Voiceover

Welcome to The Freq Show podcast, hosted by Sam Thurmond and Jaclyn Steele Thurmond. Sam is an Air Force Academy graduate and veteran who, after his service and two deployments, escaped the nine-to-five grind by building a real estate investing business that has, to date, accounted for over $50 million in real estate transactions. Jaclyn is an award-winning musician, former owner of boutique branding agency Steele International, and We are

Jaclyn

so excited to welcome you to The Freq Show podcast, where we center our content around the frequency of belief.

Sam

Why? Because when we overcome fear and self-doubt, basically by getting out of our own way, we can make the impossible possible.

Jaclyn

And in this podcast, we are going to share our favorite mindset tools and life lessons that have completely transformed our lives and businesses. So without further ado, let's

Sam

get freaky. All right. Welcome back to The Freak Show. I'm Sam Thurman. I'm here with my co-host and beautiful wife.

Jaclyn

Thank you. Jaclyn Steele Thurman.

Sam

Yeah, yeah. Let me do the intro today. So we'll see how it goes, but we're super excited to do this episode. I think it's going to be really fun. And the title of the episode is The World Wants You to Be Stupid. And six ways to be savvy in that world. And I think, put another way, the world wants you to be easily influenced.

Jaclyn

Yeah. That is a great alternate title. The world wants you to be easily influenced.

Sam

With all the information that's going around, everybody has a voice, which there's Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. perspectives and our own feelings on things so that we can maybe have a more nuanced based approach to

Jaclyn

operating. Yeah, it's vital that we think for ourselves. And the reason I brought up the possibility of doing this topic, this episode, was because I got flagged on Instagram. And I was like, why did I get flagged on Instagram? What would I have done? And I looked into it and it was because I shared something that RFK had shared about, I think it was like the childhood vaccine schedule or something like that. And this happens to be a topic that I have heavily researched because I have a child who is subject to the childhood vaccine schedule. So I have books on it. I've read articles. I've watched YouTube videos. I've reached out to people that I trust. And I know more than the average person about this. Am I an expert? No. But I realized that what RFK was saying was true. It was absolutely factually based and true. And I shared it and I got flagged for it. And I'm not offended that I got flagged, whatever. It's that the process of sharing information now and truthful information is under attack. And it's not okay that factual information is being so heavily censored by people people who are controlling algorithms. And I forget who said it recently, but they said the most powerful people in the world right now are the people who control the algorithms. And that's absolutely correct. And so I think our point in wanting to do this was we have to learn to think for ourselves. And if you have a differing opinion than we do, we welcome that. Not only do we not hate that, we welcome it because it's important to be challenged. But at the end of the day, we have to do our own research and we have to be able to think for ourselves if we are going to be healthy individuals and if we have any chance at redeeming our country.

Sam

Yeah. And to me, I think we had this, when we were kind of talking about this episode, when we were putting the outline together, we had this conversation and my feeling is, okay, regardless of your point of view on any given topic, let's look at this and take the Switzerland approach, not taking sides, how do we have a process, a thought process of taking in information regardless of what our opinions are and processing that information in a better way? And I think that's at the core of some of the biggest problems in our society is that we do not have space for nuance. We have to be polarized. We're forced and encouraged to be polarized to where we're either on one extreme or the other, and then we have to subscribe to everything. And

Jaclyn

then we become easier to control the more radicalized we are.

Sam

Exactly. So again, I think... A neutral process of understanding, intaking information, making decisions, and then ultimately developing your own perspective is what intrigues me.

Jaclyn

Yeah. Oh, it's fantastic. And I think of this in terms of digestion. Just like we take in food and then we digest it, this is how we feel like digesting information will give you the best results, like how to digest it in the optimal way.

Sam

Yeah.

Jaclyn

And we came up with six different things that we feel like we do regularly that has helped us to form opinions that we feel like are informed. Would you say that that's correct?

Sam

Yeah. And I don't want to go out of order, but I think ultimately developing an opinion that you can ultimately defend, that you can explain why. Because so often the easiest way to to have an argument with someone is just to ask them why they think what they think. And so often people can't do that. They can't give you reasons why they think that. And also pretending to have an opinion on a topic that you just don't know anything about. There's so much that I don't know about. There's so much that I don't know. I'm not going to be able to sit there and have an in-depth conversation and tell you this is my hard stance opinion on something because I just don't know enough. And I think there's some expectation. It's a cheap way to elevate yourself and put yourself on a moral high ground to just prescribe to a blanket group thought on things without having any depth. It becomes part of

Jaclyn

one's identity. Right. But that also I think is so dangerous and it shows how fragile people's identities are right now if their identity becomes a political party.

Sam

Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. So speaking of digestion, did you want to go through the the top Yeah, I think we

Jaclyn

should. So I told you about how my Instagram account was flagged and that just made me go. It took me back to my fourth grade classroom with Mrs. Lance and there was a poster on the wall that said, stand up for what is right, even if you're standing alone. And I loved that quote so much. dorky, chubby fourth grade Jaclyn was like, hey mom, will you get me this poster to put in my room? And of course my wonderful mother did it. And so I had in my room this poster that said, stand up for what is right, even if you're standing alone. And I think that because of cancel culture, because of group think, because of how polarized the political parties are in our country, People are so afraid to stand up for what they actually believe in. They would rather subscribe to groupthink so that they are part of the tribe. And I get it, evolutionarily, we are part of a tribe and we had to be part of a tribe to survive. But right now, what I think is really cool and sexy is saying what you actually think. And in order to understand what you actually think, it does take some digesting of information. And another, I think, important part that we need to understand is that we are heading into a world of AI where it is predicting how people, based on what's going on right now, are going to react to certain political topics, certain global issues. globalization topics, you name it, AI is going to be predicting stuff. And Elon just did a talk about this and he said, Google Gemini AI is pandering to political correctness. And so that is so... We are moving in... I don't think all AI is bad, but I think we're moving into what potentially could be a very dangerous time where political correctness becomes the norm when there are so many things that are politically incorrect that are actually hurting us and hurting our country. And so we must think for ourselves. And I think the first thing that we need to talk about is a gut check. And... This is what I want to say about this. I want to give an example. Let's say someone says something that you have not yet formed an opinion on, or maybe you do have an opinion on it. Maybe it's a strong one, but there's something about it that just isn't sitting right. You do a gut check and you go, does this resonate as truth to me? That's one of my favorite questions to ask myself. Does this resonate as truth? Is this really what's going on? Do you have anything to add to that?

Sam

Yeah, I think we're talking about the process. So the first step in the process is at your core level, because there's a book written a while back. I forget what it was called, but it was like Snap Judgments or Scratches. snap thinking or whatever it is. And it talks about your gut response or your intuition is right like 95% of the time. Before you put it through a filter, before you put it through what is the world telling you or what is media or social media or influencers or celebrities or politicians before... You take their word as gospel. What is your core intuition

Jaclyn

telling you? And spoiler, celebrities are not smarter than you are. Politicians are not necessarily smarter than you are. So we don't need to take their word or take their opinions and adopt them as our own.

Sam

Well, in most cases, they're the most out-of-touch people with reality for the company. the common person, reality of the common person. But they are... They have a platform. They are incentivized. They are incentivized to manipulate.

Voiceover

Yeah, absolutely. Whether

Sam

they even recognize... Politicians, I'm 100% recognize it. But whether celebrity... I think some celebrities are just... as easily influenced as anybody else. But you have to understand that they are incentivized to parrot whatever popular stance is there and whatever is considered acceptable. So to just take that and take that as gospel is just foolish. It's foolish. So I think that that first step, what does my gut say? And really taking a minute to listen to yourself and is the most important thing just to create that space between what are you being told and what do I actually think. Like if everybody would just do that, I think we'd be in such a better position. But yeah, so okay. So you've done your gut check. You've taken the information. You've taken a minute to process and understand how you feel about it. Then what's the next step?

Jaclyn

I think you do your research, right? You do your research. When I was in high school, I was part of Model UN. Again, like very nerdy, geeky, Jaclyn, Model UN. But something that I think is absolutely priceless is that when I was arguing on behalf of a country, let's say it was France, I had to know on these very specific points What France believed, but also have a very good understanding of what other countries believed. Because when I was at the Model UN Convention, I had to understand where Denmark was coming from and where the Netherlands was coming from and where the USA was coming from and where China was coming from and still be able to create a... influential and concise point on behalf of France. And in order to do that, you have to know what the other side is thinking. It's also more effective if you want to slam dunk the point to really know what they're thinking and be one step ahead of them. Does that make sense? And you become one step ahead of them by understanding where they're coming from.

Sam

Yeah. So understanding... understanding all the perspectives, all the important perspectives in the situation or the topic or whatever it is, and having that openness to doing so. Yeah, to

Jaclyn

explore counterpoints.

Sam

Right, right.

Jaclyn

Yeah.

Sam

Yeah, because if you don't take that time to... take other perspectives into account, you are siloed and easily influenced and brainwashed if you can't even understand why someone else would. And so I think a simple way of putting it is how could you argue the other side? Like if this is your opinion, try arguing the other side of the topic.

Jaclyn

Yeah, I think that's very effective. And fully understanding why they think that too.

Sam

So, okay. Can

Jaclyn

I add one more thing to that? Of course. generally both sides of the argument, you want to read something like the Wall Street Journal that is a little less politicized. So when you're doing your research, make sure that you are taking information from different resources and not just ones that lean the way you want them to lean.

Sam

Right. Seek out differing opinions. And that's why podcasts are so powerful. Just becoming more and more powerful is because they allow long-form conversation versus... Fox News or CNN or whatever it is where they have 60 seconds to summarize something that's as complicated as Israel and Palestine. I forget what podcast I was listening to, but they were referencing another series podcast on the history of Israel and Palestine and They said, if you really want to understand the history, you should listen to this. And the series was something like this. 36 hours long

Jaclyn

yeah

Sam

and i'm surprised it's not even longer all the details but

Jaclyn

because israel has been around since almost since the beginning of time

Sam

yeah

Jaclyn

since humans started taking over the earth since history started being recorded there has been conflict in that region this is not something that just started in the last year this has been going on for decades

Sam

we want we Because we are lazy and we only have so much capacity. We want to simplify. There is comfort in feeling like you know what you think, certainly. Makes

Jaclyn

the world palatable.

Sam

Most things like that can't be simplified because they just are not. Yeah. So at any rate, I think so... You've done your research. You've looked for different resources. Obviously, they have to be trustworthy resources that aren't bent one way or another for political gain or financial gain or whatever it is. So you've done your research. Now, what do you do?

Jaclyn

You do another gut check.

Sam

Right.

Jaclyn

Yeah, and you go, what resonates as truth to me now? Now that I have this information, now that I have a good understanding of what both sides of the argument are saying, how do I really feel about it? And then the next thing that I think you can do, this is what I wrote, is read books to expand your mind. And this is not only books about that topic, although I think that that's a helpful thing. This is reading books in general. If someone were to ask me, how do you grow and grow quickly? The number one thing I would say is read books, right? Find anything that interests you and dive deeply. Sam can tell you I have been an avid reader since the day he met me, and it has expanded my mind tenfold. There are places on earth that I feel like I've been to because I've read books about them, but I've never set foot in them physically. There are topics that I know... maybe a general amount of information on that I have never experienced because I've read books on the topic. And what it does, what reading does is it expands your mind in a way that you start to think differently. You start to process information differently. You start seeing different perspectives. You start seeing how and why people think certain things or how and why you think something. And that happens because your mind is being challenged. And the more Yeah. And so you are

Sam

just exposed to, you're just, you're just exposing your, yourself to so much more. And I like the thought of reading a book, um, Because say you read a book on thermodynamics, you know, whoever wrote that book on thermodynamics is taking probably a 30, 40-year career and condensing it down into a 200, 300-page book that you can now have access to all of their knowledge, you know, within... number of days reading through that. So it condenses, it just, it's a, it's a, it condenses expertise and condenses information. And it's a cheat code.

Jaclyn

Yeah, it is a cheat code. So number one, gut check. Number two, do your own research and gut check again. Number three, read books to expand your mind. That's my favorite one. And then number four, ask questions and be real about how people answer you. Is it an intelligent answer based in fact, or is it all based on opinions from someone's feedback loop? This is also why doing your own research is so important. So you have an understanding of the real issues at hand and factually based information.

Sam

Debate is so important and the ability to debate and have conversations with people of an opposing view. And I think an ability to do that If you're unable to do that and you're so attached to your ideology, that should tell you something right there that you are basing your opinions on your ego more so. Yeah, it's

Jaclyn

become part of your identity.

Sam

Actually forming an educated opinion. Yeah,

Jaclyn

and if you aren't changing your opinion, fairly regularly about things, as you gain more information on different topics, I would challenge you and ask you why. Why are you so attached to that opinion? Is it because it's part of a political party? Is it because it's part of a religious system that you are attached to? And I think it is so sexy and so cool to be able to change your opinion based on fact.

Sam

Right. Circumstances change. Information is uncovered or discovered. And there should always be a level of openness. It doesn't mean you can't be passionate about something. I love to be

Jaclyn

fiery about things.

Sam

That you truly believe in and really put yourself behind it. But there always has to be an openness of, if there is a different point of view, more information or a better point of view, and a willingness to adapt to that. So not identifying with your beliefs 100% I think is really important. And like you said, that's why doing that gut check-in continuously throughout the process is so important.

Jaclyn

And I have to commend you. I feel like when we... debate people because we love having deep conversations about faith and politics and all of the hot button topics, right? We like to have those conversations, you and I, and then we also enjoy having those kinds of conversations with our friends and with our family. And we have a lot of differing opinions within our circles, right? And you are really good at not being attached to to your opinion. Do you know what I'm saying? It's not really part of your identity until you have really done research on something and then you have no problem standing up for what you believe in. But you tend to be much more calm in a debate where I am a lot more like my dad, who is a lawyer, and I'm a little bit more aggressive.

Sam

Well, I think that was one of the things that originally attracted to me attracted me to you so much was that you were so like opinionated and you weren't afraid to basically give it to somebody if they you know if they if there was an opportunity for a debate or conversation or whatever and you you truly believed what you felt or yeah you truly believe what you thought and I thought that that was very attractive because that's the opposite of me like I like you said, am not super attached to beliefs. And sometimes it's really hard to be that way because you want to just know what you believe. But I've always just had an openness to more information, to other perspectives that I would prefer to hear a new perspective that would can sway what I currently believe. Do you know what I mean? Sure, yeah.

Jaclyn

And I love hearing other perspectives too.

Sam

Because I feel like it ultimately, it's like questioning your faith. If you've never questioned your faith, then are you truly faithful? Because you haven't asked any questions. You haven't gotten any answers that actually satisfy you. You've got to chew on it. So I think that's what I'm always just open to searching for answers answers that are going to really solidify what I believe. And then ultimately, once I do believe something, I feel like I have a stronger basis for that.

Jaclyn

You do. And you stand firm in it like an oak tree. You do. You really do. Okay. So I think the next thing is after you ask questions and you're real about the answers that people give you, like, is this an answer based in fact, or is this just group think? And you analyze that. be capable of explaining your own viewpoint. I think this is so, so important. Gut check, do your own research, gut check again, read books, ask questions, be capable of explaining your own viewpoint.

Sam

And this is another one of those things that, back to what I was saying, what really caught my attention with you from this perspective w as you are the daughter of a lawyer, so I know that that's part of it, but your ability... T

Jaclyn

That's why you were attracted to me? I didn't have any money.

Sam

Yeah, I was trying to get a sugar mama.

Sam

Sam

Yeah, eventually. But you had a really innate ability to communicate your point of view in a very... concise way. And I have always looked up to that and valued that a great deal. So what's your trick? I feel like you have a couple tricks up your sleeve on how you go about that.

Jaclyn

Well, I think in threes. Three is my favorite number. But when I am thinking about a topic and I feel like I am going to defend myself in a debate, I think of three points that I can make in favor of what I believe. And that makes it very digestible to be able to go, hey, here's how I feel about, and I'm just going to name hot button topics. I'm not going to say what I believe about them at this point, but here's what I think about abortion and the three reasons why I think what I think. Here's what I think about global warming and the three reasons I think why what I think. why I think. Here is what I feel about RFK and the three reasons why I feel that way. And then you can go deeper and deeper and you can go, okay, here's reason number one. Here are three things about reason number one. But it's to me when you're debating something or you're standing up for what you believe in, you have to have facts to back that up. It can't all be based on emotion. Emotion isn't a bad thing and passion about something is a wonderful thing, but there also has to be roots in fact. You need to have your feet on the ground. And so I think thinking in threes is a very easy way to make doing that digestible and make bringing your point across more effective. Because when you drone on and on and on and on and on, you lose people. But if you say, hey, here's this, here's this, here's this, bam, I'm done. It's a very effective, powerful way. I think being raised by a lawyer, my uncle is a lawyer too. We used to have debates around the dinner table. That helped me. But really, I think what has helped me the most is reading. I read so much and I challenge my mind so much that I'm able to form opinions because I've already put it through a giant sieve of information, a giant sieve of beliefs that I already have, moral beliefs. And so it's easy to come up with those three, like, this is what I think.

Sam

Yeah. And so the flip side of that is, The flip side of having those three bullet points to make your case, basically, is when someone asks you a very broad question. What is your take on, again, Israel-Palestine? What is your take on abortion? What is this and what is that? I think what can make it difficult is a lot of times is when someone asks a broad question, when you try to answer a broad question. And that's just, you're trying to, there's so many different aspects of that question that you're just not going to be able to summarize in a conversation.

Jaclyn

No, nor should you.

Sam

And so a better way to go about that is when you're asked a broad question is to answer that with the question and basically one that narrows down what that person wants to know. What specifically about abortion do you want to know my stance on? What specifically about presidential campaigns or whatever it is, these very broad topics Having that – forcing that person to carve down what they're asking you before you even attempt to try to answer it really simplifies and puts you in a position to where you're not just – they're not – I feel like answering a broad question like that is like them just putting up – 300-pound sack on your back and telling you to lug it up a mountain. It's not a possible task.

Jaclyn

Be more specific. Yeah, I completely agree with you. And I think that in relation to all of this, it's important to note that Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. with a full heart and an open heart, say what you believe and let it sit on the table between the two of you. You know what I mean? Yeah. Let go. Let go. I feel like I was going to say one more thing about that, but I don't remember. It was about arguing and debating. Oh, I remember what it is. If you don't know the answer to a question, don't be afraid to say, you know what? I don't know enough information about this to have an educated opinion. And I have said that many times. My dad and I have a lot of conversations about legal things and political things and a lot of hot-button topics, and we'll ask each other questions. And there have been many times both of us have said, you know what, I just don't have enough information on that to have an intelligent opinion

Sam

or an educated opinion. Yeah, nothing makes you look worse than... Pretending like you know what you're talking about when you have absolutely no clue. I mean, just look at our politicians.

Jaclyn

Yeah, yeah. It's okay to not know everything. None of us know everything.

Sam

Yeah.

Jaclyn

Okay, what's the last thing?

Sam

So the last bullet point is aligning your values. So once you've gone through this process, you know how you initially feel about something, you've taken the time to do the research, expose yourself to information and other perspectives, you've had conversations, you've asked other people questions, and you are able to form relationships your belief, you're able to argue your belief, you're able to communicate that. The last thing we have on here, and I think this is, it's last on the list, but it's, I would say, this would be sprinkled. Extremely important. And it would be sprinkled throughout the entire process, is aligning your beliefs with your values. Yeah. Or aligning your perspectives, because I know beliefs and values tend to be the same thing, but aligning your perspective on certain topics with your values being extremely important because ultimately that's going to solidify and be your compass that guides you in the process.

Jaclyn

Absolutely. Our values, if we don't have a moral compass, we are lost in the world. I will say that to the day that I die. And I feel like our current cultural climate is trying to remove people's moral compass. Some of the things that are happening, I think, are really good and it's moving culture forward. And then some of it, I think, is just trying to strip us of a moral compass. And like we said, keep us stupid. It wants us to be stupid. I don't have anything to add to that. I think I want to end with a question, though. Is that okay with you?

Sam

Do you have a question? Okay.

Jaclyn

I do. Yeah. Are you willing to do the work to form your own opinion? Whether it's on something small or a hot button topic that could get you into a little heat in society. Are you willing to do the work to form your own opinion? All right. Thanks, guys. We'll see you next Tuesday. Thank you so much for listening to The Freak Show with Sam Thurmond and me, Jaclyn Steele Thurmond. We would love to connect with you via our website, beckonliving.com and on social media.

Sam

You can find us on Instagram and TikTok @ Beckon Living, and you can join our email list to receive uplifting messages, podcast and business updates, and discounts on high-frequency products just for our freqy community. Cheers to high-frequency living.