16. Worst Gig Stories

You'd be forgiven for thinking a professional musician's life is made up entirely of inspiration, joy, fun and adventure. But is that true, or is it a little romanticised? And why should something as simple and as awesome as playing music be so challenging? Rooney and Danny sit down for a quick fire back and forth, sharing their most ridiculous worst gig stories. Tune in and let their frustration be your comic relief.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:10

Well I've got cold sweat. How was that? How was that all by reliving the horror? The utter horror. You thought you'd left it all behind. Of some. Some gigs. Now, I don't want to sound like a a moaning, you know, whingy old former musician.

SPEAKER_00 0:35

I I feel like you do want to sound like that. I feel like I've given you a platform to capitalise on your grumpiness. You're like, yes, finally. Most gigs go great. That's not true. They they have for me of the wrong. No, you're lying to yourself. I think you have 10 bad gigs for every good one. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 0:56

No, I feel I feel pretty, pretty lucky. Um, but yeah, every now and then you have one that really sticks in the craw. Yeah. And the fact that you can still remember some of these decades sometimes later tells you everything you need to know. Yep. Um before we throw it back to you for a proper intro. One other thing I was thinking when I was reliving this these nightmares was when I was starting to come up and doing a lot of gigs, I was always amazed at how grumpy the experienced players were.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:31

And I was always like, because I was so happy to be playing, getting paid. I was like, this is the best thing in the world. I'm getting paid loads of money to play music. Yeah. And then you maybe try to hire someone or you talk to someone who's been doing it for much longer, and they're like, How much is it? Where is it? What time? Who's playing? That one always got me. Who's playing? Yeah. And you think, well, why does it matter? You're getting paid, man. And now I'm like, oh, I'm the same. Hey, who's playing totally? Where is it? What time, you know? When do we get paid? Yeah. Are we getting paid like three months later?

SPEAKER_00 2:04

Yeah. When the accounts team have caught like, yeah. Anyway, I remember meeting someone as well, um, uh, when I was in my late teens and noticing how kind of bitter and cynical they were.

SPEAKER_03 2:14

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:14

And making a promise to myself, like, I'm never gonna let myself get like that. Which I have in many ways failed on. Um, but that's always stayed in my head. No comment. Yeah, and it's one of the reasons why I have tried so hard to sort of get to the bottom of why, right?

SPEAKER_02 2:35

Are these the best gig stories? Because they taught you a lesson and they actually improved your business sense and your like it just it nailed the thing that you don't want to happen in the future, you know?

SPEAKER_00 2:50

I mean, that's a very positive way of looking at it. You could look at it all bad things in life, like the lessons, right? Yeah, it will teach you something. Um, it depends what we've brought in. You know, we don't know what each other's stories are, obviously. I I I will start off by saying I've actually like made a point of leaving out the darker stuff. Right. There is there is a lot of stuff that is not fit for a podcast. Yeah. Like it's astonishing how much violence there is when you're a gigging musician. Maybe not so much for you because you are hiding behind your barricade. Right, yeah. But if you're out front, I mean, just think about what we do for a living. We take very, very expensive equipment into a room full of people who are completely shitfaced and have almost no respect for you. And in times if you had your mic smash into the into your teeth, yeah. And when it catches the little bit of your lip on the way, it hurts like a motherfucker. Yeah. Um, you mentioned smile and keep going. Yep. They'll they'll grab your equipment, um, both versions. Uh they'll knock all your stuff over and they have to pick it back up again.

SPEAKER_03 3:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 3:52

Um, and for for that, you get underpaid and badly treated. And then you've got to load it all out at the end of the night. It's pr it's a pretty tough job. So I've left off a lot of the darker stuff and tried to keep it light and funny. Yeah. What's your first story?

SPEAKER_02 4:12

Okay. Um, because there's so many, I'm gonna be try and be as brief as I can. I've only got two pages. Right. Okay, my first worst gig story. Uh, I'm breaking the rules a little bit straight away. Not a gig, it was actually a session. Uh hard to hard, I don't want to name any names, so I'm gonna try and tiptoe around this as much as I can. I'll just set the scene. I'm in the control room. I've come into the to the setting late. As a drummer who's been added on a little bit late, there's already some tracks being put down. I'm very young, green, I don't know what to say necessarily, but I want to appear very smart and like I know everything and I know what's going on. And there's a very well-known producer sort of hovering around behind me, and I'm sitting there and I'm feeling a bit of spotlight and pressure, and like almost like I have to say something clever, and they're playing some tracks back, and I sort of snigger and go, Oh, it sounds cool, but man, we can lose the keys. I mean, what? Yeah, what is that? Okay, and this producer who everybody knows is is standing behind me and he goes, That's me playing the keys. Is it no, no, not him? Okay, no. Um and anyway, oh I can leave that one there, but let's just say mortifying. Right. But also, I've I've I learnt a very hard lesson that day. Shut your mouth.

SPEAKER_00 5:51

Yeah, I mean, in your defense though, it's a pretty stressful situation. Yeah, I've been in those situations loads, and suddenly you feel like you've got socks in your mouth, you know, and you're like you say, you're it's not that you're trying to be clever, but you're trying to just keep up. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 6:04

I mean, you're trying to you've been brought in, you know, you're I guess the hired gun, for lack of a better term. Not that I I consider myself a gun player or anything, but I've been hired and I've uh young and I felt some pressure to say something.

SPEAKER_00 6:18

But this is where I think band leaders and producers need to learn to be less of a douche. To understand they've got a nervous person coming in and just go, okay, well, we're never getting anything good if they're nervous. Let's make them feel at ease. Yeah. We all started somewhere.

SPEAKER_02 6:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:31

You know, but anyway, that's a different subject. Anyway, I'll I'll I'll I'll leave that one brief and we'll take it over to you. I mean, I was just going to tack on the front that for the first 10 years of my live work, uh, which was from 91, you know, through to roughly the year 2000 or so, I don't think we ever had stage monitors.

SPEAKER_02 6:49

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 6:50

I mean, there were exceptions. Yeah. But this, you know, I'm a teenager, I was I turned 12 in 91, so this is like my teen years. Yeah. Um, it was very rare to have stage monitors. So I I spent that whole time trying to sing, um, feeling so frustrated because I knew I was a better singer than what I was able to do live.

SPEAKER_02 7:07

And you get to the end of the night, you've lost your voice, and you're just like, what am I doing? Yeah. Why was I shouting?

SPEAKER_00 7:12

And then I did start to get into the kind of the pub scene that existed in the early 2000s. We were playing at you know, the Dogs Bollocks and what was the one on the shore called? Masonic? Yeah, places like that. And they would have monitors, but they were gutless things. You could never hear yourself anyway. I eventually got to the point where I bought my own powered monitor and a and a Y cable so I could plug myself into it uh and control it and you know, feedback, be damned. Um, and then eventually moved to in-air monitors, which solved it. But yeah, but yes, that was brutal. Um, but the first story I was actually going to tell was when we're on tour in 1996, and we had to get from Talpo to Palmerston North for a very, very early gig. Uh, we were playing at Massey University on the grounds there, and I can't remember the time of the gig, but for whatever reason we had to get up super early and get on the road in our van. We were so young, we actually had a driver on that gig, and as well as a bit of a crew. And we got up, um, all groggy, you know, had our coffee and cornflakes or whatever, got in the van. We had been on the road for an hour before we realised she had driven the wrong way.

unknown 8:19

Oh.

SPEAKER_00 8:19

And she she was driving on the road out to Napier, and people that know those roads know there's no way across. So we had to drive back to Talpa. So that's two hours and then start the trip again. And it got to the point where we pretty much arrived at performance time and we we threw the gear down and played, sort of pulled it off, but it was pretty stressful.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 8:38

This was like a back and forth, right? Yeah, okay, great.

SPEAKER_02 8:41

Tag. I've actually I've actually realized I've broken the rules again. Uh but I will go in order just to keep up. Uh, story two here for me is also as a gig that never happened. Right. So I got fired. Um again, young. Did you tell the keyboard player to fuck off?

SPEAKER_00 9:01

Surely we don't need keys, right? Who's the singing?

SPEAKER_02 9:03

He sucks. So again, I've got to be very careful with names here because some of these people are dear friends now. Um uh a different producer lined me up to play drums for a fairly big artist, especially at the time for me would have been a like a mind-blowing gig, which I, by the way, was not ready for. Right. So I'm not putting any blame on anyone necessarily. Um we did one rehearsal, everybody's giving me stink eye. And eventually, I think at one point in the rehearsal, the bassist got on the drums and tried to show me how to play the song. And I had I had worked on these songs for like a month diligently, but I just wasn't good. Right. And he got on, he was better than me on the drums, and I got fired. I didn't even get told because you know how it works in music, you don't get told. No, you just don't get a call. That's right. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 10:03

So I eventually get ghosted before it was a term.

SPEAKER_02 10:06

Yeah, so I I actually called my friend who was the producer on it, who was trying to do me a solid. Yeah. He was trying to, hey, you know, I'll get you in on this. And I asked him, I said, uh, is what's going on? Is the tour still happening? Am I am I still playing drums? And he's like, nah, bro, they um I didn't know I didn't know how to say it. But the the band just said nah, we can't play with him. Right, wow. So this is just yeah, me being totally open and honest, uh, without naming names, but it's you know, they say like opportun when opportunity meets preparation and all these magic things, yeah, opportunity, but not prepared. But not through my fault, I just wasn't literally was not good enough. Yeah. And if I had done that tour with this fairly big guy, I mean I was not ready for it. I would have been humiliated. Or you would have stepped up. No, no, I was I can tell you. You just weren't ready. I just was not ready. Yeah. But anyway, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 11:09

Over to you. Interesting. I'm gonna have to message you lots after this recording and ask you who these people are. Yeah. Um, my next story is really short. One time I got a bee sting on my foot and my foot swelled up, so I did my gig in one shoe. Outdoor gig in Tinnepie of all places. Nice. Yeah, I just remember um my foot swelled up beyond what was reasonable. And I'm like, okay, well, I'm just going with one shoe.

SPEAKER_03 11:31

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 11:32

Shall I shall I go for my next one? No idea. Well, um, the shortest gig I ever played in my entire life. I was asked to perform uh an acoustic performance, solo performance at a poetry reading evening. I was the the kind of the opening act for the poets, you know. And um, I was really young, went along to this gig. Uh it was time, they called called me up, introduced me. Thanks very much, get up. My first song is called Whatever. Um, start playing. Hadn't even gotten to the verse yet, broke a string. In that moment, realized I didn't have any other strings.

unknown 12:04

Oh.

SPEAKER_00 12:05

And I went, well, that was me. Thanks very much. I'll see you next time. Did you like that intro? Yeah, I thought my guitar at this case, and I quickly left. And I have never ever gone to a gig without spare strings. But there you go. There we go.

SPEAKER_02 12:17

Yeah. Okay. Uh, another session story. Um, again, one of these situations when you're starting out and you're just you're just not ready, right? And if you don't know this, shuffles are quite hard.

SPEAKER_00 12:32

Right.

SPEAKER_02 12:33

Uh, deceptively hard to play a nice shuffle.

SPEAKER_00 12:36

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 12:37

Anyway, I'm in there, I'm nailing it, I'm on the click, and you know, I'm like, oh, these guys are gonna be blown away. And I can see in the control room, because I can see through the glass that the engineer and the producer are like looking at each other, and I'm thinking, doesn't look like a good look. So they'd like they call me in, finished.

SPEAKER_00 12:58

But I like that when you look through the window and then having a serious conversation, but it's all it's they haven't pushed the button, so you can't hear what they're saying. He's like, hey, you know, like they could be going like this guy's really good. We haven't kept him on playing like this. Get him on the rest of the album, or like, what the fuck is wrong with this guy?

SPEAKER_02 13:13

So also this the actually the engineer in this case ended up being a great friend, and I did multiple sessions with him after, so it's hilarious now. Yeah. Um, but anyway, long story short, finish, go back in the control room, and he spins around in his little engineer's chair and he goes, Shuffles are pretty hard, aren't they?

SPEAKER_00 13:38

And my ego went wow, there's no one in the room doesn't know what that means.

SPEAKER_02 13:47

And I knew right then, but but again, let's reframe this a little bit without being like, you know, painfully positive. I'd learnt like that wasn't good enough. Right. And it's like, but also, hey, I was on the click though.

SPEAKER_00 14:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:05

So it's not been on the click.

SPEAKER_00 14:07

But the shuffle isn't about the click. No, it's it's between the beats that matter. Right, right.

SPEAKER_02 14:12

So I was like, oh okay. Anyway.

SPEAKER_00 14:16

Just before I go to my next story, on one of the recent episodes, Mike was talking about how he did contemplate becoming a professional musician but was sort of intimidated by the idea, which is totally understandable. Yeah. Um and yet you and I did it. I think that was the show, show me the money episode. Um through these sorts of moments, was there a part of your brain that ever went, Oh, I can't do this anymore, I have to give up?

SPEAKER_02 14:40

I I've been thinking about this recently. Um, I think it's moments like that you understand how much you don't know. Yeah. And you think, okay, am I gonna do this? Because if so, I've actually I thought I was working hard before, but that was nothing.

SPEAKER_00 14:56

Yeah, because for me, I was so committed to this being my journey that never contemplated. Never occurred to me. Right. I I would yeah, I would always internalize it and go, what am I gonna do about this? And you know.

SPEAKER_02 15:09

I think things like that, where in that case I thought I had done something good, but I was so amateur that I couldn't self-how what's what's the word for it? I couldn't actually hear myself properly. Like self-critique. Yeah, yeah. And especially in the moment, you know. So I've got a much better at understanding and sort of getting the gauge on where I am.

SPEAKER_00 15:33

Funnily enough, I think my strength was self-critiquing. Right. But I think my weakness was actually believing in myself in those moments where that mattered. And in moments where I should have just like kept my mouth shut and had confidence and just done my job, I think I probably um was a little bit too good at critiquing myself. That turned into self-doubt, you know.

SPEAKER_02 15:53

The the one thing about since then and going deep on shuffles at various points, um, is the being safe in the knowledge that nobody nobody can play a shuffle. Right. So you're like, okay. It wasn't like I'm just really terrible at a terrible person, terrible drummer.

SPEAKER_01 16:11

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:11

And it wasn't like I thought I was amazing. Right. It um it's just that you think, oh, everybody struggles with this, you know?

SPEAKER_00 16:18

Yeah. Well, my next story was when we were doing an outdoor show on Myers Park with Fur Patrol as the um headliner. And this this was a gig where I lost my rag. And uh and we're we're standing up there in front of a huge audience. I don't know how big the audience was, but people going all the way up the hill. And for whatever the reason, the uh the the monitors are sort of cutting in and out, but they're cutting from uh all lows and no tops to all tops and no lows. So it's just like that. And I could not sing through the situation, right? And I'm I'm talking to the guys, you know, on the side of stage, like something's wrong with the monitors. And and don't be a diva. Yeah, yeah. It's pretty much the answer I was getting. Um and it went on and on and on, and we were just crashing and burning because of this. And eventually, oh, and the other thing that was going on was there was a a DJ doing record scratching and stuff like that between bands, right? This guy decided to jam along with us. So, so now, and I've got nothing against record scratching, but it's not our that alone is a worst big story. I actually forgot about that until just then. So book a bookka booker, and and then it's boop boop boop boom like this. And eventually I walked up to the mic and I said something between songs, and I said, I hope you're all enjoying yourself, because I can't hear a fucking thing like this. And um, and then I went on and I went on a two-minute rant full of expletives. Not on the mic. On the mic. Like it's so frustrating. Big up. I found out afterwards that after the first sentence, they just turned me off. So I was up on the mic. I the mucha cocaine comes out from the wings and holds it up. Yeah, and um, and I came off the stage and you know, obviously people weren't happy, but I was giving it back too. Like, what do you mean? I was up there, I was the one who was vulnerable. What are you angry at me for? Get your fucking chip to work properly at the end.

SPEAKER_03 18:14

No, that's not good enough, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:16

All that kind of stuff. Um anyway, I calmed down, I sent the um organizers an apology letter. They never replied because we don't need to be professional in our industry, right? No. Um, and um that's just one of those situations like, yeah, I handled that terribly, but also totally understandably, and it shouldn't have fucking happened. Well, if you can't do your job, yeah, it's frustrating. This is the thing. Like, like you're up there on the ball. And you look like a dick. I look like a dick. I I can't sing and tune because of what you guys are doing.

SPEAKER_02 18:46

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:47

You know, I mean, I know things go wrong, but just it's just the way it's handled is so frustrating. Yeah. Um, and you know, the other dynamic that makes gigging hard is that you really have to be on side with your engineers. Yep. Because they can sabotage you. You know what you can do. Big acts bring their own. That's right, absolutely. Yeah. And you don't have that luxury if you're a starting out artist, you don't have the money for it. So, so you're actually in this awful situation where you're having to constantly kiss ass and like, oh hey man, oh nice, oh great job, man. Oh, because if you say anything critical, they'll start to mess with your monitor sound and actually sabotage you. So they can do a job as bad as I'm describing, and you're not allowed to say anything unless you're me and you didn't get the memo.

SPEAKER_02 19:33

You've just reminded me of two stories that aren't on the list, but anyway. Okay, that was a long one. Your turn. Okay. So this one is a wedding gig at a private residence. Uh very fancy schmancy, you know, and my wedding band, we were a suit and tie type act. Yeah. Because we're we wanted the premium, you know, work, uh, wedding suit, you know, it all fit fits the vibe. As uh the teachers at uni said, always always dress one step above your client. Yes. Yeah. I like that. So um we turn up at this very, very large, expansive house, and it's all very impressive, and this is gonna be a great night. And then I think it was the father of the bride, or father of one of them, he he's starts micromanaging. Right. Oh god, you're the band, great. Oh, yeah, we love live music here, all this sort of stuff. I'll show you where you're gonna play. Now, this was about this time of year, yeah. Which is winter here in in New Zealand, and he leads us through all these spaces inside this huge house that would be perfect for a for a four-piece band like us. Right. So we go right past all those and through this room. You're gonna be out here on the veranda. And I said, Um, but the people are gonna be inside. No, they're not, they're gonna be outside, mate. Look, we've got this huge grass. I said it's the middle of winter. Yeah. No, no, no, no, no. We've got a fire brage over this. I said, it's already cold, mate. Yeah, yeah. No, no, what are you talking? Oh, oh, we don't want to be like that. Um, and I said, hold on. So you want us to be playing outside in the middle of winter. It's in our contract, by the way, that we need shelter and all that stuff. Yeah, there should be. Uh with our PA in a residential area facing your backyard.

SPEAKER_00 21:36

I was just about to ask if it was residential.

SPEAKER_02 21:38

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 21:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 21:39

With everyone in the house behind us. There's not going to be anyone in the house. So I was just like, no. And the band, you know, I was that guy on the gig, and the band are like, oh, just take it easy, mate. Like, it'll let's just do it, it'll be fine. No, it won't be fine. You know why? Because we're a bunch of absolute Dipsticks and suits standing in the middle of like in winter, it's probably gonna rain. Yeah, all our gear's gonna get wet, and we're playing to no one for three hours. Yeah, exactly. No, no, no, uh, don't worry about it, mate. So we we do it. Oh, you you gave in. Well, I'm only the drummer in the band, I'm one voice, you're outvoted, three to one. Yeah, yeah. Mr. Micromanager was not taking anything, so we start playing, everyone's up dancing on the grass, it's beautiful. Oh, there's mud all over my dress. Oh, there's this and that. Everyone goes inside. So we literally imagine like a suburban area. We're outside, yeah, full noise, yeah, playing for three hours in the dark to no one. God, and this asshole is poking his head round. We're facing the other bloody way. He's coming out going, you're right, guys, thumbs up, oh, sounding awesome. We can hear you in there.

SPEAKER_00 23:08

God, what an arsehole. You prick.

SPEAKER_02 23:12

You again trying to reframe these things, you don't give in on those things. I didn't. And I I was real this is one of the reasons why I stopped gigging. Yeah. Is I was just like, I'm I can't do that.

SPEAKER_00 23:28

That is dumb. I learned how to argue those things a little bit better. Like, for example, use the words health and safety, right, and you immediately win. As soon as there's an a liability issue in terms of um someone getting electrocuted or or gear getting destroyed, um people back down real quick.

SPEAKER_02 23:48

But this is why we had it in the contract.

SPEAKER_00 23:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:51

But of course, when it comes to it, oh, drop nuts and give in and do what the client asks. No, no, it's in the client, it's in the agreement. You signed it. Was it your band? Were you the band leader? Uh no, I wouldn't I wouldn't say I was necessarily the band leader. I was I mean Did you book the gig though? No, okay, established member of the band. Yeah. Uh and but I I'm like to the guys, why do we have a bloody contract? Yeah, exactly. Yeah. We've got so okay. So what if it rains? Yeah. Well, that's it. It's okay. So our LPA is outside. Yeah. So you guys are happy to to do what you know also know is not going to work. That's tens of thousands of dollars going on.

SPEAKER_00 24:33

Yeah. Who's this guy? And it's all in the spirit of being gutless. Like, like musicians need to learn to stand up for themselves. They bitch and moan about so much stuff, but they're their own worst enemy.

SPEAKER_02 24:42

This this one made me really angry because I I could see ten steps ahead of this idiot. Yeah. But he's not supposed to know. I'm like, I'm telling the guys, we know he doesn't. Yeah. He's probably been to five weddings in the last ten years. Yeah. We go to two weddings every weekend. Right. Yeah. And he's not in the band. So who cares?

SPEAKER_00 25:05

And it's funny because when I've spoken to musicians and bands who are more easygoing about that stuff.

SPEAKER_02 25:13

Um I consider myself easygoing.

SPEAKER_00 25:15

Right. Well, I don't consider myself to be easygoing. But um, but they always, and they're like, yeah, yeah, whatever, you know. Um, but they're always they've always got all these stories about how all their gear got destroyed, and yeah, yeah, I had to buy a new app.

SPEAKER_02 25:26

You know, and I'm like, fuck, man. No, no, no. It's just pathetic.

SPEAKER_00 25:30

Anyway. Yeah. That I've had so many of those gigs.

SPEAKER_02 25:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:33

Um, I haven't even put them on my list.

SPEAKER_02 25:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 25:35

Um moments where I mean, uh this isn't on my list. There was a gig where we were supposed to play at Motat, we're gonna be playing in a marquee. It was a pretty rainy day. We get there, they've set it up on a hill, uh, there's no stage, um, and there's literally like the person the person from Motat is going, Oh yep, so you guys are setting up in here. Yeah, and I'm like looking in the marquee. No power? Two things down the middle of the area of the marquee was a river.

SPEAKER_02 26:02

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 26:02

Like uh almost a foot deep. I've been there, yeah. Um, because the water's gushing down the middle of this road, yeah. And the power, um, there's a power cable lying there that goes off over into the building, and there's a drain pipe overflowing pouring onto the plug. And I'm just like, you can't be serious, we're not setting up here. And they go, yeah, this is where we're setting up. Yeah. I had to this was booked through an agent. I had to go and call the agent and say, Come on, man. Um, and we eventually did move. Um, there was just no way I was playing there, but yep, but this is a normal day. We're not talking about outside stuff, you know. Yeah, anyway. Um, there was a time where we were playing live uh 20 something years ago in the middle of this beautiful ballad. Um, we knew our bassist wasn't very well, and he um suddenly took his bass off and ran away. And and I was like, where did he go? Um it turned out he went to the bathroom and was puking his you know guts out. So I I he was gone. The band, I brought the band down to a lower vibe. I did a more of a solo acoustic, I mean solo uh guitar and vocal thing, and started to you know make stuff up, and we turned it into an inspired moment and very heartfelt and emotional, and I just kept it going as long as I could. Like, is he coming back? Is he coming back? And then after what felt like days, he re-emerged, he picked up his bass, we gave each other the iron back in and finished the song. Oh so it's not a worst gig story, but just a funny thing that he had. I love it. Yep.

SPEAKER_02 27:30

Um, another one when I was I was pretty green. Uh, we had it was a rare originals gig for me. And let's just say a lot more people turned up than we expected for for funny reasons.

SPEAKER_00 27:44

That's a weird problem to have as an originals.

SPEAKER_02 27:46

We absolutely packed out this bar, and because I was quite green, I just found myself getting very nervous. And I hadn't done a lot of gigs, and I and I and I actually really started freaking out, and people the people were there to see us, so they're really excited. Some of them didn't even know I played, you know, it was that type of situation. We didn't even know you played drums, and he's gonna be amazing, go-go, you know, yeah, yeah. Really, really hyping you up, and you're just like, oh, oh. And I just got really on my own head, and what had happened was that had manifested in me holding the sticks really tight.

SPEAKER_00 28:26

Ah, right.

SPEAKER_02 28:27

And I ended up playing really hard and loud. Every every drummer's probably had one of these in their in their career. And we got about into like the third song of the night, and I couldn't feel my hands. And I also couldn't make, if you can imagine, like my hands were like a claw. Right. They were just like this. Yeah. I couldn't hold the sticks. I ended up gonna I know this is not a video, but I ended up having to hold the sticks like a hammer fist, like this.

SPEAKER_00 29:01

The listeners have probably wondered why you picked up a shaker. Yeah. It's a shaker with a long handle. He was showing me his grip on the handle.

SPEAKER_02 29:08

Imagine like grabbing an axe, which is not a good way to hold a drumstick. And it was so and obviously you can't play with that type of grip. So we're playing, and I've still got most of the night to go. Yeah. And the band, uh, and I'm thinking, are they noticing how shit I'm playing? And they're looking around like, Are you alright, bro? Like, um, what's up? And this is like the third song, and I'm like, oh no, I'm good, I'm good, I'm good. Yeah, and of course that's making me more nervous. Yeah. So now we're in this death spiral, and all these people have turned up and they're like, oh, the bands don't sound that good. And I'm like, so that was a huge lesson. Yeah. Relaxation, grip, how important the grip is like fundamentals.

SPEAKER_00 30:03

I'll go slightly out of order here because I have a similar story. Um, and I had a s this happened to me several times actually. So I I was playing in an acoustic performance, a duo acoustic performance in Pontaby one night, and my arm um folded up quite quite away into the gig. It folded up and stopped working, and I and it was basically paralyzed. Um, so that was the end of the gig. And I took about an hour and a half to get the problem uh to to to work it back out again.

SPEAKER_03 30:30

Right.

SPEAKER_00 30:31

And then it would happen on occasion from gig to gig.

SPEAKER_03 30:34

Ah.

SPEAKER_00 30:35

Um, and it was it was terrifying. Every time I went to play, I didn't know if it was gonna happen. Because you literally can't play. It was literally fold up, yeah, like in my left hand as well. And I, you know, um, there was a gig that we did uh for the launch of the second album I released called Say What You Mean, and the record company threw the gig and they invited a whole bunch of people to sort of check out you know the new band and the new the new album, all this extra pressure. We had also just lost our guitar player, um he had quit, so I was now trying to play sort of two parts, like I was playing parts that I hadn't really planned out as much because we had been playing live with two of us, and now I had to try and join the parts together, so I was sort of on the back foot, and right at the crucial moment in this gig, my arm folded up. And it yeah, like I say, it kept happening. And I went to specialists and I had acupuncture, I went to a variety of different doctors, no one could figure out what was going on. They ruled out carbon tunnel, they ruled out a variety of things. And one day I was talking to this guy who raced motorbikes, and he goes, Oh, I know what that is. I said, What is it? And he goes, It's motorbike wrist. And I was like, What's that? And he goes, Well, when because he was like a stunt rider, and he goes, when we're doing all these stunts and jumps and stuff, you know, we've got the accelerator on one hand and the brake on the other. And he goes, You can just hold on too tight for too long and cut off the circulation to your right. And I I remember before talking to this guy, I'd just been on tour with Tommy Manuel. I told him about the problem, and he goes, I don't know what that is, but it sounds like you're holding on too tight. Um, and I realized that it was always happening in these moments where I felt tense. Yeah, and so while there was never an actual solution per se, um it what I thought is okay, I'm gonna take this as you know the message from the the heavens to lighten up because I knew that good playing is light anyway. So I I worked really hard on my technique, probably never happened again.

SPEAKER_03 32:24

Right.

SPEAKER_00 32:25

But it was brutal.

SPEAKER_02 32:26

Do you think guitar lessons would help someone who is suffering from similar?

SPEAKER_00 32:31

Well, only if you have a good tutor, because you have to have someone who actually gives you the right feedback from experience, right?

SPEAKER_02 32:37

Whether you've never picked up a guitar or you've been playing for years and you feel like you've hit a wall, Auckland guitar lessons are for you. Lessons are one-on-one, and every session is built around your goals, your taste, and the songs you actually want to play. All the fundamentals of technique and theory are covered in an accessible way and applied within the songs you're learning. So you progress faster and actually enjoy the ride. If you've always wanted to play, now's the time. If you've plateaued, Auckland Guitar Lessons will unlock your plane, rebuild your confidence, and get you moving again. Head to aucklandguitarlessons.co.nz or email info at aucklandguitarlessons.co.nz to find out more.

SPEAKER_00 33:18

Now you realize you did just do a mic. Almost. Yeah. You went from like blah blah blah blah blah to like blah blah blah blah blah. Like totally change, totally change your demeanour.

SPEAKER_02 33:29

Um okay, uh there was a wedding gig where we're up in Matakana, which for people outside the country is an hour, yeah. Probably an hour drive. Loads of weddings up there. So we go up there, um, we set up um, you know, the typical ridiculous, you know, set up at 2 p.m., come back at 10 o'clock to play. So what do you do for you know seven hours? So we're hanging out, you know, and you're spending money too. We've been had dinner and you know, trying to kill time and do all this stuff in Medicana. Go back to the gig. That gives me the shits. I've done that so many times. So it's your whole day, it's your whole day.

SPEAKER_00 34:05

Just waiting and waiting.

SPEAKER_02 34:07

Yeah. So then we turn, we turn up, you know, again early to be ready. We're in our suits again, you know, very professional. Oh no, you know, everyone was just having a we're doing speeches, we're doing this and that. We're like, uh, just to let you guys know we're we're out of here at 12. Oh no, it's fine, it won't be long, you know, blah blah blah. Goes on and on and on and on. Oh, and to make it double worse, in the time we had gone, we'd set up, left, and come back. Everyone had been fucking around on our gear. Oh people have been playing the drums, people have been playing the guitar, everything, all the and they said, Oh yeah, all the kids went up and had a jam. Oh man. I'm like, I was like ready to fight. Yeah, yeah. I was like, what do you mean all the kids have been having a jam? So all the everything was moved.

SPEAKER_01 34:53

God.

SPEAKER_02 34:54

So that alone is traumatizing. Yeah. We end up starting, I would say about 11 p.m. and we're in the middle of nowhere. We're like, but we've got to pack down and get back home. And they agreed the contract was 12 shut off. Yeah. And we said, hey, we're out of here at 12. Oh, yeah, but speeches, ha! All these, you know, unfunny, stupid speeches. I remember when he was five and he pooed his pants. And it's like, cool, okay. So we play, 12 o'clock, we say, Hey, um, that's us, you know. I think we did another song or two just to keep the peace and go above and beyond. Bride, face of like furious, you know, just like genuinely really, really angry. We start packing down, we're getting heckled by everyone. What are you doing, you bunch of pussies? Like, oh, you know, this and that. Was this a uh a venue mandate as well? Beautiful place. Uh, I think one of them or a family member owned the venue. Oh, okay, right. These people were wealthy. Yeah. Really, really up there. So next day, um, we we definitely got the vibe that these people are really annoyed. But what what did we do? We're still getting home at two or three in the morning. Yeah. Um, very long, angry emails the next day from the from them. Never got paid. So we spent our whole weekend doing this, not to mention organising the gig.

SPEAKER_01 36:29

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 36:29

Yeah. We had all our gear fucked with. We, you know, doing all this playing and gotta get it suits dry, cleaned, and there's a lot in this. Yeah. And you don't get paid, and they're loaded.

SPEAKER_00 36:45

I mean, the gear being messed with is such a great example of how l little amount of respect people have for musicians. Mind-blowing. I think that's actually a kiwi thing. I don't think you would have that happen in a lot of other countries. I'm sure it happens in some places. But I think that there is a a part of our culture that sees musicians as dancing monkeys in the corner, you know, like play play your song, and then we're gonna watch the game.

SPEAKER_02 37:14

But th that's no different to me jumping in your fancy car and just going for a spin. Yeah. Yeah, or going through your purse, or just anything like that, just fondling your wife.

SPEAKER_00 37:24

Unbelievable.

SPEAKER_02 37:25

Like, just the it's astonishing, isn't it? It's hard to get. That one was astounding. And coming back to the start and why people are grumpy, experience, players are grumpy, money. When are we getting paid?

SPEAKER_00 37:39

You know, and it's like And who are we playing with? I understand too, because it's like there's so many uh people out there that was so. I haven't even done that yet. Yeah, and got there yet. No, I haven't I don't think I've even noted all those. You reminded me of a gig that in Matakana where um they had a contracted curfew because of noise control problems, and the same thing happened, speeches went on and all the rest of it. By the time we actually played, I think we got about 25 minutes in. Yeah, um, we got paid. There wasn't a dispute. The bride and groom were absolutely in support of us on this one. Um, but of course the audience didn't know that, you know. So we got the same amount of abuses we're packing down. I was literally sitting going, I would love to keep playing. I just but we are literally bound by a contract to stop. So again, we just left in the firing line, you know. That wasn't my next story, but I just remembered. Um, and you also remind me of another one, uh, a similar gig where we were getting shot with water pistols during the gig. Oh, that's nice. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 38:33

Oh, you've just reminded me one. Oh my god. Oh, real quick, yeah. Turn up uh the wedding, what do you call them? Wedding planner has provided a crate of tambourines for the guests. Right. And I'm like, do you realize how loud tambourines are? And how annoying that is? Can you imagine f there were about 50 tambourines? 50 tambourines in a crowd. And I'm like, do you guys want to hear music? They were playing them. This must be a kiwi thing, also. They were playing them all night and having a great time. Yeah. I'm like, but you can't hear us.

SPEAKER_00 39:15

Yeah. Like, what are you guys on? You just reminded me of another one where someone got the wireless speech mic and was singing along. Outrageous. Our sound engineer went and um took the mic off and took the batteries out and gave it back to him. Was it a was it a real diva moment where he thought like he was amazing or not? No, he was just being a smart ass. Right. Just had too many bears in him, no respect. Yeah. Just a general lack of respect for musicians. My next story was just gonna be uh uh slight name drop, but we're supporting John Mayer. Um, and this was a long time ago, 25 years ago. Um, sold-out theatre, really great gig. Really, like we played brilliantly, the audience response was amazing. Um, we got to the end of our set, and I said, you know, we're out of time. Thank you so much, it's been a blast. Um, we actually got an encore as a support band, which is just totally unheard of. And I'm like, so sorry, like we're just a support band, we can't do an encore, and you know, that's our time. And there's but it's just getting louder and louder and louder, and now I'm like, I don't really know what to do. My drummer No, he didn't. He went, We've got one more. No, he didn't. And I was like, Oh, well, that's cool. And I said, Apparently we've got one more. Hooray! They all went. So we played our last song, huge reaction, couldn't have gone better. Oh I'm just thinking, what an amazing experience. Where as I walk off the stage, uh, I don't know who it was, might have been their stage manager or something in his American accent. He's like, That wasn't cool, man. And I was like, What? And it turns out I don't know what our drummer was thinking, I don't know if he made it up or he misheard, but we didn't have one more. We just totally broke the rules. Again, I tried to write a letter of apol an email of apology to the promoter. No reply. No reply. That was a that was a good faith mistake as well. I was thrown under the bus. Yeah. I was also just gonna quickly mention as a side topic, uh, awkward loadens.

SPEAKER_02 41:12

Oh my god.

SPEAKER_00 41:13

Cuja lounge. Auckland Museum. That's on my list. I hate that place. Sky City. Yep. Um, even I'm trying to get up to San Fran in Wellington. I haven't played there. That's a bit of a haul getting up those stairs. But you know, remember how the elevator at Koja was never working?

SPEAKER_03 41:28

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:28

You'd go up like six flights of stairs. Drum kit upstairs. Oh my god. And um, and so many corporate venues are like that, aren't they? Because they're not actually set up for bands. Yeah. So you have to get park over there. The florist has left their van in the way. No one's set up for a band. No, that's right. There's nowhere to park.

SPEAKER_02 41:43

That's right. Let's not even go there with parking.

SPEAKER_00 41:46

Yeah. So what's your next one?

SPEAKER_02 41:47

Okay. Uh, WaiHecke gig uh with my jazz group that I had at uni. So we're again pretty green, not overly experienced. Um, and we get hired after they'd seen us. Just gonna put it out there. They'd already seen us, they knew what we're about. These guys are great, they'll be perfect for the gig. You know what? It's like gigging on WaiHeke, trying to get over on the ferry and organizing this event accommodation, and it goes on and on and on. Anyway, we turn up, we're setting up, everyone's very, very drunk. Quite a young crowd at this event, and they're just so excited. You know, the the band's about to start. I'm like, hey, we're a four-piece jazz group with upright bass, um, saxophone. And I'm like, this is no, no, this is not gonna work. Yeah, yeah, and but we weren't good enough to just flip and do something completely different, right? So here we are playing jazz standards, reading off our little, you know, lead sheets, and the crowd, like we we get like halfway through the first song because you know, the crowd don't even know when the song starts or ends, it's jazz. Yeah, they're like, hey, do you guys do any like Dave Dobin or anything? We're like, this is gonna be a long night, man.

SPEAKER_00 43:06

Yeah. It's tough when someone likes you, they've seen you somewhere, they like you, they book you for the thing. Yeah, um, they them they might be sitting there over there going, I love these guys. Um, but the audio it's just the wrong thing for the audience. Yeah, and the audience don't know. They don't know what's in the contract, they don't know what the who the person uh what the person was thinking who booked you, you know, you're there with the best of intentions, yeah. Um, but they're in front of you just going, you know, play the foo fighters, or whatever.

SPEAKER_02 43:32

I can understand it. You know, it's your work do and you're young and you're ready to party and you're and it's just like what um I can understand.

SPEAKER_00 43:41

I I just learned eventually to ask a lot more questions about the gig to make sure we were suitable.

SPEAKER_02 43:45

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 43:46

Uh and there were times that I'd be pretty staunch about it.

SPEAKER_02 43:50

If people I th look, if people are coming saying, Hey, do you guys do this song? That's nice. Yeah. That shows that they're you know, they're having a good night, they want their favourite. Song, whether it's wagon wheel or not, you know, like that's fine. Um, you know, just that's cool. Yeah, I'm cool with that.

SPEAKER_00 44:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 44:08

Okay. Um, well, oh, that was my one. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 44:11

So my I was gonna mention one in um Christchurch when I was on tour with Tommy, and there's actually um two with Tommy that I'll throw out at once. Uh there's uh one with Tommy where I had one of those nights the night before where you just don't get to sleep, um, couldn't get to sleep, and came out the next day. I looked so haggard. Uh came I came out into the foyer of the hotel the next morning. Um, everyone was already standing there waiting because we were about to head to the airport. Uh, we're in Wellington. And as soon as the elevator doors opened and I walked out, Tommy looked at me and went, What's wrong with you? That's how bad I looked from just like no sleep at all. And I was just like, Oh, I just feel terrible, you know. So I got to the gig in Christchurch, and it was like ten minutes to go before I had to go out, play a solo acoustic performance in front of a full theatre. And I'm just feeling so terrible. I'm thinking, I don't know how this is gonna hap work. I I I can't imagine being on stage in ten minutes.

SPEAKER_02 45:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:11

Um, in fact, this isn't a worse gig story at all. This is kind of the opposite. I went out and somehow just turned it on, delivered a really good show. I was on the fumes, no fuel in the tank. Sometimes no prep is good. Yeah. Or or just being in that state of like, I don't know, desperation meets reaction. Um, and I remember just it going surprisingly well, and I came off stage and passed out.

SPEAKER_02 45:38

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 45:39

That was it. I was done. Even I think that was even the gig where Tommy likes to bring out the support act later in the show and sort of to give another round of applause. I think I was out. He was like, Where is he? Bring him out on a stretcher. Yeah, and the other Tommy one I was gonna say was when we were playing in Hamilton one night, and the sound system there was awful, and the engineer was just a local person who wasn't really doing a good job. And I was really, really struggling. I just could not get a vibe out of my vocals or my guitar, and I was really, really struggling. Um, and I came off stage feeling quite defeated, thinking like, man, I just I could hear everything, but everything sounded so flat, you know, and I should be better than that. I should be able to get through that. And then Tommy goes out and just plays the most amazing, immaculate performance. He's funny, it's emotional, it's this, it's that, and that's making me feel worse because I'm like, fuck, he's doing great, you know, and like I couldn't even get through my little bit. Um, and then he he said when he went off before the first encore, he um he said, Oh, you know, thanks very much. And he turned around, big smile, and he walked towards the wings. As soon as he crossed past the curtain, his smile dropped. Oh, and he said to me, Man, that was hard. Wow, what a pro. He goes, I just fought the whole time.

SPEAKER_02 46:54

What a pro. And that's what I thought. What a pro. And also amateur players who think certain things are easy have no idea. Yeah, planes only part of it. Absolutely. It's all the extra stuff.

SPEAKER_01 47:06

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:06

Okay, um, quick one, Auckland Council, who we all love. Fantastic establishment. Very well organized. Music and Parks series, which still goes, uh, which I'm no longer a part of because we got signed on to do a jazz gig at the Botanic Gardens in Manurewa for no money. Of course, it's Auckland Council. I think it was like 600 bucks for the whole band. Yeah. I put throw together a jazz group. Um, and we don't get paid when they say that they'll pay us. Surprise, surprise, Auckland Councils, you know, they're normally very reliable for council. And uh just so happened that the bassist that I hired was just a pain. So he was like, Where's the money, bro? And I'm like, they haven't paid us, and it was hardly any money anyway. He's like, he's just on me the whole time. I'm on to the council. Oh, sorry, we only do the payouts on the 20th of the month. You know, one of those stupid answers. Yeah, it's like 600 bucks, guys. Yeah, we've just done the gig, you know. And anyway, get to the 20th of the month, no money. Message them. Oh, the person you need's away. Okay, well, who else can we talk to? Oh, you're gonna have to wait. When's she back? Oh, next month. Okay, wait for her to get back the following month. Uh oh, okay, sorry about that. That's our mistake, it'll go through on the next payment cycle. Doesn't come through on the next payment cycle. It literally took about four months to get 600 bucks out of the whole time. The bassist is just like, oh, what you hired me, mate, you're gonna have to pay, you know, and just like constantly on my ass. And I'm just like, none of this is worth this. You know, it was a nightmare anyway.

SPEAKER_00 48:46

I had you just reminded me that I had a gig lined up with a drummer that you know. Um, I think he injured himself a few days out. So he goes, Oh, find uh another guy for you, okay. And he and he found another guy, no one I'd ever heard of before, no one I've ever heard of since. This guy turns up, he hasn't learned any of the material, uh, although even though he said he had, wasn't a terrible player, but he certainly wasn't amazing. But he was, I'm pretty sure, a gang member. And um all of his stories were pretty interesting. Uh and anyway, so we get to the end of the gig. It's kind of gone okay, sort of. Like he missed all of the changes, but we got through it, you know. We left on good terms, everything, you know, whatever. Packed up, went home. It's now pretty late at night. He gives me a call, says, uh, where's the money, bro? Well, that night. The same night. When he's home. Yeah, I'd just gotten home. Oh. And I'm like, What do you mean? And he goes, Where's the money, bro? And I'm like, Well, we I'll pay you. We'll get paid inside a week, usually, and I'll pay you. Send me an invoice, and he's like, No, no, no. That's a bit intense. No, no, no, no, no. And I got the stern word, I got the uh clear understanding that I gave him cash now or things got ugly. So what he turned up, I gave him some money, and I never saw him again. Jeez. So you're gonna have to get that name off you later. But the next one I was gonna um actually say was uh again another one that was kind of a mess, but a really good gig. So I don't know if it's a worse gig story. We're on tour in about 2006. Uh we were in Glenham, I think. We were an originals band that knew a few covers. Um the venue absolutely filled up. It was an amazing audience, totally energetic. We got up, we just couldn't do anything wrong. Everything we did they loved. There was a moment where the drummer came up to me and said, You know, you okay? And I said, Yeah, why? And he goes, A high hair just flew past your head. You know, there was a there was a moment where I think I accidentally hurt someone's feelings. This this um mid-show, this young woman uh came up to the stage and put her hands on the um edge of her top and said, I'll show you my tits if you play this such and such song. And being like almost autistic about I'm just about the music, I considered the song she said, and I went, No, thank you. I love it. I wasn't even thinking about it. It's like, yeah, I don't really like that song. Um anyway, they um they we finished our actual show, they wanted more. We started playing the covers we knew, they wanted more. Um, the the venue owner came over and said, You guys are killing it. I'll give you some more money if you just keep going. Okay, cool. We're on tour, we're desperately trying to break even, so we'll take the money. We get to the point where where we have no songs left. We start playing a few songs again. Um then our bass player goes, Um, do you know this song? And I'm like, Not really. And he goes, Let's just try it. So then we start, we just and it still works like this. We got to the point where I I hit a wall, yeah, and I the last thing I remember was turning to my drummer and saying, You've got to get me out of here. And then I passed out. Wow. And I woke up two hours later in our van. I don't I don't know what happened. What? Yeah, I think I collapsed. And I woke up a couple hours later, everyone was gone except for the band and the venue owner. She was so stoked, and she uh my my lasting memory of that night is she then fired up the cooker and made us all like really good cheese toaster sandwiches. Ah, what a good sort. Yeah, so we sat up and had our toaster sandwiches and they'll pass out in the van again.

SPEAKER_02 52:34

And so that's like you're giving giving so much in the moment and not even thinking about the consequences, and then it's gone. It's got uh yeah, yeah. I was I was depleted. Wow. Okay, here we go. A real quick one. We did a gig at Sky City, which is uh just a lovely venue to load in and out of. Four-piece band up there, and um big thing, big corporate thing. I don't know, hundreds and hundreds of people, and we're the big act, and we're and we start playing, and everyone's sitting down and just you know, conversation, and we're just sort of easing into the night. We take a break, and the DJ, they've got a DJ for when we take a break, and it's all great, you know, fine. But you know when DJs they've got a certain bass, and you can't recreate that with a band, right? Uh-huh. Everyone gets up dancing. So no one was dancing for us. DJ starts first song, yeah, boom, crowds up and uh losing their minds and really into it. We had only played for like 45 minutes and getting paid well, um, and the event organizer comes over to us. We're in a green room, we've got beautiful food, we've got drinks, it's all it's all laid on. Yeah, she comes over and goes, Hey, um, are you guys cool with just you know, just chilling out for the night? And we're like, you know what? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 53:56

I mean, it was embarrassing, but we we didn't play again. That happens a lot. It's it's it's there's no it's not an accident that they often don't use the full system for the support band. Right. Because they don't want the support band to sound bigger than the main act. Well, this yeah, yeah, this was not that case. I know it's not that case, but it's the same kind of idea when you go from live band that always sounds like a live band to fully produced subby dance music. Like you're fucked.

SPEAKER_02 54:21

You don't compete with that. No. And but I mean, and the when I think about it, she handled this, she was very sheepish about it, and she was like, I'm sorry. She actually gave us a voucher to one of the restaurants in the thing as well and said, Hey, go get a meal, really sorry, because we couldn't really just go and start packing down. Yeah, she said, I really understand it's a bit awkward, so go and have something to eat, and we'll cover your parking. And so, yeah, humiliating in a way, but yeah, you know, get paid.

SPEAKER_00 54:52

I I had uh um two gigs in a row booked supporting Brian Ferry and Joan Armor Trading, um, again doing an acoustic duo thing. And a week and a half, I think it was, or maybe two weeks before, I fell off a Swiss ball at the gym and broke my elbow in two places. Don't go to the gym, kids. On my on my left arm. And um I I was so determined to do the gigs that I I had this cast you know on my on my elbow. I went to the doctor and said, You have to take this thing off, or I'm gonna get it off with a screwdriver because I have to play this gig. And and the doctor was like, No, no, I was gonna take it off anyway because otherwise your arm will get like stuck in place with elbow things, you have to get the cast off quick. So he took the cast off, and I could I couldn't, it was a rotational something, something that I broke as well, and I couldn't turn my arm around to play. So for a few days I was like trying to like force my arm around and eventually got to the point where I could turn it around enough to put it on the neck.

SPEAKER_03 55:48

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 55:48

Happens to be that good guitar playing technique on the left hand is to actually keep your wrist and yarn pretty still, right? And then to just use, you know, your your position. So once I got myself in place, I could sort of play alright. But we had the most amazing photos taken of on these two gigs uh where I'm like I I look like I'm full rock and roll mode with all my facial expressions, like full rock and roll face. I'm actually just in pure agony every time I moved. I had a fucking broken elbow. Yeah, but I couldn't not do the gigs, and then you passed out, and then I parked out, yeah. Um there was a gig where the power cable went outside and back in, or something like that. Someone closed the door, snapped the right in half.

unknown 56:30

Wow.

SPEAKER_00 56:32

Took us a second to figure out what happened there. Yeah, where are you up to with your stories?

SPEAKER_02 56:36

I think I'm out of my official ones. You've reminded me of a million, yeah. Um, but anyway, if you got a few more.

SPEAKER_00 56:42

There was a uh a bad gig in LA once. It wasn't great. We're we're playing in a studio where a lot of famous stuff had been recorded, and they asked us to play a set of songs that have been recorded in the studio, which was pretty cool because it was like Led Zap and Tom Petty and Prince and stuff like that. Um, but it was just a train wreck with the musicians and the stage monitoring that we just we just didn't stand a chance.

SPEAKER_02 57:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 57:06

Uh so that was pretty brutal. I was excited about that one. Um, but yeah, there was a a band I played for for a while that uh had an 80s theme to them. I'm not gonna say the name of the band, but uh well there's a few, so we're not two or three, yeah. But anyway, there were some pretty atrocious things that happened in that band. One that was my fault was when I got to the airport five minutes late and missed a flight. And that it was uh Auckland Airport, we were playing in Christchurch, and I remember the singer who had already checked in, and she just looked at me and said, What are you gonna do? And I was like, I don't know. And she said, Good luck, and then she went and got on the plane, and I then had a big argument with ever with the uh people with you know who were working there because they refused to help, and I got someone else involved, and la la la la. Eventually I hopscotch my way down the country, spent all day flying from one place to another. Oh wow, and just got there in time, and hadn't sound checked or anything, pretty much plugged in and started playing. Oh, that's horrible. That was brutal. But yeah, there were some shitty things that happened in that band. Like we were playing a big outdoor show in Nelson, set up in front of the there's some church or something at the end of the main street, had a big stage set up there, and the audience flooded the entire street. The crew were very they were kind of like a little gang who took pleasure in kind of screwing you over. And the Did you guys know them? They were our crew. We toured them, we toured with them constantly.

SPEAKER_02 58:32

That's very strange.

SPEAKER_00 58:33

And the manager of the band was a very manipulative character who, if you were on side with him, he was your best friend. But if you were in the way of his funny agenda, he would he wouldn't just deal with you honestly indirectly, he would he was a sort of guy who would cause problems for you as a retaliatory sort of thing. So things had been peachy for a while with him, and then he had tried to undercut us financially, and he had tried to undercut us in terms of logistics. Um, this caused one of our mutual friends to quit.

SPEAKER_02 59:03

Right.

SPEAKER_00 59:03

Uh I didn't quit as soon as I should have. And so he had gone. Um, I stayed around, I then became the next target. Once I did eventually quit, another one of our friends would eventually quit. But so we've packed down in Nelson, they've all gone up to a place to have drinks or something, and I'm just now standing there with all of my gear in the middle of this empty street at like, you know, a really late time at night. And I ring the manager and go, Oh, hey man, um, what shall I do with my gear? Like, shall I put it in the truck or something? And they there's some jokes and they hang up, and I'm like, What? Ring him back, what's going on, man? Hey, so you're stuck? I'm just standing there with my my my only option is to either stand there and wait or to abandon all my expensive equipment in the middle of the street. And I'm pretty sure we had a truck there, but the truck was locked. It happened a few times. I I look up at the window, um, they're upstairs in the window, they're peering out and all laughing, getting a kick out of it. What in the name of God is that about? Right? So there was that story. There was towards the end, there was a um there were there were a couple of funny things that went with that band that weren't the same kind of twistedness. Like there was a a gig we did in Singapore where um for the longest time the bass amp wasn't working at soundcheck, and they had about 15 sort of engineers, I guess, or crew members on the stage trying to figure out what was wrong with this bass amp. And it was actually our bassist in the end who who went, Do you think it would work better if we you know plugged it in? And he held up a power cable. And I remember thinking it was there was this large crew of supposed experts who hadn't checked if it was plugged in. Um but um and there was another one where the power went out in Tauronga as well, and the the gig was off, we had to postpone. Someone drove into a pole nearby. Wow, eventful band. Yeah, the venue was full, it was a sold-out gig, and um that was the end of that. But um the one of the last gigs I did with them was in Talpo, and it was in front of over 20,000 people. Jeez. And we the we had been told that we weren't the headliners by any stretch, there were big m massive artists playing after us. But the we'd been told that all you had to do on Friday is get to Telpo. There's nothing we can do on Friday because we're gonna do a line check in the morning, we don't have much time, quick line check, make sure everything's working, and then we're on um at time, right? Okay, fair enough. It's not ideal, but it's pretty normal. So I just get on the road whenever it suits me, which is like mid-afternoon, early afternoon. I didn't leave it late. I'm um I had the music cranked, it's a nice day, I'm about an hour out of Telpo, and I get a phone call saying, Where the fuck are you? That's the worst. What do you mean? And he goes, We're standing here ready to sound check.

SPEAKER_02 1:01:50

What?

SPEAKER_00 1:01:50

And I'm like, No, tonight we just have to get to TALPO and we're doing a line check in the morning. No, we're doing a sound check tonight. So I I said, Well, I'm a I'm looking at the GPS, I'm an hour away. So I pull in, they're all standing there looking at me, everyone's angry, and I realised the same manager had told me the wrong information to sabotage me. On purpose. Yep, yep. He was pushing me out of the band because he was doing things like saying, You're gonna get X amount for this gig, and then he'd pay us $200 less. And I would say, That's not on, man. Like, you need to pay us what you said. Oh my god. I was standing up for myself, and now I was paying for it. Right. Where the the people who survived in that band were the pushovers.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:29

That's crazy.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:30

It's it's disgusting.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:31

I never had any bullying like that ever. Yeah, it's disgusting. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:35

So soon after that gig, I quit the band. He pushed me on one more thing, and I typed up my resignation, and that was the end of that. Yeah. That's kind of the end of my list. I had um a gig with our show Noise Play, where I sliced the end of my finger off. Yeah, and we got um locked down, cancelled one of our shows, and the postponement caused problems and things like that. That was pretty rough. But yeah, that's kind of we could call it there if you want. Yeah. Does everyone now understand why we uh don't do it anymore?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:05

It's only like a snippet, you know, out of thousands of gigs. But if anyone's listening, if I want to hear your stories too. Yeah. Like there will be some gems for sure. Uh, and you don't have to keep it PG. You can hit us with anything. We'd we sort of need to a little bit.

SPEAKER_00 1:03:22

We need to filter ourselves a little bit because we still know some of these people and and things like that. I mean, let's let's try and end on a bit of a positive note because all of these things I think come down to shitty people and flaws in our culture in terms of the easygoing thing going too far and stuff like that. Um, but there are great audience members out there. Oh, yeah. And there are great musicians out there, total professionals who have nothing but respect for. And it's it's unfortunate that you're often up there playing in front of a decent sized audience, and you know, everyone in the audience is a complete, like lovely, supportive person, and it's just one or two people that cause a problem. It's just it's it's hard from a musician's point of view because we really, really break our backs trying to do this. And if anything, I just wish that that would get you know celebrated more and people would maybe maybe the culture around music should be less about the pop stars and more about the hardworking musicians who have to load in their own PA. You know, because like I say, we love playing music and lots of people like hearing the music.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:29

Yeah, and there and there's different tiers of disrespect, right? You could go you could think of like uh NZSO at the town hall, yeah, and I mean what a beautiful setting, and everything's great, and the crowds all sitting there and they're actually listening, and then someone's phone goes off. Yeah, you know, that's that's a huge amount of disrespect in that setting. Yes, whereas at a pub, you know, that's that's far down the list.

SPEAKER_00 1:04:56

Well, you wouldn't hear it for starters, but yeah, there's do you feel though, because I got to certain points in my career where I was like, I'm angry, but uh I just played at a pub, it got rowdy, something happened, I'm angry. Is this my fault? Because I was the one who put myself in that situation.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:13

Well, you start to, you know, how can how can I put it? Your tolerance starts to go down over time, right? So as a drummer, and every every drummer who's listening will will testify, when you're walking out of a club or something, and someone says banging on your drum that you're holding as you walk out. Yeah, I mean, that might be funny if it's your friend and you're 19. When you're 45, yeah, and it's like uh just some idiot. Yeah it's just like I kind of just want to hit you.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:47

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:48

Like there's it, I can't explain how different like the tolerance is. It's just like I've got no time for it.

SPEAKER_01 1:05:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:05:54

The other thing I've noticed is when I was younger, I was more part of the party side of it. You're closer to the to the party angle, you know? Whereas now I'm I'm not a big drinker, I'm not a big uh party animal, or I don't even particularly like spin out late or anything. So I just like all of that side of it, the shenanigans, I I I just don't care. I'm I'm I'm not interested, you know.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:21

Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:22

Um I'm I'm a little bit like you. Um if I'm gigging, I'm actually there for the gig. Yeah. I I just want to play my best, I want us to sound good. All of the fundamentals. Um I want it to be a good night. I want everyone to be losing it and having the best night. I mean, my my theory was always I want people to leave saying that's the best band I've ever seen. Yeah. Which of course is silly, but it could be for that per that experience could be the best thing. But it's the right goal to have in your head, just to try and get there as far as you can.

SPEAKER_00 1:06:56

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 1:06:57

So all of the extra ex exterior stuff is just so yeah, I don't know. I don't want anything to interfere with that. Yeah. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:05

Yeah. Well, like you said, um leave us comments about your experiences or uh anything um that these stories may have brought up for you. Or maybe if you're not a working musician, you know, are you surprised by these stories? Or did you know that this stuff happens? Oh, this is nothing. This is nothing. No, no, we've we've diluted this big time. Yeah, yeah. Like I said, I left off all the twisted stuff.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:26

Yeah, I mean, stop stopping while a huge fight, you know, yeah, finishes in the dance floor, all that kind of stuff. God, you just remind me of another one. Jeez. Yeah. I mean half of the course, you know. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:37

Yeah, yeah. Um, but yeah, um, comment and uh join our Facebook group. We've got a buy me a coffee page, which I always forget to mention, which is called buymea coffee.com what do we know show. Thanks for listening. Thanks for being here. Thank you again. It's been fun.

SPEAKER_02 1:07:55

Mike will be back with you. Should we do a a quick little funk? Sure. I'm just gonna go with my shaker again, I think. This episode was brought to you by Auckland Guitar Lessons. Head to Aucklandguitarlessons.co dot nz or email info at aucklandguitarlessons.co.nz to find out more.