The RedRum Podcast
Join Captain and Wilson as they enjoy an adult beverage or two and review the good, the bad, and the ugly of horror films!
The RedRum Podcast
Annihilation
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
Send us your movie recommendations!
Captain and Wilson are back this week to discuss the 2018 cosmic horror film, "Annihilation," directed by Alex Garland. It stars Natalie Portman, Jennifer Jason Leigh, Gina Rodriguez, Tessa Thompson, Tuva Novotny, and Oscar Isaac.
Cold Open And Recent Watches
WilsonDoes my voice sound back to normal? You said it's not a odd earlier. Raspbi. Raspi.
CaptainYeah, I think you just needed to stretch them.
WilsonActually talk today.
CaptainYeah. How are we doing?
WilsonDoing pretty good.
CaptainDoing great.
WilsonWhat's going over there?
CaptainDoing good. Doing good. It's Fryay.
WilsonFry Yay.
CaptainUm, I did finally see Begonia. Really good.
WilsonA very good movie.
CaptainYeah. I kind of knew what to expect, but I was not a not not all of it.
WilsonI had like no expectations for that movie. I basically went in blind.
CaptainOh, I like knew what it was about.
WilsonOh.
CaptainLike, oh, you didn't even know that?
WilsonMm-mm.
CaptainYeah, I mean, I guess I'm watching it like, what, a year late?
WilsonUh I don't know when it came out.
CaptainDidn't it get a nom at something?
WilsonIt was. I think it was nominated for Best Picture. This like the Oscars that just happened.
CaptainOh, okay. It says 2025. Yeah. So that would have been the ones that just happened. Oh, it's not that late. It was October. I thought it was later than that. Or earlier than that.
WilsonUm Well, now I'm like, I hope I didn't get that wrong for what it was nominated for. It was something featured. Maybe it was Actress. I don't know. Uh yes, it was best. Oh. Uh it was nominated for Best Picture, Best Actress, Best Adapted Screenplay, and Best Original Score. Didn't get any of them.
CaptainNobs are fine though. Like that's that's enough. Yeah. Um Yeah, like I I I knew vaguely what the movie's about that people think this high executive or something is an alien, but um dude, like the execution of how that played out, so good.
WilsonIt was very good.
CaptainLike, and as it goes on, you're like you almost get a hint and where you're like, is this is this real? And then and then and then when they like re Oh my gosh, so good. Um I don't know, you rem remember the details of the movie. Like specific, I don't know. Did you watch it like when it came out?
WilsonYes, but I okay I feel like I remember most of it.
CaptainOkay, so at towards the end where um so that guy shoots himself, was not expecting that. The one cousin. Oh, yes, yeah, was not expecting that, but then she gets free basically, um, and then you see her frantically running um back to that um calculator that she has to like input like some big code into.
WilsonYeah.
CaptainOkay. So when we were watching it, when Jane and I were watching it, like it basically during that run of her going back to her office and getting that thing, you're like, you know, oh, like wow, she really is an alien, right? Okay, but the scene the scene goes where she grabs calculator, she goes into the closet, and then she gets booted up back to her. Um, it's like the last 10 minutes, she gets like booted up back to her people, and they're like, oh yeah, earth shit, like we should just annihilate, like just um, not worth it. All the products we were doing to try to like, what was it like save the planet or bring the planet back or something, right? Something like that. Anyway. Um weird connection to the movie we're about to talk about. Um but anyway, um, okay, we're watching the movie, and the scene comes where she's going back to her office, she's like bloody, she's like dirty, um, like she's just been in this basement for like five days. Um, or maybe not that long, but she's nasty. Um the office uh is like currently a crime scene, right? Because they were just there with the other guy and there was a the bomb that went off on his chest. And she's running in there barefoot and she reaches down to the calculator, like she doesn't touch it yet, but she like reaches for it, and the movie that we're watching, it cuts, and we were like, like, but then this Pablo came up that was like playback error. But dude, that as the ending to the movie was like incredible because we were like, like it was like obvious enough that she was reaching for that tool, yeah, but she doesn't actually end up touching it.
WilsonUh-huh.
CaptainAnd we were like, oh, that's like such a good ending.
WilsonWow.
CaptainAnd then the movie keeps going, and like the rest of it, it's like, you know, she's in her alien ship, and like it's not, it's like just kind of like the resolution of being like, yeah, let's get off Earth. But I was like, honestly, the other ending was better.
WilsonLike that actually sounds pretty good.
CaptainIt was we were both like, like, um so in a weird way, it was almost like, damn, there's more movie left. But um, but I mean it was still really good. It was just like, did we just like stumble upon like an incredible ending that no one thought about?
WilsonSeems like you kinda did, but yeah, I don't know.
CaptainI was just like, wow, what a cool way to end it. Like what a like definitive enough, but like, you know. Um but anyway, it was fine. Like the rest of the movie, the the last 10 minutes were fine, but it was just it was still a good movie. It was just funny the way that it the way that it played out.
WilsonI'll have to tell Finn about that. He'll get a kick out of it.
CaptainYeah, it it was like really good. Like that that like reach but not touch. Um it was like spot on. Um the movie still costs money to rent, so I can't even like tell you to like go to the specific time. I'm not gonna like rent it for six dollars again, but but um whenever it becomes free, maybe. Yeah. Um yes.
Undertone And Podcast Prep Humor
CaptainOh, and then you saw a movie that I also saw.
WilsonYes, Undertone, which I was very excited to see based on trailers that I had seen.
CaptainIt was very meta in the beginning. I was like, welcome to the podcast.
WilsonI know it was like it was actually interesting seeing how many things that we do. Like, I'm not saying we're special or anything. I'm sure a lot of people do that, but I had never seen a like a podcast prep of anyone else. Like, you know, you and I don't say like, let's get in the character, but like a lot of the other stuff that they were saying, um, in terms of like the prep, I was like, okay, that's like exactly what we talk about.
CaptainYeah, it was cool how they yeah, they take a lot of breaks.
WilsonUm Yeah, I was like, they talked for like two minutes and they're like, Um actually done, it's it's late. I was like, what?
CaptainI'm like, get that done, girl.
WilsonYeah, so you started at 3 a.m. Yeah, that was I don't know.
CaptainSo did you like the movie? I think we ended up giving it the same rating on here, too.
WilsonUm, you gave it a half a star more. I it wasn't bad. I was a little let down. The movie I thought was just fine.
CaptainYeah, it was fine. I I am a little I was confused by okay, so like there's like this thing that comes after your child, right? But like why did it come after her mom? Or right? Yeah, that part I don't I like didn't fully understand that part. But I mean for like just generally like kind of spooky, it was good.
WilsonMaybe it was like coming after her end, like the main character as the daughter, and then also going after her baby. Yeah. Like, since she's also like a baby, well not really, but like I mean, she was pregnant in the movie, but like very, very early.
CaptainBut I it was like it seemed like it was coming after her mom. And I was like, okay, but her mom's her mom, but her I mean her mom was in a childlike state where she needed constant care. Um But it was I I do like the scenes of the her of like you know, it focuses on the main character and like her bedridden mom is all of a sudden like standing watching her from a corner like that.
WilsonAnd I liked all the wide shots of like you saw the rest of the room and you were just staring to see like what's gonna pop up, yeah, what's gonna show up, but like nothing ever really did.
CaptainYeah, it's a strange movie to um there's like only two humans that ever are on camera, which is interesting. Yeah. Like it's you know, she's saying she's making it like this doctor's appointment or her, you know, the mom's caretaker, you know, she's like talking to them, but like you don't ever actually see the other humans, which is a more like um yeah, like alienating. Like it puts you in a weird space.
WilsonSo Yeah, this movie had to be like five dollars to make.
CaptainIt's all voiceover work and then just the one main dude. When for the mom's uh character, I was like, easiest job in the world, dude. I sleep in a bed, that's all I do.
WilsonThat's like Sadie Sink in like the last season of Stranger Things.
CaptainYeah, she just like I'll take my check for my eight hours of being in this bed.
WilsonUm this movie was fifty, or sorry, five hundred thousand dollars. That's what it was to make. So far, the box office is already 9.3 million.
CaptainI was gonna say, you're gonna hit that easy on a box office.
WilsonYeah.
CaptainUm, yeah. I mean it it was fine. It was good. Like, I I feel like, you know, if someone was looking for just kind of like an ooky spooky little, you know. I would say someone who um doesn't love horror movies but will deal with them, like that one girl we went to college with, like, I feel like this would be a really funny movie to watch with her because she'd be she'd be like screaming, but it wouldn't be that scary.
WilsonI forgot about that. Yeah.
CaptainUm, very fun. Um, but anyway, yeah. Uh it was good.
Upcoming Movies And App Talk
CaptainYeah. You you said you already have tickets to Project Tail Mary. Holy shit, that has good reviews.
WilsonYeah.
unknownYeah.
WilsonDamn. Yeah, I'm I'm excited.
CaptainYeah, I'm looking at Rotten Tomatoes right now. Oh, did you see Hoppers? Amazing.
WilsonNo, but I did see like I did see it's doing very well. I I think I I might have mentioned on the podcast before, but we're somehow never in a rush to see animated movies, and then we see them like a couple years later, and like, wow, that was so good. Like we finally just saw all the Paddington movies.
CaptainSir.
WilsonPaddington 3 or Paddington, Peru, was like it was okay.
CaptainOkay, but Paddington 2 Oscar Academy Award. All of them. Um, yeah, really good. Um, okay, but Hoppers, um, how do you change your top four again? Because it's going in here.
WilsonOh, um, I think if you're looking at your profile in the top right, is there like a little like rant rant?
CaptainThere's a settings.
WilsonUh oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
CaptainIt's in, yep, it's that's where it is. Um wow, you were like knew that immediately.
WilsonWell, I was cheating just because I feel like in apps, if you go to your profile, it's almost always in the top right or the top left to like go to settings.
CaptainMine top four now is like two bright yellow movies. I don't know if you can see.
WilsonBright yellow. Oh, yeah.
CaptainUm, yeah, I would highly recommend. If you're gonna ever be in a rush to see any animated movie, it's gonna be that one.
WilsonDamn. Alright, alright, alright.
CaptainIt was really good. It was really good. And I we saw the trailer for Toy Story 5 during that movie, during the you know, beginning.
WilsonYou know, I didn't I don't need another Toy Story, but I'm obviously gonna watch it.
CaptainYeah, I'm gonna what? I'm definitely gonna watch it. Didn't we just realize that guys like the voice of Slinky?
WilsonJim Barney from Troll Month.
CaptainYeah, from Troll Month. Um Yeah. Well, I'll probably maybe I'll get tickets. I don't know. Like you said, I'm kind of busy.
WilsonYeah, well. You had time for hoppers, so and undertone.
CaptainThat is true. That is true. We'll see.
WilsonWe'll see. Uh all right. Do you want to hop in?
CaptainYes.
WilsonDo you want to bring us in?
Welcome And Why Annihilation
CaptainYes. Okay. Welcome to the 189th episode of the Red Rem podcast, where we review horror movies while enjoying an adult beverage or two. And I'm Captain.
WilsonAnd I'm Wilson.
CaptainAnd this week we're reviewing the 2018 sci-fi cosmic horror film Annihilation.
Alex Garland Career Snapshot
CaptainI have never had to spell this word this many times in my fucking life.
WilsonBut I definitely know how to spell it now.
CaptainI had to write this so many times in preparation. Um it was directed by Alex Garland and loosely based off of a 2014 novel by Jeff Vandermeer. Um Garland is a screenwriter, film, and TV director. He rose to prominence with his novel The Beach. Um screenwriter? I don't know. Um, he received praise for writing the Danny Boyle film 28 days later. Oh, wait, we just did that. And 28 years later.
WilsonWell, we didn't just do that. We did that like nine years ago.
CaptainSorry. I mean, I just watched the Oh, oh, okay. What was that one called?
WilsonUh 28 Years Later, Bone Temple. Wait.
CaptainOh, this is not Bone Temple.
WilsonYeah, he didn't think.
CaptainOh, he did Sunshine, which is like one of the best.
WilsonIt's in my top four.
CaptainHmm. Um, as well as Never Let Me Go and Dread. His directoral debut when he wrote and directed Ex Machina.
WilsonDid we do that for the I don't think, but I've seen it.
CaptainI like recently saw it for the first time, like six months ago.
WilsonHmm.
CaptainUm, he earned an Academy Award Nom Best Original Screenplay and won three British Independent Film Awards, including Best Screenplay, Best Director, Best British Okay, whatever. Oh. So yeah, he did it well for his first movie in 2014, and then, you know, um kept making them. Wait, 28 Days Later is the first one. We did do that. That was episode two.
WilsonI think so.
CaptainYeah. Okay. Okay.
WilsonOr at least very close around that time frame. I don't yeah.
CaptainI know what episode one was, and it was not this. Okay.
WilsonAre we doing that again this year or is that next year?
CaptainOh. I had to check the least. Maybe. Actually, it should be this year. Yeah, I didn't I didn't put that in there, but I certainly can for 200.
Cast Picks And Familiar Faces
CaptainUm, okay, so fuck ten of famous people in here. Uh we have the main character, Nile Portman, who plays Lena. Um, she's in View for Vendetta, one of your faves. Is that in your top four?
WilsonNo, but it's close.
CaptainBlack Swan, in which she won an Academy Award. She also was prominent for her Jane Foster role in the Thor movies in the Marvel Universe. Um, and oh, that's made her one of the world's highest paid actresses, the Marvel Universe stuff.
WilsonShe's also in Star Wars.
CaptainOh, yeah. I it's not. I wouldn't say I'm like the biggest fan.
unknownDamn.
CaptainI'm not of her, of Star Wars.
WilsonWell, no, that I mean that that's true. I think I knew that.
CaptainShe's fine. I always mix her up with the other lady.
WilsonKira Knightley?
CaptainYeah.
WilsonYeah.
CaptainBut I didn't do it this time because I didn't say she was in Pirates. Um okay. Dr. Ventris. I always do that. It's played by Jennifer Jason Lee. Um who was Ventress again? Oh, I yeah, yeah. I know who that is. Yeah, she was in The Fast Times at Ridgemont High, and she also was in Atypical as the Mom. So I watched all of that show. There's like four seasons on Netflix, and then she also was in the fifth season of Fargo. What do you know her from? Do you recognize her?
WilsonAnytime I see her face, all I think of is weeds because she played Nancy Batwin's sister. That was the first time I saw her. So it's like all I think about.
CaptainYeah, that's fair. She also has a very particular like voice slash facial combo.
WilsonYeah, she's like always just like frowning, and then she um Yes.
CaptainGood frown.
WilsonShe I wouldn't call it a vocal fry, but it's always like um how would you describe that? Yeah, there's like a depressed like tone to her voice.
CaptainYeah, it's like almost nasally, but not like uh nasely. It's like it's like a different kind of space in the throat. I don't really know how to describe that.
WilsonYeah.
CaptainUm yeah. She's good and atypical. She plays a woman that's been through a lot, but then also does a lot of bad things.
WilsonI I feel like she'd play that role very well.
CaptainYes, exactly. Um Gina Rodriguez plays um Anya Thorensine. I don't remember them saying her name in the movie. I just called her the paramedic the whole time. Um but she used in Jane the Virgin. She was the main character in Jane the Virgin. She won a Golden Globe for that. Um great in Jane the Virgin.
WilsonI never saw it, but I heard it gets weird.
CaptainIt does get weird, but it's such a good, it's such a great, like, like a modern um uh what do you call that? Um daytime what do you call that? Like daytime drama, the days of our lives or something like that.
WilsonLike a modern soap opera?
CaptainYeah, like a very modern soap opera.
WilsonYou mean like along the lines of like I would consider a modern soap opera to be like Grey's Anatomy, Scandal, like that type of thing?
CaptainNo, this is a little bit more campy than that.
WilsonOkay.
CaptainUm yeah, like like kind of like that, but bring the camp back in.
WilsonOkay.
unknownOkay.
CaptainBring bring like half the camp back in.
WilsonOkay. That sounds good.
CaptainIt is it is really good. I actually like love that show. I got Jay watching it when I was watching it. Um yeah. And then I was like, what I thought I'd seen her in something else. She was in like um, there's a show called like Dead You're Dead to Me or something, where she plays like a the main character, but she's like dead the whole time or something. Um I was like, oh, was she on Barbie, the Barbie movie? But I was like, nope, that was America Ferrara. Oh um, but anyway, she was really good in Chain the Virgin. Um we have Tessa Thompson who plays Josie Reddick, so she's like a physicist, I think, in this movie. Um she gained her mainstream attention for playing Bianca in the Creed movies. Um she's also Valkyrie in as Valkyrie in the Marvel Cinematic Universe. I don't remember that. In the Thor movies as well. Oh, I probably mostly know her know her for Westworld.
WilsonYeah, she was good in that. Really good in that. Even though I feel like that season, or maybe it was the season before that, kind of was like really bumpy.
CaptainIt it does start going off the rails, yeah. Um we have Oscar Isaac who plays Kane. He was also an ex-Machina. Um he's a superhero in the X-Men Apocalypse movies, but he was mostly known for playing Poe in the Star Wars movies. Oh, is that why you made sure to mention Star Wars?
WilsonUm, no, I didn't even think about that, but yeah.
CaptainOh. And he's in Dune. Oh, yay, and Night, Moon Knight, and then most recently Frankenstein. Did you watch that? The for 2025? I did. Yeah, it was good.
WilsonYeah, it was just really long.
CaptainYeah. I wouldn't say his role, like the more interesting role is um Jacob Wee Lordy's role. Like that was that was more interesting. Um Lomax. Benedict Wong as Lomax. I don't remember who that is in this movie.
WilsonUm, he was someone. Oh, he was talking to her at the end when she came back.
CaptainOh, the guy that's interviewing her.
WilsonYes.
CaptainOkay, yes. He's oh that's right. He's the um the person in Doctor Strange. Wong in Doctor Strange, yes. Oh yeah, and he was recently in Weapons, also.
WilsonYeah.
CaptainUm he's also in Prometheus, Marco Polo. Oh, and he's in the film The Martian. Isn't that done by the same guy that did Project Hell Mary?
WilsonThe writer, yeah.
CaptainYeah. Yeah. Um, and then we have who the hell is Katie in this movie? I don't know.
WilsonAre these just people that showed up in the lab?
CaptainOh, maybe. Well, somebody else that was in Crazy, nope, that was in ex-machina. She was in Crazy Rich Agents, but there's a lot of ex-machina people in here in this movie. Are you looking it up?
WilsonSo I was just clicking on it, but I guess that makes sense with Alex Garland. He might have just like, I like all these people. Let's keep using them.
CaptainDirectors, ever since we've done this podcast, I've noticed that so much now where I'm like, oh, directors are like, I met you in person and you're cool and I want to work with you again. I'm like, damn.
WilsonYeah. I mean, I guess like you know, you know what they can do, and they're good people, so it's like, yeah, hell yeah, reuse them.
CaptainYeah, I didn't realize how much I mean, I guess it's obvious in that industry. It's like how much it's like who you actually know and have met, but it's like interesting to see it when we're actually like analyzing and documenting.
WilsonSome of them are like serial offenders. Some of them just casually do it.
CaptainLike, yeah, some of them the wiki stuff.
WilsonI mean, I'm not complaining. I like the people he picks, but he definitely refuses.
CaptainYes. Has a specific type of person he wants in there. Uh there was that one movie we did where the whole movie was written for Kristen Stewart. Remember that? Uh it wasn't that long ago. She was like uh clairvoyant or something.
WilsonOh, yeah. I forgot.
CaptainAnd the director was like, yeah, I worked with her and I just wanted to work with her so bad I just wrote a movie for her. I was like, Sir, are you good?
WilsonUm seems like people do that a lot, or like at least they'll write parts specifically for people. Um and I always feel bad if they can't get them because I'm like, oh, that sucks.
CaptainYeah, that's pretty bad.
Plot Setup Kane Returns
CaptainUm anyway, so this movie is about um Lena, who is well, I guess it starts out with it's kind of she's kind of under interrogation. We don't really know why, but you kind of get questions being asked towards her, and she implies that like at least one person's dead. But she's basically a science professor. Uh she teaches like biology at a med school or in in during medical school curriculum. Um, and she uh is depressed because her husband's missing. Um she is like I guess she doesn't know she's assuming he's dead basically.
WilsonUm it's been like a year.
CaptainYeah, she hasn't seen him in like uh 12 months, but um, she's having like a depressing moment in her house, um, painting her bedroom and being sad. And then her husband just appears um up their steps. And at first I thought she was so I have seen this movie, but I don't I barely remember like the details. I kind of remember the shimmer, um, but I I didn't remember like any of like the actual plot. Um, but anyway, at first I was like, is she just um hallucinating? But no, he actually shows up and he said he was like on a covert mission somewhere or or he was supposed to be have been on a covert mission, like he told him he told her that before he left, but he said he doesn't remember like how long he's been gone or where he was, and she's getting annoyed that he like vanished for 12 months and then is just like really avoidant, won't won't answer anything. But um, he quickly gets rushed off into an ambulance because he's bleeding. Um, and while she's in the ambulance with him to the hospital, it gets interrupted by like a police escort that like pulls him out, drugs Lena, and then kidnaps her too. And I'm like, I get it if you're like the US Army, but I don't know if you can do that. Like, I don't know. So anyway, she's she wakes up in this facility, um, and she's being asked a bunch of questions about Kane. Like, did he say where he was? You know, did you learn anything about it? Um, this is by Dr. Ventress. Um and she said based on her Lena said based on her like scientific understanding, it's like it's almost like he was exposed to radiation. Um but he must have been exposed to like a lot of radiation, and then that's when Dr. Ventress explains the shimmer um and how like they've it's like this expanding zone that started at this lighthouse off the coast of what was it, Alabama or something?
WilsonSomething like yeah and something around there.
CaptainAnd um, it keeps growing and it basically like anything that goes inside doesn't come back out.
WilsonYeah, did i I might have missed it, but did you say that it was from like a meteor that crashed into the lighthouse?
CaptainOh no.
WilsonLike there something crashed and then the shimmers started to grow.
CaptainYeah, and it's exactly like a shimmer, like it's this like blurry uh zone that just keeps slowly growing over the land. Um so she said everything that goes in doesn't come back out, dot dot dot, except Kane. Um, but he's in like severely like he's in like multiple organ failure. He's not doing well, they can't obviously they can't talk to him. Um so you know, she's basically Dr. Ventures is basically just explaining this to her, like he can't communicate, um, and his he's he's deteriorating. So she again, it doesn't fully make sense why they would bring Lena here. Like they didn't have to bring her here, but whatever. Um, but they don't basically Dr. Bench is like they don't know there's many theories about what this thing is, but they basically have to stop it because it's it keeps growing and it's taking over land. Um and then she quickly meets the other female staff that work there that are about to go on the next mission into the shimmer. So they've sent a bunch of men, I guess, into the shimmer, but they haven't sent women yet. So this is like their next step of trying to figure out how to get how to get more how to understand it and get people to come back out. But um, there's a paramedic, there's Dr. Ventress, there's a physicist, and then somebody studying magnetic fields, whatever that's called.
WilsonIs that the one where it says a geomorphologist?
CaptainOh, sure. Is that what it calls her? Oh yeah.
WilsonWell, there's that word here.
CaptainOh, I see it. Yes. Yeah. Paramedic physicist yeah, geomorphologist Jesus Christ.
WilsonUm this looks more topography related, but uh whatever.
CaptainUh she said magnetic fields. I don't know.
WilsonMaybe she has no idea what she studies.
CaptainMaybe. Um, but anyway, the Lena was like, yeah, I'll join. Nothing else to do.
WilsonShe didn't she doesn't tell them that um her husband was one of the people that went into the shimmer and has returned.
CaptainYeah, the one person that that's happened to, yeah. She Dr. Ventress knows that, but she decides not to tell any of the other women her connection to Kane. That Kane's a little like um a touchy subject right now because some people are like, you know, you know, maybe this is a discovery, like he's returned, but other people are like, why the fuck is this specific person returned? Like, something's up if this person returned and nothing else. No one else and nothing else hoped.
WilsonAnd he was gone for like a year. Oh, right.
CaptainSo he was gone for like a whole 12 months. So people are like, it's touchy. So she doesn't, she just doesn't say anything to them. But um, she basically says, like, yeah, I'll come. I'm a biologist from Johns Hopkins. Um they don't do any extensive background checking. It's like so strange. I'm like, I'm sure you need like a psych eval, like all the all the red tape that they're missing in this movie. I'm like, there'd be so much of it to go on this mission. Like, where's her signing, like the 50-page NDA? Or like no liability? Um I I don't you don't find this out until like later in the movie, but she actually is like ex-Army, like she's the army veteran, so maybe that's why some of that stuff's skipped over. But anyway, they walk in with guns, um, and the next time they're like cognizant of reality, they realize that they've had already been in the shimmer for like three to four days based on how many rations are missing.
Entering The Shimmer Time Missing
WilsonYeah, they like wake up in their tents and they're like the fuck? I don't know what I did for the last three to four days.
CaptainYeah, their tents are made and and they've eaten food, but they have no recollection of it.
WilsonUm, it's like why that happens, and seemingly that doesn't happen again, but maybe it does, because I think at some point when she's being interviewed later, they're like, You've been gone for like two months or something.
CaptainOh, really?
WilsonI think so.
CaptainI don't remember that. But time definitely works differently there. Um so there's also a flashback to Lena uh where she's like seems to be cheating on her husband with that coworker or that colleague. Um there's like a quick flash of that. Like that's her a nightmare she's having that she wakes up from. Um, but it does seem to be real. Um, a real memory. Um, I mean, but he was gone for a year. Like she assumed he was dead.
WilsonI think it was before.
CaptainOh shit, it was before that.
WilsonYes, it was like I think he was still often like deployed or something pretty often. And then I think she had the affair, and I think he chose to do this expedition because he had a like tumultuous thing with his wife.
CaptainYeah, they explain that later on. I forgot that, yes, it was before, yeah. Um, and after. Um but yeah, so they start to explore, um, and because she is the biologist, she's like sees that there's a bunch of um weird like plant growth. Basically, there's like significantly different flowers, but they're all growing from the same vine, which wouldn't make sense in any earth.
WilsonYeah, she's like, you can't you can't do that.
CaptainCan't do it. Um we do find out that uh there's a giant crocodile that attacks one of them. It doesn't kill one of them. No.
WilsonAlmost does yeah, it like eats Tessa Thompson's backpack.
CaptainYes, but she Lena like Natalie Portman's character like gets in army mode and starts brr.
WilsonUm yeah, she knows how to handle a weapon.
CaptainYeah, and that's where you learn that she's ex-military, um, because it's like shocking how well she can shoot things. Anyway, she does explain that she met her husband in the army, which is where she learned to shoot.
WilsonUm and basically still they don't know like she talks about her husband. Yeah.
CaptainThey don't know what's Kane. And then um I they kind of have a conversation about how everybody's like a little fucked up if you came in here.
WilsonUm, like people have to there's a reason you chose this near suicide mission.
CaptainRight, exactly. Um so they find a mess hall where it clearly looks like there was a camp set up from the last people that were in here, um, including Kane. Um, and they have a video camera. They actually it was a SD card that was left out that says for those that follow, like in a bag, and it's um a video of Kane cutting up another cutting open another shoulder, and his intestines are like worming around in his body, like it's cutting, he just slices him open. Um really crazy looking. That's not kind of nasty, not how the human body is supposed to look, yeah. But um based and he says something online of like this is what happens when you are here too long, or something like that. Um so everyone's a little freaked out. Um there's a discussion about like how it seems like it might mess up your DNA. I'm not
DNA Refraction And Weird Biology
Captainreally sure. Um, but they don't really get a long time to think about that or work that out because later that night one of the people gets taken by like some type of bear-ish creature.
WilsonWell, I think before that happens, they Venturous goes to the where that that video was filmed in the mess hall. Oh, right. And they see the remains of the guy's body, and it's basically just like grown and deformed and turned half into like flowers and just like all kinds of fucked up.
CaptainIt looks like where he was cut open, like basically like exp his body like exploded and like a fungus flower thing came out. Yes. That's true. Um, but then Shepard is taken by a bear like creature. Um and she doesn't return. No, she's she's uh yeah, she's gone. Um the other, so two of the people that are there, the paramedic and this physicist, I think, want to turn around, but Dr. Ventress doesn't want to. She's like, We're gonna I'm going to lighthouse, whether you come or not. And Natalie is like kind of the split point, but she basically decides to keep going. She tells them because they've been moving forward, um, it would take six days to turn back around if it took them six days to get here, and it'll be faster if they just get to the lighthouse and they can leave it, leave the shimmer that way. But she does kind of basically say in the interrogation that she was guessing. Yeah. Like she was saying it with confidence during the scene, but she didn't really know that. She was just had nothing to go back home to if Kane wasn't there. Like she already had a sad life without him, so it was gonna couldn't be returned to a sad life without him.
WilsonYeah, and I think this is also around the part where we find out Venturous is basically dying anyway. So like Yeah. Yeah.
CaptainShe says she has terminal cancer, so like she was never planning on necessarily leaving the Shimmer. She just needed for her own personal knowledge to know like what what it was and what was the cause, because it had been, I guess, her main job for however last, you know, whatever time of her life. Um And then I think they oh, yes. There's more discussion about their bodies being like refracted or like DNA being messed with.
WilsonLike the physicist has some weird speech about that, but Yeah, she sees like because they see these plants, these flower plants that have grown into the shapes of humans, and she's like, Yeah, the shimmer is like reflecting DNA, so that's why the plants look like humans, and that's why you have like plant DNA in you or something.
CaptainYeah, she says human hox genes incorporation, something like that. Anyway, the paramedic, Gina Rodriguez's character, sees like a wiggle in her hand and it scares her, like in her palm.
WilsonOh yeah, she was like her fingerprints are constantly moving.
CaptainYeah, so later that night, um, she goes
Paranoia Peaks Then The Bear
Captaincrazy.
WilsonShe loses her cookies, like all of them.
CaptainYeah, the Lena wakes up, like I think the three of them are like tied to a chair, and she Lena uh the paramedic's holding Lena's locket, and in there is a picture of Kane. So she's like, you know, you're a liar. Um, like, who are you? What are you really doing here? She didn't, you know. She thinks something like malicious and above her is going on. Um, she even says, like, you're the only one that saw the bear take her, so like, how do we know it wasn't you that killed her? Um, but um that doesn't go on for long because then the bear comes through.
WilsonWell, because she hears screams that sound like the deceased or supposedly deceased shepherd.
CaptainYeah, it sounds like shepherd screaming help, I think.
WilsonYeah. She immediately runs outside. Next thing we hear is there is a bear sneaking into the house and it's coming up to them strapped in their chairs, and when it like growls, it's may it's like mimicking the dead soldier's screams.
CaptainYeah, it it its vocalization literally sounds like human screams, like those specific people's human screams.
WilsonIt's like freaky.
CaptainYeah, it's really it's it is really freaky. And it's like half it's like partial bear, it's like radiation bear. So it doesn't look like just a regular bear, so it's even scarier. Um so somehow the bear does not come after them because like they don't react to it at all. Um, so they do um I think all all of them get out. Yes. Natalie, Portman's character, yeah. Her, the physicist, and Dr. Ventress are all still alive and they get out. Um, but they are like Ventress basically says, like, uh our bodies are disintegrating, like we basically kind of just have to get to the lighthouse if we want to do anything on this mission. Um but i the world is like getting kind of like wiggly and mushy, so it does seem like they're going through like dementia or hallucinations, like it's not entirely clear like how time and space is working.
WilsonUm but is this I think it's around is it around this time where um yes, where the physicist basically says like I don't want to do this anymore or whatever, and just like goes off and becomes yeah, she's like, I don't want to fight it, I don't want to resist it, I'm gonna basically join it, and she turns into flowers.
CaptainYeah, she just yeah. Um yeah, so Lena's alone now because Ventress went off early in the morning
Ventress Splits Off Toward Lighthouse
Captainwithout them. Like she was like, I'm going to lighthouse, whether you come or not. Yeah. So she's alone now, and um, this is where you get like full understanding that she's like retelling this story to um the guy that's interrogating her. What's her what's his character's name? Lomax. Um, so you're getting like she's explaining that she's retelling. Uh you get more of that scene, basically.
WilsonYeah.
CaptainSo Lena eventually makes it to the lighthouse, right? And um she sees uh a video camera in there and she like in actually inside the lighthouse, and she's watching a tape, and it's her husband, Kane's on the tape, saying, Um, like I can't be here anymore, or I I don't even know what's real. I he said, like, I th I thought I was a man, but now I don't know who I am. I don't know who you are, or something. Like he's talking to the cameraman, um, and he's like, I'm I'm dipping. So he straps himself with like a phosphorus bomb, um yeah, or a phosphorus grenade, and it explodes, and it's like really bright light white. So like the there's like just a white flash on the screen, and then the cameraman comes around the camera and it's Kane. It's another Kane, it's a full duplicate of him. Uh, and Lena's like, nope, no, no, no, no, no. Like she closes the she closes the uh camp quarter that's there.
WilsonBecause that means that her husband that came home at the beginning of the movie is like this doppelganger.
CaptainYeah, definitely not her husband. Um oh, because the guy on camera before he grenades is says, like, if you find Lena, tell her I love her or something. Um and then there's like this black hole that's in the bottom of the lighthouse, so she climbs down there and she finds Ventress is down there. And Ventress says weird stuff like she discovered the origin, but the origin's now inside her, and it will devour everything, like nothing else will remain. Annihilation, which title of the film, name drop.
Kane Tape And Doppelganger Reveal
CaptainAnd then she like projectile vomits, like rocket lights out of her mouth everywhere. I'm not really sure what that was exactly.
WilsonUm but it turns into like a weird, a very pretty, like weird like pulsating pattern that takes one of Lena's blood samples.
CaptainYeah, I was saying it was kind of like a prism like kaleidoscope blob in space. Yeah. And then it pulls one drop of blood from Lena's eye socket or something, and then um morphs into a humanoid-shaped thing. Um, and it's basically mimicking Lena um as she's um moving. Like it's this faceless humanoid thing that's mimicking her movements. Um she is unable to escape this creature because it's like uh yeah, I don't even know how to explain it. It's like she's trying to get out, but every time she moves to like get out of the lighthouse, it like I don't know, follows her and like compresses into her. Yeah, I don't know how you explain that. But anyway, she is really smart and she gets away from it by basically re-igniting this phosphorus bomb in its hand.
WilsonBut it it's like right as it fully turns into basically her.
CaptainOh shit, yeah. Yeah. Like it it I think she actually touches it for the first time, like hand to hand, and it just starts like melding into becoming her entirely, like face and body, and then she was like, phosphorus. Um, and it starts, you know, like catching fire, and then she exits the lighthouse finally. Um and it's like um yeah, basically everything starts to catch fire, like the this humanoid thing is. Like touching stuff as it's as it's ignited, so everything starts catching fire, and she's watching it go up in flames from the outside of the lighthouse. Um it's like a very I'm I can't even explain like the vibe during that like five-minute scene of this humanoid mimicking her is like so creepy, like it's very eerie.
WilsonYes, eerie, uncomfortable. Yeah.
CaptainIt's good, but yeah, but it's it is very scary. Puts you on edge. Yes, puts you on edge. And then um basically, as the lighthouse catches fire, like all the other like shimmery, like um alien type plant stuff starts to die. Like it seems like the lighthouse had a bunch of like uh deep roots underneath it that was connecting it to like other trees and plants. So all of them start dying. And then it goes back to Lena's retelling the story, and the interviewer Lomax is like, okay, so it was alien. And she was like, Yeah, it does seem to be like an intelligent alien life form that made its way to Earth, but she can't really describe it or like what it wants or even why it came here. Um But she's like, I don't even know if I can say that it was malicious. Like she she says like she doesn't think it was here purposely to destroy stuff, but just to make something new. Yeah. Um and it's very clear that as she's saying this, that she has some of the alien DNA mutation in her because she like drinks a glass of water and the water's like goopy when it or like backwashed. It kind of looks like two cells Yeah, splitting or something. And then she gets reunited with Kane and she hugs him, and she's like, What did she say to him? Like, oh so you're alien, or or are you really Cain or Are You Him or something like that? And he doesn't really answer, but then they hug because they're both alien DNA mutate babies together.
WilsonYeah.
CaptainUm so like neither one of them are themselves anymore. Um Yeah, and I think that's basically oh, they hug and their irises start to like uh shimmer and uh like brighten.
WilsonYeah, so they are they're basically like well, there's something new.
CaptainYes, there's something new. That's what I think.
Themes Change Self Destruction Identity
WilsonI heard I heard this movie has a lot of symbolism to just like how people change over time. Or something. Oh. I don't know. Oh something or other.
CaptainMaybe. Probably. I mean, it's based off of a book. The book's probably really good. Is the book called the same name?
WilsonI um I was reading about it, I don't recall. It I it was part of the hot goss, but um Alex Garland, he like he didn't adapt it directly, he s described it as a dream of the novel.
CaptainThat's so artsy. Yeah, so it looks like it does have the same name.
Ratings Box Office And Studio Pressure
CaptainUm so this Hakas and Num Nums here we have so this movie's budget was somewhere between 40 and 55. I guess they're not entirely sure. And the box office was only kind of even that number, like 43.1 million. So didn't really hit the double mark that was looking for, but it does have really good ratings. Is this why didn't I finish this? The Ron Taino says an 88 for critics and for audience. Um why can't I type? Annihilation Jesus. You would think I would know how to spell this perfectly now. Annihilation. Um 88 critics and 67 audience. Oh, that's a little low for audience, I feel like.
WilsonYeah, well, I mean, I guess it seems like critically very well, but it did not the box office was not good. Which I actually didn't know that either, but I mean I didn't see it in theaters, so I mean I think I did. I don't remember.
CaptainApparently it had poor uh test screening, so the financier at Paramount became concerned that it was like too intellectual or too complicated, and they he demanded like changes to make it appeal to a wider audience, including making Natalie Portman's character more sympathetic. Um, and apparently they changed the ending from the actual book. So Oh, sorry, I kept reading. It says that the producer sided with Alex Garland on his desire not to alter the film. Oh, and defended him refusing to to do, like I guess, the final cut of the ending, so maybe they didn't alter the ending of the book or of the movie, the original screenplay.
WilsonSo it probably would have performed better if they listened to the Paramount guy, but I'm glad they didn't.
CaptainI mean the paragraph Paramount Guy is just how much money can we make?
WilsonSo Yeah, and also he is not very popular right now, anyway.
CaptainOh. It's the same dude.
WilsonThe one that's like been on in the news lately. Yeah. David Ellison, yeah, it's the same dude. Oh wow. Just bought um Warner Brothers or whatever.
CaptainYeah.
WilsonYeah.
Warner Brothers And Bachelorette Mess
CaptainHave you seen this is so super unrelated, but I don't even watch The Bachelorette, but have you seen all the crazy stuff about that?
WilsonI just saw headlines that they canceled it because of this domestic violence stuff, and I was like, damn, ABC must be pissed.
CaptainWhat I'm confused about is that so the main, the lady, The Bachelorette, is like from Secret Lives of Mormon Wives, never watched that show either. But uh, she like apparently when you first meet her on that show, she's getting arrested for domestic violence.
WilsonYeah, it's like why did they ever pick her? It was obviously known she was problematic.
CaptainYeah, and like I guess she has probation, but then this video came out about like of the actual event that her boyfriend, I guess, never released to the public until now, and he's releasing it like, you know, to TMZ, like a few days before this season's about to air. Uh it sounds like he's a terrible man too, like, based on what I saw people say about him, but like now they're like not airing her whole season, and it's like millions of dollars down the drain.
WilsonLike they shouldn't air her stuff, but however, I do feel bad for the like everyone else involved with that show that they just like Yeah, they were saying all the post-production people immediately out of a job. Yeah.
CaptainLike, and now the I guess Warner Brothers is like I guess produces with ABC or ABC or they fill I don't know, but there's like a now like the two of them are arguing with each other about whose fault it was that they chose her. Um, and then like there's all this money wasted of like, um basically, I guess there's again I've never watched the show, but I guess there's like restaurants or hotels that are shown on the show, and it's like free promotion for the restaurant, so the show doesn't get charged for it. But now that they're not premiering, all those places are requesting their money. Um and nobody knows who's paying for that.
WilsonSo what a mess.
CaptainIt's just a mess. And I I did know this, even though I'd never seen the show, that apparently they always use one of the top contenders, like one of the fan favorites that doesn't finish the show for like doesn't get chosen at the end as like the next bachelor, and it just keeps doing that with like and then the next bachelor, so like they keep choosing like you know, one of the fan favorites that doesn't actually get married or whatever. Um and now there's like this weird, like, okay, what do we what do we do for the next bachelor now? Like, do they pick somebody from like multiple seasons ago? Like yeah, apparently it's like a whole mess. Um but it's just you brought up Warner Brothers and it made me think about that. Again, I like don't watch the show at all, but I'm like, wow, this is like so interesting. Um, Annihilation.
Production Trivia Book Adaptation Notes
WilsonUm, so did you uh have any more hot goss? Are we into the rags?
CaptainUm yeah, you said yeah, you liked Oscar Iskick was filming this movie adjacently with Star Wars, so he was like they were bit they were like studio lots next to each other, and it says that he had the same trailer for both films, and he'd also often film scenes from both movies on the same day.
WilsonThat would be rough. I mean, he wasn't in that much of this movie, but still. I'm sure that was taxing.
CaptainYeah, most of the movie well, maybe half of his roles he plays like a zombie-like character in this. Um Alex Garland said he did, yeah, read this novel, but he didn't, yeah, he said he didn't want to reread it and he was doing that dream-like state, like you said. Um is there anything else that's really that interesting? Um it says that the uh name of the five female characters uh is revealed in the first book. Five female characters' ethnicity is revealed in the first book. Um, it says there was some criticism because Natalie Portman's character, I guess, was supposed to be half Asian and half Native American. Um but he said he cast characters based on his reaction to the actors in the casting process and like nothing else. So I mean, yeah, I mean you cast him. Um you cast based on what they can do, I guess. Um Natalie said she uh started she said earlier in her career that she never wanted to be in horror movies, but then after the success of Black Swan, she was like, oh shit, never mind. And then immediately was like, I'm totally down to do this movie. Because Black Swan was 20 2010.
WilsonUm okay, yeah.
CaptainSo she was like, you know what? And that Black Swan is great, like five stars. I never re-watched it, but I feel like I should. It's really good. Um yeah, there's some other small things in here, but it's not really. I saw this thing that apparently the there's something about like the first house that they come upon in The Shimmer apparently is like an echoed copy of I guess the house that her and Kane have.
WilsonOh, I saw that. I was like, I never would have caught that.
CaptainI never would have caught it either. Because inside the shimmer, it's like everything's kind of like partially broken down.
WilsonYeah. Um I just would have thought, like, oh, they reused the set because it's chamber.
CaptainOh, yes, and then obviously Isaac Oscar Isaac and Natalie Portman are both in trilogies in Star Wars, but they're in different trilogies. So and we talked about it in the thing in the intro, but there's multiple people that are from Thor in here, so yeah. Um yeah, there's like a lot of stuff in here, but I feel like it would be more cool um like reading the book with with like this movie. I feel like that would be I don't know, interesting.
WilsonYeah, maybe I should add that to my list. I'd be curious what it to your goodreads.
CaptainYou are reading stuff on there.
WilsonI am.
CaptainI see.
WilsonI just finished a book today.
CaptainI want to finish a book today. I'm reading uh a book about this lady that her she goes out for her run, and when she comes back, there's her husband is living in the house, but there's another woman there that he claims to be that's like is looks similar to her and it claims to be his wife. Oh and when she goes out for her run, she has she doesn't have her ID, her car keys, her phone, so she doesn't have anything to claim she is who she says he is, but her husband's like, I've never met you before. Like, this is my wife. That sounds kind of good. They get like the cops involved because she's like breaking into her house because it's her house. Yeah, it's pretty good.
WilsonHmm.
CaptainYou'll see. Well, I can't remember the title, but it's on my Goodreads.
WilsonOkay, I'll check it out.
CaptainOkay.
WilsonUm
Favorite Scenes Scores Next Film
WilsonYeah, there's a lot of stuff in here, but any of those what's your rag? Oh raise a Glaus.
CaptainOh yeah, I picked a rag. Uh, it's kind of obvious, but the scene where you're watching Kane kill himself on camera, and then the cameraman comes into scene and it's another Kane. I'm like, I mean, that's gotta be everybody's rag. Like it's such a yeah, it's such a good reveal. Like, he yeah. Uh really done well, yeah. What about you?
WilsonI feel like mine is probably also pretty popular. It's just when the bear comes in and it's like mimicking the voice.
CaptainYeah, also really good.
WilsonFreaky fucking bear.
CaptainUm, that's a radiation does. No. Um I did, yeah, I did really like this movie. I think I gave it four out of five ones.
WilsonYeah, I think that's why I gave it two.
CaptainYeah, I think 80's probably pretty spot on with what I think this movie deserves. They could have like done a little bit more explanation, but you know, I don't think it like needs that explanation.
WilsonYeah, I remember when I first watched it, I was confused, more confused at the ending. This time watching it, I don't know if I was just paying more attention or or just like time has given me a different perspective. Uh but it it made a little bit more sense this time.
CaptainYeah. I do, and I didn't read into like um like how to interpret it, but I can totally see this as like an interpretation for people changing over time. Yeah. I I would recommend. I don't really know I would think it's great. Um next time. Next time we're doing Afraid, but it's like a fray. So it's like evil AI in a house. Okay. It's like uh Smart House. Yeah, Smart House, but evil AI.
WilsonUm I mean Smart House, the the Disney Channel movie was kind of an evil AI. I mean, she meant well, but Jesus Christ was that animated?
CaptainI don't even remember that movie.
WilsonNo, that was a real people movie.
CaptainReal people movie? Okay. Well, this movie is from 2024 and it's a Blumhouse, so we'll see.
WilsonIt's probably terrible, but I'm excited.
CaptainProbably terrible. Yeah, it does not have good reviews. Um anyway, we're doing Afraid, but AI.
Survival Advice Bring A Journal
CaptainUm and then, oh no, you have a question for me, but I don't have an answer yet.
WilsonOoh, I'll say it real slowly.
CaptainOh, do you have like a specific question?
WilsonUm You mean like a guided uh guided advice? Like let's say what?
CaptainThis movie's not very like life relatable.
WilsonLike everyday problems. Um let's see. If I were to go into the shimmer or any let's say any new area that I haven't explored before, um, what what's like one thing I should avoid doing?
CaptainAvoid. Avoid doing.
WilsonOr one thing I should absolutely do.
CaptainUh um, okay, they talk about like I I feel like people talk about this and they go on these like long journeys that I didn't see them do at all in here is like um journaling or like writing down specifics of what happened that day.
WilsonBecause like they're scientists, they should be doing that.
CaptainThere's like four days in the beginning that they say they have no recollection. I'm like, but if you had a journal, maybe you'd be able to like read your notes. They said like cameras are weird in there, radio singles are weird, but I'm like, pen and paper, babe. Pen pen and paper, and motherfucking paper. So that would be my advice. Journal