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and should do more of."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":449.21,"endTime":449.75,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":449.81,"endTime":451.789,"body":"Like you said, not a lot"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":449.81,"endTime":451.789,"body":"of books written about"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":451.789,"endTime":453.02,"body":"being this type of manager."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":453.07,"endTime":454.75,"body":"I'm curious, as you've been"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":453.07,"endTime":454.75,"body":"working with these groups,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":455.46999999999997,"endTime":456.58,"body":"what have you found works?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":456.58,"endTime":458.89,"body":"What's the messaging that"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":456.58,"endTime":458.89,"body":"sort of gets through to them,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":458.89,"endTime":461.26,"body":"and what sort of training do"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":458.89,"endTime":461.26,"body":"you feel resonates with them?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":461.71,"endTime":463.96,"body":"I have"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":461.71,"endTime":463.96,"body":"explored all kinds of different"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":463.96,"endTime":465.31,"body":"ways to help these people."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":466.93,"endTime":468.43,"body":"Looked at doing courses."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":468.43,"endTime":469.93,"body":"I've looked at writing a book."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":469.93,"endTime":473.56,"body":"I've looked at any range of"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":469.93,"endTime":473.56,"body":"things to be able to help"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":473.56,"endTime":477.58,"body":"them, and what I've discovered,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":473.56,"endTime":477.58,"body":"I've done seminars, I've"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":477.58,"endTime":479.57,"body":"done, I've spoken to groups."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":480.04,"endTime":483.564,"body":"The problem is the kinds of"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":480.04,"endTime":483.564,"body":"situations that these second"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":483.564,"endTime":487.104,"body":"and third level managers"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":483.564,"endTime":487.104,"body":"deal with tend to be very"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":487.104,"endTime":490.585,"body":"tactical and situationally"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":487.104,"endTime":490.585,"body":"dependent situations."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":490.944,"endTime":493.465,"body":"They are deeply dependent"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":490.944,"endTime":493.465,"body":"upon what their business"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":493.465,"endTime":496.015,"body":"is and how it works, and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":493.465,"endTime":496.015,"body":"who the personalities"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":496.015,"endTime":499.374,"body":"involved are, and often the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":496.015,"endTime":499.374,"body":"technology that's involved."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":499.374,"endTime":502.195,"body":"And so it's a really"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":499.374,"endTime":502.195,"body":"very custom problem."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":502.195,"endTime":504.684,"body":"I have this problem, I don't"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":502.195,"endTime":504.684,"body":"know how to deal with it."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":504.684,"endTime":505.734,"body":"What should I do with it?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":507.685,"endTime":510.325,"body":"There's no book"},{"speaker":"Chris 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frustrating"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":539.264,"endTime":542.0840000000001,"body":"for me as somebody who"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":539.264,"endTime":542.0840000000001,"body":"creates content and wants"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":542.0840000000001,"endTime":545.0840000000001,"body":"to impact a whole lot of"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":542.0840000000001,"endTime":545.0840000000001,"body":"people, it's very frustrating."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":545.0840000000001,"endTime":548.144,"body":"But for me, one-on-one"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":545.0840000000001,"endTime":548.144,"body":"is what works."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":548.2040000000001,"endTime":552.214,"body":"Working one-on-one, that's"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":548.2040000000001,"endTime":552.214,"body":"where I find I have the most"},{"speaker":"Chris 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Rice","startTime":563.894,"endTime":566.6540000000001,"body":"in are very tactical, and one"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":563.894,"endTime":566.6540000000001,"body":"of the things I think I've"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":566.6540000000001,"endTime":571.5440000000001,"body":"seen quite a bit is there's a"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":566.6540000000001,"endTime":571.5440000000001,"body":"struggle to, they might have"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":571.5440000000001,"endTime":574.394,"body":"good tactical ideas, but then"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":571.5440000000001,"endTime":574.394,"body":"they have to translate them"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":574.394,"endTime":578.5590000000001,"body":"into the strategy that the"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":574.394,"endTime":578.5590000000001,"body":"leadership has and communicating"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":578.5590000000001,"endTime":579.849,"body":"it both ways, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":579.849,"endTime":581.619,"body":"It can be a little"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":579.849,"endTime":581.619,"body":"bit of a challenge."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":582.0390000000001,"endTime":584.379,"body":"I think it's"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":582.0390000000001,"endTime":584.379,"body":"called middle management"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":584.379,"endTime":585.0690000000001,"body":"for a lot of reasons."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":585.9490000000001,"endTime":589.49,"body":"One of the problems you've"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":585.9490000000001,"endTime":589.49,"body":"got is that while you are"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":589.49,"endTime":592.6690000000001,"body":"busy trying to deal with this"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":589.49,"endTime":592.6690000000001,"body":"horribly tactical problem"},{"speaker":"Chris 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Williams","startTime":607.489,"endTime":611.0290000000001,"body":"You have to translate that,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":607.489,"endTime":611.0290000000001,"body":"that high level objective"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":611.2990000000001,"endTime":614.629,"body":"into the pieces that"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":611.2990000000001,"endTime":614.629,"body":"actually matter to get done."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":615.065,"endTime":617.975,"body":"And that level of translation"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":615.065,"endTime":617.975,"body":"is really complicated."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":617.975,"endTime":621.514,"body":"And it also isn't helped by"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":617.975,"endTime":621.514,"body":"the fact that you can't go"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":621.514,"endTime":625.264,"body":"to that frontline person and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":621.514,"endTime":625.264,"body":"scream the strategic objective"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":625.264,"endTime":627.514,"body":"at them 'cause it doesn't help."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":627.5440000000001,"endTime":630.114,"body":"They don't, I, how do"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":627.5440000000001,"endTime":630.114,"body":"I, how do I motivate our"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":630.114,"endTime":631.3140000000001,"body":"customer base to do it?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":631.3140000000001,"endTime":632.754,"body":"That doesn't help me."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":632.754,"endTime":635.094,"body":"I need to know, should"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":632.754,"endTime":635.094,"body":"I get this project done"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":635.094,"endTime":636.4140000000001,"body":"like this or like that."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":636.4140000000001,"endTime":639.9240000000001,"body":"So a huge portion of"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":636.4140000000001,"endTime":639.9240000000001,"body":"what middle management is"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":639.9240000000001,"endTime":641.9040000000001,"body":"translating requirements."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":642.354,"endTime":645.024,"body":"From the vague to"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":642.354,"endTime":645.024,"body":"the specific, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":645.354,"endTime":648.714,"body":"And deciding what is noise and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":645.354,"endTime":648.714,"body":"what is not, and what to bother"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":648.714,"endTime":650.5440000000001,"body":"your employees with and whatnot."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":650.9340000000001,"endTime":654.594,"body":"So there's this huge filtration"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":650.9340000000001,"endTime":654.594,"body":"process that you've gotta be"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":654.9240000000001,"endTime":657.1740000000001,"body":"just incredibly facile at."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":657.2040000000001,"endTime":659.3040000000001,"body":"And also communicative, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":659.3040000000001,"endTime":661.5540000000001,"body":"You gotta be really good"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":659.3040000000001,"endTime":661.5540000000001,"body":"at communicating these"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":661.5540000000001,"endTime":664.259,"body":"kinds of things in a way"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":661.5540000000001,"endTime":664.259,"body":"that people can hear them."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":664.975,"endTime":669.3240000000001,"body":"It's very underestimated how"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":664.975,"endTime":669.3240000000001,"body":"incredibly hard that job can be."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":669.714,"endTime":670.6740000000001,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":669.714,"endTime":670.6740000000001,"body":"I think so too."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":670.6740000000001,"endTime":673.4040000000001,"body":"I think it doesn't get enough"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":670.6740000000001,"endTime":673.4040000000001,"body":"respect when you hear all this"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":673.4040000000001,"endTime":676.254,"body":"talk about flattening or getting"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":673.4040000000001,"endTime":676.254,"body":"rid of middle managers and I"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":676.259,"endTime":679.7990000000001,"body":"think that's not quite fair"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":676.259,"endTime":679.7990000000001,"body":"'cause a lot of them have not"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":679.7990000000001,"endTime":681.269,"body":"been set up for success, so."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":681.389,"endTime":683.399,"body":"You look at a"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":681.389,"endTime":683.399,"body":"company like Amazon that has"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":683.399,"endTime":686.879,"body":"something like five people"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":683.399,"endTime":686.879,"body":"working for every middle manager"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":686.879,"endTime":688.1690000000001,"body":"and they now want to go to 10."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":688.219,"endTime":689.2090000000001,"body":"Okay, cool."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":689.614,"endTime":692.764,"body":"So that means instead of getting"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":689.614,"endTime":692.764,"body":"20% of my manager's time, I'm"},{"speaker":"Chris 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Rice","startTime":704.7940000000001,"endTime":708.0640000000001,"body":"middle managers face, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":708.0640000000001,"endTime":710.5840000000001,"body":"It's one thing when you're"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":708.0640000000001,"endTime":710.5840000000001,"body":"at the line manager level,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":710.5840000000001,"endTime":712.9240000000001,"body":"you have your direct reports"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":710.5840000000001,"endTime":712.9240000000001,"body":"and your, like I, we were"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":712.9240000000001,"endTime":715.384,"body":"talking about before, your"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":712.9240000000001,"endTime":715.384,"body":"expertise and everything,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":715.384,"endTime":716.8240000000001,"body":"it all like translates."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":717.1990000000001,"endTime":719.5390000000001,"body":"It's limited to a certain"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":717.1990000000001,"endTime":719.5390000000001,"body":"area, but when you become"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":719.5390000000001,"endTime":722.8090000000001,"body":"a manager of managers, that"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":719.5390000000001,"endTime":722.8090000000001,"body":"perception of you starts to"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":722.8090000000001,"endTime":724.759,"body":"change among everyone below you."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":725.5390000000001,"endTime":726.9490000000001,"body":"What advice do you"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":725.5390000000001,"endTime":726.9490000000001,"body":"have for helping folks"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":726.9490000000001,"endTime":728.4490000000001,"body":"navigate that shift?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":728.6890000000001,"endTime":730.759,"body":"One of"},{"speaker":"Chris 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Williams","startTime":741.369,"endTime":743.0790000000001,"body":"does, that's really hard."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":743.0790000000001,"endTime":747.614,"body":"And so one of the things I"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":743.0790000000001,"endTime":747.614,"body":"like advise senior managers"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":747.6740000000001,"endTime":751.394,"body":"to do is to occasionally"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":747.6740000000001,"endTime":751.394,"body":"have opportunities to speak"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":751.394,"endTime":753.734,"body":"to broader organizations,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":751.394,"endTime":753.734,"body":"broader groups."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":754.119,"endTime":757.8090000000001,"body":"And lay out some of the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":754.119,"endTime":757.8090000000001,"body":"strategic challenges that their"},{"speaker":"Chris 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been asked by the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":773.229,"endTime":776.769,"body":"corporation to implement this."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":777.6940000000001,"endTime":780.1740000000001,"body":"Build this product"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":777.6940000000001,"endTime":780.1740000000001,"body":"or whatever, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":780.354,"endTime":782.9340000000001,"body":"And you can explain to people,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":780.354,"endTime":782.9340000000001,"body":"then that means we need to"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":782.9340000000001,"endTime":785.394,"body":"do this and this and this,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":782.9340000000001,"endTime":785.394,"body":"and here's this team over"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":785.394,"endTime":787.494,"body":"here doing this, and this"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":785.394,"endTime":787.494,"body":"team over there doing that."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":787.494,"endTime":791.094,"body":"And if you lay that out in a"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":787.494,"endTime":791.094,"body":"particular way, people suddenly"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":791.094,"endTime":796.644,"body":"get a respect for, oh, I see you"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":791.094,"endTime":796.644,"body":"are managing this whole project."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":796.644,"endTime":799.464,"body":"I didn't understand what"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":796.644,"endTime":799.464,"body":"that part of it was."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":799.7940000000001,"endTime":802.344,"body":"So there's an opportunity"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":799.7940000000001,"endTime":802.344,"body":"for you to be more open and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":802.344,"endTime":803.634,"body":"honest about what goes on."},{"speaker":"Chris 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Williams","startTime":817.214,"endTime":820.364,"body":"with those people because"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":820.364,"endTime":822.0740000000001,"body":"most people are smart."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":822.479,"endTime":826.469,"body":"They can smell you when"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":822.479,"endTime":826.469,"body":"you're making stuff up."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":826.8290000000001,"endTime":830.369,"body":"So you have to be honest about,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":826.8290000000001,"endTime":830.369,"body":"hey, I know this is hard and I"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":830.369,"endTime":833.9090000000001,"body":"know this may be an unbeatable"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":830.369,"endTime":833.9090000000001,"body":"goal, but we're gonna work"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":833.9090000000001,"endTime":836.999,"body":"our best to see if we can get"},{"speaker":"Chris 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this topic, is generations."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":850.629,"endTime":853.5340000000001,"body":"You've got people navigating"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":850.629,"endTime":853.5340000000001,"body":"up to five generations in the"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":853.5340000000001,"endTime":856.6540000000001,"body":"workforce now, and this comes"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":853.5340000000001,"endTime":856.6540000000001,"body":"with some obvious challenges."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":856.7040000000001,"endTime":858.6840000000001,"body":"I'm curious though, I,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":856.7040000000001,"endTime":858.6840000000001,"body":"'cause I saw you posted"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":858.6840000000001,"endTime":860.094,"body":"something about this recently."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":860.724,"endTime":864.0840000000001,"body":"How do we help managers and"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":860.724,"endTime":864.0840000000001,"body":"really the workforce as a whole"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":864.0840000000001,"endTime":867.8040000000001,"body":"move beyond sort of generational"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":864.0840000000001,"endTime":867.8040000000001,"body":"tropes and stereotypes?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":868.5390000000001,"endTime":871.1790000000001,"body":"How can we help these people"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":868.5390000000001,"endTime":871.1790000000001,"body":"look at these challenges"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":871.1790000000001,"endTime":872.0490000000001,"body":"in a different way?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":872.4390000000001,"endTime":875.2890000000001,"body":"One of the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":872.4390000000001,"endTime":875.2890000000001,"body":"things I work with, everybody"},{"speaker":"Chris 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things."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":891.739,"endTime":894.379,"body":"The way I relate it to"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":891.739,"endTime":894.379,"body":"people is through some"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":894.379,"endTime":896.0590000000001,"body":"things they will see at work."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":896.0590000000001,"endTime":899.3290000000001,"body":"For example, some"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":896.0590000000001,"endTime":899.3290000000001,"body":"people like emails, some"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":899.3290000000001,"endTime":900.649,"body":"people like phone calls."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":900.649,"endTime":902.089,"body":"Some people like a text."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":902.089,"endTime":903.7990000000001,"body":"Some people prefer Slack."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":904.1590000000001,"endTime":907.6990000000001,"body":"Some people like feedback"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":904.1590000000001,"endTime":907.6990000000001,"body":"to be very careful and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":907.6990000000001,"endTime":909.349,"body":"thoughtful and gentle."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":909.6590000000001,"endTime":912.239,"body":"And they need a little bit"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":909.6590000000001,"endTime":912.239,"body":"of stroking before they"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":912.239,"endTime":913.5590000000001,"body":"get some negative feedback."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":913.5590000000001,"endTime":915.839,"body":"Other people, if you give"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":913.5590000000001,"endTime":915.839,"body":"them that kind of feedback,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":915.839,"endTime":919.4090000000001,"body":"they will not hear you and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":915.839,"endTime":919.4090000000001,"body":"you practically have to scream"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":919.4090000000001,"endTime":922.7890000000001,"body":"the feedback, stop doing that,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":919.4090000000001,"endTime":922.7890000000001,"body":"or but if you do that to some"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":922.7890000000001,"endTime":924.589,"body":"people, they will cry, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":924.889,"endTime":926.1790000000001,"body":"So you can't do that."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":926.1790000000001,"endTime":928.5490000000001,"body":"You can't forgive"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":926.1790000000001,"endTime":928.5490000000001,"body":"everybody the same kind"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":928.5490000000001,"endTime":929.899,"body":"of feedback all the time."},{"speaker":"Chris 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feedback."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":961.8090000000001,"endTime":964.899,"body":"Doesn't hear me unless I'm"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":961.8090000000001,"endTime":964.899,"body":"talking quite directly at you."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":965.1990000000001,"endTime":967.1790000000001,"body":"Will never open my email."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":967.1790000000001,"endTime":969.519,"body":"Only hears it when I"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":967.1790000000001,"endTime":969.519,"body":"send you a text, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":969.8190000000001,"endTime":973.599,"body":"If you treat each one of"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":969.8190000000001,"endTime":973.599,"body":"your employees that way with"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":973.599,"endTime":977.9490000000001,"body":"the, whatever the world they"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":973.599,"endTime":977.9490000000001,"body":"live in is, you suddenly"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":977.9490000000001,"endTime":981.2790000000001,"body":"realize that generational"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":977.9490000000001,"endTime":981.2790000000001,"body":"stereotypes don't mean anything."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":981.759,"endTime":984.1890000000001,"body":"And that's the whole work"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":981.759,"endTime":984.1890000000001,"body":"from home thing, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":984.1890000000001,"endTime":985.5690000000001,"body":"There are some people who would."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":986.024,"endTime":988.844,"body":"Absolutely love"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":986.024,"endTime":988.844,"body":"to work from home."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":989.0540000000001,"endTime":992.354,"body":"There are other people for"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":989.0540000000001,"endTime":992.354,"body":"whom the office is a sanctuary."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":992.354,"endTime":993.9140000000001,"body":"Their home is a nightmare."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":994.1840000000001,"endTime":997.244,"body":"They wanna get to the office"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":994.1840000000001,"endTime":997.244,"body":"because it's quieter and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":997.274,"endTime":1000.5440000000001,"body":"they can focus and whatever"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":997.274,"endTime":1000.5440000000001,"body":"because they got kids running"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1000.5440000000001,"endTime":1002.134,"body":"all whatever it is, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1002.374,"endTime":1006.4540000000001,"body":"There are other people for whom"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1002.374,"endTime":1006.4540000000001,"body":"the office is a scary place"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1006.4540000000001,"endTime":1010.894,"body":"that's 45 minutes away, and the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1006.4540000000001,"endTime":1010.894,"body":"commute drives me nuts, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1010.894,"endTime":1013.594,"body":"So those people could"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1010.894,"endTime":1013.594,"body":"be 25 or they could be"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1013.594,"endTime":1015.4240000000001,"body":"65, who knows, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1015.7990000000001,"endTime":1018.1690000000001,"body":"You have to treat"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1015.7990000000001,"endTime":1018.1690000000001,"body":"everybody as an individual."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1018.1690000000001,"endTime":1021.619,"body":"And the cool part is the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1018.1690000000001,"endTime":1021.619,"body":"sooner you start to do that,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1021.859,"endTime":1024.799,"body":"the more effective your"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1021.859,"endTime":1024.799,"body":"relationship with them will be."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1024.799,"endTime":1028.219,"body":"The more respect they'll give"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1024.799,"endTime":1028.219,"body":"you, the more open and honest"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1028.219,"endTime":1031.609,"body":"your conversation can be, and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1028.219,"endTime":1031.609,"body":"the better your relationship as"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1031.939,"endTime":1033.889,"body":"a manager and a leader will be."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1033.939,"endTime":1037.209,"body":"The generational stereotypes"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1033.939,"endTime":1037.209,"body":"thing just chaps me."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1037.389,"endTime":1042.129,"body":"Partly as an older person"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1037.389,"endTime":1042.129,"body":"being stereotyped, as you don't"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1042.129,"endTime":1043.569,"body":"understand new technology."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1043.569,"endTime":1046.179,"body":"I'm working with an"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1043.569,"endTime":1046.179,"body":"AI startup right now."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1046.179,"endTime":1046.5990000000002,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1046.8690000000001,"endTime":1049.239,"body":"A friend of mine and I"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1046.8690000000001,"endTime":1049.239,"body":"have developed a really"},{"speaker":"Chris 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Williams","startTime":1062.0240000000001,"endTime":1063.7340000000002,"body":"No, I'm pretty good"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1062.0240000000001,"endTime":1063.7340000000002,"body":"at opening my phone."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1064.0040000000001,"endTime":1064.875,"body":"Ask my wife."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1066.039,"endTime":1067.529,"body":"Yeah, ask TikTok."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1067.634,"endTime":1067.875,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1069.194,"endTime":1070.034,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1070.424,"endTime":1071.294,"body":"That's great."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1071.294,"endTime":1073.054,"body":"And I think a big part"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1071.294,"endTime":1073.054,"body":"of the reason I ask that"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1073.054,"endTime":1076.304,"body":"question is because a lot of"},{"speaker":"David 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first"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1174.909,"endTime":1178.299,"body":"were the ones who obviously had"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1178.299,"endTime":1181.929,"body":"blown something up or had some"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1178.299,"endTime":1181.929,"body":"terrible performance problem."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1182.304,"endTime":1184.7640000000001,"body":"But the next people on the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1182.304,"endTime":1184.7640000000001,"body":"list were the people who,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1184.7640000000001,"endTime":1186.834,"body":"when you brought up their"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1184.7640000000001,"endTime":1186.834,"body":"name, people went who?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1187.2540000000001,"endTime":1191.874,"body":"So what you need to do as an"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1187.2540000000001,"endTime":1191.874,"body":"individual is make connections"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1191.874,"endTime":1193.374,"body":"across the organization."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1193.704,"endTime":1195.9840000000002,"body":"And the thing I keep telling"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1193.704,"endTime":1195.9840000000002,"body":"people is whether or not"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1195.9840000000002,"endTime":1199.2240000000002,"body":"your organization wants you"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1195.9840000000002,"endTime":1199.2240000000002,"body":"to work cross-functionally,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1199.435,"endTime":1202.464,"body":"there's nothing preventing"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1199.435,"endTime":1202.464,"body":"you from having an association"},{"speaker":"Chris 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whatever."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1215.679,"endTime":1218.829,"body":"And I love to tell people the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1215.679,"endTime":1218.829,"body":"way you do that conversation"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1218.829,"endTime":1221.409,"body":"is you sit down with 'em and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1218.829,"endTime":1221.409,"body":"you say to the finance guy,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1221.769,"endTime":1224.3490000000002,"body":"I don't even understand how"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1221.769,"endTime":1224.3490000000002,"body":"you guys do what you do."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1224.3490000000002,"endTime":1226.5990000000002,"body":"How do you guys come up"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1224.3490000000002,"endTime":1226.5990000000002,"body":"with these complex reports?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1226.5990000000002,"endTime":1227.469,"body":"How does that work?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1227.829,"endTime":1229.3,"body":"When are you guys"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1227.829,"endTime":1229.3,"body":"supposed to do them?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1229.3,"endTime":1232.3,"body":"How does that, how do the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1229.3,"endTime":1232.3,"body":"upper management react"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1232.3,"endTime":1233.3490000000002,"body":"when you do those things?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1233.669,"endTime":1235.769,"body":"Don't you get some pushback"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1233.669,"endTime":1235.769,"body":"when you try and push"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1235.769,"endTime":1236.729,"body":"down on people with it?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1236.909,"endTime":1240.959,"body":"How does this ask them a million"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1236.909,"endTime":1240.959,"body":"questions about their job?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1240.959,"endTime":1245.219,"body":"And I have never met someone"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1240.959,"endTime":1245.219,"body":"who, when you start asking"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1245.219,"endTime":1248.069,"body":"good, genuine questions about"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1245.219,"endTime":1248.069,"body":"what they do for a living,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1248.3690000000001,"endTime":1250.74,"body":"doesn't just light up and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1248.3690000000001,"endTime":1250.74,"body":"want to tell you it really"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1250.74,"endTime":1253.99,"body":"gets to me like this and I,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1250.74,"endTime":1253.99,"body":"eventually you've gained a"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1253.99,"endTime":1256.81,"body":"relationship with someone over"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1253.99,"endTime":1256.81,"body":"in finance and then you've"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1256.81,"endTime":1259.5990000000002,"body":"gained a relationship with"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1256.81,"endTime":1259.5990000000002,"body":"someone in marketing and sales"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1259.5990000000002,"endTime":1262.81,"body":"and whatever, and they will"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1259.5990000000002,"endTime":1262.81,"body":"introduce you to somebody else."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1263.199,"endTime":1267.035,"body":"And so when the time comes"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1263.199,"endTime":1267.035,"body":"for some thing that blows"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1267.035,"endTime":1270.515,"body":"up, you are required to cut"},{"speaker":"Chris 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to lay"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1279.89,"endTime":1282.26,"body":"off the under performers,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1282.26,"endTime":1283.19,"body":"everybody will go no."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1283.19,"endTime":1284.1200000000001,"body":"Wait, not Chris."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1284.1200000000001,"endTime":1284.75,"body":"I know him."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1284.75,"endTime":1285.71,"body":"He is a good guy."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1285.79,"endTime":1290.3300000000002,"body":"Just because the organization"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1285.79,"endTime":1290.3300000000002,"body":"doesn't want you to be, working"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1290.3300000000002,"endTime":1292.97,"body":"together between each other"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1290.3300000000002,"endTime":1292.97,"body":"doesn't mean you can't have a"},{"speaker":"Chris 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have"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1315.015,"endTime":1318.645,"body":"a negative relationship"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1318.645,"endTime":1321.435,"body":"when you've got a one-on-one"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1318.645,"endTime":1321.435,"body":"connection with somebody."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1321.96,"endTime":1322.8,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1323.1000000000001,"endTime":1326.1000000000001,"body":"More often than not you"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1323.1000000000001,"endTime":1326.1000000000001,"body":"find that they'll ask these"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1326.1000000000001,"endTime":1328.3200000000002,"body":"questions, they start to"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1326.1000000000001,"endTime":1328.3200000000002,"body":"understand what you are doing"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1328.3200000000002,"endTime":1330.42,"body":"better, and then when that"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1328.3200000000002,"endTime":1330.42,"body":"conversation's being had,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1330.42,"endTime":1333.8500000000001,"body":"they say no, I know Chris has"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1330.42,"endTime":1333.8500000000001,"body":"been working on and they've"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1333.8500000000001,"endTime":1335.17,"body":"got a long list of things."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1335.17,"endTime":1338.3600000000001,"body":"And it's, there's more"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1335.17,"endTime":1338.3600000000001,"body":"advocates at your back."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1338.81,"endTime":1340.085,"body":"It's never a bad thing to have."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1340.7,"endTime":1341.81,"body":"Never a bad thing."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1342.38,"endTime":1343.8500000000001,"body":"I wanna finish"},{"speaker":"David 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Williams","startTime":1524.1200000000001,"endTime":1526.8500000000001,"body":"Not about where you're"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1524.1200000000001,"endTime":1526.8500000000001,"body":"doing it, it's about"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1526.8500000000001,"endTime":1528.3200000000002,"body":"you're not getting it done."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1528.3200000000002,"endTime":1530.9,"body":"So I think one of"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1528.3200000000002,"endTime":1530.9,"body":"the things that has."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1531.7250000000001,"endTime":1536.7350000000001,"body":"Return to office is an easy"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1531.7250000000001,"endTime":1536.7350000000001,"body":"whipping post upon which to hang"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1536.7350000000001,"endTime":1539.4650000000001,"body":"your poor management hat on."},{"speaker":"Chris 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Rice","startTime":1562.665,"endTime":1565.155,"body":"are like the appearance of"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1562.665,"endTime":1565.155,"body":"work getting done, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1565.605,"endTime":1568.335,"body":"I find every time you"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1565.605,"endTime":1568.335,"body":"do that, what happens?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1568.335,"endTime":1570.275,"body":"People find a way"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1568.335,"endTime":1570.275,"body":"to game the system."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1570.315,"endTime":1571.345,"body":"So they did"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1571.365,"endTime":1572.6200000000001,"body":"the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1571.365,"endTime":1572.6200000000001,"body":"little mouse movers."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1572.6200000000001,"endTime":1573.43,"body":"The mouse movers."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1574.21,"endTime":1576.67,"body":"People just pretending to"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1574.21,"endTime":1576.67,"body":"type and not really doing"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1576.67,"endTime":1577.69,"body":"much of anything, you know?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1577.8,"endTime":1577.8600000000001,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1577.8600000000001,"endTime":1581.68,"body":"It's one of those things"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1577.8600000000001,"endTime":1581.68,"body":"that long ago I reinvented"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1581.68,"endTime":1584.05,"body":"the compensation system"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1581.68,"endTime":1584.05,"body":"for all of Microsoft."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1584.6200000000001,"endTime":1587.29,"body":"We changed every single one"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1584.6200000000001,"endTime":1587.29,"body":"of, at the time, there were"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1587.29,"endTime":1589.42,"body":"33,000 employees or something."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1589.42,"endTime":1591.49,"body":"We changed every single"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1589.42,"endTime":1591.49,"body":"person's compensation."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1591.49,"endTime":1594.8200000000002,"body":"In the process of doing"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1591.49,"endTime":1594.8200000000002,"body":"that compensation analysis"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1594.8200000000002,"endTime":1597.64,"body":"and revamp, we talked with"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1594.8200000000002,"endTime":1597.64,"body":"some of the world's leading"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1597.97,"endTime":1601.2250000000001,"body":"compensation experts and time"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1597.97,"endTime":1601.2250000000001,"body":"and time again they said, the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1601.2250000000001,"endTime":1604.7350000000001,"body":"most difficult thing to do in"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1601.2250000000001,"endTime":1604.7350000000001,"body":"a compensation system is to"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1604.7350000000001,"endTime":1608.9950000000001,"body":"make sure that you monitor the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1604.7350000000001,"endTime":1608.9950000000001,"body":"result that you want, not the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1608.9950000000001,"endTime":1610.555,"body":"results you think you want."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1610.585,"endTime":1613.105,"body":"Because as you see,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1610.585,"endTime":1613.105,"body":"for example, it's very"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1613.105,"endTime":1614.575,"body":"common in sales circles."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1614.575,"endTime":1617.9850000000001,"body":"For example, if you give"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1614.575,"endTime":1617.9850000000001,"body":"people a payment, a commission"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1617.9850000000001,"endTime":1619.665,"body":"based on the sale, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1620.005,"endTime":1623.125,"body":"People will sell stuff that"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1620.005,"endTime":1623.125,"body":"people don't want just to"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1623.125,"endTime":1626.395,"body":"get the sale, even though the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1623.125,"endTime":1626.395,"body":"return will come back later."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1626.755,"endTime":1628.285,"body":"So then you have to,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1626.755,"endTime":1628.285,"body":"oh wait, no, we got a"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1628.285,"endTime":1629.2150000000001,"body":"credit for the return."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1629.2150000000001,"endTime":1632.035,"body":"Or you'll get these stupid"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1629.2150000000001,"endTime":1632.035,"body":"behaviors where people rush"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1632.035,"endTime":1634.285,"body":"orders through at the end of"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1632.035,"endTime":1634.285,"body":"the quarter and then have no"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1634.285,"endTime":1636.385,"body":"orders for the beginning of the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1634.285,"endTime":1636.385,"body":"next quarter, and then rushing"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1636.385,"endTime":1637.105,"body":"through the end of the quarter."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1637.525,"endTime":1641.185,"body":"So compensation systems are"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1637.525,"endTime":1641.185,"body":"exactly the model for that."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1641.185,"endTime":1644.875,"body":"The minute you set out"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1641.185,"endTime":1644.875,"body":"some objective, people"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1644.875,"endTime":1647.125,"body":"will figure out a way"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1644.875,"endTime":1647.125,"body":"to gain that objective."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1647.76,"endTime":1650.31,"body":"You have to make sure your"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1647.76,"endTime":1650.31,"body":"objectives are clear and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1650.31,"endTime":1652.2,"body":"related to the business at hand."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1652.2,"endTime":1656.01,"body":"Really relatable to the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1652.2,"endTime":1656.01,"body":"business, as you said, mouse"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1656.01,"endTime":1661.0800000000002,"body":"movers and key twiddles to make"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1656.01,"endTime":1661.0800000000002,"body":"it look like I'm busy, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1661.3500000000001,"endTime":1661.68,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1661.73,"endTime":1663.6200000000001,"body":"As long as people have"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1661.73,"endTime":1663.6200000000001,"body":"been getting paid to work,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1663.6200000000001,"endTime":1665.5700000000002,"body":"they've been figuring"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1663.6200000000001,"endTime":1665.5700000000002,"body":"out how to look busy,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1665.67,"endTime":1669.24,"body":"but the point"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1665.67,"endTime":1669.24,"body":"is, people who are pretending"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1669.24,"endTime":1672.9450000000002,"body":"to work, you should be able to"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1669.24,"endTime":1672.9450000000002,"body":"see that in their work, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1672.9450000000002,"endTime":1673.755,"body":"In"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1672.9450000000002,"endTime":1673.755,"body":"their productivity."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1674.545,"endTime":1676.105,"body":"They're"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1674.545,"endTime":1676.105,"body":"not getting stuff done."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1676.435,"endTime":1678.935,"body":"And then the other thing I"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1676.435,"endTime":1678.935,"body":"so I make that comment and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1678.935,"endTime":1680.7050000000002,"body":"I say, yeah, but what about"},{"speaker":"Chris 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content."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1741.8200000000002,"endTime":1744.8500000000001,"body":"I got a quarter of a million"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1741.8200000000002,"endTime":1744.8500000000001,"body":"followers on TikTok, which is"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1744.8500000000001,"endTime":1747.1000000000001,"body":"just always a my amazing to me."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1747.43,"endTime":1751.3600000000001,"body":"I'm also on YouTube and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1747.43,"endTime":1751.3600000000001,"body":"LinkedIn and Bluesky and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1751.3600000000001,"endTime":1752.74,"body":"Threads and everywhere."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1753.085,"endTime":1760.615,"body":"If you search for"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1753.085,"endTime":1760.615,"body":"CLWill, you will find me."},{"speaker":"Chris 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let's talk."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1776.69,"endTime":1778.01,"body":"The last thing"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1776.69,"endTime":1778.01,"body":"we always do before we"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1778.01,"endTime":1780.2,"body":"sign off the podcast is"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1778.01,"endTime":1780.2,"body":"a little tradition here."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1780.2,"endTime":1782.3300000000002,"body":"I turn it over to you, you"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1780.2,"endTime":1782.3300000000002,"body":"get to ask me a question."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1782.3300000000002,"endTime":1782.99,"body":"Anything you want."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1783.0800000000002,"endTime":1784.8500000000001,"body":"Doesn't have to be about"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1783.0800000000002,"endTime":1784.8500000000001,"body":"the topic, but it can be."},{"speaker":"Chris 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and"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1817.65,"endTime":1820.8300000000002,"body":"I'm like a talent acquisition"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1817.65,"endTime":1820.8300000000002,"body":"manager or trying to figure out"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1820.8300000000002,"endTime":1822.56,"body":"that, or am I, am I compliance?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1822.56,"endTime":1823.22,"body":"Am I payroll?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1823.22,"endTime":1825.47,"body":"Am I gonna focus on"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1823.22,"endTime":1825.47,"body":"one specific area?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1825.89,"endTime":1828.41,"body":"Other folks, I think they're"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1825.89,"endTime":1828.41,"body":"kinda looking at it like,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1828.41,"endTime":1832.31,"body":"this is a tool, it's not"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1828.41,"endTime":1832.31,"body":"gonna fully replace the"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1832.31,"endTime":1833.8400000000001,"body":"need for like human input."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1833.9,"endTime":1835.5800000000002,"body":"And also somebody's"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1833.9,"endTime":1835.5800000000002,"body":"gotta monitor it, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1836.15,"endTime":1839.72,"body":"So I think there's a"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1836.15,"endTime":1839.72,"body":"level of mixture in it."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1839.72,"endTime":1841.4,"body":"Some folks are getting"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1839.72,"endTime":1841.4,"body":"a little nervous."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1841.97,"endTime":1845.18,"body":"And I think wanting to figure"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1841.97,"endTime":1845.18,"body":"out, like they wanna open"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1845.18,"endTime":1847.7,"body":"another door if nothing"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1845.18,"endTime":1847.7,"body":"else, just to see like what"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1847.7,"endTime":1848.9,"body":"a, what's on the other side."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1849.56,"endTime":1852.02,"body":"And also, a lot of these"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1849.56,"endTime":1852.02,"body":"folks are overwhelmed"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1852.02,"endTime":1852.68,"body":"right now, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1852.68,"endTime":1853.94,"body":"State of the world"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1852.68,"endTime":1853.94,"body":"kind of thing."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1853.94,"endTime":1857.72,"body":"People are asking a lot of"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1853.94,"endTime":1857.72,"body":"questions and they've got a"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1857.72,"endTime":1860.0,"body":"lot of people in their face"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1857.72,"endTime":1860.0,"body":"asking 'em the same questions"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1860.0,"endTime":1861.2,"body":"about ai and they don't know."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1861.74,"endTime":1864.8300000000002,"body":"It's interesting timing because"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1861.74,"endTime":1864.8300000000002,"body":"I think a lot of people are"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1864.8300000000002,"endTime":1867.23,"body":"thinking like, I gotta figure"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1864.8300000000002,"endTime":1867.23,"body":"out what that next thing is."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1867.65,"endTime":1869.8700000000001,"body":"But there's a level of"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1867.65,"endTime":1869.8700000000001,"body":"we're not there yet, though."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1870.3500000000001,"endTime":1871.3700000000001,"body":"We've got time."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1871.52,"endTime":1874.23,"body":"It's gonna be a while before"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1871.52,"endTime":1874.23,"body":"this thing just completely,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1874.5900000000001,"endTime":1876.93,"body":"it's like I, I was saying to"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1874.5900000000001,"endTime":1876.93,"body":"somebody on a podcast just"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1876.93,"endTime":1880.3200000000002,"body":"last week about, I saw this"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1876.93,"endTime":1880.3200000000002,"body":"study from MIT and this guy"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1880.3200000000002,"endTime":1883.65,"body":"was like, his management expert"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1880.3200000000002,"endTime":1883.65,"body":"was like, there's no meaningful"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1883.65,"endTime":1886.74,"body":"work that a human being does"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1883.65,"endTime":1886.74,"body":"that AI is ready to replace it"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1886.74,"endTime":1889.8300000000002,"body":"this time, or will be probably"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1886.74,"endTime":1889.8300000000002,"body":"for the next year or two."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1889.88,"endTime":1892.46,"body":"I think for that generalist"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1889.88,"endTime":1892.46,"body":"crowd, that's a good"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1892.46,"endTime":1893.3,"body":"thing to keep in mind."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1893.3,"endTime":1895.43,"body":"Like you're still going to"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1893.3,"endTime":1895.43,"body":"have to be there to manage"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1895.43,"endTime":1896.6000000000001,"body":"the thing and monitor it."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1896.6000000000001,"endTime":1898.45,"body":"What is it saying,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1896.6000000000001,"endTime":1898.45,"body":"is it actually put,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1898.69,"endTime":1899.74,"body":"are the outputs good?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1900.79,"endTime":1902.23,"body":"They've got a little"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1900.79,"endTime":1902.23,"body":"time, but they should."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1902.65,"endTime":1903.76,"body":"It's on everybody's mind."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1904.1200000000001,"endTime":1906.13,"body":"I think one"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1904.1200000000001,"endTime":1906.13,"body":"of the things that I take"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1906.49,"endTime":1910.15,"body":"solace in is that if you look"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1906.49,"endTime":1910.15,"body":"at the output of any of these"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1910.15,"endTime":1914.3400000000001,"body":"things, if you look at output"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1910.15,"endTime":1914.3400000000001,"body":"of, ChatGPT writing or writing"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1914.3400000000001,"endTime":1918.72,"body":"code, or the answers to quite"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1914.3400000000001,"endTime":1918.72,"body":"the answers are mid, right?"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1919.1100000000001,"endTime":1920.01,"body":"They're fine."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1920.01,"endTime":1921.0,"body":"That'll do."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1921.3600000000001,"endTime":1924.63,"body":"So I think what it does is it"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1921.3600000000001,"endTime":1924.63,"body":"puts pressure on people who"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1924.63,"endTime":1928.29,"body":"are mid, that'll do in whatever"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1924.63,"endTime":1928.29,"body":"you're doing, that you're"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1928.29,"endTime":1929.67,"body":"gonna get pressure from that."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1929.67,"endTime":1931.1100000000001,"body":"So you need to up your game."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1931.1100000000001,"endTime":1933.21,"body":"You need to be better"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1931.1100000000001,"endTime":1933.21,"body":"and smarter and a better"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1933.21,"endTime":1934.44,"body":"communicator and a better."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1935.19,"endTime":1938.6100000000001,"body":"Whatever you do in order"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1935.19,"endTime":1938.6100000000001,"body":"to differentiate yourself"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1938.6100000000001,"endTime":1942.5700000000002,"body":"from the mid that is being"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1938.6100000000001,"endTime":1942.5700000000002,"body":"automated behind you, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1942.78,"endTime":1943.68,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1943.68,"endTime":1946.0,"body":"I think, if you look at"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1943.68,"endTime":1946.0,"body":"it like if you're that"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1946.0,"endTime":1947.44,"body":"generalist and you're being"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1946.0,"endTime":1947.44,"body":"asked these questions,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1947.44,"endTime":1948.8200000000002,"body":"think about the next steps."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1948.8200000000002,"endTime":1950.8600000000001,"body":"Yes, it can answer this,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1948.8200000000002,"endTime":1950.8600000000001,"body":"but like that's another"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1950.8600000000001,"endTime":1953.05,"body":"layer of value that I"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1950.8600000000001,"endTime":1953.05,"body":"can add to the person."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1953.39,"endTime":1956.48,"body":"As a content creator, you've"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1953.39,"endTime":1956.48,"body":"probably used it probably to"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1956.48,"endTime":1959.18,"body":"write a script or something"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1956.48,"endTime":1959.18,"body":"like that, but what happens?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1959.675,"endTime":1961.355,"body":"Even though it's getting"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1959.675,"endTime":1961.355,"body":"more sophisticated and it"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1961.355,"endTime":1963.665,"body":"still writes pretty good now."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1963.9950000000001,"endTime":1966.4850000000001,"body":"The one thing I would say"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1963.9950000000001,"endTime":1966.4850000000001,"body":"is it's not a particularly"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1966.4850000000001,"endTime":1971.075,"body":"talented storyteller and it"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1966.4850000000001,"endTime":1971.075,"body":"can't add human value to it."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1971.4950000000001,"endTime":1972.9650000000001,"body":"That's where you can thrive,"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1973.2050000000002,"endTime":1974.7050000000002,"body":"it"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1973.2050000000002,"endTime":1974.7050000000002,"body":"tends to be verbose."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1975.095,"endTime":1978.335,"body":"It also tends to try and"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1975.095,"endTime":1978.335,"body":"play down the middle."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1978.9650000000001,"endTime":1983.615,"body":"One of the things that you can"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1978.9650000000001,"endTime":1983.615,"body":"do as an individual is emphasize"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1983.615,"endTime":1987.185,"body":"the corners, emphasize the"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1983.615,"endTime":1987.185,"body":"edges, emphasize the extremes"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1987.185,"endTime":1991.505,"body":"in one way or another, because"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1987.185,"endTime":1991.505,"body":"being down the middle is"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1991.805,"endTime":1994.895,"body":"interesting, but it's not really"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":1991.805,"endTime":1994.895,"body":"what provides human value."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1995.145,"endTime":1997.305,"body":"And it's not"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1995.145,"endTime":1997.305,"body":"what people consume, right?"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1997.425,"endTime":2000.395,"body":"People don't remember down"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":1997.425,"endTime":2000.395,"body":"the middle when you have a"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2000.395,"endTime":2003.2050000000002,"body":"point of view or a stance"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2000.395,"endTime":2003.2050000000002,"body":"sort of that you're taking."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2003.415,"endTime":2004.375,"body":"People do remember that."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":2004.615,"endTime":2004.885,"body":"Yep."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2005.2250000000001,"endTime":2006.515,"body":"Chris, as"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2005.2250000000001,"endTime":2006.515,"body":"always, it's been a"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2006.7250000000001,"endTime":2007.655,"body":"pleasure talking with you."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":2007.925,"endTime":2008.585,"body":"I loved it."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":2008.585,"endTime":2009.24,"body":"Thank you very much."},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":2009.4550000000002,"endTime":2010.835,"body":"It's a pleasure"},{"speaker":"Chris Williams","startTime":2009.4550000000002,"endTime":2010.835,"body":"talking to you too."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2011.845,"endTime":2012.2050000000002,"body":"All right."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2012.2050000000002,"endTime":2013.525,"body":"Listeners, until next time."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2013.525,"endTime":2015.265,"body":"If you haven't done so"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2013.525,"endTime":2015.265,"body":"already, head on over,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2015.265,"endTime":2017.815,"body":"sign up for the People"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2015.265,"endTime":2017.815,"body":"Managing People newsletter,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2017.815,"endTime":2020.895,"body":"peoplemanagingpeople.com/subscribe."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2020.9650000000001,"endTime":2023.425,"body":"And until then,"},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2020.9650000000001,"endTime":2023.425,"body":"color in the corners."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2023.815,"endTime":2024.505,"body":"Avoid the middle."},{"speaker":"David Rice","startTime":2024.7450000000001,"endTime":2026.155,"body":"Let ChatGPT do the middle."}]}