The Get More Smarter Podcast - A Weekly Show About Colorado Politics
The Get More Smarter Podcast is a weekly overview of Colorado politics. The podcast is hosted by seasoned Colorado politicos Jason Bane of ColoradoPols.com and Ian Silverii, former 9News talking head, former Denver Post Columnist, former Executive Director of ProgressNow Colorado, and current has-been. Each week they dive into the local and national news, and for some reason, have had Governors, US Senators, Members of Congress, and countless local elected officials as guests over the years. The guys are also frighteningly good at predicting the future. No, really. Are you ready to Get More Smarter?
The Get More Smarter Podcast - A Weekly Show About Colorado Politics
Team Normal and the Escape Goats (feat. Jessica Killin)
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This week on the Get More Smarter Podcast, the Colorado State Budget got a billion dollar cut, again, thanks to Gabe Evans, Jeff Hurd, and the rest of the Republicans Colorado sends to Washington. We break down the outcome of the recently concluded Special Session. Then, friend of the pod Governor Jared Polis has some...words for HHS Secretary RFK Junior, and, frankly, they’re words neither we nor any other major Democrat in Colorado would ever use. And finally, can a Democrat win Colorado’s 2nd most Republican congressional district? Well, if one can, it might just be our guest today: Jessica Killin joins us from Colorado Springs to talk about how she plans to win the 5th district in 2026.
That’s it for this episode! If you loved watching and/or listening to it as much as we loved recording it, you can thank us by subscribing to the pod wherever you listen, following us over on New Old Twitter AKA Bluesky, subscribing to our shiny new channel on YouTube, smashing that subscribe button on our Substack, and sharing this episode with your friends, your enemies, and your 8th favorite Member of Congress from Colorado! THANK YOU so much for listening, and we’ll see you next time!
So to blame HR One is misconstrued. It is an escape goat.
SPEAKER_03All right, everyone, warm up those brains. It's time for the Get More Smarter Podcast. This one here is episode 249. I'm Jason Bain.
SPEAKER_02I'm Ian Silveria. This week on the Get More Smarter Podcast, the Colorado State budget got a billion-dollar cut. Again, thanks to Gabe Evans, Jeff Hurd, and the rest of the Republicans, Colorado sent us to Washington, and their state legislative mini-minority counterparts becowned themselves over and over again the whole time. We break down the outcome of the recently concluded special session. Then, friend of the pod, Governor Jared Polis has some choice words for somehow HHS Secretary RFK Jr. And frankly, they're words neither us nor any other major Democrat in Colorado would ever use. And finally, can a Democrat win Colorado's second most Republican congressional district? Well, if one can, it just might be our guest today. Jessica Killen joins us from Colorado Springs to talk about how she plans to win the 5th District in 2026.
SPEAKER_03Let's see what? One, two, three, four, six days. Colorado's tax system is pegged to the federal tax system. So when they made a bunch of stupid cuts in order to fund tax cuts for rich people, it changed Colorado's budget and meant that a special session needed to be called to figure out what to do with a newly$800 million budget hole. That's a lot of money. That is a lot of money. And so lawmakers did a couple of things. They changed four tax provisions affecting businesses and business owners. Republicans will say they raised taxes. What Democrats did is just uh sort of declined to put into effect the dumber cuts that were done by the big beautiful bill.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I mean, the reality of all this is like we went through this in 2010. Republicans, when the economy cratered and there was a real financial crisis that caused the state to cut the budget because the economy was not doing well, therefore tax revenues were down. By closing a bunch of loopholes, Republicans and conservative interest groups sued and lost because the legislature does, in fact, have the ability to close loopholes to raise revenue without violating Tabor, according to the court. Right.
SPEAKER_03So they did a couple of things. I I I won't bore you with the numbers, but essentially they um got rid of a tax break for wealthy owners of pass-through businesses that would have taken effect.
SPEAKER_02This is like as a result of the Trump tax cuts last time around. They got a big cut at the federal level. Therefore, to your point, they got a big cut at the state level. This closes that loophole and says if you're making half a million dollars a year or more, which was the income threshold for this, you no longer get a special tax cut. Sorry. And you'll probably still be okay. You're gonna be fine.
SPEAKER_03Democrats also passed legislation to add Hong Kong, Ireland, Liechtenstein, Netherlands, and Singapore to the list of companies that can't that corporations can't route their revenue through in order to escape taxes.
SPEAKER_02These are called so-called tax havens. Uh wife of the show, Britney Peterson, worked on this bill when she was in the state house a million years ago. So good to see that it's in effect, and they're adding more tax havens to the list of no, you can't fucking do that, places to stash her money. Right.
SPEAKER_03Uh Democrats also passed a bill to let the state sell up to$125 million in tax credits to large companies, which essentially lets them pay taxes earlier at a discount.
SPEAKER_02It's basically like prepaying your taxes for 80 cents on a dollar, yeah. Which like, I don't think this is something we can or should get in the habit of doing a lot, but like as a cobble together a billion dollar strategy, seems to be an interesting piece of it.
SPEAKER_03Right. And then for the rest of uh the I I don't know what the all adds up to, a couple hundred million dollars. Uh Jared Polos was empowered to make a few more budget cuts uh in order to get us across the$800 million hole. Chasm. Is chasm good? Chasm is more accurate than a hole, I would say. Governor Polis really stuck to the Democratic message of why this special session was necessary in comments uh after the session had ended.
SPEAKER_04Congressman Gabe Evans and the other Republicans from Colorado's House delegation voted to pass HR1, a bill in Congress that only passed by one vote. Any of them could have stopped it. It increased the federal budget deficit by trillions of dollars, and also created a deficit here in Colorado. They cost Colorado$1.2 billion. Today I decided bill that rebalances Colorado's budget. I'm gonna stand Congressman Evans and the other members of our congressional delegation. I use to balance Colorado's budget, and I hope they use it to balance the federal budget.
SPEAKER_02This like moron with the comment, like immediately they're like, You've been in charge forever. You're the one who put a billion dollars out of balance. No, we fucking weren't you moron. You don't know how anything works at all. Like, just listen to the show. We explain it all for you.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, it's uh and and as we mentioned last week, no nobody in the media in Colorado was buying that narrative from Republicans.
SPEAKER_02No, but it's also like really good messaging from the governor to just be like, here's whose fault this is. Yeah. And he's got the bully pulpit and he's using it. Good good job. Good job on this one.
SPEAKER_03Here's uh Denver 7 with a little more on what all went down in those six days.
SPEAKER_10After six tense days under the Gold Dome, Colorado special session wrapped up tonight. Thanks for joining us tonight on Denver 7 News at 5. I'm Micah Smith. And I'm Jessica Porter. Glad you're with us.
SPEAKER_11It was a week dominated by high-stakes negotiations and drama. Lawmakers wrestled with the state's budget shortfall, managing to find a way to close a nearly$800 million gap. They also sparred over the future of artificial intelligence regulations before punting on what would have been a first in the nation push to regulate AI. And we witnessed a rarity, the potential political censure of a lawmaker who ultimately resigned while under fire. It has been a whirlwind stretch that will leave a lasting mark on Colorado politics.
SPEAKER_10And we start tonight with that partisan fight over the removal of a now former representative, Ryan Armagost. Denver Seven's Brandon Richard is live at the state capitol. Brandon heated words today from both sides of the aisle about Armagost.
SPEAKER_23Yeah, that's right. Well, it's tense moments in the House chamber this afternoon, leading the Republican leader to storm out of the chamber. And there's been a big partisan divide, in fact, throughout these last six days of the special session. Lawmakers gave final approval to their last batch of bills aimed at addressing the$783 million budget gap, a Democratic majority strategy focused on ending tax breaks, dipping into state reserves, and cutting spending.
SPEAKER_03So as you heard there from Denver 7, uh, Republicans somehow managed to leave the special session with a negative spotlight on themselves because of a debate over the resolution condemning now former Representative Ryan Armagast.
SPEAKER_02All they had to do was go in there and say whatever the majority is doing is bad. It's bad to close tax loopholes, it's bad to cut uh programs, it's bad to cut services, you're doing it wrong, and then they could have like won the narrative on it. I mean, it would it'd be disingenuous, but yeah, that's that's the easy uh it's not rocket search.
SPEAKER_03That's a move on the board, right? What'd they do instead? Uh well, instead they uh decided to debate this resolution condemning former rep Ryan Armagast, even though every Republican but two voted for it. I did it was just it was baffling. I I don't know why they did this. I uh Ryan or um state rep uh Ken Dildo de Graff called it a lynching, because you know, of course he did. And then uh House Minority Leader Rose Paglisi demonstrated why nobody takes her serious as a leader. This is ridiculous.
SPEAKER_18The first is to Representative Zokai. I um I do not believe the behavior that was exhibited was right. And I have seen degrading, degrading behavior from both sides of the aisle since I have been here.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_18And I think we must do better as an institution to preserve the integrity of this institution. We should absolutely do better. And we need to commit to doing that for the integrity of the institution and for the people we serve. And so if there's an apology you're looking for from me, I am sorry that this happened to you.
SPEAKER_02Oh, close. This happened to you. Almost a real apology. Yeah, swinging a message.
SPEAKER_18The challenges to my character. Oh, yeah, it's about you. I want to address that because that's now I'm the real victim. On April 11th, when the incident happened, I wasn't here that day. I hardly ever take a day off.
SPEAKER_03No one cares.
SPEAKER_18But I was excused for something that was court ordered. I had no choice, I could not be here on April 11th. April 14th, I came back to the chamber. We had a conversation. You and I had a conversation, I didn't see the signal chat. You don't have to believe me. I am telling you, I didn't see the signal chat. I did not know when you and I had a conversation. I did not know.
SPEAKER_02I didn't see the tweet. I have no comment on the tweet.
SPEAKER_18And I committed to trying to find out who posted the picture on the internet. Then later, I realized I I was told, still have never read it, that uh it was Representative Armagost. What why haven't you read it? What are you doing?
SPEAKER_02Unfucking believable. There, there's the biggest lie in the entire bullshit spiel, isn't it?
SPEAKER_18I had a conversation with your majority leader, your leadership, and I told her it was Representative Armagost. And I'm sorry that she had bills with Representative Armagost that was more important than your safety.
SPEAKER_02Oh yeah, fuck that.
SPEAKER_18My integrity, my character has been assaulted, and I have the right to defend myself.
SPEAKER_02Jesus Christ.
SPEAKER_03So wait, what she's saying is that because people were critical of her for not doing anything to police her own caucus, she's the victim.
SPEAKER_02And how fucking dare you criticize me for not handling my caucus members who were doing horrible things? Remember, for those of you who weren't following the story, this was because Armaghs took a disgusting creep shot, a picture surreptitiously, of Representative Zokai, sent it to some fucking signal chat full of ghouls. They all made racist, sexist, and and terrible comments about her sexualizing her, diminishing her in unspeakable ways. This then jumped to Twitter where the feeding frenzy was as about as bad as it can be, led to bomb threats at Representative Zokai's kids' schools, and this one has the nerve to make herself the fucking victim here? What a joke.
SPEAKER_03We've talked a lot about how Paglisi is not able to control her own members, has no idea what she's doing in the caucus. And this is another example of why. None of these things are leadership. All you had to do was say, I'm sorry. Uh it's not okay what uh what they did.
SPEAKER_02This guy resigned. He's out the door, he's on the way to fucking Arizona, under the wheels, man. That's the move. It's also the right thing to do, right?
SPEAKER_03Man, the easiest thing to do. But instead, they did all this, and uh Paglisi stormed out after that speech, and and then the uh the after action media reports were mostly about that. I mean, they're just god, they're dumb.
SPEAKER_02Trying to make herself the victim here is like an all-timer. Like that is like a very that is the most cynical thing I've seen in a very long time.
Legislating with Crayons
SPEAKER_03That wasn't the only weird comment in those six days from Republicans, which brings us to uh one of our regular features, legislating with crayons.
SPEAKER_09Legislating with crayons.
SPEAKER_03But the good news for you, our listeners, is that we have so much audio to share from people who are just not serious. Republican, they're not serious people. For example, I'll give you uh uh a proposal that uh Representative Scott Bottoms and Senator Linda Zamora Wilson put forward. Uh they wanted uh to do an amendment that would take the proceeds from the sale of fetal harvesting and reimburse the state somehow. Uh the fetal harvesting isn't happening, but I Right. I was gonna say, is that a thing that happens? I I reimburse the state for what?
SPEAKER_02I don't I don't get how that would work. But this is like one of those like work backwards from the conclusion ideas where it's like, all right, here's what we're gonna do. We're gonna like make an amendment about fetal harvesting, and how can we get people to vote on it? Because they think that's like a big trap, right? That's the whole point of this.
SPEAKER_03Right. And it it it just it went nowhere. As did this uh proposal from uh Ken Dildo de Graff arguing that we should do genetic identification of post-abortion remains in order to identify the responsible male to repay the state again.
SPEAKER_05I don't know how, but one of the things that's missing is that I think that any the the the pre-born human remains should be genetically tested. And they should be paternally identified, and there should be paternal remuneration to the state for the procedure. I think that is only fair. I think that would be a free market. Suppression. You know, as I grew up, one of the things was uh if you can't do the time, don't do the crime. So if you can't do the time, don't do the crime. It's pretty easy.
SPEAKER_02Oh, Jesus Christ. This is like what this is like fetal harvesting plus dad's rights bullshit plus state budget cut equals bad idea.
SPEAKER_03Here's the graph talking to Free State Colorado about what he thinks all this is about in the bigger picture.
SPEAKER_06Ultimately, I don't know why they don't want any businesses to remain in Colorado, but that the uh this is seems all part of uh their rewilding, aka depeopling of Colorado. So get rid of the businesses, you'll get rid of the people, and then uh you know they'll have their little wolf sanctuary. I don't know. It's all insanity.
SPEAKER_02Wait, so the conspiracy theory is that Democrats are trying to remove so through abortions and wolf reintroduction and the destruction of the entire business community, Colorado will return to nature and be like life after people. And this is the plan. He figured it out.
SPEAKER_03This fucking guy is great, man. My God. Here's another one of his proposals, which I think is satirical, but it's really impossible to know with the graph.
SPEAKER_05The intent of the General Assembly is that all coinage remaining on the ground for more than 30 seconds, this would be a new version of the 30-second rule, will become real property of the state. While most coins are represented by their face value, found pennies have a value of a day's worth of good luck. Well, in tangible, this day's luck of work, good luck, is estimated to have a value of$19.68. The fee of which, being the rightful property of the State of Colorado, will be$6.56, in accordance with the tax liberation day being mid-April. And that means tax liberation day means when you stop paying taxes, when your labor stops being compelled and given to the state, when your slavery stops, and when you have and when you can start earning income for yourself. The Democrats hate that it's mid-April. They would like it to go farther in the year.
SPEAKER_03But he wasn't alone. Here's uh State Senator Byron Pelton with a just genius idea.
SPEAKER_14Right now I'm waiting to hear my bill, which is a resolution that says any fee or I'm sorry, any tax increase has to go to the citizens. So uh and ask their permissions to increase.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, what an interesting idea that we certainly don't already have.
SPEAKER_03It's super taber. Um here's uh Representative Rebecca Kelty, not really understanding the mathing.
SPEAKER_01I know last session um for the republicans, we had almost, well, actually, over$900,000 worth of cuts that we proposed. They were denied, they were turned down, and now you know we're back to the drawing board again. And I told them before, if we don't do something now, we're gonna be back here again. And guess where we are?
SPEAKER_03It's a$800 million budget deficit, but thanks for your$900,000 proposal. They had$900,000, bro.
SPEAKER_02If you didn't cut my 900k.
SPEAKER_03I told them this would happen. Uh no, you didn't. Um, here's uh Representative Larry Don Sukla of Montezuma County trying to use his words.
SPEAKER_02Definitely has my favorite name. I'm gonna get you, suckla.
SPEAKER_07And we have got to get back to being physically responsible. And I hope that we can get that done. I doubt that's gonna be done here, but the Republicans are gonna be pushing as hard as possible to get that done, and we need to start voting differently. We have got to start voting for Republicans and physically conservative people. Thank you.
SPEAKER_02Physically conservative. Physically conservative is very funny, but my god, i Republicans on the federal level are the reason why we're here right now, bud.
SPEAKER_03Uh well, but they're they're physically conservative over there, I guess. Here's Representative Jarvis Caldwell absolutely botching the Republican narrative. So we have a somewhere between one$1.2 billion budget deficit after HR1 pass, which is Oops, you're not supposed to say that.
SPEAKER_02No, you're supposed to say it's because the Democrats overspent, silly boy. Try and stay on message.
SPEAKER_03And then uh finally, here's Republican Representative Dusty Johnson with something that I imagine we're gonna be playing again and again on this show.
SPEAKER_12So to blame HR1 is misconscued, it is an escapegoat.
SPEAKER_02She did not say escapegoat. Hold on, we're running it back.
SPEAKER_12So to blame HR1 is misckewed, it is an escapegoat.
SPEAKER_02It's an escapegoat. No. Miskonskewed, an escapegoat.
SPEAKER_14I love that so much. Escapegoat?
SPEAKER_02These are not serious people. Don't listen to them. Again, this is something that like a right-wing loser put out ostensibly to like help bolster the GOP's image in Colorado.
Jared Polis and RFK Jr.
SPEAKER_03If we weren't so physically responsible, we we could avoid this escapegoat. Oh God, they're idiots. All right, let's uh talk a little bit about uh Governor Jared Polis and uh Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr.
SPEAKER_02Insofar as this episode has been largely praiseworthy of a governor and largely critical of people who are lying about what he's done and had to do because of congressional federal action, this segment will not be that way. No, no, it won't.
SPEAKER_03Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and President Trump fired Centers for Disease Control Director Susan Monarez less than a month into the job because she was not just rubber stamping RFK Jr.'s nonsensical ideas about vaccines. Here's Kyle Clark with Nine News on what, Governor Jr.
SPEAKER_21Jared Polis said. The Center for Disease Control is in shambles as Health Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. replaces science and scientists with conspiracy theories and his anti-vaccine agenda. But Democratic Governor Jared Polis is standing by his enthusiastic endorsement of Kennedy to continue leading America's health systems. There's been a stream of resignations and firings at the CDC this week as medical leaders refused to implement RFK Jr.'s various discredited ideas about vaccines and public health. Governor Polis was all in on RFK's nomination when it happened, said that he would be willing to take on big pharma and vaccine mandates. Today, R. Marshall Zellinger asked the governor if, after this purge at the CDC and the rise of this anti-vax crusade, if he's still on board with RFK Jr., do you regret your vocal support of RFK Jr.
SPEAKER_04Well, I try to work with anybody as you know, Marshall, and I was glad that President Trump didn't put a pharmaceutical lobbyist in that position like he did last time. We hope to work on making America healthier, and we already uh got a staff waiver with regard to uh improving the quality of food available to our lowest-income Coloradans and helping to end food deserts. So I've always been critical of his stance on vaccinations, which seemed to be the crux of what this current issue is about.
SPEAKER_21In fact, RFK Jr.'s pseudoscience goes beyond his views on vaccines. Just this week, he said that he could diagnose children as he passed them in airports as being, quote, overburdened with mitochondrial challenges, adding, quote, I know what a healthy child is supposed to look like.
SPEAKER_03I loved in that video uh Mark Ferrino, the budget director, yeah. Budget director, is is sit standing in the backbine polis like doing the Homer Simpson trying to disappear into the wall. Sorry, Mark your traffic, man. Members of Colorado's congressional delegation from Congressman DeGoose to Congresswoman Pederson and both of our senators criticized what's happening at the CDC for obvious reasons. What is Polis doing?
SPEAKER_02Uh I don't I I don't know. The uh different this seems to be a snare that our governor gets entangled in a lot, this RFK snare. And I I don't quite understand why. Like, he's not a like anti-vaxxer. The governor was very front and center on encouraging people as much as possible to get vaccinated. He wasn't quite in the like mandate camp that some other Blue State governors were. So I understand that he's more of the like persuade people to do this stuff instead of forcing them to do it camp ideologically. But there's no reason to praise RFK Jr. There's no reason to not just say or to use make America healthy.
SPEAKER_03That pissed me off too. Like you don't need to use the branding.
Jessica Killin
SPEAKER_02Yeah, the sloganeering is is not particularly helpful. But like, look, we have a lot of love for the gov. We think he's done a lot of good things for the state. This is a place where we just like fundamentally disagree with him that he thinks, quite frankly, you need to like appease members of this administration for fear of them coming into doing bad things to your state. When the opposite strategy, look at Pritzker, look at Newsom, look at some of these other blue state democrats, like uh forget her name, up in Maine, who punched him early on. The only way to beat a bully is to hit him back. It's not to try and appease them in any way. It is now my distinct pleasure to introduce our guest today, Jessica Killen, Democratic candidate for Colorado's 5th Congressional District. A proud fourth generation Colorado, Jessica is a devoted mother, Army veteran, and public servant running for Colorado's 5th Congressional District to restore competence, courage, and character to Washington, something they are in dire need of. Raised in Colorado Springs by public school educators, Jessica learned the value of hard work and public service. She served as a captain and paratrooper in the U.S. Army, leading soldiers overseas and participating in peacekeeping missions. She has since dedicated her career to improving the livelihoods of all Americans, including over a decade at USAA, where she worked to protect military families during the 2008 financial crisis, streamlined VA home loans, and helped service members avoid predatory lenders. She then returned to public service in leadership roles on Capitol Hill and the White House, which we will get into very shortly here. Jessica Killen, welcome to the Get More Smarter Podcast.
SPEAKER_15Thanks. That's a nice intro. I I think I somebody on my team wrote that. They did.
SPEAKER_02And they did a fine job. I literally only edited like two things. Um but before we get into like the campaign and the nuts and bolts of the of the political stuff here, just take a few minutes to like fill in those blanks. Tell us about yourself, your career, your connection to Colorado Springs, and why you're running for Congress. Sure.
SPEAKER_15Uh okay. Well, thanks. Uh thanks for having me. Really appreciate it. Um, yeah, I am, as as the statement says, a fourth generation Colorado on both sides, actually. Um so lots, uh lots of aunts, uncles, cousins, sisters, everyone running around this pretty much, I think, uh, have connections in every district in the state. Um was born in Lahara, which if you don't know where that is, that's okay. It's south of Alam, way south of south of Alamosa. And then my parents.
SPEAKER_02It's La Hara.
SPEAKER_15Yeah, if you can move La Hara, yeah.
SPEAKER_03Wait, there's a south of Alamosa?
SPEAKER_15Uh, that's a good question. I'd have to look now on. I don't know. Um, so my parents uh were public school educators, as you noted. My parents were both teachers. My dad ended up getting his master's, and so he we came here to Colorado Springs for him for his first principalship. He was the principal of Falcon Middle School. Um, I was in elementary school at the time. So basically grew up here. Uh elementary school, middle school, and then graduated from Falcon High School on the east side of Colorado Springs, sort of out powers and barns. Um, so not from a military family, not an army brat, but grew up in a community just surrounded by uh, you know, at the time, you know, now there are five, five major military posts here in Colorado Springs. At the time, there were, it was the Air Force Academy, Peterson, then Air Force Base, and NORAD Space Command. We've since then, and and Fort Carson. And then they've added Shrever since then. And then NORAD has changed over to Space Command. Um, anyway, because I was surrounded by all these military and veterans' families when my parents said, hey, you know, we don't have any money for college, what do you think? I got an Army ROTC scholarship and uh went to college on an Army ROTC scholarship and then served, as you noted, overseas most of the time. I was at Fort Bragg for a little bit. I am a paratrooper, went to Fort Benning, Georgia for that, but um did most of my work overseas, uh, first as part of Operation Joint Endeavor, Joint Guard. So I'm a pre-9-11 vet doing uh peacekeeping operations and supporting peacekeeping operations in the Balkans. Uh and then as an as an MP, we so we were doing maneuver and mobility support um from Hungary to Bosnia. And then a huge part of the work I did also then um was in NATO expansion. Uh, you know, this is it's interesting. This was a time when uh people in Europe still remembered the Marshall Plan, uh, still remembered and noted the importance of American diplomacy and soft power and how that, first of all, helps create the global stability, which I also believe helps protect our own national security. It's a out of uh I don't think I'm quite in touch with the current view of the Trump administration on that, but I I do think that these are critical components to our own national security. And one of the things we were doing when I was there is expanding NATO. And we expanded NATO to include Poland while I was there, and then we did a bunch of work on some other Eastern Bloc nations, Latvia, Slovakia, which were all then admitted uh into NATO in 2004, notably not Ukraine. Um, so what has happened in Ukraine is certainly near and dear to my heart. Um then returned to the States. Uh was gonna go to CU Boulder Law School, but got into Georgetown. And the rule of thumb then was to go to the best law school you get into. So I went to Georgetown, which is how I ended up.
SPEAKER_03Is the rule of thumb now to go to the worst one? No.
SPEAKER_15I just think that people have gotten realistic about how much law school costs and maybe it's not always worth it. I don't know. But uh, so I went to Georgetown and then uh practiced law and then spent basically I spent half of my career in the private sector. So three years at a law firm, uh, and then 10 years at USAA. I spent a decade there. I started there right before the financial crisis. And so, as you noted, worked a lot, you know, used some of the skills and some of the things I learned in the Army. Like my one of my biggest issues was um uh bounce checks uh with my that my soldiers had bounce checks. And so started working through financial products that would help establish credit for young service members who needed uh, you know, it's hard to establish credit when you don't make much money. And so new, new payday lending alternatives and and cards uh that would uh help them develop a credit line. Also helping streamline the VA home loan system and worked a lot with the VA and to improve the VA home loan process then. And then, you know, just worked through providing uh financial services uh products through for veterans and service members throughout that time. Then during Trump 1.0, um was thinking about coming home and met my now husband, and he was in DC, so stayed there a little longer, uh, but did some jobs that I think really also were critical to me making this decision and also critical to, I think, what will be my success as a congressional candidate and also as a member of Congress. I uh was a chief of staff for several members uh of the House of Representatives, um in the uh Donna Shalala in the 116th Congress. I was notably uh also on the cat on Capitol Hill and working as a chief uh on January 6th. And so, you know, that was in the moment, realized like I'd never thought in a million years, uh, someone as a who's a patriot and care I care deeply about my country that I'd see one branch of government essentially attacking another branch of government. Um but went through all that. Uh, then I was uh chief of staff from Marie Gloosencamp Perez, who Oh, cool, I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, she's rules.
SPEAKER_15Yeah, who was in a also very challenging district. And so I think that's where I learned and began to understand how to operate in a district like the one I'm running in, uh in my home district. And uh also just and how and how effective you can be in a district like like this, like mine. And then I went on to go work for Doug M. Hoff and be his chief of staff uh in the last year and a half of the administration and left there on the 20th of January. So why I'm running, um first and foremost, because I'm a patriot and I love my country. And I think we can do better. I think Congress can do better. Uh I care deeply about Article One, and I feel that Congress and Jeff Crank in particular are ceding their power and not putting a check on the administration or on the executive branch in a way that they should. They are not being responsible and being good stewards of taxpayer dollars. And I know how Congress can and should work and that it should work better for people. It's called the House of Representatives for a reason. You're supposed to fucking represent the people that elected you, and he's not doing that. And um, and I really believe I've watched this district change over the years when I was growing up in this district, and we'll talk about it, I'm sure. Like this was six counties. Um, it's now one county. And that's because of the massive change that has happened in this district. And I I've been out in the community, I'm talking to people, I'm telling you, people around Colorado may not know that this district is ripe for change. Everyone in Colorado Springs knows. Everyone in El Paso County knows.
SPEAKER_03But before before we continue, I can I confirm have you seen Jeff Crank in person? Uh I have not yet met someone else in the case.
SPEAKER_15Crazily, you know who uh who has? My husband.
SPEAKER_03So he does exist.
SPEAKER_15But he had a Jeff Crank sighting in Washington, D.C., not in Colorado, unfortunately.
SPEAKER_02So okay, so there's at least there's at least one degree of confirmation. Yeah. I s I've I've been out there a lot and I've never seen him. I've run into the rest of the delegation, though. I want to talk a little bit about uh your work with the second gentleman, who I just briefly was extraordinarily kind to me. The second gentleman is among other things, sort of like the spouse boss. So, like when you're a congressional spouse, like he is your guy and he interfaces in his office was really supportive. So you were chief of staff uh to the second gentleman uh during some pretty intense times. Uh what did you learn from your time in the White House or the Naval Observatory? I don't know where you actually met.
SPEAKER_15I worked at the White House, yeah. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Okay, very good. Any stories from your time with Mr. M. Hof that you can share with us to get a better sense of what that job was like and how it prepared you for a run for Congress?
SPEAKER_15I will give uh the SG, Mr. Mhof, a lot of credit. He was the first ever male spouse uh and uh and the first ever um Jewish principal in the White House. And um he took it very seriously. And, you know, when I first started with him, I thought I was gonna be working, uh he had, you know, he developed his platform and anti-Semitism was one of those things. Um, gender equity was another. And uh, but I started there uh in late August, early September of 2023. And so I thought I was gonna be mostly working on gender equity work. But then of course October 7th happened, and I would say he was like, Oh, do you sort of wish you were Jewish? And I was like, Well, I'm like George Santos now, I'm Jewish. Um, because I learned all about uh how to manage Jewish politics, but also, you know, this and this was a very serious issue after after September, uh, after October 7th, and especially on college campuses. And it's something that I'm very proud of, the work that we did to combat anti-Semitism and anti and hate generally. And one of the things we worked on, I think is so critical, and it's part of my own brand of politics, is bringing different people of different faiths together to talk these issues out. Because I think we don't talk enough about we we tend to silo ourselves and not talk to each other. And this is something that he took seriously. And he's a very he, you know, he's he's a guy who he cares deeply, uh, not just about his wife, but about the country as well. And this is something that I think we I I'm I think that's something that we did a lot of is just bringing people together, trying to find common ground. And that's gonna be something that I definitely focus on in in my congressional race and as a member of Congress as well.
SPEAKER_03Let me ask you a little bit about the hopium in the 5th congressional district. Uh there's a lot of talk the that we've heard that it it's sort of like Orange County, California around 2017, right before it flipped blue. The the district is one of the few where uh Vice President Harris performed better than President Biden. The Cook Political Report says it's moving toward Democrats faster than any other district in the country. We've heard some of this before, and a Democrat never manages to get over the hump. Why is this different?
SPEAKER_15I think it's different because uh first and foremost, uh, you know, we have not run a well-funded Democrat who meets, who also matches the district in terms ideologically, uh, and who knows and understands the core values of this district really since 2014. And in 20, that was Irv Halter. And, you know, he uh ran a great race, but you know, you that was a very different time. We could not, that was a tough cycle for for Democrats for starters, and it wasn't winnable then. So I think first and foremost, just you know, putting together all the pieces of the puzzle to be a a great candidate and uh and someone who can win. And that is, you know, working my ass off, meeting people where they are, listening to people, also raising the resources so that I can effectively communicate my message beyond the people I meet in person, but in the broader network of people, those are the those are the that's how you win, you know, that and actually being engaged in the community. And I just don't think we've been able, and also honestly, this trend, the the the the changes in this district have happened so fast, I understand why we haven't, right? It's this is really the first cycle that we can do it. Then if you look at 2018, which I think, you know, is if you look at past his prologue, you know, a midterm cycle like this during a Trump administration in particular is a time in which you can have a better chance at flipping a district like this. And then doing the hard work and engaging with the community is how you keep it. Uh, you know, and I a great example, I think Orange County is a great example, but I just ran into Abigail Spanberger uh in Denver last week. And you know, she had a a worse district. I, you know, she was R plus six, and Brat, who was her her, uh the person she ran against, he had won his previous race by 15 points. And I was like, damn, I got this in the back. I don't know about that, but like, and now she's running for governor of Virginia and probably gonna win. So I I, you know, I think there's lots of examples out there. Orange County is definitely one of them, but I Abigail Spanberger and her race and the way she, and that women in national security in particular, um, do really uh connect in a way in a special way with voters. And I I think, you know, listen, my district has a hundred thousand service members and veterans in the district. It should be represented by a veteran and somebody who speaks their language and understands what they've been through. And Jeff Crank has not.
SPEAKER_03But yeah, let me follow up on that. The district has never had a military associated person representing them, as far as I can remember.
SPEAKER_15I mean, I it did 46 years ago. I think when before Joe Heffling? Yeah, it's like, yeah, yeah, before Joe Heffling, yeah. I know.
SPEAKER_02Well, so it's really interesting. I mean, Colorado Springs has certainly undergone a lot of changes, right? Like a lot of Democrats are are elected from the state legislature in seats in the springs that never had before. You have an unaffiliated immigrant mayor in Yemimobilade, uh, be defeating sort of Colorado Springs institution, Wayne Williams, and it wasn't particularly close. You know, it's really, it's a really good point. Um, and you know, a hundred thousand more registered unaffiliated voters than Republicans in the district right now, plus the hundred thousand service members, or I'm sure there's some overlap there that you mentioned. But still, Jeff Crank won last time by 14 points. So if I'm hearing you right, it's a combination of the backlash to Trump, which we discussed before you got on here in a different segment. The special election victories that Democrats are having across the country right now are enormous, right? Your resource advantage, can you spill a little bit on how the fundraising is going for the listeners?
SPEAKER_15Yeah, yeah. I'm closing in on 900. You know, August is notoriously. It's the worst.
SPEAKER_09Um, it's been just brutal.
SPEAKER_15Uh I'm closing in on 900,000 now. You know, we're gonna be over, we're gonna be over a million by the end of the quarter. Uh and yeah, I mean, Crank has raised uh a little over 500. He had just under 500 cash on hand. So I raised more at my launch than he has raised all year. We'll see how he does in Q3, but I'm sure his August sucked too. And um, you know, I I think my when I when I make my argument to most, yeah, there's three pillars, the three-legged stool, if you will. You have the trends and the changes, and also the fact that this is a midterm year. And uh one point I didn't know uh, but I think is important is uh college attainability in this district has gone from 35% to 45% over the last decade.
SPEAKER_02I didn't know that.
SPEAKER_15We have and we have higher college attainment than CD eight and CD three than any of the other uh, you know, sort of any of the other uh Republican held districts in the in the in the state. Um and those are the people who turn out for midterm elections. Those are the people that turn out. Um so and then you have, I think Jeff Crank is a uniquely vulnerable incumbent. We can talk about all the reasons why. And then the third piece is sort of what we already talked about. There's a lot of pieces to the puzzle to running a successful congressional campaign, and I'm hitting every mark and I will continue to hit every mark.
SPEAKER_02So maybe this is a stereotype. So correct me if I'm wrong about this, but like it seems like this district, among a few and fewer and fewer, still has like some old school Romney Republicans that are not so MAGA, like they're not like all Trumpy, right? Which feels like a crank mismatch because all he's doing is shine in this guy's boots. But folks who are not MAGA, they've still been reliably voting for Republicans for decades, right? Like, you know.
SPEAKER_15Yeah. And what we need to provide them though is an alternative that actually meets them. And it's sort of funny you say Romney Republicans, because I had a meeting with uh Amy Walter at Cook Political a couple of weeks ago. And she's like, if you could bring anyone into the district to campaign with you, no, no questions asked and nothing, who would it be? And I was like, Mitt Romney.
SPEAKER_02Okay, so what's your what's your message to these sort of like more traditional non-MAGA Republicans? Because you're gonna need to win at least some of them if you're gonna win the district, right?
SPEAKER_15Yeah. My message is first of all, you know, I sometimes feel like I'm a little bit of a Democrat without a home, too. Um, I am, you know, for sure, you know, I care deeply about fiscal responsibility. And what I find fascinating is. The big, beautiful, ugly, whatever Phil we want to, whatever we want to call it, it's so fiscally unconservative. It's the opposite of conservative. And saddling our kids and our grandkids with uh debt that is honestly unsustainable and that is it it's irresponsible, it's immoral, and it's not conservative. So that's one piece in particular. And I think old school Romney Republicans, to your point, are aligned with me. I align with them. I understand. And it's also gotten to a point, you know, people, it's getting this is a little wonky, but the second biggest line item, when you think about member of Congress, your job, good steward of taxpayer dollars, the second biggest line item right now in the federal budget is interest on the debt. And we can't afford to have good programs that are moving this country forward, that are getting people into a place where they feel like they can access the American dream, where they feel like government is working for them, if we're spending all our money on interest on the debt. And this just that this bill just made that worse. I think the other piece that this isn't necessarily political, but I think most Republicans, independents, and Democrats understand. I think what's the the biggest problem our country's facing right now, and that El Paso County also is facing, is income and wealth inequality. And it's it's pull it's dividing us. It's in and we are it and putting us in silos and creating an environment where we are that's completely divisive. And we need to focus on building out and having policies that actually build out a bitter, a better middle class, a more robust middle class to bring our country together again and to bring my community together again. And those things resonate, I think, with um, and I can talk about, you know, where I'm at on immigration and some other areas where I probably am not quite aligned with the far left side of the Democratic Party, but you know, where in the end, most of the country is in the middle, most of my district's in the middle, and that's where I am too.
SPEAKER_03You know, anybody who's been involved in politics professionally, I think at some point thinks about what they would do different if they were the candidate, if they um or or or maybe what they even might do the same. Is there anything from your previous experience that that you've been thinking about as you've been a candidate where you were like, um, uh yeah, I'm not gonna do this like so-and-so did it, or I'm gonna do something different?
SPEAKER_15You know, that's a time, I'm not gonna throw anyone under the bus. Uh, but I'll say, you know, listen, I've seen the good and the bad and the ugly of Washington. Uh there's definitely a lot of things I would do differently. I think first and foremost, I believe, you know, I think one of the things I've seen in government overall that drives me crazy is a lack of good leadership and management. And um, I learned how to lead and manage in the Army. And they really treat, they really train lieutenants and junior officers the basic core principles of how to lead by example and how to treat your people with dignity and respect and demonstrate that you care about them not only as professionals, but as people. And I'm a big believer that when everyone's rowing in the same direction and everyone knows and understands the mission and a mission-driven uh environment, and everyone feels invested in that mission, we perform better. Teams perform better. And so that's been a core thing of me as a in my staff capacity and leadership roles in government. And I'm trying to take that into my candidacy as well. And that I want all my constituents to know I care about them deeply, but also everyone who works around me, we all need to be very focused on the mission and have and feel invested in it because I think we will perform better that way. And I think government would perform better. So I we need more, and this is why I think people who have a service background who have served in the military before are effective members of Congress, effective leaders in government, because they know that and they know and understand how to make things work and how to get shit done.
SPEAKER_03Is there anything that surprised you thus far as a candidate that you maybe were like, oh, I I didn't think I'd feel like this, or I didn't think I'd have to do this much, or uh, or is this kind of how you thought it would go?
SPEAKER_15Uh, definitely a lot of surprises. You know, I've only worked on the official side before. I've never really worked uh uh loosely with campaigns, but not like this. So there's been a lot in terms of the way certain components of fundraising work, the way, you know, all sorts of stuff. But one thing, and uh I've said this, I always thought that being a staffer would make me a better uh principal and a better candidate. And I think that's true. I now realize that being a candidate uh before or would have made me a better staffer that because it's hard. It's really hard to put yourself out there and to always be on and to, you know, it's I love it. And it's I'm I I'm excited about it and I'm excited about what I can do and how I can serve my community. But it is um, it's a new challenge. And um, I'm learning something. This is my first podcast, as we talked about. Like I'm doing new shit every day. Uh and so yeah, I don't know if there's any one thing in particular that I can like think of right at this moment, but there's been a lot of lessons learned where I'm like, oh, okay, that's the way we do this. Um for sure, uh components of fundraising that I just didn't understand how it all worked. I still don't really get how digital fundraising works, but I'm just I I don't understand it all.
SPEAKER_02Uh a lot a lot of it works like this. Somebody sends out a bunch of text with your picture on it and then uh makes money and then puts it in their pocket. I have noted that. That's the unfortunate. Yeah. Well, so let's let's talk some shit about Jeff Crank. So uh so Jeff Crank has voted with Donald Trump and Lauren Boebert nearly a hundred percent of the time. He voted for the big, beautiful bullshit bill that cuts Medicaid and food assistance and harms veterans and does all sorts of horrible, nasty stuff. He defended Mike Waltz after that classified information leaked on signal. Remember that feels like forever ago. Um He loves Pete Heggseth, by the way.
SPEAKER_15Jeff Crank loves Peter Pete Hegseth. I and by the way, veterans are not on board with him. So I'm maybe sorry.
SPEAKER_02Of those or others, if you were Jeff Crank, which one of these votes or positions or modes would you be most worried about now that he has a very legitimate challenger in you?
SPEAKER_15Well, I think first of all, he he uh he voted in committee, he didn't on the floor, but in committee, you know, he voted to sell off public lands. And, you know, that is and that is one where Jeff Hurd actually voted separate differently from Jeff Crank. Um, so you know, listen, moderating themselves on the mar he Jeff Hurd is moderating himself on the margins, but you know, public lands are a critical and important part of the Colorado lived experience. And uh people will not forget that. And the economy. And the economy. Exactly. Indeed. So I think for sure that uh on a broader level, I would say for sure the vote on the big beautiful bill. I think all Republicans are going to be paying a very hefty price for that. Um, because ultimately, people voted for this administration and I believe voted for Jeff Crank to create a better, more affordable life. And, you know, when I look here, what we're dealing with in Colorado Springs in El Paso County, we are short 25,000 homes. Many of those probably need to be in the affordable housing category. People are barely getting by in terms of their health insurance and groceries, and none of that is going down. It's only going up. And uh so I would be deeply concerned about that because I actually am gonna focus on things that are actually gonna make life better for the community and make life and make things more affordable and focus on actual solutions, not just honestly, I I don't get it. Just he basically puts party politics over the people of his district.
SPEAKER_02And until now, that was a fairly safe bet for a guy from this district, but we're we're hoping you can change that. I want to ask you a little bit about uh you mentioned the now home of multiple military installations uh in Colorado Springs and El Paso County, including Space Command. Uh, keeping space command in Colorado seems to be one of the very rare issues on which our entire congressional delegation actually agrees. What would you do to keep Space Command in Colorado if you were in Congress?
SPEAKER_15Well, I do more than just send a letter to Donald Trump. Um I, you know, I, you know, we need to talk about, we need to talk with all of our partners, right? Needs to be military partners, civilian sector partners, government partners, the private sector, you know, we've set up, we have now here in Colorado Springs a de facto business community that very much supports Space Command and its mission. And what people don't realize is that you if you move Space Command to Huntsville, Alabama, half of the people who work for Space Command are civilian. They're not going to Huntsville, Alabama. They've made clear that they're not going to Huntsville. So you are then basically creating a massive brain drain at in an entity that is actually quite specialized and has quite specialized knowledge. Um, and you cannot effectively do that. You cannot run an effective entity in Huntsville with given those changes. So I think the pro problem is it's we get need to get, once again, my brand of politics, get everyone together, what whether Republican, Democrat, independent, it doesn't matter. Everyone should be focused on one core mission. That's make making keeping space command here because it makes the most sense. And it's the best for our country and for our national security and for the space command's uh success overall. We should all be focused on that.
SPEAKER_03Let me ask you about immigration. You've said President Biden was too slow to close the border, but you've also called Trump's deportation measures immoral and illegal. Where do you think Democrats need to be on this issue, both to win elections, but also just to have a workable system in this country?
SPEAKER_15There's been so I what my biggest frustration is that immigration has just become so politicized. Any effort that we've made uh that's bipartisan, that's rational, that does shut down the border, or at least bring it, you know, slow down uh illegal immigration, and then comes up with a different pathway to citizenship, whatever you want to say, that is it recognizes the reality of that we have all these people here and we've got to deal with the immigrants that we have here, um, has been shut down just to score political points. People know that. Voters know that. They're sick of it. They're sick of Republicans politicizing it and they're sick of Democrats politicizing it. So I'm hopeful if we elect more people like me, we can actually get something done that makes sense for our country. I do think that the Biden administration was way too slow, uh, did too little too late on on the border and border security. And I do think, though, that, you know, what's happening uh right now with the ice raids and deportations, you know, my favorite, one of the things that I think makes America great already is adherence to the rule of law. We have rule of law. And right now, what's happening is not just immoral and incompetent, but it's lawless. And we need to actually have a plan on how to, you know, we were told that they're only going to remove illegal immigrants who are criminals. That is absolutely not what not what's happening. So, and you know, I think all voters, no matter what you have behind your name, uh know and understand that that is immoral and it's inhuman and people don't like it.
SPEAKER_02So one thing we're hearing a lot from Democrats and progressives and the base and pundits and and everybody in between, including us, we've got plenty of criticism for the blue team uh on this show, is that Democrats aren't really fighting hard enough against Trump right now. But honestly, including us, the ones who complain about it aren't really offering any substantive ideas on what Democrats should be doing differently. So let's ask you if you were in Congress right now, what would you be doing to stop the most harmful parts of Trump's agenda?
SPEAKER_15I think, first of all, people forget one of the core things is two core things on uh Congress, power of the purse and oversight. And we are not seeing enough oversight of the lawlessness and the immoral and the incompetence, the doge incompetence. I just cannot believe we allowed that to go on. And it's impacted so many people in my district, and there's no check on it. And then in terms of the power of the purse, and I've sort of already spoken to this because I just think that the big beautiful bill is wholly incompetent and also unconservative. We need to get our fiscal house in order. And I would focus on I'm not a big fan of bloated spending, but also not a fan of bloated uh tax cuts. The tax cuts in that bill, along with tariffs, are ultimately regressive and ultimately increase the income inequality and income gap in our country. We need to have tax cuts and tax policy that hits, you know, that creates more fairness and creates a structure where the beneficiaries of those tax cuts is truly the middle class, not the wealthiest, because the wealthiest can afford additional to pay extra cut extra taxes. And we also, and when we're going through, yes, they're amazing. Uh and and and I, you know, when you look at also some of the provisions of that bill are gonna keep Amazon and other huge corporations in a place where they're basically paying no taxes. And I think anyone understands that the the innate in unfairness of that. So I'd take a very close look at our tax policy and make sure it's more progressive, not regressive. Focus on making cuts where, you know, there, of course there's fraud, waste, and abuse in government, but let's do it in a thoughtful way and cut, make spending cuts in a way that actually works and works for the American people and makes the American people's lives better.
SPEAKER_03Well, let's uh do a little um crystal ball looking into that was a terrible sentence.
SPEAKER_02Uh let's look into the crystal ball a little bit, Jessica. Try that.
SPEAKER_03Okay. Uh you know, let's let let's move ahead to January 2027. You're you're in office, you're the first Democrat to get elected here. What's the thing that you would want to accomplish in your first year or two where your re voters in Colorado Springs are saying, I'm glad we're glad we did that. That was a good bet.
SPEAKER_15You know, it's interesting. A couple things. I two two things that come top of mind. Um, I think first, you know, I've spent most of my career in the Army and then at USAA working with and around Republicans. Um, I'm pretty comfortable in that space. And what I found fascinating when I was working on the Hill is how siloed people become and they don't really, it's it's a collegial body. It's supposed to be a collegial body. And yet not enough, I don't see enough Democrats, Republicans sitting down, breaking bread, having lunch, drinks, coffee, whatever. And so I would definitely make an effort. I'm not saying it never happens, but I don't think it happens enough. And we've got to get out of our echo chambers on both sides of the aisle. And so definitely something I would be focused on is sitting down, breaking bread, talking to Republicans who I know I can work with. There's there's a few of them up there still, and uh and and and starting to talk about rational solutions and and things we can do together. The other thing is Doug Lamborn and now Jeff Crank basically were not engaged in the community. And I think that's how they sort of they managed to get away with it, but they weren't, they're not, and part of that is that they're not then putting forward policies that reflect what the community needs. So I'm going to be out and about hearing from the community, hearing about their issues, identifying where there are federal, you know, not a lot of issues are state and local, but identifying issues that there can be there where there's a federal nexus and where I can provide a solution or a response. Uh, I'm gonna be doing town halls. I'm gonna be talking to people who disagree with me. It sounds crazy, but actually I think it's a pretty important idea is that I understand what where people are coming from. And I think the more you do that and the more you have those con those tough, interesting, engaged conversations, the more effective you can be as a leader.
SPEAKER_03If we're looking back in January 2027 on the the election that had just passed, what do you think you'll be saying about why you won? What what what was the story? What happened, what changed, what what put you over the hump?
SPEAKER_15I worked hard, I worked my ass off, I cared about my community, I'm part of Team Normal, and we all need to focus on being part of Team Normal again. Politics have become too, you know, totally the interest groups have ruled the left and the right, and we've gotta stop. We've gotta be responsive to our constituents. And I think that if I I'm planning to run a race in which I'm as responsive to the members of my community, and that's how you win races, along with being able to effectively communicate that with resources.
SPEAKER_02Well, we have really enjoyed talking to you, and somehow we are already at time. But uh, let us know where can people find you? How can they contribute? What's your website? What social media platforms are you on? Where can our listeners go help?
SPEAKER_15Yes, I'm on all the things other than TikTok. Uh Killin, well, my website is killinforcolorado.com, K-I-L-L-I-N, F-O-R, Colorado.com.
SPEAKER_02But please, listeners, go and find Jessica Killen at killinforcolorado.com and on all the inner webs except for TikTok. I don't go there either. Jessica Killen, Democratic candidate for Colorado's Fifth Congressional District and really, really hopeful next congressperson from Colorado's Fifth Congressional District. Thank you so much for joining us on the Get More Smarter Podcast. It was awesome to talk to you, and we really appreciate your time.
Trump Time
SPEAKER_15Thank you. Thanks for having me on. Would love to have everyone's support.
SPEAKER_03All right, let's talk a little bit more about uh dear leader Trump. The uh national park system in the United States is strained because roughly one-fifth of the country's 433 parks, according to the New York Times, are understaffed because of Trump administration cuts. Twenty-four percent of permanent employees have been lost in Trump's terms thus far. Uh even so, Trump has directed all national parks to remain open, but that means that people aren't collecting, there aren't enough people to collect um the fees for people coming into the parks. Uh, bathrooms aren't getting clean, tours aren't being run.
SPEAKER_02Here's a quote. It says, budget cuts and staff reductions have set our national parks on an unsustainable and dangerous path, said Phil Francis, a 40-year veteran of the Park Service and chair of the Coalition of Protect America's National Parks, an advocacy group of current and former National Park employees. Some of the impacts of the staff cuts are visible to the public, but many are not yet. And all of this is only going to get worse. Trump has not yet even nominated someone to run the National Park Service. Right, because Doug Bergam is putting four teenagers in a fucking trench coat or AI in charge of every part of his department. I like the trench coat idea.
SPEAKER_03They're all like wobbly and an adult-sized person. A spokeswoman for the Interior Department really uh summed things up inadvertently well. Uh someone named Aubrey Spadey said uh of the Times reporting that it was erroneous, though she wouldn't mention any specifics, she said, quote, staffing levels and operations at our national parks this summer are on par with previous years, unquote. On par.
SPEAKER_02What a fucking wiggly word. On par. Is that a birdie? Is that a double bogey? How on par are we? I if on par means a quarter less staffing, then yes, you're you're right. There is no definition of on par that is 25% variants. No. I mean, it they don't even know what to say anymore. They're just like, uh yeah. Uh fake news. They don't really care. I mean, they don't fucking give a shit. Like national parks, especially, like, think about it. Like, what's the one federal agency besides like the EPA, which is getting hollowed out, besides the Department of Education, which is getting hollowed out, besides the Smithsonian, which is getting hollowed out, that would be like most oppositional to like a Donald Trump agenda. It's the Park Service. So like just dismantling it piece by piece is obviously the planet's at Project 2025. We've talked about it a million times, and putting a creep like Doug Bergam in charge of it was also a huge fucking problem.
SPEAKER_03We've also talked uh in recent episodes about the price increases in the United States, the coming price increases because of tariffs and things like that. Here's another one you're gonna see uh as soon as uh today on Friday, the day we're recording, because uh online shopping is about to get a lot more expensive. Trump has erased an exemption that allows low-cost imports to enter the country duty free.
SPEAKER_02This is like your fast fashion, like your sheens, for instance, like your eleven dollar dresses from China. Right. Uh those prices are gonna go up ten to fifty percent.
SPEAKER_03Oh, that's a lot. Uh Etsy, the company that uh the website where you can, you know, make sell stuff that you make, they're flat out telling people that you should raise your prices fifty percent or so on the front end in order to cover your additional shipping costs. People are not gonna be happy about this.
SPEAKER_02No, and like it uh I don't understand what they thought was gonna happen. Like this is all very intentional. Like they know it's slow rolling. They're closing these loopholes. People are telling them, well, if you do that, all this stuff's gonna get more expensive. They're gonna try and blame Democrats somehow. I don't think it's gonna work. People voted for this idiot because they thought, well, he's a buffoon and a racist and a monster, but he'll probably make things cheaper. Now he's making them more expensive.
SPEAKER_03Right. And his response is to say, well, we're bringing in all this money and tariffs, but to who? No one's seeing it.
SPEAKER_02I don't know. Like I was thinking the other day, I I'm not sure how that part works, quite frankly. Like, who do they write a check to? Is it the IRS? Is it this they said they were gonna come up with them? It's just to Donald Trump. Yeah, I mean, if he's just pocketing the tariff money, that would make the most sense out of any arrangement of all this stuff. But I just think like ultimately, like it's not an uninteresting idea to like do a temporary sort of tariff type sales tax thing to like get the revenue of the federal government into a better position. But the problem is they increased the debt ceiling$5 trillion. They just cut taxes for the richest people in the world again. They just extended the last Trump taxes again. So it doesn't pan out to be net positive. And then of course they cut Medicaid by a billion dollars all the way. Like, so I don't understand how this pencils in any conceivable way, other than everybody is going to pay more money for the same shit. That money is going to go to the government, and Donald Trump, a Republican president, is selling this is a good thing. Very strange stuff. And of course, like tariffs and sales taxes are like obscenely regressive, whereas income taxes and wealth taxes are progressive, and that's why they're doing the one and not the other.
SPEAKER_03This all leads us to our newish segment where we feature an example or examples of people calling out the nonsense from the Trump administration.
SPEAKER_22This is a bullshit. It's bullshit. This is a bullshit. That's bullshit.
SPEAKER_03See now that's a bully.
SPEAKER_02Yes, he has no authority to do this, of course, but because he's Donald Trump, he thinks he is just in charge of everything. Yeah, she's suing him, right?
SPEAKER_03Yep, she's suing. She says, quote, President Trump purported to fire me for cause when no cause exists under the law, and he has no authority to do so. I will not resign. I will continue to carry out my duties to help the American economy as I have been doing since 2022.
SPEAKER_02Hell yeah. Way to go. The only way to beat these freaks is to punch them in the face and fight back. That's it. You can't take it lying down, you can't slink away, stand up, fight back. And like, maybe she'll win, maybe she'll lose, but you don't win by not trying.
SPEAKER_03And we've also seen very direct comments from uh members of the uh or or leaders in the CDC who resigned following the firing of the less than one month old boss. Uh the Washington Post collected some of those comments and they're they're pretty good.
SPEAKER_20Dmitry Daskalakis, I'm an infectious disease doctor, and I was the director of the National Center for Immunization and Respiratory Diseases.
SPEAKER_19I'm Dan Jernigan. Um I was until recently the director of the National Center for Emerging and Zonotic Infectious Diseases at CDC.
SPEAKER_13I'm Dr. Howry, I was the chief medical officer to turn on a resignation yesterday.
SPEAKER_20I tendered my resignation um because um I could not be a part of the weaponization of public health in CDC.
SPEAKER_19We really think that the use of the scientific information as evidence to help the decision making with vaccines is critical. And if that is not the approach that is being taken, then Americans are not getting what they need from us.
SPEAKER_13I'm a scientist. I think it's okay to question. Well, you shouldn't know what your recommendation is going to be before you have the data. We should always be questioning, or you shouldn't have a preconceived idea before you have the data.
SPEAKER_20I fear that without scientific leadership, um, and what I mean by that is the director of CDC, um, there will be um decisions made around vaccines that are uh based on uh you know predecided ideas rather than based on uh presentation of high-quality science and discussion.
SPEAKER_19I think there is a scientific process that we need to be following, and there is the ethical responsibility of how we handle it.
SPEAKER_20As we saw the day unfold with Susan, um realizing that we potentially would not have such a scientific leader anymore, um, that we would then be sort of in an unfettered uh situation where undue influence and ideology would drive the science. That is where my line is. The three of us are committed. We love CDC.
SPEAKER_13We didn't want to leave, but we had to.
SPEAKER_02What do you think about this? What do you think about the professional class resigning instead of trying to slow things down, jam up the works, redirect the ship from inside by sticking around?
SPEAKER_03I I I feel a little differently about this just because these are people with scientific backgrounds who um, you know, for their entire careers, they would be ethically opposed to ignoring science. And this sort of goes against their fundamental training and and experience. I I understand why that would be hard for them to continue forward. And you know, they may have realized there's not much they can do anyway, because if they're gonna fire a Republican from uh you know who was put forward by Trump less than a month into her job, uh they're not gonna listen to anybody else.
SPEAKER_02I feel that I I I'm not in that position, so it's easier for me to say than it is for them to do or not do. But like I I think I tend to side with the like stick it out, you can't fire me, I'm going to stay here and do my job until I'm dragged out uh one way or another because the health of the nation is so important, and the people that are and they're just gonna be replaced by conspiracy theorists and toadies and freaks and you know political actors. Right.
SPEAKER_03Then then maybe why they did this than just to get ahead of their own firings, probably to say, I'm not you're not gonna fire me. And here's here's why I'm quitting.
SPEAKER_02They are just the speed and depth to which they have just utterly remade the entire country in a very short amount of time is fucking frightening.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, you say this a lot, and I I I think it's worth repeating here. If you were trying to destroy a country on purpose, what else would you be doing?
Quick Hits
SPEAKER_02What would you be doing differently? Like if your goal was the annihilation of the United States of America as we know it, what actions would you be taking that are different than what this administration is doing? I can't think of many.
SPEAKER_03All right, let's do a couple of quick hits and then we'll roll out of here. The uh bread sandwich, Congressman Jeff Hurd from the 3rd Congressional District, uh continues to not show his face, which is sort of understandable after he talked a lot for months about opposing Medicaid cuts and then voting twice for Medicaid cuts. But here's KSJD Radio in the Four Corners region.
SPEAKER_00People who came to Dolores on Wednesday night to see third district congressman Jeff Hurd had to make do with asking questions of the Montezuma County Commissioners instead. Commission chair Jim Candelleria told the crowd of about 120 that he'd just been notified that Heard would not attend because the aide with whom he was traveling had a medical emergency. Federal onlookers voiced skepticism, noting that an aide to Heard was also a no-show at a scheduled town hall in Dolores in February. Candelaria said to Heard that local people want a town hall. This meeting was only to be a sit-down between the commissioners and the congressmen. The commissioners took audience questions for about an hour. Many were about the effects of recent drastic cuts to federal funding for things such as Medicaid, public lands agencies, and food banks. One person said, quote, We are in distress, to which Commissioner Kent Lindsay responded, quote, We're in distress too. The board said they are waiting to see how decisions made in a recent special session of the Colorado legislature will affect counties. Colorado is seeking to deal with a roughly$800 million budget shortfall, some of that the result of federal budget cuts. Candelaria told the audience, quote, we're going to navigate the waters the best that we can. This is KSJD.
SPEAKER_02I just want to say I've I'd never heard of Gail Binkley or KSJD before, but my God, is that like the perfect person for the Western Slopes public radio station? Holy moly. Great job. Just a disappointment, man. Just an absolutely crushing disappointment. And Jeff Hurd, what a goddamn coward.
SPEAKER_03Not only refusing to show up at the town hall, but then making local elected officials eat shit sandwiches on his behalf.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And then like, you asshole. You can really only use the like staffer had a medical emergency bullshit once. Like, two's two's a little bit suspicious, man. Jeff, Jeff Hurd's grandmother's gonna start dying a lot, I think.
SPEAKER_03Not the other one this time. Uh we've got some good news for you. Ah, finally. Starting with a big win for Democrats in Iowa. Here's ABC News.
SPEAKER_16Breaking news in the closely watched election in Iowa. Democrats flipping a seat in the state Senate, and Jay O'Brien is in Washington with what this means for the GOP supermajority in that state. Good morning, Jay.
SPEAKER_17Yeah, Rebecca. Democrat Caitlin Dre beating Republican Christopher Pruch by 11 points, in this case, just about 800 votes in a district that Donald Trump won easily in 2024, according to the latest data from local elections officials.
SPEAKER_03This uh is something that I think uh it would be scary for a person like Republican Senator Jody Ernst, who is up for re-election in 2026, but she bounced a few days later.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Uh that whole thing about how she said we're all gonna die one day. I'm sure she did a little internal searching, I mean polling, and found out that uh that wasn't a fucking very popular thing, I think.
SPEAKER_03No, and the fact that uh this Democrat won big in a Trump carried district has got to freak her out. As would newest, the newest polling on the generic congressional ballot.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, uh we've got a poll from the economists here, which is like a B to an A according to 538. Generic congressional ballot. And to be clear, this is just between 18 and 29 year olds, so that's not the whole thing. Democrats 48%, Republicans 22. That's a 26-point banger. And this comes on the heels of a G. Elliott Morris poll for his excellent substack strength in numbers that you should check out if you haven't already. That shows the overall generic congressional ballot. Democrats are plus eight right now. And our friends at the down ballot, which is another great Substack that you should check out, the hyphen downballot.com, went back and did a great podcast episode. We put it on our Blue Sky feed a couple days ago, where they took the average of all the special elections that have been happening so far, and there have been 35 of these things. So this is a pretty big pool of data since Trump was put back into office this January. The average Democratic overperformance, so the number above the typical outcome of any of these special elections is 15 points. In 2017, which was the last time we had a Trump pre-midterm off year with special elections, so it's apples to apples, the average Democratic overperformance was 10.5. So that's four and a half points lower than it is right now. And Democrats went on to win 40 new seats in the House of Representatives in 2018, making Nancy Pelosi the speaker. This is good news. All the caveats about whether or not we're allowed to actually have elections and count votes and things like that.
SPEAKER_03And finally, our gibberish of the week. Let's go back to the special session and listen to Montezuma County Republican rep Larry Don Sukla talking about whatever this is. Montezuma County really punching above their weight this episode.
SPEAKER_08I'm a man, I can't have a baby. But really, I'm pretty sure about it. Anyway, uh I love babies. I love baby calves. I like all babies. And uh since I can't really speak to abortion because I can't have one, I'll speak to um something that I did a few years ago. I bought 50 open heifers, and I um sold them as open heifers on the internet, and then what I did was and I had already sold them, and then the neighbor's bull got in them. And uh the only way since I had already sold them as open heifers, I had to bort the 50 open heifers, and I had to use a drug that they we use in the cattle industry called Little Light. And so I I gave him that shot, ran him to the chute, and I gave him that shot, and uh, you just have to wait a day. And then I had him in a small 13-acre pasture, and these 50 head, and then I walked out there to see what the results were. And I gotta tell you, it made me sick to my stomach what I seen. I seen 50 dead baby calves laying all over the pasture.
SPEAKER_02I I can't think of a more Colorado thing than a cow abortion.
SPEAKER_03And this goes back again to what we were talking about earlier with Rose Paglisi. Why are you letting this dickhead talk?
SPEAKER_02Well, Jason, he's one out of 65 members of the house and he has privileges just like everybody.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, but I mean, like, can't you just pull him aside and be like, listen, can you just knock it the fuck off a little bit? Can you like stick to something we're actually discussing, please? All right, that's it for us this week.
SPEAKER_02To get more sponsored podcasts is a production of collarpulls.com and the big horn company or hosts are me, Ian Silveri in America's dub. Jason Babe. Who managed to figure out how to engineer and produce this thing? Megan makes a video. Thanks, Megan, and does a bunch of other stuff too. I do other stuff. I promise. Even though I have two kids and I'm really tired. Get your shots while you still can. Protect your trans kids, your autistic kids, your immigrant kids, and any other kids in your life. Really? Also, release a fucking Epstein for creeps. Subscribe on YouTube, Apple Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. Rate the show and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts. If you got more smarter, it actually helps us a lot. Go to our YouTube channel, unbattle the trolls in the comment section, and also find us at getmoresmark.com, where you can sign up for bonus content in our substack. And please send all angry and non-Angry Rants to Angry Rants at GetMorSmarter.com. Other shit to Ian at GetMorSmarter.com and other other shit to Jason at GetMoresmarter.com. Thank you so much to Jessica Killen for being our guest this week, and thank you so much for listening. We'll see you next time. As far as I can tell.
