Modern Burning Bushes

Some conversations don’t fit in neat categories, and that’s exactly the point. We sit down with author, professor, and former technology executive Dr. Setrag Koshafian to talk about what happens when a lifelong pursuit of mathematics, computer science, and philosophy doesn’t dissolve faith, but sharpens it. His journey moves from agnosticism and mocking Christians to a grounded commitment to Jesus Christ, and he shares what finally broke through intellectually and personally. 

From Moses noticing a “strange sight” in Exodus, we ask a provocative question: what are the modern burning bushes we keep walking past? That takes us into topics many Christians aren’t sure how to handle, from UFO claims and coming disclosure conversations to the deeper issue underneath them: spiritual discernment in a world full of noise. We also explore how the drive to live forever shows up in new forms, including AI, transhumanism, brain tech, and the cultural hunger to redefine reality on our own terms. 

We go there on science and faith too, including why Dr. Koshafian thinks compartmentalizing is a mistake and why emerging technologies like quantum computing raise questions that are not only technical but theological. Along the way, we talk revivals, the Trinity, why certain biblical passages are rarely preached, and why end times teaching should ultimately lead to hope, not fear, because God’s kingdom ends with a new heaven and a new earth. 

If you enjoy Christian apologetics, faith and science, and clear thinking about culture and technology, you’ll want to hear this one. Subscribe, share this with a friend who loves big questions, and leave a review so more listeners can find the show. Find Setrag's books here: https://amzn.to/3RsK9xO

Transcript

A Life Spent Seeking Truth

SPEAKER_00 0:00

Happens when a lifelong pursuit of science, mathematics, and philosophy leads not away from God, but directly to him. Today, author, professor, and former technology executive, Dr. Sitram Koshafian joins us to share his remarkable journey from intellectual searching to Christian faith and the experiences that inspired his 21st Century Burning Bushes series. You won't want to miss this thought-provoking conversation.

SPEAKER_01 0:29

Well, hello and welcome to the show. Thank you so much for joining me.

SPEAKER_04 0:33

Great to be here, Elsa, and uh I'm very glad we are doing this today.

SPEAKER_01 0:38

I am too. I'm really excited for this topic and to hear your insights and your story because it's really um it's especially compelling to me. I I love I love big question askers, and and that is that is what you are. Um, you actually spent a lifetime asking some of life's biggest questions, right? And those, of course, led to you writing this uh incredible three-volume series, 21st century burning bushes. Um, and in this series, you you have science, philosophy, uh, personal experience, and uh, of course, biblical faith that all intersect um in some really, really fascinating ways. So um clearly you are someone who was genuinely searching for truth, right? Um, tell me a little bit more about what that search looked like for you.

SPEAKER_04 1:36

Yeah, that's very interesting because even uh the last few years of my high school, I even organized a group of people where we were searching for truth. I was very hungry searching for truth. What is the meaning of life and looked at different types of philosophies? I wanted to major in philosophy, ended up majoring in mathematics and computer science. Um, and I came to the United States, did a PhD in computer science. Uh, but I've been always fascinated uh with uh not only the moral and spiritual aspect of faith, but also the intellectual. And uh I was very inquisitive, and I had uh certain experiences. Um, we can get into them. Uh, one of them is uh when I was a young man, very young, uh, I saw a UFO, and that raised a question in me what was this? So uh it's been going on this a very strange phenomenon. I was not a Christian there, I was a very young, 12 years old, uh, but it raised a question in my mind, and this was right, and uh, you know, fast forward to the 21st century to this year, there are congressional hearings on UFOs. Yes, and what is uh that is strange, and the question uh I had is is the church paying attention? Are Christian paying attention? It's a very strange thing. Uh if you don't mind, I will give you uh very briefly the inspiration.

UFOs And A Strange Sight

SPEAKER_04 3:20

Please do where the title came. Yeah, so it it it just hit me one day. I was reading Exodus 3, 1 to 3, and uh Moses was herding his sheep. So if you like, uh he's he was doing his regular thing, his choice um for his father-in-law, he was herding sheep, and he saw a strange sight, it says so in the Bible. And uh many times we hear God called Moses. Well, not exactly, it was Moses who saw the strange sight. God didn't say, Hey, Mo, come over here. No, he saw the strange sight and said, Let me go over there and see what this thing is about, because the bush is burning, but it's not being consumed. And when he went, the rest is history, and so the question came, it just hit me. Are there burning bushes now today in the 21st century that we are not paying attention? We're saying we're busy, everybody's busy, right? Right, right, and so I started with with few topics, the usual culprit like UFOs and so on. But then I said, No, wait a minute, even Jesus Christ, the people have towards him, or the Bible, or revivals, or supernatural, or science. I mean, that's I mean, look, I've written these three books. I'm writing the fourth, by the way, volume on the end times and wonders. It will cover many, many topics, including the return of our Lord Jesus Christ. But um, when I started, there were few topics, it ended up being 25 topics. Volume three is on science and technology, right? Artificial intelligence. Sure. Who would have thought the revolution we are experiencing with artificial intelligence? But there is also volume three on morality, on the walk culture. Who would have thought? This is a strange thing, we should turn around and find out what it's about, that people are not sure they're male or female.

SPEAKER_01 5:40

Right. Who who would have thought, right? I mean, you yeah, who could have imagined that these would be real conversations we'd be having with a serious face?

SPEAKER_04 5:56

I can go and on, so let me stop. There is a lot. Okay.

SPEAKER_01 6:00

Yeah, I you know, yeah, can we just sit and talk for like the next 10 hours, please? I wouldn't do that to you. I wouldn't do that to you. Um, but there are, you know, you're so right. And there's so many elements that that you are covering and addressing here, and they are all interconnected. And it's it's a matter of like finding the how and the why and the who makes them all connected. And it is truly fascinating. And I just have to quickly go back and just say, wow, and the fact that you were a teenager and and instead of just being out being a hooligan and and looking for trouble, like most of us teenagers maybe were, um, you were asking these really big questions and and just having these profound thoughts and you know, the experiences, of course, that you have. And, you know, it's funny when you mentioned the UFO, there was a time, not even that long ago, that if you said that in certain company, they'd be like, Oh, he's crazy. And now nobody bats an eye, they're like, Oh, you saw UFO. Yeah, you know, and nobody's surprised because we we know we know differently now that, you know, and and how um how vain of us to think that we could possibly be the only life out there, right? Like there's just so we're not that big, we're not nearly as big as we think we are. Um was there a question? I'm curious, was there a question in your philosophy, your philosophical um studies, was there a question that um that nobody seemed to be able to answer? Like, do you have a question out there that's still nagging at you?

SPEAKER_04 7:44

Not so much nagging, but uh the fact that we're not as smart as we think we are, okay? A lot of things are not figured out, and it's more like what uh what is the end game? These are very complicated topics, by the way. The topics I'm challenging I'm treating in my books are very sophisticated topics, and uh there is uh really this dynamics between, for lack of a better name, two kingdoms.

Two Kingdoms And Modern Temptations

SPEAKER_04 8:21

And it has many, many nuances. You know, uh we think of Christianity as a religion, Christianity is not a religion, right? Jesus never declared I'm gonna establish a religion, He came to establish and proclaim his kingdom, and that is that starts with repentance, but uh contrasting that kingdom, there is another kingdom, and there has been this struggle going on between these two kingdoms. I'm talking about the serpent, the original temptation, and it's it's really uh so fascinating that the uh the earliest temptation, eat this fruit, your eyes will open and you will be like gods. Well, in one of the chapters of uh volume two, I deal with transhumanism and and look what we're doing to achieve this godhood within us. I mean, there are some really crazy, like CRISPR chips implanted in your brain, or downloading your soul to a robot so you can live forever. There's so many things, these are all burning pushes. It goes back, it's connecting, goes back to the initial uh temptation, be like gods, and uh and it's all over, it's in in the secret societies, for example. Involunty, I deal with the new age and secret societies. New age is almost like the religion of secret societies, uh, the deep state, as people talking. Uh, what are they? How are these connected with the nefarious entity who tempted uh Eve and Adam? How are they connected? How are, as you were saying, the dots are connected.

SPEAKER_01 10:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 10:20

So those are the things that keep me away from you.

SPEAKER_01 10:24

Yeah, absolutely. And you know, and it is, I think people shy away from thinking about these things because they are so big, because the implications, once you start, you know, they call them the rabbit holes, right? Once you start going down the rabbit holes, um, it's almost impossible to stop and you can't sleep at night because that's what you're thinking about. So that's kind of what you go through, right? Because your your mind is is just working in such a big way. Um, you know, because again, right from the beginning, we mentioned philosophy and you know, math and and all of these things that people think are can't be in the same room, essentially, you know, Christianity and science, and you know, that's such a misconception, right? I mean, they are truly very married, right?

SPEAKER_04 11:19

I am so glad you brought that up because we as Christians, as humans, secular people compartmentalize, you know, like we have the scientific world, we have the political world, we have the you know, religious world, we have the social, the morality, we compartmentalize. Right, that's not reality, they're all connected, everything is connected.

Quantum Physics And Spiritual Reality

SPEAKER_04 11:47

Uh, so everything from cosmology, uh, I mean, look at how it's impacting us, the recent advances in science, especially in artificial intelligence, as I mentioned, there is another tsunami that is coming, and that is quantum computing and quantum physics, and the marriage of artificial intelligence with quantum. Quantum happens to be uh very uh, for lack of a better name, uh, Christian, in the sense that there are aspects of quantum that are reflected in the word of God. For example, in quantum, you have the notion of entanglement. So two particles could be entangled, and you impact one, it impacts the other faster than the speed of light. There could be millions of miles away from each other. Nothing travels faster than the speed of light, but the two particles are entangled. Well, you read the Bible, it says what you earth is bound in heaven, what you lose on earth, it's loosened in heaven, so they're entangled. So that's an aspect of entanglement, one example that is in prayer. There's so many other aspects, even the physics of it, the duality, the right can be mess and waves, it's all in the Bible, and so uh that's a burning bush that we ignored, so that quantum physics and the spiritual life are not decoupled, they are one and uh all part of the same universe that our wonderful creator has created.

SPEAKER_01 13:32

Um yeah, it's so it's it's just so fascinating to listen to you explain this. Like the the image that comes to mind is almost like a mirror, like it's just there's all these mirrors that are just reflecting on on each other, essentially. Uh it's just so wild. I'm so curious about your Christianity journey because that was not your original, that's not your upbringing, correct?

From Agnostic To Christian Faith

SPEAKER_04 14:02

Well, I I am traditionally an Armenian apostolic Orthodox. Okay, yeah, but I you know I did, I was an agnostic. Sure. I even made fun of Christians. So uh, but there came a time that um, you know, uh a number of intellectuals have uh said this there is a God-shaped vacuum in our hearts that only God can fill. So even though I was fighting, I was reading philosophers, uh try even Eastern religions, etc., that emptiness was there until I uh there was a guy who was a PhD in philosophy. I always liked philosophy. So uh I wanted to uh go there and disrupt the meeting and basically give him a piece of my mind and tell him, Are you crazy? You're so educated philosopher, and you're a Christian, you know. I I wanted to make fun of him. But he gave at first meeting, he gave his, this was like an evangelistic meeting, he gave his testimony and it touched my heart how he came to faith. And after a couple of meetings, I gave my life to Christ, I accepted him as my savior, and uh it's been an incredible journey ever since. Uh, I know inside my heart uh it's the truth. You know, we we talk about the Trinity. Here's another thing we talk about the Trinity, which is amazing itself, by the way. It's it the Trinity itself is a burning bush. Um, and the God of the I'm sorry, explain that a little bit, if you will. Yeah, because it's so strange. You know, it's so strange because there are three personalities and one God. There are three distinct personalities, but God is one. That's not easy to understand, right? And other uh religions like Islam, I've studied Islam, some I witnessed to Muslims and have seen them come to Christ. By the way, uh sidetrack, I do that sometimes.

SPEAKER_01 16:12

That's okay, I love it. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 16:15

You're so kind. Um, many Muslims are coming to Christ because Christ is appearing to them through dreams.

SPEAKER_01 16:22

I've read that, yes.

SPEAKER_04 16:24

Okay, many, many, and and and I've known this. Uh going back to the thing, so they will um accuse uh Christians of worshiping different gods, right? So so because it's not easy to understand, right? They're one. My father and I are one, but they're distinct, right? The baptism of Jesus, right? The Father speaks, Jesus is there, the Holy Spirit comes as a doll. So so they're distinct, but they're one, so that is so so deep. And we humans are a trinity, we have spirit, soul, and body. This is all in my book, by the way. And the soul itself is trinity. We have mind, emotions, and will. Now, our spirit is the most important because when we accept Christ, the Holy Spirit comes into us and we become alive. And the rest of our lives, things don't get easy.

SPEAKER_01 17:26

No, they sure don't. The rest of our lives are luckily, nobody ever said that it would be easy, so that's being delusional if you thought it was going to be right. Go on, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_04 17:41

So, the rest of our lives, we like to mature so that we let the Holy Spirit guide our soul, and then through that, our bodies. You know, you mentioned something very interesting, and I was paying close attention to it. Uh, these are big topics, you know, that many people do not uh like to address, but then again, it's the most important topic. You know, you see all these monuments and buildings people have built so that they can live forever through these monuments, right? Yeah, through these statues or whatever they do, through contributions, they have their names on a plaque, whatever, you know. Right. You know, if you miss this, if if you miss the one choice you should make in accepting Christ and having eternity, you miss everything. So, yes, it's a big topic, but it's the most important topic.

SPEAKER_01 18:39

It truly is. And I think you know, it's you know, like we said, it's it's the one topic that people probably are simultaneously running from and running toward all the time. Like there's that that push and pull, I think, you know, to conform to the world or to go where your heart is really telling you. And I love when you said um a a God-sized hole in in your heart. And I I think that is what all of humanity who is has not accepted Christ, um, that's what they're living with. And and the proof of it, correct me if I'm wrong, the proof of it is in the seeking of surface pleasures, you know, joy, topical, uh, you know, pleasures of the world, essentially, and constantly being dissatisfied. And all we have to do is look around to see the proof of it. And then when I get the incredible opportunity to speak with someone like you who has found the source of joy, um, it exudes from you, it literally pours off of you. And and that's what everybody is seeking. So I just, you know, that the mean girl in me just wants to shake everyone and say, look, it's right here. It's right here. You got it right in front of you, the answer. Um, I know I'm simplifying so much. Um, and especially to somebody who's, you know, spent decades learning and studying this. And and I do love that you explain these, these things so fully in your in your books. And it's just incredible.

Turning Big Questions Into Books

SPEAKER_01 20:23

Can I ask you, like, was it did the process of writing these books, or is the process of writing these books, is it difficult? Because there's gotta be so much that you want to put in there. Do you ever feel overwhelmed by it?

SPEAKER_04 20:41

Excellent question. Thank you for asking that. Yes, I have. And uh two things I want to mention. Now, number one, there are so many burning bushes, you know, all around us. They're all around us. Uh, and I've categorized them into spiritual burning bushes, where I speak about our Lord Jesus Christ, the word of God, revivals. The history of Christianity is the history of revivals. And thank God revivals are happening, and then supernatural manifestations, supernatural gifts. God gave me at least one, uh, and and this is another uh very interesting trend. And then volume two is about science, about uh digital technology, artificial intelligence, quantum mechanics, uh, crypto, bitcoin, cryptocurrency, uh, digital currency, the human body, transhumanism, and technology-driven doomsday scenarios. That's volume two, and volume three is is about culture, society, morality. I start with walk. Walk is so irrational for me, I cannot uh understand. I gave you an example like uh, are you a man or a woman? It's that's difficult to figure it out.

SPEAKER_01 21:56

You know, it shouldn't be a difficult question to answer.

SPEAKER_04 22:01

It's just amazing. And then uh, but also other trends like New Age and secret societies, uh, and uh you know, all these things that um you know, and and then eventually uh I also dedicated a chapter uh to Christian hypocrisy and apostasy, because many people are avoiding uh you know Christianity because of the behavior of some Christians, right? And I'll give examples. In fact, after volume three, uh nobody's gonna like me because I I expose all denominations. I mean, yeah, that's awesome.

SPEAKER_01 22:43

I think listen, that's my favorite kind of person right there that you know speaks the truth even when people don't want to hear it. So I love that.

SPEAKER_04 22:51

Uh uh absolutely. I mean, uh there is one way. Look how how society is trying to tell you, you have your truth, I am my truth, etc. Jesus didn't give us our choice that choice. He said, I am the way, the truth, and life. Nobody comes to the father except through me. That is very controversial, you know, because it's all resistance.

SPEAKER_01 23:18

My absolute favorite, yeah. Yes. Uh I'm just I'm so captivated by this. I I can't even tell you. And you know, God knew what he was doing when he gave you an analytical, scientific, mathematical mind, because I would imagine that had to be like one of the only ways you were able to keep this all from being a big messy ball of yarn in your head, and and to be able to put these structured in a way that you know people could read these books in in a way that makes it organized, like makes it understandable and not not overwhelming. Um, so absolutely brilliant in doing this the way that you've done it. So I'm personally very excited to read these books, by the way. I'm like before I might even, if you see me kind of looking down like this, it's because I'm ordering them on Amazon right now. No, you're so welcome. And I would be remiss to not mention that you are actually a very prolific author. You have a whole other authorship life. Um, please go ahead and and give a little mention to to that work as well, because that's also very fascinating.

SPEAKER_04 24:34

Yeah, I I mean, uh my father was a writer, uh I'm a writer, I love to write because as you mentioned, writing forces to go you to go deeper and and organize uh the thoughts. So that's if if I were to say I have a gift, that's it. Um, and I'm using it for his glory. But before that, in computer science, um, I've written, authored and co-authored about 10 books. And in two areas that I've dedicated a chapter on digital technology and digital transformation. My latest uh book in that domain uh is on digital transformation, and I speak about culture, the culture of transformation. It's it's so fascinating that uh the malaise that we see in governments, we also see in large organizations.

SPEAKER_03 25:25

Sure.

SPEAKER_04 25:26

And and and so so there they I've written 10 books. Um uh my specialty, I've been in two areas. Uh I don't want to get too technical.

SPEAKER_01 25:37

Yeah, I won't be able to follow it, I can tell you right now.

SPEAKER_04 25:41

Uh one is intelligent databases and the other intelligent business process management. Um, so I I've gone very deep into this, and I've a lot of publications I've worked on. Uh, I should also mention um that uh two things. Number one, I stand on the shoulder of giants. These giants are authors who have taught me uh uh and I reference them. Uh so so a lot of uh my inspiration is from other Christian

The Topics Churches Avoid

SPEAKER_04 26:12

authors. Early on in my Christian walk, I loved Francis Schaeffer.

SPEAKER_01 26:18

You knew I was gonna ask you who your favorite was. Thank you.

SPEAKER_04 26:21

I love that. He's amazing. Also, C.S. Lewis, but more recently, authors who have focused on UFOs and this, what are called fringe uh Christian topics. You know, the Christian topics are like a bell curve. Sorry for the mathematical there is the frequency of topics that you find on YouTube and people talk about it very frequent. But there are these other topics, the fringe on the sides, that many Christians uh don't touch. Uh many Christians and uh churches are not ready with the disclosure of the UFO that is coming. It's an extremely complicated topics, uh topic, and it's related to the megalithic structures that we see, but it's also related to secret societies, age, you know, demonic uh trends, they're all related to one another.

SPEAKER_01 27:23

You know, it's funny that you said that because I've had this sense that because it's always like hint, I feel like it's always hinted at that there's this connection, but nobody ever talks about it. Why is that? Are people afraid to talk about it? Are they uh because they don't want to look like they're crazy, or is it something bigger than than that, that people are not ready to talk about this in in that type of depth?

SPEAKER_04 27:51

Excellent question. So, because many times, like if you ask Christians or pastors and so on, priests, uh they they focus, they say, let's talk just about Jesus. But Jesus talked about these things. For example, Jesus says, said, as in the days of Noah. Uh you might even ask the question, uh, why did uh the flood happen? Okay, there this is a very powerful burning bush. I mean, why did God kill all these people? Well, one answer, and I I tell you, nobody has all the answers. By the way, again, let me sidetrack. Uh I will come back to this. Uh, the um the book, every chapter has a QR code. Okay, and you scan the QR code, it will take you to a web page. And and that web page has sometimes often additional material. I'm trying to keep them up to date. So, um, you know, in one of your earlier questions, you know, uh, there is so much material, I cannot put it just in the book. Sure, this is a live book, so it it extends.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

And I what a smart, smart way to do that. I love that because I am that person, like I'll I'll pick out one thing and I'll be like, oh, wait, I need to know more about that, and then I'm going so and it's right there. You just do the QR code and it you can get. I love that. Yeah, amazing.

SPEAKER_04 29:22

Yeah, absolutely. And and going back to the to the Noah, that you know, why did uh God uh uh do the flood and only eight people were saved? Well, one theory that I believe in is that Noah was the only one who has who was genetically pure because of the corruption of the Nephilim. Again, okay, like take Genesis 6, for example, and it talks about the sons of God finding uh coming down and finding the ladies, the humans uh ladies attractive and taking wives for themselves, and their children were the Nephilim and the giants. You don't see sermons about this.

SPEAKER_01 30:08

No, never, ever. Ever.

SPEAKER_04 30:12

But it's in the Bible, and and uh and there are interpretations, you know. Some people say the sons of God are uh the children of Seth, you know, Adam's uh you know child, of the Adam's born. Uh well, uh sons of God, whenever it's used in the Bible, means angels, with one exception. If you look at the genealogy of uh humanity, because son of, son of, son of, son of, until it comes to Adam, son of God. Adam was the only one who was uh born directly from God, created by God. So were the angels directly by God. We became daughters and sons of God because uh you know, when we accept Christ, we get adopted, you know. And by the way, I tell you, I find uh women uh much more closer to God than most men I know, they're much more open in my relationship.

SPEAKER_01 31:11

I agree with you, you know.

SPEAKER_04 31:12

I don't know why, but they're much more open.

SPEAKER_01 31:15

It is interesting. I do agree with you that that it seems harder for men, yeah.

SPEAKER_04 31:19

And God honored that, you know, the the women went to the tomb and saw the angel and Jesus was uh resurrected. So yeah, so we can, I mean, we can go on the there.

SPEAKER_01 31:32

Oh my goodness, we could. I know. Let okay, all right. Let me redirect us here.

End Times Hope And Next Steps

SPEAKER_01 31:36

I'm sorry, that was my bad. Um, so there are so let me just recap for for our audience. There are three books available right now in the series. You are working on the fourth one. Do you know the release date for that one yet? Or is it still in progress?

SPEAKER_04 31:51

Still in progress. I am hoping end of this year, Q1 next year, because it's uh end times and and wonders. So I'm gonna talk about the coming. Uh you know, uh, it's uh let me leave this with you and with your authors. The last chapter is about uh the new earth and the new heaven. God is gonna completely redo uh it's a mess, so it's a new earth, but it leads to that. So I deal with burning bushes. Uh, you know, the last uh chapter of volume three is about the kingdom of God, it's a very important uh chapter because I talk about the failure that we've had as humanity. Uh we've made a mess of things, and it's getting worse, by the way. Signs I I'm seeing it's it's amazing. The moral collapse, the look at the wars and rumors of wars, etc. But I wanted to finish in a positive note that God has a kingdom. That was the last chapter of volume three. The last chapter of volume four, it deals with UFOs, it deals with megalithic uh structures, uh, it it deals with uh end times, the different interpretations of the book of Revelation, isn't our wonderful starts with Genesis, ends with Revelation, uh, so and and then the the new heaven and the new earth. There is no heaven and earth, all these separations, it's all about separations, right? Yeah, the sickness is all about separations, of separation in human relationships, separation between countries, separation between us and God, they're all gonna collapse and we're gonna be with free will. We're not gonna be robots with free will in perpetual joy in the presence of God. So that's where we're going to.

SPEAKER_01 33:46

That is the most beautiful thing to close this out with. And and what a wonderful message, because the tendency, natural, understandable tendency, is for us to feel fearful. You know, we talk about end times, that sounds terrifying. But when you're a Christian and you know what's on the other side of all of this, it's you know, there there is a peace that you cannot even describe uh with any due justice, right? It's just a totally different kind of piece. You still have frustrations, you still get aggravated, you still get mad, you still do all the things that everybody else does. Um, but there is something so much deeper inside of you with that knowledge in your heart. So I love that you close this out on this.

Where To Find The Series

SPEAKER_01 34:34

Will you do me the the favor of telling everyone where they can find your books and where they can find you, uh, website, if you have any uh book signing events, any anything you want to share with them?

SPEAKER_04 34:47

Absolutely. Thank you very much. You can find the books on Amazon, Barnes and Noble, everywhere. Uh, and on Amazon, uh, just put 21st century burning bushes or uh my name. Maybe you can, you know, if when you're sharing this, you can put the URLs. Uh it's there. You can also go to burningbushes.org, burningbushes.org, and that's my website, and there are links to the books where you can buy them. And and uh that that leads you from burningbushes.org to all the other uh books, volumes, and I have, as I said, a web page. I try to keep them updated after I finish uh the fourth volume. I'm gonna dedicate myself to this, you know. Um, I I'm hoping the Lord will not return before I finish volume four because I've put a lot of work, but he is of course we want him to come.

SPEAKER_01 35:46

Lord, let him finish, please. I totally understand that. Uh, this has been such a treasure for me. I I can't thank you enough for spending some time with me. I honestly, we could have gone down every single different path, and and I just would have picked your brain all day long. So um thank you for indulging me every time that I did. Uh this is is just wonderful. Uh, yes, to everyone watching and listening. The uh links for everything will be in the show notes. You'll be able to click right on them, get right to those books. I will be going right to them after we're finished here. Uh and again, thank you so much for joining me.

SPEAKER_04 36:31

God bless you and may his face shine upon you. Thank you very much.

SPEAKER_01 36:35

Thank you, you as well. Take care, guys. We will see you in the next episode. Bye-bye.

Final Thanks And Closing

SPEAKER_00 36:41

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