hate Yeah, yeah.

Chuck Shute: 30:48

Yeah, so then I feel like a lot of the other songs on the record too are, which is funny, because I know we talked about this last time now you're really not a Beatles fan. But there's definitely a lot of Beatles type sound on this record. Would you agree with that? Yeah. Oh, yeah. Okay.

dUg Pinnick: 31:04

I'll explain it real quick. I tried to make this real quick. I'm not a Beatle thing. What happened was, when you're 14 years old, and the Beatles first come on the scene, and then for the next 20 years, all you hear is be the it didn't matter where you were, what you did, you're a Beatles, and anything that a musician, if you're listening to music, and there's things that you're inspired by and you like and you hear, you're going to incorporate it into your repertoire of what you create. And the Beatles, they did a lot of things that were just just a one off contribution in songwriting. And so yeah, I use a lot of Beatles stuff, but I don't play Beatle records. I never really liked them. When it comes to just sitting down and just get enamored by Paul Ringo or whatever. I didn't get it. But for music or for music theory, and, and, and, and inspiration. Oh, yeah. Beatles were. Were there, you know, time Jerry knew knew every little grunt and groan of the diesels there. They're from they were fans. And I think when we all get together, it just comes out. You know, what else you gonna do?

Chuck Shute: 32:16

When they sing on a few of the songs like a lot of it's all God's children. Is that more to tie right that one?

dUg Pinnick: 32:23

Yeah. Any song? Any song that that? We sing we wrote? Yeah, that's, that's a deep song. I love it. When I first heard it. I'm going oh my god, this is heavy. And then it goes off into adventure. Oh, man, it's like, okay, this is we're gonna put this on the record. This is. This is in King's X moment.

Chuck Shute: 32:46

Yeah, cuz it says, it's about like, you know, the misunderstood, misunderstood songs of the bunch. It's about people who call themselves Christians, but then they do a lot of non Christian things, which I think you told me about last time how like, you kind of noticed that when you guys were playing with like Petra and some of these other Christian bands. A lot of them were kind of like the Christian man's but then they're doing all that. And I had Michael Sweet from stripe, Ron, he was telling me, there was some of the same stuff going on with his band. And when he saw a lot of that as well, which I really enjoyed. Have you ever met him over time with

dUg Pinnick: 33:19

me, we had a really great hang out one time on the Monsters of Rock. And they they were playing or he was playing. I can't remember who I was playing. But it was a monster Rock Tour on the on the boat. And me and him had a couple of drinks and just sat and talked for hours and hours about our experience. In Christian dome, it was pretty cool. That's

Chuck Shute: 33:45

really good. Because you two are it's funny, you kind of I feel like you two are kind of different. Because he's, he's still live in the Christian thing. And you're like, I'm not a Christian. Yeah, but you're both Oh, interesting.

dUg Pinnick: 33:55

And what I love about him, and about what I've learned is we just have to accept each other for our beliefs and find the common ground. When there was never an argument there was never a misunderstanding or any judgment. He's just he's a true Christian who cares and loves from people. And which, you know, that's all you want. You just don't want to be around hypocrites, you know, and, you know, it's hard enough trying not to be a hypocrite yourself and then having to follow the rules and regulations and live in that world. You can't you can't do it. And if you're not perfect, then you know, you don't fit in the crowd and you got to be amongst the perfect but cry out and say you're not and it's just it's just I won't even go into that. That was such a mindfuck for me that that you know, people go you know, come back and I'm going there's no way it was child abuse for me. For you. It was you know, gives you life and peace and love and joy and purpose. You know, for me, child abuse.

Chuck Shute: 34:59

Why? But you went through as a Christian? Yes. Yeah. Good. Is it now today? Like, yeah, because I remember you told me last time that you were you went through like a period, it was like three days where you didn't eat and you fasted, and you tried to like, stay away and all this stuff. Yeah. Like, what is what are your thoughts on that now? Because I think don't they have like, what did they call them like, not not concentration camps, but like, transformation camps or something where they transform gay kids. On those things,

dUg Pinnick: 35:29

it is such bullshit. It is such being bullshit. And that's all I can say about it. Because to go down that rabbit hole, I'd have to go down the bliss of how that hurts people and destroys people, it doesn't bring them any closer to God. And even the ones that come out saying they're okay, I got something about that, too. But anyway, we won't go into that. What I've just been learning, you know, because I'm still just, I'm still open minded to whatever is true. And there are a lot of scriptures in the Bible, that don't say gay, but they were David and Jonathan, Jonathan and David loved each other more than their wives. When Jonathan died, and Jonathan's I mean, you know, it's like, you look at that, or Jesus, and one of his disciples, puts his head in his breast, and Jesus says, this is, this is my love, you know, and then when he's dying, he says to Mary, he says, to someone, oh, he says, The apostles when he came back, go feed my sheep. But he says to this disciple, to his mother, Mary, and so this is your son, you take care of. So that was his love. You know, it's like you I mean, I know people who disagree with me. But, you know, you go to the Bible, and you find out there was a lot of that going on in the Bible never said anything was wrong. Never, ever did. But it doesn't matter, because people won't believe it. They, you know, society says there's something wrong with it. So they're going to believe that all I can say is, if you're gay, be gay. And and it's, it's worse to live your life being somebody that you and, and, and someone said to me, one time I had an uncle came up to me, he's here younger than me, like, I got a big family. But he says, Doug, why did you choose to be gay, and I'm going, would you think someone would choose to be hated by the world, to be rejected by the world to be thrown out of your home, to be embarrassed to have to live in a closet, they have to live a lie, they have to live in the insecurity of that to be fired from your job. And then the poor ones that they can't hide that they're gay, and they're like, look like women, and they act like woman and then the what they get shit on, and how strong they are, and they can keep going. You know, and you think it's a choice? Are you fucking kidding me? Are you fucking kidding me? It's just as it's as stupid as question I've ever heard in my life. Because the thing is, they don't understand. If you're bisexual, you can go either way. If you're kinky, Oh, you like women, but you let a guy suck your dick. But you don't say Don't let nobody know. You. I'm saying all that shit is going out there. So that's why people think it's a choice. Because those people can choose whether they go either way or not. in whatever capacity it is, but a gay person. In our hearts, we do not like, you know, the opposite sex and there's nothing we can do about it. We felt it our whole fucking life.

Chuck Shute: 39:04

And you even tried like you just had you tried to pray the gay it didn't work. So we

dUg Pinnick: 39:08

have we all try. We all try our best to most gay people and then tried to have sex with a woman I tried to find tried to do something to make see what's wrong with me. You know, I mean, it's just sad. It's so sad. That that religion tortures people that much. If you go to society, the Romans, the Greeks, were no problems with it ever married and had abortions. You know, it was like, society was different back then. This is just, this is just the evangelical prison.

Chuck Shute: 39:39

It's interwoven. I feel like it's changing too. There's a lot of churches now that are gay friendly. I mean, there are still some that are like, going to hell and that kind of stuff. But then it's so interesting to me. It's like different interpretations of

dUg Pinnick: 39:51

an event even Yeah, that's the thing is, it's like, yeah, they're gay friendly. The thing is, if you're gonna follow Religion and so you're supposed to follow the whole thing and follow the guy down say, Don't Don't say God says this, But he meant that it was it's okay. But this is okay no find it, and then break it down and tell me what it means. I mean, read the Bible in Aramaic, and you will find that it almost has nothing to do with the King James Version. Almost nothing. And people still won't, won't go do that. You know, I mean, the New Testament, the Bible has been translated what, five or six times, you know, and at that point, words really mean the same thing. It's just not that we believe in something. It's faith, you have to have faith that that's the rub. That's the cult on it. You have to believe without any reason, you have to believe that is a cult. I don't care how big it is. It's still toast.

Chuck Shute: 41:05

I wanted Michael Sweet say when you told him that.

dUg Pinnick: 41:08

He didn't say anything. But I didn't tell him that. But he would probably look at me and say, yep, it really is. And I still believe that Jesus died for my sins. Now go give me five. That's what it's all about. At the end of the day is the belief in Jesus, He died for your sins, and you're gonna go to heaven. And then the whole the whole thing. And at the end of the day, when when a Christian says, I believe that Jesus is my Savior, and I will, you know, and he's my, and I pray everyday to him, I go, I ain't gonna argue with you about that. But all the rest of this shit all the rest of this shit. We can fight all day about it anyway. Right?

Chuck Shute: 41:46

So what is your life philosophy now? Because now you've you've kind of left the church and the Christian stuff behind. You just tried to do unto others? I mean, or what is do you have, like a belief or just?

dUg Pinnick: 41:57

Yeah, do unto others as you would have them do unto you. And, and and there is a thing called negative and positive energy, whether you're Christian or not, there's god, there's the devil, it's negative, it's positive. The Bible says, resist the devil who flee from you. Well, I say, resist the negativity, speak of positive things, fill your life with positive things in the negativity, really, it's all the same principle. It's just, it doesn't have an aid. You know, I mean, we're all on the same path. We're all trying to find the same piece from the same source. We're just the confusion is, is what, what it all entails that we don't have anything to do. And how we tried to control each other with it and Lord over each other with all this knowledge that we supposedly have, we can't prove. But what you believe in your heart, that's what you should go for. And believe it, you know, and leave me alone. Don't come to me and tell me that I'm gonna go to hell because, okay, you worry about your life, make sure that you are okay with the universe or whatever you believe. You know, I'm okay. I will deal with my universe. And that's what people in religions don't want to let you do. They want you to be like them. Because they're afraid that if they let you be you, then you're going to take them or change their children, or change their way of life. And I get it, but that's too bad.

Chuck Shute: 43:35

Yeah, but then, like you said, I mean, you sat with Michael Sweet and talk to him for hours. So that and I like that I like when people I don't want everyone to believe the same thing I do. I want to just I want to understand people that believe different things. I like hearing different perspectives. And that's why I do the show. Like, I like hearing all the different I like having Michael Sweet on and listen to his perspectives. I like having your perspectives. I mean, it's interesting. I want to understand people.

dUg Pinnick: 43:59

Yeah. Because we all have we all come from somewhere. And we all have our personal beliefs through our journey, you know, and none of us can discredit the other. But we can surely raise questions as to validity. You know, what you're saying, you know, I don't like bullshit, I want if you're going to talk to me about something, tell me something that's going to benefit me and help me understand where you're coming from, you know, I want to know, so that maybe that my judging you, in my subconscious can can be, you know, fixed. You know, because we're all judges of some people. We are prejudiced. We have we're all racist in some ways. There's, you know, that's just who we are. You know, we have things that we look at a person go, it doesn't matter, we there's millions. We just have to recognize that. And people are people. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 44:57

And don't you think when you get to know somebody better than you sit down with them and spend time with them. You start to realize how you're more similar to that person rather than different.

dUg Pinnick: 45:07

Yes. And sometimes you found out how different you are.

Chuck Shute: 45:12

Yeah, like, whatever your preconception. Yeah. When you get to know that usually changing,

dUg Pinnick: 45:17

right? It does, it always does. And like somebody says to me one time, they said, Ask anybody or No, tell him. He said, anybody you meet, you have a gay relative, whether you know it or not. And I thought, wow, that is true.

Chuck Shute: 45:36

Yeah, I mean, what is the I don't know, I forget the numbers. Is it 5%? Or

dUg Pinnick: 45:40

10% 10%? Okay, yeah, that's, that's the same amount as black people in America. So.

Chuck Shute: 45:47

Okay, so what's harder? In 2022? Would you say? It's hard? Is it harder to be a black man, a gay man or Christian? What do you think is the hardest thing in 2022? Man, that's

dUg Pinnick: 46:05

weird to say, I think it's hard on all of everything. Because, I mean, on one hand, LG, BT Q, I don't even know how to say it. There's so many letters now. But But there has been so much done to accept. But then on the other hand, there's been so much done to drag it under the carpet again, you know, I think in everything, it's been that way. The 80s, MTV came out and put all this stuff on MTV and said that everybody's cool, you can be gay you can be this can be that you can be half and half. Everybody loves everybody. And all of a sudden, the 80s everybody was all okay, you know, and then MTV disappears. And we're back to our tribes again, because of politics and things. So, you know, I don't know what's better. As for Christians, true, a true Christian, I think they're fine, and they will be fine. Just like a gay person, I'll be fine. I've been fine my whole life. You know, I'm getting through life and deal with life as it goes in a real Christian ones that just want to raise your family, love each other, go to church and get live a good life, you know, they will have that life is what you make it. But those those people who are misled, who are taught that they deserve to know those people that are being being made to be afraid, you know, because a lot of people in the church are afraid. And I remember, this is going to experience I remember, back in the 70s, before I started smoking weed, I was told by my pastor that smoking weed, opens your soul up to demons, and you will have evil spirits coming in. And we believe that and we prayed against it. And we did our church services. And a pastor talked about the evils of weed and satanic and all the rituals that they did with it and stuff. So one time I was out with some friends who weren't Christians, who were Jesus, Jesus freaks at the time. That's what we call us back in the 70s. And this kid pulled out a drink, start smoking it and I started shaking, I was so scared. I thought the devil was gonna come in, and I just didn't know what to do. And I had to go pray. And I thought to myself, this is what an aspect of religion does to you, it makes you afraid of something that you shouldn't be afraid of. And what's going on right now, in the church is these pastors are preaching, be afraid, be afraid of the transgenders. Be afraid of the gays, be afraid of these people, and the Mexicans and the people, you know, be afraid, because they're coming to change you to change your way of life, to push you back in the corner and take everything from you. They don't deserve it like we've, we've worked for. We've been, it's our heritage, this is ours, and they're coming in to change it. We can't have that. I'm afraid. That's what I'm seeing. And that's what, you know, as soon as people are not afraid, they'll all all can live in the same neighborhood, because they're all making the same amount of money. They all got a car, they're all kids are all going to school, everybody's happy. You know, but the society has to have this. You know, well, we won't even go down that rabbit hole I can go on and on a

Chuck Shute: 49:45

good point. It's the fear. It's the fear that the people push that fear and I feel like it's what's your brand of fear, right? If you turn on the news, or if you turn on CNN, they're pushing fear. They're pushing sides of fear but they're pushing fear. That's What I'm trying to say COVID are transgender. Yeah,

dUg Pinnick: 50:04

I say this transgender, okay, we have handicapped bathrooms, just put a fucking transgender and a handicap on the goddamn door and walk away. Okay, there are solutions. You know, there are so many solutions to things in it. See, because people aren't looking at the solution. They're looking at the fear. I don't want a transgender male walking into the men's women's bathroom with my daughter in there. That's not gonna happen very often. And even if it does, that transgendered thinks she feels a woman she's not gonna hurt anybody. But on the other hand, I understand the fear. So put the sign on the handicap.

Chuck Shute: 50:55

Solve the problem problem solving products.

dUg Pinnick: 51:00

Easier said than done? Yeah, no.

Chuck Shute: 51:03

Oh, yeah. Let's lighten things up a little bit. We've gone dark stuff. Here's some funny stuff. I thought was funny. So Tommy Lee, your buddy, you bought you smoked weed? Sure. He posts a dick pic. I just wanted to get your thoughts on that. Like, because at first I was like, Oh, that's pretty funny. And then some people were mad because they're saying like, if he went out and exposed himself in public, he'd be in jail. But because he did it on social media, it was okay. And so I was like, Ah, I never thought of that. But I was. I want to get your take on that.

dUg Pinnick: 51:32

Well, you know, I wish I had the balls at Tommy Lee. He just did it. I mean, come on. He puts it out. He puts it out there and says oops on the table was like It's like it's obvious. He did it on purpose. Just to see what what happened and he got what he wanted. He got everybody talking purpose. That's important. People don't get it. Publicity stunt.

Chuck Shute: 51:55

Those guys are so fucking are those the best motley crew their publicity geniuses? Like?

dUg Pinnick: 52:01

Yes. And that's, you know, whatever it is, he got the attention that he needed. And I'm jealous because I wish I had the balls to do that. And you and you would too, if you if you, you know, looked at the world like he did. Like he does, right. And at the end of the day, they're gonna take it down anyway. So we'll see. And, and even if he goes to jail for it, he'll get out the same day. He's got lawyers and B tests. No problem. Tommy does what he wants to do. As long as I've known Tommy, Tommy, he does, but he wants to. But the other thing is a friend of mine texted me. I can't believe Tony did that. And I go, What do you mean, he did that? We all saw him. Fuck Pamela. All of us did, right. And he looked up and said, Yeah, we did. And we going in that was 100 years ago. That's it. So why is everybody like going? Oh, my God. Right. Get out of here. Right? Hey, everybody's talking. I thought it was cute. I haven't asked him to talk about it. I just talked to Nick yesterday. I never mentioned Tommy to him or the other guys. We just have our own little world. Yeah. But what are

Chuck Shute: 53:08

your hours of I'm so curious that these conversations,

dUg Pinnick: 53:12

just life in general, you know, we love to make fun of things and just talk about future projects and music and stuff. You know, he's an awesome guy. He really really is.

Unknown: 53:24

Are you gonna come on his solo record?

dUg Pinnick: 53:26

Um, we talked we actually well, his solo record. Um, no, but it's done. But we are talking about doing another project together. Just you know, it takes me a long time to get what he wants done, but put it this way. We're always talking about stuff. We'll see what happens in the future.

Chuck Shute: 53:44

You're on so many frickin side projects. I love it. You got the you're doing a new K XM record with George Lynch and Ray from corrente. Right.

dUg Pinnick: 53:52

That's in that's in the conversation that we haven't gotten any further than that. But it will happen.

Chuck Shute: 53:58

Okay, and then you have you have a new well, not new but it's joy bomb 2021 Was your solo record. There's a grinder blues. There's so many like side projects. But my I think my thing is like you got to can't wait this long between kings X records because this record is so good. People need to hear it. It sounds contemporary but yet, like classic there's, it's a eclectic. It's so many things that sounds fresh. I think that's the biggest thing to me is it sounds like a fresh new record. I feel like rock kind of stuck in like 2002 and it just kind of everything sounded like that Shinedown Nickelback kind of sound which is fine. But now you kind of shook it up with this new record.

dUg Pinnick: 54:38

And thank you. Well, this is what we wanted. We never thought that it would turn out like that and that people would say that but you know our dreams. So far dreams come true. In that aspect. You know, I mean being together for 40 years and taken 14 years often make a record. We didn't do it on purpose either. Time Jerry just didn't feel like we had anything to offer. After after 14 records, it's like, what are you going to do? We're going to put out, shut out another record, you know? And I'm going well, yeah. And I kept writing and I write and I've gotten a couple of side projects and even trace mountain, you know, Jeff Amon, Mike McCready, from Pearl Jam. I did a whole bunch of stuff and wrote all kinds of songs. And I wrote about 50 tunes. And I just figured, you gotta write a lot of tunes to find good 10 good ones, you know, you can't just write five songs and think they're all gonna be good. And, um, so finally, I remember my side of the story is I remember we were on the road, and we were hanging out doing something, I pulled out my little boombox and I said, Hey, guys, I got a couple songs I want to play for you that I wrote. You know, this is about four years ago now. And I played a couple of songs in time Jerry went, wow. I like that. And Jerry goes, Wow, I feel encouraged. And then it both said, man, well, I got some songs too, maybe we should think about this. And and that's how it started. And a couple years later, we finally got together and and did everything we need to do to make this record. We got together and pull a bunch of songs together and pick the songs that we liked and everybody contributed. And no fighting no freak outs, no, no anything we just went in and had a good time making this record. And it was it was kind of like being with a bunch of old friends that you haven't seen in a long time. You know, and it made me realize what I have with King's X is special you know complying with all the other bands which is takes nothing away from the other bands I learned a lot playing with other bands and in and it was it was an incredible experience. And now I appreciate kings X even more.

Chuck Shute: 56:59

I love it. I love it you guys are making new music now if you do shows me or you're gonna do shows what songs we're gonna make the setlist because I noticed like the first I think the first Kings XR I ever heard was black flag and I love that song. It's so catchy. But I noticed you don't play it on the setlist anymore with that.

dUg Pinnick: 57:18

We did we did it a lot actually. On the last. Wow. Yeah. And the last 10 years, it was always as I said, you must have missed out on it. We dropped it a couple of the last time we went out which was a couple weeks ago. It's just it's just so it should be to do that. And last in Germany, I kid no more. That's wrong. It's a marathon, all the vocals, all the harmonies all. It's a lot of work. But you know, Kings X has always been notorious if we got to record, we're gonna do almost a whole record. Oh, really? Yeah, we we've always done that. And then we fade into the songs that, you know, we settled into, and songs get dropped after a while. But um, yeah, we want to do everything but swipe up, because I don't think we can swipe up is one of those songs where we'd have to, we have to practice that for a month for five hours a day, like we did want to be loved. Okay,

Chuck Shute: 58:19

that everybody needs to get the new record. It's amazing. And you guys are making great music. I think you're on top of your game. I don't know, maybe for whatever my opinions worth. So hopefully people will agree with me.

dUg Pinnick: 58:29

I appreciate them. And I really do you're not the person said that. And that means a lot when people are consistent consistently saying that. It's encouraging. Yeah, this is what we do. Yeah, absolutely.

Chuck Shute: 58:43

Well, I always end each episode with a charity. I think last time you gave a shout out to Compassion International shownotes as well as your king's X website, of course.

dUg Pinnick: 58:52

I don't mean, I didn't know what I would say is

Chuck Shute: 58:55

I'll put it in the show notes. Now. It's all good.

dUg Pinnick: 58:57

Okay. It's shout out to compassion. Yeah, compassion

Chuck Shute: 59:01

or national. I think that's what you mentioned last time. So if people have a few extra dollars after they buy the new kings X record or they preorder it, then they can throw a few dollars that way to donate.

dUg Pinnick: 59:11

Okay, yeah, and take a shout out to Compassion International. They're a bunch of people who take care of kids that don't have any money to go to school, they feed them. It's only $21 a month and you can sponsor a kid for their whole the whole time they go to school, and they get a good meal. They teach them a lot of cool things and you get letters from them and pictures. It's really cool. So give a shout out to Compassion International. Okay. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 59:42

Thanks so much, Doug. This is fun. I love your opinions. I love the music. So

dUg Pinnick: 59:48

I have opinions. I love

Chuck Shute: 59:50

it. Fascinating. Thanks, Doug. I'll see you later. Thank you again to Doug Pinnick. So open and real with me, I think But that makes for a great interview. I really enjoyed it and whether you agree or disagree with some of his viewpoints, it's interesting to hear because he has real, real experience. Over seven years on this earth. I found it fascinating. And one thing we can all probably agree on is that kings X is a great rock band and they are putting out great music. And I think if you're a fan, you're going to love this new record. So check it out, see the band, buy the merch, support them. And if you enjoyed this episode, well let me know in the comments, and make sure to subscribe so that you catch all the future episodes. Thank you for listening. And remember, shoot for the moon.