00:00:00 Prof Michele Barbour
Welcome to the enterprise sessions. Today I'm talking to Doctor Zeke Steer, who's CEO and founder of Milbotix, Zeke. Thank you so much for finding the time in your busy schedule to talk to me.
00:00:11 Dr Zeke Steer
No problem.
00:00:11 Prof Michele Barbour
I know a little bit about the Milbotix story and what gave rise to it. I'm really looking forward to to exploring that, but before we do, perhaps you could just tell us a little bit about your background and what brought you to Bristol.
00:00:24 Dr Zeke Steer
Absolutely. Yeah. So I started my career in defence, originally in the area of force protection. So I was developing systems that we use to prevent roadside bombs from detonating. I then moved into artificial intelligence with the same company and this was based in Tewksbury. And there I was working with really large.
00:00:44 Dr Zeke Steer
Social media data sets exploring patterns and trying to identify significant events. And then I moved into surveillance with a piece of software that was used to integrate lots of different data feeds and from some really James Bond type deal.
00:01:01 Dr Zeke Steer
But towards the end of that that job, I got itchy feet and I stopped learning in the way that I was hoping I would and really wanted to go back to university, you know, pursue a PhD, hopefully reengage with learning and explore the next chapter. And that led me to the Bristol Robotics lab where I did my PhD.
00:01:21 Dr Zeke Steer
Partnership between the University of Bristol and.
00:01:24 Dr Zeke Steer
Mm-hmm. And now commercialising that research. So here I am.
00:01:29 Prof Michele Barbour
I find it fascinating when I'm having conversations with entrepreneurs like yourself, how how often there's that theme of that, that need to keep learning that frustration when you stop learning and how learning is is a real driver. And it sounds like that's what you just described to me too.
00:01:43 Dr Zeke Steer
Very much so, yeah. I mean, when I was working, I was also learning outside of work and it was taking its toll. So bizarrely, although I was slowing down in my learning at work, I was doing a lot more outside of work.
00:01:55 Dr Zeke Steer
And it was taking a a really major toll on me, so I knew that I had to do something to combine my interest in learning with my main, you know.
00:02:02 Prof Michele Barbour
Profession. So tell me a little bit about the PhD. What? What kind of topic did you select?
00:02:09 Dr Zeke Steer
Based on my personal experience with my great grandmother, who had dementia and became very aggressive, I became, you know, really motivated to try and explore a technological solution that could help people.
00:02:21 Dr Zeke Steer
Remain independent in the community, where they often prefer to be. So I was working with the Assisted Living Group at the Bristol Robotics Lab and they do some really exciting research. You know, integrating robotics into People's Daily lives to support, you know, after people that have a disability or people that are a little bit older.
00:02:41 Dr Zeke Steer
And my particular research focused on how we could use a wearable to detect signs of a person being in distress, where that person couldn't necessarily communicate that and it went very well and you know, obviously, having had that personal experience with my great grandmother, I wanted to try and make an impact more so than I could.
00:03:00 Dr Zeke Steer
Done by staying within academia and publishing papers. So I decided to go on that very difficult commercialization route and so far going pretty well.
00:03:09 Prof Michele Barbour
Ohh I I'm looking forward to hearing more about that. But first of all tell me a little bit about the technology so inspired by your great grandmother who was struggling as as so many people do with with the.
00:03:21 Prof Michele Barbour
The awful effects of dementia.
00:03:25 Prof Michele Barbour
I understand that what you all ended up.
00:03:26 Prof Michele Barbour
With was socks.
00:03:28 Prof Michele Barbour
That's right. OK. So why socks and what sorts of things can the socks detect to indicate a person might be in distress?
00:03:37 Dr Zeke Steer
I was very lucky through my research to be working with Saint Monica Trust, also based in Bristol and an initial part of the research involved.
00:03:44 Dr Zeke Steer
Taking in different wearables into the care home and speaking to frontline care staff who, you know, had a lot of experience with people with dementia, and I kept hearing the same thing, reiterated that nobody with dementia would use this, they would take it off.
00:03:59 Dr Zeke Steer
There was a particular anecdote that, you know, I've told a few Times Now, but there was this elderly gentleman who received a very expensive watch from his family and it lasted a couple of weeks before it went missing. Eventually the staff found it down the toilet. So it really highlights, you know, how people with dementia don't necessarily behave in logical ways.
00:04:17 Prof Michele Barbour
No predictable ways at all.
00:04:18 Dr Zeke Steer
Exactly. So through conversations with the care team we, you know, identified the need for an alternative wearable.
00:04:25 Dr Zeke Steer
And actually, socks is something that everybody wears, at least in this country, familiar item of clothing, a lot less likely to be removed than other other other wearables. And and that's where we, you know, pursuing there's a there's a form.
00:04:39 Prof Michele Barbour
Factor as you say, so familiar that I guess someone so used to it they they don't even notice.
00:04:43 Dr Zeke Steer
They're wearing it. That's the idea exactly.
00:04:45 Prof Michele Barbour
Yeah, yeah. And and are the socks noticeably different, like it is the technological components of them.
00:04:46 Dr Zeke Steer
Yeah, after sight out of.
00:04:55 Prof Michele Barbour
Readily apparent to the.
00:04:56 Dr Zeke Steer
Wearer currently they are because we're at a prototype phase, but obviously as we further develop the technology, the idea is that we will be miniaturizing the electronics, making them look and feel just like a regular pair of socks, and also ensuring that they can be washed like a regular pair of socks, which is really important.
00:04:59
Yeah.
00:05:12 Prof Michele Barbour
Absolutely. And then so we've, you've got a person who, I mean from my observations that people have mentioned, the distress can come on gradually or it can come on really quite abruptly.
00:05:23 Prof Michele Barbour
And can manifest in different ways. So what? What can the socks tell you? What are the socks detecting?
00:05:30 Dr Zeke Steer
We're looking for physiological markers of stress, principally through the person's sweat response, but also through heart rate movement, skin temperature and the real innovation isn't actually in the hardware, it's in the the algorithms that sit on top of that data processing and generate an alert.
00:05:47 Dr Zeke Steer
So we're trying to alert carers to these signs of distress about 30 minutes before an episode occurs to give the carer time to intervene, provide what might be a relatively light touch form of support like a painkiller for example, and avoid that escalation in behaviour which obviously has quite negative consequences in many cases.
00:06:04 Prof Michele Barbour
The.
00:06:05 Prof Michele Barbour
For themselves and for potentially.
00:06:07 Prof Michele Barbour
Around them as well. Yeah. So that's sort of early detection, intervention prevention sort of approach. Yeah. So you completed your PhD. You've got these prototype socks and through your collaboration with this Monica trust, you've got some confidence.
00:06:07 Dr Zeke Steer
People around them.
00:06:12 Dr Zeke Steer
Precisely.
00:06:20 Prof Michele Barbour
That's that's. That's the right vehicle. That's the right mechanism. What convinced you that it was necessary to move on to a commercialization phase?
00:06:31 Dr Zeke Steer
I I'd always aspired to really start, you know, a a technology business and I think a lot of that came through hoping to emulate my grandfather, who came over from Nigeria in the 1950s, originally started his career as a travelling salesman, faced tremendous amount of ignorance.
00:06:51 Dr Zeke Steer
Not many black people in the UK in the 1950s, but he persevered and succeeded, became very successful. He actually started one of the first mixed night clubs in the UK at the time.
00:07:04 Prof Michele Barbour
Oh, wow. Extraordinary.
00:07:06 Dr Zeke Steer
And I believe through him, you know, we now live in this multicultural society which we all relish, certainly within Bristol.
00:07:13 Prof Michele Barbour
Absolutely. A pioneer of that integration. And So what did he sell as his travelling sales?
00:07:14 Dr Zeke Steer
And date.
00:07:16 Dr Zeke Steer
Exactly, bringing people together.
00:07:19 Prof Michele Barbour
Yep.
00:07:20 Dr Zeke Steer
I honestly don't know. I I I don't know. I know that he, you know, started organising these nights for for people originally from Africa, but eventually from the UK as well. And it really took off. And then the nightclub started and it had a whole.
00:07:34 Prof Michele Barbour
String of nightclubs. Oh, how wonderful. So you've got the inspiration from your great grandmother.
00:07:39 Prof Michele Barbour
The need for the product, but the inspiration from your grandfather for that, that entrepreneurial that, that making something that that's real and and influences people's lives.
00:07:49 Dr Zeke Steer
They're making a difference, hopefully a societal difference. Ultimately at the end.
00:07:50
Yeah.
00:07:52 Dr Zeke Steer
Of.
00:07:52 Dr Zeke Steer
The day and I do hope that with the product we're developing, you know, maybe it will improve outcomes for people with dementia.
00:07:53 Prof Michele Barbour
Absolutely.
00:07:59 Dr Zeke Steer
Yeah, build recognition of, you know, the the challenges that aggression poses and and how to resolve them.
00:08:05 Prof Michele Barbour
And actually, knowing a little bit about the challenges that care home staff and care workers, as well as the families face if it can also help them do their jobs in a way that's effective and manageable, I imagine that would be quite a positive outcome too.
00:08:17 Dr Zeke Steer
Exactly the the sector faces some real challenges, and innovation is desperately needed and I think part of that will be delivered through through technology, you know, and improving attitudes towards technology is really key to.
00:08:29 Dr Zeke Steer
Hopefully put the sector on a more sustainable footing.
00:08:32 Prof Michele Barbour
Wonderful. So umm, so having had this very, very strong motivation, this conviction, this is what you needed to do. What were the steps you took? How did?
00:08:40 Prof Michele Barbour
You.
00:08:41 Prof Michele Barbour
Seek how did you find ways to start to commercialize your socks your product?
00:08:46 Dr Zeke Steer
I was very keen, even at the outset, before I embarked on the PhD, that this is something that I wanted to do, so I remember actually at my PhD interview having that conversation around IP. You know, if I pursue this pH. D will I retain ownership of the IP? I was told I would at the time actually when I decided to then go down that route, it was a little bit more complicated and I had to get approval from my supervisor.
00:09:05
OK.
00:09:08 Dr Zeke Steer
So the first step really for me was ensuring that I had the ability to take that IP and build the business around it, and fortunately I did. It's then really a case of getting some sort of funding on board and the University of Bristol were massively helpful with the runway program. Great had some funding through that UI.
00:09:14
Yep.
00:09:17
Yes.
00:09:28 Dr Zeke Steer
Also gave me some funding. The catalyst really was through Alzheimer's Society and their accelerator program. So they picked up on what?
00:09:36 Dr Zeke Steer
We were doing it, gave us 100,000 lbs, which we're able to then match with grants. So we had a bit of money to invest in, you know, moving the product forward into the next stage really with the view to entering care home trials, which we're just about to kick off right now.
00:09:53 Prof Michele Barbour
I've noticed as you're describing your journey, the motivation was I. But now you're moving into the commercialization, talking about we. So who have you brought along with you on the journey? Who are you? Who is the we?
00:10:06 Dr Zeke Steer
Hmm. Umm, so the first uh, you know partner in this I guess partner in crime was Jack.
00:10:12 Dr Zeke Steer
Donald, who actually met through the PhD research. So she was dementia lead at Saint Monica Trust, and she was so, you know, I guess enthusiastic about the product, but also engaged with my personal mission with my great grandmother that she decided to jump on board. And, you know, she's a really key member of the team as co-founder.
00:10:17
OK.
00:10:32 Dr Zeke Steer
We also have a couple of non executive directors, Jane and Peter, and we have some engineers alongside. Yeah, Prabha and Vasudev who Vasudev was actually an intern at the University of Bristol who we've taken.
00:10:45 Dr Zeke Steer
Forward. So certainly you know, keeping it within Bristol and you know recruiting where where we can really.
00:10:53 Prof Michele Barbour
And you take the role as CEO in your company.
00:10:56 Prof Michele Barbour
So I've observed that.
00:10:58 Prof Michele Barbour
Quite commonly, the scientist the engineer often enters more of a CSO, although often becomes the CEO. You went straight in as CEO, correct? That was for what reason.
00:11:11 Dr Zeke Steer
Necessity. I would say, you know, obviously we needed somebody to lead the ship and I was the best person to do that with my knowledge of the.
00:11:12
Yes.
00:11:21 Dr Zeke Steer
However, I think it presents certain challenges because you're always tempted to get too involved in the technology, especially when you have a very lean team.
00:11:28 Dr Zeke Steer
And that's probably one of the reasons why I'm so tired today is that I'm doing lots of things and really I should be focused on being a CEO and I'm not doing that very well, but it.
00:11:36 Prof Michele Barbour
Will it will get easier. I I do think that I do think that's something where a lot of us suffer from, to be perfectly honest, because I think there's that you've got the combination of the the really, really strong sort of basis in the science and the engineering.
00:11:49 Prof Michele Barbour
But also the conviction and the drive that you need in a CEO that that need that person needs to be fully behind the mission of what it is you're trying to achieve.
00:11:57 Prof Michele Barbour
So I'm I'm. I'm sorry that you're so tired, but I do think it sounds I can fully understand why you've tried.
00:12:02 Prof Michele Barbour
To take on that role.
00:12:03 Dr Zeke Steer
It is, but I think part of being a leader as well is being able to effectively delegate and to find people that can do a better job than you can because obviously you can't be an expert at everything. And so I'm I'm working on that.
00:12:13 Prof Michele Barbour
Can't do everything. Yeah. Good. Well, we all have development.
00:12:16
Yep.
00:12:18 Prof Michele Barbour
So at the moment, are you manufacturing your product yourselves in your laboratory and in the fullness of time, will that continue? Do you see this becoming the mailbox factory or do you plan to outsource that?
00:12:30 Dr Zeke Steer
We have a number of partners that we're working with, some of them based in Bristol. The sock manufacturer is based in Nottingham. So really what we do within Bristol is we we we bring in various different components, assemble them together currently put them into a box, a kit and then ship that out, but hopefully.
00:12:50 Dr Zeke Steer
We will have a partner alongside that will do a lot of that work.
00:12:54 Prof Michele Barbour
Right.
00:12:55 Dr Zeke Steer
Eventually.
00:12:56 Prof Michele Barbour
Excellent. So you mentioned a couple of minutes ago that you're entering into a field trial. Would you like to tell us a little bit more about that and and?
00:13:04 Prof Michele Barbour
What you hope to learn from us?
00:13:05 Dr Zeke Steer
Yeah, we're working with about 25 organisations, including care homes, care providers, universities and digital social care platforms. So we are packaging together our what we call smart socks Sherlock kits. Given that it's a bit of a discovery at this point and we're going to be sending those out. We have a number of.
00:13:26 Dr Zeke Steer
And questions that we want to try and answer through the evaluations.
00:13:31 Dr Zeke Steer
UM, principally, you know key to us is collecting data that we can then use to evidence the benefit of the technology, but also driving forward the algorithms and improving the performance through the data that we collect. We're working with Cranfield University to run those there's evaluations, so we'll hopefully have alongside.
00:13:50 Dr Zeke Steer
Independent academic validation of the technology. We've already got a couple of publications out there in the wild, so really exciting to be able to finally get something out there and get feedback on it. And you know, use that really as a stepping stone for the next iteration of the development.
00:14:06 Prof Michele Barbour
And is it your anticipation or your hope that in the fullness of time, care homes and and individuals, maybe with an older person in the family, will be able to to buy these and?
00:14:16 Prof Michele Barbour
Use these direct.
00:14:19 Dr Zeke Steer
Exactly. Yeah. So initially we're targeting care homes. Obviously you know it's a bit easier for us to sell into care homes. It's a more homogeneous, you know, target market scalable. Yeah. But eventually we would love to sell them in the community to to people living at home and hopefully avoid people like my great grandmother having to go into care.
00:14:40 Prof Michele Barbour
So I fully understand your, uh, your rationale for starting with UM, the sort of the the the group of people with dementia, particularly the older community with dementia. Are there other groups of individuals who could benefit from this kind of technology? I'm thinking perhaps people with quite, quite extremely affected by autism, for example.
00:15:00 Prof Michele Barbour
Do you anticipate that might be possible?
00:15:01 Dr Zeke Steer
Definitely, yeah. We've had a huge amount of interest within the autism and learning disability space, and actually some of our trials will be conducted with organisations that are providing care for people with autism and learning disability.
00:15:12 Dr Zeke Steer
In addition, traumatic brain injury, potentially broader applications too. You know, we're certainly keeping our options open about how we can apply the technology and who can benefit from it. But yeah, all about delivering impact where we can.
00:15:28 Prof Michele Barbour
So you've come into this whole undertaking from the PhD onwards with this really, really strong personal drive and motivation, not only on the care side but on the sort of commercialisation entrepreneurship side.
00:15:42 Prof Michele Barbour
How has it been? Has it gone as you anticipated? Has anything surprised you or or tripped you up along the way?
00:15:50 Dr Zeke Steer
It's really hard work, actually, much harder than I expected at the outset. Yeah, maybe I had my blinkers on and I just said I'm gonna do this, but it's incredibly hard work. I'd say it's probably the equivalent of doing 3 pH. D's, so yeah, it's tough. That's maybe the biggest surprise for me. Just how much work is involved to actually take.
00:16:10 Dr Zeke Steer
Some research that's reasonably well developed and build the product around it.
00:16:15 Prof Michele Barbour
Are there particular places you look for for support or or even comradeship other founders? Or is it within the company or back at one of the universities? Where do you get that sort of support someone to hold?
00:16:28 Dr Zeke Steer
You up? Yeah, I think it's actually one of the fantastic benefits of being in Bristol. We have set squared.
00:16:35 Dr Zeke Steer
We have a future space at UI. We have just a huge amount of support for founders that are going on this journey, and generally you'll find that.
00:16:42 Dr Zeke Steer
And as they're very happy to help each other, because we all know how challenging it is to go on this journey. So yeah, we all sort of, you know, prop each other up and give support where we can and it makes it that much easier to ultimately get to where we want to be.
00:16:56 Prof Michele Barbour
There's people that really understand what it is you're going through, whether it's technologically similar or not. It's it's the the concepts isn't the struggles and the barriers.
00:17:03 Dr Zeke Steer
Exactly. Yeah. You know what? What does it take to bring a product to market? It's a huge amount of stuff. So yeah, getting that support is really valuable.
00:17:09 Prof Michele Barbour
Yeah, pivots along the way sometimes, although not so much in your case actually.
00:17:14 Dr Zeke Steer
Not yet. Yeah. Who knows what's down there? Yeah, you know, around the corner.
00:17:18 Prof Michele Barbour
It sounds like you've been primarily sort of grant based so far. Do you plan to attract investments from venture capitalist or angels or is that not something on your on your game plan?
00:17:29 Dr Zeke Steer
Now we have been successful with grants and actually due to that success, we need to match the grants that we have to seek investment.
00:17:36 Dr Zeke Steer
We're literally just on the cusp of closing £250,000 in investment. That's only half of what we need there, so we are going out and seeking another 250K.
00:17:48 Dr Zeke Steer
And we will be launching A crowdfunding campaign imminently. So do watch out.
00:17:53 Dr Zeke Steer
For.
00:17:53 Prof Michele Barbour
That, that's that's very exciting. I've done some crowdfunding and it was of all of the investment raising I've done. Probably the most fun and the most exciting. Also the most scary in some ways because you're not quite sure what's going to happen, but I wish you every success with that.
00:18:01
OK.
00:18:07 Dr Zeke Steer
Thank you very.
00:18:07 Prof Michele Barbour
Much so if you were to look forward, I mean, you choose the time frame two years, five years, 10 years.
00:18:15 Prof Michele Barbour
If you were to look forward.
00:18:18 Prof Michele Barbour
What do you want to have achieved? What would you feel satisfied in terms of an achievement point in a few years time?
00:18:26 Dr Zeke Steer
I think in the short term, obviously I want to get a product to market it. I want to see people using that and.
00:18:31 Dr Zeke Steer
Getting.
00:18:31 Dr Zeke Steer
Value from it looking a little bit further ahead. I still have a lot to learn and I want to take that product overseas and understand some of the challenges.
00:18:41 Dr Zeke Steer
Associated with that. So you know really rounding out my experience of building a business.
00:18:47 Dr Zeke Steer
Maybe within five years or so I'll be looking towards an exit. Hopefully if things have gone well and thinking about the next phase of my entrepreneurial journey and I've already had a few thoughts, I won't share them now, but yeah, there will be a new chapter hopefully and more exciting stuff to come.
00:18:59 Prof Michele Barbour
No.
00:19:05 Prof Michele Barbour
And what I find interesting in your answer and I won't ask you to disclose anything that you don't want to, but is that despite the hard work and the struggles and the feeling like you're doing 3 PhD simultaneously, I think you're saying you do it all again.
00:19:18 Dr Zeke Steer
I absolutely would. Yeah. I mean, there's no more rewarding uh experience than taking something that you've been working on for many years and ultimately bringing it to people that are going.
00:19:29 Dr Zeke Steer
To benefit so.
00:19:30 Prof Michele Barbour
Something that's so your motivations are so personal and so profound to you as well.
00:19:34 Dr Zeke Steer
Exactly. Yeah, it's it's having that tangible, you know, awareness of what this could do for somebody. And actually being part of the the journey towards bringing that to life, it's hugely satisfying.
00:19:47 Prof Michele Barbour
So, knowing what you know now, if you were to advise the Zika of a few years ago, maybe prior to the PhD, but maybe just at the point you were starting to feel you weren't learning in the way you wanted.
00:19:58 Prof Michele Barbour
To in your.
00:19:59 Prof Michele Barbour
In your job, what advice would you give?
00:20:01 Prof Michele Barbour
Your younger self.
00:20:03 Dr Zeke Steer
I would have said don't hesitate because I was quite dissatisfied at work for some time. Uh, I was toying with starting a business, but I didn't really have the confidence the the knowledge that I needed to do that and obviously then.
00:20:19 Dr Zeke Steer
I suppose one of the confidence building activities I did was to pursue the PhD so that I felt more comfortable in having something that I could take.
00:20:25 Dr Zeke Steer
Forward, but retrospectively, you know, perhaps I could have started that journey sooner and with it being such hard work, I would have benefited from being a few years younger going on that journey. So yeah, my my advice to other people would be don't hesitate, do it, capitalize on the amazing resources that we have here in Bristol and support.
00:20:46 Dr Zeke Steer
And yeah, you'll be successful.
00:20:48 Prof Michele Barbour
So knowing how you came into this and how strongly you felt about what you're trying to achieve, what would you like to be the legacy of Mel Botics? What would you like to have fundamentally changed?
00:21:01 Dr Zeke Steer
I think certainly within the care sector, attitudes are changing towards dementia, but there is still a relic of.
00:21:09 Dr Zeke Steer
You know, inevitability of the condition of how things will pan out.
00:21:15 Dr Zeke Steer
I would like to think that through the technology that we're developing and the advice that we're supplying alongside, there might be some positive change towards how dementia is viewed in society and and hopefully people with dementia will.
00:21:31 Dr Zeke Steer
You know, find that journey ultimately not quite so difficult. Yeah. At the end of the day. And I know a lot of that is through the interactions.
00:21:39 Dr Zeke Steer
That.
00:21:39 Dr Zeke Steer
They have with family, with carers and if we can build the awareness of how they are feeling once they've lost the ability to communicate that I'm sure there's potential to avoid unnecessary.
00:21:50 Dr Zeke Steer
Offering. So that's really what drives me.
00:21:53 Prof Michele Barbour
The time and shape those interactions to be supportive to the individual not not exacerbate any anxiety they're feeling.
00:22:00 Dr Zeke Steer
Very well put. Yeah, that's.
00:22:02 Prof Michele Barbour
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's all for this enterprise session. But join us again soon to hear more about the way our amazing staff and students are translating their enterprising ideas into real world impact. And do please click on the links if you'd like to contact the University of Bristol.