Season 7 Episode 8: The Word on Coaching - Pursuit of it all

Are you in Pursuit of it All?

In this episode we have a heartfelt conversation with Jennifer Gerlock. She is a Blogger and Marketer.  Her online work has lead her to collaborate with brands like Coca-Cola, Sleep Number, Invisalign, Saucony, Flat-Out Bread, Ritz Carlton, Great Wolf Lodge and Hallmark, among others.

When you are in pursuit of everything, what happens when you get everything except the thing that matters most to you?

We chat with Jennifer about her experience of career achievement and the potential high price. 

After sitting down with herself and examining what she really wanted she made a big decision...

Listen to this episode for some balanced wisdom, honest self-evaluation, and refreshing humor as we discuss the Pursuit of it All.

Contact information:
(19) Jennifer Gerlock | LinkedIn

About - Pursuit of it All

Partner With Us - Pursuit of it All

Books Recommended in this episode:

Dare to Lead: Brave Work. Tough Conversations. Whole Hearts.: Brown, Brené: 9780399592522: Amazon.com: Books


Check out our best-selling book The Word on Coaching.  Buy a copy for yourself and copies to share with others.
Amazon.com: The Word on Coaching: 9781737643807: Neely, Debby, Auger, Joann, Fuselier, Kevin: Books

Check out our  quick guide about powerful questions: "Embrace the Power of Questions!"   A Quick Reference Guide to Getting the Answers You Need.  

Transcript

Debby 0:04

Hi, everyone. Welcome to the Word On Coaching podcast. I'm Debbie. I'm here with Joanne. Hi, Joanne.

JoAnn 0:12

Hello.

Debby 0:13

And I'm here with Kevin. Hi, Kevin.

Kevin 0:16

Hey, Debbie.

Debby 0:17

So we are coaches three. We are three friends with decades of leadership and coaching experience who want to share our passion with others. Now, our podcasts are for leaders, whether you have the formal title or not. We know a lot of you are out there leading without that formal title, doing your thing. We appreciate that a lot. Now we focus on one word that relates to leadership and coaching. Because we know leadership is hard. We've been leaders. We support leaders. So we, along with our guests, want to give you tips, information, maybe a different perspective, but always a lot of support. We are here for you. today we are excited to welcome Jennifer Gerlach. Hi, Jen.

0:58

Hi.

Debby 1:00

So let me tell you a little about Jen. So Jen is currently a public affairs specialist for a government agency. She's also the owner, editor, and a contributor for her blog, Pursuit of it All. So check out her blog. Now, I met Jen through her work at our local chamber of commerce. And I don't know how to describe this Jen, I was trying to think of it. She's this, Someone who brings good vibes and you'll, you'll experience it yourself. So you'll get to see what I'm talking about. She's very creative and she's one of those unique people that gets a lot of things done and has a lot of fun doing it. It's nice when you get to be brought along for the ride with that. Jen, what else would you like our audience to see?

1:45

Oh, my goodness. Well I've spent most of my professional career in some manner working with or for nonprofits. So, like, I have a real heart for the community. I love to volunteer. I love to give back. So, I'm always part of a, a board or a committee or something like that trying to give back in some manner. I always like to point that out because I think the nonprofit world really shaped my philosophy on giving, maybe giving too much to the community and, it's just always really resonated with me.

Debby 2:17

Great. Thanks. Thanks for sharing that. I do think that's really important that you shared that because you've made a little bit of a switch and we're going to talk about that. for today's episode, the word is pursuit of it all. So, obviously, that's more than one word and it's also the name of your blog, Jen. But the more that you and I talked about life and growth and dreams, the more it just seemed to make sense that this should be our topic for tonight, especially as we reflected on your past year. Jen, if you had to give a definition of what it means to be in Pursuit of it All, what would you say?

2:54

I think 25 year old Jen would have told you something very different than maybe this 50 year old Jen because when we first started playing around with this fun project, Pursuit of it All meant something very different. For me, though, now I think it's about living a full, vibrant life that balances, you know, work and joy and growth. I think that's where I am with pursuit of it all. And yes, I know. It's not one word.

JoAnn 3:21

It can be really easy to lose yourself in your job, in your career, or what we refer to as our career. What? Caught your attention that told you that was what was happening to you.

3:35

Well, you know, this is a story, but I will say that something about me is I've always really thrown myself into my career. It's, I've never picked a job that I wasn't truly passionate about and so there have been times that I've Many times in my life. I think it's important to say that I've really probably prioritized that above too much you know, even with having a family and other obligations, I was in charge of a leadership development program and I was the marketing. The vice president marketing communications at the non profit that I was working at so there were two full time jobs And I had been doing that for quite some time and that's in addition to You and and this is not to brag, but I, I promise it, it'll tell you a little bit more about what kind of caught my attention was I had run many marathons and half marathons, and that's where I found a lot of stress relief and things like that. So, just all that stuff. To be said I went, I had been going along in my job for a bit of time. Loved it. Very much enjoyed it. I went to a routine doctor's visit. And I got some really disturbing health news. My labs came back and I was like a hair. That's how they described it to me. A very thin hair away from being pre diabetic. Plus I also was flagged for metabolic syndrome. And that was a big alarm for me because a few years before my husband had had metabolic syndrome, which led him to a, he got diagnosed. Had a heart attack and then had triple bypass surgery. So that was a big trigger for us in our family. And me, the marathon runner, you know, this or who I thought I was, was getting all of these terrible results back. My doctor started going through, what was going on in my life, how could I, she was counseling me on how, you know, What's your life like? Talk to me about what your your obligations are. And that led me to some other you know, conversations with colleagues and friends about, how could I possibly have these results and what can I do about them? And, you know, a deep analysis of where I was in my life at the time kind of led me to understand that, it wasn't Irregular for me to be out 2 to 3 times a week, working 12 to 14 hours a day with with my job commitments and with my volunteer commitments, and I started to realize that I couldn't give up the job. I couldn't give up. The family, obviously, but I needed to make some sort of change in my life because my doctor was telling me, look, your, your levels are going crazy and you need to make some changes. So I decided to give up my friends, if that makes sense to you, but really it was the only thing I felt like I could pull back on in order to prioritize my health. I did that for about two years. A good seven months, honestly, I didn't go out much, really my obligations. I went out in the community, I did what I needed to do, but I pulled back from everything else and started to, like I said, I was having a conversation with friends and I started to realize, like, this is not a way to live. I can't keep doing this. You know, nothing was changing with my home life and I think this was changing with my job life. And so that really started me down a road of introspection. And then I think it was my doctor who just ended up saying, Bam, this is called burnout. Have you ever heard of it? Have you ever? It's, it's not a new thing. So we really started having discussions and that's honestly how that came to be. Plus, my mom also started displaying some health. Issues as well, which put another burden on my time and I had to come to terms with the fact that you know There was something had to give and I started to really think about how I could change my life or what needed to go

Debby 7:17

Yeah, I don't know that everyone understands that burnout is actually classified as a disease, right? the World Health Organization has classified it as a disease, it's not just like You know, I'm having a bad week, right? It's serious.

7:32

It absolutely is. I did a lot of research into it and started to dig into, research as overachievers. I'm sure we've all, you know, first thing we do is like run to Google and try to figure out what that means. And, and I have to be honest with you. I didn't realize it was, I just thought it was a buzzword. I thought it was something that was, I was hearing about something the media was talking about. You know, I'd read some articles on it. I did not actually realize it was a medical term in that. Yeah, the World Health Organization was. Trying to get people to take it seriously,

Kevin 8:00

it can be very easy to get on that treadmill or hamster wheel or whatever, where you just go in and you're just doing the things you always do. And then somebody throws something there. You just keep going. You keep doing those things. And as I was listening to you share your story, you were having a lot of success. When you came to this realization, you were at peak career. Can we say I was. And so I know that took a lot of courage for you to, to be able to take some action to make the changes that included leaving your role. Can you tell us a little bit more about how you made that decision and what you actually did based on this realization.

8:46

Yeah, I think that's a really important part of the story is I was actually at, you know, peak career. Most people's to this moment in time are still confused as to why I would do that. But I was at probably the highest point of my career with a good. Trajectory in front of me. My programs were thriving. So one of the things I was executive director for a community leadership program at the time that community leadership program had a wait list and it had never done that before. So I was going on, like, Three years of a waiting list for the program. We had another event that I was responsible for. It was called she week, which was a week of events for women in business. It had gotten to really high levels. Actually, that's how Debbie and I met or where we got to work together. And It was winning national awards and it spawned a bunch of sister events across the East Coast. So I was actually consulting with other organizations on how to put that on in their community. And so that was wonderful. But, you know, as somebody who loves achieving, I just kept feeling the pressure to set the bar higher, With great success comes even greater expectations for the next year, and again, as I mentioned, I was at a nonprofit, so nonprofits they have a smaller staff and generally have to do a lot with a little amount of resources. I was already exhausted. I loved what I did though. I just can't say that enough. I loved everything about what I did, the people I did it with, but I was exhausted and I was burnt out. And because I was in a leadership role, you know, I was. I knew there was no change in staffing structure and there was no real end in sight as far as like taking things off people's plates. So I just had to sit down and with myself and have like a, a real heart to heart about where are things going. How can, you know, how am I going to proceed in my life? But I love this. I love everything about who I am and what I do. But I started to realize that all my life, I had really defined myself by my job, my job description. Probably not healthy, probably need some therapy, but but really, you know, as a professional, I, it was, it was a big part of, of my life. So and I started to entertain the idea of like, Where do I go from here? Could I make a change even though I loved my job? Should I make a change? Would I be emotionally fulfilled? Would I be fulfilled as a person if I left? And, and, you know, as luck would have it, I gotta be honest, something, I wouldn't say it dropped in my lap, but the opportunity came out of nowhere. Working. for the federal government, which is something I'd never done for, right? So I started to really think about it, and try to understand, who I would be without these titles and, these programs, and this title. community standing or whatever that might be. And why would I leave it? Well, it would give me balance. It would give me health. It would give me joy. I could slow down, you know, all the things concepts I'd never thought of even before or entertained before. So while ambition in my community mattered, so did my health and, but it was hard and stepping away ended up being the best choice, but it was the scariest decision I have ever made in my life. 1

Debby 12:05

of the things you had mentioned to me when we had talked was that you, you had gotten a little stuck. In your kind of mental self talk around, well, I can have passion for my job or I can have the life that I want, or, you know, and kind of that or thinking, can you talk a little bit about how you got yourself out of that?

12:25

I never entertained the idea of I could have this and that, you know, I'd never really considered, it was always an either or. And so It really, it really took some internal discovery to again, go back and figure out who I would be with, without. The titles, the fancy titles, as I call them. And if me as a, as just a human being in this world if I would find fulfillment and balance and my life work through that, and as it turns out, you can do both, which I really hadn't considered before. Was in either or situation. It was not an end situation.

Kevin 13:03

I was thinking about something that you said earlier, and maybe it's a title of a book article podcast sitting down with myself conversations about me for me. I said that because I think there come time in all of our lives when we need to sit down with ourself. And reconcile what is really going on with me, what is really going on with me? Because we can, we can try to act like we don't see it happening, but we can, we can feel it. I am literally out of control. For me, just a couple of weeks ago, in the stretch of 11 days, I think I was away, out of town, like nine out of 11 days. That's too much. That's too much. Right. I need to sit down and have a conversation with myself. Why did I make this schedule? Why am I doing this? Why did I say yes to all of these things that caused me to be on that stretch? I was exhausted.

14:07

Oh, it's such a hard place to be. And I know that I'm thinking about, I think I had to have the sit down with myself because I'm a. I like to verbally process things with people, right? So as we're talking, I'm thinking about that's just how I work. And my husband, I was talking to my husband about it a lot. And he said, you know, what is going to make you only, you know, what is going to make you happy? Only, you know, if making a drastic change like this will fill your soul. Because I kept asking him. He's like, well, you know, but I really love it. So that was the part, It's really easy to leave something when you are not happy It's very easy to leave if you know, the staff is terrible your you know X Y Z the pay is terrible whatever that might be But it was it's very difficult to leave for what I felt like at the time was a selfish reason And I didn't want to be selfish. I wanted to keep giving to my community and he said I mean he said what do you want? Like it was like a scene from The Notebook. What do you want? It was a little bit like that. So I did. I had to sit down and have that conversation with myself and really do a lot of examination to understand if I was going to be happy if I made a drastic change.

JoAnn 15:17

You make such an excellent point of we're the ones that get in our own way. Right. So often,

15:25

and

JoAnn 15:26

you know, there's lots of barriers there. And I think our culture lends itself to that. And I mean, Western culture, American culture specifically, is it, we are so connected to what we do and the two primary things is family and work. And we, constantly are battling between those two things. Who am I? outside of this house, who am I inside the house? And it sounds like,, you really had to have some pretty strong conversations with yourself. So at the end of the day, I'd like to hear what were the two or three primary barriers that were in your way? And how did you go about giving your yourself permission to do what you needed to do?

16:11

Barriers were certainly my identity. That sounds odd, but I, I did. It was trying to get real and understand who I thought I was without these it's not the title. It was the meaning behind the work. I felt like I was doing good things in the world. I felt like I was having a positive impact on other people. There's no bigger joy than creating a program that grows someone as a human. And I was doing that. in, in two different parts of, of my job with both with the leadership program and with the SheWeek. And so it was so joyful, but who am I, if I can't have that kind of impact on that scale, you know, do I even have anything to offer otherwise. So that was my biggest, I would say that's my one biggest barrier. I don't know if there were more, but you said giving, Permission and that is funny because that's something I thought about before talking to you all is that was the biggest hurdle or shift for me was giving myself permission to slow down. That felt like a bit of a sin to me. I don't slow down. We don't slow down. Slow down to enjoy life. What are you talking about? But I, it was like I'm sorry to read a book what's happening right now. But I'd always been really pushing forward. I was constantly moving, constantly raising the bar, constantly doing. So I had to sort of rethink the idea of. That success is sacrifice. The choosing the new role was the leap. There were so many unknowns there. I'm not in the beginning stages of my career journey, if you know what I mean. So the job that, kind of came to be was very different than what I was used to. But it really, it was a challenge, but it really helped me see myself beyond my title. Right, which we've been talking about. Let me appreciate who I was as a whole person. So I was able to step back and really take on something new, which I personally love.

Debby 18:13

Jen, how did you embrace that? I guess it might be a fear. I'm not maybe too strong of a word of starting over because, like you said, like, you were successful. You knew a lot of people you were in a routine. You know, you had it down and it is great going into it. Not just learning a new role, but it's. Building new relationships, building a new routine, like. And a lot of people, that can be what stops them, it's just the fear of starting over again.

18:41

Well, you know, it was, to be honest, it was the, it's either the fear of starting over again or the fear of, of going back to where I was, right? I had done so, I'd made so many great strides with my health. It was really it wasn't a dramatic like live or die situation, but it almost was because I was faced with the thought of. Of not having a really rich full life because I, I just was giving, giving, giving until, I just came home and collapse. I guess there's not a wrong, not a wrong word though. Debbie, there was a decent amount of it.

Debby 19:18

I hear a lot of your values come through when you, when you talk, you know, and that getting an alignment with that, for sure.

19:26

Yeah, it

Kevin 19:27

sounds like you may have learned a few things in those conversations with yourself. I want you to share a few things with us. What have you learned about yourself? And maybe even what have you learned about life from this past year? And this is a two parter. What have you learned about yourself and life? And then can you really have it all? Can we talk about that a little bit?

19:51

I learned that I'm entirely capable of making tough decisions. And even walking away from something that I love. because of my values and my convictions. I realized I needed more than just professional success to be truly fulfilled. And I'm not sure that I would let myself admit to that a couple of years ago, you know, even just four years ago. I don't think that I would even say that I had a, I am what I do problem identity problem, but I definitely learned a lot about that. I found a new joy in, Relationship building and simplicity. So that simply going to have coffee with someone with no relationship building or networking involved in that. A large part of what I did before was relationship building. It was entirely based on, you know connections. And so I learned that it was okay to allow myself simple joy. But, but truly when, when you're so focused on the give, you don't ever sit down and think, Oh, you know, maybe I could, maybe I, you know, to take up a hobby or just, I love this. I love this, this genre of music. Maybe I could learn piano or something like that. Having it all though. I think. For me, having it all is about living a life that's real and rich now. I think we can have it all, but I think that we have to be clear about what. I don't think you can have 100 percent of it all 100 percent of the time. I gave up that thought process years and years ago because, as a, working mom professional, I realized that, there are There's a juggle there. There's not everything is going to be perfect all the time, unless you have a lot of help and bigger budget that I had, but I also learned about letting go of the things I thought I needed to make room for things that really. Matter. I

Kevin 21:58

think we've all well, I'll speak for myself. I've struggled with some of those, some of those same things. Can I have it all? And what I've learned is all I can change the definition of that every day if I want to. What does all mean for me right now in my life? It means spending time with my grandson and my son and his all means I can redefine what having it all really means for me, right? Cause there's sometimes I was pursuing other people's definitions of having it all.

22:34

That's so true. I think we get stuck in that to be honest. Like that's why I, sometimes that's why I was sort of referring to like 25 year old me had a real different. Perspective, and then you know, part of why I didn't, it was blasphemy to think that I could that I should change jobs is because I had this definition of what society. What is good and right and true, and I should be pursuing versus, you know, somehow made me feel a little bit less that I was pursuing something that I felt was selfish, but it really does change like season to season in your life. What, what matters? Absolutely.

Debby 23:15

And who you listen to, right? Sometimes you gotta be like, shut up, society. I don't believe that anymore.

23:22

Yeah, that's the beauty of being a little bit older. Don't really care so much what people

Debby 23:26

think. That's why they say that, right? I'm laughing there because I'm counting down the days where I'm going to take some time off at the holidays because I have a book I want to read. And I was kind of laughing because I'm like, why aren't I just reading that book now? Why am I waiting until I have time off?

23:44

Right? That's crazy. But no, it's true. You know, you're just, and that's another part of this is like what, that's another thing I thought is what am I waiting for? What am I waiting for? What is, when is it time to do this? It's just, it's just that, what are you waiting for? Why, why don't you just give yourself permission to be happy now?

Debby 24:06

Yeah.

24:08

I love that. I'm going to

Debby 24:09

write that on a post it. What are you waiting for? Right up by my laptop. What are you waiting for? Write that book. Right, Kevin? Yeah.

Kevin 24:20

What are you waiting for? Be happy now. Yeah, no, I feel like

24:25

we're coming out of this with a couple of book titles. So yeah, write these down.

Debby 24:30

Absolutely. So, Jen, before we let you go and again, thank you for being here, because this has been really interesting topic. And I know a lot of people are going to benefit from. I'm hearing your story. But we always have three questions we like to ask our guests, we want to make sure that we get your insight on these. The first question, Is what is a book that you believe a leader coach should read?

24:56

This is going to line up. You're going to laugh and probably have heard this before and it's going to line up probably with our conversation. But of course, Dare to Lead by Brene Brown. Of course, I know a lot of people quote it. It just happens to be very, to resonate with me a lot right now in the season that I'm in. I mean, she talks about courage, vulnerability, empathy, and how that's really important. to become a leader and you know, vulnerability being a strength of leadership. I'm, I'm a big believer in that. I think I've drawn my own, I've been most inspired by leaders who were vulnerable. The opposite of what I think I, what I thought a leader was when I was younger, which was this powerful make no mistake type of person. Yeah, it's, it's, it's really in the connection with people. And I think that I got that from that book and I reread it often.

Debby 25:48

Great. Dare to Lead by Brene Brown. Jen, what, what's a question that you've been asked that gave you pause, you maybe just caused you to, to kind of stop and think a little deeper, maybe a little differently about something?

26:03

Well, the question is what, what would you do if you weren't afraid? You know, what would you do? And if you actually think about that. It's pretty humbling. It can change your perspective on a lot of things and it goes back to, what are you waiting for?

Debby 26:23

And Jim, besides what we talked about today, what is your word on coaching?

26:28

Bravery. I've been thinking about this. I think bravery is a good word. Because leadership means oftentimes stepping into the unknown, right? And making hard decisions. Sometimes you don't have a clear map, but you really need to trust your gut and trust the process. And I think The leaders, the leaders who changed the world, even if it's a small part of the world, are those that are brave and vulnerable and not afraid to tell a story that can maybe help someone else out in their own journey. So bravery is a, is a big word for me in leadership.

Debby 27:04

Thank you for being brave and for your bravery in what you've done in your life, but also your bravery and being here tonight and sharing your story, because it can be a little nerve wracking and vulnerable, right? To put yourself out there and say, here's what happened to me. Let me, let me tell you all about it.

27:19

Yeah, thank you so much for letting me be on the show and, and the podcast and, thank you for making this very comfortable for me. As I told you before we came on, I was very nervous about this interview, so I, I do, I do appreciate the conversation because it does help other people. Absolutely.

Kevin 27:36

Thank you. Thank you. It's been a pleasure speaking with you.

Debby 27:39

Yeah. And Kevin and Joanne, it's been a pleasure to have my partners on the call. Thank you to our audience for listening. Audience, make sure you check out more of our Word on Coaching podcast. We're in season seven, so there's a lot out there. Yeah. Go, go out and re listen to things. You can connect with us on our coaches three Facebook page. And don't forget about our book, The Word on Coaching. It's available out there. You can buy copies for yourself and it's a great book to buy for other people. The holidays are coming up, so it's a great gift idea for your mentees, your team, your buddies, that, that young person that you see a lot of potential in. So pick the book up for them. And until next time, everyone, that is The Word on Coaching.