Why HR Leaders are Quitting with Claire Schmidt, AllVoices

In this HRchat episode, we consider findings from a recent survey of HR leaders that suggests HR pros are jumping ship in record numbers.

Bill's guest is Claire Schmidt, CEO and Founder of AllVoices, an employee feedback management platform that helps company leaders ask for, and act on, employee feedback of all kinds through a secure, truly anonymous communication channel. The platform provides real-time insights that help company leadership build and sustain healthy cultures.

Prior to founding AllVoices, Claire served as Vice President of Technology and Innovation at Fox, the Senior Director of Giving at Thrive Market, as well as the Director of Programs at Thorn.

Questions Include: 

• What has to fundamentally change when it comes to reporting issues in the workplace?
• What are the main stages when it comes to reporting workplace issues and harassment?
• AllVoices recently released a report called HR and the Great Resignation: Who’s Leaving, Hiring Outlook, and Strategies for Retention. The report surveyed HR leaders to better understand who’s leaving their jobs and why, what their organizations are doing to increase engagement and retention, hiring outlooks and strategies, and how HR leaders themselves are shouldering this weight. Let's run through some of the findings:
  • Tell us about the data sample. What were the demographics of those surveyed?
  • 48% of HR leaders have seen over 30% of their staff quit in the past year and 28% of employees are leaving because they’ve found a better offer. Just how competitive is it at the moment? How difficult is it to keep one's employees? 
  • $61,000 to $80,000 is how much the majority of HR leaders say it costs to replace an employee. Can you explain the business case for retaining existing talent v. hiring and onboarding new employees? 
  • 53% of HR leaders are burned out and 48% of HR leaders are looking for a new job! Why is it such a stressful time for HR pros or are we seeing the result of two long years of the HR leaders muddling through the pandemic? 

We do our best to ensure editorial objectivity. The views and ideas shared by our guests and sponsors are entirely independent of The HR Gazette, HRchat Podcast, and Iceni Media Inc.  

Transcript

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Speaker 1 0:01

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Speaker 2 0:22

Welcome to another episode of the HR chat show. I'm your host today, bill Bannum . And in this HR chat episode, we are gonna consider finding some , a recent survey of HR leaders that suggest that HR pros are jumping ship in record numbers. My guest today is Claire Schmidt, CEO, and founder, over at all voices, an employee feedback management platform that helps company leaders ask for and act on employee feedback of all kinds through a secure, truly anonymous communication channel. The platform provides real time insights that help company leadership build and sustain healthy cultures says Claire prior to founding all voices. Claire served as VP of technology and innovation at Fox, the senior director of giving at thrive market, as well as the director of programs over at thorn . Hey Claire, it's my pleasure to welcome you to the HR chat show today.

Speaker 3 1:20

Thank you so much. It's great to be here.

Speaker 2 1:23

So that sounds like a pretty impressive career background there. Claire, why don't you start there? Why don't you start by telling our listeners a bit more about your career background and then why you started all voices?

Speaker 3 1:35

Yeah, my background is really at the intersection of technology and social good. That is what I've spent pretty much my entire career doing. Um, and I was most recently vice president of technology and innovation at 20th century Fox. And while I was there, I read Susan Fowler's blog post about her experience at Uber , um, and started thinking about why we sort of, we as a society are asking employees to do something so challenging. Um, so intimidating and overwhelming, which is , um, speak up , uh, potentially to someone they've never met before. Uh, about an issue they've experienced at work that might be incredibly sensitive , um, and stressful, and to just cross their fingers and hope that that conversation goes well. Um, why are we asking them to do that in order for companies who need the information about what is actually happening in their culture to get that information? And my hypothesis was that most people, unlike Susan actually never speak up in the first place about whatever's going on and they just stay quiet, whether it was a small piece of feedback about something or more serious issue like harassment. And when I looked into harassment, I saw that 75% of people who experienced harassment at work, never reported it. So that really sent me down the path of trying to understand what could be done to help more people speak up at work about pretty much anything that they're experiencing in a way that feels comfortable and safe to them. And that's really how all voices came to be was through that sort of , uh , that question. And then the ensuing conversations with experts, leaders, lawyers, HR, people, and employees.

Speaker 2 3:31

Okay , thank you very much. So maybe you can now share with our listeners what you think has to fundamentally change when it comes to reporting issues in the workplace.

Speaker 3 3:44

Yeah, I mean, I think the first thing is if you, as a company, want to hear from your employees and want to know what's going on, not just from a sort of altruistic perspective, right? Uh , but also from the standpoint that knowing about whether something like harassment for example, is happening to your company , um, is critical to helping avoid, you know, legal liability and risk and other downstream effects, whether it's, you know , um, that story being broken in the New York times , uh , and the impact that that might have on your , on your bottom line, right? So there's sort of a moral reason to be aware of what's happening in your company culture. Um, and there's also a self-interested reason from, from a company perspective. So if you want to know about what's going on, then new channels need to be provided for employees to speak up about these things. Because ultimately what we saw in part during the me too movement, which was right around the time I started all voices , um, is that employees are not comfortable speaking up and they need options. They need , uh , methods of speaking up that feel safer to them . Um, and so that's the first step is putting those systems in place so that employees have options so that you're actually hearing from them .

Speaker 2 5:12

Okay. Okay. Thank you very much. So tell me, Claire, what are the , what are the main stages when it comes to reporting workplace issues and, and harassment?

Speaker 3 5:22

Yeah, I mean, it , it really depends on the company and what tools or channels they have available. So the state of the world previously was that employees really didn't have options when it came to reporting workplace issues. So their only options were go directly to someone in HR or your manager or someone else in the company. If you feel comfortable who will then have to inform HR or stay quiet and don't tell anyone about it, that was the old paradigm. And what we've introduced with all voices is actually a third path, which is yes, you can still stay, stay quiet. Yes. You can still go to HR, go to your manager, go to another company leader if , if it's someone that you trust. But there's a third path, which is speak up through a digital channel and be able to understand how the information that you're sharing is going to be received on the other end , um, gain comfort in that process, ask questions , um, before deciding ultimately to reveal your identity, the specifics of the situation, et cetera . Um, so I think the old way was very binary. It was either you've come forward or you haven't, and once you came forward, you were sort of all the way out. And there was no way to say, actually, I don't wanna, actually, I don't wanna talk about this anymore. You know, forget I said anything because a , the company legally can't do that. And B they know who you are. So , um, like in Susan Fowler's case, once she spoke up and it didn't go the way she thought it might or hoped, it might, there was no way to say, okay, then just forget I ever told you this. Um, and let's go back to things being normal. No, instead she experienced retaliation. Um, she was mistreated, she was bullied all because she had spoken up , um, because there was no undoing it once, once she had. And I think I was very moved by Susan's story. It's a very difficult position to be in. And I actually reached out to her early on when I was starting all voices and got her perspective on like, which would there have been a more comfortable way for you to go through this process? Um, and a , a lot of what she shared with me really informed the way we decided to build this platform. So , um, I think of it as like before us and after us, what the process might be, what the options might be. Um, I think they've expanded and that's a really good thing for employees.

Speaker 2 7:59

Okay. Thank you very much. Now then I understand that all voices recently released a report called HR and the great resignation who's leaving, hiring outlook and strategies for retention. Uh , the reports surveyed HR leaders to better understand who's leaving their jobs and why, what their organizations are doing to increase engagement and retention, hiring outlooks and strategies and how HR leaders themselves are shouldering this way at the moment. I'd now like to run through some of those findings with you, Claire. Um , before we get into the stats though, perhaps you can tell our listeners a bit about the sample, the sample size, the demographics , um, perhaps talk a little bit about industries, number of those poll and so on.

Speaker 3 8:47

Yeah. Happy to share. So , um, this was a really fascinating , uh , research report we had done, we have done a lot of , um , serving employees in the past, and I feel like we have a really good perspective on their experiences with anything, from sharing feedback, to reporting discrimination or harassment , um, or, you know, ethics issues and safety issues and, and everything in between. This was our first time , um, actually serving HR leaders. Uh, and what we found was, was really interesting. So , um, first a quick breakdown on who we surveyed. We surveyed 400 , um, HR managers, supervisors, leaders, directors, and executives. Uh, the gender split was about 60, 40 female male. The age breakdown was pretty even across the various age buckets, but the largest bucket was actually the 25 to 34. Um, and then , uh, uh, no, sorry. The largest bucket was actually the 35 to 44. And then the next highest was the 25 to 34 age bucket. So the majority of respondents were in that like 25 to 44 age group. Um, and then there was a pretty even split in terms of the size business they work for. Uh, so between small businesses, medium, large, and, and major corporations, it was pretty evenly split with the majority in the medium and large, which is a hundred to 10,000 employees. So that was the breakdown of who we , uh, talked to. And we just heard some fascinating things. Overall, one thing we heard is just, they themselves are very burned out. Um, and this was something that, that we were surprised to find, but, but 48% of them were looking for new jobs as well. So there's been all of this conversation going on about the great resignation and how can HR leaders do more to retain employees, but they themselves are burned out for many of the same reasons. And so , um, how can organizations do more to retain HR leaders, I think is another conversation that hasn't been happening as much.

Speaker 2 11:01

I understand that 48% of HR leaders have seen over 30% of their staff quit in the past year. And according to your findings, 28% of employees are leaving because they found a better offer. My question for you there then is just, just how competitive is it at the moment, Claire, and how difficult is it to keep one's employees?

Speaker 3 11:25

I mean, I think those numbers really speak for themselves. Like half of the, of the leaders we interviewed basically have had a third of their staff turnover. Like it's really, really , um, mind, mind boggling when you think about it. Um, and I think so, so I would say it is a very competitive , uh, time to retain your employees. It's a challenging time to retain your employees. Um, but it's an interesting time to be hiring because there's so many people who are open to new opportunities and looking for new opportunities. And , um, you may have to pay more than, than you might have two years ago to get them, or you might have to offer more in terms of the overall package. Um, but it's a , it's an interesting time to hire , um, and, and definitely a more challenging time than we've seen in a while , uh , as it relates to employee retention.

Speaker 2 12:25

Okay. And 61,000 to 80,000 is how much the majority of HR leaders say that it costs to replace an employee. Maybe you can now explain the , a bit about the business case for retaining existing talent versus hiring and onboarding new employees. And obviously tie that with what you're just speaking about at the end there about the, the role of employee feedback and acting upon that so that you can actually keep your best people.

Speaker 3 12:54

If you look at the previous finding, right, which is that, that , uh , half of HR leaders are seeing about a third of their staff, quit have seen a third of their staff quit in the past year and then apply these numbers to that, right? Each person that leaves it's costing between 60 and $80,000 to replace one of them . Right. And then multiply that by potentially hundreds of employees who are leaving. Um, it becomes very, very expensive to lose employees. And I think when you look at what that number is comprised of, right, it's the cost of , um, the , the knowledge that's lost when the old employee leaves , um, it's the cost of recruiting the new employees , um, and that can be incredibly expensive. Um, the time it takes to interview them and , um, reference, check them and all those things and , um, and train them and onboard them and, and get them up to speed and, and the productivity losses that happen as a result of that previous person leaving. Um, so it's very expensive. So it is critical for companies who want to succeed , um, not to lose their great employees. And the analogy that I give sometimes when I talk about this is it's kind of similar to, we're a SaaS company, right? We sell software, we don't wanna lose our customers. We worked really hard to find those customers and to bring them into our ecosystem and to get them, you know, up and running, using our platform. And we've built relationships with them. It's really tough for us to lose one of them because we've invested so much in them. Um, and, and it takes a lot more effort to go out and find someone else. Um, so that's the analogy I sometimes give, which is like you put in so much effort to, to hiring employees and to , um, making them a part of the team and bringing them into the culture. You don't wanna lose them because of something that could have been prevented. And so that gets into feedback and real time , always on listening to your employees, if your employee is having an issue at work. And they're not really sure who to talk to, they don't know if it's a big enough deal to bring HR into it, or even to service with their manager. Maybe it's an issue with their manager. The it's making them feel demotivated, they're becoming disengaged. Maybe they're starting to put feelers out there for another job. The sooner you can find out about what's going on with that employee, the better, because you could potentially fix it. For example , um, a couple years ago, one of our customers was , um, in the process of looking for new office space and it wasn't something they had announced to their entire , uh , employee base. They were just looking for it. They knew they were outgrowing their old space. And they mentioned this to me , um, later, but they got a couple of reports from employees on all voices who were just so frustrated. It almost seemed like they were at the point of like, I can't work in these conditions anymore. Um, kind of like as a last ditch effort , uh, they were using the tool, which we had just rolled out with them. And , uh, our customer told me we're so happy that we got this information from them because we're able to use the communication tool to tell them, Hey, don't despair. We're looking for new office. This is something we're actively working on. And then they even announced it to the broader team so that if anyone else was feeling frustrated about it , uh , that they were aware that steps were being taken. Um, a lot of times the way things work in companies is that something might already be in process, but just hasn't been announced yet. And so sometimes it's simply a communication issue of telling people what is, is going to happen in the future. And could you imagine if they had lost that employee , um, or those employees , uh, thinking about this, this cost comparison that we've just done, that's like two employees, maybe more possibly around 60 to $80,000 in cost , just losing them. Um, so the tool is incredibly valuable at scale. When you start to think about all the different types of feedback that's coming in , um, and giving , uh, HR leadership, the ability to know what's happening with their employees in real time ,

Speaker 2 17:24

Or at least that's the , the HR leadership that is still around because , uh , the findings also suggest that 53% of HR leaders are burned out and 48% of HR leaders are actively looking for a new job at the moment. Why is that Claire ? Why is it, is it because it's , uh , a very stressful time for HR pros at the moment due to the, the extra pressures of the great resignation and all of that, what all of that brings or are we seeing actually the result of two very long, very hard years , um, for , for HR leaders who had to model through the pandemic and perhaps now they feel like it's the right time to, to go elsewhere.

Speaker 3 18:06

Yeah, I think that's a really , uh , good question. I think the answer is , um, both <laugh> , uh, so I think it has to do with, in part, it has to do with burnout, which you mentioned , um, during the pandemic, we asked a lot of HR leaders , um , we asked them to take on a lot of extra responsibilities , um , but not necessarily with additional resources, right. It's like do more jobs, but with the same amount of time <laugh> . Um , and so I think that naturally is a recipe for burnout. It was like, okay, we need to figure out how we're gonna handle remote work. We need to create , uh , COVID 19 policies. We need to create , uh , vaccine policies. We need to think about return to work. Um, so it's just been, we need to figure out ways to keep people feeling connected, even though they're remote or , um, you know, the list goes on and on, and I've heard a ton of it from , um, from HR leaders. Uh , it's also been an incredibly, you know, challenging time globally , uh, as it relates to just what's happening out in the world. Um, people dying wars , uh, you know, potential recession, you name it. So I think burnout on the sort of like individual HR person level, and then kind of across HR people, given the role they're having to play. Um, but also like HR leaders , um, are, you know, some of them themselves got like, like the survey said got better offers, got , um, uh , an offer that maybe was hard to turn down because it , they were being paid better. There were better benefits. There was more flexibility, whatever it might be. So I don't think you can discount that either. Um, that that's incredibly important. Um, but I would just say overall, it's been a really, really tough couple of years. There's a lot of pressure being put on HR teams , um, because of COVID 19. And then on top of that, the great resignation. And I think it would be surprising if there wasn't burnout.

Speaker 2 20:19

Okay. Okay. Thank you very much, Claire . You're not gonna believe this, but we are already coming towards the end of this conversation today , uh , before we do wrap up, how can our listeners connect with you? So maybe through LinkedIn, maybe you wanna share your email address, perhaps you're on Twitter and such, and also, how can they learn more about all the cool things happening over at all voices?

Speaker 3 20:40

Yeah. Um, so the best place to go is our website to kind of see everything. We have a really great , um, webinar series. We have a blog, lots of content. Um, so all voices.co is our website COO . Um, and then as far as me, you can totally find me on LinkedIn and Twitter. Uh, I'm , uh, pretty active on LinkedIn, not as much so on Twitter , um, but would love to connect there as well.

Speaker 2 21:10

Wonderful. Well, that just leads me to say for today, Claire, thank you very much for being my guest on this episode of the HR chat show.

Speaker 3 21:19

Thank you so much. It was wonderful chatting with you

Speaker 2 21:22

And listeners. There will, of course be links to , uh , the things that we've been talking about today in the show notes. So , uh , you can find more information there and as always until next time, happy working.

Speaker 1 21:36

Thanks for listening to this episode of V HR chat podcast. There are hundreds of conversations with business experts available for free on the HR Gazette website, apple, Spotify, and all the main platforms. And remember to like subscribe and follow us on social media.