143: Modular Scanners, Cytology, and AI Integration in Digital Pathology

You think going digital in pathology just means buying a scanner? 

Think again. 

In this episode sponsored by Epredia, I sat down with Ryan Davis, Director of Global Business Strategy at Epredia, to talk about what it really takes to implement digital pathology—and why modularity, cytology support, and AI integration are changing the game. 

Whether you’re starting your digital journey or scaling up with advanced tech, there’s something in this conversation for you.

🎯 Highlights with Timestamps:

• [00:01:00] Who is Ryan Davis? Epredia’s digital transformation story
• [00:04:00] From Thermo Fisher to PHC Group: A legacy of diagnostic solutions
• [00:06:00] The 3DHistech partnership—why collaboration > competition
• [00:10:00] Spotlight: The P1000 scanner and its water immersion feature
• [00:16:00] Modular, fluorescent, and multi-functional scanners explained
• [00:21:00] Interoperability: Integrating with existing AI and IMS systems
• [00:24:00] Global footprint and customer feedback (Radboud, CorePlus, Puerto Rico)
• [00:27:00] Use cases in biopharma and neuroscience
• [00:30:00] AI partners: Aiforia, PaigeAI, IBEX, TechCyte
• [00:34:00] What’s coming: FDA clearance, polarization scanners
• [00:38:00] Community outreach through DPA and global conferences
• [00:40:00] Learn more: Live Labs and webinars at www.epredia.com
  
  
  

📚 Resources from this Episode:

• CorePlus Study: Deployment of Artificial Intelligence Algorithm for 100% QC of Pap Tests
• Epredia Live Labs: www.epredia.com → Events
• AI partners mentioned: Aiforia, PaigeAI, TechCyte, IBEX
  
  

Transcript

Modular Scanners, Cytology, and AI Integration in Digital Pathology

Introduction to Digital Pathology

Aleks: [00:00:00] You're mentioning words that make me happy, workflow, like an end-to-end workflow, AI integration, interoperability. I think it's a challenge for anybody who wants to embark on the digital pathology journey to fit all those pieces together. 

Ryan: Yeah. So the P1000 is a technology that was launched onto the market in 20, between 2017 and 2018.

One of the things that was really no. Nice about that instrument is not only the capacity and the random access capabilities of it

Aleks: Spoiler alert, it can scan 1000 slides. 

Ryan: That's right. 

Aleks: That's what it's called. P1000.

Ryan: That's right. Yep.

Aleks: Yeah. Tell me why the customers like it.

Ryan: They needed something that could fully digitize their workflow.

Introduction: Learn about the newest digital pathology trends in science and industry. Meet the most interesting people in the niche and gain insights relevant to your own projects. Here is where pathology meets computer science.  [00:01:00] You are listening to the Digital Pathology Podcast with your host, Dr. Alexandra Zuraw.

Aleks: Welcome my digital pathology trailblazers. Today-

Meet Ryan Davis: Director of Global Business Strategy

Aleks: My guest is Ryan Davis, and Ryan is the Director of Global Business Strategy for Digital Pathology and AI at Epredia. And Epredia is Digital Pathology Place sponsor. They are sponsoring this episode, and they've been supporting us for several months already. And they have a suite of digital pathology solutions, not only for the classical digital pathology anatomic path, but also for cytology.

And they are incorporating AI into their tools, and this is what they're gonna be talking today. Welcome, Ryan. How are you today? 

Ryan: I'm doing very well. Thank you for having me, and very excited for the discussion.

Aleks: I'm so happy to have you. We start with the guest first. So tell the digital pathology trailblazers a little bit about yourself before we dive into Epredia and your role at Epredia as well.  [00:02:00]

Ryan: Absolutely, yeah, I'd be happy to. So I've been with Epredia for about 10 years now. And that was originally the AP division of Thermo Fisher Scientific. I've had a number of different roles within the organization, but really dove into the digital pathology world in 2018. And since then I have really focused in on how various facilities utilize digital to help their workflow but also how different applications can really help drive and really different collaborations between the software, hardware, and AI, as you mentioned, really help customers to take digital pathology to the next level. I've been serving on the DPA board now for a couple years both in the US and Europe. And so that has also given me the opportunity to learn a lot about the different needs and different challenges that people have had within their digital adoption.

Aleks: I think 2018, that's so recent, but then.

In digital pathology years. It's a lot years. 

Ryan: That's right. That's exactly right. [00:03:00] 

Aleks: It's like, I don't know, it's like in dog years that one year counts for more.

The Evolution of Epredia

Aleks: And you've been at Epredia for a long time, so Epredia has an interesting history. You mentioned that they used to be Thermo Fisher. Can you share how you transitioned from being part of Thermo Fisher to becoming a standalone entity?

Ryan: Absolutely. Yeah, so we've had an interesting history, as you've mentioned, and we have some legacy companies that go all the way back into the 70s and even earlier in the 19 hundreds. And you know, one of our goals was always to provide not only workflow solutions ranging from when the sample is assessed all the way through diagnostics.

But also we've really looked at how do we automate the workflow overall. So we've had various. Different products from tissue processing all the way through staining and cover slipping, and we add in digital pathology as part of that journey in 2017. But the transition piece of it [00:04:00]  is part of the Thermo Fisher story.

So we were part of their organization for many years. And in 2019, PHC Group, which is a Japanese-based company, acquired us. As a way really to get into the cancer diagnostic field. So they have a number of different other organizations that are healthcare-focused, and by acquiring the AP

Aleks: famous anything that so we,...

Ryan: yeah, so we…

Aleks: …pathology community knows about,

Ryan: Potentially the diabetes care line.

Bayer is one of our sister companies. We also have LSI Media, which is a Japanese-based reference laboratory. It does different diagnostic care. And then probably the other one would be P-H-C-B-I, which has ultra-low free freezers and incubators that many of the pharmaceutical companies around the world utilize for, for storing their vaccines and vaccine development.

Aleks: Interesting because everybody knows [00:05:00] Thermo Fisher. And I want everybody to know Epredia as a strong… 

Ryan: …absolutely 

 Aleks: …pathology player. What sets you apart in this space? What makes you guys a strong player? And I know part of it is the breadth of solutions that you offer, but yeah. Why are you so cool?

Why are you different? Yeah. Why are you a strong player in this space.

Ryan: Absolutely.

Epredia's Digital Pathology Solutions

Ryan: So when we initiated our, our first, you know, let's say dance into digital pathology we partnered with a company called 3DHistech and 3DHistech has been in the digital pathology space for many years, offering a variety of technologies for both brightfield and fluorescent samples.

But as you also rightly mentioned, it's not just FFPE samples, but also gives you the ability to digitize liquid-based samples. Even certain things like bacteriology and virology. So there's a wide variety of sample types [00:06:00] that we're able to digitize. However, we knew that from a standpoint of hardware, that was just one step for the journey of digital pathology adopters.

And so we also wanted to have a good, strong offering for the IMS and viewer software as well as AI. So we did make some investments and established commercial relationships with two major AI players in the marketplace. And one of our goals was not only to offer a variety of instruments and software, but also to remain interoperable.

So one of the things that a lot of customers really need is a best-in-breed solution. And so while we feel that we've built a very nice portfolio, we also offer the ability to connect into other IMS software, other AI players that allow customers to really get what they need to get the best benefit.

Out of their digital solution,

Aleks: You're mentioning words that make me happy. Workflow, like an end-to-end workflow, AI integration, and interoperability. [00:07:00] I think it's a challenge for anybody who wants to embark on that digital pathology journey. To fit all those pieces together. I think before you start actually educating yourself, you think you, you're gonna get the scanner and you're good to go.

And there's a lot more pieces to it. Yeah. And now AI being an important an important factor, not even like if you're not yet using AI, the option to get plugged in from your preferred solution provider. 

Ryan: Yeah. Fully agree. Yeah.

Aleks: And yeah, I've heard about your partnership with 3DHistech in 2019.

I think you guys were one of the first companies that had a fluorescent scanner that was both brightfield and fluorescent. So. How did this collab elaboration boost [00:08:00] your product offering? So, were you looking for somebody to enrich everything you had for pathology with a scanner, and how did you find the best partner?

Ryan: Yeah, it's a great question, and really that journey began way before 2017, right? So we started and we knew that 3DHistech was strong on the European market for many years and had a very strong offering. And we also knew that based on the pathology customers that we had for our let's say pre-analytical steps, that there was a lot more customers exploring and understanding.

The digital space. And so when we looked at the various options on the market, one was certainly for us to start from scratch, right? And develop our own technology. But we felt that because 3DHistech had done such a great job with developing their portfolio with understanding what various players need within the.

Within the digital space and having a robust platform that they were a very nice fit to our [00:09:00] pathology workflow. And because of the flexibility of instruments that they had, it also allowed us to not only serve, you know, small community centers or research facilities, but also all the way up to major hospital groups and IDNs, as well as being able to serve the research in big biotech and biopharma organizations as well.

Aleks: There are different strategies. Either you develop your own technology from scratch and there's place for that. But whenever there is an opportunity to have this kind of partnership, like a win partnership. Win for you, win for your partner, and win for your clients I feel like, oh, we don't need to reinvent the wheel.

Yeah. And we can just capitalize on it's not that one plus one equals two. It's like exponentially. I don't know, better access, like, it's not linear what you gain from a partnership like that. And I know you guys have been partners for a long time. The first time we met [00:10:00] actually was in 2019 at the DPAI conference in New York.

Right. And then… 

Ryan: That's right. 

Aleks: Yeah. We met at USCAP this March. And I saw because this is an important question. Like what are those scanners that you have? Like, we have fantastic scanners. What are they?

The P1000 Scanner: Features and Benefits

Aleks: So one of them that I saw was the P1000 that was that had this, the water immersion, was that P1000?

Ryan: That's correct. Yeah. 

Aleks: Because I saw your equipment at several occasions. So one was the one at USCAP, and I was impressed with the water immersion, and we're gonna talk about that. And the other time I visited the Radboud University in the Netherlands and they have a full room full of P1000s.

They have like four of them running continuously. The whole pathology department is digitized and they are using the P1000s, [00:11:00] not only for diagnostics, but also they have a super strong AI working group that publishes internationally. Jeroen van der Laak is their leader and they do have P1000, so… 

Ryan: yeah. Yeah, absolutely. 

Aleks: Let's talk. Let's talk about those P1000s. Let's start with that. Absolutely.

Ryan: Yeah. So the P1000 is a technology that was launched onto the market in 27, between 2017 and 2018, depending on the global location of your listeners. But we introduced it in the US in 2018 and, one of the things that was really no nice about that instrument is not only the capacity and the random access capabilities of it, but as you… 

Aleks: Spoiler alert, it can scan 1000 slides. That's right. That's what it's called. P1000.

Ryan: That's right. Yep. Absolutely. And you know, one of the things that.

A lot of customers ask is, well, what if I don't have a thousand slides at one time to scan? And so it's been built in a way that you're able to have random access [00:12:00] to all the slides, as well as almost add an additional shift to your workflow by being able to scan overnight and having technologies to make sure that it doesn't go down if it encounters a slide in the middle of the night that is.

Maybe problematic, but to your point about the water immersion, because this is a very nice feature that not only allows you to do cytology slides, hematology slides, but one of the things that was looked at during the development process is how do we, acquire images that go past the standard 40X or even 80X resolution to give that clarity without, you know, disrupting the workflow by introducing really long scan speeds.

And what was found is that by adding an automatic dispenser which is essentially a syringe that dispenses water onto the sample area and then utilizes the third water immersion objective in order to get a higher depth of field by utilizing [00:13:00] a different specific gravity, which is water in order to get that refractive index to a different level.

And so because of that, and we've done a few studies with some some of our customer partner sites. That has shown that without needing to do Z stacking or extended focus, which we also have the ability to do, we're still able to get a very clear and crisp image by utilizing that water immersion.

And one last piece that I'll talk about from an automation standpoint is that it then uses a squeegee to pull the water off of that slide. So you're not, you're not swimming. If you'll. Scanner after the scanning's complete.

Aleks: So I saw this one at USCAP, and you can open the door and put your head inside.

I'm gonna include the short that I made out of it, and there is indeed like a syringe that squirts water on the slide so that the objective can be immersed. [00:14:00] I think that is tapping into an. Unmet need of the cytopathology and clinical pathology community. When I talk to them, they often feel like they're the underserved group in the digital pathology space.

So now there is technology for that, which is great. And I also know who has this scanner, and he was a guest on my podcast Mariano De Socarraz. 

Ryan: That's right. 

Aleks: His in his practice in Puerto Rico.

Ryan: That's right. Yeah. Core Plus has been a great partner of ours with Mariano and Dr. Santon and his team.

And they did a fantastic study utilizing their Cytology samples and the water immersion to show the differences between using multiple layers of  Zstacking or extended focus versus using a single layer water immersion.

Aleks: They are pioneers. They're like have all the digital pathology, cutting edge technologies that there are.

Ryan: Yeah.  [00:15:00]

Aleks: So this is amazing. Okay, so we have high throughput, which is P1000. Do all those P1000 have water immersion or is that. Like a separate product or add-on to the product?

Ryan: Yeah, it is an option on both our P1000 and P480. But it can be added at any time. For people who may not need it right away, but think that in the future they may want to go to cytology scanning or hempath scanning.

So it is something that can be added on and is optional.

Aleks: That is useful because you. Often don't go all at once, and you have like specialties that go first and then you add on other specialties. 

Ryan: So yeah. 

Aleks: The option to, for this to be modular. Is interesting.

Modular and Fluorescent Scanners

Aleks: What about the fluorescent instruments?

Absolutely. I know you have Midi three of, or MIDI, how do you call this one and P250, right? That's they fluorescent, but they're both bright field [00:16:00] and fluorescent. Right? So it's a multi-functional machine as well. Tell us a little bit about these two.

Ryan: Yeah. And actually we have three scanners for fluorescent and brightfield imaging.

And we have six in our total portfolio, but two of the three that you mentioned, the MIDI and the P250. And then the one in the middle is the Scan2, which has 150 slide capacity which sits in the middle between those two other instruments, 

Aleks: I think you misnamed it because. It should be called 150.

Ryan: Well, it's going to be in the future replayed it a little differently, but as of right now, it is the Scan2. And that was based on the development journey. But that's a good catch that the other ones have have the number of capacity in the name. So the MIDI is a 12 slide scanner, scan 2 150, and P250.

Actually olds 300 slides. But we'll work on [00:17:00] that.

Aleks: It better to call it 250 and. When it holds 300 slides, then call it 200, 300 and it would only hold 200. 

Ryan: And That's exactly right. It's better to over.

Aleks: So you're airing on Yes. You're overdelivering on that one.

Ryan: That's right. Exactly. And so one of the nice things, and as you mentioned, it can do both bright field and fluorescent scannings, but I think the important piece is that they don't have to go in batches.

So if you have a panel that includes both brightfield and fluorescent images, it can automatically read the barcode. On that sample and determine if it needs to be imaged in a fluorescent manner or if it is a bright field scanning slide. And what I would say is that because of that automation, we've also been able to do, I would say, more adequate sample detection.

Fluorescent slides are very challenging to pick up where the sample is, but we wanted to be able to automate that [00:18:00] by utilizing a technology called. A dark field preview which allows for us almost to send a sonar type effect to understand where the sample is. And then on the newer scanners, we have a five x objective, which will allow for the user to do a full pre-scan in a matter of seconds.

So that it's very accurate on where we're sending that fluorescent signal or where we're looking to excite those floor force. One last comment is the fluorescent package is also upgradable. So let's say there's a user who is only gonna start with Bright Field Imaging and a year from now, two years from now, they want to get into fluorescence imaging.

We can add that as a module onto the instrument at a later date. And it's just a matter of adding the light source, which we use Lumin Core Light Source. And we have two options for that. And then adding a camera potentially, and the filter wheel. So we use a turret wheel that utilizes filter cubes [00:19:00] in order to get the right wavelength for for the right light.

Aleks: So that is, or at least, let's put it that way, I was not aware of the ability to have this type of modular options in whole slide scanners. So. Because I was just about to say, oh, so this one can be for a research center that does both fluorescence and bright field. But it doesn't need to be like that.

You can just like start your digital pathology journey wherever you wanna start it and figure out what you might wanna. Need or want, or how you wanna expand your capabilities in the future. And you don't need to actually buy the capability. You can just buy the option with the other tool that you're using, whichever scanner you're gonna choose.

I think that's unique. I was not aware of that.

Ryan: Yeah. And this was [00:20:00] really important when we understood that not every digital journey is the same, right? Some people just wanna start with prostate cases or lung cases, and other people want to, you know, scan everything that they produce in the laboratory.

So by having this modularity and these different-sized options. We're really able to tailor the right fit for whatever the customer or the institution is looking to do.

Interoperability and Customer Success

Aleks: So, I do wanna hear about your customer success stories, but one more thing that you mentioned at the beginning, the interoperability.

So. If somebody just wants a Epredia scanner and everything, they can have it. But if they already have something else then you do offer the option to be compatible with that.

Ryan: Absolutely. Yeah. 

Aleks: I understand it correctly. 

Ryan: That's correct. Yeah. So we do have a file format that our units produce as a native format. [00:21:00]

But we're also able to convert to many of the other file formats. That are on the market, whether that's a a DICOM image or SVS or NDP, we're able to in process and automatically convert that image without disrupting the workflow. So if somebody already has an IMS or an IT architecture in place that they need to keep consistent, we're able to fit in to that architecture, which is extremely important, right?

Because these are large investments.

Collaborative Solutions in Digital Pathology

Ryan: Into not only the storage and the archives, but also the software itself. So while we do offer the full end-to-end solution, we are not so rigid as to saying that we can't work with other players in the market. And that's true of AI players as well.

So we're happy to work with them with either cloud-based or on-prem solutions.

Aleks: I saw your scanners in the Netherlands at Radboud, and I wanna see it. At Core Plus in Puerto Rico. I got an [00:22:00] invite during the podcast. I didn't take advantage of this invite to actually go there and see his practice, which I very much wanna do.

So I have to work on that project. Yeah.

Customer Feedback and Global Adoption

Aleks: Tell me why the customers like it. I mean, I think. I already have some idea why they might like it, but was there something based on what we talked, right, the modularity, the interoperability, the option to do cytology, but did you get any feedback about something that we didn't mention or something that was extremely important to people that might not be so obvious?

Ryan: Yeah. You know, a lot of those and especially for CorePlus, one of their main goals was they needed something that could fully digitize their workflow. Right. So it wasn't just one sample type, or it wasn't just the ability to digitize and then analyze it with one AI player. They really wanted that flexibility.

And so that was one reason when we were in early discussions with Mariano and Dr. Santa, that they [00:23:00] felt that this was the right solution for them. I would say many of our customers, and we do have over a thousand placements globally and about 400 in the US. Many of them…

Aleks: Anybody in Poland already having your scanners?

Ryan: There are certainly people in Poland that are utilizing yes, the scanners as well. And I can send well, I'll have to, I don't travel that much to Poland, but I can get you certainly the names of of those of those customer sites. Absolutely. Apologies. I don't.

Aleks: In December again.

Okay. So I don't know. December is around Christmas, so I might not be traveling for for educational digital pathology content. Yeah. But I also go there in the summer, so if there is somebody close to me, I would be more than happy to visit a site where, yeah, there is a previous scanner.

Ryan: Absolutely.

Yep. And I'll certainly let you know the customer facilities that have them in Poland and really across Europe. [00:24:00] 

International Presence and Awards

Ryan: So many customers across Europe as well as the US or the Americas in Latin America as well have adopted it. And I would say, you know, one of the other things is just.

The ability to get the solutions that's right for their project has been a lot of the feedback from customers as well. And then the quality. So the quality of image produced on these instruments is extremely high. And there have been a couple awards won by the #DHistech instruments.

During the international scanner contest, it was put on in Germany. And so in 2016 and 2012…

Aleks:  I didn't know there was an international scanning contest. I should know about it. I have to look up this information.

Ryan: Yep. So, that we were winners with 3DHistech in instruments of the 40x resolution image as well as some of the speed contests or the throughput contest.

That were put on by that organization in Germany. And then maybe the last thing that I think is important is because of the [00:25:00] modularity, it makes the repair of these instruments quite seamless. So you've seen a lot of the other technologies on the market. You have to pull off the you know, entirety of the shell and it takes some time to get it back together.

Because of the way that these are designed, you can quickly exchange out the components. And our engineers are able to to complete that quite quickly.

Aleks: When you were talking about this contest, the speed contest, I imagine like all those scanners next to ready, steady go scan.

Ryan: I wasn’t involve in those particular ones. But I think it is done based on the start and stop points of all of the different scanners. So…

Aleks:  Yeah, it wouldn't be that spectacular. So, because it's basically a box where you put this slide, but you know what? I remembered that at Path Visions, there was one hackathon, and I think I sent slides [00:26:00] and you guys were scanning them with a previous scanner as well.

Ryan: That's right. Yeah. Yeah. And we've done the Connectathon and…

Aleks:  21 connect that on. Yeah.

Ryan: Yep. And we participated, I think Sectra put that particular one on, and we were happy to participate and perform very well with the DICOM images that they were looking to incorporate.

Aleks: And the slides were provided by Digital Pathology Place.

Ryan: Absolutely. Thank you for providing those.

Aleks: Anytime I have a special set for this type of occasion that are de-identified and can be used for this stuff. So, if anybody needs them, let me know. I'm happy to lend them to you. Okay.

Applications in Biopharma and Neuroscience

Aleks: So for the clinical value is clear, but you mentioned that research, pharma biotech are also using your scanners.

Who is using, where are they using, and what are they using it for? What are the applications there?

Ryan: Yeah, so I'm gonna be a little [00:27:00] respectful of some of the organizational names, just because of some of the type of work that they do. But what I can say is that in the drug discovery place you know, we are very well adopted because of the high-quality nature and our ability to image above 40x resolution in a very quick manner.

So we have some of the biggest. Biopharma and biotech players in the world that are, you know, not only in the US but also across the globe, that have adopted this technology in order to do drug discovery. We're also very well adopted in the neuroscience and neuro research space. And you know, one of the other things that we found is that because we're able to.

Pivot and offer a wide variety of different types, is that they're able to do multiple different types of studies with our technology. Rather than needing to invest each time [00:28:00] into a platform in order to carry out a specific research project or study, they're able to utilize ours for a wide variety, which helps them really diversify their ROI when making this type of investment into a scanner.

Aleks: Do you have an application that comes like, is the application in the biotech or biopharma space that comes over and over again, like anything specific that you can share?

Ryan: And do you, by that, do you mean?

Aleks:  As far as it like, more like, okay, we need a tool that does a lot of different things because the research we're doing is diverse.

Yeah. And so, so what I'm getting at is like, oh, we want, something that scans three channels because this is a specific biomarker set that we're working on. Or I don't know, something. An example like that. And if you cannot share that's okay because I work in this space [00:29:00] and I know that there is a lot of proprietary information that

Ryan: Yeah.

Aleks: Should not be shared there. 

Ryan: There is certainly some sensitivity. I would say one of the things that would be consistent is that when we get into the multiplexing realm, there are a few, you know, common kits. Those are utilized, whether that's a fourplex or sixplex or even higher into the eight and 11 range.

And because we're able to digitize really the full light spectrum and including into the near IR light range, it does help us maintain that flexibility. But these specific kits that are for multiplexing, we found a lot of success in. And then I would say fish samples. So looking at specific probes and looking at higher than 40x and getting into that 80, 90x range has been critical of adopting our TECO technology.

Aleks: I didn't even have an 90x on my microscope. I'm an anatomic pathologist in my maximum is 40x. [00:30:00] Yeah, definitely a different use case. Okay.

AI Partnerships and Capabilities

Aleks: What about AI? Let's talk about AI. Yeah. We need to discuss what are your own capabilities. Is there anything that is like AI of things and who are your partners?

That's like three questions in one. But let's cover the AI topic because this is so I, let me give you a little bit of context. I do this DigiPath Digest. It's a weekly literature abstract review, and what I'm seeing for the last month or two, I get PubMed alerts from different publications and what I've been seeing other than of course the foundation model, which is the newest, greatest hype in the digital pathology space.

There is something that brings me a lot more joy. There are publications on implementing AI for quantification. [00:31:00] Of the scores that pathologists are already doing visually. Like the PDL one, Ki-67, HER2 things that basically are already part of the diagnostic practice, but now. You can use AI for this, of course, given that you're digitized.

And even though this is not like a groundbreaking science, it brings me a lot of joy because this is a lot closer to implementation in the practice than, you know, the more abstract, generative AI applications. So yeah. Who do you work with that could potentially offer this kind of solutions?

Ryan: Absolutely. 

Aleks: People who would like to implement that.

Ryan: Yeah. And I fully agree with your point that one of the great benefits of AI is being able to do things that take pathologists a lot of times. To do today, right? Or, and whether it's counting or looking at specific areas, this can point the pathologist [00:32:00] with all the years of expertise that they have to the areas where that expertise is really needed.

So we've made several partnerships within the AI space. We do have some image analysis software with 3D histech, and that is for things like nuclear quantifications or membrane quantifications, things like that. And then on the AI. Side, we've made partnerships with Aiforia, which has both a pre-analytic or preclinical as well as clinical suites that are able to do a wide variety of different analysis types.

And then we also partnered with PaigeAI, who has really been one of the groundbreaking leaders from a clinical AI perspective. And they're doing still some really innovative things when it comes to how they're looking at multimodality. Types of analysis. So, those are our two main partnerships.

However, with some of the studies we've done TechCyte was a big player in our project {00:33:00] with Core Plus, and then IBEX was also for the prostate and breast samples. The utilization that Mariano and his team are using for their analysis.

Aleks: Interesting. So Aiforia is a digital pathology place sponsor as well.

And Paige is the famous Paige who's made it to, through the FDA clearance for the prostate diagnostic. No prostate computer aided diagnostic tool. Right. So, pretty strategic strong partners on the AI side. So what's coming next? What is, what Is the cutting edge that you guys are planning?

Yeah. You have a robust suite of things. You are partnering with the AI cutting edge partners, but anything exciting that's gonna be launched, that's gonna be happening?

Ryan: Yeah.

Upcoming Innovations and FDA Clearance

Ryan: One of the things that we're most excited about is our [00:34:00] pending 510K clearance with the FDA. So we did you know, go through our clinical trials.

We have a product that were a premium manufacturing at our UK based facility. And right now we're pending 510K clearance. So it's not on the market yet, but we're very excited about that that pending clearance. And then the other thing that has recently been launched is.

A polarization option on the P480. 

Aleks: Oh my goodness. 

Ryan: Which, which is gonna also do some very which I don't have to tell you the importance of that. But we're very excited about that polarization capability on the P480 as well.

Aleks: This is why do I say, oh my goodness. 'cause of course I'm happy about it.

But I was talking to Dr. Anil Perwani on the podcast, and I don't work in the diagnostic space. So every, I don't know [00:35:00] how many years I would need a polarizer, maybe one time in my career since I started working. In the toxpath space, I actually needed to use a polarizer. So it's totally not on my radar that might be needed for digitization.

But he mentioned that, oh, we didn't go digital for our all specialties. And I'm like, oh, why not? And I was expecting him to say, well, we don't have a good cytology scanner. No, he said that the kidney pathologist. The GU pathologists, they need this polarization on a daily basis, and they just didn't have a solution for that.

So that's why I'm like, oh my goodness. Polarization is entering the digital pathology space. Amazing. This is super cool.

Ryan: Yeah, so we're very excited about both of those and with the E1000, which is currently launched in the European market, so your listeners globally. Are able to to work with their [00:36:00] Epredia representatives in those markets.

And as mentioned we're just waiting to be able to launch it in the US at some point, hopefully.

Aleks: Amazing.

Community Engagement and Conferences

Aleks: So, you mentioned something at the beginning that you are on the board of Digital Pathology Associations. Epredia is a benefactor member which means. You care about the digital pathology community, not only in terms of you know, introducing the features that are currently limiting for practicing digital pathology for some specialties for some applications.

Do you have a specific focus or something that. Is guiding you how to contribute or is it more like, okay, we're listening to the community and then we try to address the pain points that we're learning about? What guides your contributions there?

Ryan: Yeah it's a great question and as soon as I entered in the digital pathology space, I knew that it was something really special.

And it's something that if I could [00:37:00] help the community to better understand the technology to fill any of the gaps that. You know, that are out there with the technology that's present today, and how can we fill those with new technology features? I really wanted to understand from all levels where the biggest concerns were, whether that was a cost standpoint, workflow based.

Was it consistency? And by being on the DPA board and the European equivalent, it's really helped me to understand where different challenges are. And that's ranged everything from the pre-analytical right, and the preparation of the sample and some of the variability there that occurs in the AP department.

But also, you know, when we're talking about, the size of the images. This is not something that the pathology world is used to. So being able to help them manage the IT journey and the conversation with their IT departments is also something that I've been very interested in. [00:38:00] So, I wouldn't say that there's one specific topic within the digital boards that has stood out, but all of them together I think is what we can help drive.

Digital adoption. And the other piece is reimbursement, which on the US market has been a, an important one with some of these surveillance codes that have come out. And some people starting to look at billing for digital. So I think all of that together is what's kept me really excited and interested in how do I help positively the digital community.

Aleks: So, are you guys going to any conferences or are you going to all pathology conferences?

Ryan: I wish I could say we're going to all of them, but there's so many now that we that we do attend as many as we can because those are invaluable for us to get. Feedback from from the market, right, and from the users of these technologies.

We are excited to be at PathVisions coming up here in Orlando [00:39:00] in a few weeks here in early November. And then we'll also be at the DP and AI in London which is a great event for us each year. And then we have a. Congresses that will be attending in the Asia Pacific market in China.

And we were just recently in Singapore at DP and AI. So we have a number of 'em that we attend each year. But those are a couple that are coming up here soon.

Aleks: And I know you travel to many of them because often we contact or we try to schedule something and you're like, no, I'm coming back from Asia.

No, I was just at this and this Congress in Europe. So, definitely a big presence. At those live events, any webinars anywhere online that people can learn more about Epredia other than digital pathology play website where all your webinars are listed as events? 

Ryan: Absolutely. 

Aleks: And our podcast. Anything else that you guys are doing on a consistent basis or less consistent basis?

To show [00:40:00] yourself online?

Online Resources and Webinars

Ryan: Yeah, absolutely. So we do have live labs once a month, and this is kind of a really unique way for people to get a live view into our technology. So we have a site in Kalamazoo, Michigan, which is one of our manufacturing sites for consumables. And there we have all of our different technologies.

So we set up a camera and audio, and we do different highlights. Of different technology features. So yesterday we actually had one for TMA technology for tissue microarrays, and then our next one will be for fluorescence imaging in November. And so on the website, which is www.epredia.com under the live events, you're able to see all those past live lab events and then the schedule for the future ones.

Aleks: That's amazing. So it's basically like a virtual show and tell. 

Ryan: Exactly 

Aleks: For people who are interested in a particular application or a particular product of yours. 

Ryan: Exactly. 

Aleks: That's so interesting. 

Ryan: Yeah. 

Aleks: So if the listeners [00:41:00] would want to learn more about Epredia, the best places to go to the website or where would you want them to ask?

Ryan: Absolutely. Yeah, that's a great place to start. We do have a digital pathology page on our Epredia website. And if they have any. Specific questions or anything that is top of mind, there is a way to get directly in contact with us and their local Epredia representative to, to answer those questions directly.

Aleks: So all this can be accessed through the website?

Ryan: Yes, ma'am. Yep, that's correct.

Aleks: Epredia.com. And that's gonna be in the show notes. And if you would like to ask me, I will relay all the questions that sometimes happen that people listen to the podcast like. Couple of months or a year after publishing, they're like, oh, you talked about this and that.

Could you ask them? So totally ask me questions as well. Thank you so much, Ryan, for joining us.

Ryan: Thank you for having me,

Aleks: And I wish you a wonderful day. 

Ryan: Thank you. Have a great afternoon. Speak soon.

Aleks: And [00:42:00] see you at Path Visions.

Ryan: That's right. We'll see everybody at Path Visions.

Aleks: We it may be that this one is gonna, this episode is gonna be published after Path Visions.

So, but there's definitely gonna be live footage or live reportage on LinkedIn and on social media. So you're gonna see us together there. 

Ryan: Perfect. 

Aleks: Okay.

Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Aleks: Thank you so much for staying till the end. It means you are a true digital pathology trailblazer and inspired by this webinar series that Epredia is organizing every month and showing their equipment and different applications.

I went on their website. Registered there and saw Ryan giving a webinar. But another important issue other than education, you can get your free CE credits and also Florida credits. For those webinars, so I might be exploring them and letting you know what's worth checking out. In the meantime, if you have any questions, [00:43:00] reach out through the website or on LinkedIn or ask me questions about anything related to this podcast.

And if you wanna learn how the digital pathology trailblazers that we mentioned in this episode are doing digital pathology, so Mariano de Socarraz and Jeroenn van der Laak and their group there's gonna be a link either in the show notes or on YouTube, and you can go and binge watch or binge listen to those episodes, and I talk to you in the next one.