Get Ready with Dave Seibel: Don’t Run Out of Money

“Don’t be a bobblehead, don’t just sit there and shake your head. And don’t be afraid to ask for help.” - Dave Seibel

David Seibel, Author of Don’t Run Out of Money and host of the Don’t Run Out of Money TV show joined me on the Get Ready Podcast to talk about the concept of how to avoid running out of money. We also discussed how wealth management is about more than investing and The Don’t Run Out of Money TV Show.

Bio:  David J. Seibel MBA, ChFC® is the bestselling author and the founder and Managing Partner of AGS Aurora Financial Services, LLC. Since the height of the financial crisis in 2008, Dave has been helping families manage their financial risk and develop plans for their financial future to help ensure they don't run out of money.  Dave has a Master of Science degree from Worcester Polytechnic University and a Master of Business Administration from Fordham University. Dave is also a Chartered Financial Consultant®.  Before beginning his entrepreneurial career in 2000, Dave held corporate finance and executive finance positions at companies such as Random House Publishing, Allied-Signal, Estee Lauder, Revlon, Coleman, where he was Treasurer, and Sunbeam, where he was Vice President, Chief Financial Officer, International.

Transcript

Speaker 1: 0:12

Welcome to the get ready with Tony Stewart podcast. I'm pleased to be joined today by David Cybele. Dave is the bestselling author hosted the don't run out of money, TV show and the managing partner of Aurora financial services. In this episode, we'll be discussing Dave's book. Don't run out of money, his television show, and Dave's financial philosophy. Dave, welcome to get ready. Thank you for joining me today.

Speaker 2: 0:38

Thanks Tony. Happy to be here.

Speaker 1: 0:41

Fantastic. I'm looking forward to talking to you and learning more about you and your work. Uh, so let's dive in. Uh, first question is about your origin story. Uh, can you tell us about yourself and how you got started in personal finance?

Speaker 2: 0:56

Well, yeah, personal finance, uh, I really started, I've been a finance guy. My whole career, uh, spent the first 20 ish or so years, uh, working on the corporate side, working my way up through the ranks, uh, started as an accountant on wall street and, uh, ended as a chief financial officer of the international division for Sunbeam. Uh, went down there to try to bail them out as part of a team, uh, didn't really work, but it was, it was my, my last stop, uh, decided, uh, December 31st in 1999 was my last day in the corporate world. Um, decided at that point, a lot of different family reasons, things at a young son, I was traveling way too much, uh, part of the, you know, the problems being international, but, you know, so it was running a bunch of different businesses, uh, you know, after that. And, you know, then we came to 2008 and as the world was imploding financially in 2008, I had, uh, you know, a lot of friends and family calling me up and saying, you know, what do I do? Uh, you know, pure panic out there. So, uh, you know, I was doing some consulting at the time for, for a friend of mine who was running a guardian general agency. And, uh, he said to me, one day he goes, why don't you become a financial advisor? And I thought about it for a couple seconds and said, okay, that sounds like a good idea. I was running, I was running a hedge fund at the time, uh, which we had totally automated. I had people working for me out in Chicago that were doing all the heavy lifting. So, uh, I just said, okay, let's do it. So I got into this business, it probably the worst imaginable time, but you know, probably the most important time.

Speaker 1: 2:57

Definitely. Well, that, that was quite a, I guess yeah, turbulent time is a good word for it,

Speaker 2: 3:04

Just to say the least,

Speaker 1: 3:05

But you bring a wealth of experience. I mean, uh, from the corporate world to running a hedge fund, that kind of gives you a flavor of how things work at the financial services industry. And I think it's good because sometimes people come up and they only know the financial services industry. So they're rather limited in their, I guess, would you say broader financial scope?

Speaker 2: 3:30

Uh, yeah. I mean, that, that brings up a lot of different, uh, things that I like to talk about. And, and, you know, unfortunately in this business, um, a lot of what you get are, are salespeople, you know, there's people selling product. And I think that's what, that's one of the things that causes a lot of the problems. And I, you know, I try to take a different approach to it by looking at, you know, instead of, uh, you know, what's on the news and what's the hot stock and, and all these other things, it's, what's the bigger picture and what should people really be concerned with and looking at and focusing on.

Speaker 1: 4:08

Definitely. I like that the big picture is so important and that's what I want to ask you next is about your financial philosophy. You've mentioned that wealth management is much more than simply investing your money. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Speaker 2: 4:24

Well, yeah, you know, it's funny with this, you know, we live in a, uh, Google anything time, so everybody's an expert on everything because they can kind of go to Google and look at it. And I call, you know, in the book, I refer to it as, you know, the big number versus the little number. And I think that part of the problems that we have is that everybody right now focuses on the big number. They focus on their account balance, they focus on, you know, what's, uh, what do they have in their IRA, in their 401k and all they want is more money. So they, they look at the account balance, but there believe it or not. When you, when you sit down and you start really doing planning for why are we doing this? Um, you know, I started really looking at what I call the small number, because what's important. You know, you can have a lot of money, but if you're spending more than that and the small number being, how much money do you need each month to live the life that you want to live, whether it's today or in retirement, you know, I focus a lot on retirement income planning, um, you know, but the philosophy really is looking at the small number because what good is having a lot of money, if a it's not enough because you're not looking at things realistically, and, and you've got, you know, your expenses and debt and everything else is way out of whack. Right? We have, uh, you know, I always talk about the calculators. You can find online. So people punch numbers, you know, punch a few numbers into these things and they think they come up with an answer yet. It doesn't usually they don't make sense. So, you know, really in a nutshell, I think my philosophy is not worrying so much about the account balance. Obviously that's important investing your assets properly is important. And I think we do that very well. Um, but it's really focusing on the other things, focusing on your goals, focusing on what do you want your life to be in retirement or really at any point in time?

Speaker 1: 6:36

Well, that's great. And I think maybe that comes from your outside perspective that it sounds like you're encouraging it. I also feel that sometimes people need tasks, different questions. Would you agree with that? That we're not asking the right questions? Always.

Speaker 2: 6:51

No, because what, what are the questions that people are asking and, and, you know, what is the usual interaction with a financial guy is all about the markets. And, you know, I always joke with people when I have, you know, people come into my office, prospects, new clients come into my office. I said, you know, you gotta be prepared for a totally different experience. Um, it's not that I don't care what the market's doing, but you know, I, we don't make decisions, uh, based on a point in time. And, you know, I always, I always have a way of, I'll walk up to the whiteboard in my office and I'll draw a long line a timeline and I'll make a small dot and I'll say, okay, this is where we are. This is the beginning, and this is the end. Right. I can just picture what that means. And you put a little dot on the board and you say, does it make sense to make a decision based on something that happens right now, that's going to affect you for the longterm. So it really is a matter of, of just thinking about it differently. And unfortunately the average advisor, when you walk into their office, you know, on the investment side, what do they do? They're going to talk about beating the market, whatever that means, right? Because that can mean a lot of different things. And, you know, you go in for your annual review and I've spoke to people that do this and what happens, you know, if, if, if they beat the market, you know, he's running around the room high five, and yeah. And if he didn't beat the market, he's talking about things like volatility or politics or China, or, uh, you know, aliens landing somewhere. But there's always going to be excused and excuse. And either way, they get you to leave the office, you know, maybe give you some nice warm chocolate chip cookies or something, and you're going to feel like, okay, we can, we can hang with this guy for another year, but you know, again, getting back to what I said before, all along, you're missing the point. It's not just about, you know, as I always say, you're not going to be successful because of rate of return.

Speaker 1: 8:54

That's great. You, it makes me think about it. And I don't remember if this is a Benjamin Graham book, but with the theory of Mr. Market and how your partner is Mr. Market, and some days he comes in and he's in a good mood, do you recall that,

Speaker 2: 9:09

You know, I, I think I know what you're talking about, but it, yeah, it's, you know, you can't, I always tell the story that, you know, the market gets people crazy. Um, and I had a friend once upon a time, uh, still a friend, but just, this goes back a while. And w you know, I think it was back during the.com days when that was just a long, extended period of time of, you know, odd Judah. If, if you will, where, you know, every day, you know, once we got into 2000, the market just kept going down and, you know, occasionally you get good days, but he would get really depressed when the market was down. There was only one problem. He didn't have any money invested in the market. And this is just one of those things where, uh, this is what it does to people. And, you know, it's like today, everybody's, you know, the, what's the greatest financial advice. You can give somebody today. And I say that sarcastically, uh, because I've heard it so many times, you know, by Tesla or Apple or Google know, alphabet or half a dozen other stocks. But, you know, one of the things is we have very short memory and people, real people forget that every time we get into something like this, the other shoe drops, you know, we want to make sure that the focus is not on the market, but on what happens, because we know the market's going to go up and down. So if everything you're doing is based on the market and you're ignoring everything else, that's, that's a ride. I mean, do you really want that type of tension, anxiety, uh, whatever you want to call it at any point in your life, but certainly when you're retired and your, your income is now gone away.

Speaker 1: 11:04

Yeah, definitely. Now, I mean, that's so important. I think so many people do focus on the market and the market is just, it's going to do what it's going to do. And sometimes it defies logic, uh, with the market movements. Um, you know, and I think it's a good segue, um, to talk a little bit about your book, what is your book don't run out of money about?

Speaker 2: 11:28

Well, you know, on the surface, it's, it's a book on a retirement income plan. So, you know, in short, you know, people focus on growing their assets in, you know, people call that the accumulation phase. So when you're younger, you're just growing your assets. You're not worried about what's going to come later. Um, but when you get into retirement, it really does matter how you take your, so the book, you know, on the surface, the book goes into things like how to do planning and, and, you know, some of the problems with, you know, some of the, uh, ways that people do things. And it really is just a framework for dealing at a deal with advisors and how to pick an advisor and things like that, but also kind of giving a broad understanding of, of the subject matter. So if you go in and work with an advisor, you are at an equal footing, um, and you understand the process or what the process should be, really what the book is about though, is there's so many things, and this is, this is kind of one of the reasons I wrote it, but it there's so many things that I heard getting into this business that, uh, you know, I refer to people in the book, you know, as bobbleheads, because there's so many things that I'll say to somebody just to get a reaction and, you know, they'll just nod their head, you know, like, Oh, you know, you're going to be in a lower tax bracket when you retire. Yup. Yup. Well, no, not necessarily. And not if I do my job, right. We, we don't want that to be a goal of being in a lower tax bracket. Well, yeah. I mean, we do tax planning, things like that, but you shouldn't be planning on having less, you should be planning on having more if you're doing it right. But the point is that there's so many things that we've heard over the years that we just take for granted, you know, defer all your, you know, defer taxes until you retire. Cause you'll be in a lower tax bracket. Well, that's a problem, you know, bonds and stocks move in opposite directions. So one is a hedge against the other, not necessarily, uh, you know, things like the, you know, the, the rules of thumb, the rule of a hundred, which says that, you know, if you subtract your age from a hundred, uh, you know, that's your split of stocks and bonds and, and, you know, all sorts of things like that, the, the rules of thumb, which we accept. And actually there's a ton of advisors out there that manage people's, uh, wealth and, and, you know, do their planning based on these rules. And they're just a bunch of junk when you're really, when you really do the math and get into them, any amount of risk that people put, you know, take on and put themselves under is just unwarranted and dangerous. So that's really why that, that's the main, I guess, theme of the book when it, when I, you know, kind of get right down to what

Speaker 1: 14:24

Well, that's great. And I think that's so important for people to realize that there is no real set rule on it. Um, reminds me of something I read recently about the BMI index. It's now used widely through the medical field, that it was just something put together for an advertising campaign. And it's not based on any science or

Speaker 2: 14:45

Fantastic. There's so many things like that. You're right. I did not know that one though. That's good. Yeah. I read that. And like, boy, that sounds

Speaker 1: 14:52

Like just so much of what you're talking about is like, yeah. You know, some of that, you know, and also the 4% withdrawal rolls

Speaker 2: 15:02

Favorites because, uh, you know, the person that wrote that did it at a time and, and, you know, they don't realize that. I think the title of the article was safe, withdrawal rates based on historical returns. Well, if you just look at that, you should know there's a problem, but when you do the math and you look at what rates were back, when this was being written and what they are now, uh, you know, it's tough and it's funny, Tony. Cause one of the things I always ask when I, when I see somebody, an advisor to talks about that is I always ask them, have you read the article because you think if you're basing your, your, you know, what you do in financial planning, you're basing your strategy on this article, um, or on this theory or whatever you want to call it, that you would have at least read it and understand what it means. I have not met one person who has actually read the article.

Speaker 1: 16:05

Wow, that's incredible. I'm not surprised, you know, um, I come out of the life insurance industry. And when you were talking about interest rates is, uh, my focus was really on consulting and litigation consulting, but really deconstructing the life insurance, uh, illustrations and contracts. And it was the same thing as I get in there. And most insurance agents didn't really understand what they were selling and let alone their clients understanding what they were buying, but the same type of thing.

Speaker 2: 16:35

Yes, exactly. And, and that's, you know, it's one of those things where in this business and, you know, getting back to the bobble heads is that you find all the time that people don't want to ask the questions. I mean, some of this stuff is, is very complex. You know, you get into different, uh, different products, you know, especially when you get into annuities or, you know, structuring life insurance. When you talk about that, it can get very, very complex. Now it doesn't mean it's bad. It just means you need to understand it. And you know, you get people that just sit there and they won't ask the question for whatever reason, because I think it's because people think that there's so much information out there that they should understand this. They shouldn't understand investing, they should understand these products and they, they're almost embarrassed to ask the question. Um, I have a policy of forcing the question, um, because I don't want to do anything if people don't understand it, uh, because it's going to come back to bite everybody in the butt later on.

Speaker 1: 17:43

That's great. I think that's so important. You, you really hit on it is that I think so much of it is about financial. I mean, that's really at the core of it. And then people don't wanting to seem like they don't understand, even though nobody's ever taught this stuff, uh, anywhere it's not part of our high school or college curriculum. So

Speaker 2: 18:03

Yeah. Somebody explained that to me.

Speaker 1: 18:05

Yeah. That's a big issue. That's a big issue. Um, so, you know, I always like to ask this question is what inspired you to write don't run out of money?

Speaker 2: 18:17

Well, I'd like to say that there was something, you know, some higher purpose or something like that, but you know, it, it goes to one of my philosophies in life, which is, uh, never make a decision with a beer in your hand. And this kind of fell into that category. I had written an article that was on Fox business.com. I think it was 2014 maybe. And it was, it was really, my philosophy was a lot of the things in the book, just in a nutshell, um, you know, talking about the rules of thumb and talking about some other things, and it was a bit of a rant, you know, it was just something I put together. Um, but it was pretty well received, a lot of positive comments. And, uh, you know, I was at one of these things, you know, that advisors are forced to go to, uh, sing around one night, uh, having some cocktails and a bunch of people who had read the article, um, were, you know, said, you know, you should write a book. Well, you know, so 20 minutes later I'm putting my foot in my mouth saying, you know what, that's a great idea. I think I'll write a book. Well, now once you put it out there, um, and you say it a few times, you know, I remember reading something and I can't remember where it was, but somebody put this article together on, on what to be aware of an advisor. And, you know, they say, be aware of the advisor. That's always talking about writing a book or saying he's writing a book and somehow never does. So after a while it just became, okay, I've got to write this. I've got to get this done. So after a few, you know, fits and starts and restarts and other things, I finally over the course of about a year, I guess it was, uh, just got the thing written.

Speaker 1: 20:19

That's great. Yeah. Writing a book is definitely a labor of love, but I think it's a great way of expressing your philosophy and putting it down on paper. I help, I think, did it help refine the philosophy for you and in your work with clients?

Speaker 2: 20:38

Uh, it does. I think what it does is it, it, it, you know, it kind of institutionalizes what the process is and it's been good. You know, we, it's funny, we've sold a bunch of books, you know, it's fun to, you know, every, every month or whatever it is, you get your little checks from Amazon. Um, but we've probably given away two, three times as many, and it's been really a good thing for us to give it to a prospect and they come in and read the book and they know what the process is. So it makes it a lot easier. They know the important questions to ask, they know what to expect. So I kind of look at it. It's almost like a user's manual for doing, you know, for doing your retirement planning and, you know, it's been good.

Speaker 1: 21:28

Well, that's great. And I think that's something you hit on something. I think that's important. And I think it also leads back to that informed consumer that having prospects read that book before they meet with you, or let's say even another advisor is that I think that maybe that helps them to become the informed consumer where they start task the right questions.

Speaker 2: 21:51

It's part of the book. Yeah, that was, that was a big part of the book. And I even in the appendix, I put a list of, I think, a dozen questions to ask your advisor, because, you know, as you know, Tony in this business, uh, and, and some of the rules are changing this, but everybody calls themselves a financial advisor, but what does that mean? So are you an investment advisor? Are you a stock broker, you know, registered representative, uh, are you, uh, life, life insurance, only advisor, um, are you doing comprehensive planning? You know, what is it that you're doing? And what's your model. And too often people have no idea. They, you know, they come across an advisor because he was doing a dinner seminar or some, you know, some other prospecting method and, you know, they see a pitch and they go in and talk to him and you know, that, that they end up working with this person without knowing exactly what it is they do, or even more importantly don't do.

Speaker 1: 22:53

Yeah. That that's, that's important. That's something, you know, also that I'm hoping to tease out is, as I'm going along here is to help people understand the wide spectrum of people who may be giving you financial advice on the differences in compensation and how that might impact their recommendations. It's, it's incredible.

Speaker 2: 23:18

Yeah. We have a, you know, I, I put a whole chapter early in the book. Uh, it, the title of the chapter is who's your guy, because, you know, everybody's got a guy, right. Whenever you ask somebody, you know, Oh, I have a guy, you know, but for people to understand who their guy is and what their guy does and what their guy doesn't do and what products they sell and how they get paid and who they work for, you know, are they working for a, or do they have a fiduciary responsibility to the, to the people they're working for? That's a big difference. And most people just either assume or don't understand. Um, and, and honestly, there's th th that, I think that's one of the big problems with the business, uh, is it's not set up for the individual. It's set up for the advisor and they can hide behind these things and they can do different things. And, you know, they can somehow sleep at night. I, I don't, I don't understand that one, but, you know, I guess you can justify anything in your own mind.

Speaker 1: 24:23

I, I think so. And I think even sometimes it's because I'm not even sure the advisors fully understand what they're doing, but no,

Speaker 2: 24:32

No. I think a lot of them have selling systems that they've been taught and, you know, whatever little market niche they're in, uh, you know, some of them are, I I've met some of these guys. Some of them are just excellent salespeople. It doesn't mean they're good advisors. It doesn't mean they're really helping the people that they're working with. It just means that they're really good salespeople.

Speaker 1: 24:58

Exactly. And they could go sell something else. They just happened to be selling a financial services product that night. I think that's a key that the financial services industry really needs to confront is advisors need to actually be able to advise, and some of them need to be

Speaker 2: 25:18

On about what they do. You know, I don't think there's a problem if, if somebody is, you know, and, and in the book real quick, I, I talk about the different types of investment advisors, right? Cause just on now, investment advisors are different. Okay. They have a fiduciary responsibility to the client, which means they work for the client, not for a company. It means a bunch of other things, but it's like the highest standard. But even inside of investment advisors, there's many types. There's the, you know, the, the extremes there's, there are investment advisors that all they do is manage your portfolio. That's all they do. That's all they want to do. Um, and you know, oftentimes we have people come into our office because they feel that their advisors should be doing more for them. And I have to tell them, well, you know, that's, that's what they do. That's their business. And I kind of equate it to, to a doctor. You know, when you're, when you're young, you go to a pediatrician, you know, but the day you turn 18, while they've kick you out of the office, cause now you don't longer need a pediatrician. You need something else. You know, you have your general practitioner who you're with for a lot of years. And then when you get to be a certain age, you know, then you're going to a doctor that's, you know, specializes in older people. Well, it's the same thing with, I, I think in finance, I think that, you know, you have people early on, you know, you should be just be worrying about and things like that. That's why they call it the cumulation phase. And yeah, if you have issues saving and stuff like that, you want to talk to somebody. But as we get into retirement, income planning and things like that, it's a whole different world. You know, there's some very good investment advisors out there and it don't do what I do because we focus on planning. We want that to be a core. I don't think you can go into the next step in your, in your life, you know, in retirement without a real income plan. But there's a lot of guys that they just don't do that they worry about investing. They worry about portfolios and that's absolutely fine. It's just up to the, the, the individuals, the clients at that point in time to know that, okay, I love this guy. He's done well for us, but now I need to go to a different doctor.

Speaker 1: 27:33

Yeah. I think that's great. It made me think about, as you talked about general practitioners is sometimes people may not even know that they're actually seeing a specialist rather than a teepee. Right. You know, that it works a little bit differently is they may think they're financial planners, that guy where he's just a specialist, as you mentioned, and maybe that's a key differentiator. Um, one day they get in a couple of questions really about your TV show. Um, sure. Think that's really exciting. I had the honor of being on an episode, uh, last week, actually. Uh, so can you tell us a little bit about your TV show? Don't run out of money and what it's about? Sure.

Speaker 2: 28:13

You know, we, it's funny how things kind of develop. We started the TV show. I was asked to do it, uh, I guess it was back. It was early in the year and then COVID hit, so everything was pushed out and we started it. Uh, I don't know. It must've been October, I guess. Um, and it, you know, I really wanted it or, uh, visualized it first about being, you know, all the topics in the book and all the things I think about. And then you realize that you quickly run out of things that if you're doing a weekly TV show, you know, or a podcast or anything else that, you know, you run out of topics quick, uh, you know, very quickly. So you need to kind of, you know, pivot around. And what we did is we said, you know what, there's all these things out there that people struggle with. Uh, you know, we did three shows on, uh, college planning, FAFSA, and, uh, saving for college and how to get your kids into college and things like that because these are important financial decisions that affect people down the road. And, you know, when we say don't run out of money, we mean don't run out of money and we see it too often, people making bad financial decisions that lead to other things down the road. College is a perfect example. Uh, I come across people all the time that because they don't want little Johnny or little Susie to have to take any loans out that they got their retirement savings to pay for a college. Um, you know, not always the smartest financial move. So I just took the approach that, you know, what, let's, let's go out and find true experts, not sales people in, you know, who can come on and answer those questions that we can take any financial question or, you know, even pseudo financial question or, you know, on the periphery, but things that are going to help people and that help people make informed, you know, well thought out decisions instead of just, what did they Google yesterday, or, you know, an article that they saw that was from three years ago, but they just didn't, you know, they just saw it yesterday and they think that it's the, uh, the gospel

Speaker 1: 30:28

Definitely. Well, I think you come back to a theme and I love the theme. It's something I focus on is, uh, informed well thought out decisions that I think, you know, as I always say, I think people spend more time looking for their next television than they do thinking about like the 401k open enrollment. Right. So it's incredible. Um, so as we talk about this, how do you feel we can improve financial literacy?

Speaker 2: 31:00

Oh, that Fu we could, we could spend hours talking about that one, Tony, but I think it's a couple things. Um, number one is I think they have to get it back into the schools where they're, where they're teaching this stuff. Because unfortunately, um, at least from my experience where I live, uh, in New Jersey, it's not coming from the parents. Uh, you know, I see kids with, uh, you know, that don't think twice about, you know, they're hungry. So they'll order a sandwich on, you know, door dash or something, and end up paying, you know,$25 for, you know, a big Mac. Um, there's just, no, uh, there's no education. There's no thought it, it doesn't seem to be coming from the parents. Cause it seems the parents just want to give the kids everything, which is, you know, drives me crazy. Um, so I really think it's gotta start at home and it's got to start at a young age and it's gotta be something that, that people really focus on. Uh, you know, I always tell the story. I have a very good friend who, uh, became a client of mine and they are very, I mean, these are people who are just financially, well, you know, I don't wanna say well off. I mean, they did well because they saved and they always focused on the future and they taught that to their kids. And one of the things they taught to their kids was okay, you don't need all the money that you're going to get from the grandparents, the aunts, the uncles, and everything. So the deal was that every time they got a PR a gift, they could spend half of it and half it how to get invested.

Speaker 1: 32:40

Well,

Speaker 2: 32:42

Four kids are all in their, I guess, twenties and thirties now. And they all have well over six figures invested both in combination of Roth accounts and, uh, just individual accounts and just very, very good money habits. And this was taught to them by their parents. That's where it's got to come from. I, you know, when you see it work, uh, it's amazing. And here's, here's four kids that are well, well set for life because not only because they have a good head start, but because they have very good habits.

Speaker 1: 33:21

Yeah. And thinking about it myself, I think, you know, because my father was the financial guy, uh, CPA Corp, and, uh, that, that helped develop good money habits for myself. And I think that's something, you know, people expected in the educational system and it's also getting parents because that's kids see their parents do certain things and their parents are modeling certain behaviors. Well,

Speaker 2: 33:49

That's true. And everybody is so, you know, today it just seems that so many people, their biggest concern is keeping up with the Jones is driving, you know, the newest, you know, leasing a new car every, so every three years or two years to make sure that they have the nicest car on a block and making sure the kids have absolutely everything. And, and, you know, I know when we were young, we worked, you know, we were always doing something, you know, a day like today where there's snow on the ground, you know, we'd be out shoveling snow and making, you know, making money, you know, back then it might've been five, 10 bucks for doing, you know, somebody walking driveway. But, you know, we had money in our pockets. We could go out and, and, uh, you know, we were always thinking about making some money so that we had some money and today it just doesn't seem like that's the,

Speaker 1: 34:42

Yeah, yeah. I would a hundred percent agree. I know in high school I had two jobs that I worked. Um, you know, it was like we work, I don't know. Maybe it's because I think our load and high school is probably not quite the same, some of these kids experience. Um, but, but I think that is part of it is when you were 16, that was it. You went out and got a job. Granted they weren't the greatest jobs, but everybody that I knew at 16 was working, you know,

Speaker 2: 35:16

And what did you learn from those jobs that weren't that great, you know, think about all the jobs that you had going back. And I look at some of the jobs I had and you know, everything from delivering newspapers and pizzas to, you know, working in a machine shop and, you know, just working outside, just all these things that kids today, it just seems won't do. Or, you know, mommy and daddy won't let them do it. And I think that they miss the, the benefit and the learning experience of having some tough jobs, having to get up, having to go to work, having to, you know, work hard in the summer. Um, and I think that's something that, uh, I think we miss

Speaker 1: 36:07

Definitely. I, I would agree. I th I think it is about the work ethic because these jobs you couldn't, you had to show up, you had to work the full time. Hey, there wasn't any mailing it in. Right. So no screens, you know, you were on and your work and yeah, exactly. So, you know, to wrap up, uh, this is my big wrap up question is, okay, what is your number one tip on being financially prepared? You know,

Speaker 2: 36:37

I can, it could give you a lot of different things, but I think, you know, what I tell people is don't be a bobblehead. I love it. Don't, you know, don't just sit there and shake your head. Don't, you know, it's, don't be afraid to ask for help. Um, you know, this, we live in this, do it yourself kind of world, where you can Google anything. But I, you know, and I know that there's a lot of people out there that say, well, you don't need an account and you can use turbo tax and you don't need a financial advisor. You can use these online services and you can't, you don't need this and you don't need that. But is that really makes sense? You know, and in the book I use the example that, you know, the whole DIY thing, you know, let's look at the investment, financial planning side, is there so many mistakes that people can make that can be, you know, financially fatal that, you know, is, is paying somebody for, for that just like you would pay to go to the doctor. I said, you know, doing it yourself, does that make any more sense than, you know, performing an appendectomy on yourself with nothing more than an Exacto knife, a copy of Grey's anatomy and a subscription to web MD, you know, but that's the way people look at so many different topics, um, both financially and, and non-financial topics that, well, I can Google it or I can look it up on YouTube. Um, and you know, I've spent a lot of years in, in the financial world, you know, I think I have the, um, uh, the unfortunate that I've seen both sides of it. I've, I've worked with companies, you know, when, where I've been part of a, you know, a group taking companies public, uh, I've worked in distress companies. I've worked in all, all manner of, you know, different companies. I've handled, pensions, done all this stuff. And now on the personal side, um, I know what's true and what's not true. And I know that most people, the information that you're getting online is going to cost your money, um, having surrounding yourself, you know, I, I guess, well, you know, a good piece of advice is, you know, if, if you want to act like you're wealthy or you want to be wealthy or whatever that means, right, you want to be successful. One of the things we always talk about is, you know, it's your definition of success. It's not mine, uh, for you. Well, act like the wealthy, you know, wealthy people are wealthy because they surround themselves with people that give them good advice because they're experts in their field. And don't be afraid to do that because what you'll find certainly in this business is that when, when you dissect the products that people are buying, you know, we get into a whole discussion on no load mutual funds and how expensive they really are, that, you know, paying, uh, a very good financial advisor to do comprehensive financial planning for you. And, you know, somebody that you can talk to and bounce ideas off of and, and really, uh, get good advice from is often no more expensive than doing it yourself. It's just, one is transparent where you see what you're paying and one is not either way you're paying it. Yeah.

Speaker 1: 40:00

I, I think that's a very important takeaways that at the end of the day, you're paying something for something that there areas no Freeline shop is these big mutual fund companies are just offering these products because they're right

Speaker 2: 40:16

Guys, well, that's the new commercials they talk about, you know, no fetus and no fee that, and everybody like, Oh, well, that's great. I'm going to do that. Well, does that really make th and, and this is one of the things I always try to say, give it the smell test. Does that really make sense that they're doing this? And maybe there's no fee over here, but it's costing you something somewhere. And my experience with financial products is the less you see the more you pay.

Speaker 1: 40:48

Oh, I, I like that advice more, the less you see you, the more you pay.

Speaker 2: 40:53

Yeah. Transparency is a good thing.

Speaker 1: 40:59

Yeah. I got to Mark that down as I tried to get some of those great quotes in the show notes. Um, so Dave, I am going to put all your URLs and, um, social media handles in there, but, uh, what is the best way for people to learn more about you and to get in touch?

Speaker 2: 41:14

Well, you know what, we're actually going through a process now of changing things. We're putting up the show page and, and you know, everything else. Um, we're actually going to create a membership site, which will be free for people just to, um, get people in on, you know, for the shows and all the information there. So, uh, easiest way is just, uh, you can, you can see our, our company page at www dot AGSM, aurora.com. And from there, you'll, there'll be links to everything else. Um, you can also go on the TV show is on RVN tv.tv, and you can go there and go to our page and see, uh, the most recent shows and get a schedule for when the shows are streaming a live, I guess, recorded. But when they, you know, again, we'll have, don't run out of money.tv in the near future, which will have, uh, everything up there to fantastic. Fantastic. What day? Um, thank you so much for joining me today. This has been a fantastic conversation. My pleasure, Tony, I enjoyed it. Always enjoyed talking to you myself. Yeah, definitely. So, uh, to everyone out there, listening or watching, please remember to subscribe to the, get ready with Tony star podcast until next time

Speaker 3: 42:49

[inaudible].