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SNM242: The Art of New Ideas with Robin Landa

• Jonathan Green : Bestselling Author, Tropical Island Entrepreneur, 7-Figure Blogger

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Jonathan Green: Where artistic and creativity intersect the art of new ideas with special guest Robin Landa on today's episode. 

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Announcer: Are you tired of dealing with your boss? Do you feel underpaid and underappreciated? If you want to make it online, fire your boss and start living your retirement dreams now.

Then you've come to the right place. Welcome to Serve No Master Podcast, where you'll learn how to open new revenue streams and make money while you sleep. Presented live from a Tropical island in the South Pacific by best selling author Jonathan Green. Now, here's your host. 

Jonathan Green: I'm really interested in this topic because we spend so much of our lives limiting our creativity and learning in school.

Stop being creative. Stop being creative. Follow the rules. Follow the rules. But what you teach in design, and you've written so many books on this topic, it's very fascinating to me. I'd love to know how your journey began with your passion for creativity and seeing how it can help entrepreneurs and businesses to succeed and grow.

Robin Landa: Thanks so much for having me on the show. I'm honored, Jonathan, I'm a big fan of yours. Thanks. I've always been interested in creativity because, from a young age, I was always interested in art and design and started drawing and designing very, very young, and then went into it as a career and I see that when I teach, if I explain the creativity process and how to come up with new ideas, students get it very rapidly.

But if you don't explain it and you let them use existing, Processes like brainstorming or the conventional five step process, there seems to be a black box in there. Like how does the idea, how does the aha moment form? And so I really needed to find a way to very clearly explain to them how you do form an idea and how to validate the idea, how to make sure the idea has merit, that it does something for individuals or society or the planet.

Jonathan Green: So I think those are the two really important parts. The first is people say, oh, I can't have any, I don't have any ideas. I can't think of anything. I can't come with any ideas. And there's, we feel like stuck. And then the second is, well, what if I'm, my ideas a bad idea? So those are two things you brought up, which are really, really good.

But first I'd love to talk about brainstorming. I think that's how everyone's taught. They come up with ideas in school and they always say the same thing. There's no bad ideas. Whatever you say will put on the board, and then someone has a bad idea and everyone looks at them like, what are you thinking? You're so dumb. So even when you make that promise it doesn't work, why is brainstorming so ineffective and why is it what we're always taught as a method? 

Robin Landa: It, it was introduced by Alex Osborne in 1953, um, for use in advertising agencies where you had a group of creative people sitting around a table and throwing ideas at each other, and they already are good at the creative process, but when you take it out into the world and people aren't trained as creative thinkers, Becomes kind of, um, just random and people just throw out a lot of ideas and, and that of course is part of the process that nobody judges in the beginning.

You just throw out your ideas. And it does work for some people and, and, and I think it especially works for individuals where you just write everything down and then one thought might lead to another in a group, you really need a very good leader who will allow a kind of improverb yes and ideas where you don't squash anybody else's ideas that are thrown out, but you are really not thinking about whether you're filling a gap, like what's missing, what, what will your idea fill in the discipline or the sector or the industry or the world? How will, and then how will it help people? 

So it's just kind of, um, thinking out loud, which can work for some people, but it, it really isn't efficacious in, uh, in, in producing quality ideas, worthwhile ideas, ideas worth pursuing that may have, that are consequential.

Jonathan Green: Okay. That's very interesting. Like I'm familiar with it where almost like the teacher's having the glass brainstorm to try and guess the idea that they've already had. Like, let's brainstorm what's the real reason people do this or what's, let's brainstorm, what are the qualities of a leader? But they come with a completely whole original idea.

It's much, that's very interesting to me because, That is where people run into a wall a lot, you know? Um, trying to come up with business idea and what type of products to make, cuz there's so many things that work. I think the biggest challenge of building biz online is not the limitations, it's the broadness.

Cuz there's so many business models that work. How do you choose the one that's right for you? So what, can you tell me a little bit about your method for coming up with creative ideas and kind of how we can activate that part of people's brains. 

Robin Landa: Sure. And I, I do wanna go back to something you said that's really insightful, which is brainstorming is, is good for when you're looking for an insight.

So you, you mentioned something about how do people behave? Brainstorming works well that way in where we're all thinking about the same target audience and we're thinking about their behaviors. But my process is not a black box and that's what I think makes it really different and actionable. So there are, it's very easy to remember too.

There are three Gs. There's goal, gap, and game. So most people think that a goal is the idea, but it's not. It's just the start, the gap. I mean, the goal is what you hope to achieve, but it's just the start, the gap is the piece that's missing. And that's really crucial for growth and for doing something good and something that's beneficial because there's so many gaps in in different industry sectors, fields.

You know, if you think about the fact that we got the Covid vaccine because those scientists filled a gap in a delivery, a medicine delivery system, messenger mRNA. So the gap is what's missing? Is it a product? Is it a service? Are, is it an audience who's being ignored or underserved? Uh, it can, is it, a question that hasn't been answered yet is, is it a method that's outdated?

Is it a method that no one's, no one is willing to try? Is it a toxic, free method? I mean, there's so many gaps. And that kind of ensures that your goal will actually be worthwhile. But then the, the final thing to think about is, again, what's in it for people? What's in it for the planet? What's in it for creatures?

What's in it for society? And so you have a way of evaluating whether the gap, the goal on the gap that you're filling, have a worthwhile outcome, a meaningful outcome, a significant outcome. 

Jonathan Green: So let's say someone's working through this process, they come up with an idea, they go, I think this is a really good idea.

Um, and I've seen this. I love watching those TV shows where people have inventions. I'm so fascinated with inventions. And then they have the invention, and then they always spend huge amounts of money on patents. You know, always spent $65,000 on patents around the world so no one could steal our idea, but they never validate, and it turns out it's a terrible idea or that no one wants to buy it which was really what the market says. I always say, you know, I write a lot of books that the readers, it's a democracy. They get to vote. It doesn't matter how hard I work on a book, if they don't, if nobody likes it. And for all of the books I've written, my favorite books are never my audience's favorite books. So I can't predict their behavior.

So let's talk a little bit about the idea of validation. Cause I think that's where people get really nervous is what if my idea's a bad one? How can I tell? And I've certainly had bad ideas that I've run with. What's your validation process? How can we start to check it that we have a good idea? 

Robin Landa: Well, I think, I'm sorry.

I, I think you're right and you have to validate it. I, uh, you have to do some research, first of all, and there are all sorts of, you can do it yourself. Um, there's research firms that will do research for you about the need, about the insight, cuz you brought this up earlier. What's the insight into the target audience that your idea fills?

Will it resonate with them? Is it relevant to them? Is it relevant to their needs, to their aspirations, to their desires? Um, none of us knew that we really needed it. An iPhone, uh, a smartphone, until Steve Jobs figured out that that would be something people really wanted and needed and, and became very attached to.

But in this three Gs process, it's that gap that's key because if, if you write a book about a subject that people really need to understand or know about, and no one else has done it, you're filling a void. You're in, in academia, we say you're moving the discipline forward. And you're filling a void. Um, anticipating whether it resonates with some, with an audience, research helps, uh, but that is often a gamble.

Um, but really good research and really understanding why you're doing this, the why behind it is important. And if your values align with the target audience's values, and if you are thinking about uh, something other than profit. That's my, my big pitch is to think about three P's profit, people and the planet.

Jonathan Green: So when you talk about an empty market, sometimes people say, oh, nobody's doing this. That must means there's a big opportunity, but oftentimes nobody's doing it for a reason. And I'll give you a specific example that happened with me about, uh, four years ago. 

One of my friends came and goes, I just had a great idea. I wrote a new book and it's gonna be so successful, how to quit vaping. And I said, wow. I didn't know people were trying to quit vaping. I thought everyone was trying to start vaping, right? I thought everyone was switching from cigarettes to vaping. Where's your research data? How did you know that people have this problem?

He goes, I didn't do any research. I just saw a gap. I just saw an opportunity. Right? It doesn't exist. And ofcourse. Nobody bought it because even now, I don't know anyone was trying to quit vaping. Everyone I know who started 10 years ago is still loving it. Maybe in the future, right? They'll discover that it's bad for you, like they did with smoking and there will be a shift.

So sometimes that empty market or there's that saying like, um, what is it? Pioneers get shot in the back with arrows. Like you don't wanna be the first to market, you wanna be the second. So what about that part of the process? How can, what happens when someone gets a false positive? Like are, a lot of people do research by saying, Hey, if I made this, would you buy it?

And everyone goes, yeah, cause that was great. And then when it's, and then it's for sale, they don't buy it. Right? There's that difference between saying you'd buy something and actually buying it. I find that gap to be the really dangerous place where a lot of people are doing validation variety, especially with friends and family.

Cuz your friends are like, oh, I'll just tell you it's a good idea. Cause I don't wanna hurt the friendship. 

Robin Landa: Well, yeah, I mean, your friend didn't really do any research. He just assumed that that would be a gap and actually the book might start selling now cause vaping is bad for you. And, and those companies are, I think, are in trouble.

Um, but you do need good research. And so if you go back to, uh, the idea of the woman who invented Spanx, I'm forgetting her name at the moment, but, When she did mention it to somebody, they didn't think it was a good idea, and then she realized that she really shouldn't mention it to anybody because they're gonna dissuade her and she was dead, right?

I mean, she did do some research. So it depends on whether you're guessing at a gap or whether you're really figuring out that it, it is valid because there's a need or a desire or benefit. The main thing to think about with any audience is they're gonna say, what's in it for me? That's just human nature.

Will I look younger? Will I feel better? Will my children be happier? Will you know, will my hair be shinier? There's always gotta be a benefit, whether it's functional, meaning something practical. Or whether it's emotional, something that'll make me feel better, feel good, um, be happier, be entertained. So I, I think part of the gap, again, has to be validated by the benefit by the game.

Jonathan Green: So does this mean every good idea is always in kind of an empty space, or is it okay to enter a crowded space as long as you have something that makes your proposition unique. Is that enough for it to be a good idea? 

Robin Landa: Well, I think you can enter a crowded space and either do it somewhat differently, um, which is creative, a twist on something that exists.

So if you're not original, which means new or innovative, and you're entering creatively with a twist on something that exists, that could work. If there's an added benefit or if you're just, your advertising is just smashing, um, that will do it right? Or if you have an insight into the audience again. 

So if you think about um, I think their name is Midea. It's a Chinese air conditioning company that just entered the US market and they decided to aim at New Yorkers because people who live in New York City have special problems and apartments where they're overheated in the winter and they actually use air conditioners in the winter and they keep their windows open simultaneously.

And Midea really thought about that and thought about those people. And so they entered a very crowded space of air conditioning manufacturers with a kind of specialty in mind and also a special audience, and they got a fantastic ad agency to per odell, to, to launch the product, the brand rather into, into New York.

Jonathan Green: Okay. This is very interesting. So, I think your process is great and people are gonna really love your new book that's coming out. It's a very interesting process cuz a lot of people struggle with creativity within the realm of financial viability. But overall, are there some ways that people can activate the creative part of their brain to kind of get the juices flowing, or some habits they can implement?

Robin Landa: Absolutely. Uh, I've taught, literally taught thousands of people to unlock their creative potential. And there are ways to do it. There are, there are habits to build. Um, one, one is being very curious. Uh, And not just about your own vertical, right, about your own business, but about expanding out to being curious about other things.

So a great example is somebody like Lin Manuel Miranda, who wrote Hamilton when he finished with, um, In the Heights, his first show on Off Broadway, and it was about to come to Broadway. He needed a break and he took a vacation on the beach in Mexico and he needed a book to read. And rather than choosing, selecting a book about the theater or about music, or about lyrics or anything really related to what he does as a songwriter, actor, director, he picked up the biography of Alexander Hamilton.

If he hadn't been curious about American history and our founding fathers, we wouldn't have one of the greatest musicals of all time. So being curious about many things is really, really a golden habit to build. Another one is observation. To be a mindful observer, to really notice things, notice potential, um, when people see things that others not that can really trigger an insight into something. And in fact, there's been a recent, uh, scientific medical study that being observant actually awards off senility. So there, there are headed benefits to being observant, to a mindful observer, and then being open, being open to new experiences, new ideas.

And I'm not saying to listen to the rants of, of ignorant people, but to be open and, and engage in dialogue rather than debate with, with, with people and, and to get multiple perspectives so that you get a diverse, uh, group of people to talk with and, and dialogue with. And then one of the best ways to build your creativity, and you can do it every day, is ask a what if question.

What if people could fly? What if we could become invisible and listen to what other people say about us? Um, what if, what if, what if? And what if really is a question that a lot of science fiction writers ask and answer in their novels about possibilities outside our own realm of experience. 

Jonathan Green: I think these are some really good ideas because so much of what we're is to limit our creativity to only study your field, to only kind of read books in your category. Like people are always surprised cause I write so many business books and that's really what I do, that I don't read business books. Um, it, cause the last thing I wanna do is just take an idea from someone else's book.

And when I'm not working, I'm not working. All I read is science fiction books. And a lot of the ideas I get from those books end up in my products and my training, my blog posts, and a lot of my content comes from this other place that allows me to be a little different than everyone else because I'm not using the same metaphors and I'm not kind of just repeating.

So it's a very interesting idea cuz so often we're taught, we expect people to always do the same thing. Like, oh, if you write movies all you should do is like writing movies and reading books about writing movies. So I think that's really good to think about expanding outside. What people expect of you or like the limitations of your industry.

So I think that's a really cool idea. Can you explain the difference between creativity and strategic creativity? 

Robin Landa: Sure. Creativity is, um, A twist on something new that exists. And a lot of people think of creativity as something that only artists or songwriters, or musicians have, and it's kind of this willy-nilly, you know, it strikes you with the bolt of lightning.

But strategic creativity is the power to conceive something that actually solves a problem, anticipates a problem, um, or an issue or, or a need anticipates, a need, the way Steve Jobs anticipated how, what people would need in terms of a smartphone and, very importantly, aims, empathetically and appropriately at people at the target audience and then ultimately, going back to my other concept is something that benefits people. So strategic creativity means that you're really thinking with purpose with why and with purpose in mind. 

Jonathan Green: Okay. I think these are some really good concepts that are gonna help a lot of people who are feeling kind of stuck or stagnant.

Where can people come online to learn more about what you do and see about your upcoming book? 

Robin Landa: Thank you so much for asking. I have a website, Robin. It's my name, robinlanda.com, and you can actually get some really cool free information there too. Um, all my books are available on all book sellers, Amazon, Barnes and Noble, any book seller that you, you use.

And um, my new book that's coming outta November is The New Art of Ideas: Unlock Your Creative Potential where I explained the process that we were talking about. And just so your listeners know, Anybody who pre-orders, I'm donating all my royalties to benefit humanitarian relief in Ukraine. 

Jonathan Green: That's wonderful.

Thank you so much for your generosity, and thank you so much for being here today. 

Robin Landa: My pleasure. Thank you for inviting me. It was great. 

Jonathan Green: Thanks for listening to today's episode. I am passionate about product creation and it doesn't have to be hard. Let me help you break through the most common myths that stop people from creating a product and show you how to make your first product in an afternoon at servemaster.com/myth.

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