The Ikigai Podcast
The Ikigai Podcast
Discovering Ikigai: Making Life Worth Living After Losing Everything To War with Myroslava Marchenko
How do you rebuild your life after losing everything?
Coping with loss is one of life’s greatest challenges, yet there are paths to recovery that can help us heal and move forward. One such path is discovering a sense of ikigai.
In this episode of the Ikigai Podcast, Nick speaks with Myroslava Marchenko on how individuals can rediscover purpose and resilience in the aftermath of profound loss.
When people ask me what Ikigai is, I always say that Ikigai is a mix of positive emotions, so there is not just one, because if there is one, you would name it like it is. So if it is happiness, you would say happiness. If it is excitement, you would say excitement. But for me, Ikigai it is a mix of emotions.
Speaker 2:Find your Ikigai at ikigaitribecom. My guest today on the Ikigai podcast is Mira Slava Macienko from Kharviv, Ukraine. Mira is a travel PR consultant in Berlin, a journalist, a social media coordinator, a content marketer for tourism, a travel agent, a copywriter, a coach for travel professionals the list could go on and on. Mira is also a certified Ikigai tribe coach, a dear friend, and only just last November was a participant in my first Ikigai retreat. Mira, it's an honor to have you on the podcast today and it's good to see you. Thank you for joining me.
Speaker 1:Thank you, Nick. Thank you for inviting. It's an honor for me to be your guest.
Speaker 2:Wonderful. So where do we begin? This will be a profound and special episode as we discuss loss and ikigai, so we're going to dive right in and I'll say what you shared with me. Your working life stopped by the first of many missile strikes on your city of Kharkiv in Ukraine on the 24th of November 2022. Do you want to share that experience?
Speaker 1:First of all, yeah, thank you, nick, for asking that, because that is a painful experience from one side and that is a very meaningful experience and that is the first step to Ikigai from the other side. So, yes, I got the news about the war start when I was out of Ukraine and I was about 15,000 kilometers away when the first bombs hit my city. My city is very close to Russian border and it was the first city which was bombed and the very first day my family, my husband and my son could see Russian tanks just near our house. So the first third which I got after I realized that my family was safe that moment. The first third was oh my God, I lost everything.
Speaker 1:Because working in travel business, I understand that that very minute I lost all my projects. Of course nobody would travel, nobody will think about that, that is not that case and my house was exactly next to the Russian border. I realized that we could not stay there anymore. My family had to move out and I was out of Ukraine. So I lost connection to my family. I could not come back home. So that was unforgettable pain I felt and I can remember it up to this moment because I was not ready for that stress at all.
Speaker 2:Thank you for sharing that. It's just unimaginable. I just I can't imagine losing everything in the space of like an hour, finding out and realizing can't do my business anymore. Lost my home, lost my. You know all those connections, the neighborhood, and I guess it was with great relief that you knew your family was safe. So how did you process that, did you? Is it like fight or flight mode? Were you very emotional? Were you very? Were you angry? Were you thinking what do I need to do?
Speaker 1:You know. So first of all, that was, there were several tragedies inside me. For one second and of course that was a professional tragedy that was family, a long distance between me and family, and, as I said before, I was not ready for that. And the first two weeks I was in very deep stress, you know, I was pulling my hair out, I was drinking, I was smoking. I never did before that. So I did some abnormal things just trying to find a way how I could kill that negative emotions, the way how I could kill that negative emotions, which were? They were just, you know, appearing every second, new and new of course, a fear of uncertain future, not understanding what is it going to be. I couldn't understand. How long is it? So is it safe for my family for a long time or it's only for short time?
Speaker 1:So I was moving around Europe trying to get closer to Ukraine, because everybody thought that moment that it would be short war. So everybody said, oh, two days, three days, one week, two weeks. Everybody said, oh, two days, three days, one week, two weeks. So then two weeks were over and the war, as we see now it's a third year. So that moment I moved closer to Ukrainian border. But my family said to me, don't come back. So just, I live in the farthest end of my country, so I had to cross the forest end of my country, so I had to cross the country to reach my home. And my family said, no, that is very dangerous. And I happened in Germany. So that was an invitation from my lady friend just to come to her house in a very deep, deep village of Germany. So one day, living in a big city in Ukraine, having houses, apartments, I don't know, cars, businesses, travelings and so on, I happened in German village but that was safe.
Speaker 2:Hard to process. So you, you're right, you had this great life, uh, successful business, you were traveling, you were doing what you loved, you had your family, and then, in one day, it's all gone, it's all lost and you've. You happen to be in germany. So you told me you, you couldn't see your family for seven months, and I can't imagine not seeing my partner or my son for seven months. So that's a long time. Do you want to touch on that?
Speaker 1:That was really for me also not very so. For me that was a painful experience, first of all because I was in Germany and they didn't have the proper documents to leave that country and I had to wait for those documents. And I had only, of course I had video, but sometimes I even couldn't have video calls because my family was in a distant village in the forest and the internet was not always possible there. So that was, like you know. Now I could say that that was Ikigai retreat.
Speaker 1:So I had time to slow down, to look, like you know, from the distance at my life and to analyze what was really valuable, what was really not very valuable at all, because, you know, I was looking at my huge house in Ukraine and I realized that I cannot have it anymore. I looked at my apartment, at my cars, and they realized that that moment they meant nothing. So the only important thing was my family life. So, yes, seven months I was without my family and then I had the chance to get new documents and move to Ukraine. Not move to Ukraine, visit Ukraine. I could visit Ukraine.
Speaker 2:Oh, you could visit, yeah, yeah. So while this was all going on, you also discovered your father had cancer.
Speaker 1:That was like you know, that was like a double hit. So I had just find the way how I could manage. First stress, Then I got the second stress. So from one side that was a stress. From the second side that was the possibility for all my family to move to Germany. But before moving to Germany, so before I could go to Germany, to Ukraine, from Germany, I managed to fix my life in Germany. So for those six months without any German, without knowing any up to this moment I have no idea about German language, I speak only English. But for those six months I managed to find a job here in Germany, I managed to rent an apartment that time and I organized the space where I could take my family, wow. And so then we discovered that father got cancer and that was there. Unfortunately, that was the chance for all my family to move out of Ukraine, because we got that permission to leave the country.
Speaker 2:I see. So these remind me of your qualities. You're very resilient, you're very proactive, and when you have a problem, you seem to approach it logically and think what can I do? So that's what I love about you you have this incredible energy. You're very resilient, you're very positive. But what was it like going back to Ukraine, knowing everything had changed and it was a war zone, your country had been invaded and you couldn't go back to your home. You had to go back to your home to get everyone out. What was that like?
Speaker 1:So first of all, then I came there for a month, every single day, and my city was bombed. That was horrible. I couldn't stay in my apartment because I was in shock. You know, for me that was new, new impressions, I would say. You know, for me that was new, new impressions, I would say, and the new feelings of that horror. Then you are in the house and the house is shaking. You know, every time then the bomb is somewhere in the city.
Speaker 1:I couldn't believe that it was in 21st century, in the middle of Europe, and that was very, a very stressful experience. But I had to make some papers for my father, I had to make some papers for my husband, so we had to spend that month there. But we were leaving Ukraine by two cars and we were crossing the whole country and that was very. I remember that up to this moment. Then we were driving across the country, about 1,200 kilometers, and you were driving just among broken houses, damaged cities, so tanks, cars I could see that before only in movies, you know. And then I was driving and saw that on my own. I realized that that was the total end of my previous life. That's it.
Speaker 2:What a must be very shocking and profound realisation. Everything's changed, home is gone, seems like forever, it will never be the same and you had to start this new life in Germany. So I imagine it was quite hard adjusting to this new life in Germany. Do you want to touch on that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, thank you for that question, because up to this moment I am not integrated in this country society. So, first of all, I do not speak german and I have inside protest to learn that language. I don't know why, but that is just. I just do not, like I say, I do not make myself that. So I tried several times, I stopped it.
Speaker 1:But I have really very valuable experience of communicating people here, of communication with people, yes, and I got the first experience to be employed here. I was never employed before and now I am employed and I could not say that I love that. But Ikigai helps me in this case. I will tell you later how. And so Germany gave us possibility to live in a safe country, germany gave me possibility to make money, germany gave me possibility to relax and think a bit about more or less clear future, and Germany gave me possibility to buy house here. So now we are having our own house here, we are having our garden, we are having school for our child and we are having more or less, let's say, two or three steps for future. Not many years, because I'm not integrated in Germany, but two or three steps for future we have.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean, look, I've met you, we spent a week together and you have this incredible positivity, so you seem to handle things very well and I wouldn't have known all of this loss and tragedy if I hadn't known your background. So, before we talk about Ikigai, let's talk a little bit more about loss, because you said you had this realization all these material things your home you know not your home the house, the physical house, the cars, all these things you realized didn't really matter, but you have lost significant things. Obviously you know your business, this community, and you know, imagine, a lot of friends. So to, yeah, to lose so much I think you touched on this before you realized what matters to you.
Speaker 1:I want to say that the most important here that I lost and I cannot get back, important here that I lost and I cannot get back, that is community, which is a bus show I know now that word and that is France. I do not have anybody now offline. I do not have. That is the the biggest challenge for me. That is the biggest my soul pain now because I do not have anybody offline. I have a lot online we will speak about that later but I do not have anybody so and I realized that and just you know anybody so, and I realized that, and just you know, sometime not sure not long time ago, I said to my husband, who is the only person offline, husband and son. And I say that now I understand I would never have chance to meet all my community, to meet all my lady friends, to meet all my community, to meet all my lady friends, to invite them to our house, to our yard, to have, just you know, yoga meetings one morning. I would never have that and that was a very painful thought in my mind.
Speaker 1:And probably now it is the biggest challenge to make as many offline meetings somewhere out of Germany, let's say as many as I can. So I'm trying to find the possibility to go somewhere for two days, for three days, if I know that my people can be somewhere around. And I am now trying to do my best and invite people to my house. So we have a big house, we have a big yard and I create different events here and invite my lady friends. So I just, you know, I said, use them with different ideas. I invite them for the concerts, I invite them for my birthday, I invite them. So I just say, okay, I will create the reason to come. Sometimes I even buy tickets to them, you know, and uh, because I need that. And so that is my uh, that is my priority number one now to meet as many people offline as I can.
Speaker 2:Yes, I can relate to that. As you know, my business is largely online. It's all about Ikigai. I spend a lot of time in this room and I'm definitely like you. I'm a people person and making new friends, new connections, is really important, but it's so much better when it's in person and I would say that's you know one of my Ikigai and I think it's one of yours. So let's touch on Ikigai and the impact it's had on your life. How would you define Ikigai? What does it mean to you.
Speaker 1:I love that question, so thank you. First of all, for me, when people ask me what Ikigai is, I always say that Ikigai is a mix of positive emotions. So there is not just one, because if there is one, you would name it like it is. So if it is happiness, you would say happiness. If it is excitement, you would say excitement. But for me Ikigai it is a mix of emotions.
Speaker 1:Me, ikigai it is a mix of emotions and I made for myself a list of 40 emotions, because there are hundreds of them. But I made a list of 40 emotions and I make, uh, when I feel a mix of those emotions, I take a piece of paper and I have it just next to me. I could show you, of course. So I take a piece of paper, write it down, write what gave me that mix of emotions, and put it in my Ikigai bank. So that is very helpful. Every time then you feel that your mental state is going down, that you are not so happy, you are not so excited, you are not so energetic, and so on, just go to your ikigai bank, take out one piece piece of paper and do it, love it, so that. So that is very important to make a list of sources of your ikigai, which is mix of emotions, and then know them and anytime you can use it to upgrade your mental state.
Speaker 2:I love it. Ikigai is something you feel and, and you're right, it is a range of emotions. It can be excitement, it can be happiness, it can be.
Speaker 1:Proudness.
Speaker 2:Calmness, yeah, reflective calmness. It can be this intimacy you share with other people. So I love your approach because you're almost asking, like, what emotions, what positive emotions, do you want to feel, which we would call Ikigai Kan, and you then identify what brings you those emotions and they're your sources, and that's I mean we're really referencing the work of Mikko Kamiya. She identified Ikigai sources and then ikigai card. So it is ultimately something you feel and, as you pointed out, it's not one emotion and it's certainly not limited to happiness. It can be this array of emotions and you also point out, it's ultimately something in you that you uncover or, I guess, release.
Speaker 1:Yes, that is very important, that it is 100%, that Ikigai is in you, so everybody has it. So the only what everybody can do is uncover. So you shouldn't go out somewhere and look around. So that is not in the field, it's not in your garden, that is inside you and the only thing you can do is uncover your ikigai and if, if you do that, there is a way in reality. So there is not one day, there is not one exercise. There is a way of researching yourself. There is question to yourself every single day. So there is communication to yourself. There is a deep adventure inside, but that is important to understand. That is inside, deep adventure inside, but that is important to understand. That is inside, not outside, not around you.
Speaker 2:So you've gone through a very unique experience, a very tragic experience of basically losing everything. So we could say you lost all your ikigai, almost all your ikigai. We could say you lost all your Ikigai or almost all your Ikigai, and then you had to move and reorganize your life and then, I guess, once all that settled, you moved your family to Germany. You had to adjust to this new life and then, I guess you know, find or uncover new Ikigai after you'd lost everything. And Kami Amiko writes about this. She writes about the loss of ikigais almost like a collapse of your value systems. So I guess my question is how do you find or uncover ikigai again when you've lost everything?
Speaker 1:First of all, I realized that there is the start from the scratch, you know, and it will depend only on you and what you choose. So anybody can choose to suffer, feel unhappy, I don't know. So smoke cigarettes and drink wine, or you can choose adventure, research and uncover something inside you, because then you lose everything outside, you will never lose yourself. So you always have yourself, yes, and then you have yourself. You understand that, oh my God. So I have treasure. That is here. Yes, I'm here, thanks God. Yes, I'm here, thanks God, I'm not bombed. And so that was the moment that I lost everything outside. I said, oh my God, thanks, I have my brain, I have my soul, I have my body, what I can do with all of that stuff, what I can do with all of that stuff? And that was the moment when I started to look inside and I started searching for something valuable inside. You know, leaving our endless to-do lists very often forget about our inside world. And that was the moment when I realized so nothing is around. Only you is your own value. And Ikigai, searching for Ikigai. That way, that process of searching for Ikigai source it became a long trip, to myself as well, and I took Ikigai as a criteria of my present life.
Speaker 1:Now I always ask myself several questions. When I have to make decision, when I have to make choice, when I have to make decision, when I have to make choice, when I have to do something, I always ask myself will it be source of my ikigai? Will it change my life? Will I feel ikigai after that? And I understand that life is too short not to live ikigai. So, and if I can refuse of doing something, or if I can avoid doing something, if I can make a choice and have an ikigai after that, I will do that.
Speaker 1:So in most cases, people could say that it sounds selfish. I would say it sounds ikigai, because that is not living for yourself, that is living your life. And if you are happy in your life, if you are excited about your life, if you are proud of your life, everybody will be happy around you as well. So Ikigai and I say it to many people around me Ikigai is a great criteria and it can make your life easier. You know, because you have like a basis and you can ask yourself, okay, how to make this choice? I can do that easily. If it is my ikigai, I will do that. If it is not my ikigai, I will never do that. That's it. Life is too short.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's a really valuable insight. It gives you criteria to make decisions that really support your life and are based on your values. So I think Ikigai is all about living authentically to your values and when you do that, yeah, you're like a better person to be around because you're being authentic, you're being true to who you want to be. But, interestingly, even some Ikigai sources, like you mentioned, could be drinking or smoking, and they're more like coping mechanisms. So maybe they're a short-term solution, but they're not really healthy ikigai solutions. But I guess what we're talking about is tragedy. Trauma can push you to contemplate. Yeah, what really matters to me, what is my higai? And you've gone through that and I think from that, one quality I'm assuming you've always had is resilience. So you have this incredible resilience and you can quickly move on, make decisions. But it sounds like resilience strengthens this belief in Ikigai and it helps you understand what are your Ikigai sources. So do you want to touch on resilience?
Speaker 1:That is, yes, that is very, very, very actual topic to discuss, because that is exactly what I gained when I started to study Ikigai Not before, you know, because I could say that I was pretty weak and I mean, I was not focused, I couldn't understand where to focus, where to find their energy, how to reduce my stress, and so on so far, but then I just started subconsciously, not consciously, that time, yes, I started to look inside and I started to understand that I am responsible for my life and at the moment you make that decision, you became resilient. So, because you understand that nobody around cannot make your life better and nobody around can make your life worse, only you make a decision. What is your life look like now? And at the moment you are strong enough to make that decision. You know it's about will, it's about inside will. So people are very weak in most cases and they do not have will to make that decision. I was lucky, I could say, to have that will. So I didn't train that. Yes, I was just lucky that I had that will. So that was, I was responsible for my life and I found condition, internal sources of my mental state, which I liked.
Speaker 1:That moment, yes, and I could say that I found my ikigai sources inside and I based on it. But first was decision to be responsible for your life and I would say, in any stress situation. So the first, of course you can make yourself a bit bold, you can make yourself a bit drunk and so on, that's okay. You can make yourself a bit drunk and so on, that's okay. But after that you just have to have a fair talk to yourself. I'm ready to be responsible for that in any situation, even in war. So when you cannot control what is going around, but you cannot control how you react at that, and then your icky guy way starts. So you make the decision and go inside to search for sources what can change your mental state and what can help you to be stronger.
Speaker 2:Very powerful. I think Viktor Frankl wrote on this and he described it as the last human freedom. Like you, can lose everything. All these horrible things can be done to you, but whatever you think and what choices you make, regardless of circumstance, is your last human freedom, and it's very powerful. You can always choose how to think and how to react, and maybe we don't do that enough today. We have so much influence now we have. Most of us listening to this podcast would have a pretty good life, and we have probably I don't know first world problems or minor problems, but you've gone through something. You know life changing tragic things will never be the same, but it sounds like it's almost turned you into this stronger new person and you see life differently. Is that the case? Do you see life very differently now?
Speaker 1:Absolutely yes. First of all, I like Frankl's idea that if you set a kind of future for your brain, you will survive. And in this case he was speaking about goal for future and he was thinking, for example, about writing a book about his sufferings, and that kept him alive. So the same I I'm doing now, I could say, but I'm doing now because of ikigai bright future, need you know. And uh, I made it like a practice for me and it works, because I had a very painful, stressful situation with my when I realized that my father was dying here in Germany and I realized that my mental state was very unstable. But that moment I have already. I had already knew about ikigai. So I went out to the balcony, uh, took my telephone and you know, at the moment then my father was dying.
Speaker 1:I was in a terrible mental state. I took my telephone, remembering about that icky guy need, about bright future, and I just started to search for a new car for myself. From one side, it's nonsense. From the other side, my brain changed focus and I changed my mental state. That moment I had no plans to buy the car or something like that. You know, I didn't need it that moment, but I just gave my brain a different idea to think about nice event in the future which I will arrange for myself. It changed state very, very, very fast and I use this practice very often. When I see that now, in the moment, I'm going to get stress, I just try to cheat my brain and show it something nice in the future. I love it.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. So that's a very that's a much better yeah, far better to switch your focus and think, okay, what can I look forward to? You're creating it yourself. You're saying, well, I'm going to think about buying a car in the future, I might think about buying a Porsche now. So rather than thinking, oh, I'm stressed, I'll have a drink, I'll have a smoke, I'll yeah. So this ability to switch focus and decide I want this for my future a much healthier way to handle stress than a coping mechanism. This is like a really proactive way to handle stress and ties back to resilience and really is asking well, everything's crap. At the moment, I feel crap, but what do I want to think about, what do I want to focus on? And you really live that and I've seen that and I mean I have many people interesting people come into my life for Ikigai, but you are definitely one of the most unique and inspiring and you've really embraced Ikigai, all the teachings, and you now live a life of Ikigai. So how has Ikigai changed your life?
Speaker 1:First of all, thank you. No, I want to thank universe for you in my Ikigai life, because you were the first one who really gave me that first touch to Ikigai and my idea was to search for Ikigai knowledge, not to help myself. My idea was to help thousands of women, ukrainian women, who are out of Ukraine. Now, about Ikigai, I started to develop different ways, how I could use that in my life and how it could help for lives of Ukrainian women. Now I am one of the leaders of Ikigai Club and up to this moment, we have about 73 ukrainian ladies who are in that ikigai club and that is our big achievement here.
Speaker 1:So that is first. Second. I understand that I show people that what they can find, then they lose everything. It is the way to help not only those women, but it's a way to help my country as well. That is really very powerful, because they lost everything as well. They are out of their countries and they now selling them that idea of Ikigai. In reality, I am selling them their future life possibilities to be with yourself, to be powerful, to have that mental state that you can do everything in any place on the planet. So I think that is my, it's a kind of my Ikigai mission.
Speaker 2:It's inspiring. I'm really astounded that this one word, which I mean is a universal concept. We all want to have a meaningful, fulfilling life. But, yeah, the Japanese language seems to articulate, articulates concepts into one word and it's something. There's something very appealing. And there's also this cultural lens, this Japanese lens on what makes life worth living, which is different to other cultures. And here you are, you're inspiring, you're giving all these women hope and you created it all, this community. Obviously, it's needed with so many women going through loss, many of who can't see their partners because they're husbands or fathers, maybe even sons, in Ukraine fighting. And it's also creating community, which we both love, and that idea of ibasho. So, yeah, it's very inspiring for me to see you take Ikigai and use it to inspire other people who are going through so much loss, and you've even turned Ikigai into a verb with this phrase Ikigai, your life, which I love. So do you want to touch on that?
Speaker 1:Yes, first of all, I created two things about Ikigai now. Yes, yes, first of all, I created two things about Ikigai now. Yes, the first I created that, as I say, transformational tool which is Ikigai life plan, and I created that to show women that they can plan Ikigai sources in their life, so they do not have to plan only to-do lists, but they have to plan ikigai in their life, so they have to plan events, they have to plan meaningful meetings and so on, so something which will give them that great feeling and that great mental state, that mix of emotions. Yes, I created that slogan Ikigai your life, where Ikigai is a verb, and I am going to produce this year, I'm going to produce a sweet shorts for girls in my club and I think that this year, everybody in my club will wear Ikigai your life. So everybody will Ikigai their life, because that is really very important to leave emotions but not only to do lists.
Speaker 2:I love it when people turn nouns into verbs and I mean it really articulates the proactive nature of Ikigai. If you want Ikigai, you have to do something, you have to set plans, you have to meet people, you have to engage in activities that are meaningful, challenging, and Ikigai is also very reflective, because you need to understand yourself, your values. But once you understand that, then you've got to do something. And I believe Ikigai is strongly felt when there is some sort of challenge or obstacle you have to overcome, usually in a positive context. So starting your own community or we'll talk about this later, but you know me, deciding to do my first retreat, all these planning challenges, imposter syndrome, all these things you have to overcome. But once you do overcome those challenges and you create community, the Ikigai is felt more intensely. So, yeah, I love this idea of ikigai-ing your life. I might start using it, so I'll give you credit.
Speaker 1:But you know what is really important here? Japanese are lucky to live to ikigai their life because, because they are japanese, yes, but we it's like a new skill we have to get. So that's why, for us, if you want to have ikigai in your life, you have to ikigai your life, because that is a skill you have to gain. And there is a skill to identify Ikigai because you have already had it, yes, so you have to uncover it. And I always say there is a skill, and I think that in some years we will discuss here, like you know, like a useful habit you should get, you should gain this. That is Ikigai habit. And so there is ikigai habit and so that is and I think I love the phrase that ikigai is the best expert japan can make. I like this phrase, yes and um, that is very, that is very true. So that's why, for japanese, it's's okay, they live that, they know what is it. But for us we have to ikigai. Yes, that is a proactive approach.
Speaker 2:Yeah, even Ken Moggi said ikigai is perhaps the best export of Japan. Japan has all these amazing cultures, cultural aspects, products and whatnot. But perhaps ikigai this word that articulates perhaps a different way to think about life, how to make life meaningful is unique and can change lives. Then there's the irony. I guess in Japan, you know, it's just a normal word. For them it's not something they really think about or talk about that much. It's so ingrained in their life that among my friends, the ones who don't even think about it usually live a life of ikigai because they don't need to think about their ikigai, because they know what it is.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so that's almost an irony of ikigai is like, when you know you're Ikigai, you're just living it. Obviously our perspectives are different because we're sharing the concept. We talk about it a lot. So it goes back to this idea of feeling you know you're living with Ikigai when you feel multiple positive emotions every day from different sources, from people, from challenges, from work, from your hobbies. The list could go on and on, but I think there would be people listening to this podcast who might think, oh, I'm struggling with a lack of ikigai. So what is your advice, mira, for people listening to this episode and they're thinking, oh, I don't have ikigai so you know, I, just as I said before, that is a question of making decision and making choice.
Speaker 1:But we have to understand one very simple thing we will never get anything good in life if we do not feel good. But you know, that is the most important, that is the mental state. Even money, that is a reflection of your interaction with the universe. If you are not happy, if you are not satisfied, if you are not grateful, if you are in a bad mood, world will give you back the same. So that's why, the first and the most important make a decision to live this happy life. So that should be Ikigai life. Yes, you should make a decision to Ikigai your life. So that is first. Second, you remember the idea that you have already had ikigai inside. So it means you have that treasure, you're happy, you're lucky. So go inside and try to find it. Ask yourself questions, make ikigai bank, write down your answers and look what makes you feel those emotions, yes, mix of emotions. Just study yourself, take responsibility and do not look at circumstances, because not circumstances make your life, but you can make your life and Ikigai it's a lifestyle. So there is not one day exercise If you make a decision to live that style. Just follow it.
Speaker 1:Start from the small, like Ken Mohe said as well yes, start from the small. Start, do something first. What can make you happy, excited and so on? So start with the small and write down, make your Ikigai bank. Think about that and understand that everything is inside, not outside. And I always say to my, as soon as I get something negative inside, not outside, and I always say to my, as soon as I get something negative inside, bad mood or something like that, I always remember the world will give me back the same. I do not want that. So I go and change the same. At the moment that I realized that I lost everything and I asked my question okay, what do you want to get back? Yes, what do you want to get? You have now just a sheet of paper, yes, and so you can draw everything you want there. So what do you want to draw? Take bright colors. So make your life Ikigai your life. That's it.
Speaker 2:I love it. Yeah, I love what I learned from my students, and my students often have this different perspective or they describe Ikigai in different ways, and these words often come up or terms come up like ikigai decisions, and that's something I learned not learned, but one of my coaches came up with like, oh, I'm teaching my clients ikigai decisions before they make financial decisions. Shout out to Chris yeah, and this idea of an ikigai life plan from you, or this idea to just ikigai your life and to focus whatever you focus on is what you're going to get back. So if you yeah, if you focus on all the negatives, that's what you're going to get, but if you focus on life affirming aspects of your life and you start small and be proactive about how you're going to generate or create that in your life, then your life will change and you'll feel better. So we really are responsible for how we feel and we can always start small, as Ken Moggy prescribes. So I love it.
Speaker 2:So this leads us to. So I love it. So this leads us to reminiscing about the time we met in person, which wasn't too long ago we met last November and it was very special. I remember waiting for you outside Tokyo train station looking at my watch, trying to find you and Lydia. And then, yeah, you guys showed up, you were the first to show up and since that moment, or from that moment, we had this incredible eight days together. So what did you enjoy about the retreat? What did you learn?
Speaker 1:That was. I could say that after this moment that was the best journey in my life. I traveled a lot, I visited a lot of countries more than 50, but that was the best journey of my life, not because of people I met and because of idea of retreat itself. And the main idea and you know what I really loved that when I send a postcard from one Japanese town to me in Germany. So I wrote the postcard to myself and I wrote there my insights about trip. So when I came Cologne I even didn't remember what was in my postcard. But today I read it one more time and there were very important thoughts about that trip.
Speaker 1:So, first of all, that was a perfect mix of people and you created the most important idea not to look around just I mean sites or places or houses, but to feel how they live, to feel people, to meet people, to understand the value. You showed me people who are living in their Ikigai and I admired them. So that was amazing experience. When I looked at people understand oh my gosh. So he was dying in digor after his family for 400 years in the 21st century then everything can be done with machines, but he was so excited with his job and that was very valuable. I felt a different taste of life.
Speaker 1:So your japan I would say your japan, because I would see it different if I go there with other experience yes, so, but your Japan showed me people how people are living in their Ikigai, how they feel that mental state, how they feel what is it? How they feel their Ikigai? So that was like a trip inside japanese. So that was, that was the the most valuable experience trip inside japanese people. I would never do it myself, despite the fact that I am travel professional. I can craft any trip. I would never do that. I cannot.
Speaker 2:So that was very valuable it was very valuable and that's what I wanted to create. I mean, we had a great group dynamic in our own group, but for me it is about the connections you make with Japanese and the people.
Speaker 2:I'm very lucky I seem to stumble upon and meet very special people and yeah even your example of Watanabe-san, the Indigo Dying Craftsman, 16th generation family business for 400 years, and yet he was so humble, friendly and we had this wonderful day where we, you know, made our own shores and this history passed from 15 generations down to him and he's got his own problems. You know, he doesn't have any direct children and he's thinking about how can he pass on this dying crafts, yeah, this dying crafts. So that's another era of Japan that I worry about. Like, oh, there are all these crafts that are dying.
Speaker 2:So to be able to bring you guys and have you experience, that was special. So it's always tied to people. I think the Ikigai, almost every Ikigai experience, either directly or indirectly, is tied to people and I agree it was a very different experience of Japan and maybe hard to create, unless I guess I'm lucky I've got friends, of course, the amazing Shinji, who is a dear friend and such a fun guy. So, yeah, you need someone to help you locally and I was very lucky that I had shinji, who I've known for 20 years, to help.
Speaker 1:So uh chinji is a hero of my uh video, uh in instagram today, and I uh I interviewed him and that was one of the Japanese which I really loved how he described Ikigai, and I want to say that you and Shinji did a great job choosing the locations. Yeah, that was one more plus to that retreat that I really loved all locations I visited. I loved all places we stayed. I loved myself in this trip. I had a perfect mood, always good mood, fantastic food, fantastic places for dinner and lunch and so on.
Speaker 1:So every detail was crafted especially for me and you did a great job because we had vegetarians, people who didn't eat meat, people who ate meat, people who didn't drink, people who drank. So in reality, you had to do so many different details, but I would recommend you never do that after yes, never do it in the future. Just say we have this food, because otherwise you can go crazy every time asking people oh my God, no food, no meat, no fish, no nothing, and that is really very difficult to organize. So you did a perfect job here as well. Then, monastery it was incredible experience and Zen meditation with that. I just yesterday watched that video with that motivational stick. That is my favorite. I love it. That is every single moment I can remember in my mind and I'm happy to you know, know, like to replay it over and over again because it gives me ikigai. So that is a source of ikigai.
Speaker 2:I love it yeah, it was, for me too it's. I mean, it was a challenge, but it was a worthy challenge. It was a worthwhile challenge and, you're right, me and Shinji were thinking what are we going to do? Like, we've got a strict vegetarian, we have two halau eaters, we have a pescatarian, and then we have people who can eat meat. And my friend Shinji's like, oh, this is like tragedy that they can't have shabu-shabu, they can't have yakiniku, they can't even eat sushi, like all these foods that are so delicious.
Speaker 2:And then he got to work and he was so diligent and, as you know, I mean I went to Japan just to meet all these people and plan and greet people, because I thought this is not a holiday, this is a study trip. This needs to be very special. And then again, for the people, yeah, we got special access to that Buddhist temple and that experience of zazen seated meditation with the encouragement stick. You know the stick to whack you to focus, and that was interesting, that interplay of asking to be in a hit and obviously it's safe and it's done to encourage you. So even for me, all of this was like new.
Speaker 2:Most of it was new to me and I was very lucky to have these connections and I'll be forever grateful to Shinji and all the work he put in. It's strengthened our friendship and this is something we're going to do, so that's something I'll do again, hopefully this year, in 2025. Ikigai opens up your future. It makes you realize I can do this, I can do that, I can bring people together. So what does your future hold for you, mira, for 2025? What are your Ikigai plans?
Speaker 1:So, first of all, I am an Ikigai ambassador in this part of the planet. I named it myself and I am going to set this trend which is Ikigai lifestyle, and I'm doing that now. So ikigai, your life, that is the motto I will promote this year and I will promote that living ikigai, that is something you must experience, because life is too short, and I'm going to do several offline speeches and the the first one is in january 2025, so next week I will go to berlin to speak and I am going to write the book as well.
Speaker 2:Nice.
Speaker 1:And I am going to, together with Lydia, we are going to describe Japanese concepts, different Japanese concepts which can help you to move forward, to uncover your ikigai love it and there is.
Speaker 1:There is, of course, because of you. So because you made fantastic ikigai retreat journal, where you showed us different concepts and we it was like there the beginning of that idea, and flying back from japan in the airplane, we started to to drop ideas and up to this moment, we have a picture what we want to do. So I think we are going to finish this year as well. Thank you, nick.
Speaker 2:Awesome.
Speaker 1:Obrigado.
Speaker 2:Koto da koso. So, yeah, it's so wonderful for me to hear this and you are an ambassador and I'll always support you and I look forward to us meeting again in person and collaborating on some Ikigai projects with Lydia, your wonderful friend Lydia, who's also part of Ikigai tribe, and it was so funny when you told me Lydia you know she's elegant and graceful, and that you're at the supermarket and the checkout lady thought Lydia was Japanese, Just based on her body, language and behavior. So we have all these beautiful memories.
Speaker 1:You know I had several comments from people that we look like Japanese. They say, wow, you are maybe because of black hair, I don't know. But they say you look like Japanese. And so from one side that is a kind of compliment. You know, I take it. I say okay, probably in the past life it was.
Speaker 2:Maybe. So, before we end, where can people find you? I know you and Lydia are very active on Instagram, so we'll link to your Instagram accounts.
Speaker 1:Absolutely. Yes, my Instagram account is ikigaimiroslavomarchenko, so that is very easy. Ikigai, miroslava Marchenko, so that is very easy. And yes, I am very active and I am promoting ideas of Ikigai in all my contact pieces, so I'm trying to show what the Ikigai is, what you can do, what practices can help you to uncover it, and so on.
Speaker 2:Awesome, it's been a pleasure. It was so wonderful to meet you last November and you're a very special friend, you and Lydia, and I can't wait to see you this year. So let's make it an Ikigai goal to catch up in person again, maybe here there or maybe in Japan again.
Speaker 1:Thank you, nick, for invitation. Yes, I definitely have Japan in my list in my Ikigai life plan. In my Ikigai life plan, that is yes, and not because of Japan, but because of people and because of Ikigai. So thank you for inviting me. That was very special interview.
Speaker 2:My pleasure. Bye for now.
Speaker 1:Bye.