Episode 289 - Michael with Peter Zaremba, "Releasing Control, Embracing Serenity"

Welcome to another episode of Restoring the Soul with Michael John Cusick. In today's conversation, we dive into the practice of releasing our grip on judgment, control, and attachment to outcomes. Peter Zaremba shares an eye-opening personal account of encountering an irritating traveler, prompting a reflection on his quick-to-judge nature. This episode explores the liberating concept of being fully present in the moment and the pitfalls of becoming entangled with future expectations.

Together with Michael, the conversation unfolds to reveal the challenges and benefits of detachment—from mental, emotional, and physical standpoints. We'll hear how expectations can cloud our holiday experiences and the transformative shift when we move from expectation to hopeful possibility. The discussion also delves into the significance of the Serenity Prayer, the wisdom of the Twelve Steps in recovery, and Michael's morning routine of surrender and letting go—all as paths to finding true peace and contentedness.

HELPFUL RESOURCES:
Episode 288 - Michael with Peter Zaremba, "7 Toxic Outcomes of Maintaining Control"

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Transcript

MICHAEL CUSICK: 0:00

God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can and the wisdom to know the difference. Living One day at a time, enjoying one moment at a time, accepting hardship, as the path to peace, taking as he did the sinful world as it is not as I would have it, trusting that He will make all things right, if I surrender to His will, that I may be reasonably happy in this life, and supremely happy with him forever. In the next. Amen. Some of you may recognize the first part of that prayer as the Serenity Prayer. And indeed, the second half of it is also what we've come to call the Serenity Prayer. And it's actually a prayer written by the German theologian and Pastor Reinhold Niebuhr in 1926. And Alcoholics Anonymous, adopted that in the 1930s, as a prayer that any member of Alcoholics Anonymous generally prays during meeting or other times in their life as they work the 12 steps. And I started with that prayer, because A, it's beautiful, and that prayer is actually the antidote to what we talked about in the previous episode about seven toxic consequences of maintaining control or seven painful ways that control impacts us. So in the last podcast, we really left with the question of how do we let go of control? How do we surrender? How do we come to trust and just be with the things that we can't control? And the Serenity Prayer is the quintessential answer to that? And of course, Peter, welcome back to the program, by the way.

Peter Zaremba: 1:53

Oh, thanks. Great to be here, Michael.

MICHAEL CUSICK: 1:55

You know, the apostle Paul spoke about in the book of Philippians, how he could be content in all circumstances. And I've come to see that if I was to paraphrase him, I can be content, even when the outcomes that I would like to see happen don't happen. He wrote that while he was in a Roman prison, I can be content even when I'm not out. Being an apostle, or making tense. I can be content even when I'm shipwrecked, or flogged, or beaten. And then we know that Jesus talked about don't worry about tomorrow, today has enough matters of its own and paraphrase. Don't worry about the things that you can't control, you can't control tomorrow. Because today, you should just focus on the things that you can control and the things that are happening right here. And now. So this is a really biblical Jesus oriented concept in terms of the healing the antidote and the freedom. But the Serenity Prayer has meant a lot to both of us. Will you talk a little bit about how it's helped you with acceptance and letting go of control?

Peter Zaremba: 3:06

Yeah, I think. Absolutely. You mentioned in the last podcast, I use the word powerlessness, right, which is in 12, step spirituality, the admission of powerlessness is the first step. And, you know, I heard I heard it said, and I resonate this when you when you truly come to a place of accepting powerlessness, there's a strange power in that, right, there's a, there's a, when you're admit that you're not in control, there's a type of control that you gain that's very different than you being in control. But you're somehow connected to that, like neighbors prayer, that there's a power greater than yourself, that can be trusted. And there's some, there is some, maybe control is the wrong word. But there's, there's a strength or a power in that. So I deeply resonate with that. Last episode, Michael, you you shared about the, you know, the circle of control, and, and you unpacked it, and could you maybe go just revisit that again? And remind us about what the circle of control is?

MICHAEL CUSICK: 4:20

Yeah, absolutely. So for people that saw or heard the title of this podcast is how to let go of control or how to find acceptance, then it's important to realize that the circle of control that we talked about is this visual construct with two circles. In the middle, there's a circle about the size of a baseball and around that is a circle about the size of basketball. The middle circle are things I can control, like my words, my actions, certain behaviors, the effort that I put in, whether I take my medicine, but not whether I actually get well can't control that. So the outer circle are things that I cannot control and the principle behind the circle of control It is that if I am attached to an outcome, if I am requiring or demanding the goal, the desire or the outcome to happen, that is in my heart or mind, and it doesn't happen, then one of four things is going to happen, I'm going to be depressed, I'm going to be anxious, I'm going to be angry, I'm going to be addicted. And the impact on my own emotions is that I will cause pain to myself and others, in my mind, my emotions and in my heart. And so that circle of control is just a way of understanding and talking about the need to surrender control, because we see the way that it's harmful. And the way that maintaining control and demanding that the outcome happened is actually causing suffering upon us. The suffering is not that it's not happening as painful and as excruciating as something might be. You know, we talked earlier, I had a kind of random example about infertility. And that's something that Julianne and I struggled with for several years before we had a biological child and adopted a child and that pain is so so deep. And so for people listening who might be going, Yeah, this sounds nice. Bear with us. Because there's a there's actually a promise that there's a there's a peace that passes understanding, as many of us know, in Philippians, four, six, and seven. And that doesn't just happen when we close our eyes and wish hard enough to get that peace. But it happens when we realize that the peace, the contentment, even the sense of soothing that we need in our heart, happens as we let go of our needing to control the outcome. And then we open ourselves to the care and the presence of one who is loving and good and kind and present, who is there and in control. Which doesn't mean that poof, the outcome happens and we get our wish, but somehow in the midst of the struggle and the suffering, that there is another there where we're actually freed up in our hearts.

Peter Zaremba: 7:12

So, Mike, I'll speak for myself, I'm pretty sure that many other people listening are going okay, I'm with you. You've you've addressed and defined the problem, the consequences. All of us, I certainly relate to wanting to control the outcome. We struggle with control some more than others. But But how? How? What's it look like to let go to give up control? What's the inner? What's the inner dialogue? What's the inner work of how to do this?

MICHAEL CUSICK: 7:52

I think the first thing Peter is to realize that we are attached to outcomes, to name it, and to realize that this is a universal reality, that it's not something for just a few controlling people with OCD or with personality disorders. And you know, there are two lies in the book of Genesis and the story in the Garden of Eden, and one of them is that you can't trust God did he really say, as well chamber said that all sin is rooted in the suspicion that God is not good. The second lie is you won't die. In other words, you can be God, you can control all things, you will not die, you can control the outcome. So in recognizing that this battle is there, and that it's very human, the Christian way of saying it on one level would be to realize that I want to play God, that I want to move the pieces on the chessboard, so that they always are in my favor, and so that I win the game. But as GK Chesterton said in his book, book, orthodoxy, chess players go mad, and poets never do. And God is a poet, and not a chess player. And so the first thing is to recognize and I don't have an outline written down here, because what we're going to do is go through the serenity prayer that I read at the top, but we learn to detach from outcomes. And the historical spiritual tradition, going back to the early centuries of the church, is that attachment, and I'm not using the word attachment like healthy, secure attachment that psychologists are now talking about attachment. Back in those days in the spiritual writers, were the addictions and the things that we give our heart to in exchange for life, in exchange for a sense of calm in exchange for a sense of peace and clarity about everything's going to be okay in the world. And so how do we healthy how do we detach from outcomes in healthy ways? And I would say that we have to practice and try Brain in the same way that an athlete develops a muscle in the same way that a year ago in June, when I was at a heavier weight than I've ever been in my life, and I started walking, I started to have to huff and puff and get off the couch and realize that I can't just go and complete the 100 Kilometer pilgrimage that I attempted to do in Scotland that didn't finish because I got COVID. But I have to get in shape, I have to be healthy, I have to drop some weight, I have to make sure that I have the right shoes that I have to practice for this. And with that showing up over and over and over again, doing things that will allow me to hike in the same way we do things that allows us to detach. And we can't just close our eyes and count to three and say, I'm going to trust God or on the count of three, I'm going to detach and surrender. We can't as one set of slogans goes just let go. And let God which is infuriating, right? You want to smack the person who says that? What does that mean? But we can act and practice in a way so that we become the kind of person that can detach, because there's something else present. There's actually someone home, when we let go, there's someone and something there. And I found no greater tool than two things I want to discuss with you. In this episode, we'll talk about the Serenity Prayer. And specifically looking at the second part of that famous prayer. And then in another episode, we're gonna talk about contemplative practices, and how learning to be present, learning how to be with learning how to be still learning how to accept non judgmentally, the experiences, perceptions, feelings, thoughts and outcomes that are there, that allows us to surrender. And to let go of outcomes.

Peter Zaremba: 11:53

Yeah, talk a little bit about detachment. Like, I understand mentally, what that word means. I believe I do, right? What does it look like? To detach from an outcome in our head? In our emotions? You know, I'm thinking I'm thinking about, you know, let's say we're about to host Thanksgiving, right? And I have some pretty strong expectations. And it's my favorite holiday, right? It really is my favorite holiday. And I know I have expectations, and outcomes that I want to be true. And so for me, when I think about like detaching from that it's like, I know that like people's reactions are whether they liked the food or the things turn out, right, or whether people are laughing, whether I'm whether my self, my assessment of them as if they're enjoying themselves, and I'm being a good enough host. What is it? Michael? What, how would you know if you're detached? Is it? Is it a is it a process? Or is it and forgive me, I jumped in again, but you know, for for, again, for somebody who wants things to be black and white. And we know what we're talking about has is complex. This

MICHAEL CUSICK: 13:09

is where there's so many areas of overlap and crossover from a lot of different conversations. The first thing I would say is that all of what you described about Thanksgiving, and I'm sure that many people can relate, you know, you're have expectations about what you'd like to happen. And maybe the word stress would fit in there too. If you think about it, like if that if what your expectations are don't happen, you get stressed out, I get stressed about the preparation for Thanksgiving, not the actual time with the meal and having people over, you know, already I'm thinking about you know, I haven't gone to the grocery store and buttons, sweet potatoes, you know, so when I when I show up there, they're going to be sweet potatoes. And I think we need to realize that that experience of expectations or outcomes that were attached to that it's a mental set of expectations. I have a picture in my head of what this should be like for it to go well, for other people to enjoy it for other people to go wow, that was great. Wow, Pete and Lynn host people in their home and they're amazing. And for you to just go okay, that was a good day. That's mental. Then there's emotional and emotional might be that you feel some anticipation and some anxiety because generally speaking expectations are like a bullseye. And I'm standing there with the arrow and I have to hit that bullseye. And anything outside of that Bullseye in the concentric outward circles is less than that. And that sets us up for depression, anxiety, anger, irritability or addiction. It's not surprising that Thanksgiving is often a stressful holiday and that people overeat a lot. I mean, they go, they go hand in hand. I think in addition to the mental and emotional I think it's important to realize that expectations are also embodied, that all of our expectations have a location, inside of our body, inside of our gut, the butterflies that we feel the tension that we feel the way that we feel moderately nauseous, or like we might have diarrhea, if the guests come too early in the turkey isn't cooked, all of us have in that location in our body, a little cartoon bubble that comes out that's invisible, that says, if the food isn't great, and if people leave early, or if somebody spills, sparkling cider on the the centerpiece, then the day is a disaster, you know, things like that. So our expectations are very embodied their mental, their emotional, and so they're really pervasive and who we are. And as we recognize, I think a starting point is what's the most pronounced. And I think a lot of people are not aware of the embodied aspect of the expectation, they just think about the mental aspect of okay, I should let that go, I should let that go. And very often, that doesn't work. You know, you read in little blogs and things like that on social media about, you know, let go of all expectations, and just have fun. And it often doesn't work, because that's locked into your body. And, you know, I remember in fourth grade on Thanksgiving, when there was a drug dealer that drove by our house and pulled out a gun, and they didn't shoot it. But they wave the gun, and my uncle saw it, and everybody go to the back room. And I remember laying on the floor on Thanksgiving afternoon thinking we're in danger, and we lived in a halfway decent suburb. And so that happened in fourth grade. And believe it or not, without whether I'm aware of it or not, I carry that with me into Thanksgiving experience. There's some stress going on where anything could happen. And that's very, very embodied. Now let's come with a word that's in contrast to the word expectation. And I have to credit Paul Young, my friend in the author that wrote the shack in in the shack, Paul said, there's a big difference between expectations and expectancy. God doesn't have expectations for us, but God has expectancy. And here's what I mean by that. Expectations are that God has his glasses down on his nose like an angry English schoolmaster, who's scowling at us. And we've not met the expectations we failed the test. expectancy is the god leans in, and his eyes are sparkling, and he's smiling. And he's rubbing his hands together with expectancy saying, I can't wait to be together with everyone. And let's see what happens during the day. Maybe sparkling wine will be spilled on the table. And, and maybe people will squirt whipped cream all over each other's faces and and maybe somebody will put a pie in someone else's face and who knows what kind of merriment and laughter could break out? And who knows what kind of tears could happen when people go around and say, What am I thankful for, and that grandma died peacefully last year, and didn't go through another two years of cancer and in pain, laughter tears. In other words, everything belongs as the book title by Richard Rohr suggests, and if we first realize that expectations are not rooted in a wrong desire, but they're rooted in the attachment to the outcome, that everything on Thanksgiving has to be a certain way. And then we realize that we can bring those expectations and hope and look at possibility. And this requires that we be grounded in our bodies. Because if we're not grounded in if our bodies are activated, or anxious or angry, then we're going to be not in our right brain, but in our left brain, and our left brain will get locked into things have to be this way. And in McGilchrist says that the left brain is about certainty what must be true, and the right brain is about possibility. And so the right brain and the left brain working in harmony, open up possibility for you could be aware of your tendencies and your expectations and breathe and get grounded and try to get calm and do whatever spiritual practices are there, like we'll talk about in the next episode of contemplation and centering prayer. And you could go into that day with joy versus stress, and versus anxiety and tension. And we all know a holiday where people are snapping at each other because our expectations are not being met.

Peter Zaremba: 19:43

Thank you. There was a time in my life where I could only know what I was thinking. I couldn't tell you what I was feeling. A really struggle. I've grown in that area. But when you talk about embodied embodying your your fear or your stress or your anger? That's that's kind of new ground for me, but, boy, is it true. So I'm just grateful that you spoke about that, Michael, um, let's talk about 12 Step spirituality, your own work in the steps and and how, how has, how have the 12 steps informed your practice of being able to identify, control, learning to let go? Words like acceptance and surrender?

MICHAEL CUSICK: 20:32

Yeah, thank you for asking. This has been just a beautiful and powerful part of my life, as you well know, as we both been on a recovery journey and the material and the truth and the steps and the fellowship of 12 Step programs is just it's been literally transformational for me in the last year in my life, so let me take the Serenity Prayer in general. the Serenity Prayer is a tool that allows me to daily integrate, and be conscious of the truth of the 12 steps. And so if we're talking about letting go of control, the first step in Alcoholics Anonymous or Overeaters Anonymous, are Sex Addicts Anonymous, are gamblers anonymous, or cocaine anonymous And frankly, the 12 steps are for everyone. The first step is I admitted that I was powerless over blank, and that my life became unmanageable. So in my case, a year ago, November 1 2022, I prayed a prayer with someone and I said, God, I admit that I am powerless over food, and my cravings and that my life has become unmanageable. Second step, why don't you go ahead and say it

Peter Zaremba: 21:55

came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.

MICHAEL CUSICK: 21:59

Totally biblical prayer came to believe that a power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity. Psalm 23, verse three, He restores my soul, body, mind, emotions, will and Spirit and He guides me on a path of things being the way they ought to be. There's a path for things to become the way that they ought to be. And God calls that in the scriptures, restoration. So I came to believe that God and for the Christian, we believe that God looks like Jesus, and Jesus looks like God, I came to believe that Jesus could and would restore me to sanity. And that word sanity, in the Latin means wholeness. So the second step of AAA is, I came to believe that Jesus could make me whole. But first backup step one, I had to admit that I'm powerless. And that when I operate with food, and over, eat compulsively, and medicate, with food, that I am clogging the drain, or the pipe that goes back and forth between God and I, where his love to flow into me and my gratitude and joy and love to flow back to him and others, that pipe gets clogged, when I am addicted or attached to certain outcomes. And so step one, allows me to acknowledge that there is a power greater than me that I don't have to be all powerful that I don't have to be God, there is this God, who says, I'm available, I'm accessible, and I will make you whole. And then the third step is that I gave myself over to the care and the will of God as I understood God. So in the 12 steps, you know, it's secular, you can make God whatever you want it to be whatever, however you define your higher power. But for those of us that are Christians, that we offer ourselves, that we surrender, that we entrust ourselves that we that we give ourselves to God, and to his care, and to His will. Now, that's the long answer to the question of how in the world do we actually detach? How in the world do we let go of control? And Peter, I've shared this with you, and you've shared with me a similar kind of thing. And I guess I'm going public with this. But I've started because you've encouraged me to do this a morning prayer routine, where I basically created my own prayer, where I take those big ideas from the 12 steps about surrender. And this helps me to detach from outcomes and to begin to surrender the control that I have around my struggles. So every morning I pray this among other things, merciful Father, I admit that I am powerless right now over food, fantasy, fear, anxiety, irritability, resentment, isolation, lying, judging people pleasing, procrastinate, nation avoidance insecurity, parentheses, my threatened ego, self sufficiency and coveting. As a result of my brokenness and my character defenses, my life becomes unmanageable. And I'll often just pause and I'll say, Okay, God, right now is I pray. And I did this morning, I looked at that list, and now it's in my head. Okay, um, I haven't acted out with food and a year. And so going through this list, let's see judging others, okay? Right now, God, I'm judging the people that are in my building who have been causing me frustration lately, because there's a problem in my building where our offices that's not being taken care of. And I do not love them. I do not like them. And I'm judging that they are incompetent, and they are uncaring, and their money grubbing greedy, slumlords, that's all in my head. And I can wake up in the morning. And the first thought, in my mind is what an SOB that person is. And I'm called to bless them. And I'm called to love my enemy. And so I'll pray through this, the control is I want to control the outcome by having this contempt in this anger for this person. And when I pray this and say, God, I admit that I'm powerless over this judging in this contempt, and pausing here. And I admit that this brokenness around this judging something inside of me, which is my own insecurity, and lack of control, I admit that right now that one is really palpable, I really sense that that one is like the juice is right there. And so God, the next paragraph that I pray, my life has become unmanageable. And only you Jesus can restore me to sanity and to wholeness. I don't want this, I don't want to be a judging person. I don't want to be angry, irritable, I don't want to binge on food. And then I say, Jesus, I turned my life over to you to your care. I trust you with my body, my mind, my will, my emotions. And I ask that your will would be done that classic line from the Lord's Prayer. And then I might sit several times and just say, breathing deep, thy will be done. And I can just spit those words out, because I grew up Catholic saying the Lord's Prayer over and over like a rap song. And I'll just slowly kind of digest and breed those words, thy will be done. Not my judging, not my irritability, not my insecurity, thy will be done. And then the next thing I'll say, help me release the fears that I have that veil, your light, and your love. And again, gently, not forced not flexing my muscles or gritting my teeth. They will be done. Yeah, Lord, your will, your will, is what I want. And then the next paragraph, God, I humbly ask for you to remove my shortcomings. And isn't that the fifth step in in the steps, I humbly ask for you to remove my shortcomings and then you gave me this line, especially the ones that I cling to. In other words, judging isn't so bad. You're like, Yeah, I know, I don't want to binge on food. And I don't want to be angry at my wife and kids. But judging is private. It's just inside, nobody really knows. So I think it's okay to hate this person. But God, their shortcomings and character defenses that I cling to, and I don't want them, I want to control it, I want to hold on to it. I want to clench my fist around it. And right now, as I say, Thy will be done. I'm letting go. And I'm surrendering. I'm giving up needing to manage this. And it's at that point, not every day, not every time, but it's at that point where the doorway to peace, contentment, calmness and serenity comes.

Peter Zaremba: 29:08

Oh, yeah, you know, I shared with you and another friend. A few months ago, I was on a plane and there's a guy behind me having a phone conversation after the doors closed. He was loud, obnoxious, arrogant. We go to deep plane. Every morning I have one of one of my prayers is that I confess that I'm capable of judging people in an instant and becoming hateful, angry, and inwardly violent toward them. Right. And so and then the prayer, the seven step prayer on that was, you know, I catch myself judging people becoming angry and hateful, and I let it go. So we go to the plane and this guy, like, like, kind of bumps me and moves past me and scoots ahead of me, right because he's in a hurry, and I had this moment hairy fantasy, it's terrible, but like, have like me hunting him down in the, in the in the airport and like hitting it with my luggage. And I and I caught myself, I just caught myself like, there I go again. And look, I don't know who this guy and then the self talk the healthy self talk you don't know what's going on for this guy you don't know what he's been through today you don't know why he cut you off maybe he's got a connecting flight, whatever and, and I can let it go. And so to me the motivation here, right? Speaking for myself, again, I gotta believe other people are feeling it is the promise of this work you're suggesting is freedom to be present, which is the only place that life happens, right? It's not processing the past, it's not obsessing about the future, but to be free, available in the present. That's an AI. And if you taste it, once you get a taste, but you want more you want more we were made for that. So that to me, Michael, I think is, is the great hope here is that this is a this is a path, a journey of how to be free in the present, how to be available.

MICHAEL CUSICK: 31:13

I love that, thank you for bringing that up, because being attached to the outcome immediately puts us in the future. When this happens tomorrow, this afternoon, next year, when my child turns out, okay, when I get the job promotion, when the future happens the way I want it, then I'll be okay. And I want to say what you said in a different way. God only exists in the present moment. God is the God of the past, and a god of the future. But God only exists in the eternal present moment. And if we are outside of the present moment, into the future, where we're attached to outcomes, we will be, as I said before angry, anxious, addicted, or depressed, and the cost on herself and others will take a real toll. And usually what we're attached to, in the future, the outcome that we must have is somehow that story is written and determined by our past. So our past and future are always playing out to pull us out of the present moment. And you've heard me talk before about you know that that being present is not just a modern mindfulness idea or some kind of helpful therapeutic idea for people with anxiety and trauma, that this is a Hebrew ancient idea that goes back preceding the Old Testament being written for David was was constantly talking about ways that he wanted to practice the presence of God. And we can't practice the presence of God until we can be present with ourself so that there's a self to actually present in the present. So, I love that. All we can do is move into accepting the present moment and living in that