Keep Coming Back Podcast
We bring the AA Speaker to the microphone to record their story of recovery, creating “Speaker Tapes” for this generation. Website: KeepComingBack.net
Keep Coming Back Podcast
vol 15. Sobriety Date 1/7/2004 (Andrew)
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Andrew shares his Experience, Strength and Hope; from growing up in Silicon Valley and working at Apple to homelessness, with grand mal seizures sprinkled throughout, Andrew finds himself having a spiritual experience that's one of a kind -- and has been sober since.
Quotes
"I remember the feeling of shame, but also the desperation that I had to have a drink; there was nothing else more important."
"I was the most stubborn guy, and that's no way to live, 'cause it will make you drink."
I like to believe that God speaks through us and that what is supposed to come out is exactly what probably you need to hear, but also what others listening need to hear. Right. So I have heard you share for journaling this morning, writing about my day. And I don't know how long I've known you, but I think it's been at least six years.
SPEAKER_01The first time I met you, I think um Hen Henry was in the oven still.
SPEAKER_00Okay.
SPEAKER_01How old is he now?
SPEAKER_00He'll be five in January.
SPEAKER_01So you were probably I don't know, you were showing a little bit, is what I remember.
SPEAKER_00So 2014.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_01So I was right. Yeah. It's been five or six years ago. Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_00Well, I'm so glad that you're here, Andrew. I'm going to have you start with your name again and your sobriety date. My name is Tara, I'm an alcoholic. We're here to listen to your experience, strength, and hope. While you share your story, I will remain quiet. And then when you're done, I'll ask a couple questions and you can have your Saturday back.
SPEAKER_01Oh, okay. All right. Nothing more important than this.
SPEAKER_00I agree. So whenever you're ready.
SPEAKER_01Um my name is Andrew W. I am a professional alcoholic. Wink wink, not not. Uh my sobriety date is um January 7th, 2004. So coming up here on 16 years, and it feels more like I don't know, 50 years. Um not because it's bad, but because it's been great and I've enjoyed every moment of my sobriety over the past almost 16 years. So my experience um was uh pretty normal, I think, in the beginning of my alcoholic days. Uh I experimented with drinking uh with friends, the parents were gone. So we would sneak and um make what's called a suicide, which is basically just grab everything you could and throw it in a cup and then see how long it took you to get a buzz and then throw up. And I was probably about 15, so that's 1985. And I remember being very sick and thinking I'm never gonna do that again, and then two weeks later we were we were trying it again. So most of my experience uh I would say was pretty normal in high school. Uh I grew up in the Bay Area in Silicon Valley, and um I grew up in a place where most of my friends, their parents were executives at some of the top businesses, um, Apple, uh, Intel, HP, uh things like that. And so the kids that I grew up around were uh pushed in school and were basically um a high achiever with high achiever parents, even though I was born into a family where my parents were uh divorced when I was three, and um my dad passed away when I was eight years old. Uh even though my parents were divorced, it still was quite a shock and quite a loss. So um I think looking back, the the inability to deal with my dad's death is what caused a lot of anxiety in me and uh spurned my attraction to drinking because, well, I didn't have to think about it, among other things. So um getting back to being 15 um and being normal, I would say, is uh I drank like every other kid, I think, where I grew up. On the weekends, we would hunt for parties and and drink and try and you know um have fun and and and just do do the normal things that uh young teenage boys would do. Um and then as I got older, um I started to have more uh periods of uh missing things. Like uh I was a big U2, the band fan. And in 1987, they came to the Cow Palace, and I'd never had peppermint schnapps before, so I proceeded with the normal beers, uh, eight beers this time, and peppermint schnapps though, and uh I proceeded to miss the entire concert, my favorite band. And uh my friends would make fun of me, and I actually ended up in Rock Med at the Cow Palace, and I remember talking to this African American lady, and I was telling her how messed up society was and that racism was wrong, and all this, and she said she was she was very nice, you know. She'd heard it all before, I'm sure, from every drunk she'd ever been around. Excuse me. But um, you know, she made sure I was okay until my friend showed up, and then my friends had to carry me out. And uh, you know, I got a t-shirt uh from the concert, that's all I remember. And um that uh for whatever reason that stuck with me, that I would go so far to drink uh at 17 years old that I would miss my favorite concert. Um, but it still didn't dawn on me that, hey, there's an issue, this seems very normal. So this kind of behavior continued uh throughout high school and then into the college years. Um I would uh drink in college uh to blackout um and uh not remember, and then you know, a couple days later I would get up and I would be able to run three miles and lift weights and do all the things that a young guy could do. So, hey, you know, there's no physical harm here, and I'm going to a good school. So um ended up graduating and uh coming back up to the Bay Area to uh start my life, I guess, as a working guy. And um, but the patterns would still continue, go out on the weekends with friends and drink and not remember, and this continued until uh I was 26. And uh prior to that many times there were blackouts and I'd miss things and uh just uh nothing really that I considered uh abnormal. Um abnormal. And uh my one of my um greatest regrets though is uh I actually dated a gal uh during this time that ended up passing away, and I never really told her how much I loved her because I was mostly drunk at the time. So um that passing actually of that girlfriend, even though we had broken up at the time, coincided with the anniversary of my dad's passing, and I think that's kind of where I I just felt like lost. Like, what is the point? There's no point. Um I didn't uh despite growing up in with a Midwestern grandparent set that drug me to Baptist church every Sunday, and a mom that had me baptized in England or the Anglican church, all of this religious stuff was uh just a bunch of crap to me. Um it was an excuse to manipulate and um you know make people believe in Santa Claus and and things like that. So there really wasn't an option for me to think, hey God, can you help me? Um it was more about my wits, my intelligence, and hey man, I graduated from college, smart dude, I can figure this all out. And the more that I relied on this philosophy, the more isolated I became. Um and luckily or unluckily for me, when I was 26, I met this gal who lo and behold, she was an alcoholic too. And as I've come to learn, you know, we we find each other. I got friends in low places, so uh and we found each other um and we were able to continue our drinking careers as well as our you know our work careers um not so well. Um I was working for Apple Computer at the time, and I just remember um being 26, 27, going out with this gal, and uh she had a house, and we were able to just you know get loaded every weekend and it turned into every night. And pretty soon, um about 27 years of age, I started waking up at 5 o'clock in the morning, going to the freezer where we kept the vodka, and having to have um tons of vodka uh just to get myself started in the morning so I wouldn't shake. And uh remember the feeling of shame, but also the feeling of desperation that I had to have a drink. There was nothing else that was more important. And I just kept thinking, you know, I've had a really good life, I've had some bad things that have happened to me, but you know, I have my wits about me, um, I have my degree, um, I'm driven, I'm motive, I know I'm intelligent. So these these counter what I thought were counterthoughts of, you know, no, I'm not. I don't have a drinking problem. I look at all the things that I have, um, slowly started to fade because the obsession was it was on, and it was on bad. Um there was nothing that uh it was almost like I was a heroin addict in my mind because I had to have this level of alcohol in my system. I would shake and I would have a fever, I would get the DTs, and when I was working one day, um I didn't know that this could happen, but I had a grandma seizure at work uh from alcohol withdrawals, and I must have missed my morning routine of vodka because my body just lost it. So I would say I was a morning drinker um seven days a week uh from the time I was about 27 till the seizure when I was about twenty nine. And uh this was about 1999, and my my first reaction was when I woke up in the hospital because they'd gone in, the ambulance had gone in with a gurney through the entire building in Apple, uh, put me on the gurney, I don't remember any of this, and took me to the El Communal Hospital in Mountain View, and I woke up and they told me I had a grand mall seizure from alcohol withdrawals, handed me a bunch of paper on alcoholism, and I just looked at it and went, yeah, right. I have a problem with drinking. Um even still, it just did not dawn on me that my body was starting to um say, no, you can't do this, not at this level. Um, a pint of vodka in a couple hours was like, okay, that's easy. So it went from fun, fun and a problem, to nothing but a problem over about a two-year period. And the fact that I was able to live with this gal and uh continue to drink because she condoned it, looked the other way. Her family were um alcoholics. Um my friends had suspicions, my family had suspicions, but nobody ever said anything. I was able to just sort of hide in in this house and and work. Um but at uh a certain point um after I'd gotten out of the hospital and gone back to work, um, I would go out at lunchtime and I would have a water bottle and I would drink what looked to be water, but it was full of vodka. And that was just to stop the shakes and um the tremors. And um once uh once I got back into the building, I thought a ton of uh altoids would would solve that problem. It didn't. Um I remember I had a boss at the time who said, Hey man, uh I lived through the 60s, uh, I know what you're doing. And I looked at him like, what the hell you 60s? That was like acid, and I don't know. I'm I'm drinking. And but he said he what he meant was, I know you have a problem, and if you don't go seek help, I'm gonna have to let you go. Well, I'm like, I don't have a problem. So I just figured out, hey, um, I'm gonna keep drinking. Well, I got fired. And um, if you want financial pain, this is pre-iPod, not iPad, but pod. Apple shares were like $10, they went up to $120 about two years later, and I lost all of that. So I would have been financially set for a long time because I had been given a number of shares, those were all gone. So um after I lost my job, um I basically went home and just drank for the next year um under the guise that yes, I'm looking for a job. Uh pretty soon, even the alcoholic that I lived with got tired of that and uh I got booted. So I ended up being homeless at this point. I'd probably had two or three more seizures and um didn't care. I was gonna I was gonna die. That's basically where I was at. Uh couldn't live without the drink. Uh the shame of losing jobs, of losing girls, friends, houses, cars, um didn't change me at all. Um I my mom tried her best to do what she thought was the right thing, and that was to put me in a sober home. And I'd made it a couple of times, about two or three months, but I ended up drinking again, and the the you know, the obsession was still there. Um about 2003, uh so from tw 1997 to 2003, um, I I don't know how much alcohol I drank. Um, I was also using uh methamphetamines to make sure that I could drink for longer, and I was hanging out with people that dealt. Um how I ended up there, I have no idea. Um it's strange, the the bedfellas you make when you travel the low-life universe. But I was living in my car, and um I remember having one last drink, and it was wine of all things. And driving my car, and this is uh the 7th of January, 2004. Uh, I don't remember anything about 2002 or 2003. Um I just spent the whole time drunk. I don't even know where I lived and what I did. Um I as I said, I was uh driving my car and I had one more grandma seizure. This time I was doing approximately 65 miles per hour on Highway 2880 in San Jose, and my car flew off the freeway, hit a sound wall, and went down a ravine into a tributary of the Guadalupe River. Um I know this because I Google earthed it and looked and figured out where I was at. I have a scar on my thumb from um getting out of the car and climbing a chain link fence. Umestly, uh I should have been dead from the 10 grandma seizures I had before, uh, but I wasn't. And then this time all I had was a burn on the end of my big old nose from the airbag that uh burned me when uh my face hit the steering wheel. Uh thank God for airbags. Um I just remember walking out of that and you know, I cut my hand, my nose, um, but I I somehow something hit me at that particular moment. And like I said, I I was raised with religion and and all this stuff. Uh reject it wholeheartedly. Uh my college teaching is about critical thinking and um scientific method, and but my being was overwhelmed by this feeling of love all of a sudden, right after a car accident, and I'm walking out. This love that I felt or sensed hit me from behind as I was walking out of this ravine, and I just I remember this because again, critical method, critical thinking, scientific method uh d it was gone. And this feeling of love hit me, and it was my grandfather, who was my father's father, who had partially raised me. He didn't say his name, and I didn't see him, I just knew it was him. And I'm like, whoa. And I knew this is what heaven is when you pass, you're gonna meet your ancestors, and if you're lucky, they love you. And it was like my guardian angel came out of somewhere, and I didn't believe in any of this stuff, right? But it's not like I had to believe at that particular moment. I just understood there's more going on, that I don't have to fight like this, and that it's gonna be okay. Just go ahead, live your life. It was this gentle, loving feeling and voice that just took me. And I don't know why it was from behind, but it was like love and light shot through me from the back to the front, and I could see a few of my other ancestors, I don't quite know who they were, but I just had this feeling that your ancestors are watching you. And this life is just uh a little blip on the radar. So once for whatever reason that clicked in my silly, over-critical thinking brain, and I allowed the feeling of love to hit me, um, it was it changed me instantly, and I was done with drinking. And I know no one else that has this story. I I know there are people who have the burning bush, whatever, but I've never heard this story, and I've been sober for 16 years and been to hundreds of meetings. What that means, uh, it just means that the answer will come to us uh in individualistic ways because that's what we need. If you're listening. And by no means do you have to take it to the extreme like I did, and park your car into a sound wall at 65 uh to get the memo. Um but I did. That was my thing. So anyway, long story short, I was done. And I instantly uh talked to my mom, told her I was done. She didn't believe me, nobody believed me. I said, put me in a sober home. She did. Um and thankfully, um I was just uh for me, being humble was uh like an oxymoron. It was, you know, I was athletic, I was intelligent, I know how to do that, but then there was also this tremendous insecurity that was also this huge ego, and all of that was gone. And I just said, what do I need to do? So I listened to the the person that ran the halfway house. Um I hung out with people that were just like me, had issues, and were struggling to get it. And I remember I went to this one meeting where I met my sponsor, and I was still very sick and recovering, and I my head was down, and I heard his voice, and his voice was like, Hey, and it was this English voice. My mom's from from England, and this guy was from Manchester, and it was like another angel. Um he just he was funny, he was cool, he wasn't pushy, he wasn't a book Nazi, he wasn't gonna, eh. He's like, oh hey, mate, I've got four years. Eh, this is what I did, and why don't you work on your humility and acceptance that this is what it is? I'm like, all right, so uh my whole mantra for two years from the my sobriety date, the 7th of January 2004, was um just shut up and listen, Drew. Just be quiet and and and don't let your ego get in the way, because that's what's been screwing you up the whole time. You know, you need to be humble and figure out what's next, and it's not in your brain, it's gonna come to you. So I basically felt like an infant and um grew up to about six or seven years of age uh for those first two years. Uh literally, my soul and my you know, intellect and all that was very much retarded because of how I grew up and um what I thought was right and wrong and what I think I can do and all wrong. And uh the lesson that my sobriety period taught me is always acceptance and humility. Those are the cornerstones of what gets me to where I need to be, which is humble. Um and when I'm humble, I'm able to listen to others, be there for others, and also be useful to a higher power or for me it's my grandfather um because that's what it it that's what morphs for me uh instead of a god instead of this all powerful dude that sits in the sky um not into the whole you know I I think God could very well be a female um that's just the way I work so um but for me the my my mentor and uh the graceful human being that is my grandfather is the thing that that leads my spirit now so my story is normal and totally abnormal crazy um I still don't know how I lived why I lived some days even 16 years in almost I you know I have all of the promises that have come true I have a wonderful wife I have an awesome nine year old daughter uh who is a pain in the butt and I don't mind because that's life and I'm given this opportunity to struggle and be a dad struggle and be a husband and you know I I've had three or four jobs over the past five years and none of that is the employer's fault that I'm moved on. It it's still me trying to find me in even in sobriety if the obsession's gone the miracles have happened all these things you have a home house awesome car what I you know life still shows up and so all of the things that I didn't practice when I was 15 16 17 20 21 25 I still have to get right and for me it it's not getting those things right because that's gonna give me the career I want it's I get to be a better friend a better person a better human I get to step back from the craziness that that I see others get involved with and figure out how I can be helpful. And that's really what I think this life is all about. And for whatever reason we as humans have struggled to we make it about us but really it's not it it's about all of us. And that's where this love thing that I this gift that I was given this tiny moment of time where I was shown hey there's way more going on here dude you need to just chill out was uh was what uh unlocked my you know my fears my anxieties my whatever it was that was wanting me to drink to to to not deal with life went away and now life shows up and I'm like okay this sucks but it's not that bad um what what can I do? And a lot of times I don't have the answer and I'll just have to wait like uh just and wait for the answer to come. My if I could pick anything about this program that works and has worked for me is there's so many practical tools that you can apply to any situation and so it appeals to my logical side but there's this whole mystical love side that that I didn't want to believe in and um but I do now and I am the most I was the most stubborn guy and um that's no way to live because it'll make you drink so um my experience was crazy um got me here my strength is um that I'm a banana in the bunch and I know it now and I like it and my hope is that I can um inspire others to not have to take it as far as I did and if they have recognize that um it's okay no matter what you did it'll be okay start from ground zero and work your way back up I did and uh the promises do come true thank you Andrew what do you say to the alcoholic that is out there suffering in silence being fat drunk and stupid is no way to live your life boy or girl uh no sorry animal house um you know there's nothing that uh anybody could have said to me to to change me so I don't think there's anything that I can tell someone that's still suffering. Um I mean it really is no way to live but when you don't know any other way and you know the the rottenness in your brain is uh telling you that that drinking is the only answer there's nothing anybody can do no one's gonna save you. Um what you have to do is if you can stop drinking for a little bit and allow a little bit of normalcy to sink in and then you you need to go to meetings and absorb because it's like there's this blackout anytime you drink the message is not going to get through um if you give yourself two or three days and you're sober a little bit go to a meeting some of those things will sink in uh believe it or not um and you will be in a place where others see that you're still suffering and they may not be able to help you right away but if you just keep going it's almost like going to the gym you're 500 pounds overweight go ah you know I went and I only lost a pound well keep going you'll lose two the next time and before you know it if you get a month 30 days of sobriety uh wow I lost 400 it it really does happen like that. You just have to keep going.
SPEAKER_00It's like anything in life you have to keep practicing and you can't do it if you're drunk that's an awesome analogy that works for me it's the piece about some of it will get in but not if you're not sober. And we have somebody coming to our meeting actually that has been coming having a drink and I didn't know how to handle that situation and I said I suggested to him just try coming sober once because of the same sentiment that you just related to is you there's this block when there's alcohol in your system and I think that your spiritual program is a lot similar to mine than I realized because I don't know that you bring it up that much when you share on Saturday morning but the moment where you talk about being agnostic and how that made you isolate more really resonated with me because the when I went to grad school you were dumb if you believed in God the the circle I was in and so I became agnostic by pure intelligence around me that knew so much. They were all smarter than me. How did I get there? All of that I actually came out of a blackout once during a grad school class talking to the entire class but this is not my story this is your story. So I related to the agnostic piece. I've always sensed that so don't don't you know I intelligence has nothing to do it intelligence makes it worse in fact when it comes to the program intelligence definitely there's that expression where we save a lot of dumb people and lose a lot of smart people or that's maybe I'm gonna have to cut that out. That's not very nice. Because we overanalyze it and that's not true for smart or dumb it's just the intellect like you had it gets in the way it gets in the way we want to analyze everything we want to understand we want to track it back we want to basically overanalyze it.
SPEAKER_01But intellect or not it it there's no your s all of our souls have equal value. Uh why some are more intelligent than others it is whatever. That's for another debate another time but yeah it in terms of overthinking yeah um the agnostic part was uh just anger from me that why has my dad been taken away? Um why has my girlfriend been taken away? Fuck you, I'm done. Screw this um come on God get me. It was like a dare well he did get me or it did get me. She did get me uh it just didn't get me in the way that I was expecting because God and this higher power thing they're not anger they're not this crazy Catholic you know whip yourself and confess It's love. That's what is out that's what God and the higher power really is and and we're all part of it and it's just that's cool. It's very love thy neighbor the whole if you look at each religion though they're get rid of all what man has done to it. The core of it is love. Jesus our buddy his birthday's coming up is my buddy we should all be like him he it it's a metaphor for love.
SPEAKER_00Hello right yeah so and grace and forgiveness and I'm not here to save the good people I'm here to save those that need me. That's my favorite part.
SPEAKER_01Being a banana in the bunch it sounds like I just have to be like eh but really what it means is um and I don't want this to sound cocky but you're a little more advanced in that your spirit is resonating more with the universe and you have this energy that is given off and more of us the universe needs more of us to move towards that love and get away from all this whatever the heck is going on in this day and age. Um because what's going on right now is just all about um short-term self-interest and me, me and um very basic child needs and the adults the ones with the the spirit and the love in them we need to that's why we I believe we were drunks is is we needed to wake up and move forward and and we're supposed to carry these other spirits who are still suffering forward. It's just what we're supposed to do.
SPEAKER_00That is how the program is designed and I believe that in my core I just want to be of service and AA is designed in a way where our type can do just that and it's just this very cleverly designed program for living and you had mentioned it made you a better friend a better person a better human the tools are so applicable in everyday life you mentioned all these things so for AA is a place where we get sober but it's also we're a place where we learn how to be the best version of ourselves. You know it's my opportunity to be what I was meant to be. And I did not know your story. I mean you had mentioned 2002 2003 that you don't really remember much and you were living in a car. Yeah and homeless shelter too I did not realize that it's a perfect example of fun becoming fun with a problem to being just a problem. And now you describe your life you with your wife and your daughter and you just sent me a picture of you in Hawaii.
SPEAKER_01Yeah I know right it's my 50th birthday and I'm in Hawaii I'm swimming with a turtle a giant turtle that swims underneath me and I thought it was a tiger shark and I freaked out and my d my daughter's like nah dad it's a turtle chill out I'm like oh yeah um yeah I could have never imagined that moment I could have never imagined making it to 35 let alone fifty um the amount of damage that I did um I mean I I was was definitely done with this lifetime and trying to kill myself um and for whatever reason um it's not about me for sure uh I was brought back from the prank and I lived like that for two years um in a car in a homeless shelter um you know the homeless shelter everybody's like yeah we need more homeless shelters well they're not the best places in the world I had all my stuff ripped off um people tried to assault me uh there's just not nice people there um and I don't care if you went to college I don't care if you have those you know those nice clothes you're here just like I I mean it was just you know but hey you know so what if I'm in a homeless shelter so what if I'm in a car? You know I can still drink because I got this is these people at American Express gave me a fifty thousand dollar limit on my credit card. How stupid are they? So if I pay the minimum I mean so um thank you credit card companies for extending my alcoholic career but the party ended got you here yeah I did and um you know the rooms where I met you that the particular room where we met is um a rare room indeed um traveled many of the hallways in in the Bay Area and met many uh you know people that are doctors and lawyers in Stanford and um this place uh is by far um the room where we met one of the most advanced places I've ever ran into other human beings and they're not people that I would normally hang out with.
SPEAKER_00I wouldn't even like go to the voting polls with them but we're all here for the same reason which is you know to try and get ourselves right and then help others and wow wouldn't that be a great philosophy for this country right now it is a really magical room it's my tribe and when people are seeking a home group or seeking some comfort it's the 90 and 90 that got me to that room it was just keep going until you find your people and I I'm geographically nothing like anyone in that room. I'm a different gender than most of the people the women are my age or you know perhaps they're a couple years older me their children are a bit older so similarities are the struggle with alcohol that we once had the recovery that we have now the desire to become a better person that's what I find is the best in that room where everyone is seeking most everyone is seeking to become except for who did you picture who did you picture in your head a guy that won't be named okay I wanted to uh strangle him a few times I have no idea who you're talking about auto water no anyhow I'm uh two more things two more things so again not my story your story however after we turn off recording I gotta tell you about the Bush concert that I ended up in the first day the entire concert could not walk down the steps to get to my seat and I was 16.
SPEAKER_01Yeah so that's a that's a fun story. But the better story is uh I went to see uh Def Leopard uh two years ago uh similar experience where I was drunk and I missed the whole show in 1988 uh in 2016 I was able to watch the whole show and watch all the other people fall down the stairs and get drunk and go thank god that's not me and oh my god these guys are 60 years old and they're still damn good and and to to feel the music to hear it sober what an awesome experience. Who do you could go and you should go to a concert sober you don't need to get stoned and you don't need to drink because actually the music's better.
SPEAKER_00Anyway that's my editorial on I agree I feel like everything is better sober but when I was drinking I thought if I thought if we're gonna have fun let's really have fun. So we're gonna have a Christmas party let's raise it up a notch and it was that constant if some is good and more is better. If some is good and we just had Stuart on before you and Stuart was telling me to slow down with the recordings of this because I'm so what's that?
SPEAKER_01No Stuart Stuart was a guy that never slowed down sorry I know I'm well enough to say that but yeah.
SPEAKER_00Well that's probably why you can recognize it. Yeah he's like how many do you need to do a month I just can't do it at all if I can't do five a month I can't do it. But recordings of this of this show. Right yeah so but my original goal was one a month and then suddenly it's three a month and uh but Stuart uh what was I talking about Stuart for uh his his uh past he was telling you to slow down yes yeah I don't know how that relates to anything he's a very influential guy apparently we needed to talk about Stuart.
SPEAKER_01Yeah he's he's uh he's a character um but he's got the ability to uh speak the truth like I wish I could so there you go yes and he's just as crazy as we are which is beautiful it's true and it it's detraction not promotion um and our lives still show up I mean you have kids I have kids and we have relationships and it's not like oh my god I'm perfect now and I'm gonna be perfect in every single moment drive down the street and I'm I'm you know a Neanderthal again so um i you don't have to be perfect at everything all the time uh it's just an awareness that we're doing more uh we're supposed to be doing more uh it's more than just us and there will be times when you're given an opportunity to take advantage of that and push push us forward pull us forward I don't know what it is sometimes it's both yeah I know sometimes it's crawling forward but I think that everyone has a purpose they just need to find what their purpose is and for me keep coming back and doing this spending my entire Saturday recording these back to back yeah is like Disneyland for me. Yeah and I love it. Well I I've I've often thought you're too hard on yourself and oh my god Stuart said the same thing yeah because I an hour ago you know ah or you say ah I'm a bitch in this situation it's like I don't you know maybe you are sometimes and you just don't show it here whatever I'm a dick sometimes too and I don't really show here my point is uh you're smarter than you give yourself credit for and you're wiser than you give yourself credit for and there's more going on with you and this is I mean you're inspiring to me because dude you're going for it like this is cool not just because I get to talk into a microphone.
SPEAKER_00We do like talking about ourselves though. Yeah that's the hardest part of keep coming back is keeping me out of it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah I don't but that's how we also get healthy. That's true. Because you gotta be able to talk about yourself. We go nuts staying inside our heads but no the It's dangerous. You know you got a lot going on um and I think your career is boring to you quite honestly but you have to do it. But this is more interesting to you and I think you should follow your passion. I I mean I see you writing notes prodigiously as you've done since the beginning and y these podcasts whatever you need to write a book and not because I think more people should do this but you have the idea and the gumption to go ahead and do it. So keep keep going on it and um follow it because I think this kind of visceral stuff is what's gonna change people.
SPEAKER_00Um thank you welcome I'm very grateful for your time and all of the ego feeding that you did for me.
SPEAKER_01It's not though it's the truth.
SPEAKER_00Well I appreciate it.
SPEAKER_01Well that that's yeah that's why I need to get into a different career. I I just I see people and I see things and it needs to be said more often than not.
SPEAKER_00So um you had mentioned I know we were we were just wrapping up and here I am not wrapping up because you had mentioned years ago about wanting to be a drug and alcohol counselor and I've just been waiting for you to make that decision on your own but I think it might be time. Yeah I and Stuart was just talking about how he sold everything and he went back to school and I think it's Andrew's turn.
SPEAKER_01Yeah I don't sell everything. No no my wife wouldn't let it let me um I you know I've gravitated back towards that because again I my job went away and like I don't know about a month ago this latest job that I had and honestly I sit there and I'm doing this job and it's it's mindless and they're paying me money and then I have to deal with some Nimrod psychosis that is trying to pretend like this job is more important than her mental state of being and I'm just like trying to okay I get it it's a job and then but then I'm trying to counsel this person and they don't appreciate it.
SPEAKER_00Right. And you can counsel where it's appreciated. So Fred is recording at three o'clock today you I've talked to him I think it's time.
SPEAKER_01Yeah well I've gone to school a little bit for it. I know what I can do but I've spoken my you're right. See here the critical thinking brain is not accepting what the universe is telling me right in front of my face so um I appreciate that and um I appreciate what you've done here um I I think you know there's no telling what you're gonna do if you just keep going on this because you know um I don't know keep coming back.
SPEAKER_00Yeah well because it works for more information read the first one hundred and sixty four pages of the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous or visit keepcoming back dot net