{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"startTime":0.74,"endTime":1.97,"body":"AXSCHAT"},{"startTime":0.74,"endTime":1.97,"body":"Max Fisher"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1.97,"endTime":3.9,"body":"Hello and welcome to Axschat."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":3.9,"endTime":6.8,"body":"I'm delighted we are joined"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":3.9,"endTime":6.8,"body":"today by Max Fisher."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":6.8,"endTime":9.8,"body":"Max is someone"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":6.8,"endTime":9.8,"body":"that has come to us"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":9.8,"endTime":13.08,"body":"by way of some of"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":9.8,"endTime":13.08,"body":"our previous Axschats"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":13.08,"endTime":16.04,"body":"and I love how the community"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":13.08,"endTime":16.04,"body":"brings everything together."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":16.04,"endTime":22.61,"body":"So Max is part of Debra's"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":16.04,"endTime":22.61,"body":"Billion Strong community."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":23.16,"endTime":25.25,"body":"And we are going to be"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":23.16,"endTime":25.25,"body":"talking about identity today."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":25.25,"endTime":28.43,"body":"And Billion Strong is all"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":25.25,"endTime":28.43,"body":"about disability identity."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":29.39,"endTime":33.01,"body":"Max is a deaf, blind,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":29.39,"endTime":33.01,"body":"gender queer scientist,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":33.01,"endTime":35.44,"body":"working in the field"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":33.01,"endTime":35.44,"body":"of nano medicine."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":35.44,"endTime":41.22,"body":"And so Max that sounds"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":35.44,"endTime":41.22,"body":"like you're as rare"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":41.22,"endTime":42.82,"body":"as a needle in a haystack."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":43.84,"endTime":45.83,"body":"You're hitting loads"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":43.84,"endTime":45.83,"body":"of different intersections."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":45.83,"endTime":51.44,"body":"So tell us about yourself"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":45.83,"endTime":51.44,"body":"and your journey"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":51.44,"endTime":54.55,"body":"into the sort of"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":51.44,"endTime":54.55,"body":"disability advocacy space"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":54.55,"endTime":57.74,"body":"and how you ended up"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":54.55,"endTime":57.74,"body":"on here today,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":57.74,"endTime":62.15,"body":"connected with us"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":57.74,"endTime":62.15,"body":"and let's take it from there."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":62.15,"endTime":63.37,"body":"Welcome."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":63.37,"endTime":66.85,"body":"Hi. 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cool."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":247.61,"endTime":250.11,"body":"And I also have another rare"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":247.61,"endTime":250.11,"body":"condition called cold urticaria"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":250.11,"endTime":254.12,"body":"and that got some media"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":250.11,"endTime":254.12,"body":"attention in 019, pre Covid"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":254.12,"endTime":256.49,"body":"because I wear"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":254.12,"endTime":256.49,"body":"a face mask outside"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":257.02,"endTime":259.52,"body":"because if I breathe cold air"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":257.02,"endTime":259.52,"body":"my throat swells up."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":260.05,"endTime":261.65,"body":"That is not very fun."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":262.43,"endTime":264.55,"body":"So I started making videos"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":262.43,"endTime":264.55,"body":"about 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Hang on."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":272.49,"endTime":274.01,"body":"You go, where do we start"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":272.49,"endTime":274.01,"body":"and I go,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":274.01,"endTime":279.63,"body":"where do I come back in."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":274.01,"endTime":279.63,"body":"So we have had over the years"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":280.25,"endTime":283.53,"body":"about 150 different"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":280.25,"endTime":283.53,"body":"people appear."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":283.53,"endTime":286.93,"body":"But one of the sort one"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":283.53,"endTime":286.93,"body":"of the recuring themes"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":286.93,"endTime":289.98,"body":"is around chronic pain"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":286.93,"endTime":289.98,"body":"and how people aren't believed."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":289.98,"endTime":291.32,"body":"Mm 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relief."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":461.5,"endTime":462.74,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":462.74,"endTime":464.53,"body":"In terms of you're able"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":462.74,"endTime":464.53,"body":"to come to terms with it."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":464.53,"endTime":465.74,"body":"Yes, 100%."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":465.74,"endTime":471.06,"body":"Yes and so"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":465.74,"endTime":471.06,"body":"and yes we do advocate."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":471.06,"endTime":474.17,"body":"But I advocate for this stuff."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":471.06,"endTime":474.17,"body":"As you go through it,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":474.17,"endTime":478.2,"body":"you want other people's journeys"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":474.17,"endTime":478.2,"body":"to be easier?"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":478.2,"endTime":479.51,"body":"Exactly that."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":479.51,"endTime":481.51,"body":"And that's 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of all of these"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":495.64,"endTime":499.9,"body":"different areas,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":499.9,"endTime":502.06,"body":"so you know quite often"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":499.9,"endTime":502.06,"body":"once you have done that"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":502.06,"endTime":503.66,"body":"and you start advocating."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":504.21,"endTime":505.56,"body":"Mm hmm."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":505.56,"endTime":507.9,"body":"That then means"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":505.56,"endTime":507.9,"body":"lots of interactions"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":507.9,"endTime":509.29,"body":"with other people."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":509.29,"endTime":512.1,"body":"You went on a journey within"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":509.29,"endTime":512.1,"body":"your own workplace as well."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":512.1,"endTime":513.34,"body":"You got a job."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":513.34,"endTime":514.55,"body":"Mm hmm."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":514.55,"endTime":517.2,"body":"You then started up an ERG."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":517.2,"endTime":521.83,"body":"So tell us about your experience"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":517.2,"endTime":521.83,"body":"of starting up"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":521.83,"endTime":524.87,"body":"and running"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":521.83,"endTime":524.87,"body":"an employee network."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":524.87,"endTime":526.09,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":526.09,"endTime":528.67,"body":"So this is like one of the"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":526.09,"endTime":528.67,"body":"highlights of my career so far."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":528.67,"endTime":530.53,"body":"Even though it ended"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":528.67,"endTime":530.53,"body":"sort of on a sour note."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":530.53,"endTime":532.75,"body":"It is still 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months"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":570.75,"endTime":575.1,"body":"and months later like"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":575.1,"endTime":577.77,"body":"I think it was like nine,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":575.1,"endTime":577.77,"body":"ten months later,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":577.77,"endTime":580.27,"body":"I had an email from someone"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":577.77,"endTime":580.27,"body":"quite high up"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":580.27,"endTime":581.52,"body":"in the company being like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":581.52,"endTime":585.48,"body":"hey, we are thinking"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":581.52,"endTime":585.48,"body":"of starting a disability ERG,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":585.48,"endTime":588.85,"body":"we can't think of anybody"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":585.48,"endTime":588.85,"body":"better to help run it."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":588.85,"endTime":592.0,"body":"There is this other 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like,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":792.6,"endTime":793.84,"body":"oh right,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":793.84,"endTime":797.74,"body":"we could do even better"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":793.84,"endTime":797.74,"body":"by our employees and others"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":797.74,"endTime":801.49,"body":"and really having the will"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":797.74,"endTime":801.49,"body":"to want to do the right thing"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":801.49,"endTime":803.03,"body":"but not always"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":801.49,"endTime":803.03,"body":"having the budget."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":803.03,"endTime":806.57,"body":"Especially with these"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":803.03,"endTime":806.57,"body":"ridiculous crazy times."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":806.57,"endTime":811.52,"body":"And so one thing"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":806.57,"endTime":811.52,"body":"I wanted to do"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":811.52,"endTime":815.29,"body":"was make sure that the audience"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":811.52,"endTime":815.29,"body":"got to meet you"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":815.85,"endTime":817.62,"body":"and hear what you're saying"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":817.62,"endTime":820.78,"body":"and to really think"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":817.62,"endTime":820.78,"body":"of the nuances associated"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":820.78,"endTime":822.38,"body":"with what Max is saying."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":822.38,"endTime":825.06,"body":"Especially since"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":822.38,"endTime":825.06,"body":"she is representing"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":825.06,"endTime":827.25,"body":"different lived experiences"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":827.25,"endTime":830.33,"body":"and the uniqueness"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":827.25,"endTime":830.33,"body":"of being a human being."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":830.33,"endTime":834.57,"body":"So but one thing"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":830.33,"endTime":834.57,"body":"I would be curious about"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":834.57,"endTime":838.24,"body":"because I think it's really hard"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":834.57,"endTime":838.24,"body":"right now for employers."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":839.19,"endTime":840.59,"body":"Maybe even a little bit harder"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":840.59,"endTime":842.52,"body":"in some way"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":840.59,"endTime":842.52,"body":"for corporate employers,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":842.52,"endTime":844.79,"body":"not that I'm feeling sorry"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":842.52,"endTime":844.79,"body":"for corporations right now."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":844.79,"endTime":849.93,"body":"I think they need to pick up"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":844.79,"endTime":849.93,"body":"the be better thing"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":849.93,"endTime":851.18,"body":"but at the same time,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":851.18,"endTime":854.86,"body":"I think society"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":851.18,"endTime":854.86,"body":"sends you know employers"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":854.86,"endTime":857.1,"body":"so many mixed messages"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":854.86,"endTime":857.1,"body":"and society,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":858.21,"endTime":859.81,"body":"you better solve"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":858.21,"endTime":859.81,"body":"all these problems."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":859.81,"endTime":861.98,"body":"We all didn't solve"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":859.81,"endTime":861.98,"body":"but you better solve it now"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":861.98,"endTime":865.07,"body":"in the workforce."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":861.98,"endTime":865.07,"body":"So one thing I would,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":865.76,"endTime":868.06,"body":"I think might be helpful"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":865.76,"endTime":868.06,"body":"for the audience"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":869.15,"endTime":872.34,"body":"is what would you advise"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":869.15,"endTime":872.34,"body":"that they do Max,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":872.34,"endTime":873.71,"body":"when they are really."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":873.71,"endTime":875.65,"body":"This is another"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":873.71,"endTime":875.65,"body":"big question okay."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":875.65,"endTime":877.0,"body":"You take it wherever you want."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":877.0,"endTime":878.24,"body":"Perfect."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":878.24,"endTime":880.75,"body":"I believe employers are trying."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":880.75,"endTime":883.77,"body":"I believe they are 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kind"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":898.48,"endTime":901.37,"body":"of employee we want."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":901.37,"endTime":903.86,"body":"But I often feel"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":901.37,"endTime":903.86,"body":"they just don't know"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":903.86,"endTime":907.79,"body":"how to really include"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":903.86,"endTime":907.79,"body":"diverse humans"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":907.79,"endTime":910.68,"body":"and I also want"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":907.79,"endTime":910.68,"body":"to make another point,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":910.68,"endTime":914.59,"body":"while you think about this,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":910.68,"endTime":914.59,"body":"in that,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":914.59,"endTime":917.22,"body":"I also just want"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":914.59,"endTime":917.22,"body":"to show you love"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":917.22,"endTime":919.43,"body":"and empathy"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":917.22,"endTime":919.43,"body":"for your chronic pain."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":920.17,"endTime":923.98,"body":"My beautiful daughter, Sarah,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":920.17,"endTime":923.98,"body":"born with Down Syndrome,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":923.98,"endTime":928.64,"body":"she lives with chronic pain"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":923.98,"endTime":928.64,"body":"and it has been so difficult."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":928.64,"endTime":931.71,"body":"And when I'm sometimes like,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":928.64,"endTime":931.71,"body":"Sarah, you can be nicer."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":931.71,"endTime":934.19,"body":"You know, it's hard"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":931.71,"endTime":934.19,"body":"sometimes to be nice"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":934.19,"endTime":935.79,"body":"when you feel really bad."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":936.41,"endTime":940.0,"body":"So I just am so empathic"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":936.41,"endTime":940.0,"body":"over anyone"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":940.0,"endTime":941.57,"body":"that is walking"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":940.0,"endTime":941.57,"body":"that kind of pain."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":941.57,"endTime":943.55,"body":"My husband did"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":941.57,"endTime":943.55,"body":"and now Sarah is."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":944.49,"endTime":947.89,"body":"And it's effecting my life,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":944.49,"endTime":947.89,"body":"as her mother,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":947.89,"endTime":950.91,"body":"somebody that loves her and is"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":947.89,"endTime":950.91,"body":"one of her primary caregivers."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":950.91,"endTime":954.78,"body":"So I don't think"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":950.91,"endTime":954.78,"body":"we can 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sometimes"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1236.95,"endTime":1243.3,"body":"we get het up as advocates"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1243.3,"endTime":1245.16,"body":"about people"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1243.3,"endTime":1245.16,"body":"using person first language."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1245.16,"endTime":1246.81,"body":"Particularly"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1245.16,"endTime":1246.81,"body":"in certain communities,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1246.81,"endTime":1249.25,"body":"particularly in the neuro"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1246.81,"endTime":1249.25,"body":"divergent community"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1249.25,"endTime":1251.61,"body":"and the instinct is to go"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1251.61,"endTime":1256.51,"body":"and send a verbal right hook"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1251.61,"endTime":1256.51,"body":"or a snarky tweet."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1256.51,"endTime":1257.79,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1257.79,"endTime":1260.17,"body":"And I think you explained"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1257.79,"endTime":1260.17,"body":"it perfectly"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1260.17,"endTime":1262.61,"body":"by saying actually we do"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1262.61,"endTime":1265.28,"body":"just need to remind people"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1262.61,"endTime":1265.28,"body":"of our humanity."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1265.28,"endTime":1268.99,"body":"So thank you for that"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1265.28,"endTime":1268.99,"body":"and I'll hand over to Antonio."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1272.5,"endTime":1277.14,"body":"Well, I just want"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1272.5,"endTime":1277.14,"body":"to talk about you know, honesty"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1277.14,"endTime":1279.81,"body":"and being honest"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1277.14,"endTime":1279.81,"body":"within organisations."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1279.81,"endTime":1284.77,"body":"You know, sometimes"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1279.81,"endTime":1284.77,"body":"we need to question,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1284.77,"endTime":1290.25,"body":"you know organisations who are"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1284.77,"endTime":1290.25,"body":"doing things under the radar,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1290.25,"endTime":1293.7,"body":"they don't really talk"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1290.25,"endTime":1293.7,"body":"much about disability."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1293.7,"endTime":1296.27,"body":"They might not talk much"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1293.7,"endTime":1296.27,"body":"about inclusion."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1296.27,"endTime":1299.01,"body":"So people have"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1296.27,"endTime":1299.01,"body":"some expectations"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1299.01,"endTime":1300.92,"body":"but they are doing it"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1299.01,"endTime":1300.92,"body":"under the radar."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1300.92,"endTime":1302.56,"body":"They are not"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1300.92,"endTime":1302.56,"body":"actively promoting."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1303.15,"endTime":1306.11,"body":"So they are doing it"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1303.15,"endTime":1306.11,"body":"in a kind of a subtle way."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1306.11,"endTime":1308.78,"body":"On the other end"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1306.11,"endTime":1308.78,"body":"we have other organisations"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1308.78,"endTime":1312.05,"body":"who are very vocal"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1308.78,"endTime":1312.05,"body":"but then they disappointment."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1312.05,"endTime":1314.31,"body":"Because people say,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1312.05,"endTime":1314.31,"body":"it's so good."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1314.31,"endTime":1317.79,"body":"It's really wonderful"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1314.31,"endTime":1317.79,"body":"to see all this"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1317.79,"endTime":1321.51,"body":"taking place in our big glass"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1317.79,"endTime":1321.51,"body":"building Head Office."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1322.03,"endTime":1326.07,"body":"But me, I'm here in the south"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1322.03,"endTime":1326.07,"body":"or in the different hemisphere."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1326.07,"endTime":1329.01,"body":"And this does really reach me."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1326.07,"endTime":1329.01,"body":"So happy there."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1329.57,"endTime":1333.89,"body":"But here I can't talk"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1329.57,"endTime":1333.89,"body":"with my manager about disability"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1333.89,"endTime":1337.27,"body":"because otherwise I'll be"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1333.89,"endTime":1337.27,"body":"under the radar of HR."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1337.81,"endTime":1340.42,"body":"How do we stand"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1337.81,"endTime":1340.42,"body":"in terms of honesty"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1340.42,"endTime":1343.72,"body":"when we have conversations"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1340.42,"endTime":1343.72,"body":"about disability and inclusion."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1345.14,"endTime":1346.74,"body":"Good question."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1347.27,"endTime":1349.69,"body":"I think honestly"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1347.27,"endTime":1349.69,"body":"about disability"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1349.69,"endTime":1351.17,"body":"really benefits everybody."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1351.17,"endTime":1354.99,"body":"So I try to be honest"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1351.17,"endTime":1354.99,"body":"about it in my interviews,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1354.99,"endTime":1357.57,"body":"to make sure that"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1354.99,"endTime":1357.57,"body":"if they are not happy"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1357.57,"endTime":1361.17,"body":"with a disabled person that they"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1357.57,"endTime":1361.17,"body":"don't hire a disabled person"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1361.17,"endTime":1363.56,"body":"because then my life"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1361.17,"endTime":1363.56,"body":"will be miserable."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1363.56,"endTime":1366.24,"body":"I don't really care about"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1363.56,"endTime":1366.24,"body":"how the company feels."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1366.24,"endTime":1369.19,"body":"I care about how much harder"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1369.19,"endTime":1371.16,"body":"they are going to make"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1369.19,"endTime":1371.16,"body":"my life for me"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1373.69,"endTime":1376.3,"body":"and I think there's"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1373.69,"endTime":1376.3,"body":"a lot of organisations"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1376.3,"endTime":1377.69,"body":"that are all bark and no bite"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1377.69,"endTime":1381.78,"body":"and they post all over"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1377.69,"endTime":1381.78,"body":"social media diversity is good,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1381.78,"endTime":1383.78,"body":"we are so diverse."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1383.78,"endTime":1385.21,"body":"And then when you get"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1383.78,"endTime":1385.21,"body":"in the company,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1385.21,"endTime":1388.19,"body":"it's not really that diverse."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1388.19,"endTime":1391.11,"body":"You have hired like two"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1388.19,"endTime":1391.11,"body":"disabled people,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1391.7,"endTime":1393.87,"body":"a gay man"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1391.7,"endTime":1393.87,"body":"and three people of colour."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1394.7,"endTime":1399.24,"body":"Everyone else is white,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1394.7,"endTime":1399.24,"body":"cisgender, able bodied,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1399.24,"endTime":1401.89,"body":"straight, et cetera."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1399.24,"endTime":1401.89,"body":"And it's like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1402.92,"endTime":1408.74,"body":"there is a fundamental"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1402.92,"endTime":1408.74,"body":"misunderstanding of diversity,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1409.52,"endTime":1411.55,"body":"where just have having"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1409.52,"endTime":1411.55,"body":"a few people"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1411.55,"endTime":1414.23,"body":"who are a little bit different"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1411.55,"endTime":1414.23,"body":"or a little bit quirky,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1414.23,"endTime":1418.56,"body":"as some people call me,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1414.23,"endTime":1418.56,"body":"makes you a diverse workforce"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1418.56,"endTime":1422.8,"body":"and it's not that's not"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1418.56,"endTime":1422.8,"body":"diversity at all."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1423.6,"endTime":1426.15,"body":"Diversity is not screaming it"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1423.6,"endTime":1426.15,"body":"from the rooftops"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1426.15,"endTime":1427.68,"body":"and being like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1426.15,"endTime":1427.68,"body":"we are diverse."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1427.68,"endTime":1429.95,"body":"It's actually putting money"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1427.68,"endTime":1429.95,"body":"where your mouth is"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1429.95,"endTime":1433.24,"body":"and just being diverse."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1429.95,"endTime":1433.24,"body":"Like diversity is so normal."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1434.55,"endTime":1438.47,"body":"If you pick 15 random people,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1439.08,"endTime":1441.78,"body":"they are all going to be"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1439.08,"endTime":1441.78,"body":"diverse in some way."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1441.78,"endTime":1444.43,"body":"If I put names into a hat"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1441.78,"endTime":1444.43,"body":"and I and drew some names,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1444.43,"endTime":1447.66,"body":"they are all going to have,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1444.43,"endTime":1447.66,"body":"some of them will be gay,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1447.66,"endTime":1450.95,"body":"some of them might be trans,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1447.66,"endTime":1450.95,"body":"some of them will be disabled."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1450.95,"endTime":1454.09,"body":"Like, it's just so normal"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1450.95,"endTime":1454.09,"body":"to be different."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1455.8,"endTime":1460.13,"body":"And a lot of companies see it"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1455.8,"endTime":1460.13,"body":"as abnormal to be different"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1460.13,"endTime":1462.03,"body":"but will hire you anyway."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1462.03,"endTime":1465.11,"body":"Whereas companies need to move"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1462.03,"endTime":1465.11,"body":"more towards like okay,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1465.68,"endTime":1469.21,"body":"you have a disability but that's"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1465.68,"endTime":1469.21,"body":"totally normal and fine."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1469.21,"endTime":1470.81,"body":"How can we help?"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1472.43,"endTime":1474.62,"body":"Well, I don't usually do this"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1474.62,"endTime":1476.87,"body":"but as you were talking"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1476.87,"endTime":1479.44,"body":"I wrote down three"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1476.87,"endTime":1479.44,"body":"different quotes from you."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1480.08,"endTime":1484.1,"body":"I'm going to put on"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1480.08,"endTime":1484.1,"body":"LinkedIn and Twitter."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1484.1,"endTime":1486.86,"body":"Honesty about disabilities"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1484.1,"endTime":1486.86,"body":"benefit everyone."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1487.69,"endTime":1492.95,"body":"Wow is that so powerful."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1487.69,"endTime":1492.95,"body":"Disability is so normal."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1495.01,"endTime":1497.8,"body":"And also, it's normal"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1495.01,"endTime":1497.8,"body":"to be different."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1498.62,"endTime":1500.16,"body":"What is going on?"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1500.16,"endTime":1503.69,"body":"This is just so normal"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1500.16,"endTime":1503.69,"body":"to do all this stuff and yet,"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1503.69,"endTime":1506.23,"body":"we have you"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1503.69,"endTime":1506.23,"body":"definitely an unicorn."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1506.23,"endTime":1509.19,"body":"Yes, that does"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1506.23,"endTime":1509.19,"body":"seem to happen a lot."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1509.19,"endTime":1512.77,"body":"I do tick a lot of boxes"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1509.19,"endTime":1512.77,"body":"not because I'm trying,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1512.77,"endTime":1514.72,"body":"just how the cards fell."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1515.98,"endTime":1518.68,"body":"I just happen to be"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1515.98,"endTime":1518.68,"body":"a gay person,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1518.68,"endTime":1521.28,"body":"who is nonbinary,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1518.68,"endTime":1521.28,"body":"who is also disabled,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1521.28,"endTime":1522.75,"body":"whose ears don't work,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1522.75,"endTime":1526.21,"body":"whose eyes don't really work,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1522.75,"endTime":1526.21,"body":"who likes science."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1526.21,"endTime":1530.36,"body":"That's just how it's fell"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1526.21,"endTime":1530.36,"body":"and I love that."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1531.12,"endTime":1532.64,"body":"It's such a rich life"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1531.12,"endTime":1532.64,"body":"that I have."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1532.64,"endTime":1534.09,"body":"Like, look at all these"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1532.64,"endTime":1534.09,"body":"wonderful things"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1534.09,"endTime":1535.33,"body":"that I get to do."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1535.33,"endTime":1537.37,"body":"Right."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1537.37,"endTime":1541.4,"body":"I've been seriously"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1537.37,"endTime":1541.4,"body":"looking at the numbers"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1541.4,"endTime":1543.91,"body":"and references about the numbers"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1541.4,"endTime":1543.91,"body":"of disabled people."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1543.91,"endTime":1548.61,"body":"And apparently there is a number"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1543.91,"endTime":1548.61,"body":"of 15% of the population."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1549.83,"endTime":1551.78,"body":"But if you dive deep"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1549.83,"endTime":1551.78,"body":"in other numbers"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1551.78,"endTime":1554.22,"body":"you realise"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1551.78,"endTime":1554.22,"body":"how absurd that is."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1555.68,"endTime":1558.09,"body":"Because if you just look"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1555.68,"endTime":1558.09,"body":"at the number of people"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1558.09,"endTime":1561.13,"body":"that wear something like this,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1558.09,"endTime":1561.13,"body":"around the world,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1561.81,"endTime":1566.69,"body":"you have about 65% of people"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1561.81,"endTime":1566.69,"body":"around the world"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1566.69,"endTime":1568.15,"body":"and more or less,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1568.15,"endTime":1571.04,"body":"the number might"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1568.15,"endTime":1571.04,"body":"slightly diverge by country,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1571.04,"endTime":1575.14,"body":"by country regarding the age"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1571.04,"endTime":1575.14,"body":"and then on the top of that,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1575.14,"endTime":1578.14,"body":"you have people who are deaf,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1575.14,"endTime":1578.14,"body":"another number."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1578.14,"endTime":1582.13,"body":"So it's basically impossible"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1578.14,"endTime":1582.13,"body":"that we can claim"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1582.13,"endTime":1585.22,"body":"that only 15% of the population"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1582.13,"endTime":1585.22,"body":"has a disability."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1586.18,"endTime":1588.61,"body":"Probably it is the other way"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1586.18,"endTime":1588.61,"body":"around, you know."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1589.16,"endTime":1590.66,"body":"I think you're right."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1590.66,"endTime":1592.54,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1592.54,"endTime":1597.15,"body":"And these type of numbers"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1592.54,"endTime":1597.15,"body":"they end up contributing"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1597.15,"endTime":1601.24,"body":"to the way how much people"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1597.15,"endTime":1601.24,"body":"see the community,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1601.24,"endTime":1606.42,"body":"oh, well 15%"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1601.24,"endTime":1606.42,"body":"and we have interesting cases"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1606.42,"endTime":1611.34,"body":"as think of something,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1606.42,"endTime":1611.34,"body":"release it and did a survey"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1611.34,"endTime":1613.88,"body":"and then people,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1611.34,"endTime":1613.88,"body":"usually assume,"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1613.88,"endTime":1617.54,"body":"so, 5% of my workforce"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1613.88,"endTime":1617.54,"body":"has a disability."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1617.54,"endTime":1621.16,"body":"And then end up realising"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1617.54,"endTime":1621.16,"body":"it's 25% or 30%."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1621.82,"endTime":1625.18,"body":"I think we need to look"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1621.82,"endTime":1625.18,"body":"more seriously to the numbers"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1625.18,"endTime":1628.18,"body":"because they are creating"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1625.18,"endTime":1628.18,"body":"a lot of misunderstandings"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1628.18,"endTime":1629.97,"body":"in the way"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1628.18,"endTime":1629.97,"body":"that we read the world."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1629.97,"endTime":1631.23,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1631.23,"endTime":1635.41,"body":"I think the word disability"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1631.23,"endTime":1635.41,"body":"has been taken out of proportion"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1635.98,"endTime":1637.87,"body":"because people think"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1635.98,"endTime":1637.87,"body":"that being disabled"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1637.87,"endTime":1640.33,"body":"is the worse thing"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1637.87,"endTime":1640.33,"body":"you can ever be."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1640.33,"endTime":1641.94,"body":"Therefore to be disabled,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1641.94,"endTime":1644.5,"body":"you must have one of"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1641.94,"endTime":1644.5,"body":"the worse conditions ever."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1644.5,"endTime":1647.61,"body":"You must have to use"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1644.5,"endTime":1647.61,"body":"the mobility aid"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1647.61,"endTime":1650.25,"body":"that's reserved"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1647.61,"endTime":1650.25,"body":"for the worse sufferers."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1650.88,"endTime":1652.48,"body":"And it isn't like"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1650.88,"endTime":1652.48,"body":"that at all."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1653.12,"endTime":1657.36,"body":"Disability, it's not"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1653.12,"endTime":1657.36,"body":"the worse thing you can be,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1657.36,"endTime":1660.0,"body":"for a start"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1657.36,"endTime":1660.0,"body":"and it's so broad."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1660.0,"endTime":1662.35,"body":"Like, people are like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1660.0,"endTime":1662.35,"body":"oh, I've a chronic illness"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1662.35,"endTime":1664.05,"body":"but I'm not disabled though."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1664.05,"endTime":1666.37,"body":"And I'm like, okay,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1664.05,"endTime":1666.37,"body":"well what do you mean by that?"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1666.37,"endTime":1669.78,"body":"And they're just like I am not"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1666.37,"endTime":1669.78,"body":"really chronically ill enough."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1669.78,"endTime":1671.42,"body":"And I am like, no, no,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1669.78,"endTime":1671.42,"body":"you are, you are."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1671.42,"endTime":1674.4,"body":"You're disabled enough"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1671.42,"endTime":1674.4,"body":"to use the term disabled."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1675.58,"endTime":1678.06,"body":"Like that is just what it is,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1675.58,"endTime":1678.06,"body":"it is just like an adjective."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1678.06,"endTime":1680.63,"body":"It's like my hair is green"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1678.06,"endTime":1680.63,"body":"but some of these parts,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1680.63,"endTime":1682.83,"body":"they are yellow"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1680.63,"endTime":1682.83,"body":"and they are blue at the back."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1682.83,"endTime":1685.76,"body":"That does not mean I'm not"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1682.83,"endTime":1685.76,"body":"green enough to call myself"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1685.76,"endTime":1687.81,"body":"someone with green hair."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1687.81,"endTime":1690.21,"body":"I love that analogy."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1690.21,"endTime":1692.56,"body":"It is something"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1690.21,"endTime":1692.56,"body":"I've struggled with a lot"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1692.56,"endTime":1695.74,"body":"because when I say, people say"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1692.56,"endTime":1695.74,"body":"you don't look disabled."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1695.74,"endTime":1697.69,"body":"And I'm like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1695.74,"endTime":1697.69,"body":"what does that look like?"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1698.3,"endTime":1699.87,"body":"I go I'm deafblind"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1698.3,"endTime":1699.87,"body":"and people are like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1699.87,"endTime":1701.98,"body":"you don't look like"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1699.87,"endTime":1701.98,"body":"and I go great,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1701.98,"endTime":1704.48,"body":"you look it to me"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1701.98,"endTime":1704.48,"body":"because I can't fucking see you."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1706.6,"endTime":1709.12,"body":"Thank you for F bombing."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1706.6,"endTime":1709.12,"body":"It is usually me."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1709.12,"endTime":1710.96,"body":"I'm so sorry."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1710.96,"endTime":1712.36,"body":"Don't be sorry."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1712.36,"endTime":1717.9,"body":"And by the way we'll not"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1712.36,"endTime":1717.9,"body":"be staring in the captions."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1717.9,"endTime":1719.7,"body":"We'll leave it."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1719.7,"endTime":1721.01,"body":"Perfect."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1721.01,"endTime":1723.73,"body":"Deaf people should not guess"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1721.01,"endTime":1723.73,"body":"which swear word, I said."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1723.73,"endTime":1729.77,"body":"They deserve to know."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1729.77,"endTime":1731.25,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1731.25,"endTime":1734.5,"body":"I'm an adult deaf person,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1731.25,"endTime":1734.5,"body":"I don't need to be censored."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1736.57,"endTime":1738.18,"body":"No. So many things here."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1740.43,"endTime":1741.71,"body":"So, so many things."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1741.71,"endTime":1745.19,"body":"So, we, when I talk about"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1741.71,"endTime":1745.19,"body":"my own organisation,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1745.19,"endTime":1748.53,"body":"we are, as you've"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1745.19,"endTime":1748.53,"body":"already mentioned diverse"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1748.53,"endTime":1751.47,"body":"by our very existence,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1751.47,"endTime":1754.26,"body":"we are in 70 countries,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1751.47,"endTime":1754.26,"body":"110,000 people."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1755.16,"endTime":1757.13,"body":"The diversity is there"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1755.16,"endTime":1757.13,"body":"by default"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1757.13,"endTime":1759.42,"body":"but it's our choice"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1757.13,"endTime":1759.42,"body":"to be inclusive."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1759.42,"endTime":1760.65,"body":"Mm hmm."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1760.65,"endTime":1764.0,"body":"And I think that everyone"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1764.0,"endTime":1766.85,"body":"is focused"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1764.0,"endTime":1766.85,"body":"on diversity and metrics"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1766.85,"endTime":1769.22,"body":"and not enough on culture"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1766.85,"endTime":1769.22,"body":"and attitudes"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1769.22,"endTime":1770.82,"body":"and how we treat people."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1772.29,"endTime":1774.49,"body":"Now, there are certain things"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1772.29,"endTime":1774.49,"body":"we do need to measure"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1774.49,"endTime":1777.7,"body":"because businesses operate on,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1774.49,"endTime":1777.7,"body":"if it doesn't get measured,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1777.7,"endTime":1780.16,"body":"it doesn't get done,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1777.7,"endTime":1780.16,"body":"kind of ethos."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1780.73,"endTime":1782.379,"body":"But at the same time,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1780.73,"endTime":1782.379,"body":"I am happy."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1783.25,"endTime":1785.9,"body":"Be careful about"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1783.25,"endTime":1785.9,"body":"what you choose to measure."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1785.9,"endTime":1788.22,"body":"Yes, it's like measure"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1785.9,"endTime":1788.22,"body":"so that you know"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1788.22,"endTime":1791.069,"body":"that you're doing it but don't"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1788.22,"endTime":1791.069,"body":"do it for the measurement."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1792.37,"endTime":1794.87,"body":"Oh."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1794.87,"endTime":1796.79,"body":"Debra has got"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1794.87,"endTime":1796.79,"body":"her pen running out."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1798.47,"endTime":1800.07,"body":"I got another quote."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1801.2,"endTime":1803.66,"body":"I'm going to follow Max"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1801.2,"endTime":1803.66,"body":"around all day"},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1803.66,"endTime":1805.78,"body":"and just get quotes from her."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1805.78,"endTime":1808.01,"body":"That happens more"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1805.78,"endTime":1808.01,"body":"than I can even say."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1808.74,"endTime":1814.01,"body":"So I mean I think"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1808.74,"endTime":1814.01,"body":"that you know,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1814.01,"endTime":1817.89,"body":"changing culture change"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1814.01,"endTime":1817.89,"body":"and mindset change"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1817.89,"endTime":1821.41,"body":"is so integral"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1817.89,"endTime":1821.41,"body":"to what we are doing"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1821.41,"endTime":1824.44,"body":"which is why we need"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1821.41,"endTime":1824.44,"body":"people like yourself"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1824.44,"endTime":1829.44,"body":"that are willing to talk"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1824.44,"endTime":1829.44,"body":"about this coherently,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1829.44,"endTime":1834.87,"body":"willing to also see things"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1829.44,"endTime":1834.87,"body":"from the other perspective"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1835.65,"endTime":1841.07,"body":"because I think that the fact"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1835.65,"endTime":1841.07,"body":"that you're able to see"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1841.07,"endTime":1842.95,"body":"that other people"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1841.07,"endTime":1842.95,"body":"might need that reminder,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1842.95,"endTime":1845.59,"body":"in the language"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1842.95,"endTime":1845.59,"body":"and accept something"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1845.59,"endTime":1848.72,"body":"that you would prefer"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1845.59,"endTime":1848.72,"body":"not to but understand that."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1848.72,"endTime":1851.65,"body":"I would prefer they just"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1848.72,"endTime":1851.65,"body":"saw me as a person from the off"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1851.65,"endTime":1853.51,"body":"and like maybe they would just"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1851.65,"endTime":1853.51,"body":"describe me"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1853.51,"endTime":1854.71,"body":"slightly differently."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1854.71,"endTime":1857.66,"body":"And be like, oh, that's max,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1854.71,"endTime":1857.66,"body":"they are a disabled person."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1857.66,"endTime":1861.47,"body":"Like, sometimes I want"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1857.66,"endTime":1861.47,"body":"to be like Max."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1861.47,"endTime":1862.93,"body":"They tick our diversity boxes."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1862.93,"endTime":1865.45,"body":"And they contribute to our stats"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1862.93,"endTime":1865.45,"body":"in these three columns."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1865.45,"endTime":1866.71,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1866.71,"endTime":1869.55,"body":"Like, sometimes we get"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1866.71,"endTime":1869.55,"body":"so caught up in the language."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1870.18,"endTime":1872.5,"body":"So for example, at university,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1870.18,"endTime":1872.5,"body":"I was the --"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1873.05,"endTime":1875.899,"body":"we'll call it the trans officer,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1873.05,"endTime":1875.899,"body":"it's a much longer name."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1876.4,"endTime":1879.41,"body":"And we were campaigning"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1876.4,"endTime":1879.41,"body":"for some gender-neutral toilets."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1879.41,"endTime":1881.81,"body":"We just wanted like some"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1879.41,"endTime":1881.81,"body":"to be available."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1881.81,"endTime":1885.38,"body":"The single use ones"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1881.81,"endTime":1885.38,"body":"that are just like a room"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1885.38,"endTime":1889.47,"body":"with one toilet in it"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1885.38,"endTime":1889.47,"body":"and the door locks"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1889.47,"endTime":1893.02,"body":"and they were like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1889.47,"endTime":1893.02,"body":"yes, it's for like okay,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1893.02,"endTime":1895.81,"body":"we can do that,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1893.02,"endTime":1895.81,"body":"what shall we put on the door."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1895.81,"endTime":1899.38,"body":"And the decision"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1895.81,"endTime":1899.38,"body":"about what language"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1899.38,"endTime":1901.479,"body":"and what picture"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1899.38,"endTime":1901.479,"body":"we would put on the door,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1902.27,"endTime":1904.44,"body":"held the project up by"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1902.27,"endTime":1904.44,"body":"at least a year."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1904.44,"endTime":1907.53,"body":"I think I was arguing,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1904.44,"endTime":1907.53,"body":"just put toilet on it."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1907.53,"endTime":1908.87,"body":"Right, right."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1908.87,"endTime":1911.38,"body":"For the three years,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1908.87,"endTime":1911.38,"body":"and they were like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1911.38,"endTime":1913.93,"body":"oh, but it's a bit vulgar"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1911.38,"endTime":1913.93,"body":"and I'm like"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1915.36,"endTime":1916.67,"body":"and then I'm just like"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1916.67,"endTime":1919.7,"body":"why don't you put a picture"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1916.67,"endTime":1919.7,"body":"of a toilet or just like WC."},{"speaker":"DEBRA","startTime":1919.7,"endTime":1920.98,"body":"Bathroom."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1920.98,"endTime":1924.44,"body":"Or the stick figures,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1924.44,"endTime":1925.97,"body":"where they've got like one"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1924.44,"endTime":1925.97,"body":"that's the man"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1925.97,"endTime":1927.82,"body":"and one that's the woman,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1925.97,"endTime":1927.82,"body":"just put both and they're like,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1927.82,"endTime":1929.45,"body":"that might be a bit vague."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1927.82,"endTime":1929.45,"body":"And I'm like."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1929.45,"endTime":1930.68,"body":"Poop emoji."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1930.68,"endTime":1934.1,"body":"So it's too vague"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1930.68,"endTime":1934.1,"body":"and too specific,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1934.1,"endTime":1935.72,"body":"like, I don't care."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1936.45,"endTime":1938.78,"body":"I know it's not ideal"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1936.45,"endTime":1938.78,"body":"that we are representing"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1938.78,"endTime":1942.61,"body":"two sexes and nonbinary people"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1938.78,"endTime":1942.61,"body":"maybe don't fit either of those"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1942.61,"endTime":1944.39,"body":"and maybe the non-binary"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1942.61,"endTime":1944.39,"body":"person identifies"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1944.39,"endTime":1945.7,"body":"as the line"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1944.39,"endTime":1945.7,"body":"of the middle of them."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1945.7,"endTime":1949.83,"body":"I don't care, I just want"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1945.7,"endTime":1949.83,"body":"somewhere that I can go pee"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1949.83,"endTime":1954.05,"body":"and I think they got"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1949.83,"endTime":1954.05,"body":"so hung up on the language"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1954.05,"endTime":1956.08,"body":"and I'm like you're missing"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1954.05,"endTime":1956.08,"body":"the entire point."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1956.08,"endTime":1957.3,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1957.3,"endTime":1958.64,"body":"I don't want to pee"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1957.3,"endTime":1958.64,"body":"in bathroom nine"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1958.64,"endTime":1960.24,"body":"and three quarters, I just"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1963.39,"endTime":1965.72,"body":"Maybe that was"},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1963.39,"endTime":1965.72,"body":"quite a good name."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1965.72,"endTime":1967.6,"body":"Place to go to go pee."},{"speaker":"ANTONIO","startTime":1965.72,"endTime":1967.6,"body":"That's it."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1970.8,"endTime":1973.05,"body":"Then, can you only pee"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1970.8,"endTime":1973.05,"body":"or do the other thing."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1973.66,"endTime":1976.46,"body":"That's why I said,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1973.66,"endTime":1976.46,"body":"just put the poop emoji."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1976.46,"endTime":1977.74,"body":"I was going to say that,"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1977.74,"endTime":1979.44,"body":"we should just put"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1977.74,"endTime":1979.44,"body":"the poop emoji."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1980.82,"endTime":1982.05,"body":"Excellent."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1982.05,"endTime":1986.03,"body":"I think that's a perfect"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1982.05,"endTime":1986.03,"body":"ending to the Podcast."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1986.03,"endTime":1989.26,"body":"Someone has to stop me"},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":1986.03,"endTime":1989.26,"body":"because otherwise I never will."},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1989.26,"endTime":1990.61,"body":"On that note,"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1990.61,"endTime":1993.0,"body":"I need to thank"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1990.61,"endTime":1993.0,"body":"My ClearText and Amazon"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1993.0,"endTime":1994.75,"body":"for keeping us captioned"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1993.0,"endTime":1994.75,"body":"and On Air"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1995.38,"endTime":1998.29,"body":"and I really look forward"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1995.38,"endTime":1998.29,"body":"to continuing this conversation"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1998.29,"endTime":1999.58,"body":"with poop emoji's"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1999.58,"endTime":2001.83,"body":"so long as they are"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":1999.58,"endTime":2001.83,"body":"all accurately described"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":2001.83,"endTime":2004.15,"body":"with image descriptions"},{"speaker":"NEIL","startTime":2001.83,"endTime":2004.15,"body":"and everything else."},{"speaker":"MAX","startTime":2005.55,"endTime":2007.15,"body":"Perfect."}]}