Dance for nature: How communities can turn conservation into opportunity

In this episode of Around Uganda, Raziah Athman speaks with conservationist and former Bwindi ranger Hebert Banobi about the role communities play in protecting Uganda’s natural heritage. He highlights the value of planting indigenous trees, creating authentic cultural experiences for visitors, and encourages communities to “dance for nature, not just for money” as part of conservation and tourism.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:03

Hello and welcome to the new vision podcast around Uganda. I'm your host, Razia Uthman. Uganda is often called the Pale of Africa, and much of that beauty comes from its incredible biodiversity and protected landscapes. The country has 12 national parks, 12 wildlife reserves, and several wildlife sanctuaries, protecting some of the most important ecosystems in East Africa. Uganda is also known as the primate capital of the world, with more than 5,000 chimpanzees and over 1,080 bird species, representing about 50% of Africa's bird species. Perhaps most famously, Uganda hosts more than half of the world's remaining mountain gorillas, with about 459 recorded in windy impenetrable national park, making conservation here globally significant. But protecting these natural treasures requires collaboration between conservationists, communities, farmers, and the tourism sector. Today we are exploring the connection between conservation, tourism, and community livelihoods. Joining me is Herbert Banobi, a conservationist by nature and a former ranger in Bindi Impenetrable Forest, who has spent years protecting wildlife while working closely with communities around the park. Herbert, welcome to the podcast.

SPEAKER_01 1:47

Maybe having worked with the Buindi as a community conservation ranger, then I retired and went for further studies in social work, social administration. I came worked with local government, but my passion was in conservation. So I said, how can I do conservation to become part of my life, live in my village?

SPEAKER_00 2:09

How about conservation areas like Bwindi are surrounded by communities that depend heavily on farming? At the same time, these forests protect globally important wildlife like mountain gorillas and chimpanzees. From your experience, what options are farmers being given to support conservation, such as agroforestry or planting natural and indigenous trees, while still sustaining their livelihoods? And how can indigenous tree planting become part of a tourism experience where visitors not only see wildlife but also participate in conservation activities that help restore forest ecosystems?

SPEAKER_01 2:52

It is not easy to give a convincing tongue for conservation because it counters with people uh with farmers. While we say don't spoil everything, we cannot have anything we want unless we spoil the forest, we cut down the trees, we burn, and so we've been on that counter, but not really in hustle, but we have been convincing each other. We can have crops as well as conservation. So that is the campaign I've been carrying on. And the organization I've been, I've tried a number of them, organizations, but on along the way, uh challenges notwithstanding, some of them don't go on. But the current one I am I am working with is African Community Conservation and Tourism Research Resource Center. So while my key interest is in conservation, but the blending word is tourism because tourism is the market uh that makes people survive to stand. So when I blend the two, I end up convincing people that oh, maybe uh he's talking sense now that he's bringing us close to tourism. So the advocacy has been that uh our natural resources, our forests, our wildlife are all new to many outsiders. So even if we conserved trees, we planted trees, indigenous trees, they are all new to foreigners. They can make a package for tourism. So uh along that one, then we say when we conserve trees, let us conserve our natural forests, the pockets somewhere, let's conserve all our valleys because they are meaningful to us in terms of conservation, protecting the water sources, making sure our rivers don't continue eroding and eroding and eroding, and finally they dry. So I said let's do a campaign at community level.

SPEAKER_00 5:13

Many experts say conservation cannot succeed without local communities. Tourism linked to gorilla tracking has already shown how communities can benefit. In Bwindi, gorilla tourism has grown from around 3,000 visitors in the 1990s to more than 15,000 tourists in recent years, generating revenue that supports conservation and local development. From your time as a ranger, how important is community involvement in conservation and what practical ways can communities participate in protecting forests and wildlife while also improving their livelihoods?

SPEAKER_01 5:57

Whatever we conserve, we shall tell the world. If we can have opportunities of telling the world out there, there are also some conservationists who would wish to hear these stories, who would wish to come and see if it is real that communities can conserve, then we can bring another dimension of conservation campaign rather than going in counter bullet against the the poacher, maybe boundaries with the scarries, with what monitoring, the drones, we can do our community conservation. And the communities themselves can protect the wildlife, they can protect their environments, they can protect the trees. So along that kind of teaching, that's where we begin making partnerships. And you find me in full knowledge with what Moses is doing here, Pangolin Conservation, Rescue and Restation. He rescues, rehabilitates, and then releases. And that story is really very good for me. And when I'm talking about Moses, I feel very comfortable. And then we are also looking at others like uh the Rhinoceras chameleon. Somebody had them in his garden area. He said, no, yeah, you stop, you stop cutting it. Now that they love you, this place, you just forgo and let it stay. So it's another place that is more or less like this of Moses. It is in another direction, it is on Kabar in Npungu. So I have other places like uh forests, forest pockets within the communities. I just encourage them to say, you leave them, let them grow, let birds come there. You'll one time find they can host a bird that is nowhere else in the world, and you begin seeing the value of your small forest. So that has been a long story, and I have now uh 12 uh 12 points which are in my naming they are called community conservation and tourism touch points. Touch points meaning it's a whole village, and when you stand at one point, you can look around and see many things that communities are conserving.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

Tourism is now one of Uganda's key economic sectors, and wildlife tourism plays a major role in funding conservation. In fact, great apes like gorillas contribute over 60% of the Uganda Wildlife Authority's internally generated tourism revenue, largely through gorilla trekking permits and related tourism activities. In your view, how can Uganda continue to blend tourism with conservation, ensuring that tourism activities actually strengthen environmental protection rather than putting additional pressure on natural ecosystems?

SPEAKER_01 9:19

There is a gap that is not yet occupied. While we are talking about community about conservation, uh the conventional understanding of conservation has been on wildlife, natural resources, and towns, hotels, uh more or less that. But those tourists that come, there is an area that is still virgin, the community. Community is not yet in the market. They come and by virtue of the these people, the operators of tourism, they just book a whole line from America. They know where they are going to go, they know which car to go with, the where to stop, where to sleep, and then go see the mountain goldinas, then back to the car, then move until they are taken back. So the community is completely more or less uh above 90%, it is not known. And one research, I told you my place is a research center, but it's community-based, not that uh how do I call it? High high or high-tech. No, it's not high-tech research, but mine is community-based. Simply uh taking an example of when you are carrying a chicken and you are walking to the maybe to the market. When the chicken looks at other chicken, free chicken on along the road, it struggles to leave you to go and join the chicken, the other chicken. Meaning there is an attraction between chicken and chicken. Same thing with goats, pulling it to the market in a rope, it finds the other goats, you will struggle to get it from there. Meaning there is a relationship between goat and goat. Same thing with dogs. So when you bring that correlation and talk about human beings, surely when you are passing and you are in a car and you find where people are gathered, there is a feeling that what are these people doing here? They find a group of women digging, they are digging, maybe they are singing as they dig. The attraction will be, but oh, how what are these women doing? What are why how are they doing it? But you don't have the opportunity, you are in a car, it is moving from car and table and taking you to wind. You will never have a chance to say, Hello, people, what are you doing? So that is an area which I thought if we would emphasize and make sure we exploit that there is no human being who another human being will say hello and will not respond. And that one, I've discovered it through a period of about five, ten ten years, or I've been taking visitors, those who come to see what we do, taking them to a group of women weaving and sitting with them and uh asking the women to teach these visitors how to weave. It makes them one time they gave a comment that community visiting has been the most interesting throughout the trip. So those are some of the strengths I see that we need to exploit. Then uh, together with what I do, there is the what approach are we going to use to make sure people can come close to what I am trying to preach?

SPEAKER_00 13:07

Beyond wildlife, cultural heritage is also becoming an important part of Uganda's tourism experience. Many communities around conservation areas perform traditional dances for tourists, but sometimes this risks becoming just a commercial performance. How can communities ensure that traditional dance and cultural practices remain authentic and meaningful while still allowing visitors to appreciate and learn from these traditions? And how can culture, conservation, and tourism work together to create experiences that benefit both communities and the environment?

SPEAKER_01 13:50

First of all, it is another strength that is not exploited, the African cultural performances: music, dance, and drama. This is a powerful approach when even if we who are standing here, if sounds of music, drumming and so on started just next door, we can easily stop what we are doing and go to watch. So that power tells me that if we would do it very organizedly, we would change the uh negative, may I call it the negative interpretation of what our culture has been of saying people Africans can dance for money. Because here uh what has happened in many tourism centers, people just organize dancing groups, and the moment they learn that they are visitors in the pangolin, they just begin drumming in the next doors so that people can ask to go and see. But they will just be seeing dance that is stage managed, it is not purposeful dancing. So in my research center, we are saying we should change uh to make a purposeful uh music, dance, and drama that is tailored to conservation campaign. So we have done it, we had done it three times uh when corona came and it sweated me down. But what was it about? We are taking people into community-based research saying people don't know, the current generation don't know how their village was 50 years or more ago. They just see what it is today, but tell them, ask them to tell you what it was 50 years ago, they don't know. So, my first motivating question for the people to go into that said we need to know how was my village 50 or more years ago, then that means the generation that is going to perform is not aware about what it was. It will push them to go and ask the generations like me above 50 years, say how was Mboha like this village is called Mboha Kanya Virabu. How was Mboha? Then I tell them the whole of this was a forest. Then people begin opening their eyes, saying, A forest, but we are seeing tea, we are seeing uh coffee. No, at that time, 50 years before, there was no coffee. All this was a thicket, it was a forest, very dark, and our river was quiet, and it was full, it was pure water. So, what you see today is not what was there 50 years ago. It's a dancing for nature other than dancing for money.

SPEAKER_00 16:58

Herbert Banobi, thank you so much for sharing your insights and experiences with us today. Your perspective reminds us that conservation is not just about protecting forests and wildlife, it's also about supporting communities, preserving culture, and building sustainable tourism that benefits everyone. And to our listeners, thank you for tuning in to Around Uganda on the New Vision Podcasts. I'm Rosia Usman, and join us again next time as we continue exploring the people, stories, and ideas shaping Uganda.