Monster Squad Review and Analysis

Join Josh Gilliland and Jordon Huppert for a look back at the 1987 Gen X classic Monster Squad. Tune in for their analysis covering burglary of abandoned houses, invasion of privacy, self-defense, anti-bullying laws, shop classes with limited supervision, and whether the Army would answer a call for help written in crayon.

Chapters

• 0:05 Setting the Stage: Monster Squad
• 1:21 Can You Murder a Vampire?
• 6:36 Courts vs. Creatures: Legal Status
• 13:26 Bullying, Assault, and Juvenile Justice
• 22:30 Where Is This Town? Southern Clues
• 28:30 Peeping Tom Laws and Privacy
• 35:45 Corpses Across State Lines
• 43:05 Wolfman, 5150 Holds, and Use of Force
• 55:05 Montage Crimes: Shop Class Silver Bullets
• 1:03:18 Brides, Bigamy, and Family Law
• 1:13:05 Trespass for an Amulet: Abandoned Property

Transcript

Josh Gilliland: 0:05

Hello everyone, my name is Joshua Gilliland, one of the founding attorneys of the Legal Geeks. With me is Jordan Hoopert, longtime friend. And we are going to discuss the 1987 classic Monster Squad. Jordan, how are you doing? I'm well, Josh. Thank you. How are you? Fantastic. It's October. Life's good. So let's let's chat about this fun movie. Do you when did you first see it? Uh Thursday night. Oh, okay. Uh I I saw it. I know I got some ears on you. I saw it in '87 while visiting my grandparents in Ann Arbor, Michigan. So there's a a sweetness there that I have for this film just from you know, again, it was summer, and we spent a couple weeks with our grandparents, and they would often drop us off at the movie theater, uh, which was in a mall, uh, to see. Yeah. So like we saw Robocop and one of the I think it was the summer before 86 or the Transformers movie when we visited them. So Back to the Future, uh, the year before. So again, all fun, all good. Uh, but let's break down perhaps the greatest love letter to Universal Monsters of all time. So maybe second only to young Frankenstein, but this does have an you know, it covers all of them as opposed to just a lot of Frankenstein love for all of the Frankenstein movies. So we both went through this, we did some issue spotting, and one of the issues you identified with you can't murder a vampire. Can you explain what what you mean by that observation?

Jordon Huppert: 1:53

Sure. So this is always one of those like funny cocktail conversations that I find myself in is like, well, you know, could you prosecute somebody in X movie for murdering this vampire, or could you prosecute oddly the vampire for murdering this person? And the answer is always no, because the the model penal code and most of the laws based off of it are murder or homicide, I guess, is defined as the killing of one human being by another human being. So if you are definitionally not human, like a vampire, you can neither be murdered nor be prosecuted for murder.

Josh Gilliland: 2:36

So the legal status of vampires is not something we've ever covered before, because you could argue that they're formerly human, but they're now something else being undead.

Jordon Huppert: 2:47

Um it's a category we don't have because like it's yes, the law has never kept up with the uh rise of the undead.

Josh Gilliland: 2:54

No, no, it's you know, Congress and state legislatures have not held special sessions to identify address the issue of vampiric assailants who are killing people and consuming their blood. That's not something the legislature is engaged in. I'm sure they're just getting around to it. I don't know if a court would be cool with the idea of saying you can't prosecute a vampire for killing a human being, like for every wrong, there's a right. So do they just call a mulligan on that and leave it to the defense to make the argument they're not human? Or would there be another attack that they could do? Because taking the position that they're like uh uh vermin, like like you know, rats, or you know, that need that you can, you know, exterminate because if you have mice in your house, it's okay to call an exterminator. The issue is the mice aren't well again, they have a different social structure than humanity, but you know, it's not a former human being that's at play, and like that's the differential uh here that you still you have somebody who was formerly human, who's now a creature of the night. Gross abuse of a corpse. Yeah, I mean, what do you do you prosecute? Because again, you're not, but do you go? We don't need to have a trial. I mean, like that could be the other extreme, which is offensive to our view of justice that we'll just indefinitely hold creatures of the night as a matter of that's what they are, so we don't have to treat them as human beings anymore. I I think that would be problematic as well.

Jordon Huppert: 4:46

That would be very problematic. So I will I will call back to an old article that I think you wrote for the site about the legal status of droids in Star Wars. And I suspect that when we start to get into the area of sentient non-humans, the uh the law is going to have to do some some adapting.

Josh Gilliland: 5:07

Agreed. And if this were an actual problem, I don't know how it could play out, you know, because it would probably hit a courtroom before it would hit the legislature. And a judge would do one of two things. They would say we're gonna follow our traditions and like do Miranda Rites, rid of habeas corpus, and all of the things that we're used to, uh, just as soldiers on the battlefield who conduct arrests of terrorists read Miranda Rites, because it's it's just what we do, it's what we're used to doing, and so we're gonna follow that tradition on how we apply our laws. The other way is you know, they sorry, we can't hold them, or we're not going to try them because they're not human, but they're still a dangerous creature, and treat it like a wild bear or some other escaped animal that's that's a hazard. Either ruling would get the legislature to respond.

Jordon Huppert: 6:19

Yeah, and that I mean, at least in the criminal realm, that is often the way we we see laws go through is you know, something happens in the courtroom that a group or groups feel is unjust, they petition the legislature, the legislature changes the law to meet out whatever they think I suppose in the moment justice is, and then we adapt to the law.

Josh Gilliland: 6:46

Especially if it makes a lot of news, because if you have a a situation where like like at the end of this film, Dracula kills a whole lot of police officers.

Jordon Huppert: 6:59

Yep, okay.

Josh Gilliland: 7:00

I I lost count, but it might have been seven. Uh just in marching up to the little girl. So you have a whole bunch of dead police officers. That would make the news. There's no way around that. That would absolutely positively make the news.

Jordon Huppert: 7:22

Yeah, and be called out to small southern town to deal with monster invasion would probably make at least some newspapers. Yeah. Especially once they figured out it wasn't a joke. Yeah, it's like, oh, that's cute. Oh, oh, it was real. Here's the gilman's corpse.

Josh Gilliland: 7:39

He's real. Uh yeah, it's because he might have been the only one not vacuumed up. Uh, or the mummy's remains, you know, might not. Uh I mean, we saw police officers get sucked into the void as well.

Jordon Huppert: 7:56

So you know the mummy unravels, the werewolf turns back into a human. Um, Dracula and Frankenstein get sucked up into the void. I guess we should probably say there's there's spoilers for the end of the movie.

Josh Gilliland: 8:13

Yeah, yeah. This movie from 1987, yeah. It's uh, and we're talking about the details of the film.

Jordon Huppert: 8:20

Yeah, um, but yeah, I think you're right. I don't know, I don't remember what happens to the Gilga, the Gilman.

Josh Gilliland: 8:26

Uh Horace shoots him.

Jordon Huppert: 8:28

Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 8:29

Uh and so so again, he did. And you know, does the vortex you know, to limbo pull in the corpse? Because if you do have bodies, and uh, you know, again, there would be autopsies. There'd be autopsies of the wolf man, there would be autopsies of the gill man. If if there's a pharaoh that came back to life, that will be would be studied.

Jordon Huppert: 8:55

How did this happen? Well, and of course, in the grand scheme, the grand tradition of uh monster movies, can you even be sure he's dead?

Josh Gilliland: 9:06

Yeah, I I would think there's a high gill man returns. Yeah, I think the gill man, I mean, he took a shot to the right side of the chest, uh, probably took out the lungs. I mean, it was the left side, probably probably would have hit the heart, but like you see him stop breathing. The mummy is a more interesting question because he unravels, could he be reconstituted? I I don't know, but again, like those are the nerd questions to ask for all the monster fans out there of could the mummy be put back together? I don't know, but all right, that's issue. That's just murdering a vampire. We see there's a lot of unfortunate 1980s insults that kids did say in the 1980s, and it's super cringe worthy to see today, because I remember kids saying things like that, and today kids wouldn't say things like that. That we it's nearly 40 years later, we just wouldn't we don't do that anymore. But Horace is nicknamed Fat Kid, and even by his friends, yep. Um, we have bullies that call him Fat Kid, and he says, you know, my name is Horace. There's full-on bullying, and then it turns into assault and battery, you know, if uh if not torture with you know stepping on a candy bar and telling him to eat it, bad situations. You you've done criminal defense. You know, what are some of your thoughts on the uh criminal uh aspects of you know kids getting bullied and and assaulted?

Jordon Huppert: 10:45

Yeah, well I mean I suppose first I will say that you you are correct. This movie is if if I could describe it as nothing else, I would call it aggressively 80s. There is a lot of uh what's it anachronist anachronisms? No, not anachronisms. I don't know. There's a lot of things that are culturally relevant at the time that would have been perfectly normal fit in with the movie time period, I think. Uh that you are you are correct or very very cringeworthy today. But I've done a small amount of juvenile uh delinquency laws, and you do see situations like this come up um fairly frequently in that that courtroom, and I won't get into the uh debate of uh criminal prosecutions against children, but you do uh this is the kind of situation that those courts generally deal with. Um the bullies are definitely charged with assault. The older kid who ends up joining them, whose name Rudy.

Josh Gilliland: 11:49

Who's middle school?

Jordon Huppert: 11:50

Who's middle school?

Josh Gilliland: 11:52

And so like the other kids are 12. So like let's say he's an eighth grader that looks like he's a senior in high school, and the other kids, I mean 12, you could be sixth grade or twelve or seventh grade, depending on the uh exact time of the birthday and um like where you might live. But yeah, 12-year-olds, because again, 14, a lot of eighth graders, a lot of kids turn 14 in the eighth grade. I know from my scouting experience. So 13 in 12 or 13 in the seventh grade makes sense. 13 to 14 in the eighth grade makes sense. If these kids are 12, they could be sixth graders or they could be uh seventh graders.

Jordon Huppert: 12:39

Yeah. And if there's a uh that I that actually brings up another interesting issue of what age can someone be brought into juvenile court. Because if they're 12, they might actually fall too young, depending on what state we're in. So if we're assuming, I think you and I were talking about this a little before we started. If we assume Alabama, uh Alabama has an age of uh 14 to be brought into juvenile court. Oh no, that's age juvenile case can be transferred to adult court.

Josh Gilliland: 13:13

Okay. And again, so to so those who might be wondering what we discussed, it was what state did this take place in? And I think it's somewhere in the uh south because we have swamps, uh, there's antebellum looking houses for where a lot of the action takes place. Uh but then you get suburbia because this was filmed in LA. Or you know, I I wouldn't be surprised if there was a universal back lot. So, you know, you could be a Northridge in some neighborhood for it's like this looks a lot like Southern California, and then it looks very antebellum all of a sudden. Uh, but yeah, it's again like you have the Delta in California, but you know, that is not doesn't look like a Louisiana swamp, and this definitely looked like a southern swamp.

Jordon Huppert: 14:05

Yeah. Um no, it definitely did look like some of the older parts of the south and some small town, could be small town Alabama or northern Florida. Yeah, Louisiana.

Josh Gilliland: 14:19

I mean, just something um parts of Arkansas. I mean, like so again, there's there's places where it could make sense. Uh, but what doesn't make sense is the oh if they're in a hot part of the state, you know, clothing matches. Sheriffs do have a mild resemblance to Smokey and the Bandit. Yeah, good times. Good times, but again, no one again, you you don't hear many southern draws, but there's some, you know, there there is there's a little yeah. Um, but anyway, so that could play a factor on whether or not those kids would end up in juvenile hall. I I don't think those uh what they did would rise to the level of getting having them prosecuted as an adult because that would just seem vindictive. This is definitely guidance counselor territory. Oh, yeah. Um, that you would want to intercede, and also from a policy standpoint, you don't want to truly turn them in to criminals. So um it can be a self-fulfilling prophecy with with uh uh uh if they go depending depending on how they attack it. Um so I'd I would prefer them not, you know, it's again kids kids need a uh uh influence on how to behave.

Jordon Huppert: 15:42

Yeah, and courts are um courts are many things, but they are not the world's best uh teachers. So bringing a child into a even you know juvenile quasi-criminal court setting to try to teach them how to behave is not your best uh your best social use of funding, in my humble opinion.

Josh Gilliland: 16:08

I agree with that opinion. There's there are other methods to encourage socially acceptable behavior that doesn't put people on a you know school-to-prison fast track. So but yeah, there's some disturbing things that happen and disturbing I don't remember kids using language like like that takes place in the bullying scenes with such fervor and jubilation. I don't remember that getting thrown around, but not to the extent that uh that happens in the beginning of the film.

Jordon Huppert: 16:49

Yeah, I do. Um but you know, a few years apart, and I would be so I would have been growing up after this, was born in 85. So we would have been the generation taking influence from movies like this.

Josh Gilliland: 17:06

Yeah, so that was life was like in the 80s. It's like you know, it's like it's way turned up. It's way turned up. Oh yeah, it did happen, but I don't remember on the playground people throwing around terms like that indiscriminately. Uh I remember it because it was seen as an insult, it was seen as offensive, and it was seen as mean. It still happened, but but today we uh it just no, like no one should be doing that. Like it just society doesn't tolerate that kind of behavior anymore. Um moving forward, uh, we do have some peeping tom invasion of privacy issues. Speaking of other things, we still don't tolerate, just like oh Lord, like uh so like the the the hero kid. Okay, so again, bullying should the response to bullying shouldn't be bullying, like it's the policy of we'll just slap some sense into them. Oh, that is very aggressively 80s and also not reflective of reality. But you know, as as Rudy's trying to get into the monster squad, uh you know, they're in the treehouse and he's playing peeping tom on one of the kids' older sisters, who's let's just say high school.

Jordon Huppert: 18:27

Um yeah, here's hoping. Yeah, you know, 18, I'm sure.

Josh Gilliland: 18:32

Uh just oh god. Uh so there's definitely an age gap. Um, it's creepy, it's wrong. Um, and again, it's you know, the the original Wolfman has inadvertent uh peeping tom invasion of privacy. Uh because we have Larry Talbot, you know, they're he's at his father's estate. They have a new telescope installed for stargazing, and he looks through it and it's aimed at the town, and that's how we see you know the female lead, and um and it does turn into a weird peeping tom situation out of the gate.

Jordon Huppert: 19:10

So it's like don't and it's so you're saying it's an homage in the scene.

Josh Gilliland: 19:15

Possibly. I mean, so because again, they're for the artistic purpose of uh yeah, it's I again I don't we didn't have a treehouse that didn't happen in my neighborhood, so uh Lord Almighty. Um people close blinds, uh, but again, peeping tom and is and throwing a camera in makes it worse. It's because it's like it's not like an accidental like looking out the window and get and you know seeing okay, she has the blinds open. Whoops.

Jordon Huppert: 19:51

Um yeah, no, this is much this feels much more thought out with the camera and the tripod and there was a plan.

Josh Gilliland: 20:00

Um that that does well again. Yeah, with the player's intervention, yeah.

Jordon Huppert: 20:10

Probably with all of them, because it is also real strongly implied that this is his first time in the treehouse, and unless he brought that camera, uh you're gonna yeah, best not go down that road.

Josh Gilliland: 20:24

Yeah, it's like why did they have no, no, it's like what were they what was the plan there? Like it that's not a normal way to leave a camera. Like I do a lot of photography, but cameras are in their bags, tripods put away, like it's yeah, nothing's just set out.

Jordon Huppert: 20:49

Uh no, and none of that's inexpensive.

Josh Gilliland: 20:52

No, no, it's uh again, it's like I'm sure dad finding out that the you know camera was set up to creep on the neighbor girl. Um probably wouldn't mom and dad would not be happy. Mom and dad had enough problems already, uh uh that required counseling, but um tossing in you know what my son or one of his buddies is a peeping town tom and using our treehouse, like that's just yeah, that's uh it's not gonna win you points back down at the precinct either. No, no, like they I mean like he has to come down like a hammer on it just uh uh and again, like does that require uh charges uh in order to correct the behavior? Because again, there's a victim. There is there's there's an absolute victim with this, and and uh she's not gonna sit back and go like oh boys will be boys. No, that's not an acceptable answer to this situation. Like drop the hammer.

Jordon Huppert: 22:00

Uh well, and especially I mean, today we have the uh addition of the internet and digital photography, which today makes these things generally worse because they are then pictures like that are then shared or posted somewhere, and that's worse.

Josh Gilliland: 22:24

The peeping tom laws again, uh it's a state issue. Uh the they're they're they fall under invasion of privacy. Some states actually call them peeping tom. Uh states have started incorporating drones into uh their their laws, uh because they don't want somebody flying a drone outs outside of somebody else's window for taking pictures, which meant it happened because very few legislatures write laws proactively, going this could be a problem, so we'll come up with something. Most of most laws are because something happened and the legislature reacts to the situation.

Jordon Huppert: 23:10

Yeah, I think Oregon statutes are broad enough that we haven't specifically written in drones, but I don't think it excludes them.

Josh Gilliland: 23:19

Um I could see a DA DA come out swinging. Oh yeah. You know, it's it's it's like they should. It's like no, just just just no. Um especially today with the way that people can like cyber stalk and just uh the the opportunities for bad behavior are such that laws exist to protect people from such behavior, and as we keep developing technologies that can be exploited for nefarious purposes, laws will need to continue to to adapt uh to that situation.

Jordon Huppert: 24:01

Yeah, yeah. Thus far they've done a particularly slow job of adapting to uh to tech, but it it's hard to keep up.

Josh Gilliland: 24:13

It is, you know, it's really hard to keep up, and unless something big happens, you you don't see an evolution. You know, again, look at the stored communication act. That's also from like 87. Uh, we haven't updated that.

Jordon Huppert: 24:31

And uh so there's communications haven't changed since 87. It's it's okay.

Josh Gilliland: 24:35

Yeah, computer storage still the same, still very much so. Still big floppy discs. You know, windows that's crazy talk. All right, we do have a uh nice World War II bomber uh uh uh cameo. I think it's a B-25, twin engine bomber. That if it is a 25, that's what Jimmy Stewart flew during World War II era of surplus. People did have uh government surplus planes that they could use in like that they could get. It makes me wonder did this thing cross the Atlantic herring corpses? Because I don't think it has the range to do that. So I don't know where else would they have picked up the mummy in Dracula? Dracula and Frankenstein, the mummy was in a museum.

Jordon Huppert: 25:24

Oh, that's right.

Josh Gilliland: 25:26

So, and there's other issues to talk about with that, probably Europe and I know B-17s. I mean, like you they would have to stop in like I think Iceland to refuel in order to get to to England, so maybe something similar again. We can go look up the range and then figure out where do they refuel. Uh, but you have international transportation of a corpse, and there's a lot of rules that come with corpses. In addition to knowing a lot about e-discovery, I know a lot about treatment of dead bodies, which would make a really unique practice area, and it's because of movies like and it and TV shows like this that have corpses moving across state lines that gets complicated.

Jordon Huppert: 26:12

And I assume there's a permitting system or something, yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 26:15

And it's like it comes up with you know, person dies in state X and then transported back to state Y. Like again, there's applications and permits, like you just don't bury someone in the backyard, like there's a process that we follow for that because we want human remains treated with dignity and we want them buried as soon as possible. And the buried as soon as possible intent is to prevent diseases from running rampant, so that's why we want to bury as quickly as possible. And there's a sordid history with like autopsies, bodies are regulated, like we just don't want generally not stuffed in a uh wooden box and put in the back of a cargo plane, yeah. Or you know, strapped to the roof of the car when you know grandma dies on the road trip, like not okay. So not okay. Um too many movies where that happens. No. Uh, but uh you identified this, so other other thoughts that you might have on it.

Jordon Huppert: 27:24

No, I just kind of remembered you saying that uh it was something you had learned about. I thought you might have fun with it.

Josh Gilliland: 27:33

Yeah, good eye. Uh yeah, it's you know, like it was a decade ago that all these TV shows just had dead bodies crossing state lines and like getting buried in different places.

Jordon Huppert: 27:47

It's like yeah, you can't just do that.

Josh Gilliland: 27:52

There's yeah, there's like that's how desecration of a corpse happens, um, or abuse of a corpse. It it upsets people.

Jordon Huppert: 28:02

I I don't do much federal work, but I guess if you're talking about crossing state lines, you're talking about federal problems.

Josh Gilliland: 28:09

It can come up that way. So there's it depends if a crime happens, but if it's you need to look up the exact requirements that that I saw years ago, but you you can't just move it from state A to State B without doing some paperwork. Again, think of God, was it vacation or little miss sunshine? It's like like the grandparents' corpse does not go on the roof of the car. It's uh no. No, thank you. You don't do that. Um, but again, these guys are undead, so like that adds another weird spin on this that the law is not designed for. So you you identified with the wolf man.

Jordon Huppert: 28:52

Um yeah, this was a fun scene.

Josh Gilliland: 28:54

Yeah, so California we call it a 5150 hold, but uh can you describe what an APO is?

Jordon Huppert: 29:01

Uh well APO is a short for assault on a public safety officer. So the the scene where the wolfman is in the police station trying to get himself arrested so that he can get locked up before he turns into a werewolf, um, he is doing basically everything he can. Short of arresting someone, you can uh Oregon calls it civil commitment holds, or I guess California's 5150. But the idea is that if someone is not mentally well enough that they become a danger to themselves or a danger to other people, you have the option of involuntarily holding them in at least in Oregon, it's a hospital setting where they're then hopefully treated and it goes, you know, you can treat them and release them, or you can uh extend the hold much longer. But usually these are like quick holds to make. to stabilize people, get them on medication, and get them into treatment things. So I thought it was interesting that and I'm not surprised that in the 80s they wouldn't have had something like that to go to. But that would have been your uh your first go-to with the wolf man before he starts beating up the police and steals one of their guns. Um which then gets him shot.

Josh Gilliland: 30:27

Yeah so there's almost like a suicide by cop you know element but he he wants to be put into a cell which raises all kinds of questions. Like when the wolf man is human um he has his own personality understands right from wrong how do you end up there like because he I understand the wolf comes out once a month for a you know couple number of nights that have a full moon which is I what two three I'm not positive yeah so that means if he knows that the wolf wants to get to you know Alabama he can go to Alaska you know and like I have control over this that the wolf cannot run between Alaska to Alabama in in two nights so like there's a way to deter that that then creates a big plot hole yeah and and like what's this guy done is like I don't think he's a recent werewolf because he's got the crazy factor of someone who's been living with it for a while speculation but it's not like well Dracula clearly knows about him. Yeah and uh so again it raises the issue of what else has he been doing? You know does he set up like a pen for himself and that's how he keeps himself safe or is he you know like like the 1970s Hulk TV show where he's just you know wandering the countryside and knowing that he's gonna turn into a wolf once a month and cause problems and if not kill people so uh issues there. I mean this also again it's it's it's poking holes in the plot for for a movie that I do have strong affinity for but like my reaction to that is like did Dracula have acolytes like how did Dracula get a car there like that that wasn't dropped out of the airplane so had in uh had he been setting up shop there for a while and thus he had a base of operations and thus did a mission to go get Frankenstein and the other creatures knew to that we're all gonna rendezvous here so that was my assumption was that he had been moving toward this for a while because he knew the journal was there and the journal had been in the town for a bit because mom bought it at a yard sale or something. Yeah um so Van Helsing clearly had his uh as it's referent his disciples that set up the amulet to be in a place where a vampire could not enter because of the religious uh iconography that's posted we're gonna surround it with crosses and other things that will keep out creatures of the night uh but again uh would that keep the creature from the black lagoon out you know could Frankenstein not have just walked in there yeah uh but I don't know the Van Helsing would have planned for that because they weren't in the opening scene no and they clearly die out and if you have a hundred years to prepare for something you know that's several generations and like would it be like the grandkids or great grandkids just not believe what's going on or did Dracula have cronies over the decades knock out family trees that could have posed the threat you figure vampires often have like thralls type uh not Igors they were Frankenstein but um familiars familiars and servants or brides and we'll talk about them shortly um yeah uh again they recreate in a unique way that causes Redfield that was Dracula's buddy servant yeah yeah yeah sorry no no no it's again just came to me uh but the so in California it's similar with with a 5150 hold being an involuntary confinement and there's a process and procedure we actually considered changing the law um a while uh in the past election that we had for um trying to treat homeless who are suffering from mental illness because we you run into this phenomenon of there's someone who clearly needs help but our system's not designed to help them because that would involve a confinement and you need due process requirements. And so it turns into this ugly balancing act of it's inhumane to let someone suffering from a mental illness just suffer in homelessness uh if if treatment could help them so they could function and hold a job and not be homeless.

Jordon Huppert: 35:47

But in order to do that you need to confine them and treat them and there are huge civil liberty issues with going we're just gonna cowboy up and involuntarily confine people so we could medicate them um that can open the door to some very scary situations as well and and uh like there's no good answer for this on on how it plays out um it's bad in every direction so um now you just noticed another issue what was the other issue that you noticed oh with the wolfman scene yes anytime a a police officer shoots somebody it's an investigation um but considering the wolfman has a gun and has shot the ceiling and I think he pointed it at one of the the officers at some point this one's probably a short investigation yeah and there's tons of witnesses in the police scene to go like no no that made sense yeah it's like the guy had a gun he Lenny Frank and Carl all got punched in the face and broke their windows like it's uh no it's that's that's a very clear cut like yeah no I would it was right to discharge your firearm like it was and I that was like pre- tasers being issued to people so like it was not nope that was uh that was pretty clearly the choice of the moment yeah it was today it's like did you try tasing them like I I could see that being an an argument of of um but again like he had a gun as yeah as soon as he has a gun and he's fired the gun that we you've crossed into the situation where lethal force makes sense um if he didn't have a weapon yeah like escalating to lethal force is problematic in my view. Yeah no you're I agree I think they could have done a better job talking him down at the beginning but um at the point where he's beaten up four of them and stolen one of their guns that it's not gonna end any other way. And again it it highlights I mean going to his mental capacity like here's someone who's clearly traumatized and in a bad place because he knows he turns into a monster and he can't control it and he and he's aware of what's happening uh uh uh as well so like he's hand hands are not on the steering wheel he's along for the ride it's traumatized him because he is his life is destroyed uh from this experience and uh he he doesn't want to go around harming people um so it's which raises the issue of well we'll get to it at the end but how do you stop the wolf man uh all right so let's go back to the treehouse how's the dog get into the treehouse I assume one of them carries the dog up but it is one of the better unanswered questions of the movie is Rudy when they're all doing the 1980s hands in thing how'd the dog get up here he's like it's not like a German shepherd it's it's like a beagle you could ride in a basket it's yeah but he's about the same size as all the kids yeah it's a small dog you know barks at the creature when it surfaces so yeah okay he's a good boy uh dog yeah again as with the vortex open hanging onto the dog's tail very cute all right so we then get a training montage because again this is a 1980s movie yeah and it would be weird not to have a prep montage because they know their battle against evil is about to unfold so there's there's a lot of theft by the junior high student who who's who's look again looks like he's right out of the 1950s streetcar named desire type type look deals like a bow and arrow from an archery course you know we have one of the moms realizing her silver's gone as you know this kid is smelting you know in what is obviously shop class like nobody in this kid's class is looking at him sideways as he's smelting and making silver bullets that was the 80s that's just like that's not the uh I I was lucky to have a a wood shop class when I was in junior high we made a letter holder and so that again I made like it when I was in the eighth seventh grade and um uh picture frame too uh so yes yes going back no one could be sharpening wooden stakes it's like you're not supposed to make weapons and I assume there's a teacher who would have at least noticed at some point I mean again I remember our shop teacher being pretty cool just kind of a gruff dude who taught wood shop so again that kind of explains the personality type of it's like jeans and button up shirt and like he works wood like it understands tools and teaching you know like again safety goggles how not to cut off a finger again we I it was it was a very you know late 80s experience for me of uh like that's how we rolled yeah but like could you have hauled in like gunpowder and all the stuff you have to mix into the cartridges to make the absolutely not and no one could start making steaks like the the the teacher would have noticed that that was like no what are you doing because I was like I was there I I could see the making steaks as just kind of a teacher overlooked kind of thing and you know maybe he made them pretty quick and nobody noticed but then he's making bullets and it's like there's only one thing that's gonna go to it's like I don't remember anyone smelting anything in class you have like an hour that's a really efficient use of time. Yeah well on the plus side kids got a career in front of them going from again that that's fun and silly to something like dark we can Dracula kidnaps three girls they're either high school students or sorority girls like they're all in like little uniforms and they're trapped in the closet and he doesn't like just kill them and consume their blood he turns them into vampires and which means like he's now recruiting and building a small army and because the new vampires will need to feed two and the town's only so big so like you've got it's a problem with that but with the concept of brides of of Dracula which you know they're movies of that title none of them actually have Dracula marrying multiple women like they don't do a marriage ceremony but it's it's the recruiting through biting and turning them into vampires but bigamy is a crime the way bigamy laws generally work they can vary state to state first marriage is valid a second marriage would be invalid it like would not be effective at all and so if a marriage was in another state the first marriage is the one that controls you can't marry three women on one night like that's just not our laws do not recognize that at all bigamy is a crime punishments vary as well on on how it is any uh in your criminal defense practice ever that ever come up so oddly not in the criminal defense practice but when I was doing family law briefly it did once somebody came in and said I found out that my partner is still married and didn't tell me and now I want out and I need to get a divorce like nope you just file this and void the second marriage and you're good.

Josh Gilliland: 44:39

That's the end of that oh how it so suck for that person like it really did you know you get weird issues of like like um probate could come up like because let's just say that it happened later that the what the person thought was her husband died and she finds out that the guy was married to somebody else prior to marrying her that turns into a weird train wreck pretty fast um inheritance and if there's a will or no no will and yeah things get this particular situation was lucky and there wasn't there weren't a lot of assets to split up or anything like that and no kids thankfully but yeah that's good but man that can get sticky yeah especially if it's like they've been together like let's just say together for a decade. Yeah oh my god like what do you like if a house was purchased like there's there's assets and again and now we're in an ugly area of family law that you know it's like why I don't want to do family law that stuff is weird.

Jordon Huppert: 45:52

No it was a short lived part of my career thankfully but um yeah it's also a weird little quirk of practicing what I at the time called door law which is just if you walk in I and are willing to pay me to do things you know tell me about it and I may take your your case because I had a private practice and needed to pay rent.

Josh Gilliland: 46:20

Um so these like weird situations popped up from time to time it's people don't seek lawyers because they need someone to be on the bowling team I mean I would welcome that of somebody calling for like I'd love to go bowling uh we need we need someone for our team that would be a nice phone call but normally they call a lawyer because something bad happened and they need to they need help um the the exception to that is someone doing like advanced estate planning or wanting to set up a a company like that can at least be proactive and not born of tragedy. But yeah there's a nice letter of warning to anybody thinking about law school in the fall yeah it's you get weird things and and because again people need help and that's why we have lawyers to to help through those weird situations of this is what we do like there's the form to fill out to try to get you out of this mess. Um or ideally it's again creating a company it's like I have a new idea it's like okay we create a company we you know get your idea you know go to the patent office or you know whatever IP needs to be protected protect it like that that's the fun stuff yeah as opposed to it's the worst day of your life and you now need help and uh just just no fun speaking of oddities so some kids have to break into a mansion abandoned mansion to get an amulet okay you issue spotted it I got some thoughts on it too so take it away yeah it's illegal you should not break into houses abandoned or not um especially not if your intention is to steal things this is the wrinkle I have with that it's abandoned and if it's abandoned property no one has domain over it now you still shouldn't go spelunking around an abandoned property because you could get hurt as evidenced by people falling through floors and other bad things that happened but if it's abandoned nobody technically owns it somebody has control over it whether it's you know a person or a governmental entity or something it it's not public property. It's not public property but it's it's in a different category um yeah and because again it's hard to be accused of theft of abandoned property because it's abandoned hard but not impossible. True true again I I didn't say it's a slam dump but again like where's the fun like this movie is kids fighting 12 year olds fighting monsters so lawyers tend to suck the fun out of all things it's like you're a buzzkill uh it's like whoops like I don't get invited to parties okay that's why I'm not on the bowling team like I'm the one pointing out we can do that like like that that's an uninsured man like don't do that um and that's we're alone all right uh we have Dracula um so this is I think one of the scariest Draculas on screen like he's he he's cruel he looks sophisticated like he's I think a little more Christopher Lee than Bella Legosi but definitely he's up there with looking suave and sophisticated and terrifying um yeah he doesn't have any of the redeeming features that I tend to associate with Dracula movies where he's like a person of the town or he has some like cover for being a vampire this guy is just I'm going to kill anybody who gets in my way of total world domination I'm doing a quick Google search Duncan Regnar who uh was in a lot of uh long career the Zorro TV series god he was he in deep space nine or am I is that somebody else who just looks a lot like him oh including airbud so you know good for him he was in v don't know what character variety of tv shows he's very effective effective I was strength being being a very scary and he he has dynamite you took a lot of it he's out of century to prepare I mean sure I I don't know when they came out with sticks of dynamite I'm sure it was readily available but in 1985 it's not in every corner drugstore no no it's not and he was in deep space nine who was he in ds nine uh he was a recurring role of Sakhar Eden who was a Bajoran uh freedom fighter yeah he was one of the counselors wasn't he yes so uh he also played uh Ruinin so I'm not sure that look definitely looks like a holodeck character the episode was subrosa for it was a TNG episode and then three episodes in deep space nine so again memorable face oh no that's the ghost that crusher falls in love with oh so he's the okay so he's the candle ghost so yeah okay something that lives in infamy that we should cover for the 60th anniversary of Star Trek of um meme uh as well so yes yeah I'm sure gates mcfadden loves that one she's on Instagram like made fun of it at a uh like one of the cruises that they did like in good like holding up one of the candles so it was just like well done okay it's just it's a humor. Yeah it's like all right you're why does this dude look so familiar and that would be why all right so he's super lethal but again like he throws dynamite in the treehouse and says the meeting adjourned again it was just like Bravo just like such a great villain like the 80s cheese factor is high but then he's like snapping X in the final yeah it's like like picks the little girl up by her chin like mean scary terrifying like he really played the role well he did not like I I I had not seen this movie.

Jordon Huppert: 53:15

I hadn't done a lot of research about it before I watched it I was not going into it expecting that level of acting yeah he he does a very good job and and it's like they wrote it well of like let's make Dracula scary make wolf man have is you're sympathetic towards the human half of the wolf man.

Josh Gilliland: 53:36

But yeah he's he's running around with dynamite car without registration or license plate so you know that's a problem. But yeah he's he's he's a very lethal Dracula who has a pretty significant body count at the by the end of the film. Uh but he lets the pilots live dynamite is regulated people just don't go buy dynamite like that's how you end up on an FBI watch list.

Jordon Huppert: 54:02

Yeah I need even buying the ingredients to make it in your shop class would probably put you on somebody's uh keep an eye on this person list.

Josh Gilliland: 54:10

Especially today like there was yeah it's like you know people can't just buy fertilizer you know in bulk like there's requirements of um how not to end up on a watch list. Let's talk about legal justification for killing the wolf man. We have the sympathetic human who knows he has a problem that he has this disease that turns him into a werewolf and he goes around killing people and he he can't control the wolf the wolf is a threat the wolf is killing people and he's killing people in a way that doesn't create more werewolves um I don't know if they're if that was intentional but like no one gets scratched um and and if they did it's you don't see anyone getting scratched but he does kill people. I was kind of ready for the the dad to get bitten by the werewolf or something toward the end and for that to be like a the cliffhanger at the end of the movie but it never this is very representative of an 80s dad on a redemption arc okay so like divorce was a real thing in for boomer parents in the 80s and and so kids dealt with that of their baby boomer parents getting divorced and parents going to couples therapy and counseling and and trying to save marriages like that was a thing and 80s dads on redemption arc on move in movies as a motif.

Jordon Huppert: 55:41

Yeah although I also thought good on them for having a marriage counselor in 1987.

Josh Gilliland: 55:47

Yeah that was uh again growing up with you know you know divorced parents yeah do not remember that the late 70s early 80s but that was more of a thing that was at least verbalized uh by the late 80s uh and they do play the like dad's job is causing the problems being a police officer is hard like yeah there are jobs that are hard uh because they take a lot of time like there are lawyers who are we lawyers have a very high divorce rate um there's the the mantra of like lawyers should not marry other lawyers um i don't agree with that i don't agree with it's a mantra but it's a mantra it's like because they like those marriages frequently end in divorce yeah things that are very successful because again it's it's a hard job with lots of hours and that you tend to bring stress home yeah i i do think the practice of law has gotten better about recognizing work-life balance and not having again like 1980s you know boiler room type hours uh but same you know similar problems for police officers you know or anyone in public safety that they work some extreme hours and like if you're like my mom was a paramedic and she had she was good at not bringing the job home with her wow but she had calls that bothered her like the domestic violence one that she ended up testifying in found the records from that uh there was a murder suicide where a mom killed her kids and then killed herself and like in that one you know that one really bothered her um because the kids were rough yeah the kids were like my age and so um yeah like that that freaked rough yeah freaked her out like that takes a toll and it it's you know you need to have a supportive spouse and also self-awareness um in dealing with that kind of work-life balance um so again marriage counseling and therapy were probably very good things for you know a you know father of two um trying to make things work but ironically this horrific experience turns into like family bonding time chroma bonding yeah it's like three because of a giant thread everyone puts aside's differences really fast and yeah what's important to me like my kid's important to me so I'm gonna go fight a werewolf and vampire so good host dad yeah junior shows up and helps and together father and son blow up a werewolf like that's uh I hope you and your kids never have to do that so same um that's a rough afternoon you then have you know the Rudy ends up killing the werewolf you know turns human and then the human says thank you before dying legal justification so you get wild animals like killing a wild animal that's a threat to someone is justified a human being turning into a wild animal that can kill someone gets weird.

Jordon Huppert: 59:21

Yeah I mean I think the human being turning into a werewolf get makes it a little weird but if you just stick with the human being there are legal justifications for killing people. Self-defense defense of others crazy person on a murder spree around town probably gets you there the imminent threat that you need there is certainly an imminent threat to is it Sean and his dad. Yep he's probably clean on this one but that said it it's still not the best idea in real life. Generally, a real bad idea. Would not recommend. But for movie purposes, I think Rudy, this is this is probably not on his list of legal problems at the end of the the movie.

Josh Gilliland: 1:00:16

No, no, he has other ones. He does. He's got other problems. But he okay, he'll have to live with killing someone.

Jordon Huppert: 1:00:23

He will.

Josh Gilliland: 1:00:24

Because it it's one thing for Horace to kill the gill man. It's like that was a scary monster. I killed the scary monster. Okay. Probably traumatic, different levels of I killed the scary monster, and then it turned to into a broken human being who said thank you before dying. He should get therapy for that. He should go talk to someone for that. Because it raises the issue that here's someone with a condition where they turn into a killing machine and they have no control over it, and the rest of society ignores him.

Jordon Huppert: 1:01:02

Okay. Even when he's asking for help not to be a killing machine.

Josh Gilliland: 1:01:06

Yeah. And so every because they are like, no, you're crazy and not the type of crazy we want to help.

Jordon Huppert: 1:01:12

Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:01:12

So we're going to leave you to go be a danger to others. There's all kinds of problems with that. Because the issue should be like, how is there a way where he gets to live? And on nights on the full moon that he's you know in an area where he could not get out and cause anyone problems. I mean, that would that would be plan A, not we'll just put him down, dark, sad.

Jordon Huppert: 1:01:39

They do a and uh an interesting an interesting delve into the idea of you know the monster inside kind of thing. The Hulk does that real well too.

Josh Gilliland: 1:01:53

Yeah. And they're again different versions of the Hulk. Yeah. Um this movie does a good job with empathy for two of the creatures. So Wolfman has an has empathy because there's a human being. This is one of the best Frankenstein's monsters ever. Like the creature is done with love. Yeah, it's a nice exploration of humanity. The other being treated differently and persecuted, uh, kids accepting someone who's different and having empathy and shows kindness and he switches sides. Like he's sent to kill children, he's and he doesn't do it.

Jordon Huppert: 1:02:37

Yeah, it's not gonna do that. No, thank you.

Josh Gilliland: 1:02:41

Which breaks the mold from the the early universal monster movies where you have little Maria get thrown in the lake. So this is he's sympathetic, yeah, and and protects the children. His demise at the end is endearing. Because he he's the hero, he gets the hero move. Yeah, he gets the saved little girl from Dracula. I remember cheers in the theater, you know. Um I'll bet. Because again, people love a hero, and in seeing a nice hero move when there's something very bad about to happen and somebody stops it.

Jordon Huppert: 1:03:21

Yeah, and people also love the redemption arc, you know, the you're a monster because of the way you look. But he's never of all of the monsters in the movie, he's the one that never does anything particularly monstrous, if I remember. No, like Dracula just kind of pulls him out of a crate, assumes he's going to be a villain with them, and sends him to kill the kids.

Josh Gilliland: 1:03:47

Yeah, the creature from the black lagoon, team bad guy.

Jordon Huppert: 1:03:52

Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:03:52

Wolfman, team bad guy, team not bad guy. The mummy. The mummy, okay. Also team bad guy. Team bad guy, clearly team bad guy. But again, in a way that what's what's been going on for like 2,000 years?

Jordon Huppert: 1:04:07

Hanging out in museums, getting free food off of uh buffets, I'm sure.

Josh Gilliland: 1:04:10

Yeah, just getting that would be a weird existence. Like, you know, does he sleep for a century or two, get up and like, okay, what what time is it? It's the internet. Yeah, it's like what's an airplane? Uh and what do you mean people went to the moon? And yeah, I'm gonna go back to sleep. This is all freaking me out, and right yeah, so but again, so again, you have two of them that are sympathetic and others who are not. They do talk touch on the Holocaust, because again, you have scary German guy, and that's his who survived. You know, we find we see the tattoo on his arm when he says he knows about real monsters, meaning that he survived a death camp. He has a model B17, and when they the kids actually meet scary German guy, they they come over for pie. Yeah, okay, you should not invite kids over and feed them. That's okay. That was a very 1980s thing, and also goes against all the training that we have on like don't take candy from strangers, but you know, that's like can you read German? And they get pie. He helps creepy today worked out for them. Yeah, it's like we but it it highlights don't think that the scary German guy is a scary German guy, he survived a death camp. Again, does stand down Dracula, so give him some credit. So again, you have people who you think are bad and they're not. So, and that's scary German guy and Frankenstein fall into that category.

Jordon Huppert: 1:05:56

And it is also I don't know, maybe this is just reflecting on it in the the times of which we live, but it is also a nice reminder that the monsters that you need to worry about are not necessarily Dracula and the Wolfman. I mean, yeah, those are fun Hollywood things, but his little his line of when he's closing the door, I've seen real monsters. That really that one has stuck with me for the couple of days since I've seen the movie.

Josh Gilliland: 1:06:27

But the I'm thinking about when this is made, so it's it's 40 years after World War II. Or 42 since the end of World War II. The World War II generation is like in retirement age of their grandparents at at this time. You do have that element of the late 80s World War II generation kind of not not in Twilight yet, uh, but definitely feeling the call of history because they had they had lived long good lives for the most part.

Jordon Huppert: 1:07:09

Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:07:10

Which now brings us to they needed a virgin to read this, which again is such a weird, ugly trope. I don't get it.

Jordon Huppert: 1:07:20

So I mean I understand that as like a a trope that has run through movies and I assume still runs through movies. What I don't get is why is it always like a woman or a girl?

Josh Gilliland: 1:07:40

I I don't know, man. Like I just I mean, like, and I don't like saying it was the 80s, like that's that's not a good answer.

Jordon Huppert: 1:07:50

But it was the 80s, yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:07:51

But it was the 80s, but there was a lot of again, the Christian history, and like say, like, oh, you know, you're clean, you're you know, you you've never had sex, and and it's just I mean like I that always just seemed weird, and and how that turns into a necessity for the spell to open up a portal to limbo is weird.

Jordon Huppert: 1:08:13

Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:08:14

That said, they asked the girl and she lies about it, and that causes problems. If she had been, sorry, I can't help you.

Jordon Huppert: 1:08:28

Let's go talk to some of my friends. Like that it's like, what's happening?

Josh Gilliland: 1:08:33

Okay, maybe Jenny can help. Um, but that's critical information that's needed to save the world.

Jordon Huppert: 1:08:46

So don't laugh. Yeah, I'm not sure they did the world's best job of imparting the criticality of the information to her.

Josh Gilliland: 1:08:56

Oh, yeah, again, because it's it's it's dopey dudes trying to ask you. It's again the the proper response would be go talk to mom. Again, it would be a slap.

Jordon Huppert: 1:09:09

Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:09:09

It's uh and then it's like, why did Becky slap Timmy? Well, you know, okay, justified. Like, no jury will convict. Her not telling the truth ends up causing more problems in a critical stage of of uh the battle against evil. Uh so again, don't lie. Like she could just know your business, or I can't help. Like you're gonna have to go get somebody else. Like, there's a way where she didn't have to disclose that that didn't involve a lie that that would not cause an end to the world problem. Uh, she doesn't have to disclose her status, but uh, she shouldn't lie about a situation that could cause a prop bigger problem. So the movie ends with you know, the heroes win, and uh it is a good fight. I mean, re-watching that fight scene, you know, you have hero was very good. Hero boy Sean getting drugged into limbo by Dracula, and he's able to grab a stake and pound it into Dracula's heart, and then you get Van Helsing, who's been in limbo for a century, finished the job.

Jordon Huppert: 1:10:19

Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:10:20

So there's police officers in Helsing, in addition to uh others that get sucked into limbo. Just with that, there's there it's a little unfair that Frankenstein gets sucked in. That's a very sweet part of the story, and the little girl lets her stuffed animal dog, you know, go go with Frankenstein, which again is very sweet, very endearing, very 1980s. But at the end, the army shows up because Eugene sends a note in crown to a local army base saying there's monsters, please help. And in good 1980s fashion, the army goes, All right.

Jordon Huppert: 1:11:01

I mean, who's gonna send a note in crayon to the army that's not real?

Josh Gilliland: 1:11:05

Please help monsters. So the positives from this are adults take kids seriously and they show up after this kid's dad basically shames the kid for saying, like, there's a monster in my closet. The army believes the kid and shows up. So, like, the kid's vindicated that way, and then it highlights the importance of believe the kids if if a kid's saying something's wrong. That's actually a really nice message. Tanks roll up to help after dad was a jerk that said they could have done other ways to trust and verify, but it raises an interesting posse comitatis issue. Broadly speaking, the army should not be doing law enforcement. There's, and that's because of post-Reconstruction, part of the agreement from the Tilden Hayes presidential dispute that ended with Hayes being president with a promise to only run for being for one term, and you then end up having the great railroad strike happen where troops are sent in and they shoot striking workers in the north. That upsets a lot of people, and the Posse Comitatus Act is enacted to make sure that troops aren't used on U.S. citizens. And so there are some exceptions to this, like when troops can be deployed within the United States, but generally we we don't like this happening. The way to to approach it is I I pulled up the the act, it doesn't apply to like the Coast Guard, which is why Coast Guard can go out and do law enforcement. And we had some changes post-9-11, and those have since expired. Broadly speaking, the Act says from the 45th Congress, uh, it shouldn't shall not be lawful to employ any part of the Army of the United States as a posse comitatus or otherwise for the purpose of executing the laws, except in such cases and under such circumstances as such employment of said force may be expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress. Then we get into uh some of the other language that is whenever except in circumstances under expressly authorized by the Constitution or Act of Congress, willfully uses any part of the army, the navy, the marine corps, the air force, or space force as a posse comitatis or otherwise to execute the law shall be fined under this title or in prison, not more than two years or both. So again, we don't want the army conducting law enforcement. A monster incursion where the fate of civilization is hanging in the balance, it would be one of those circumstances where no, we're gonna send in the troops.

Jordon Huppert: 1:14:00

I'm sure it's there in the constitution somewhere, except in case of Dracula. Yes. If a mummy is involved, go for it.

Josh Gilliland: 1:14:15

So again, I think it does raise some issues of like National Guard should have gone in first, but from an issue of just you know, the kid who's not believed by his dad that the mummy's in his closet to the army shows up when the kid sends a letter for help is endearing.

Jordon Huppert: 1:14:33

That is nice.

Josh Gilliland: 1:14:34

Fun fact about the kid's room he's wearing Robotech PJs, he has a Star Blazers poster and a Punisher poster uh on the wall. So again, that looked that looked full-on 80s, and the kid liked anime on top of it. Uh, two very popular anime that were mainstream at that point in time. That was cool.

Jordon Huppert: 1:15:01

Um I loved Robotech. I also love Star Blazers, but I watched more of Robotech.

Josh Gilliland: 1:15:07

That 80s kid had a very 80s kid bedroom and and toys and pop culture in there.

Jordon Huppert: 1:15:14

So nice little clearly good taste in it.

Josh Gilliland: 1:15:16

Yeah, yeah. So, which meant the set designer had excellent taste. Uh so since this was a new experience for you, what were your overall thoughts on uh Monster Squad?

Jordon Huppert: 1:15:28

Well, I think my overarching thought is that was an aggressively 80s movie. Um it was good. I liked I like the kind of early team-up work. I don't know that there was a lot of kind of team up movies, and that's become kind of a thing. Uh but the early kind of the all these monsters have teamed up. I enjoyed. Some of it was a little too cringe-worthy to watch in modern times, which is fine, but it didn't have the nostalgia trip for me that it that probably would have made that more bearable.

Josh Gilliland: 1:16:12

It's interesting to hear that because I again I have gray hair and a receding hairline because I've I was a kid when this came out.

Jordon Huppert: 1:16:20

I do too. I just fuzz my camera and wear my hair long.

Josh Gilliland: 1:16:23

Bless you, sir. The so again part of it is there's a nostalgia factor. I do think this is a brilliant love letter to all the universal monsters.

Jordon Huppert: 1:16:34

Very much so.

Josh Gilliland: 1:16:35

I think they really nail the universal monsters and and give humanity to two of them and extreme malice to Dracula. And it's a very effective gill man as well. I mean and being scary in a good costume. The cringeworthiness of preteens is painful to see. So, like that that did not age well, and that's that is uncomfortable to see uh at the beginning of this film because of some of the language that the characters use. Again, plot points of peeping toms and others is equally disturbing. That said, it it is a fun 80s time capsule of monsters and kids fighting monsters. If any kid watches it, you're like, parents are gonna have to talk to their kids about appropriate language and and how we're we should be better than what happens.

Jordon Huppert: 1:17:29

I will say, I do love that the trope continues all the way through of like the kids have to save the world. There's a world-ending threat, and the adults are nowhere to be found.

Josh Gilliland: 1:17:45

So the adults go from not believing to rallying. So like hero dad steps up, yeah.

Jordon Huppert: 1:17:53

Realizing, oh my kid wasn't making this up. Oh no. Oh dear. I made a mistake, I'm fixing it right now. Yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:18:06

Um like that's endearing. Um again, there's there's some sins in this, some are forgivable, some are not, and uh uh yeah, some are very awkward. Uh, but overall, again, I I do have a strong affinity for this movie because of timing and whatever it means.

Jordon Huppert: 1:18:30

But like there are a lot of movies from that time period that I love because they were things I watched with my dad or something. Just wasn't one of them. Um, but it is it is a very fun movie, yes.

Josh Gilliland: 1:18:43

And again, I I do especially if you love classic universal monsters, I would say check this out. And um yeah, and if and if you're a parent with a pre-teen and they watch it, you're gonna have to talk to them.

Jordon Huppert: 1:18:57

Yeah, you watch it after they go to bed, yeah.

Josh Gilliland: 1:19:00

Okay, let's talk to your kids of appropriate behavior and how we maybe both. Yeah, we've learned we're gonna do better. That's the that's a good message here. Yeah, so with that, uh Jordan, thanks for for helping with this. And so Josh uh celebrating spooky season and um happy Halloween, everybody. Yes, yes, stay spooky. So, everyone, thanks for tuning in, and uh, we will have more coverage. So, the plans to cover a a hammer film, we won't tell you which one yet, and another classic from the late 80s. So, with that, wherever you are, stay safe, stay healthy, and stay geeky. Take care.