inRoads

S5 Ep8 Camping at the Top of MOUNT SINAI w/ Dan Kingsley & Nolan Houvener

• Appian Media, Dan Kingsley, Nolan Houvener • Season 5 • Episode 8

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Easily winning the award for the most remote podcast recording from Appian Media - Stuart sits down with Dan Kingsley, our Executive Producer and Travel Photographer and Nolan Houvener, our Production Assistant and Assistant Editor FROM THE TOP OF MOUNT SINAI! 

The inRoads podcast is a production of Appian Media, a non-profit video production company dedicated to using compelling media to re-engage people with the Bible. Learn more and support the mission at https://appianmedia.org

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We're stepping out of the studio for easily our most remote podcast recording ever. Interviewing Dan Kingsley, our executive producer and travel photographer and Nolan Houvener, our production assistant and assistant editor. From the top of Mount Sinai. That's coming up next on inRoads. Welcome to inRoads where we share real world examples of digital evangel ism and provide tips on how you can use today's technology to spread the good news of the Gospel. Learn more about us and watch our free video series at appianmedia.org. Appian Media is currently in post-production of our next documentary series“Out of Egypt”. You're invited on this extraordinary journey through Egypt and Jordan as we look at one of the possible routes of the exodus. We'll have a lot more on how you can still be involved with this incredible project later in the show. So our team last month returned from a two week production trip in Egypt and in Jordan. And during that time we captured all kinds of content, not only for the main series“Out of Egypt”, but our children's series“Lessons from the Land: the Exodus”. And we also had the opportunity to record a handful of podcasts while we were there, including the one I'm going to share with you this morning, where Stuart sat down with Dan Kingsley and Nolan Houvener after we had spent the night in the open air at the top of Jabal Moussa, which is considered by many to be the traditional location of Mount Sinai. So this is an incredible conversation between Dan Kingsley, who has been with us on nearly every single one of our trips from the beginning and then Nolan, who has worked alongside of us over the last couple of years. But this was his first production trip with us and so I am thrilled to share that conversation with you all today on inRoads. This probably wins the award for the most remote, uh, most picturesque podcast that we'll ever record. Um, if you are, if you're listening to this right now, you're missing out. You need to probably go and watch this on YouTube because the the backdrop that we have for this, this recording is, uh, Mt. Sinai. And we're looking down into the valley behind us, and we climbed up to the top of Mount Sinai or Jabal Mousa as they, as they refer to it here yesterday afternoon and spent the night at the top and then got to watch the sunset in the sunrise. So needless to say, it's been it's been one of those experiences in life where you just know you're never going to forget it. And you're going to be telling that story for years about how you sat around the campfire with Bedouins eating wonderful chicken and laughing and having a good time. So I've got Nolan Houvener and of course Dan Kingsley with us. It is extremely dry up here and I think we noticed that last night as we were sleeping that it was just so dry and we were I was breathing in sand or something. I don't know what it was. But anyway, so as I was saying, I've got Nolan Houvener who is working with us. He's kind of the behind the scenes guy he's doing, he's kind of the utility player. He's doing whatever everybody needs him to do and he's been a good sport about it. And then of course, Dan Kingsley, our executive producer and photographer, and I just kind of wanted to pull pull you guys together and chat a little bit about your experiences up here on Jabal Moussa. So Nolan, let's start with you guys. You know, this is your first trip with Appian and I know you've been really positive and excited the whole time. How how have you enjoyed it and how has your experience up here been? It's been nonstop up. Just wonder the whole trip, just every second has been incredible. Even the more uncomfortable moments have been, they've been great, you know. But at Mount Sinai specifically, I've been looking forward to the whole time since I found out our schedule and like the places we could be, we'd be going. We're looking forward to this and staying the night up here and it's exceeded expectations. It is beyond gorgeous up here and it's cold last night, but just incredible. That's what people were warning us, that it would be hot at the bottom. And it was. And it would be cold at the top. And so we had to pack accordingly because we had to be ready for both extremes of conditions. Now, you mentioned it's been an exciting time, even the uncomfortable moments. And I think that that's a good that's a good choice of words kind of describe what are some of the hurdles that we've had to overcome? Well, there are no rules in Egypt is what we've come to find out people can to the law enforcement can change their mind about rules on a whim. We almost didn't get to come up here yesterday. We were at the bottom for about 2 hours because somebody down there working at the security checkpoint said, well, your permits are good

for today until 2:

00, not until tomorrow. And so we had to pay for another permit to then come up. So that was one hurdle we faced recently. And that's a great example of of kind of some of the things that we've had to deal with along the way. But it's been amazing, though, because we've I think the whole team has taken it in stride and we've been able to capture great content despite the hurdles that we've come up against. And in some cases that's going to kind of get pulled into the story. I think as the viewers see it coming out. Dan, let me ask you, this is not your first mountain that you've climbed. Would that be in media? No. Is this the tallest? I think this is the tallest. Excuse me. We climbed in Sardis. We climb to the top of the Acropolis. And I think this doubled the height as far as what we had to climb. We started at a much lower base level there than we did here. So even though this is probably about 6000 feet higher, we started it. We started over about a mile high. So it wasn't we didn't have to climb all 8000 feet, thankfully. Yeah. And I ran my watch yesterday as we were climbing, we clocked over 2000 feet of elevation gain and I think our final elevation was like 7100 feet above sea level. So we're up at about 7000 feet right now as we record this. So it's a tall mountain, definitely one of the tallest peaks in this area. So, Dan, let me ask you, Mount Sinai, one of the traditional sites of Mount Sinai, there are several that they believe could have been the Mount Sinai, where Moses received the Ten Commandments. But what are the feelings that you're having, just getting to be up here and then, of course, spend the night up here? What do you think? It is amazing. This is probably the hardest thing I've ever done with AP Media. I don't know if it's my age kicking in or just not being in shape, but it was tough. There were times where I was thinking, okay, I'm going to grab a Bedouin and I'm going to hire a camel to get me up. But I didn't want to be the first one to give in. So I got up here because of the delays we had. We had to go a little faster than we all would have liked. And so it took its toll. Several of us were cramping last night while we were sleeping. Had to get up and work out the kinks. But if nothing else, just from a pictorial perspective, it's amazing watching the sunset last night. And then you look over your other shoulder and there's the moon rising. The sunrise this morning shared with 50 of our newest friends as people bused from Sharm el-Sheikh hike up in the dark and watch the sunrise. So it was amazing just from that perspective. But if this is the biblical Mount Sinai and I know there's people who debate it, but this I think if it isn't, it sure represents. Well, from a biblical perspective coming up here and realizing that this is where the Israelites would have been around for a year, receiving the the commandments, seeing the fire on the mountain in the cloud. It just brings home some of the stories that we read and realize those aren't just fables that people picked up from other cultures and incorporated into the Bible. These things really happened. They're real events, real places, and we might not know exactly the dot on the map where it happened, but these events happened. So, so to that point. Dan, like, you know, we don't know this is the spot, but you kind of alluded to it. It gives a good representation. How are you going to be able to go back in your Bible classes when you're teaching on the Exodus and get to the story of the Ten Commandments and Moses going up? How is this going to help add to that experience and your ability to teach? Well, I think any anybody can be a good teacher, but when you're able to incorporate in things in experiences, sometimes it gives some perspective that you have and kind of a zeal that you might not have had before that the kids can pick up on or other people you're talking to. And so going to the land of Goshen and just seeing how green and how fertile and how watered it was, and then driving across the Sinai to to St Catherine's on hiking up. I know why the Israelites said we need some water, but we want to go back. They had melons, they had leeks. I know why they would have said that. Seeing the contrast between the two places. It just it really hits home when you have the dust on your feet, you know, a little bit of what they went through. And we'll jump back into Steve's conversation with Dan and with Nolan here in just a moment. But I wanted to share with you that while we have returned from our production trip to Egypt and to Jordan and principal photography of Out of Egypt is complete. Post-production is just getting started and there are still opportunities for you to be involved to help make this project the best that it can be. So right now, if you go to fundraiser dot, AP and media dot org, you can help support this project with a donation of any amount your funds are going to go towards the editing, the sweetening, the audio, the sound and the distribution of this content. And it will allow us to get it out as quickly as our team wants to get it out to you. Your donation will ensure that we can make this the best that it can be. AP In Media were 501c3. Your donations are tax deductible, so please consider jumping on board. Being a part of this team and donating today at Fundraise, Laser Dot, AP and Media Dawg. And thank you to all of those who've already come aboard. Now back to Stu's conversation with Dan and Nolan. So Nolan, I know I've experienced it a few times, but when you pick up a camera, are you a little disappointed because you're looking through this screen and you're going, how in the world can I communicate just exactly the beauty that I'm seeing? So the phones do nothing to capture this. The mountains look small and unimpressive. Even our cameras are not doing not doing this mountain scape justice and just how gorgeous everything around us is right now. So, yeah, it's disappointing to me. It's hard at least to capture as much of the beauty around us as we possibly can. Yeah, I think. Yeah, I was up up on one of the rocks this morning taking pictures at the sunrise. And I look out through the screen and look at it out and there's just no comparing it. Yeah. Have you been able to stop and take a minute to take it in for yourself? Yes. Yeah, good. Absolutely. That's good. You know, and I found myself shooting a lot more video when we were up there last night and this morning, because maybe if I could move the camera around and like even narrate at times what I was seeing, it was maybe more impactful or helpful for people than just a single snapshot, which you're right. It's like the mountains just look small and it's like the sun was this little tiny speck in the sky this morning, even though we looked at it and were like this, this is unbelievable. So what? Nolan, I'll ask you, what do you feel like has been your best experience so far? Best experience as it's got to be up here spending that I ate dinner last night. We were sitting on these mats around a fire and they were cooking basically whole chickens over the hot coals set, sitting there watching them cook, talking with the Bedouins, laughing, and just communing with everyone up here with strangers and our team. Like it was just the most surreal and impactful moment. The moment I'm going to remember the most, I think was last night around the fire. Yeah. And do you think from a you know, what does that do for your soul? What does that do for you when you're able to sit around a campfire and you know, your point of you're like, there's people from all different nationalities, all different backgrounds, all different religions, and they're all sitting together, laughing and having having a good time as if they've known each other forever. You know, it's it's hard to or it's easy to forget how big our world is just in America. I mean, we run into other cultures and languages occasionally. They're I'm from Indiana, so there's not a whole lot of diversity there. But when you come to a place like this, a place that if you've been to, you kind of just imagine is real, like you think it's real, but you have really no concept of what it's like here when you come to this place. And then all these other people from around the world have also journeyed all this same way to get to the same spot, because it has some religious significance in the three major religions here in this spot. It's incredible. Just the unity that you feel in in so much diversity that's up here. Yeah, that's and that is the excellent point. Dan, I want you to talk about that a little bit. There are very few places in the world that have religious significance to all three of the major world religions Islam, Judaism and Christianity. We talk about Jerusalem being one of those spots, but, you know, until Nolan just said it, I hadn't really given it that much thought. But this is probably one of those spots. Yeah, we've we've been to Jerusalem and everybody focuses on that. But yeah, actually Sinai is very important in all three month to monotheistic religions. And to Nolan's point, it's valuable to each religion because it's involved in their stories. Obviously, Christianity is the fulfillment of Judaism. The Messiah has come and God is giving salvation to the whole world. The whole world can be special people if they so choose. And so and then you see a lot of Christianity and Judaism incorporated in the founding of Islam. And so the Exodus story and being on Mount Sinai is really crucial to the, the beginnings of the Jewish nation, the Jewish people, which then in turn is important to Christianity and to Islam. Yeah. So I'll ask you the same question I asked Nolan. So far on this journey, what has been your favorite moment? And it's okay if it's the same. I know. Well, it's a little bit was here. I mean the dinner was amazing and sitting around but I think I'm focusing on more the people meeting people in Cairo, in Goshen, here on Sinai. And I'm sure it'll be this way when we get to Jordan. It gives me hope for my children because you you look at the news media and how everybody hates each other and the world is just, you know, it's it's going to destroy itself in the next 32 hours. And that's a minority of the world. There are, you know, some leaders that are bad. There are some people who are bad. But I think for the most part, especially when you travel internationally, you find out that a lot of people are just there. They're good at heart. They want peace. They want they want something for their children, for them to leave behind. They want to get along. And when you travel around, you don't have to know the language. A lot of times body language and the tone of your voice, you realize that most people just want to be friendly. And to me, meeting all these strangers, even when I couldn't speak their language, even when they couldn't speak mine, and unfortunately, I'm an American, so most people speak English, which is good for me, but bad that I don't know their language. Right. But most people want to be friendly. They want to be kind, they want to be helpful. And to me, that's been the joy of this trip, is just seeing it. Just like at dinner last night, we had Bedouins, we had some Israeli women who are actually French who joined us for dinner. We have all of us from around the U.S. We had our guide from from Gaza. We had a lot of different nationalities represented. And everybody enjoyed the dinner and had great conversation. Yeah. Into that point on people, you know, I have noticed there's two things I've noticed about the people here in Egypt, especially when we've gotten out into the rural areas. I think about the woman who was baking bread and that family when we stopped and came out, they kind of just welcomed us in. They gave us bread. I mean, we're talking people that don't have four one KS and, you know, giant bank accounts. These are people who are living very meager lives. And they were so generous with their time and with their resources. And that just shows me that we need to be generous and people around the world can are generous. And then on top of it, I was talking to a Bedouin up here who was talking about his family and his tribe, and he said his tribe lived at the bottom of this mountain. And within his tribe there were different families. You get the sense that family and community is so, so important to the people, groups that live in this in this area. And it's something that I think we as Americans can tend to forget that the family unit isn't just mom and dad and kids, it's the extended family. It's generational. And a lot of times they all live in the same village, maybe even the same home. And that's that's their identity is family. And so I think that those are those are some really interesting things that you don't see in other places in the world that seem to really illuminate when you come into the Middle East. You know, I think for those who have watched Searching for a King, when we stopped at Hebron to film. Yeah. And we just pulled up to a house and asked the guy, Hey, can we film in your front yard? Next thing we know, he is bringing tea hot tea to everybody and serving us. And we were just invading his front yard and we played soccer with his kids. Yet the generosity is just amazing and yeah, I think in America we have gotten away from looking at our family as family. And here I think in some ways the parable of the Good Samaritan comes in where, you know, who is your neighbor or the one who helped you? And most people, you're either family or your neighbor. And so they they view things a little differently than we do. And I think that's something that we need to get back to. Yeah, absolutely. So kind of as we close things out here and we look forward, so this kind of it's the beginning. In the end, it's the beginning of what I would say is the the more off the grid part of this journey. We've been in Cairo, we've been in Luxor, we've stayed in hotels and done that. But we're now getting to a place where we're going to be out in the wilderness. We're up at Mount Sinai, we're going into the deserts in Jordan. And and we'll be kind of out a bit knowing, what are you looking forward to the most as we as we continue to journey forward? I've been looking forward since the beginning. The trip really to get out of the city these past couple days been the first few to like you said, the first couple of days. We've been away from everything. We're out in middle of nowhere. So I'm really looking forward to getting out of Egypt and into Jordan and seeing these places being more in the wilderness. Yeah, yeah. Dan, what about you? I think I have to getting to see the original model, the map, which is slated for a four hour trip. I've seen the replicas, but I would love to see the original. And then actually standing on Mount Nebo. I have pictures of it from the Israel side. I've been to Jordan, but I haven't been up Mount Nebo. And from a photography perspective, I'd like to get those photographs. Looking at the land of Israel from the Transjordan. But I would also though like to stand there and just think about Moses had worked 40 years getting the children of Israel through the wilderness and then being told, this is all you're going to get to do as you're going to get to see it. And I hope it is a clear day because I would love to see what Moses saw that day. I would be neat. Yeah. And we've kind of we've kind of as we've gone along with the people have been amazing here in Egypt. But it's been a challenge. I mean, we can't we can't deny that there's been challenges along the way. And we've all kind of joked that, all right, we're looking forward to getting out of Egypt, getting into Jordan. I kind of agree with you, though. I think for our team who has been to Israel before and just known how how amazing and how friendly everybody in Israel is and how comfortable we are in Israel because we know Israel to be able to look over the mountain into that land that we know and be able to see. Oh, there's Jericho, there's the dead Sea. There's I think is going to be a neat experience for for all of us. So. Well, guys, thank you so much for for taking a few minutes to chat and sit here and take in this this wonderful view. I think we're going to wrap things up and start hiking down the mountain. Sounds good. Thanks. All right. Thank you. Thanks for joining us on this episode. It was such an incredible experience and we've got more content just like this coming up on this season of inRoads We're going to continue highlighting others that are using digital media to spread the good news of the gospel. And we'll also continue to pull back the curtain on the production of “Out of Egypt” and talk with other members of our team as we have developed and fundraised and now are producing and editing our most ambitious, challenging and rewarding project that we have ever done. That's going to be next time on inRoads. inRoads is a production of Appian Media. We're a nonprofit video production company that is 100% crowdfunded. If you're interested in learning more about how you can support Appian Media so that we can continue to create more great free content, visit us at appianmedia.org.