Keith Douglas Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/keithdouglas_torax2/

Chuck Shute Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/chuck_shute/

St. Jude's Children's Hosptial:
https://www.stjude.org

Support the show

Thanks for Listening & Shute for the Moon!

Listen on

Apple Podcasts Spotify Amazon Music Podcast Index Overcast Stitcher +

Share Episode

Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Share on LinkedIn

Keith Douglas Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/keithdouglas_torax2/

Chuck Shute Instagram:
https://www.instagram.com/chuck_shute/

St. Jude's Children's Hosptial:
https://www.stjude.org

Support the show

Thanks for Listening & Shute for the Moon!

Speaker 1: 0:24

[inaudible][inaudible]

Chuck Shute: 0:25

welcome to the chuck shoot podcast. Really excited today. We've got another special guest. Uh, he is Keith Douglas. He is the guitarist for the band Torah Torah, um, which was a big pretty big hard rock group back in the late eighties, early nineties. Uh, they toured with a lot of big bands. Um, and some of you tuned into this episode specifically to hear the interview with him. Uh, some of you may have no idea who he is and I'm sure that you will learn quite a bit about him as well as the band after this, uh, uh, episode is over. Um, but today's exciting day too because, uh, NFL season is back. NFL Pre season starts tonight. Um, so that's always a exciting thing for me. I'm a big football fan, so I think it's the Broncos and the falcons. Ah, I mean it's, uh, not two of my favorite teams, but, uh, I prefer football. I prefer even preseason football as opposed to, uh, baseball. But that's just me. Um, other thing that's going on, I just saw there's a new terantin Tina movie out once upon a time in Hollywood. I just saw it last night. Um, wow. Uh, it was, it was a long movie. It was a kind of a departure for him, I would say. Um, definitely it kind of reminds me in a way of stranger things in the sense that there's a big nostalgia piece to it, but I didn't grow up in the 60s, so I didn't, it didn't have that nostalgia effect. Like, oh, I remember, I remember this and I remember that. But I think if you grew up in the 60s, you might appreciate it. Appreciate that piece of that Ostalgie piece. Um, but I will get my full review of this movie, whether I think it's a good movie or a bad movie. Um, that will probably be on the chuck and Josh podcast. That's my other podcast that I do where we talk music, movies, news, our personal lives. A little bit of sports too, but, uh, that, uh, episode will probably be next Thursday, so stay tuned for that. I'll give you my full review of the Terantin a movie. Um, and today I think I just want to focus on, uh, Keith Douglas, the guitars from tour tour and the band tour Torah. Um, so I found this band, I grew up in Seattle in the 90s, so I kind of caught the tail end of the, the hard rock, what they call the hair metal, uh, phase of rock, I guess it was a late eighties, early nineties. I started to get into that kind of stuff in the prior on 92 was when I first got into it. I listened to a skid row record and, uh, this girl play and I was like kind of blown away. So I started getting into, I started listening to skid row guns and roses and then started getting into the poisons. And then I started just trying to absorb all of it. I mean also in the, and the Megadeath and the heavier stuff. But I listened to a lot. I even listened to the Seattle stuff, Nirvana, Alison chains, Pearl Jam, all that stuff. But, um, I remember in the mid nineties, I got this compilation, it was called youth gone wild. And, um, it was just a compilation of, you know, each band had one song and there's a song called walking shoes on there and it was by tour tour. Never heard of the band, never heard the song. Uh, it was like the fourth song in or something. And it kind of like, I think it was the best song on the record. It kind of blew me away. I was like, Whoa, what is this? Cause it starts off with this kind of Bluesy riff and it's like they aren't, they aren't, they're almost like a, like a bloop, almost like country really. It's really bluesy like Stevie Ray Vaughan or, um, like a BB King Bluesy riff. And then it just hits heavy boom. And it Kinda, you kind of go, wow, well what the hell was that? So I thought that song was awesome. Then I kinda tried to, I think I tried to find the bands, other albums, couldn't find them. Um, I think they're out of print at the time. Um, so kinda just didn't really think much of it, but did like that song. I think it wasn't until years later that I was able to either find the CDs or I don't know if it was through iTunes or something. Somehow I ended up getting more songs from the band and I was like, oh, the, the other songs are good too. What the heck? So, um, then I, that's when I really became more of a fan of the band. And then of course I wanted to see the live, but I think at the time they hadn't been, they would broken up for like 15 or 20 years. Um, and now they're back together. They have new album out and they're actually on tour, which is also amazing cause I think they've mostly just done, um, once they reunited, I think they've mostly done shows around Memphis. Um, and they've done like monsters, a rock, uh, cruise and, and festivals and things like that. But they're actually kind of on like a little bit of a mini tour right now. They've got some dates. Um, so we'll hear the history of the band. We're going to go through their, you know, their, their peak time of that, uh, late eighties, early nineties. Um, then they disbanded and then we'll hear it, but when they got to back back together and then kind of what they're up to now. So, um, Keith should be calling in any minute now, so why don't we just, uh, take a second here and uh, he should be here any second. Okay. My guest today is the guitars from the hard rock band, Torah Torah. They had two a charting albums as well as to songs that showed it on the rock charts. They toured with dangerous toys, La guns, the Colt Great White Tesla Barnum and so many more. They actually have a new album out right now titled Bastards of Beale, and also have tour dates lined up. So please welcome to the show guitars, Keith Douglas. Keith, how you doing?

Keith Douglas: 5:29

I'm great, man. How are you doing chuck?

Chuck Shute: 5:31

Good. Good. How's your knee?

Keith Douglas: 5:34

Oh Man, I'm getting there. You know, I had a total knee replacement two weeks ago yesterday and I'm feeling pretty good.

Chuck Shute: 5:40

Oh Wow. Is that just from all the, uh, hard rock touring run around stage or is it doing something else?

Keith Douglas: 5:48

Oh yeah.

Chuck Shute: 5:49

No.

Keith Douglas: 5:50

Oh kidding. No, I just had it, you know, premature, advanced arthritis. I think it's like a genetic type thing, not real sure. But

Chuck Shute: 5:59

yeah, it was on the board.

Keith Douglas: 6:01

I did some other things, trying to, trying to avoid, you know, replacing it all together and nothing else seemed to do it.

Chuck Shute: 6:08

Gotcha. Well, let's just start from the beginning. Um, when did you start playing guitar?

Keith Douglas: 6:14

Oh Man. Probably when I was 10, 10 or 11 years old.

Chuck Shute: 6:17

Oh, that law. Huh? Did you do other instruments before that or

Keith Douglas: 6:22

no, not really. You know, I'll knock around on piano or drums and stuff like that, but, you know, I was always a guitar guy, you know, growing up with, uh, with all the usual suspects, kids and you know,

Chuck Shute: 6:36

right. Kiss van Halen, cheap trick journey, ACDC, Zz top and foreigner. And I think to correct me if I'm wrong, but these are your five favorite guitars. Jimmy Hendrix, Eddie van Halen, Angus Young Peter Frampton and Randy Rhodes. I get that right?

Keith Douglas: 6:50

Uh, yeah, yeah,

Chuck Shute: 6:52

yeah.

Keith Douglas: 6:53

Let loose changes time to time. I'm not sure where you pulled that one up, but you know, um, that was right.

Chuck Shute: 7:00

Sure, sure. So, but here's my question. So I mean obviously you guys have a very bluesy sound to a lot of the guitar riffs, so I don't, I'm not seeing a lot of blues guitar. I'm not seeing like BB King or Stevie Ray Vaughan on that list. Well, who is the worst a bluesy a guitar influence clump coming from?

Keith Douglas: 7:18

Well, you know, I'm not real sure man. Yeah, probably. I grew up, man, I was trying to mimic all of the metal dudes and you know, all those people you just listed and I couldn't, you know, I couldn't touch any of them. I mean, we didn't have, you know, the, you wouldn't know youtube. I mean it was a whole different world. You know, I was trying to learn solos with, with the vinyl, you know, picking up the needle and backing it up a million times, you know, trying to figure out Joe Perry and you know, all that stuff. And I just, uh, I don't know. You know, I just kind of ended up just kind of doing my own thing and you know, it was probably, you know, years later before I really started to appreciate, you know, some blues players and the, you know, even in the last couple of years I've come across some guys that are just blowing my mind man that are, that are making me work, you know, just to be a fraction. As good as these guys are. I mean, um, so you know, it's just always an ongoing evolving process.

Chuck Shute: 8:25

Cause I think so you were kind of more the metal guy and then your singer Anthony also plays a little guitar. Well he was kind of more the Bluesy, he called it a crooner. He was kind of a hippy dippy Kinda. You wanted to do kind of more acoustic stuff and you and the tour tour basis, uh, Patrick Francis, you guys were actually in a band called liken throat, which was more of kind of like an iron maiden, Judas priest type of band. So how did you get Anthony, who kind of seemed to have a different style to come and form a band with you guys?

Keith Douglas: 8:52

You know, we actually, it was that at John Patterson, our drummer, I went to high school with him. I've known Patrick since elementary school. Um, and we just kind of ended up flaming together and, you know, I fingers the hardest thing to come by, you know, back then or where we are anyways. And, uh, you know, I just, one of those guys said, hey man, I heard that that's the same 70 days. They can really sing, you know? And he came over and played some, I can't remember, he might've played like some journey patiently, it seems like, cause the song he used to sing and you know,

Chuck Shute: 9:28

no, it's hard to say Steve Perry. Right. So he could, could he nailed that pretty well?

Keith Douglas: 9:33

Oh yeah. Yeah. Awesome. And we were just like, man, dude, you know, you're in. No, I don't, I don't care what you're saying. Okay. Really cool. So, um, but you know, once we started writing our own tunes, which was a result of being absolutely horrendous at doing cover tunes, so we didn't, we didn't last very long at that at all. You know, he and I to bounce those styles off of each other, we kind of blended them together.

Chuck Shute: 10:07

Gotcha.

Keith Douglas: 10:08

You know, and it works out well and it's

Chuck Shute: 10:10

definitely,

Keith Douglas: 10:11

you know, when we started writing for the, the most recent records, I wasn't real sure what was going to come out. I mean, we have written together in a really long time and uh, it kind of like we fell right back into it and it was the same that, you know, ying and Yang, you know, blending of, of our styles that kind of pop out.

Chuck Shute: 10:33

All right. Okay. So yeah, so going back to that in 85, you guys got together, so you kind of, you had a band but you didn't have a name. So there was, I guess I heard this, tell me if this is right. You had a friend that came up with a, he had a list of like 60 or 70 band names and yeah. And actually for awhile though, you guys were called free beer, which I thought was really funny. Yeah,

Keith Douglas: 10:54

yeah, yeah. We had that. It was more of a toe then than anything else.

Chuck Shute: 10:58

But did you actually do some shows where you said tonight is free beer playing and people showed up? No,

Keith Douglas: 11:04

I don't think we ever did, but I thought it would have been a great idea to put on a sign.

Chuck Shute: 11:11

Yeah, definitely. I think that we've got a crowd for sure. So you pick tour tour because you just thought it stood out. Um, wish Torah, I think it means tiger and Japanese and it's kind of a play on the, uh, the code name for the attack used by the Japanese Imperial Navy on the Pearl Harbor. Right. Okay. Did you guys know that at the time or are you more just like, oh, there's a van Halen song called Torah Torah. So

Keith Douglas: 11:31

we were probably way more familiar with the van Halen. Yeah. I mean, I was van Halen Junkie and back in those days. And you know, if we're looking through list, it was actually a friend of ours named Kelly coffee. Um, and she's, she was a high school when she went to high school with and we just never Paramor. And she, yeah, she showed up with this whole list of names and we just kind of, you know, needed a name and went through them and that one popped out and we said, okay, done deal.

Chuck Shute: 12:05

Awesome. You know, so yeah. So then I found this interesting. So your dad was in the glue business and you guys worked in this or he worked in this warehouse. And so what you guys did is took these old, uh, empty glue barrels and took some plywood and you built a stage in the corner of the warehouse and actually got a PA system. Um, but I, I thought, you know, first I thought when I heard this I thought, oh, you just used it for practice. But then I did some more research. So you actually, you guys actually had had concerts there. We had like a door guy. And a security guy and even a VIP section,

Keith Douglas: 12:34

it kind of ended up being that way. Uh, it was, yeah, my dad was in that business and I actually worked in the same business, you know, it was a family type deal for a year. Um, but yeah, you know, we, I kind of talked him into the warehouse, the under the, you know, pretense that it would be extra storage for his business, you know, and we could kind of use it and not bother anybody. So, you know, once we talked him into that and yeah, we kind of, Jack liked that they age and then the next thing we were Jack like in a light, you know, lighting, which was terror like radio shack like that, you know, at the time we're cutting it.

Chuck Shute: 13:15

Sure. No, it sounds fun. So, yeah. And people brought coolers of booze and lawn chairs and people ordering pizza and stuff. Oh Man. We were in, you know,

Keith Douglas: 13:25

in those, there was really nothing for people under drinking age to do, you know, there were no clubs to go in. There was nothing to do except getting in trouble. Or, you know, whatever. So we kind of started having these parties, so I asked concert kind of things and charging, you know, two or three bucks at the door, but you know, to us, you know, you put 400 people in there that was like a, you know,

Chuck Shute: 13:51

yeah. How many people would show up to these?

Keith Douglas: 13:54

Oh yeah. I mean maybe not at the first one, but yeah. Know it was a pretty good size room.

Chuck Shute: 13:59

Yeah. Cause didn't you recruit from the, the, uh, bigger concert venue down the street and say, hey, we got a, we got the after hours party at our, at warehouse over here. Right.

Keith Douglas: 14:07

Yeah. Well, you know, it was actually right next door to the midsouth calcium, which was where it was, you know, from the late sixties through until they closed it. You know, that's where I saw all the shows when I was growing up. Everybody came through there. Um, so yeah, I mean, we would, you know, people would leave the concert and pop into our place and we'd just kind of take advantage of the traffic, you know. Um, but, but it worked out awesome. I mean, and that's the way we, we actually went to, Anthony went to a different high school. Uh, then John and I, so we kinda had our two, two crowd, you know, kind of brought together and they ended up, you know, that's kind of how we ended up building our following and a one we were working with ardent studios and they were bringing in record label. That's what, uh, Brian Hutton Howard who eventually time to say and them, he's like, man, I got off the airplane and got my rent a car and you guys were on the radio, you know.

Chuck Shute: 15:12

Yeah, we had it here. Yeah. I want to get to that. Yeah. So with the Arden Studios, you guys actually, you entered a battle of the bands and you actually beat out 60 other bands and that's how you won the recording time at Arden studios. And that's when you recorded that EAP to rock, to rock to roll. And that was the songs. Phantom rider loves the bitch and they started getting airplay. Um, so can you tell me what was it like the first time you heard your song on the radio? I mean, that's got to just blow your mind, right?

Keith Douglas: 15:39

It was mind boiling. Uh, but you know, at the time there was a guy here in town named Malcolm Riker and he kind of started the whole local music scene, you know, it was pretty healthy back then, just just bans and everybody was kind of supporting each other and it was a pretty big deal. And he had a, uh, you know, he had a one or two hour show once a week or something with local music and it came, our songs, phantom rider became so popular. I mean, it was like in every rotation.

Chuck Shute: 16:08

Was this on rock 98? Is that what it was?

Keith Douglas: 16:11

Yes. Yeah. Okay. And uh, so yeah, I mean our, our a and M guy, here's us on the radio and then he shows up at our warehouse, our underground bar or whatever you want to call it. Yeah. And it was packed. I mean, it was an insane, like, man, what is going on, you know, down here. But

Chuck Shute: 16:32

very cool. So then you signed with a and m records, um, and you recorded in Arden Studios in Memphis and I thought found this interest in you while you guys were recording a lot of famous bands that had been there and I think they were recording while you were there. Allman brothers, Zz top, Leonard Skinner. Um, and I heard a story about how Anthony went to go get a cup of coffee one time and he ran into Stevie Ray Vaughan. Did you ever get star struck seeing all these guys while you're recording your first album?

Keith Douglas: 16:57

Oh my gosh, I totally did. I was just on cloud nine man, just walking around going, oh my God. Uh, but the guy who produced our first record, Joe Hardy, he did all the ZZ top stuff. So that was the big one. I'll never forget, I'm in there trying to cut Guitar Solos and Billy Gibbons decides to come in and watch.

Chuck Shute: 17:23

Does that make you nervous though?

Keith Douglas: 17:26

Oh, I'm just like, man, y'all this, this isn't gonna work. I can't do this. He's such a nice and cool guy. And we were messing around with different effects pedals. You know, he actually walked around town in a Tora Tora jacket for quite a while.

Chuck Shute: 17:42

oh wow. That is awesome. Wow. That's really cool.

Keith Douglas: 17:46

But it was so crazy, you know, there time that was in the heyday of, you know, big record projects and everybody was in there. Yeah. You know, we were cutting some stuff one night and uh, Greg Allman stuck his head in the door and today y'all want to come and hear me sing, you know, he was cutting a record and it was his birthday.

Chuck Shute: 18:08

Nice.

Keith Douglas: 18:09

Like, you know, come hang out

Chuck Shute: 18:11

and this is not, yeah, that's so cool

Keith Douglas: 18:16

for us. I mean, it was, we were just blown away, man. You know, we're going to kick the door and, but yeah, I ran into Stevie Ray there, all the Lynrd Skynrd guys. Uh, I'll tell you, is there a lot, R.E.M.... Those guys were always hanging out.

Chuck Shute: 18:32

Oh, I didn't know that.

Keith Douglas: 18:34

Um, Keith Richards was hanging there doing a solo album.

Chuck Shute: 18:39

Did you get to meet him or like talk to him at all or see him?

Keith Douglas: 18:42

I did not. I didn't, I didn't want to bother him. But you know, it's kind of a thing where you hope to run into somebody in the bathroom.

Chuck Shute: 18:48

Right, right. So then the surprise attack, that was your first album, it ended up peaking it number 47 on the billboard charts, which is pretty good. It had the singles, a walk and shoes and guilty. So let's start with walking shoes cause that's the song that really got me into the band. I think it's a great song. It definitely holds the test of time. It does not sound dated at all. It just sounds like a great song. It starts off of that Bluesy riff. Um, no, I read that you guys wrote that song in 10 minutes. So does that include the Bluesy riff a guitar with at the beginning or was that something that Joe Hardy, uh, added later or how did that come about?

Keith Douglas: 19:23

I had that risk and you know, and then I just had the loose idea and Anthony showed up at my place and I just said, hey, let's do something with this. And we just cranked out the rhythm, you know, the rest of the music and we wrote lyrics and we were just finished with it.

Chuck Shute: 19:42

So you wrote the entire thing with the lyrics to in 10 minutes,

Keith Douglas: 19:46

uh, maybe not 10.

Chuck Shute: 19:49

Okay.

Keith Douglas: 19:50

You know, half hour, 45 minutes.

Chuck Shute: 19:52

But,

Keith Douglas: 19:53

but you know, it really came together once we got into the studio to demo it, that's when we actually heard it, what it could be. We were just like, hey man, this, you know, and that was, that's when we realized that was a good one. But you know, and I've heard a bazillion people say it. I mean the easy, easy ones, you know, the good ones come pretty easy.

Chuck Shute: 20:17

Yeah.

Keith Douglas: 20:18

And struggle and strain and pull your hair out. But you know, things get difficult.

Chuck Shute: 20:23

Yeah, no, I mean, unless it's like a Bohemian rhapsody or something like that, I'm guessing that was probably not written 10 minutes. But yeah, I mean a lot of the best, just especially rock songs like that, it's just, it's not real complicated. It's, it's nothing groundbreaking. But I mean, it's just, it sounds really good. It's rocking. I mean it's still, I just listened to right before the interview just to kind of get me pumped up for this. Like it's still got that, uh, you know, vibe for me. Um, so then the song, Guilty, you guys, you actually made two versions of the video and one was a, I'm, I'm based here in Arizona. Um, and, and one of the videos was filmed in Tucson at the airplane graveyard. Um, but then you had to do a reshoot because MTV didn't like it. So how much power did MTV have back in the day? Cause this was before youtube, so, and they were basically the only music video channel, playing hard rock in America. So did you basically just have to kind of have to kiss their butt and just do whatever they said or,

Keith Douglas: 21:12

you know, I don't know that that was entirely their decision. Okay. It weighed man, they have so much influence over the whole industry that, you know, if there was anything they thought was negative about it, Biggie, you know, it would freak the label out so much that they were just like, okay, okay, let's just start over. You know, nevermind. So and, but I don't, I don't think that was the only thing with that. I think there were some other technical issues with that. I've heard stories of later. I don't, you know, I mean we're just, we're just, you know, we were cruising around and having the time of our lives, we were like whatever. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 21:57

Right. But so going back to that video, she, so I read that it, it costs around 75 80,000 and the record labels, oh, we're just going to charge you for that. So I can you explain to me, because as someone who doesn't work in the music business, I don't understand how these contracts work. So they give you some sort of deal and then they charge you for things like the bill they give you like bills for like video shoots and touring or like is that like you could actually owe money at the end of it? I don't

Keith Douglas: 22:20

technically give you a bill for it, but they tack it on to what you owe him, you know, out of records sale. So that's just that much.

Chuck Shute: 22:28

Okay.

Keith Douglas: 22:30

Recoup. You know that they just tap it all along to, you know, your bill and in before you ever see a dollar from record sale. All that gets paid that okay.

Chuck Shute: 22:43

But meanwhile though, they're paying for like touring costs and hotels and all those kinds of things, right? Sure. Yeah. Okay, so then you guys, yeah. And you guys had a song on the bill and Ted's excellent adventure soundtrack dancing with a gypsy, which I love that movie. In fact actually worked at the high school there that was filmed at now were you guys, did you get to go to the movie premiere or anything or is it kind of just like we sent you the song and then that's it.

Keith Douglas: 23:06

That's pretty much it. We went with a whole group of, uh, people here in Memphis from rdns videos where, cause that's actually right as we were first signed to a and m I think maybe before we even had started on our album. We got that placed in that movie somehow.

Chuck Shute: 23:27

Oh, okay. Now do you still get like, you get like a royalty check from that at all still or,

Keith Douglas: 23:33

yeah. Yeah, it's pretty comical.

Chuck Shute: 23:36

Oh really? Is it like is it okay? So it's nothing major, but it's something, right? I mean it's still got money coming in, right?

Keith Douglas: 23:43

Oh yeah. Oh yeah. It's funny though. Just you know, within the last couple of months, I have a 14 year old daughter and I said, man, you know, movie you might like check this out. She loved it and then she couldn't believe that, you know, we had a song on it. She was like, oh my God.

Chuck Shute: 23:59

Yeah, they're, they're actually making a third one too. So maybe you guys can get on the soundtrack for the, uh, I heard that. I'm putting that out there for you in the universe. Yeah. So that, and then in 1990 you guys tour, did you tour with the cult and bottom? Yes. Okay. So how was that? Is there any, do you have any road stories or like is there, I know you don't want your married guy, you got kids, so you don't want to tell any crazy like motley Crue dirt stories. But is there any sort of like maybe like a spinal tap kind of story? Like something went crazy or haywire or,

Keith Douglas: 24:28

oh man, our whole, you know, I can tell you about bazillion week,

Chuck Shute: 24:34

that final pap is heard

Keith Douglas: 24:35

for everybody. It's set up to every band. How close to realistic that is. Um, I, that was just a great time, man. That was the first, that was the first big, you know, that was the first time we stepped out and played an arena. And you know, we had a pretty short set that I'll never forget that. I mean we started with in Houston, uh, at the summit. It was like a, gosh, I can't even remember the capacity, but it was just mind blowing. It was so cool though. Just I watched the call with every single night. They were fantastic. And a chase and bottom was like the super nicest guy in the world.

Chuck Shute: 25:20

Oh, that's nice to hear.

Keith Douglas: 25:22

We got on really well with him. So I mean it was just very memorable. I loved it. I still one of my favorite albums and Sonic temple.

Chuck Shute: 25:31

Yeah, that's good stuff. So

Keith Douglas: 25:34

way out right now to her in the 30th some of the birds.

Chuck Shute: 25:37

Oh, that's very cool. And then you did a tour with La guns and dangerous toys. Um, how was that? I heard those guys were really nice too. They were, they treated you really well, right?

Keith Douglas: 25:47

Oh yeah, man, it was a ball. I mean, all three of us. I mean, we were just, you know, all our records were all doing well. We were all, all over MTV and it was just, it was a good package and we, everybody got along wonderfully and we just, we had a really, really great firm time. That one laughter lasted, Gosh, quite a while, mainly around that. Um, but yeah, I mean, I, I really, really enjoyed that one.

Chuck Shute: 26:12

Cool. Yeah, I just saw g dangerous toys that call in Colorado at Herman's hideaway. I'm trying to get them on the podcast. Maybe you can put in a word for me that was really impressed with their guitarist. Scott, I don't know if you remember him. I think it's a same original guitarist, right? Yeah. Yeah.

Keith Douglas: 26:27

Um, we did a deal in Atlanta Walk Lana.

Chuck Shute: 26:32

Yes. I wanted to go to that, but I had to work.

Keith Douglas: 26:35

Yeah, they played that and I, man, I ran into those guys. I haven't seen him in ages, but I talked to Scott for, yeah. Wow.

Chuck Shute: 26:42

Yeah, he's really good. It really,

Keith Douglas: 26:44

I was really impressed. Um, so then going back to to your, uh, your career. So then you had a second album that was coming out and then, uh, but w there was a wait and you had some problems. You guys actually wrote 75 songs. I heard for this and he had a hard time picking songs. Now tell me about this. You have a song on the album called a nowhere to go, but down that was actually co-written with Stan Lynch. Who for people who don't know, he was the original drummer for Tom Petty and the heartbreakers. How did that come about? You know, that was another, a brand hadn't Howard all right. And M guy. So he had set us up, Anthony and I to go write with, just, just to change it up. You know, we wrote so many songs for that album that was just dumb. I mean, we were happy with a bunch of them, but you know, it was back to the, the record label. I mean it's all, there's a lot of politics, you know, so, and we were just just trying to, just trying to get, get it gone and done, you know, and, and be happy with it. And uh, you know, and then we would get, you know, in a writing Rut or whatever and he'd say, let me hook you up with so and so. Just go out and see him and hang out. That'd be all right. Something. And uh, you know, sometimes it works, sometimes it didn't. Um, and, but we, we did hook up with some pretty interesting people. Um, but Dan Lynch was one that we just, we clicked like right off the bat, we actually wrote, um, a few songs with him. I had dead man's hand cause on that same record, he, he was the writer on that.

Chuck Shute: 28:19

Oh, I didn't know that.

Keith Douglas: 28:22

Yeah, but it's such, such a cool guy. We would just go hang out, hang at his house out in the valley and in La and, and just, you know, just the super nice,

Chuck Shute: 28:32

very cool. So you did a lot of writing and then the second year was trying to get into the studio. You finally did you finish the record, but then the record labeled in delays you for nine months because at the time Brian Adams was coming out, he had a new record coming out and they said, we're really going to concentrate on bright Adam. So, um, you guys had the choice of either releasing it without as much support from them or to wait nine months and then they would be fully behind you. Now, um, this was also at the time that obviously the music scene was changing a little bit. In hindsight, do you wish that you would've maybe nodded, not had waited so long to put out that record?

Keith Douglas: 29:07

Well, I mean, yeah, of course. But you know, it wasn't completely up to us in our decision either. You know, we had, we were working with John Hampton as a producer on that album and he ended up, you know, due to a label suggestion, he ended up going to work to do the gin blossoms.

Chuck Shute: 29:31

Hello.

Keith Douglas: 29:32

And they replaced him with Arthur Pasen to work on hours and finish it

Chuck Shute: 29:36

Sir Arthur Pace. Right. If I remember correctly.

Keith Douglas: 29:40

That is correct. And, uh, so I mean, there was a lot of stuff going on then, but if at the end of the day when we heard the record, the final mix and we were blown away. Yeah, yeah. It's still, I mean, I think it's my favorite sound and thing we ever did from top to bottom. I mean, it'll blow your speakers off.

Chuck Shute: 30:02

I know. I love the first single, especially Amnesia, which was actually co-written by Taylor Rhodes, who also co-wrote Aerosmith's Cryin as well as songs by Kix, Celine Dion journey, cheap trick, and he's on all sorts of stuff. And that song got a a irplay on radio and on MTV. U m, so, but again, it was around this time the grunge thing started taking off and u m, you guys w ere k ind o f more of a hard rock, I think. Bluesy hard rock band. U m, but I did, this i s interesting. So Alice In c hains was k ind o f becoming, starting to become a big band. Now you guys actually had Alice In chains open for you and you hung out in the northwest and when they were in Memphis. U m, tell me about that, what that was like, u m, hanging out with Alice In Chains. You guys k ind o f just thought of them more as just a rock band, right?

Keith Douglas: 30:43

Oh yeah, absolutely. I mean they were a several, several gigs up in the northwest for us. They opened and uh, they're such nice, super cool guys and um, you know, they were giving me demo tapes and all this stuff and we were hanging out, you know, before and after the games. Cause I remember hanging at the hotel and just talking. And then, you know, I, I'll, I'll never forget hearing man in the box on the radio for the first time. And I was like, holy crap, man. They got a record deal.

Chuck Shute: 31:16

Oh, so you, they opened for you like before they had a deal?

Keith Douglas: 31:19

Oh yeah. Yeah. A few times.

Chuck Shute: 31:23

Was that when you guys were just on a club tour or was that, which tour? Do you remember what

Keith Douglas: 31:28

we were, we played Seattle. Gosh, there was a close downtown. If I heard the name of it, I would know it.

Chuck Shute: 31:33

I'm from Seattle as it was at the paramount or the more or show box.

Keith Douglas: 31:38

Nah, man, I don't know.

Chuck Shute: 31:41

It was right downtown. Sure.

Keith Douglas: 31:43

Uh, just a big rectangle, brick room. Um, so, but this was, you know, 30 years ago. Right. So, um, but yeah, they opened for us there and in some other clubs. Seems like we did a theater in Spokane and I opened for, um, but just super cool. And I had, uh, I remember going home after that tour and I was really getting into some of the demos stuff that had given me and you know, then they came through, came through Memphis a time or two and we were hanging out. So, um, yeah, it's pretty crazy. But, um, you know,

Chuck Shute: 32:22

so when they start taking off, do you guys call them and say, Hey, you, we, uh, we let you open for us. Can we open for you now?

Keith Douglas: 32:30

No, no, no. We never did that.

Chuck Shute: 32:32

But do you still keep in touch with them at all or Jerry Cantrell? No. Okay.

Keith Douglas: 32:36

I haven't, no, I haven't seen him in number of years, but, uh, but yeah, I mean it's Kinda crazy. I mean, some, some of the same people have been knocking around. I mean, the first time we played Atlanta, the black crows open.

Chuck Shute: 32:50

I was going to say, that was my next question about the black crows. Tell me about that. Yeah, that sounds good. I'm a big fan of theirs too.

Keith Douglas: 32:56

It was, um, it was right around the height of the surprise attack stuff. We played a club down there and I mean, it was packed. I do remember that. Yeah. And uh, and they were the local band, you know, and at the time, I think it's even before they were called the black crows, they were called Mr Curves Darden.

Chuck Shute: 33:16

Oh, interesting. I didn't know that.

Keith Douglas: 33:18

Yeah. And they were playing in a lot of, a lot of cover tunes, makes them with their own stuff and that kind of stuff. Um, but they were hip known them that night and they were, they were pretty wild. And, uh, having a good time.

Chuck Shute: 33:34

I remember that page.

Keith Douglas: 33:36

The brothers, you know, telling me, yeah, we're about to get signed and you know, which is the same thing. Every band everywhere says and we were just like, oh cool. You know, good. Good for you.

Chuck Shute: 33:46

That's cool. Now did you tour with a warrant and Lynch mob around this time too? Or did I, did I get that wrong?

Keith Douglas: 33:53

Um, you know that

Chuck Shute: 33:56

we did a couple shows with them maybe.

Keith Douglas: 33:58

Well, we did a tour, those guys, um, and I, it was around that same time I think.

Chuck Shute: 34:06

Yeah. Gotcha.

Keith Douglas: 34:08

And that was, that was pretty cool too. You know, I've, I do remember the first, the first show of that and then it got walked in. We there were, did a college somewhere and I walked in the bathroom between the dressing rooms and George Lynch was in there with his guitar and I was just going, holy crap, I can't believe fricking George Lynch's in there. Y'All, you know?

Chuck Shute: 34:28

Yeah.

Keith Douglas: 34:29

Just practicing. I don't know. It was wild.

Chuck Shute: 34:33

He's a good guitar player

Keith Douglas: 34:35

man. You know, just being a fan. Pretty mind blowing.

Chuck Shute: 34:39

So then you guys started work on the Revolution Day record. Um, and that I think was finished in 1994 but this, this kind of like irks me because a and m refused to release it. I mean it came out years later, but I heard that actually wasn't the actual recording masters. It was kind of bits and pieces that you guys had laying around that you had to put together. So I, I guess I just don't understand this. Why doesn't the record label, I know this, you know, grunge just taken off and you know, you guys are not the hot band anymore, but for the hardcore fans, I mean, I'm sure it would have sold at least a few. Does it cost too much to just even print the copies of it? I mean, without promotion, I didn't understand that.

Keith Douglas: 35:16

You know, they only, they probably, they only paid for us to make that because they were obligated contractually. Uh, but you know, at that time, man, it was, it was man, I ain't that, you know, the whole company turned over music, the whole, everything changed overnight. You know, every emm, unfortunately we got clumped in with all of The hair metal,

Chuck Shute: 35:48

I never understood that because you guys never put on the makeup or, I mean you were like a jeans and tee shirt kind of band you. Yeah. You had long hair, but I mean so did Metallica and they, they persevered through the 90s. So yeah, I didn't really understand that. But um, so that was kind of the, go ahead. Sorry,

Keith Douglas: 36:04

We just kind of got pigeonholed into that. Uh, you know, and when they were done, they were just done. Right. They let us record it. Yeah. That was just kind of a rough time, man. Every, you know, everything was so uncertain and we were worn out. I mean, man, we had been on the road so long, but we were just, you know, frazzled. And so it was, that was a tough, tough time and tough recording. And then it wasn't too long after that that, you know, I kind of stepped away. Sure. Awhile I had a son that was on the way, he was born in 94 and at the time I was just thinking, you guys saying I got to go, you know, you know, once that responsibility first hit you, you know what I mean?

Chuck Shute: 36:51

Absolutely. So yeah, you got married, you had a son. So I'm assuming, I don't know, but I'm assuming that you, did you have to get like a regular job then or like, oh, I've got a nine to five or do you just teach guitar lessons or what did you do during this hiatus?

Keith Douglas: 37:04

Eventually. I fell into this and that and you know, yeah, yeah. You gotta do what you gotta do.

Chuck Shute: 37:10

yeah. I just think that's gotta be hard going from touring or rock band and being playing arenas. So now all of a sudden like, okay, now I gotta get like a real job. Like doesn't that Oh, but at least you got to live that for so I mean for so many years, like that's, you always have those memories and now you guys are touring again, which I think is awesome. Um, did you,

Keith Douglas: 37:31

you know, so I don't know. I'm just so grateful to have, you know, being able to do what we did. I mean, even at the time we were touring and just having the time of our lives. I mean, we were just looking at each other going, man, can you believe this?

Chuck Shute: 37:48

Absolutely.

Keith Douglas: 37:49

Time. I mean, it was party time pretty heavily, but uh,

Chuck Shute: 37:56

oh really? Okay. So it was like motley Crue, the dirt. Okay. All right. Gotcha.

Keith Douglas: 38:02

I don't think anybody can touch up. Yeah,

Chuck Shute: 38:05

right.

Keith Douglas: 38:06

We weren't even calling this man. We were milking cookies.

Chuck Shute: 38:08

Well, compared to those guys. That is great. That was a great comparison. Okay. Now, during this hiatus that you guys, you got the band broke up. Did you do any, did you play in some cover bands or tribute bands for fun or local fun bands or you just, wow. Did you practice the guitar at all or,

Keith Douglas: 38:28

you know, but you know, honestly, there was probably a fan of about 10 years that I rarely touched a guitar.

Chuck Shute: 38:37

Wow.

Keith Douglas: 38:39

Uh, just from, you know, I don't know. I have to just got busy and kind of got distracted from it, you know. Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 38:47

Did you miss it? Did you, were you, was there a piece of view of the go cat I want to be, or were you able to be creative in your day job or anything or,

Keith Douglas: 38:55

uh, you know, I, yeah, I missed it, but, you know, it was just kinda like, you know, Gosh, glad, glad I got to do that and you know, Kinda like on and do other stuff. And, uh, so when we finally got back together, you know, I had seen Patrick somewhere and that's, that's right around the time where I had read an article about Rocklahoma and I saw their up their lineup and I was like, Holy Shit, I can't believe these names are even still around

Chuck Shute: 39:26

like page.

Keith Douglas: 39:27

It was everybody. I had no idea. Yeah. And, uh, and I did run into Patrick and I said, hey man, you know, if, if we could ever get on that deal, yeah, I'll put it back up with you guys. Three months later he said, hey man, I think I think we can get on that bill. And I was like, you gotta be kidding me. So that was the first, that was our first gig back was in 2008. And, uh, which was, you know, it was pretty wild, man. We had to do a lot of rehearsing and a lot of when you're learning, I mean, I have to, gosh, it took some work.

Chuck Shute: 40:08

Yeah. Well that's right. You were quoted as saying, um, some of the early stuff, you're a little too ambitious for your own good. Um, and so you're more into the Melodica bluesy style rather than the fast and flashy these days. So you have a hard time playing a couple of those on your own Solos from the surprise attack record. Um, so talk to me about how you get around that with the live shows. You don't use tape or anything, do you?

Keith Douglas: 40:31

No, no, no,

Chuck Shute: 40:35

no. I want to see you. You're not coming to Arizona though. I'm going to have to pick a road trip,

Keith Douglas: 40:40

man. We are coming to Vegas and Salt Lake City.

Chuck Shute: 40:43

Yes. I think I'm thinking that maybe the Salt Lake City. Um, so my last episode I interviewed Mark Gus Scott. He's the drummer from trickster and he's, he's having a, he's doing a solo album and it's that weekend he's doing a release party and I, and so I'm invited to, so it's like, so I'm hoping he, I don't know what day, if it's Friday or a Saturday. I know you guys are playing Saturday in Vegas, so I'm hoping this party is either Friday or Sunday and then I can maybe do or I'm going to have to drive to Salt Lake City. It's not too far. But yeah, there's a, there's some good venues down here, so maybe you guys can look at just sneaking in and dry, you know, driving through Arizona on, on your way.

Keith Douglas: 41:16

Mark, are you in Phoenix? Yes. Okay.

Chuck Shute: 41:20

Yeah. Scottsdale, which there's a, there's a really cool place called blk live. It's beautiful. Then you, I don't know if you're familiar with it, but, uh, it's, it's kind of a newer, and they have a lot of the rock bands come play there. So I saw a video, um, that you, you said something about, I'm doing a quick solo for one of the key first projects. Um, did you, you played a solo on Tom Kiefer's new album or what? Tell me about,

Keith Douglas: 41:43

that's my son. My son's name is[inaudible].

Chuck Shute: 41:45

Oh, okay. Well that, so that explains that. So he does bands as well then.

Keith Douglas: 41:50

Oh, he, he does producing and engineering. He's, he's, he lifts in Chicago.

Chuck Shute: 41:57

Ah,

Keith Douglas: 41:58

he does his own thing on the heat man. He keeps it very busy and he's, I, you know, all the technology these days is way over my head. And so, you know, he just happened to be visiting Memphis and he said, man, I got this, this thing, I'm recording for these people and the guy can't get a fellow. Well, you just, you know, knock one out real quick.

Chuck Shute: 42:18

Oh, that's awesome. Very cool. So, and then you guys did the monsters of rock cruise this March with'em. That was with Tom Keifer and Tesla and extreme and queens rights, skid row faster, put all these bands. So, um, that's gotta be fun. So they pay you do you play every night or one night and then you just get to be on the cruise and hang out the rest of the time or twice. Okay.

Keith Douglas: 42:41

So you ha there's two, there's two performances and then you're set up to do a meet and greet type event.

Chuck Shute: 42:49

Yeah.

Keith Douglas: 42:50

Um, and maybe one of the, I can't remember a photo thing, I can't remember, but the rest of the time it's just, you know, hang out and watch vans.

Chuck Shute: 43:00

Oh, that's awesome.

Keith Douglas: 43:01

Football man. We love going and they do it so well and it's so well organized. Larry Moran runs that and he's, he does a wonderful job. It's a great time. That's the second one that we had, we had been on. And uh, man, I love it. It's a blast because you know, the wives all go and it's just like I go hang out and vacation for all of us.

Chuck Shute: 43:26

Yeah. That's very cool. Yeah. I've never even been on a cruise, so I'll have to check that out one of these days. So, and then you did the m three show with Whitesnake and Vince Neil and Steven Adler. Yeah. So I heard that Vince Neil, he flew down on his helicopter or something like that for the concert, like, or private jet or something.

Keith Douglas: 43:45

You got me.

Chuck Shute: 43:47

I have no idea. Did you get to hang out with those guys at all or not really? No. I mean,

Keith Douglas: 43:53

I think today we were playing, uh Oh, I can't even remember. I don't, I don't know. It's terrible. I don't really, I kind of start to run together now we played which thing but,

Chuck Shute: 44:06

but some of the bands do, they kind of have like, like the bigger bands, they kind of not mingle as much with the other bands. They kind of like, you know, we're too big. Kind of have that attitude sometimes or is everybody pretty cool? Or

Keith Douglas: 44:20

I just, you know, everybody's different.

Chuck Shute: 44:23

Gotcha.

Keith Douglas: 44:25

Everybody I've met then been very, very nice man and very cool. And you know, a lot of people were, I don't know, grown up. Yeah. Right. And then we were all 25 years ago and you know, everybody, it's, it's good though, man. It's a good time. And we have a blast, man. It's so awesome to, to run into, you know, some of the same fans that were out there, you know, basically alien years ago, you know.

Chuck Shute: 44:56

Yeah. They probably bring their kids now to the concerts, right?

Keith Douglas: 44:59

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, so it's, it's a bias, but that, that was a great, I've been, that was the first time we did m three. It was really top notch, man.

Chuck Shute: 45:10

That sounds fun. Yeah.

Keith Douglas: 45:11

Yeah. They know what they're doing. And it's a beautiful venue. Um, the Maryweather post civilian.

Chuck Shute: 45:17

Yeah. Yeah. Are there any newer bands or guitarist that you're currently listening to?

Keith Douglas: 45:24

Man, I run across these guys, just guitar players on the Internet. These different guys. Listen to how that plays for Edgar winner named Doug Rappaport, who's one of the best guitars. Man, he just blown my mind. Oh yeah.

Chuck Shute: 45:43

I'll have to check that out.

Keith Douglas: 45:44

A lot of blues guys, man, there's, Gosh, I can't name off the top of my head, but I'm always looking for new. Just regular rock is so refreshing. So good to hear bands now coming out like rival sons.

Chuck Shute: 46:01

Yes, they are

Keith Douglas: 46:02

here and now I actually heard on the radio with dirty honey.

Chuck Shute: 46:06

Yeah, great band.

Keith Douglas: 46:08

Cool. I like that.

Chuck Shute: 46:09

What about Tyler Bryant and the shakedown or do you listen to them? They're kind of blues

Keith Douglas: 46:13

guy. That guy is an incredible guitar player. You know, he's, he's one to, you know, for me to set my sights on and never had doubt I would ever achieve that. But man, his phrasing and his playing is so tasteful. You know, he posted all these snippets on Instagram and wherever else and man, gosh man, he can do, he knows how to phrase.

Chuck Shute: 46:44

I know, but see even you for the average per, I took guitar lessons when I was in high school. I wanted to be a rock star. I want to be a musician. I took guitar lessons for like two years and I mean it, people don't understand how hard it is to be at even, you know, you say you talk about these people that you look up to, but I mean, I look up to God like you even because you are at such a higher level than, I mean, I took lessons for two years and I couldn't even get close to what you guys are doing like, or Scott from dangerous toys or any of those guys. Um, I don't think people understand the level of talent that it takes to, to, you know, just even have a recording deal. I feel like it's, it's very, very competitive. I mean like, like I said, you guys beat out 60 bands to win that battle of the bands. I mean, so you're better than 60 other bands and that's pretty impressive. You think about it.

Keith Douglas: 47:30

Yeah. Well, you know, we were probably, I don't know, we were doing some heavy, uh, campaigning.

Chuck Shute: 47:39

That's part of it though. That's a big piece of it is the marketing and all that stuff. For sure. That's huge. Absolutely. Sure.

Keith Douglas: 47:45

But you know, some people, man, I have to tell you, I mean guitar player wired some, some guys, man, I mean I can just hear some guys just get it man. Some guys are just born with it. I don't think I'm one of those guys unfortunately.

Chuck Shute: 48:00

So did you practice a lot or how did you, I mean you sound pretty good to me, so yeah.

Keith Douglas: 48:05

Uh, you know I'm okay, I've got a long way to go. I probably, you know, I don't practice in a, and I just, like I said, I went through a big span of years where I hardly even touched it. But yeah. And that's when people think of great these great guitar players and you know what they don't say are the hours and hours and hours and hours that, that those guys put in, you know?

Chuck Shute: 48:32

Absolutely. Yeah. Some of them, the, you know, ever the guys that I watch, I mean it does seem like they just make it look easy cause I would practice and practice that could get it,

Keith Douglas: 48:43

but you have to admit it. There are some guys that it's just coming through them. The guys like Stevie Ray Vaughn.

Chuck Shute: 48:49

Yes.

Keith Douglas: 48:50

You know, to where they're almost just not even there. Right. On a man. Music is just kind of rolling through them in the, in that I can pop those buyer best players a mile away. Absolutely. Yeah. So there's some good ones out there there, man. I just, you know, I'm trying to get disciplined enough to, to try to get an even kind of to close. I would be super happy with.

Chuck Shute: 49:15

Well, I mean, I think you're, you're doing pretty well. Um, so now you're living in Memphis right now. So we just, uh, went to Nashville. Um, and I was amazed at how much music and live music is in Nashville. They have these bars that are four stories and every story is a different band. Is Memphis. It's gotta be similar. Right. Or,

Keith Douglas: 49:36

uh, you know, probably not quite to the extreme of Nashville. Now, you know, I mean, Nashville I think is just now gotten like that in the last 10 or 15 years. I mean, they've always had been used, of course in a club thing, but that's, man, that city has grown leaps and bounds over the last 10 years. I mean, it's insane.

Chuck Shute: 49:59

Yeah. I was, I don't know if we went for the NFL drafts, I don't know if it was extra crazy because of that. But I mean, I was just every bar with, like I said, it was four stories in every story at a different band. I've never seen anything like that. I mean, I've been to Vegas and New York. I mean, I've never seen anything so much live music. It was really cool.

Keith Douglas: 50:14

Oh well God, there's so many musicians there. It's crazy.

Chuck Shute: 50:17

Yeah. Well Anthony Lives there, right? So you guys are just like, oh, how far is Memphis from Nashville? A couple of hours or,

Keith Douglas: 50:24

uh, about a three hour drive. Okay. It's bad. Yeah. It's not terrible. Yeah. So, um, but the cool thing and the thing that I love about Memphis is that, you know, people just grow up here, hanging downtown, hanging on Beals for eat and just picking up the blues kind of stuff. It's mind blowing to me. I can walk into any hole in the wall in the city and you can see some of the best musicians and entertainers in the world that nobody's ever heard of.

Chuck Shute: 50:58

I bet. Yeah. That's how I felt in Nashville. I mean, I was seeing these, these cover bands and they were really good. I mean, there was people playing at the airport that I was like, this person that has hundred times more musical talent than I do and they're just playing at the airport,

Keith Douglas: 51:11

you know, every, I Guess Nashville today is what, you know, all the actors and actresses that used to flock to La, you know, I mean there's so many players, great players in Nashville and all these session guys. Really a perfectionist.

Chuck Shute: 51:30

Yeah. Cause I think a lot of the rock bands are moving there too, right?

Keith Douglas: 51:34

Yeah.

Chuck Shute: 51:35

Brett Michaels and John[inaudible], Robbie and uh, I mean your singer Anthony. So there's a lot of people that are kind of moving. They're not just used to be kind of country now. It's just like, there's a lot of hard rock guys there too, which is very cool.

Keith Douglas: 51:49

Headed that way. I mean, the cost of living. So you gotta be, you know, amazing compared to, you know,

Chuck Shute: 51:57

La and New York. Yeah, absolutely. So you guys are on tour. You're, you're, you're going to Maine, Salt Lake City, Vegas, a bunch of, uh, venue, uh, cities in Texas. You going to play at the, the famous whiskey a Gogo, which I just finally got to go to see a show at a few months ago. But again, no, Arizona. Who did I see? I saw a enough's enough.

Keith Douglas: 52:20

Oh, how was it?

Chuck Shute: 52:21

I liked it. Yeah, I still liked the band. Um, it's a different chip as the bass player. He's taken over and singing. Um, there's singer has a new solo album, which is also pretty good. They're kind of like a Beatles influenced, uh, band, but I really liked them and uh, it was a good show. I had a, I had a lot of, a lot of fun, so I'm excited to, I might try up for that whiskey a go, go show. I got to either hit you the, at Salt Lake City or maybe the Vegas or the whiskey. One of them, unless you guys book the Arizona date, if you do that, you gotta let me know. So yeah, for sure. Yeah.

Keith Douglas: 52:54

Well man, I can't wait to do the Whisky That's, I don't know, back in the late eighties, early nineties. I mean L.A. was kind of a weird scene for us because that was the height of a hair metal and that.

Chuck Shute: 53:12

Now I noticed you use the term hair metal. So is that not, cause I'm always curious about that. I personally, I just, I don't mind the term hair metal because I just love so many of those bands that it doesn't offend me. So is it not, it's not an offensive term to you then?

Keith Douglas: 53:25

No, not at all. I mean, that's what I'm used to hearing that genre called you, right? No, I don't think it's offensive at all. Um, but you know, we got lumped in with that for the country, but the people who did separate us out and it seems like L.A. Yeah, we were just kind of like outcasts, you know. Um, and we played a couple of gigs. I remember playing the Roxie and it was okay, but for whatever reason we came through and did the Whisky and man, that was one of the greatest gigs that I remember. And it was a packed house and it was killer. And it's such a historical cool place.

Chuck Shute: 54:14

Yeah. Van Halen played that. I mean, like everybody's played that. Right. So

Keith Douglas: 54:18

yeah, you name it. I mean everybody, everybody, yeah, that'll be, I mean, I just recently saw a picture of Eric Clapton play in there with whoever cream. Oh Wow. I don't know. Wow.

Chuck Shute: 54:32

I think even, yeah, because it goes back pretty far. The whiskey a go, go. So, um, did you know you guys never lived in La, did you? Or

Keith Douglas: 54:41

No, no,

Chuck Shute: 54:41

no, no. She just played there. And you still recorded in Memphis and all that? So

Keith Douglas: 54:46

yeah, I mean, I spend a lot of time in La Anthony and I did from, you know, taking trips to write with people and do, you know, stuff with the label. And so we ended up spending quite a bit of time out there.

Chuck Shute: 55:01

So did you hang out at the rainbow? And I mean you were, you involved in the scene a lot and

Keith Douglas: 55:07

not really. I mean, we went to the rainbow a time or two, but you know, it was more of a, I don't know, you know, more of a show, you know, the, we're just saying, just like he said, we're the jeans and tee shirt kind of guys.

Chuck Shute: 55:23

Absolutely. Yeah. Yeah.

Keith Douglas: 55:24

No, that's where we didn't dress up enough really to hang out there.

Chuck Shute: 55:28

But were you, so were there, they're friends that you made during this era with some of the bands, are you good friends with any of these bands or these, a lot of people that you just didn't talk to for 25 years or 20 years or whatever?

Keith Douglas: 55:39

Uh, Hu, yeah, out there.

Chuck Shute: 55:41

Yeah. Just, we'll just say in terms of like, you kind of took this hiatus from the music industry. Did you keep in touch with, with any of the bands or musicians or was it Kinda just you take a break from all the music?

Keith Douglas: 55:51

I kind of took a break from all of it, stepped away. And then, you know, from the mid nineties to the end of the nineties was probably the my least favorite era of music ever. So, I mean I just, I kind of checked out for a little while because I couldn't, you know, I didn't like much of what was coming out new life.

Chuck Shute: 56:22

Gotcha. The grunge era, the s ound garden a nd the N irvana and Pearl Jam.

Keith Douglas: 56:24

. Well I love found garden and they were, they were label Nate take me to, he was, you know, buying Hutton Howard signs. Uh, then he signed extreme and he signed Soundgarden. Right. All at the same time. So we all knew of each other and knew each other. Yeah. Cause of him, you know, I mean I actually spent a day in[inaudible] hanging, you know, he needed somebody to hang with curse Cornell cause he was here doing some voiceovers for a live record and he didn't know anybody here. So yeah, it was my job to go pick him up and hang for the day. Which is a cool story now.

Chuck Shute: 57:07

Yeah. So what's he like? Cause, I mean, he's a great singer, great musician, great songwriter. Um, what's he like as a person? I never hung out with him

Keith Douglas: 57:16

way back then. You know, I just, you know, he was just kind of a quiet guy, you know. I got the free one. We were, yeah, a lot more loud than him.

Chuck Shute: 57:27

Even the milk and cookies band was more wild than Soundgarden. Huh.

Keith Douglas: 57:30

Uh, well I mean we weren't milking cookies

Chuck Shute: 57:33

compared to, to give her to my crew. Okay. Gotcha. Well, one thing that's kind of an impressive, um, that you guys, you actually have all four core members still in the band. I mean that's pretty impressive. That's pretty rare these days. I feel like so many bands change members so many times. Is there a secret to that or is it just, I mean, you guys all seem so down to earth and there doesn't seem to be a lot of drama involved and,

Keith Douglas: 57:59

well, I just think, you know, we've known each other for so long and we've, you know, we've just kind of all come full circle really. I mean, everybody's kind of going out there and you know, there were, there were sort of even a number of years that I had rarely seen or talked to Anthony or Patrick or, you know, just if we happen to see each other, but we weren't like friends, like call each other all the time. But, um, and you know, everybody just had different things. Anything he moved away for a little bit and, uh, I don't know. I mean, we just kinda all grew up, I guess, you know.

Chuck Shute: 58:38

That's very cool. I mean, and then in 2016, um, Patrick is diagnosed with cancer and you guys don't say, okay, well we're just going to replace you get a new band basis. You actually get an event going and you fundraiser and you rally to support him. I mean, that's pretty impressive. I feel like loyalty is a very under valued, uh, you know, thing right now in society. So I think that's the, you gotta give you props for that. I think that's very cool. So,

Keith Douglas: 59:03

yeah, and you know, I mean, that wasn't entirely our doing. There was a good friend of ours, Matt Montgomery, who had that original idea. Um, and that turned out to be such a great event. And I mean the Memphis music community, I mean even from back then to now with these really tight and people support each other and show up. And that was, that was a really a great moment man. And it was, it was one of those man where you can just feel the vibe in the air and it was so much positivity and that it was just really good, good time. Absolutely. And that's also something that, you know, I mean none of us are spring chickens anymore or getting any younger and sure. We just kind of felt like, man, you know, if we love playing music together, I mean why don't we do it? I mean, cause we all four do. I mean, you can flop one of us out and not, it just doesn't really feel right for any of us.

Chuck Shute: 1:00:00

That's great though.

Keith Douglas: 1:00:01

It's always been that way. And you know, and that's why we have such a good time now to, and we feel so grateful, you know, to be able to get out. And you know, even if we're just doing weekend run to go and see people, you know, where we haven't played in 25 years and it's a blast man. Just enjoying it. And you know why not mean if you can make a couple of bucks on it on a weekend, why not? And Go have a great time.

Chuck Shute: 1:00:31

Yeah. So what I want to talk about this too. Um, I always, uh, end with a positive thing, a charity of some sort that some the cause that you're passionate about. Um, tell me about the St Jude's Children's hospital. I noticed that you're a, um, supporting them. You're, that's something that your is near and dear to your heart.

Keith Douglas: 1:00:54

Yeah, I mean, St Jude, I don't know how much you know about it, but it's just such an amazing place and that, you know, to be here in Memphis, I've had just so many people I know that has been touched and helped by Jude and people that have been through, you know, it's amazing what they do for families no matter where they're from or their background or, and they take care of their kids and they don't charge them a dime. And, uh, you know, it's just an amazing thing and they, that is, or you know, if there's any words each or I know of in the world, it's that one.

Chuck Shute: 1:01:35

Awesome. Very cool.

Keith Douglas: 1:01:38

Yeah. I mean, and I always, I mean, I'll, I'll support whatever they're doing, man. I've got two healthy kids and, you know, I'm super grateful for that. You know, I just, I don't know. It's a tough thing, man.

Chuck Shute: 1:01:51

Yeah, no, I don't. Yeah. I mean, I would like to someday. Yeah. Wow.

Keith Douglas: 1:01:57

Yeah. So, yeah. And once you do, and that makes it even just more makes you appreciate him. Yeah,

Chuck Shute: 1:02:05

absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, well, I mean, you had a great life so far. You're a father, you're a husband, you've toured with all these great bands. You're still touring. You got the new record out. Bastards appeal. Everyone should check it out. Um, is there anything else that you'd like to promote at this time or, we got the tour dates on the website.

Keith Douglas: 1:02:25

Yeah, you can check us out on all the regular social, um, check out our website is tore, tore a music.com. Um, we'll, we'll be heading out a couple of weeks from now to do the New England rock festival. Uh, that's the one in Chicopee, Massachusetts on August 16. Then we'll be at skips lounge the following night and then on that Sunday night worth of all musical in new Bedford, Massachusetts. And we're just looking forward to it, man. We can't wait to get out there and, and hook up with everybody and rock out.

Chuck Shute: 1:03:02

Yeah, that'll be fun. Yeah. I'll have to try to check you guys out. Um, unless you had an Arizona date. I'll have to make a road trip and a, I've never seen you live. I hadn't seen dangerous toys and then so we, we drove to Colorado to see them and it was great. So I'll have to do that for Torah Torah too. For sure.

Keith Douglas: 1:03:16

Yeah. Cool man. We'd love to have you. Just let me know.

Chuck Shute: 1:03:18

Okay. Well thanks so much for being on the show. Um, and we'll stay in touch.

Keith Douglas: 1:03:23

Yeah, absolutely. Trek. I appreciate it.

Chuck Shute: 1:03:25

Okay. Thanks again, Keith. Bye. Bye. Bye. Okay. That was Keith Douglas guitarists from the band Torah Torah. Hope you enjoyed that interview. Um, I also have, uh, some other, a couple of other interviews that I've done so far and hopefully many more to come. Um, we also do a, uh, the chuck and Josh podcast. We have about 50 episodes of that. Um, so check that out. Um, we're on everything. iTunes, Google, Spotify, stitcher, tune in, all these things. I don't even know what they are, but we're on there, so you just Google it. You should be able to find us. Um, I am chuck shoot and that's it for me and I'll see it until next time. Thanks.