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SNM244: The Power of Networking with Sara Alepin

• Jonathan Green : Bestselling Author, Tropical Island Entrepreneur, 7-Figure Blogger

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Jonathan Green: Using the power of networking to grow your online business with special guests, Sarah Alepin on today's episode. 

Today's episode is brought to you by click up. In today's digital world, keeping track of all your tasks, projects, employees can become overwhelming. Use the same project management tool that I use for my team for free servernomaster.com/clickup. 

Announcer: Are you tired of dealing with your boss? Do you feel underpaid and underappreciated? If you want to make it online, fire your boss and start living your retirement dreams now. Then you've come to the right place. Welcome to Serve No Master Podcast, where you'll learn how to open new revenue streams and make money while you sleep.

Presented live from a Tropical island in the South Pacific by best selling author Jonathan Green. Now, here's your host. 

Jonathan Green: This is a topic near and dear to my heart. Uh, when I first started my online journey, my first thought was, I wanna do an online business so I never have to deal with another person ever again.

I can just sit down with my computer and magically make money and never have to do any networking or connections. And boy was I totally wrong with that first thought. So I know this is your area of expertise. How did you start, um, on the journey of helping people and thinking that how important community and other people are in growing your business.

Sara Alepin: Um, . Well, first of all, thank you for having me. Uh, I'm really excited to be here. And, um, your networking story, you are not alone at all in that, um, of feeling like you didn't want to have to go back to that. Um, so to answer your question though, my story is a little bit roundabout in a way. Um, so I was a high school photography teacher and um, my side hustle was, Like fat.

Well, I mean, it was a summer job for a teacher, but um, was wedding photography and I got attacked by a student and was, uh, injured so I couldn't go back to teaching and I was like, well, I don't wanna sit around and do nothing, so I'm gonna kick my photography business into my full-time gig. And when I started, I was injured, so I needed to have other photographers that could come and support me, um, that I could hire, you know, as my additional photographer And I started going to networking events and they were terrible.

They were absolutely horrible. It was anxiety provoking, it was frustrating, it was discouraging. And I'm a really nice person. I'm very easy to talk to, so I can imagine that, um, my experience is not isolated either. Um, so I ended up getting frustrated and I decided to build my own networking organization, um, just out of a need to be able to run my business and if I was feeling it, I figured other people were too. 

Jonathan Green: You brought up something that's near and dear to my heart. When I started out in 2010, I said, I wanna learn how to network. So I used to go to networking events from meetup.com for industries I wasn't in. I said, I'm gonna go to networking events where I'm not looking for anything and every time someone does something I don't like, I'm adding it to my list.

And you know, that's why I almost never have business cards. I hate. I don't know if this happened for you, but I remember someone would go around and put a business card on each like table, like each person's place setting before you got there. So like by the time you get there, there's like four business cards that you don't want.

It reminded me kind of, of um, Valentine's Day when you're a kid, when you just, everyone puts a card in your box. And so it's great to get a bunch, but no individual card matters. And I remember, um, some people just are, they use networking events to be, I guess the best way is socially and appropriate. In the same way that happens in a dating event.

When I was single, long time ago, I went to one things called a lock and key event where every woman has a lock on a necklace and every man has a key. And I remember I was talking to a lady and a guy just walked up and tried to put the key in the lock while we're a mid conversation. And I was like, this is awful.

They've created an event that encourages really like inappropriate behavior cuz it's like we're having a conversation, like I will talk to someone before I try and put the key in. And I guess other people are trying to be quick enough to get the prize, you know, the massage or the $50 coupon, whatever. And I had a different mindset, but I re, I was like, this is just like bad speed dating is just like bad networking and it's really, really common.

So why are people, why do you think bad networking is so common. Where do you think it comes from? And I know exactly what you're talking about, where you feel uncomfortable and you go, I don't wanna be like this. Is this what I have to do at a network? I don't wanna do it. 

Sara Alepin: Yeah. I'm so with you. I, it's funny, I always think of when I start talking about networking, I'm like, it sounds like I'm talking about dating.

Um, so bad networking. You know, it's funny, I think part of it is that old school mindset of like the door to door salesman, the pool salesman, um, where that's what we think of in our generation. Because that was what was kind of normalized when we were growing up. Um, but it's shifted so much so when those bad things happen, they're so noticeable.

Um, but a lot of it is like kind of, it's that hard selling. Um, Oh, what are those Billy MA's commercials called? Um, like the sha the commercials commercial. Yes. Thank you. . It's kind of like infomercials versus social media, like, you know, an infomercial when I say that and social media like is a little bit different style of marketing.

Um, I unfortunately, you know, bad networking is out there. Um, and that's one of the reasons that you really need to screen the events because people don't show up to our events like that. Um, and if they do, they don't come back. And that's kind of cuz it's just like you're not a fit and you know, you're not a fit even when you're kind of socially inappropriate.

Jonathan Green: Yeah. The two biggest things I've noticed are the hard sell and the desperation. So I've also been to events where, and I remember this is when I was starting out, I was living on my friend's couch making 500 to a thousand dollars a month in a studio apartment. Okay. He didn't even like sleep in a separate room.

I slept near his feet on the couch and people were talking to me like I could save their business. And I was like, how come you seem more desperate than me? Like, so that was a big lesson to me. I learned no matter what, even if you're late on the rent, you hide it inside. I was like, I learned a lesson from that.

But people have these ideas. And I don't know if they're good or bad. I remember one person I met, I remember this so vividly, they had invented like a stick you could spray tan your back on, kinda like the man crew would let you shave your back. And they were like, what do you think I should do? And I was like, I don't know any, I'm the worst person.

I don't spray tan. I, I don't naturally tan and I don't know anything about what's happening in my back. It's the part of my body I can't see. And I don't know physical products. And yet they were like reaching for a life raft. You know, that thing of like, oh, we're gonna be outta business in a few weeks. And that just really stuck with me that we are approaching networking.

And it's the same thing for job networking. People only, do you ever notice that people get really active on LinkedIn right after they lose their job? Suddenly they're updating their profile. All the things they should have done before the desperation was there. And again, it goes back to dating. It's like no one, when you have a relationship, everyone's interested.

And when you're single again, they go. What happened? You changed. Now I don't like you anymore. And it's that, I think it's the smell of desperation, which is the worst smell. And it's unfortunate that we, I think people need to start networking before they have a problem so that when something happens, they're in that right position. So.

Sara Alepin: Yeah. 

Jonathan Green: How can, when should people start thinking about networking and why do they wait until It's like way too late? 

Sara Alepin: I think you should be networking from jump, like when you have any sort of idea that you might be interested in launching a business. We have people come to events all the time who don't even have a business yet, they don't have a website.

Um, and sometimes they'll be a little nervous and they'll say like, I don't know if I'm in the right place. But they are, you know, because that's how you meet the people that you are eventually going to need. And you don't know when you're going to need those people. And you need people for so many different reasons.

Like you need a marketing person at different points. You need a business coach at different points. Like, um, and, and, and not just that, but then as you continue to collect people into your network, You can refer them out to the other people. So if you, let's say are a service, uh, a person who supports service based businesses, um, and you meet that person who has this, uh, spray tan for your back thing, then if you have collected people into your network that might actually be able to help that person, then you can refer them out and.

That is an un um, kind of like an unnoticed part of networking, but a really important part of client care because you will always be top of mind for people that you treat well and that you support even when they don't pay you or you don't pay them for that support. So like this spray tan example, you know, you weren't, you couldn't help that person, but if you had someone in your network that could, that spray tan person is always going to remember that you connected them with that lifeline.

I'm so sorry, my dog is barking.

Jonathan Green: Uh oh. That's okay. This is a real life podcast, so real life things happen. Um, you're bringing up something really important, which is your network of context. A lot of people are starting out. I remember my very first event, my first conference, and one of the things someone mentioned and stuck with me was so powerful was that one guy came to the conference and didn't have any experience, had no knowledge, had no past experience, and he just met every person said, what do you do? What are you looking for? What do you do? What are you looking for? And he introduced all the matches and everyone was like, he's the most important person here.

And it really stuck with me that power that's really always been a part of my business. So people always say to me is, I've been ghostwriting for a long time and I've worked with some really big clients. They go, how do you get all these clients? You don't, do you have a big website? Do you all this marketing?

And I go, no. I just tell everyone that's what I do. Because I know not many people know 10 ghost writers. Most people know, even people who've hired a lot of ghost writers know less than five I for the first eight years I was doing had known zero. I've met three in my entire life, including me. And so it's amazing how much just telling people your thing is and speaking with confidence.

I think that was the other part missing from that projection is that when you act really confident, Then you're much more likely to be top of mind. So when someone goes, oh, do you know a Facebook person? Oh yeah, I do. I met a Facebook person last week. You become the answer to that question as long as you clearly say what you do in a short sentence, like less than five words if, if you ever really complicated explanation for your job or it's not clear what you do.

I remember someone who was one time told me he's a business architect, and I thought, well, I don't like that. It, it really turned me off. 

Sara Alepin: You saw my face, right? ? 

Jonathan Green: Yeah. So you get it. When he said that to me, I thought, oh no, because he combined two cool words, right? Like architect is what everyone in romantic comedy is I think the romantic comedy dream job, everyone's their architect with, um, another word and he's like, now I have a job. And, and felt very invented. And I think it's the common mistake when people don't really know what you do, uh, that was an important lesson I learned. It's like you have to be really crystal clear that you're really good at one thing, whatever that one thing is, and then people know if you're what they need or not.

Sometimes we try to say, oh, I do all services, like I do social media, I do SMS marketing, I do email marketing, I do copywriting, I do blog post writing. And cuz you're trying to do every service for everyone. And unfortunately then you feels like you're a jack of all trades instead of a specialist. So you actually get less work without realizing it.

That was one of the big lessons I learned, and as well as if you just tell everyone good things can come your way. So I remember when I read a lot of sales books. The first sales books are like, you eat what you kill, right? You have to hunt down your, you have to hunt down your customers, bring 'em down like wild game, like it was like a lion hunting a lamb or whatever, uh, that animal is, right? Like antelope, maybe it's antelope, right? Is that matter for. And that's how a lot of people, especially phone sales is right door to door sales, phone sales. It's that aggressive mindset. We think that's what we have to do. But I think of networking and I think of a lot of parts of my business as farming.

So I read this book, um, never Eat Alone. One of the best books I ever read recommended to me about one of the richest people I ever met, and it taught this lesson. That's, I think, the most important lesson. No, which is that favors are not a finite resource you can introduce people over and over again without running out of it.

You can give value a lot of it. And there are people who I did a favor for three years ago, and the longer someone takes to return the favor, the bigger the return. That's what I've really noticed people do. Like I used to be a favor counter, like, oh, this person knows me. This, this person knows me, that this person, and you try to wait for them to pay you back.

It's very stressful, very, very stressful. But when you switch to the favors of muscles, like, oh, the more favors I do, the better I get out it. Um, and now I actually don't really think about it. As long as I like a person, I'll do, I'll throw a lot of stuff way. I'm like, oh, I know three people do amazing for you to meet, right?

I don't think about it as long as I'm like, oh, you're nice, they're nice. I'm gonna introduce you. I introduced someone I met two weeks ago to some really big contacts of mine because she was really nice and awesome, and we had a really great connection, and you never know when you're gonna meet those people, so, When you start exercising a muscle, you get really good at it.

Like you get really good at favors and then when people do you stuff, it's really cool. People who do these really big, really amazing favors, that to you would be very financially big, but them to not, are not a big deal. So how can people start to approach networking from the give mindset rather than the take mindset?

I think that's something that really holds people back. They go there looking for a quick result, like I'm looking here and I'm only gonna talk to people that have the one thing I'm looking for. Now, I'm guilty of this. I don't like to meet people that don't own businesses. Sometimes there'll be at a conference, I meet someone like, oh, I'm number seven at Google.

I'm like, yeah, I don't wanna talk to you. I only talk to owners, like I'll talk to owner of a one person business before I'll talk to a person because. For me, I like talking to people that know what it feels like to be in the arena, that know what it feels like when it's all on you, when you have to perform.

Cuz that's a different feeling than when you're an employee. Even if you're number two in a big company, you don't have ultimate decision making authority, which means you don't have ultimate stress authority. So that's one thing for me, that's one of my personal limitations. But how can people switch past their limitations and start meeting a lot more people and realize that building out that Rolodex has a value in and of itself.

Sara Alepin: So I think the, the first thing to do, um, To, to shift is that it's not, the conversation isn't about you, it's about the other person. And so your, your goal isn't to go in and talk about, and, and this is a bad behavior technique for networking too, to just call this forward, to go in and talk about yourself.

I do this, I serve this person. This is what I'm here looking for. And that other person hasn't even had a chance to say their name yet. It is about the other person. You are there to learn what the other person does. You are there to learn about the other person and ask questions. So, um, of course you're gonna get to talk about yourself, but nobody wants to stand and hear about another person for 15 minutes, like, They're gonna be looking to lift out of that conversation really fast.

Um, so even if you go with a goal in mind and you should, um, but you don't have to accomplish that. Like you may not meet somebody who is there, you know, that you're looking to hire for social media or whatever, like, you know, you, but you might meet 15 really amazing people that now are in your network that now you can connect with other people or may hire you later, or you may hire later.

Or a whole plethora of other things, but you've also made a connection, a real connection that means something. And um, and just talking about yourself doesn't build that in the same way. So going in and, and always stepping into the mindset of this conversation isn't about me. And same, that's across business in general.

Like when you're serving clients, it's about the client. It's not about you,

Jonathan Green: What sometimes happens, I think is people are hesitant to say what they do or what they want. I one time remember, um, this girl I was friends with was dating a guy and I said, oh, what do you do? And he goes, I'm a writer. I go, oh, amazing. You write books or articles? He goes, no music. I go, oh, that's amazing.

I love music. What kind of music do you write? Are you singer song or this? And I had to ask him about eight questions to figure out what he actually did. And I remember thinking, I hate that guy. Because he could have just said, I'm a, in three words, I'm a this kind of music writer. Right. And I don't perform, I'm only a writer for other people.

Right. He could have said it in one sentence, but he buried it and it really gave me a negative feel for him and they didn't work out. I dunno if that's why, but that was my first thought. I was like, why? Especially when you have a cool job, why are you, it felt like he was ashamed of his job and I wasn't sure why.

Cuz it was a good. It wasn't like one, you could I any reason why you'd be ashamed, but if everyone would love to write music for celebrities, right? Like for big bands and stuff. So his hesitancy was so strange. But I think sometimes my experience is that people like you have to dig to figure out who they are and they don't wanna say what they're looking for because they're like trying to hide their two cards.

But for me, when I'm at a conference, you know, I wanna say what I do as quickly as I can, what I'm looking for. If I could say both of those in one sentence. They have the two pieces of data they need. I go, oh, I'm this, and I'd love to meet people that do this. So if I'm looking for new clients, I'll say, oh, I'm a celebrity ghost writer, and I'd love to meet people that are looking like to do a great project.

Tell me about you. And I've done my thing and now I don't have to talk about me. So I developed a technique when I was in my single days. And um, I'll be talking to a lady and their husband or boyfriend walks up and I never wanted a confrontation and I can't tell you how many times I start talking to the husband and then the wife is like, Hey, why weren't you talking to me?

I'm like, this guy's amazing. And so my secret technique was, I call it looking for diamonds. I wanted to meet one man with every single job that exists. I was trying to collect all the jobs. I go, I wanna meet person who teach job. So I remember one time I met the guy who does the flashlights for plane.

And I was so excited. He was like, this is a boring job. I was like, are you kidding? You do one flashlight mistake that's like a hundred million dollars a plane you can destroy. You have so much power. I was like, I don't know. You have one of the most powerful jobs I know of after air traffic controller and, but there's no backup when you're doing the flashlights.

You're the one they listen to. So I was so fascinated by that, and I brought that into my marketing, which is when people, I always wanna find the magic within someone, or the thing about their job that they love. And that allows me to get to the goodness. And sometimes it's about finding out one of my greatest network experiences.

I met a network marketer, nine, 10 figure marketer, really huge in my industry. Someone who was really high up and everyone's always trying to approach him. And I was talking to him, I was like, yeah, let's not talk about work. Let's talk about what you love to do. And it turns out he built this huge business to fund amateur archeology.

So he does a dig every year. He runs a like 10 million dollar business that he then funds digs and he always has a fossil in his pocket. And I'm one of the only people that knows that. And it's not like he doesn't like to talk about it. It's the opposite. All you have to do is drop a hint and the doors are open.

And I was like, why isn't Ev, this is very fascinating to me. Because that's a level of passion where you do a successful business to fund. Cuz let's be honest, there's no money in archeology. It's not a big business. But he had this amazing passion and you just ask. So some people their job is their passion and some people it's something else.

And a lot of my biggest successes have been asking that second question. What do you love to do? And it could be what do you love about your job or what really is the most important thing to you? Um, cuz I've seen networking mistakes. One of the biggest marketers in the world is super religious, runs a huge company.

The company's doing probably a billion dollars a year right now. And one of his earliest stories is that when he got married in college, they didn't have a baby right away. He's like 22 trying to have a child. He's one of his big stories is that we were trying to have a child, we were getting worried that we couldn't have children.

I was like at 22. Whoa. Like most people don't think that way, right? And yet people will walk up to at conferences like, Hey, do you wanna go drinking? Do you wanna go party? We're gonna go to the strip club. And I'm like, do you not? Listen? People were always amazed. He approached me to do a project. I was like, I'll do Projectally, but I have to meet your wife first cuz I know she has to approve me.

And she was at the event, I met her and she gave me the approval, which is why you worked on a project with me. And everyone's like, how did you get that project? I'm like, cause I paid attention to what's important to the person. So a lot of times it's not a lot of big questions, it's just figuring out what matters to someone.

So what are some of the techniques that you teach or recommend when you bring people into your world? The types of questions they should ask and the types of things they should look for. I know I have my techniques, but I'd love to learn a little bit more of your process. 

Sara Alepin: Um, that's a good question. Um, and you brought up a really good point here.

You know, not just asking questions, but listening to the answers and reading the room, um, is another piece that you kind of just like, you didn't explicitly call forward here. Um, but that is a huge piece of technique where you're reading the room. You, that person, that marketing person may not have said explicitly that his wife needs to approve of the people he brings into the business or brings on board. But you got, you understood from the other things that you had heard or said, you know, he got married at 22, he's very religious, he was concerned that he wouldn't be able to have children. These are all things that indicate that his relationship is incredibly important.

It's. Paramount to everything. Um, so whether or not you knew that the wife had anything to do with business, you know, you understood, okay, this is someone that's very important to this person. It takes very minimal additional effort on your part to meet the wife, you know? Do it, like, make that happen, you know?

So it's, um, that I think that is one of the most important techniques and, and something that really goes unnoticed. Um, but when you do it well, it really shines because you, it, it is the difference in landing a client like that, um, where they know, okay, oh wow, you did, you saw me, you heard me, you get me.

Now I'm, I'm gonna hire you. Um, let's make this happen. So, um, I, I think that's a really important piece here and I think you did a really awesome job of that in this story. Um, in my opinion, uh, at least from what you said, , and it sounds like you landed the client. So there you go. Um, So my strategy, what I do, um, is I always, I ask people what they do as soon as they come in.

Um, so whatever the, um, whatever the case is, and, and I kind of have different strategies for online versus in person. So I don't know if you want me to talk about them separately. 

Jonathan Green: Yes. 

Sara Alepin: But. Okay. Um, so if it's in person, I'm an extrovert, so my strategy is when I go into the room, I look for someone who looks like the last thing they wanna do is be there.

Um, and I know that probably sounds very odd, but nine times out of 10 it's just an introvert who like isn't like, Knows they need to be networking but really hates networking and I get it. So I will go up and I'll introduce myself to that person. I find out a little bit about who they are, what they do, and then I take that person around and make them my networking buddy for the night.

Um, And I developed this strategy when I was striking out networking because I realized if I was doing something kind for someone else, that other people would wanna talk to me and, and that it would really make me memorable for people too, because part of it is being memorable, right? Like having a conversation that people retain because otherwise it's just somebody handing you a business card and then leaving.

So, um, then what I would do is I'd go up to all those circles that had formerly iced me out and I would say, you know, hi, um, I'm Sarah. This is, um, Jonathan. He is a ghost writer. Um, And he lives this really cool life in Southeast Asia, which I think is where you're located, but I could be wrong. Ah, look at me.

See, I remember stuff too, uh, . And um, and then I have now introduced you. So if you're an introvert, like your ice is, the ice is broken for you now, you don't have to go through the. Pressure of walking up to the group. Um, and you don't have to have spent that energy. So it's kind to the person that I'm with.

It also, um, it gives me the ability to introduce myself and then introduce that other person. I'm comfortable doing that. It fills my extroverted bucket too. Um, so that's kind of my strategy on like getting into, cause otherwise you're walking up to circles of people and trying to get your way into them.

And that can be really intimidating. Um, it's much easier to do it when you're, when you have somebody else, when you've got a buddy. Um, so that's kind of, that's how I start in person events when I'm attending a networking event. Um, and then when I most of the networking events I go to are our networking events that are virtual.

We host both. Um, and for those, what I do is I have everybody come in and I have them introduce themselves. So they say their name, elevator pitch, they get 45 seconds max. So this is not like I'm looking for blah, blah, blah, Stuff, you know, it's, it's fast. I model it. I then I have people who have been there before I call them to the floor. Because I know they'll model it well and then everybody falls in line. So it's really good and it sets the tone for the event. Then I throw everybody in breakout rooms and I bop around and I give them three things to talk about. The first, a recent win. So whether that just be that today you got up and you made it to the computer to be on a podcast, or, um, you know you made peace with the fact that your dog was barking on the podcast. Um, you know, whatever your win is, it can be super small, but it also could be, I booked five clients last week. Um, so whatever your win is it really. We don't celebrate enough as entrepreneurs, um, our wins, and it's really nice to be able to celebrate them together.

So, um, and then after that, I have them tell something that they're either working on, struggling with or just really haven't figured out how to bring it all together yet. Um, and essentially what that tells the other person is what, um, what they're looking for. You know, what. If they're saying, I'm really struggling getting traction on social media, I know I keep talking about marketing.

I don't know why that's in my brain today, but I'm really struggling to get traction on social media. Um, then that tells, you know, that then I am gonna be like, oh, well, are you. Like, what, where do you see the problem happening or why do you feel like you're not getting traction? And, and then I know five people I can connect that person with, and I've gotten a sense of their personality and I have, you know, a sense of what they do.

So, um, that, that is all, like, that really encourages a meaningful conversation and, and a pretty quick solution based conversation because typically if you're running into a problem, either somebody else has had that problem or they know somewhere a resource or a person that can be that solution. Um, and then usually it's something fun, um, like what's your favorite cocktail trivia item?

Um, like a group of wombats is called a wisdom, um, because everybody has their funny fact that they love to share. And um, and it's just like a fun little way to kind of get to know each other, and it's a way to remember that person. So, um, the other thing is always have a, like a Google Doc or some sort of document with your links in it, because if you're allowed to share them, You want to be able to share like your contact information or whatever.

Um, just have it, it's better to like have that available so that you can then continue the conversation with that person because that's how you do that virtually. It's like your business card. Um, but not, 

Jonathan Green: Oh, that's really great. I think that's a really great technique. Some of those I'm familiar with, some of those I'm not.

So I think that's gonna be really great for people because a lot of it is, There's this fear breaking the ice, and I see two people that both want to talk to each other and both afraid to bother the other person. They go, oh, they just wanna be left alone. Nobody comes to a networking event to be left alone.

So I think that's really, really great. So where can people find more about what you're doing? More about your process and more about the types of events that you're running so they can kind of get involved with the amazing things you're doing? 

Sara Alepin: Uh, so you can find us online over at districtbliss.com. Um, and we host virtual and in person stuff.

So, um, it's super fun and really lovely people. Uh, and then if you're looking to find us in social media, we're at District Bliss events. 

Jonathan Green: That's amazing. Thank you so much for being here. This has been an amazing episode. I know a lot of people are gonna love it and a lot of people are gonna start going to your event.

So thank you so much for being here today. 

Sara Alepin: Thanks for having me. 

Jonathan Green: I hope you love today's episode. I appreciate you listening. When I started my online business, I thought I could go completely alone. Turns out connections is the name of the game, and the faster you build contacts, the faster your income grows.

Let me accelerate your success and help you earn that networking black belt absolutely free at servenomaster.com/blackbelt. 

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