China & Russia Condemn US Indictment of Raul Castro

Latin America Correspondent Jon Bonfiglio speaks to Henry Bonsu for Times Radio, plus Extras. 

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Transcript

Henry Bonsu 0:00

Yes, indeed. It is a Thursday night. In between, uh China and Russia have condemned a US decision to charge Cuba's former President Raul Castro with murder. The US accused Castro over the nineteen ninety-six downing of two planes, an incident that killed four people and fueled diplomatic tensions between Washington and the Caribbean Island. The Chinese Foreign Ministry called on the US to stop using coercion and threats against its ally, while the Kremlin said the pressure being exerted on Havana borders on violence. US Secretary of State Marco Rubio spoke to reporters earlier today, and the question of Cuba was raised. Well, let's talk to Jon Bonfiglio, Latin America correspondent. Jon, um, welcome to the program. Uh what do we think then? I mean, the US indicting 94-year-old Raul Castro over something that happened uh 30 years ago. Um, what do you think is the motivation and how are the Cubans responding?

Jon Bonfiglio 1:35

Well, I mean, the the motivation on the face of it, what's being presented as the motivation is the fact that Raul Castro was armed forces and defense minister of Cuba in 1996 when these two civilian planes were uh were shot down in the in the Florida Straits, and uh as a result that he is directly culpable for the murder of the four individuals and the downing of those two planes, and that he must be held to account. Of course, these were Cuban exiles, Cuban dissidents that were flying the planes, but they were also American citizens, and so that's where that comes from. But of course, what is actually taking place is the fact that it uh Raul Castro, in the absence, of course, because Fidel Castro died a number of years ago now. Raul Castro is now the most significant um icon of the of the revolution in um in Cuba and threats to him or the potential bringing down of Raul Castro uh also suggests that you know that is the the the the the that will bring about the the toppling of the entire Cuban administration and you know what we we might term the the Cuban experiment.

Henry Bonsu 2:42

Right. Um we heard um uh uh in my intro that both uh the Kremlin and Beijing have warned the USA to stop bullying Cuba. Uh Cuba is an ally and threats against them cannot be condoned, and uh that they should stop uh the Chinese say they should refrain from making threats of force at every turn. Now, of course, uh President Trump has just come back from what he thinks is a successful visit to President Xi in China, and of course we know that he wants uh Vladimir Putin of Russia to be his friend. So I'm wondering how seriously um the White House will take those warnings from the Russians and the Chinese.

Jon Bonfiglio 3:19

I mean, ultimately not very seriously. There's not anything uh sort of tangible which is going to take place, and and uh you sort of sort of would expect to hear these noises uh coming out of uh Beijing and uh and Moscow, because of course Cuba is a long-standing ally in in the region. But there's also a fair bit of doublespeak there, Henry, because of course everything that they're condemning uh actions that they themselves are engaged in, uh, you know, vis-a-vis, of course, Ukraine, uh, Taiwan, and and so on. So um I think what is uh what it uh is uh very clear in the corridors of power across the three capitals of the US, uh China and Russia is that they are uh uh superpowers that can basically go go about their own business and act in in whatever uh whatever way they want.

Henry Bonsu 4:05

Uh what sense do we get that the Cubans are taking this seriously enough to um hide Raul Castro and prepare for a possible Venezuelan-style military intervention?

Jon Bonfiglio 4:18

That is actually a really good um uh question, I think, because clearly there is a sea change now in in Havana and across uh Cuba. This is being taken very seriously. The the expectation now is that we are and we've entered the end game prior to some kind of uh engagement or military action. Um, and you know, in all in all likelihood, what we're gonna see, because we're not gonna see boots on the ground in the same way as we spoke about Venezuela, Henry, at the time, you know, the US administration is not interested in that uh taking place. We've seen the sort of the same reticence to uh to engage in that way uh in Iran. But undoubtedly, um the big difference between Venezuela and Cuba is that Cuba has seen Venezuela, has seen what took place in uh in Venezuela. I would also add that the Cuban sort of military infrastructure and state infrastructure, although significantly depleted and uh harmed by years of underinvestment and um and neglect, is not the Venezuelan state. It is a different uh piece, which is not to say that the US wouldn't um succeed in some kind of attempt at a precise mission to remove Raul Castro, but there is more risk involved, added to which, because of the fact that the Cuban state is stronger and is not held up by Castro, Castro is not Maduro. I mean, Castro in his nine is in his 90s, he's not held an official position for years now. So an open question is does the removal of Raul Castro actually have any meaningful impact? And you would assume, I guess going back to the parallel of Venezuela, that the US is having ongoing conversations with other figures within the uh within the Cuban administration to potentially take over should some kind of coup in inverted commerce take place.

Henry Bonsu 6:09

That's right. And um let's remember, John, only a week ago the director of the CIA, uh John Ratcliffe, met his Cuban counterpart in Havana, uh, and that was following the US renewing its offer of a hundred million dollars of aid to ease effect of its own oil blockade. John, I think you have uh disappeared from us. We've had a couple of um gremlins on the line uh tonight. Um let me uh uh take uh this opportunity to bring in Marcus's uh WhatsApp who says this the US actions are completely illegal in international law, they are preparing another Maduro style invasion of a sovereign country. Perhaps it is time for the UK to stand up before international law. What do you think Yvette Cooper, the Foreign Secretary, should say, Marcus? And do you think uh Marco Rubio and his boss Donald Trump would pay any attention to what she has to say? And then um Dominic says this Trump has a cheek to charge anyone with murder. Does he think those bombs he drops magically avoid killing anybody? Yes, and only a week or so ago didn't we discuss the fact that uh the US has bombed uh boats over the past eight or so months and killed around 194 individuals. And one of the um agencies, uh journalist investigative uh agencies, uh came up with um a number of figures, including the fact that most of the people killed that it could identify were Fisher men and a couple of women who were trying to earn a living, and they came from poverty-stricken backgrounds. It's Henry Bonsu.

Jon Bonfiglio 7:49

Hi everyone, sorry about that. Uh you might be able to hear the thunder in the background. That very sudden departure from Henry's show. Uh, storms just rolled in and uh took out the electricity. Uh, but yeah, just a couple of things to to add uh to all of this, which I think is sort of important too. Um Henry did ask how Cuba was reacting, or Cuban people were reacting, but there's a couple of interesting things as regards the Cuban sort of government itself. It's actually issued a guide called the Family Guide for Protection Against Military Aggression, which sort of outlines civilian responsibilities and also safety protocols, uh, but sort of reminds everybody in Cuba that if there is an attack, that they are there to be uh mobilized, that they are part of the sort of civilian militia, if you if you like. At the same time, um they continue to insist that Cuba continue to continues to insist that it is not a threat. Uh obviously, we heard Marco Rubio there in the in the program itself discussing about how Cuba was such a huge regional state sponsor of uh of terror, but Cuba continually points out that this is not uh the case and it also reserves the right to self-defense. Sticking on Marco Rubio, actually, just for a moment, one of the things he said in his um address to the Cuban people, uh yesterday I think it was, is that Cuba was controlled by people who are, and I quote, profiting from the state, unquote. People who are, and again, quote, uh are accountable to nobody and profit for the benefit of a small business elite, unquote. Well, you know, that could just as easily be said of the United States as of uh Cuba. And then just one other thing which it which hasn't really made the news uh at all, but um is is really gives a sense of what's taking place and why the US is in engaged with all this. Um and we go to Canada to uh for this sort of uh story of for scratching the surface, and specifically Canadian mining firm Sherritt International Corporation. Now, Sherrit, despite being Canadian, has a sort of a Cuban and Syria Cuban venture uh on the go, a mining corporation uh that it allies with, but in struggling to navigate US sanctions on Cuba, uh decided last week that it uh it was time to wind up its its operations. Um at this point, of course, Sherritt's Cuban venture is essentially worthless. Um, and then uh at that point, once it declared that it was going to wind up its its actions, um, a US company called Gillon Capital LLC suddenly came into the picture. A company linked to a former Trump advisor and fundraiser called Ray Washborn. Gillon, seemingly indifferent to US sanctions, unlike uh Sherritt International Corporation, which seemed to think that, which was convinced it would wasn't able to uh to act based on re in Cuba based on repercussions from the US. So Gillon now aims to buy a majority share in Sheritt's Cuban holdings, and uh of course has bought it at a knockdown rate and also stands to make a massive profit should Cuba become economically active once again, which of course the Trump administration fully expects to leverage. As you've said many times before, everybody, this is all about money and about profiting from the office.