Money Minded

#118 Cam Nagle | How to buy a 'boring' business (that builds your wealth)

• Terry Condon

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Cam was stuck. He’d thought building wealth through real estate would be his vehicle to financial freedom, but hit a serviceability ceiling.

He’d tried different careers, but nothing had really stuck. He was burned out and knew he had to reassess things.

So when he came across the concept of buying an established business, he looked a little harder than most.

And he found some genuine opportunities. But even though it’s a ‘buyers market’, it wasn’t easy. Finding the right business and securing finance came with some effort - but he made it happen.

And in this episode he takes you inside the process and explains how it all works.

Expect to learn:

  • Why he prefers business over real estate as his vehicle
  • Why buying business is a buyers market
  • How he got the deal done by getting two variables right
  • How he’s improving his asset from day one

Owning a business is the most likely way to build wealth, and buying one that’s already been built is the ultimate cheat code. In this ep, you’ll see why.

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Hello there, legend. Welcome back to the show. And you may have noticed over the last few episodes, there's been a bit of a business theme emerging we had Brid Fox come on and talk about how she used money mapping to build a bit of a runway. To get started building a tech business. And then we had favorites, Helen and Chase come back on the show and talk about how they come back to their roots, start a business around their original skill sets and started working together as a team. Wanted to keep that theme going. There's another conversation I had more recently with one of our guys, Cameron, and he dropped a comment on one of my posts and talked about a series that we did. earlier on this year called Debt Smart. You may remember this. It's episodes 95 to 102. We dropped a bit of a nugget in that series. We talked about how using debt to buy boring businesses from burned out boomers is the best opportunity no one is looking at or talking about in our space. I think everybody thinks it's really complex. Everybody thinks it's really complicated. Too hard. Don't know how to do it. But we've got it. Cameron didn't. Cameron picked it up, he ran with that insight, and actually went and explored it, and he made it happen. So, when he told me that he'd done this, He went and got debt, bought a boom business and is now running it. I reached out to him and said, mate, you've got to come on the show, you've got to talk us through the whole process. So expect to learn how and why he got started with debt in real estate and ultimately why he's chosen business as his vehicle. Why right now is a buyer's market, how he negotiated using the two factors, he must get right in any deal. How he's adding value to expand his margins from day one. Buying a business is the ultimate cheat code. You don't have to get the whole thing going. It's an established income stream from day one. And in Cameron's case, this income stream can very well far exceed what he was earning for the rest of his life. And he's bought this income stream for a fraction of the price that you would buy most properties these days. You've got more control over that value creation process and you can do it your way. So if you want to know what it looks like to take a bit more of an unconventional route, go off the beaten path and try something a bit different, have a listen to this episode. I hope this inspires you to keep thinking broadly about all the different ways you can accomplish your financial goals.

Tex:

Cam Nagel, welcome to the show, mate.

Cam:

Thank you for having me, Terry.

Tex:

So, listen. Might have been three or four weeks ago now, I put up a post on LinkedIn the post was sort of talking about what we covered in our debt series, which is earlier on this year. And we talked about like what we covered in that series and why I think it's so important for people to get across. And there was a couple of little things in that series, a couple of little nuggets that when you sent your comments, I was like, Cam actually saw that nugget and he made good use of it. and it was all about using debt to buy boomers businesses who were burnt out and just wanted to get some kind of return on their effort. Mate, you're somebody that has done that. I want to start from where you are right now, which is like you're what three, four weeks in, correct?

Cam:

yes, I'm coming up to, what are we at, two and a half months of being a business owner. New, new to it.

Tex:

so mate That's a quite a big decision and it's a decision that most folks won't make because it feels like there's a lot of unknowns on the other side of, it. How did you get there? Talk me through the journey

Cam:

It probably starts with finishing up high school, I'd say. Getting towards the end of year 12 and not really knowing what, I guess, I wanted to do. Didn't really even know, you know, the big, the big outside world of, of outside of school. so I ended up finding myself. Going to uni doing land surveying, which I kind of found myself in that because it was, I'd heard about it through friends and family. and so I gave it, yeah, went to uni, did that, and I guess could probably say that it, like, I wasn't, didn't love it.

Tex:

like, first career. You're not

Cam:

yeah.

Tex:

so bad, but yeah.

Cam:

Yeah, first career, I'll give this a shot. Yeah, sure, sounds all right. and went through, yeah, four years of uni, And then I guess getting towards the end of uni it was like, oh, all I want to do is just finish up uni and start working full time to start earning some money and all that. And then, I guess probably fast forward a few years of that into my mid 20s. I bought my first house, in Inverloch. So I grew up in Melbourne and then my adult life has been predominantly regional. it was after, I think it was after buying my first house, then I kind of started getting into the idea of financial independence and started kind of going down that path.

Tex:

And was this, did you feel like, this was, coming because of that sort of general dissatisfaction slash malaise with work, where you're like, well, this isn't it, like, is there a better way than this?

Cam:

yeah, I think so. I definitely, for quite a long time, Yeah, I guess wasn't really satisfied or fulfilled with work and was almost constantly looking for a way out and just had no idea what it was, if it was, a career change or, at that point in time in my mid twenties, business was like not on my radar at all.

Tex:

Mmm.

Cam:

the thing that I was getting quite interested in with The going down the financial independence kind of path, was real estate investment. and, so I was getting, right into, I was following a guy, uh, Conrad Bobulak. I was, watching his content. I went to,

Tex:

is he the Greek guy?

Cam:

yeah, yeah, great for a watch, like he is, just even for his comedic value, great. And, yeah, I went to a few of his seminars, And, they were really interesting. I read, I think I actually started with one of his books after kind of finding him on YouTube. I started reading his book, and before I finished the book, I'd I, bought my first real estate investment, like, oh crap, what have I done?

Tex:

Yeah. Yeah.

Cam:

a little two bed unit, in Geelong, in the suburb of Whittington. and, I guess it was, really soon after that I hit, hit a wall with finance. And, still kind of wanting that. Probably way out of work from a bit of dissatisfaction. wondering how I could kind of get to this place of financial independence. Not even really knowing what it was to be honest. and started trying to pivot. I knew that my finance was really limited by, it was my debt to income ratio. So. So, the one thing that I knew that I could control was my income, and I guess that was really starting to drive, okay, do I look at a career change? Do I, what can I do? And then started, I guess, finding out about business. And

Tex:

It was around this time when you started with us, right? Because I I, I, I remember this conversation, it was like we were talking about real estate and then sort of stuck here and then what next? Was that about the same time?

Cam:

yeah, so I think I was talking to you, like, first talking to you and doing that. Live by Design session, it was about July last year. and, I was, yeah, I guess around then, starting to touch on business, had seen, I guess some,

Tex:

yeah,

Cam:

other people in my

Tex:

road of, you were going down the road of learning a bit of sales stuff and training like business type skills. You're investing in that, pretty.

Cam:

yeah, now that you mentioned that, yeah, that was one of the things that I was, one of the kind of career changes that I was looking at was sales. And because I knew that was a very, I guess like valuable skill and something applied to any industry. And so, I hadn't yet no experience in sales. So one thing I thought I'd do is, all right, let's try and get some experience. so I did a course through 7th level. if, if anyone's heard of them, Jeremy Minor is the like head of that. And I thought at least if I do a course. And so it would then show to potential employers that, no, I don't have experience but hey, like, I'm invested in this, so I've like forked out the money to do a course of a few thousand dollars. Like, it's not a insignificant amount. So I started doing that. and then I Ended up having a, uh, like, an interview, I guess, with a company that was selling survey equipment and I kind of saw that as my way into sales because I did surveying as like, you know, my previous job. It's like, Oh, hang on. I could kind of use that knowledge of the, I guess the equipment and what it does. and then. That could be my step into sales, which that, that fell through. They ended up, taking on someone who worked for one of their competitors. Okay. Yup. I mean, you'd be stupid not to go with him.

Tex:

Yeah.

Cam:

So yeah, I guess I was trying to I was trying to like improve myself and invest in myself to open up opportunities.

Tex:

Mm. And that would have been in the direction of debt to income ratio, right? You're like, oh, this is a way that I can build this extra skill, potentially make it extra money and then solve for this problem here.

Cam:

Yeah, yeah, I could see sales as being, yeah, I guess having quite a high ceiling in terms of income potential the better you get, whether you go down like A commission type pay structure, and I guess with the idea of yeah, funneling that back into the real estate investing, and just building that portfolio up.

Tex:

Yeah. And how did the actual practice of money mapping, how did that all come into it for you? Was it part of that where you wanted to build a bit more of a runway or was it more you just getting as much space for servicing debt as possible? How did that play into it?

Cam:

So I guess probably my first priority with the money mapping was the cash cushion. and I think I roughly, I think I set a goal of about 30, 000 and it was to be a, like a good few months worth of expenses. and I'd got to about, 6, 000 to 7, 000 in the, in the cash cushion, and then not gave up on it, but then I was like, Oh, well, I kind of feel comfortable with that. And then. to, I guess, the future goals and then started pumping the money into that.

Tex:

Yep. Yep.

Cam:

so one of, yeah, one of my goals was to either start or buy a business. And then there was other ones like to buy a four wheel drive, slash caravan, kind of fund for the lifestyle. I think there was a traveling one in there. so once I got the cash cushion up, I then really started to focus on putting money into the, the buy or, start a business account because of the potential of the business to earn me money. I thought, well, if I, Make that my priority then the business no matter what the business is That's then going to be out to take money from that and put it into the other goals So because my highest priority really started to become A business of some sort,

Tex:

talk me through that decision around, so the focus from the cash cushion. It's an interesting one, isn't it? Because. There is no, everyone says like, how much should I have in the savings? And I'm like, well, what's your situation? Because let's say you're a doctor, you're single, you've got no dependents, you've got one of the most reliable incomes that works really hard for you all of the time and you got great loan capacity. So. I probably wouldn't really have much in savings if I was a single doctor. Like I wouldn't actually keep much of a cash cushion at all. But for us, when we're starting our business, I'm like, I want to have a year's cash cushion once I'm starting the business because it's not an established business. We've got to build it from the ground up. So we actually don't know how it's going to play out. So how did you think through? Is it just like a feeling where you're like, no, I actually feel secure enough at this point to be able to sort of shift the focus and I want to get more aggressive now.

Cam:

probably, the point where I started was like, yup, business and really started pushing it was, August last year, I did my first course with Aaron Sansoni. And that was, so that was a three day course, deep diving on. effectively deal making and, and, acquiring businesses. they kind of go deep into the aim is to effectively acquire a business with no money down, which there's several ways to do. But I think for me, the big eye opener from that course was how different of an asset type business is as opposed to real estate. because it's quite shocking because real estate, you're ways that you can increase the value of real estate. It's like, well, you do some capital works to it or you just sit, wait it out You know, like you can make,

Tex:

prints a shit ton of money

Cam:

yeah, you can, you can,

Tex:

lot of migration to, your area. Yeah.

Cam:

yep. And you sit there, you're renting it out. You might, the price might double in 10 years or whatever. but yeah, business surprised me at how different of a beast it is, how it's valued and. There's so many more ways that you can impact the value of a business, as opposed to how you can impact the value of real estate. I already knew at that point that I was like interested in business from you guys, I think quite early days you did a business section that was like two or three episodes or something. Like I, I heard I listened to that, must have been like roughly mid last year, and yeah, really liked it. Then did this, this business course, which was like, alright, I'm like going all in on this. This is my, I guess, my vehicle to that kind of financial, financial independence rather than real estate. and now real estate is just like, like

Tex:

Yeah.

Cam:

they'd sit there and they cost me money. I was like, I almost would rather piss them off. But I mean, they ended up allowing me to,

Tex:

appreciate the value of your real estate. Let's, let's call it, let's say another three years, right? So, business is running and you actually appreciate that there's wealth outside of, the business.

Cam:

yeah, diversifying it.

Tex:

Yeah, well, you're just Like, okay, it's not all concentrated in there. I've got some out. You'll appreciate, I think you'll really appreciate it then.

Cam:

Yeah, yeah,

Tex:

yeah, cool. So you got, you sort of started jumping in. You're like, oh, this is an asset class. Is more interesting because there's more that I can do with it and there's more it sounds to me as well like the thing that I've gotten from you in our conversations, that first conversation, the second one with life by design, it's like you actually just love the process of learning as well

Cam:

yeah,

Tex:

like you've just followed that for that and businesses like you're never not learning in business or you're dead. Is that part of it

Cam:

yeah.

Tex:

of the enticement? Yeah

Cam:

I guess, yeah, at this kind of point I am, I'm loving, growth, development, learning. And that, like, you guys talk about that, you know, you're moving to energy, moving away from energy. I, I guess kind of finished up uni, got into a full time job and spent most of my 20s, in I guess a bit of a mindset of like, I don't want to learn ever again because I'm like so done with schooling in the uni system,

Tex:

yeah.

Cam:

that I guess just became stagnant and then just kind of like started plodding, plodding along in the full time job and Towards my later 20s, I found myself, hit like a real big bout of depression that probably went for like six months, potentially even more. and I guess what came out of that was that, I guess one of the big things was like I wanted to, to change, develop. grow, and didn't want to be that kind of stagnant person anymore. So

Tex:

mm

Cam:

left old him behind and, yeah, and I was like, right, how can I, I guess, not be in that situation again?

Tex:

When was the realization for you that it was linked to growth, development, evolution of you as a person where you're like, this is actually what I need to be doing? Is there, can you pinpoint the moment where you made that realization? Where it's like, it's actually not about my circumstances, it's about how I'm approaching my circumstances or looking at them and what I'm doing with them. Is there a,

Cam:

Yeah, I think one, one thing that I really remember is, Even when I was feeling quite down in, this was in 2019, I actually decided to do a photography, photography course. Uh, it was something that I was kind of interested in And I thought, oh, like what better way and what quicker way to learn than pay for a course and, and learn, you know, accelerate my learning, I guess. And I didn't actually finish the course I didn't get through it, but it did, I guess, was a bit of a light bulb moment in terms of, Oh, actually learning can be interesting and fun when you are learning something that you want to learn, not something that you are forced to learn, you know, in the kind of schooling system, I guess. So, yeah, that kind of, that sticks out as a bit of a catalyst to like, all right, I'll see you next time. Like, let's actually learn.

Tex:

You

Cam:

Like, like,

Tex:

don't think that's I think it happens to all of us, but some of us figure it out and others don't. I count myself really lucky because distinctly remember feeling like that, like out of uni, you're sort of like two, three years beyond it. And the like formal pathway where you do what you're told, or you sort of have it laid out for you, that's gone. And then you You slowly get to a point where you go, well, what's, you kind of just don't feel that good anymore. You don't just, there's no, like you said, there's no growth evolution. And the girlfriend that I was with at the time, she was reading books I was like, that's interesting. What would you do that for?

Cam:

yeah.

Tex:

That's quite a quaint habit. You're like reading books and I'm like, what are you reading? And so I start sort of looking into the book she's reading and she's getting into a lot of self helpy sort of stuff. And so I read a couple of these books and, and, I'm like, wow, that just made me really think about things really differently. and then, uh, that same sort of light bulb where I was like, huh, hang on. I could do it because I wanted to do it. Not because somebody told me to do it. And the way I feel about that is completely different. It's just, it's quite interesting, isn't it? Like. It probably shows you how regimented or how overly rigid the sort of structure is and the, the relationship it creates to the concept of learning. I

Cam:

Yeah. Yup. It's yeah, it should be, I guess, fun and enjoyable and not I guess, yeah, I guess like the structured system of schooling and exams and all that is quite stressful and I guess, really, puts us off, puts us off wanting to learn.

Tex:

mean, I've talked about it before. I like, I think it's episode 88, Mitch and I did this deep dive into decisions. I see a lot of folks struggle to make decisions, just make decisions. You know what I mean? Like just make them. And it's, I kind of looked at it, I'm like, I feel like we have this negative relationship with decisions because the time that we were forced to make decisions when we were young is when we were being assessed and most of those assessments usually came with some sort of projection about Our potential or our future and it sort of gave us some sort of label It's like you're either one of the smart kids or you're kind of like one of the struggling kids or you're a battler That definitely felt like that for me where i'm like, I I reject Having to make this if I don't want to make decisions now, I don't want to have to And I feel like that that That does come into it, and particularly around money, because money's this thing where we just have very low tolerance for failure around, because I think we, I guess we sort of conflate or we sort of mash our self worth into it somehow,

Cam:

Mmm.

Tex:

to make decisions with the money. But you've kind of worked your way through that. You've worked your way through it, so I'm really, I'm really glad you're here. I'm really interested to sort of go, how was that sort of journey? Was that always normal for you or is it, know it's a pattern that we see when folks come into our process and they start doing the money mapping, the actual decision making every month, they start to become more comfortable making bigger ones. Buying a business is quite a big decision. What would you sort of, how would you sort of get from where you were to there?

Cam:

I guess once I'd, I'd bought that second property, and that was, you know, a big financial decision, but I think the, uh, the money mapping just really helps to almost, I guess ease the mind in terms of like, oh, if things don't work out,

Tex:

What would you do?

Cam:

Like the cash cushion like okay, well, I've got a personal expenses. I've got a couple of months up my sleeve

Tex:

Mm.

Cam:

and thing for me was I was much more interested in an existing business than a startup

Tex:

Yeah.

Cam:

because of effectively you're So, I guess around buying an existing business, I knew that I wasn't going to sink it straight away.

Tex:

Mm.

Cam:

and then I guess as I got further down the path of purchasing this particular business, I kind of, just talking to the owners, got a feel for how it would work. I guess genuine they were, and the staff they had in place,

Tex:

Mm hmm.

Cam:

felt that, okay, like there's really knowledgeable staff here in place, I'm not going to be hands off, I'm definitely going to have to be involved, but I guess the more I got into it, the more it made sense to me.

Tex:

Mm.

Cam:

I guess because spent money on, invested money in myself in learning and so, I guess in a way like knowledge is power. yeah, I could kind of, I could actually see, see that it could work out. so

Tex:

What about having, what about being in the room with other people who are doing it and who have sort of normalized it, right? Like, I think there's, we've talked about it before, but social gravity, like, in the room with people who, is just a normal part of what they do. Their, your goals are their habits. Basically. And they're like,

Cam:

it's,

Tex:

we do.

Cam:

it makes, yeah, such a difference. What do people say? Show me your, uh, show me your five closest friends and I'll show you your future or whatever they say. But yeah, it is amazing, when you get around. and you start talking about it, and other people have done almost the same thing. And it's like, tell me more, tell me more, like, I'm shitting myself over, you know, thinking about doing this and what you've just done it.

Tex:

Yeah. Which, I mean, that's the reason I wanted to have you on the show, right? Because I do, believe that you have probably capitalised on the best opportunity, if not the best opportunity, one of the best opportunities our generation has to really get ahead. Which is to tap into ext established businesses already built where other people have done all the hard work and use debt as an accelerator to do it. there's two parts, which is normalizing the, I'm going to buy into somebody else's business and can I do a business thing? The second part is being okay with debt. Keen to delve into that part too, because that's specifically what you commented on around like really understanding debt. Getting comfortable with that and then being able to use that and think about it more broadly than just real estate. Talk to me more about that journey, that internal journey of like, debt's not a bad thing and actually, I'm going to take out a shit ton of debt and buy a business with it.

Cam:

and I think my, I think where I got comfortable with debt was probably my interest in the real estate investing in the start. And because going to those courses, I learned a lot about finance structure, and I guess the concept that, the concept of like bad debt and good debt.

Tex:

Mm.

Cam:

Get Robert Kiyosaki. I mean, like, you know, everyone almost starts with that book. but once you kind of, yeah, one side,

Tex:

that though, don't you? You sort of get, got to get to the granular with it, yeah.

Cam:

one side, I guess once I'd learned that debt could earn me money, And that it could pretty well almost like put money in my pocket, which wasn't happening with the properties at all, yeah, I guess that kind of built up a level of comfort. and, the business, yeah, what I kind of came to learn, or came to understand was if I'm going for, you know, An existing business rather than a startup. The existing business, you've got income day one, like you don't have to worry about that.

Tex:

positively geared.

Cam:

yeah. And. I guess you want to, you know, you want to buy a business, that I guess has some kind of team in place and not like, I don't know, you don't want to take over Jono's, Jim's mowing business where, you know, if he doesn't work, there's, he doesn't, so,

Tex:

Well, let's, let's dive into that then business selection, industry selection and where you landed with this, what you've bought in terms of like the industry that it's in, the specialty, and then also the location as well. So talk me through your thinking process. What kind of business is this?

Cam:

so the business is a curtains and blinds, retailer. we do a bit of manufacturing as well. So we, we make our own curtains and, she is in house, got, two seamstresses. and then most of the other products are purchased from a supplier, made to measure. So, so yeah. arrive at our website. at our office, I guess, and we go off and install them. So, yeah, there's, a few different factors going on in the business.

Tex:

Yeah. so you know, you would look at this and you go, Oh, curtains and blinds, but it's these in boarding businesses. They're the ones that, make the

Cam:

Oh, Cody!

Tex:

All the time, and I don't know, how many times, like it's so, it's such a trap, like I want to do the sexier business and I'm like, it's always inversely correlated, right? Like

Cam:

Yup,

Tex:

it looks, the harder or maybe the shitter it is. And the more boring it is, usually the better it goes. So let's just talk like broadly where you're like curtains and blinds. Yeah, that's going to be, that's going to be good growth potential for me. There's, I can see myself really turning that into an asset. Or, you know, working into an asset where I can really build some wealth out of it. Why'd you go there?

Cam:

so, My, I guess, previous job, I was in residential land development, I'd done the surveying quite some years ago and then I guess transitioned from surveying into construction management.

Tex:

Mm

Cam:

so that put me in a role where I was managing, the civil construction of mainly residential estates. so I was seeing development and I was working like in the Latrobe Valley area, Turalgon, Warragul. so I've seen development in the area, firsthand and then I guess once I saw this curtains and blinds business up for sale, it made sense to me like, well, I can see, I can see the new housing market.

Tex:

Yep.

Cam:

And that is, you know, growing and set to keep growing.

Tex:

Yep.

Cam:

and then I kind of, I guess, later found out that that's only really a small part of the business's actual customer market anyway. but,

Tex:

more commercial stuff there as well?

Cam:

uh, we don't, so there's, We don't do too much commercial, really the majority of the customer base is usually, older, older people, probably like 50, I'm just saying like 50s plus, and they're, they're either like renovating or just have the money to splash out on, rejuvenating their window furnishes.

Tex:

Mm. Yeah,

Cam:

the market, the new housing market. People do, we do see customers in that kind of area, but they're definitely, not the majority. I guess by the time people have built a house, they're kind of a little low on funds, and,

Tex:

yeah.

Cam:

yeah,

Tex:

Yeah, that first few years is, uh, definitely not when you need to make everything, or you want to look, maybe you're going to look for, you're just like, let's keep the house over our heads. that makes sense. So, so mostly this is older folks. and it's mostly them just wanting to make their home look nice and feel like they've got a good place to live as they get a bit older. Is that right? Mm hmm.

Cam:

yeah, look, they're probably, they're probably paid off their house, or if not, you know, don't have much debt left on it. and

Tex:

income, they're a steady source of demand, and a growing, I mean, I guess they're a growing population, aren't they? Like, more and more people are moving into that bracket.

Cam:

yeah,

Tex:

Over time and particularly you're in Taralgon.

Cam:

yeah, correct, Terralgan.

Tex:

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. So, okay, so you've gone curtains and blinds This area is gonna be really good. It is a steady source of demand Now what about the actual business itself Matt? What made this business a worthwhile? Consideration for you in the beginning, because it's one thing to say, yeah, let's go into that industry. Once nothing to buy a business, but then go that business there is worth buying. What were the markers that you looked out for that made you go? Yeah, this is taking a lot of boxes for me.

Cam:

I guess I, well, the first step was, reaching out to the broker and, and then you, you know, start getting information on the, on the business. and then the first meet with the, the broker and the vendors. and so I met them and, uh, straight away, like, got a. real strong feeling that they were, I guess, like, down to earth, genuine people. got a feeling that they definitely weren't trying to rip me off. got a feeling that they, you know, wanted to, wanted to see someone come on and, look after their,

Tex:

Client

Cam:

their, uh, well, no, sorry, look after their staff,

Tex:

Yeah.

Cam:

and, you know, take care of them, make sure that they, You know, remain in employment and, so I could, I kind of got a good feeling from the get go that, that were genuine and that I wasn't, wasn't getting ripped off. I didn't feel that they were dodgy, by any means. and so,

Tex:

And what made you feel like the business itself was in good shape as well? Like when you got the information from the broker and you got it back, were there a few things that stood out for you Are you like, this is, I can work with this.

Cam:

yeah, I guess at the time, not really having any, experience in reading financials and, you know, profit and loss statement. That was I guess the information I had was profit and loss over a few, consecutive financial years, and, and, the I guess, end of year financial statement, so, I looked at that and,

Tex:

sheet was pretty healthy.

Cam:

yeah, as far as I could see, it was like, oh, okay, profit of it was like, roughly mid 300s, like, okay, well, yeah. You know, that's alright.

Tex:

That's your net, that's your net profit?

Cam:

Uh, yeah, yeah,

Tex:

Yeah, yeah. Cool.

Cam:

yeah, so I was like, well, there's,

Tex:

when you look at that, you go, that's net, that's income that's up for grabs for me. That's what I can get

Cam:

yeah, pretty much, yeah, I was looking at that and going, okay, well, this is like, this is attainable for me, like, I could have that, and I guess as soon as I started looking, you know, at financials of businesses, and you see that figure and go, like, and then compare it to my current situation at the time, like, or how different is life going to be with that,

Tex:

Exactly.

Cam:

account rather than, you know, what I was getting as a, as an employee.

Tex:

And let's think about this for a second as well, right? So for you to earn 300, 000 from, let's say, a portfolio, and let's just call it a market portfolio, you're looking at just under, under 6, 000 to be able to pocket 300, 000. I'm guessing you didn't buy a curtains and blind business for six meal cap.

Cam:

Absolutely not. No, no.

Tex:

than that, isn't it?

Cam:

it,

Tex:

not passive income. It's very active, but the point remains it's income.

Cam:

it is, and

Tex:

can make it passive. you can turn it into passive if you're a smart operator.

Cam:

yeah, that is pretty much the goal to be hands off or, well, to be hands off from the day to day operations and kind of, as I say, work on the business instead of in, working on it to, to build it up. to, to grow it and scale it, type thing. But yeah, it did definitely not cost me, millions.

Tex:

No, you actually, so, and this, share as much as you're comfortable with here, but like, I think you got, you did such a great deal with this and it does speak to the opportunity. if you are willing to be a little bit more courageous, a little bit more adventurous, like you have been and actually go out and find out, go and find out what's possible here for you. Because you got, you got a deal that not many folks get, right? Like you're looking at multiples of what the business makes. And usually you're going to be paying some kind of multiple. are you comfortable with sort of saying how much you bought it for in terms of multiples? Yeah,

Cam:

I bought it at a one X. multiple, a profit. so I guess normally you kind of, you know, you'd be looking at two, three, depends on the industry and, and, and things like that. But yeah, multiples can vary, quite a bit and yeah, I pretty well, I got it for, a one X, yeah, one year's worth of profit as they were stating in their financials.

Tex:

and just to put that into context, right? How long did these guys own this business for?

Cam:

So, the, the vendors had it for, about 10 years, 9 10 years, they, they had it for yeah.

Tex:

Let's really think about this. have worked for 10 years to get it to the point where it's gotten to and they're willing to give it to you for one year of where they got it to over 10. That's a fucking good

Cam:

Because they,

Tex:

That's

Cam:

they are done, and,

Tex:

deal.

Cam:

yeah, sail off into the sunset.

Tex:

I can tell you starting a business like, it is, so they would have bought it and grown it, right? five years in with ours. It's a lot of work. man. It's a lot of work. It's a lot for you to do. in that scenario, If you'd be able to come in, do a deal like that, that they were sort of happy with. It's such a good, it's such a good opportunity and you're not, I don't want you to make out like you've sort of screwed them because I don't think you have because there's not many, there's probably not many buyers in a place like Taralgon, right?

Cam:

Yeah, that's, that's the story. Yeah, I think it's absolutely, yeah, a buyer's market,

Terry:

a buyer's market and their choice is, okay, we're at retirement age so we just, do we have to keep going here to be able to live or can we just capitalize on some of the work we've put in over the last, because look, we've had a good life, we've been living quite well, but now we want to just spend a bit more time with our kids. Now we want to see the world a little bit more. What if we could just pull forward through, you know, the next few years worth of income, just get it in one hit. That'd be worth it, right? Absolutely. And you give it to them every day of the week because it's worth it for you as well. Like that's why I think it's such a great between those two generations. We talk about the great transfer of wealth. This is the one that no one's looking at. it's not

Cam:

yeah,

Tex:

it's, it's, it's one that's just like right for the, for the taking.

Cam:

their own, you know, their own kids weren't interested in the business at all and taking it over, and yeah, I know that they, they didn't have many other people look at it they had been trying to sell it for approximately, probably about 12 months, so by the time we settled, they were well and truly done just with the Trying to sell the business, let alone

Tex:

Yeah. They're just like, let's take

Cam:

having the business.

Tex:

yeah, yeah, so I think like it's like and it's not because by the way that it's too hard for everybody because it just gets hard. It's just that at a certain age, you just don't have the energy for it anymore

Cam:

Yeah. Yup.

Tex:

It requires and you've got that in space now. Like we had this conversation last week about all the plans that you're making, all the ways you're going to improve this business. These 10 15 years ago, you know. It's just that They're kind of at that age now where they're probably going, okay, that's sick, but that's somebody else's job now. That's not our job,

Cam:

Yup. Could not be bothered with Facebook or Instagram or any of that. and it's just, yeah, they're just. Yeah, done.

Tex:

So mate, what was it like? What was it like to sort of get that deal done? Because, because it wasn't a done deal. I remember you told me that, it actually was sort of up in the air whether you were going to be able to get enough debt to be able to buy a business of this nature. And you, you actually approached them to 100 percent vendor finance, right? To have them fund it. So just talk

Cam:

Yeah,

Tex:

that little subsection of the journey.

Cam:

yeah, so I guess my first offer was, so 100 percent of the original asking price, so that was about 400. And so I, my offer was, yeah, full asking price, but 100 So, vendor finance, like where effectively pay no money up front and you use the profit from the business to pay back the vendor over a few years or whatever, whatever the arrangement is. so they knocked that back. The broker absolutely was like, the vendor's not going to accept that. but I'll put it to them. I guess, you know, if they wanted to get rid of the business quite quickly, there's an option for them on the table. But no, they came back and they wanted at least 50 percent of the revenue. cash up front effectively. so, you know, they were kind of in the range of 200 to 250. They wanted cash up front, which, okay. and so the, so I came back, not having really, not knowing if I could actually get the bank finance, but I thought, righto, if I finance for this, and give them their at least 50 percent kind of cash up front. The trade off is I'm going to offer less. So, my second offer was then, around the 350, but fully financed. So, you know, they'd pay me. less. effectively get all their money

Tex:

All at once.

Cam:

all at once. at settlement. so yeah, so they accepted that. They, the price decreased, like, they weren't bothered by that at all. so yeah, once they'd kind of, I guess, tentatively accepted that offer, then, then started the process of, Oh shit, now I need to try and get And

Tex:

ha ha.

Cam:

that, that's a completely different beast to getting a mortgage. Yeah. So, the bank requires a lot of information, but anyway, uh, it was a learning curve.

Tex:

Yeah. And is that normal, mate? So, I mean, I haven't done this myself. So, is it normal to make an offer, have it accepted, and then go and figure out finance?

Cam:

Uh, we wasn't so, nothing's, I guess, set in stone until you've

Tex:

There's no rules, yeah.

Cam:

paperwork. So when, I guess like when you buy a house, you have a contract to sale, both parties sign that up. When you're looking at business, you have a thing called a heads of agreement, which is, it's kind of like a rough draft of, like one thing I guess is the purchase price of the business, but then you've got, there's a lot of terms. purchasing a business that you just don't get with purchasing a property. so that starting to nut out those intricacies of the terms, like, okay, we've kind of agreed on a price here, but, just for instance, like, okay, how, how do we deal with works in progress? How do we deal with what the staff entitlements are?

Tex:

Mmm.

Cam:

vehicles, did I want to purchase them? Which I did. Do I not want to purchase them? so, yeah, there, I guess there was a bit of time frame between, like, okay, here's the price that we kind of agreed on, but we have all this other stuff that we need to agree on as well. So, I had time in the background to, yeah, start getting onto, I guess, the finance side of it.

Tex:

that's kind of good too, right? Because you can, you know, I guess you can sort of get busy Going and finding good businesses and seeing if it's like worthwhile, you know in principle then sort of work out the particulars as you go So for example, like you don't have to kind of wait to have it all figured out you kind of go Does the first part work and then we work out the next parts as we go? Because otherwise, the other parts don't really matter. You're like, well, the terms could be the best ever, but if the price is all wrong, doesn't matter. So, you got terms and the price and they're two different, two different sort of categories, aren't they?

Cam:

Your price, their terms, their price, your terms. There's a bit of, you know,

Tex:

Say more about that man. I know that I've heard that a lot but just let's actually say what that means because I think it

Cam:

yeah.

Tex:

important, yeah.

Cam:

So, like, someone, Terry, you're selling your business for 100, 000. That's, that's the price you want. Okay. All right. Well, I will pay you. I'll, I'll get you what you want. You're 100, 000, but it's going to be on my terms. So if you want that 100, 000, for instance, I, I will give that to you over, say, a four year period.

Tex:

Mm,

Cam:

take profits from the business and, say, pay you 25, 000 per year to get you that 100, 000. So that's, that's your price, but my terms, as kind of a simple way of doing it. otherwise, it's more

Tex:

Well, it's

Cam:

I set the price, if I was going to set the price for like, oh, you want 100k, well, I'll give you 50k cash right now, and so, yeah,

Tex:

It's kind of what you did. You're like, well, I'll set the terms. Now, actually, you said, I'll set the price because they wanted their terms which was, no, no, no, we won't do vendor finance. they said, we want our terms like this and you're like, well, I'll set the price and the price will be this.

Cam:

yeah, effectively, yeah,

Tex:

Yeah, I think that's the creative part of it, isn't it? Like the. There's so many ways that you can slice it, there's so many ways that you could do this and it really does come down to how you can create enough value for both parties to walk away with what they want.

Cam:

yeah, it's not a, you want a win win, like, yeah, you're not, I wasn't trying to screw them, and they weren't trying to screw me, so, it's, yeah, trying to, trying to keep both parties happy and, yeah, what they want and need.

Tex:

Yeah, I love it. what's it been like, mate? So, walking in on the first day, what was it like walking in the first time and introducing yourself and?

Cam:

Yeah, so I guess as a part of the, as part of the transaction, there was a transfer period with, with the owner. So the owner, started with them two weeks before settlement, and then the owner stayed on two weeks after settlement. That first day, walking in, it actually, it actually wasn't too bad because the owners reached out, like I'd been talking to the owners obviously a bit through the, the purchasing process, and then the Friday night before I started with them, then on the Monday, They suggested and I agreed that we go out to dinner as a bit of like a, let's just get to know each other personally before then we actually, you know, working with each other. So that was That was, really good. Go to dinner with them, and then, so, then on the Monday, it was kind of like, you know, get in there, and, all right, we'll start, start introducing me to people, and just start showing me around the place, and, yeah, wow, it's just like, your eyes are just open, like, jeez, what am I doing?

Tex:

Any moment where you're like, what am I done here?

Cam:

oh, I guess, yeah, kind of at the start, it's all I guess it's all pretty overwhelming, going around, with the owner doing measure ups and quotes, and then the first two works really actually was mainly about the numbers and getting ready for settlement. So it was sitting down with the bookkeeper and sitting down with the owner and, and just going through all the kind of jobs, the jobs that are in progress, setting up oh, setting up credit applications with suppliers. How many I had to fill out, you know, filling out all my company info and

Tex:

yeah,

Cam:

over and over again. it's just all part of it.

Tex:

yeah, yeah, yeah. How

Cam:

And then,

Tex:

way through that, mate? Because there's a lot, there's a fair bit of paperwork to make something like this happen. There's a lot of process happening. How do you push your way through that?

Cam:

I know that I'm doing it for,

Tex:

Keep the bigger picture in mind.

Cam:

yeah, keeping the bigger picture in mind. Like, I'm doing this to, for something a lot bigger than what I was getting in my, 9 to 5 job. Well, I kind of still feel like I have a 9 to 5 job, but, you know, it's, it's for me. It's not for, it's not for someone else. So

Tex:

Yeah,

Cam:

it just,

Tex:

think it's different, isn't it? Like, an owner now, so You have like a hundred percent control of your day. have a hundred percent control of way that you do what you do. do you think that's worth? Like, is that a big part of

Cam:

yeah, it is kind of, it's. It's nice to, I guess kind of feel in control, a little bit. I mean, other, my other staff, sales staff, can book me into, like, sales consultations, that's fine. but I still, yeah, I still feel like I have control, of what I'm doing. I'm not, I'm not dictated to. day to day, although I didn't kind of feel like I was dictated to day to day in my previous role, but yeah, it's it's a Probably like like feeling of pride and yeah, I'm doing this for me. So

Tex:

yeah,

Cam:

Oh, oh what it's reached five o'clock. Well, I'll stay back half an hour an hour. It's like I gotta get this quote out or send invoices or an email out or I've got to deal with a problem. It's just like, yeah, you find a bit more energy, a bit more motivation when

Tex:

Yeah.

Cam:

it's on you rather than someone else's clock.

Tex:

yeah, you get your own sandcastle now. You want to make it look good.

Cam:

Yeah, pretty much.

Tex:

It sort of feels a bit like that, I reckon. The longer I get on the mic, oh, it's like a sandcastle. It's sort of, you kind of get a bit proud of it. No, that's cool, mate. And so tell me, what are the future plans here? So you've come in, now you've got, you're starting to get your feet on the desk. I can probably tell now that you're starting to really understand a few things and you're going. All right, here's how I'm going to improve this. We had a couple of conversations about this the other day. So let's just talk about a couple of the shorter term plans you've got.

Cam:

Yeah. So, one of the big things about the business that I knew was, I guess, an area for improvement, before even getting in the business was the paper based processes, effectively.

Tex:

You're

Cam:

that,

Tex:

They

Cam:

they,

Tex:

hadn't done it yet.

Cam:

they, they don't have, they don't have the fax machines sitting there.

Tex:

I'm betting that most curtains and blinds owners that are boomers in regional areas don't have, don't have a software systems. No,

Cam:

Yeah, nah, not, uh, not

Tex:

this

Cam:

softwares.

Tex:

though, right? So you think about this, what, what do we understand? We live in a world now where software does a lot of jobs. Like I was talking, we were talking about this software that we've just put in the back of our business and I was just marveling at how much efficiency we've been able to gain quite quickly and what it would mean for us. And just time traveling backwards, 20 years ago, this software is probably replacing the role of two, two and a half people in the business. And it's costing us a grand total about 2, 000 a year. And that's the opportunity in these old boring businesses basically go, they've made it run the hard way. We can make it run the easy way, make it easier for customers. There's actually a great example of this right now, actually. I can't remember what this business is called. I'll find it. And if I do find it, I'll put it in the show notes of this episode, but there's a business over in New York bought table tennis halls, just boring business, right? Table tennis hall. People come and play table tennis.

Cam:

Yeah, okay.

Tex:

did was they built a software that allowed people to self book and control the bookings themselves. So they didn't have to man these locations. And then they created all these different parts of the software that made it easy for you to like, customize your own experience, dial it right up, like pay online. Like, so I basically made it a vending machine for that experience and the margins on that business exploded. And then they took that one location, turned it into five locations. And then what they've done since is now they're licensing their software. Ping pong centers all the way around the world, pool table centers all the way around the world. Now, gyms all the way around the world. And they're a tech company because they built it out of a boring business in that way. And it was because they kind of started here. And I think at a micro level is possible and available every business like yours. in the country right now. what does that mean? That actually fattens up your margin. So that 300 profit could become 350 profit. And that's the opportunity, isn't it?

Cam:

Yeah, before, like, I don't know, I guess before marketing and advertising, it's like, just, efficiency alone, which is I guess like a point to almost touch on is like you said, the software that you're using costs, well like 2000 per annum, say. and the kind of mindset around that you go, well 2000, oh my God, that's such a lot of money. But then, what, what's the equivalent in paying that one staff person or two staff people for a whole year? As all of a sudden, like that,

Tex:

by the way. It's not just the money, it's the time.

Cam:

yeah.

Tex:

It's actually the time is the biggest cost, not the money. You could, yeah, if you had great staff members and it's not about getting rid of all staff, by the way, but it's about going like, how do you get staff in the most human facing roles so that you're having the best human interactions you possibly can. doing this manual hand. So for example, like software, just Calendly like booking me in and that sort of thing. That used to be someone's job. They used to pick up the phone and organize appointments. We don't have to do that anymore because I'm sure no one ever thought that was their purpose to pick up and make a point, right? so it's that kind of job, that double handling, and it's actually freaky. So I set up, I set up this, conversational chatbot that's on the, on our webpage at the moment, that's trained on all our information. And I just fed it with all this information. And then I asked it questions and it answered the questions. And I told her whether it did a good job or not. And I did that for like five, six hours on the weekend. And then, I don't know how man, I gotta figure this out, I don't know how this happened. But it somehow has gotten into my inbox and is answering fucking questions on my behalf. And it's booking meetings for me right now. And I looked into my inbox, I'm like, I didn't send that email. and, it was written in my tone. From me to them with a link to look into my account exactly what I would have done It did and i'm like, I don't know how to feel about that quite yet. But

Cam:

Yeah.

Tex:

But that's that's pretty insane that's like an executive assistant That knows you. knows exactly

Cam:

Mmm.

Tex:

you. want it. So. yeah, I like I actually just learned that today I trained on the weekend. I saw that happening today. I'm actually just kind of trying to think about how I feel about it

Cam:

I mean, yeah, just like it's improving quicker and quicker and I feel like I haven't only two and a half months in I haven't really touched the surface of what tech can do for me, but Yeah, that's it's it's definitely on the

Tex:

it though, like i'm just thinking out loud here right now So what I like about it is, it replied straight away, whereas the other person probably would have had to wait probably half a day, maybe, maybe even the next day,

Cam:

For response. Yeah

Tex:

and it, it was like, boom, here it is, just like, as I was like, that's actually probably gonna be net, net good. Yeah, it's just kind of getting used to the idea that you didn't do it. yeah,

Cam:

what were you doing that time when that email was sent like

Tex:

I'm actually spending time with other people so it's, it's, it's helping that person when they need to be helped whilst I'm being more productive with the actual person who's in front of me at the time. So yeah, I just, I'm

Cam:

just

Tex:

I'm still reeling a little bit from it.

Cam:

Half amazed half a little on edge,

Tex:

Yeah, I'm just like, where are we going with this? Yeah, but yeah, but I mean, look, that's that's the, that's the cool thing, isn't it? So for you, it's going to be mostly let's fix up the back end. Let's get some time efficiency back in the business. Let's upgrade and let's get it back into the modern age. And then what about once you've kind of got that going, what are you gonna do from there? Yeah,

Cam:

probably my next goal, is looking at the, I guess, marketing, and before I actually kind of do any of that, I've really trying to wrap my head around, I guess the pain points, the problems that we're trying to solve, because I kind of, well, I know who my customers are. Although I should, I need to actually probably figure out their almost alias better. And, like, I've got the products that are solving their problems, but I need to better understand their problems. and so, like I was talking to you, I think, last week, that the, I guess, a good way to go about that, that I've been, come up with, with my business coach, is that I do after sales follow up calls. Find out how the products have, Effectively improve their lives and then take that to almost drive the questions to ask in the sales process. and effectively almost using the answers out of all that to build my copy script for the marketing before I actually pay any money on the marketing. so yeah, really trying to figure out, I guess, what we're doing for people. before then I can get stuck into the marketing side and actually paying the money to boost that up. so yeah, I guess it's bringing the, getting rid of the paper processes, getting, using more software based processes, and then actually start marketing because there's at the moment zero marketing. So, I'm just kind of getting a feel for things literally, naturally, word of mouth.

Tex:

Well, if I could give you a little bit of advice here from someone who's probably figured out too late, Is that when you are building out those back end systems and you're trying to build efficiencies back into your business, build in data systems that allow you to understand the inputs and outputs of your business. What actually moves the needle, what actually, when I say what it moves the needle, what, what, what expands the bottom line, what does change that. there is so much information you can collect, it'll be overwhelming at first, but over time what you're going to figure out is like, hey, there is like 20 percent of my inputs here, Drive 80 percent of my outputs. And once you figure out what those 20 percent is, then you can defend time and space and to allocate resources in that direction, because as soon as you start moving into the marketing space, it's it is expensive time and money wise. And you want to start to really know what is moving the needle. And it's interesting because like I'm, we're sort of down a bit of wormhole with this at the moment, but everything kind of changed in the last three to five years in terms of TikTok and because of the way it's algorithm works

Cam:

we're all okay.

Tex:

done it's changed, it's changed the possibilities and the potential for smaller businesses in a way that has never been possible before, because if you're half decent at this and you can get the hang of it. And I'm not claiming to be at all, but I want to be. it's completely different now because it's not all the social media and all the media used to be based on like a social, what, what they call like a social graph. So if I'm connected to you and you're connected to me, you'll see what I post and I'll see what you post vice versa. But as the algorithm, as the platforms grow, then the algorithms are going to choose what. They're going to show from who you're connected to. Whereas what TikTok did was it doesn't really matter who you're connected to. What matters is what you're interested in. And if we can learn what you're interested in, we're just going to give you more of what you're interested in all of the time, which is why TikTok has gone bananas. Right. And it's why YouTube is kind of so good as well. actually an awesome opportunity. If you're in business, because you don't actually have to have a shit ton of followers to get a shit ton of exposure. You just have to figure out, what is it that my people are interested in, give it to them in a way they've never seen it before, and you'll get exposure. One single post change your business. And, and it's happening a lot at the moment, like there's businesses that are launching, like there's a, that, I don't know if you've seen it, liquid death, right? Liquid death is a water that sits in a can. And you'll pay six bucks for it. And that's been built off really understanding how marketing and, uh, I guess social media works.

Cam:

Right, okay. I'll be Googling that later. Oh, that's great. Oh, oh

Tex:

example. There's a supermarket over in Spain that has somehow. Made itself the center of attention for changing trends in the way people date. So this supermarket over in Spain basically created this tradition and it's created this like trend where they've said, Okay, if you're sick of all the dating apps and you're sick of swiping right, to our supermarket and use our supermarket as a place to meet people. Here's how you do it. If you are single, You go to the fruit and veg section, you get a pineapple, you put the pineapple upside down in your cart. And if you put it upside down, that's showing people that you are keen to meet somebody else. And if somebody comes up to you and bumps your car with a pineapple that's upside down, that's telling you that they're interested in you. That's what they're saying, right? Mate, there is This business has absolutely exploded. It's exploded. And there's like these little subtle cues, right? And if you put lettuce in next to your pineapple, that says that you want a one night stand because that's a perishable thing that's going to be done in a night or two. Right. and. What about this one, Cam? If you put lentils in there, you're only interested in a long term relationship because they store for a long time. But think about this, like, I'm thinking about this a lot right now. I'm like, wow, that's

Cam:

god.

Tex:

brilliant. And if you can take that kind of thinking and you can promote that and do something like that, that's brilliant. There's so much, there's so much possibility for us. And, and for you, and even like for the online side of things, I'm not, not sure if you sell online, but obviously you can break the limits of geography as well by just selling online. but yeah, like, it's just, I think it's an exciting time to be in the spaceship you're in. And there's so many opportunities that just didn't exist when the boomers were building their businesses that we have, that we have straight, straight right now, just we're just walking past it every day.

Cam:

Yeah. Have conversations like this with yourself and other people and find out, like, yeah, products that you're using or have heard from other people and it's like, okay, wow.

Tex:

Yeah, but I think you're on the right track too, like understanding like post sale, like how it expects people and things like that. Like we just sent a survey out, you probably saw it yesterday, I sent a bit of a survey out to our guys exactly for that reason. And the same reason, I want to know exactly what people think of the process the method that we're teaching, the impact that it has, what we think it has versus what it actually has, how people talk about it, the words they use. Like this one was brilliant. I can't remember who, I will credit this person, if I could remember it, but One of these people said, this is like putting on glasses for your money, right? You just all of a sudden know exactly where things are. You can see it completely clearly, whereas before it was as fuzzy as fuck. And I was like, that's brilliant. I could never come up with that. But

Cam:

Sounds like Edith Fordham retinal surgery. Yup.

Tex:

like putting on glasses for your money. I was like, that's great. And then somebody else on another one of these nights said something like, I don't feel like my future self is wagging their finger at me anymore because I'm on top of my money. And it's, I'm not judging myself and I'm feeling good about what I'm spending and that sort of thing. And it's that kind of stuff that gives you real understanding of like that person, their worldview and what they really care about, what they want. So I think you'll get, you'll get gold out of that, mate.

Cam:

Yeah. Okay.

Tex:

Mate, this has been, An epic conversation. Where can people find out a little bit more about you the business and really just get on board with what you're doing.

Cam:

The business, so the business is called Fennec Curtains and Blinds, where we're located in Terelgon, in Gippsland, Victoria. And, the, well the website is www. fennec. com. au. the, the socials, uh, yeah, they've been lacking, I don't think they've been active since, Probably the end of last year. that's, yeah, I mean that's on my agenda to get that back up and running but, that will happen in, in due course.

Tex:

If you're listening to this right now, support a small business, get around Fennec, what was it? Fennec Curtains and Blinds?

Cam:

Fennec, curtains and blinds, yup.

Tex:

Yep. Instagram? Facebook? Where are they?

Cam:

I mean, it is, yeah, we're on Instagram and Facebook and, Maybe by the time some people are listening to this, it will be, updated with a lot more newer content, that's for sure. I will be working on that. Yeah,

Tex:

Good mate, good. I got one more question for you.

Cam:

absolutely.

Tex:

So you know that for us, the big part of this is really just decoupling the concepts of wealth money and separating those two and wealth is having more of what you value. So if you're going to finish that sentence for me, how would you finish it? Wealth is?

Cam:

Wealth is I guess, wealth is the ability to The ability, time, time and, I guess, financially to be able to do, do the things that I enjoy with the people that I want to do it with, and living life on my own terms. that's, that's something that people, you know, a term that people use, but yeah, being, not, I guess, dictated to by, you know, other people. So.

Tex:

so wealth for you is self reliance in a connected community.

Cam:

Yeah, yep.

Tex:

Yeah, love it. Well, mate, you're building that and the great news is, now that you own a business, you can build a little community in the business and make that world run exactly how you want it to, which is an awesome opportunity to, to do.

Cam:

Yeah, absolutely. I kind of, almost feel like I'm, starting to get into the driver's seat of my own life.

Tex:

Yeah,

Cam:

It's and it's a, yeah, it's kind of a good feeling.

Tex:

Mate, thank you so much for bringing us on the journey and really just sharing what it was like through this whole process. Being so open as well with how you felt at different stages, how the deal went through, how you thought about it. I really wanted this to inspire a lot of people because, you know, we have the traditional ways of kind of thinking about it. Let's buy some shares and let's buy some real estate and that sort of thing. And these are all fine but, We also want to be making sure that we hit on every opportunity that's possible to us. Look at every possible thing because the underpriced things, the things that people aren't looking at where all the best opportunities are. I think you've hit on something here and I hope people are super inspired by your example and I'm sure they will be. So thanks so much for coming on to tell your story, mate.

Cam:

Thank you, yeah, thank you for reaching out and inviting me on and yeah, thanks for having me. I guess a real, Like a humbling opportunity, really, to just talk about my story and and it may, you know, resonate with a few people out there. And that's, that'd be, that's awesome.

Tex:

It definitely will, mate. Thanks again. Let's talk soon.

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