Season 6 Episode 3: The Word on Coaching - EQ/Emotional Intelligence

What is emotional intelligence?

There are many definitions but our guest Timothy Smith shares what he believes   "It's about accessing emotional information and then working with that emotional information to be more effective."

In this episode, Timothy Smith who is an experienced coach shares his insight on emotional intelligence from his personal journey and insight gained from working with his clients.

Join us as our guest Timothy Smith talks about the concept of emotional intelligence.

We hope you enjoy this episode 

Contact Information:
 (22) Timothy Smith, PCC | LinkedIn

barrenridgeconsulting.com/index.html (Company)

Recommended Books in this Podcast Episode:

3 Vital Questions: Transforming Workplace Drama: Emerald, David: 9780996871839: Amazon.com: Books

Check out our best-selling book The Word on Coaching.  Buy a copy for yourself and copies to share with others. It is a great resource for one-on-one and group discussions.

Amazon.com: The Word on Coaching: 9781737643807: Neely, Debby, Auger, Joann, Fuselier, Kevin: Books

Also, please check out a quick guide about powerful questions: "Embrace the Power of Questions!"   A Quick Reference Guide to Getting the Answers You Need.  

Transcript

JoAnn 0:07

Hello everyone. Welcome to Word on Coaching. I'm Joanne, and here with me are my two compadres, Debbie and Kevin. Hello. Hello everybody. So we're three friends that have years of leadership and coaching experience, and we wanted to share our passion with others. So this is why we're doing what we're doing. Our podcasts are for leaders, whether you have a formal title or not but we know there's a lot of leading going on out there without titles. And what we do when we get together is focus on one word and that word that usually relates to leadership and coaching. The reason we pick this is because we know that leadership is hard and it gets harder by the day sometimes it feels like. So we're here along with our guests to give you tips, information, hopefully a fresh perspective in some instances, but always with support. And because we want you to know that you do have support out here. So today we're really excited to have a former colleague, a friend of us all Tim Smith and a little bit about Tim. Gosh, Tim, I guess 15 years at minimum. Has uh, we've known, I don't know how you're getting so much older and I'm not, but. It. We have been friends and colleagues for, for a while, and one of the things Tim and I talk a lot about personality assessments and Tim and I always talk about we're on two ends of a spectrum, and we laugh about being friends because we see the world entirely different most of the time. I respect and, and admire Tim. He's a great coach and we're just excited that you hear tonight, Tim. So, you know, tell us a little bit, tell our audience a little bit about yourself and we'll jump.

Tim 2:05

Oh, thank you. Yeah, so first it is really good to to be here. I am happy to see all of you again. A little about me. I guess I've been kind of coaching full-time for about four years. Excited to share that. I just got my P C C in November of last year, which feels like an accomplishment. And I, I think that maybe a new fun thing. I really have been discovering, I think finally discovering my niche with coaching and working as cool niche with very analytical thinkers. So a lot of engineers, attorneys, people that work in finance and accounting many of them in leadership roles, and I'm. Getting the opportunity to help them in some areas where they could use some help particularly around building their eq, improving their communication skills. And then definitely managing some of the overthinking that can come with people that are really good at thinking. And I, I like it. It really kind of fans my fire because it's letting me bring a lot of my favorite topics together. And that's, you know, emotional intelligence and coaching and analytical thinking and leadership. So it's been a really cool little niche for me to discover and.

JoAnn 3:26

Yeah. So that's the word. Word we picked right, was emotional intelligence. I guess the obvious question is, we know there's a lot of buzz out there. It's not like it's a new thing, but it's, it's kind of like we come back around and it's really a lot of buzz and a lot of. Trending out there talking about eq. So why do you think it is now such an important topic? Why do you hear so much about it right now, and especially in relationship to leadership?

Tim 3:57

Oh, that's a, a good question. I think it's always been important. I think it's been gain. popularity since, probably since the late nineties. But I think more and more important is we are seeing millennials take up bigger and bigger space in the workforce, and now Gen Z moving in their expectations of how they are going to be treated in the workplace are very different than like me as a Gen X or, or baby boomers before me. And so that relationship. Peace really becomes a lot more important. And eq emotional intelligence is really probably the biggest single driver of your ability to have good working relationships. So I think that's probably what it is. It it's more important because our workforce, our, our workforce expects different from us as leaders. I think it's

Debby 4:52

really interesting that you brought that up, Tim. I just saw an article the other day. You know, we keep hearing the phrase quiet, quitting. That's the The new one, right? The new buzz phrase. And it was actually talking about these younger generations. It's not that they're quiet, quitting, it's that they want more connectedness, more relationships, which is the whole EQ piece. and I think sometimes people assume they don't want it and so that I think, you know, I hear a lot of leaders struggle with what do I do with my Gin Xers and my gin's ears and all that. And so I, all leaders out there listen up cuz Tim's gonna tell you what you need to do, to help really connect with those, those employees.

Kevin 5:30

Yeah, I was thinking about that. Also. I've been listening and reading and I heard an article about, work from home and some of the people were responding. Well, if I go into a office, Why am I going to the office? I want to connect with people when I come into the office. I just don't wanna sit at my desk and work on my same spreadsheet. So when I come to the office, what am I going to do? So when you think about emotional intelligence, it's becoming, you know, even more important because the expectation of leaders and people being more emotionally intelligent to make those connections, I think is increasing. So Tim, as we talk about this, Maybe there could be somebody out there that's really not sure what we mean when we say emotional intelligence. So what is emotional intelligence, and can you just give us a summary or a definition of what emotional intelligence is?

Tim 6:25

I can, Kevin? Good question. Really, it it's, I, there's a lot of differing opinion. I think it's very nuanced, but I think how technical, for me, I think it really kind of comes down to it. It's about accessing emotional information. and then working with that emotional information to be more effective. And the way I like to really think about it, it's not really a definition, but a visual. So if you imagine a four box model with the columns on the left side, there's self, and on the right side there's other, and then you've got the rows. The top row is around awareness, and the bottom row is around manage. So if you overlay those rows and columns, you get, you know, upper left self-awareness, upper right, you've got social awareness or empathy on the lower. Row or the lower boxes, you've got lower left self-management. So can I keep my composure? Can I keep my optimism, can I keep my motivation? And then you kind of pull all of those together in that lower right corner with relationship management or, or social management. And that's where leadership really comes in. That's where you're talking about. influence. You're talking about inspiration, you're talking about uh, teamwork, you're talking about conflict management. In my head, it's always that four box model. that's

Kevin 7:53

very helpful to, to think about that because I know different times I've had conversations with people about emotional intelligence and it's like this is an influence strategy. I mean, you have to be able to manage yourself if you're going to influence others in a positive way. So thanks, thanks for sharing that.

Tim 8:13

Good distinction.

Debby 8:15

I like that visual. It'll be easy to remember. So I think we can learn a lot, Tim, from people's journeys and experiences their stories. So tell us a little bit about your story with EQ Tim. What was your biggest discovery on your journey to learning more about emotional intelligence?

Tim 8:31

Again Joanne, you said 15 years ago? A minute ago. It was actually 19 years. And one of my big first big peaks into my lack of emotional intelligence was going through a leadership development. Program that Joanna Debbie were both involved in as facilitators and coaches. And part of that program we did a 360. It was the first time I had ever been involved in a 360 assessment. And some of the feedback I got was really pointed, let's say very eye-opening. And I think for me, the, the big takeaway there was the difference between intent and. and it's something that I've carried with me for a long time. There were oftentimes, I thought I was being funny. I thought I was being efficient in a conversation and a lot of people were experiencing me as not funny, but cynical, sarcastic and not being efficient in a conversation. I'm being blunt or being direct. And I think that was a huge, that that kind of set me off on this path of like, oh, wow. I maybe I don't know myself as well as I thought I did, and then I would say like the ongoing journey from that was to learn to understand the difference between being introspective and being self-aware because they're not the same thing. I think I've always been very introspective, an introspective child. I think that might come with introversion, but. introspection is self-awareness. They're not always, they don't always equal each other. So I think learning that, how I understand myself is just one piece of that puzzle. One, one facet of it, and to keep looking and expanding, you know, what does self-awareness mean? It's, it's really, it's a journey. It's not a destination.

JoAnn 10:31

I totally agree. I totally agree. And thanks for that correction on the 19 years That was our relationship. Everybody. he knows the stats. I'm good at guessing. He knows the stats. you know Tim, when you were talking. And I love that story. You know, I wish more of our leaders would have those aha moments, right? when they go like, eh, they look at their 360 and, and they don't make that connection. I do think it begs to ask this question, what, what do you see as the connection between coaching and eq? and it does it mean that a leader who has the high EQ will also be a really good coach. So can you talk about that a little bit?

Tim 11:17

Yeah. You know, that makes me think of it, it makes me think of something I learned in math like a thousand years ago. You know, the, the square is a rambus, but a rambus isn't necessarily a square. So with that meaning I think. does high eq, does high EQ leader equal a good coach? No, I don't think implicitly, but I think it's really hard to be a good coaching leader without high eq. So I think there, you know what I mean? Like the, the coaching is a different skill set, but your coaching skills and your skill as a coaching leader, it's gonna be far more effective with high EQ than it would be. you. You got us thinking

Kevin 12:02

tonight. Tim. You got us think. got us thinking deeply about these things. Yeah.

Debby 12:11

Geometry. I like the comparison.

Kevin 12:16

I was thinking as we're, as we're having this conversation about EQ and coaching and different things, is how do we integrate EQ into our coaching? How do we do that?

Tim 12:28

That's a, that is a thoughtful question. You know, there's part of me that just believes that that happens. You know, I, I at least. All right. First of all, let me say this, I, it's, I don't feel like I've mastered emotional intelligence on my own, so I don't want to talk like I have. What I will say is that as I have worked diligently to develop my emotional intelligence, it's made me better at anything I do with other people, including coaching. So, while I, I say what a, kind of what I said a minute ago. Coaching is a different skillset than leading. It's a different skillset than, than, than maybe having high EQ or knowing how to use high eq. But if you work on your emotional intelligence, the self awareness, the the empathy that you grow from that, just, it just naturally eeks into your coaching and it changes how you connect with people and it changes how, you know, back to those ideas of influence and inspiration. It changes how you interact with people. And that's where I think it, that the big connection is. So maybe it's not elica, if I do this, then this happens, but more like on the journey of developing your own eq, you become better at this other place where you connect with.

Kevin 13:50

Yeah. When you were saying that, Tim, I just thought about what you were saying about emotional intelligence, intelligence making you better at other aspects and in your relationships. And I was thinking EQ is maybe, it's kind of like salt when used appropriately, it makes everything better. You know, it's knowing how to

Tim 14:09

use it. I like that. I and, and, and very much agree. It is like,

Debby 14:16

and I can see with emotional intelligence, like if you're, if you're self-aware as a leader, like if you know you're one of those leaders that is not good at silence or you know, doesn't like to ask, would rather tell than ask questions. Or maybe you, you know, you're aware of your biases cause we all have them and you can manage. or your, the empathy piece, like, Hey, I'm, I'm gonna go into this conversation with the intention of trying to understand the other person instead of drilling home, you know, my point of view. So I, I see a lot of correlations, like you said, that if I am high in EQ, it will make me a better coat, cuz I'll bring that into that, that skillset and who I am. And I can remember when we first started training to become coaches. I was a little taken aback cuz the beginning of it, they, we were doing so much work on ourselves and I'm like, hold on, hold on. Like, I thought this coaching stuff was about doing stuff to other people. Right? Why are we working? So how, spending so much time on ourselves here. And I think that's the other EQ piece, right? It's part of it is about managing yourself. You know, the, the work that you do on who you are and how you show up. And then the other piece is how you use that to connect and understand and support other people. I see a lot of correlations, like you said, they're two different things, but there, there's definitely those correlations between them.

Tim 15:40

Yeah. Similarly the coaching program that I went through where I really did. you know, most of my learning was very focused on us and I had that same reaction. I'm like, you know, learning all this stuff about myself, I really know all this stuff. Which I mean, I didn't, but I thought I did. Yeah. And yeah, to understand that connection has been very empowering.

Debby 16:04

I think that leads into, to my next question for you, Tim, is I feel like EQ is one of those things, like you mentioned, that someone. Is always working on. Right. I don't, I don't know if you ever hit the peak where you're like, I've done it., I'm the most emotionally intelligent I'm ever gonna be. Right. And so I feel like it's, it's always a work in, in progress. I know I work on it and I'm sure a lot of our audience is still working on it. So what are two or three suggestions or tips thing, things that you would recommend to our audience that might help them to, keep working on their emotional.

Tim 16:35

So probably surprise, Joanne, by leaving out personality work or personality type out of that. I, I think that's important, but I would not put it at the top two or three. I think values identifying your personal values, like getting really. on what's important to you, what really drives you, what motivates you, how you wanna show up in the world. I think that's really fundamental to, to understanding yourself and thus, too good eq. I think another one that, that it's easy to fall short of is our emotional vocabulary. Like really learning the words, the nuances of. Of, of our feelings, of her emotions. And, and I'll, and I'll pull out a little Brene Brown here, but I am a huge fan, Atlas of the Heart. she talks about, we're okay at identifying mad, sad, and glad, and we are really bad at anything beyond that. We're just okay with those three. So, my two favorite resources for that is the, the Gottman Feeling Wheel, which you can Google and find. Great. It's a great resource. And then Atlas of the Heart itself, I mean, it is it is a book I am never shy about recommending to anybody who needs to understand more about emotional or emotional information. I think that and third thing, and this is the biggest and the most impactful and the hardest to do. Find your loving critics, you know, find the people who really care about you and are willing to tell you the truth. I know at least one of those that I was on this call with me, I think those are, those are good ways. I mean, it really comes down to getting feedback, understanding your values, and improving your emotional.

Debby 18:26

That's great. Can I ask a, a follow up question, cuz you had mentioned earlier that with your niche of coaching that the type of, one of the type of leaders that you really sounds like enjoy working with are the more logical leaders, right? The analytical leaders, like you said, attorneys and engineers, people like that. And I would think if you mentioned the word like emotions, feelings, emotional nuance, your emotional vocabulary that they would be. Like Right. Just like zone over, like what are we talking about? How do you talk about emotional intelligence is do you use different language? Do you just be very transparent and put it out there? So when you've got someone who's an employee who's really logical and really analytical, how do you broach these topics with them and not get them to shut?

Tim 19:16

So yeah, analytical, logical, rational those are, those are the people that I'm working with a lot. To answer the question, sometimes it's very strategically, it's, it's not in the first session. It's not in the first two sessions. It's building rapport and trust with a client and then, exploring that topic with them. I have found most of, most of the people I've worked with, you know, in the last couple of years are comfortable with the idea of emotional intelligence, the phrase emotional intelligence. We start peeling that onion and we get into that emotional vocabulary piece. Yeah, it is a little more discomfort. So I think for me, what has worked best is build the relationship I have with a client. Before we kind of dive into that, really uncomfortable. Yeah, if, you know, if you think about what we do as a combination of our thoughts and our feelings and our actions a lot of the people that I'm working with are very oriented to the thinking piece, followed closely by the doing piece, and feelings and emotions are far distant, so you kind of have to play a long game in those coaching relationships.

20:29

Okay.

Debby 20:29

That's great advice for a leader, right? Like, like you, it's what you started with. Build that relationship, build that tr that foundation, and then you can have these harder, maybe more uncomfortable conversations

Tim 20:40

if you Yes.

JoAnn 20:44

Tim, I was reading this article on this rather large study that was done on emotional intelligence and has, and how as leaders, you know, as we grow up that rank or that corporate ladder or, or move from, you know, first line all the way to even c E O. That what they noticed in this study was that a lot of the leaders as they climb up the, the, the ladder is that they lose empathy. And I, that was startling to mean. So my question to you is, one is how do they maybe recognize that they're losing empathy? And what suggestions would you make to the, the leaders as they grow to hold on to that or grow that?

Tim 21:29

It kind of saddens me to hear that and I can kind of see it, you know, as you, as you get farther away from the people, like the, the, the people that do the work your perspective on the organization changes, and I'm sure it becomes more and more about results. As far as keeping a connection, you know, I think it's important to remember that the work happens at the, maybe at the bottom of the organization. I don't like the way that sounds, but I think, you know what I mean, you know, it's, it's the work happens where the people are and. I'm not sure what to say as far as how to notice that your empathy might be slipping, but I would think the cure-all would be to spend time with your people. I mean, even if it is, a big organization, having the VP walk through a functional area. twice a month. You know, it's something, it's, it's get, get a feel for what they're experiencing. Ha have, have an understanding, like, you know, hear them talking, hear them and you don't, you don't have to spend lots of time, but just get snippets, be seen, be experienced. I think that would, I would like to think that would help.

JoAnn 22:39

Yeah. Thanks for that. Well, we, I could talk a lot more about that, but I wanna be respectful of time we always ask our guests a few questions. We promise they're not that hard. So the, the first question that I wanna ask you is, what is a book that you think a leader coach should.

Tim 23:03

Are you ready to see y'all got some good questions for me tonight? You know, the, the first book that comes to mind is three Vital Questions by I think David Emerald. and I think it's a neat way of looking at coaching in the business setting, but it's also a really cool spin on the Carman drama triangle or the, the, the d d T, the dreaded drama triangle, which is, you know, this model of, of how we interact with people in relationship that we're in relationships with. And yeah, I just think it's, it's, it's written as a fable, but it's got a lot of information in it and. It's been a book I've gone back to lots of times.

Debby 23:48

Very cool. Well, we'll add that in the notes so people can grab that title if they need it. So Tim, what's a question that someone's asked you? So you've been on the other end of coaching, right? So what's a question that really gave you pause or allowed you to think a little deeper?

Tim 24:08

So I will share this. I've been working with an awesome coach named Espy Ross out of Roanoke, Virginia, and she is really good at helping me see my assumptions and usually with something like, man, I feel like I hear some assumptions in there, so I don't even know that it's really a question. It's more just like this big check, you know, I'm sharing what my experience is or I'm talking about it, and she is. you know, respectful enough, caring enough to point out to me where I'm letting assumption play in. I'm letting my narrative, you know I'm letting my storyline play into how I'm experiencing or how I'm acting, or what I'm thinking about. Yeah, that's

Debby 24:57

great. And I, I love the reminder. It doesn't have to be a question, right? It could be an observation or a statement. I love that. So besides eq, what we talked about tonight, Tim, what is your word on coaching?

Tim 25:09

Ooh, my word on coaching. Uncomfortable. Yeah, get uncomfortable. If you're comfortable. You're probably not growing, especially if you're a leader and you're getting your feet wet with coaching. Take the risk, get uncom. try it. You know, chances are really strong that you are not going to do anything horrible. And you might ask a question that doesn't land or make an observation that somebody disagrees with, but get uncomfortable and take that chance.

Debby 25:40

Mm-hmm. so Brene Brown, courage over comfort, right? Yeah. That's her, her big quote. Yeah. Well, thank you. Thanks, Tim. We really appreciate you spending time with us tonight and sharing your experiences and your, your insights. Just, you know, from your own journey, but also your experience working with other leaders. I'm sure our audience has written down a lot of stuff that they can take away, and Joanna, Kevin is always, it's always a pleasure to have you. On our podcast as well. And thank you to our audience for listening. We so appreciate you all and that you keep following us and, and listening to the podcast. There are more podcasts to check out. We're in season six, so if you missed some of the earlier seasons, Tim was on an earlier season, go out and and check some of those out. We're gonna have some more coming to you in season six. We have a coaches three Facebook page if you'd like to connect with us. And also we'd love to mention our book with the same name as our podcast, the word on coaching. And we've been hearing lots of people saying, Hey, I'm buying a copy of the book and I'm buying it for my min, my mentee, or my team, or you know, the group that I work with or my child. So buy a copy for yourself and, and buy a copy for someone else. As always, we appreciate you guys, and until next time, that's the word on coaching.