327. Mix Engineer Brian Frost On Corporate Events

In Episode 327, the hosts welcome Brian Frost, a Salt Lake City-based/nationally working sound engineer specializing in executive keynotes, product launches, press events, and conferences, to discuss front of house vs streaming mixes, why corporate events today end up needing so many mixes to run smoothly, and much more. This episode is sponsored by Allen & Heath and RCF.

A recent contributor to Live Sound International magazine/ProSoundWeb, Brian has been sharing some killer insights into the world of high-end corporate audio on his blog and the magazine lately, and, along with Sean and Andy, he dug into those topics in this conversation. Particularly if you work corporate events of any scale, this is an episode not to miss — there’s so much great, hard-learned info that Brian has to share!

Episode Links:
Brian Frost’s Blog
“The Quiet Signs: A Look At How To Determine When It’s Time To Upgrade Your Console,” by Brian Frost
Episode 327 Transcript

NOTE: Mike Green, the artist who performs “Break Free” that opens every episode, has released a new album — Hang The Moon: Part One — available on all streaming platforms as well as DSPs that support spatial audio. Mikegreenmusic.com will direct folks to the vinyl release or allow them to purchase digitally. And, Mike is hitting the road with Whitney Tai for “The Record Store Tour” starting May 23 in New Orleans. Find out more here.

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The Signal To Noise Podcast on ProSoundWeb is co-hosted by pro audio veterans Andy Leviss and Sean Walker.

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Transcript

Episode 327 - Brian Frost

Note: This is an automatically generated transcript, so there might be mistakes--if you have any notes or feedback on it, please send them to us at signal2noise@prosoundweb.com so we can improve the transcripts for those who use them!

Voiceover: You’re listening to Signal to Noise, part of the ProSoundWeb podcast network, proudly brought to you this week by the following sponsors:

Allen & Heath, whose new dLive RackUltra FX upgrade levels up your console with 8 next-generation FX racks – putting powerful tools like vocal tuning, harmonizing, and amp simulation right at your fingertips. Learn more at allen-heath.com 

RCF and TT+ AUDIO.... Delivering premium audio solutions designed for tour sound and music professionals for over 75 years.  Visit RCF at RCF-USA.com for the latest news and product information.

Music: “Break Free” by Mike Green

[00:00:58] Andy Leviss: Hey, welcome to another episode of Signal to Noise. I'm your host, Andy Leviss. With me is always my lovely co-host, the Fountain to my Bellagio, Mr. Sean Walker. What's up, Sean?

[00:01:08] Sean Walker: So buddy, how are ya?

[00:01:10] Andy Leviss: Good. So if, if folks

[00:01:11] Sean Walker: fountain?

[00:01:12] Andy Leviss: I, I, because, because you're spraying all over, I don't know, man.

[00:01:17] Sean Walker: Retake. Do that again.

[00:01:18] Andy Leviss: The, Nope, nope. You're stuck with it.

[00:01:23] Sean Walker: How's your week, bud? How's things.

[00:01:24] Andy Leviss: it's good. You know, it's, it's a little, little, little hectic. There's some days, some days in the support world that are nice and calm and some days that are nice and hectic and, uh, but getting through it and here we are. Um, but yeah, so, so I don't know. I ki I kind of, 'cause I know, so you, you and I are both on kinda short, short, uh, timelines tonight.

So I don't wanna, I don't wanna banter too much and I just kind of wanna introduce our guests 'cause this is somebody like, like I've known his name like in passing for a while. Like we met up at, we met up at, uh, at NAMM NAMM briefly. We were talk and then friend of the podcast, Brian Maddox is also a mutual friend.

And like a little while back on Facebook, Brian was like, Hey, here's a friend of mine who says a lot of things I'm thinking and words that like, I could never come up with. Like, check out this dude's new blog that he just started in this blog post

[00:02:12] Sean Walker: Like this is the guy that talks all the shit. I wish I could talk, but I'm way too nice to do it. Is that what you're saying? I already like

[00:02:16] Andy Leviss: so like, yeah, the last couple months, like, like, uh, our, our guest Brian Frost has been, uh, blogging a lot about like, doing like corporate audio and stuff like that. And I was like, yeah, no, this is a smart dude. Like he thinks the, the, the way like we like to think and is kinda doing a really good job of explaining like how hiring corporate works to, to folks who may not be used to that.

And I was like, we gotta get 'em on and get 'em to hang. So, uh, thanks for coming on and hanging. Brian, what's going on?

[00:02:42] Brian Frost: Hey guys. Thanks for having me. Uh, really flattered to be invited, so

[00:02:47] Sean Walker: Heck yeah, dude.

[00:02:48] Brian Frost: right on.

[00:02:49] Andy Leviss: So, uh, yeah, I mean, I guess we should start, 'cause like, I mean, you, do you, you work pretty exclusively in, in the corporate market these days? Or, or like it.

[00:02:58] Brian Frost: Yeah, I would say, I mean, I could, you know, we can get into my roots, but I would say 98% of the work I do now is all corporate.

[00:03:06] Andy Leviss: Well, that, that was kind, that was kind of where I was starting to go with this is like, is is somebody who do, has ended up mostly in that market. Like, why don't we say like, how, 'cause I don't think that's anything anybody goes to. Like, I don't think anybody is like, you know, a kid is going to like, you know, big like, you know, annual general meetings and be like, I wanna do this man.

So, so like, what's it like,

[00:03:26] Sean Walker: Nobody. Nobody went and did that. Nobody was like, I can't wait to be general session a one for my whole career

[00:03:31] Andy Leviss: I mean, I feel like that is, that is a single question version of a psychopath test

Right. there.

[00:03:35] Brian Frost: Yeah. After I get outta full sail, I really, really wanna work in ballroom seven of the Marriott

[00:03:40] Sean Walker: Yeah.

[00:03:41] Brian Frost: like Cleveland. That's, that's what I want to do.

[00:03:45] Andy Leviss: So, uh,

[00:03:46] Sean Walker: Same crappy Buds box, lunch sandwich for the rest of my life.

[00:03:50] Brian Frost: Oh God. I know him too. All too well, unfortunately.

[00:03:55] Andy Leviss: So, so yeah. So how, how, how did you, how did you end up there?

[00:03:59] Brian Frost: Uh, well, I mean, similar journey to probably a lot of folks. Um, you know, I started off in music, um, you know, I, uh, I started DJing in, I don't know, late nineties. Got into

[00:04:12] Sean Walker: it. I'm out. We,

[00:04:13] Brian Frost: yeah, here we go. DJ's done

[00:04:15] Sean Walker: yet.

[00:04:16] Brian Frost: limiter. You're redlining. Get somebody, tell this guy to turn it down. Yeah, a a hundred percent.

[00:04:20] Andy Leviss: we'll, we'll get into it later maybe, but I feel, I feel like having a background in DJing makes for some of the best corporate A ones, 'cause it's one of those like, like overlooked aspects of being a corporate. A one is, is having that DJ sense, but we'll, we'll get back to that.

[00:04:34] Brian Frost: Sure. Um, so yeah. Anyway, uh, late nineties, got into that, um, drum bass DJ in the EDM scene. Started throwing my own club nights, um, eventually, you know, bought a small little sound system. I think I had a, a pair of double ev like rat first speakers and, uh, bought some used double eighteens off a buddy and, you know, was turn it up around town.

I was 22 years old, like providing sound for little raves here and there. And, um, yeah, eventually. You know, was, uh, would have to always hire like, you know, a flyer guy, a lighting guy, and a sound guy. And I'm like, I gotta start cutting out some of these middlemen. And so I would start helping the sound guy and, you know, eventually picked up a couple things, just enough to be dangerous.

And, um, from there, um, I got my first job in, I guess corporate av, a little mobile AV vendor in the Sacramento area. Um, was kind of mediocre at that. I did that for like, maybe, I don't know, eight or nine months. Uh, from there I did as most people do, and I guess that end up where I'm at and I start working for PSAV and I did that for, I don't know, maybe a year or two.

And, uh, eventually, um, became the lead tech at my property and. You know, on big shows we would have extra labor come in. And where I was at in San Francisco, that was I oi local 16, uh, big shout out to I oi local 16. Um, and we'd have 20, 30 guys on site and you know, I'd be like, okay, you guys are gonna go set up, you know, these 11 rooms.

Here's two Mackey's a Mackey 1604, an lectern mic. Go set it up, I'll check on you. You know, I'd go in there and, you know, they'd be younger kids than me, probably people that were just overhired and they wouldn't really know what they were doing. Um, and then I, you know, I was like, all right, I'm gonna help everyone out.

And then, you know, I think I was, uh, during break time over here, two of the guys talking and they're like, how much are we getting on this one? I'm like, I don't know, like 29 bucks an hour. I'm like, holy crap, you guys are making 29 bucks an hour. And, you know, I was making like 11 bucks an hour. And this was, I don't know, like 2002.

I'm like, I, there's a union for this. I'm like, how do I get in on this gravy train? Um, so I ended up going down to the union hall like the same week, and they're like, oh, we love picking off PSAV guys. Like, come on in the, you know, the pond is, is nice and, uh. You know, from there, um, you know, I was a union guy for, you know, die hard, long time.

Um, I started in the trenches and straight into corporate work. Um, I would say originally I started off. You know, uh, doing small breakout rooms, uh, again, I'll reference the Mackey 1604. Uh, cut my teeth on that thing. You know, if I was really lucky, uh, I would end up on, what was it? The, the Midas veronas, the little purple analog minuses.

And I, you know, if it was really going good, I would end up with an outboard, like Clark Technic eq, and I was, I was bawling. I was, oh man, that was, that was the pee's knees if you were doing corporate in like, you know, early two thousands. Um, so yeah, I was, I was doing that for a while and then eventually got noticed by the big dogs and the local that were doing the big keynotes, and they're like, Hey, this kid is, kind of knows what he's doing.

We should, we should bring him on. And, you know, we'll, we'll put him through his paces and see what he knows. So. Uh, I kind of transitioned from being, you know, the brand new guy, doing the small breakout rooms to being like the very bottom man on the totem pole at the big keynotes. And, you know, I'd be the guy to, you know, Hey Frost, we need you to run this snake in the pit underneath, like, you know, from front of house to backstage.

It's kind of cobwebs under there and it's pretty short, but go do it kid. We believe in you. And so,

[00:08:45] Sean Walker: And don't mention the glitter and dried beer too,

[00:08:47] Brian Frost: Yeah, a hundred percent. So, you know, I'd be pulling this like big 64 pair of copper over my shoulder, like, you know, schlepping hard and, or it'd be like, go up in the grid. We need you to wire up all these, you know, E-A-W-K-F six fifties and, you know, point 'em at people and you know, it's like 60 feet up looking through the suspension grid and it's like, okay.

[00:09:10] Sean Walker: No problem, boss. I'm on it.

[00:09:11] Brian Frost: yeah. Yeah. So, you know, did that and eventually, um, some people started believing in me and I started getting thrown my own gigs where I was the lead in the big keynote. Um, ran local reunion crews for a while, um, you know, uh, for raid into music for a while. I became the house head at, uh, bill Graham Civic Auditorium in San Francisco.

I don't know if you know that venue, but I was the house audio head there from 2009 to 13. Which in union speak, when you're a house head, um, at a venue, you're not really mixing per se. You're kind of just running local crews again, helping, getting the snake ran from front of house to back, uh, and most

[00:09:58] Sean Walker: I see a pattern for me

here. You're the

[00:10:00] Brian Frost: yeah. I'm the snake guy. A hundred percent. Most important thing is just make sure the entire squad of union guys are not standing around and making everybody look bad. Like, alright guys, I know there's nothing to do for probably about 30, 40 minutes. You three go take a break, you two go do something off in that corner, one of you stick with me.

So at least if there's no work, we're not all sitting on a road case like laughing loudly, like we're not doing anything, you know? Um. But, uh, yeah, did that, uh, till like, I don't know, 2013 or so. Um, and then I'd say right around that time is when I started getting offered bigger keynotes. Um, I think I remember like the Yamaha CL five being my first real big digital console, um, other than the, uh, pm five D at the time.

And yeah, I think I remember one of my, my first big shows was important to me. Um, I was at the Knob Hill Masonic Auditorium and I was filling in for the house guy who had, you know, had left, he was doing a rock show and, you know, for the first time I'm, you know, hitting cues on Q Lab and taking cues from a, you know, legit stage manager.

And, you know, I knew right from them like, ah, this is what I want to do. Like, this is great. Um, I had heard from friends who had, you know, been in the music forever doing touring and, you know, being a house set at that venue, I knew it's like, okay, get to the venue at seven or 8:00 AM dump the trucks, do the show, get it up by noon, then stay all night.

And by the time the show is over, you're lucky to have that truck packed up by like 1 30, 2 30 am. And then being on a bus to do that all over again the next day. A lot, you know? And then, you know, from my mentors that I learned from, um, through I Ozi, they're like, listen, you get good enough at this. Become a freelance engineer.

If you go on the road, you're gonna be put up usually in a nice hotel, air conditioning inside, you know, you set up your gear, it's gonna be up for like 5, 6, 8 days. You know, you don't have to immediately load up a truck right away and have it go away. Like, what? Isn't it nice to just come in that day, power up and push faders and, you know, it might be,

[00:12:23] Andy Leviss: mention the day rat?

[00:12:24] Brian Frost: yeah.

Yeah. I mean, you know, the content might not be as riveting. You might not get to brag that, you know, I did sound for Guns N Roses that night or whatever, but the.

[00:12:34] Andy Leviss: But I did once do a conference on riveting.

[00:12:38] Sean Walker: Right, totally. For, for $29 an hour.

[00:12:42] Brian Frost: Yeah.

[00:12:44] Sean Walker: By the way, you're hired at $29 an hour, like right now. Just get on a plane.

[00:12:47] Brian Frost: Oh, it was,

[00:12:48] Andy Leviss: Sean Inflation, inflation.

[00:12:50] Sean Walker: Oh, oh, oh. That was like a hundred years ago.

[00:12:52] Brian Frost: yeah, you can't believe how much or how life changing that is going from $11 an hour one day to 29 the next.

[00:12:59] Sean Walker: it is.

[00:12:59] Brian Frost: Oh, man. I, I was like

[00:13:01] Sean Walker: You were bawling outta control at that point. You,

[00:13:03] Brian Frost: Bawling outta

[00:13:04] Sean Walker: got a used Honda that ran in everything. Dude, you could eat lunch. It was great.

[00:13:09] Brian Frost: A hundred percent. So yeah, super thankful to be there. Um, you know, I owe a lot to I os E, got all my chops there. Um, you know, just played it cool, right? Like, you know, listening to you guys, uh, or some from the previous shows, um, referencing, uh, the book about being humble. Um, a lot listening to that and kind of listening to my own story in my head and saying, yeah, like I practiced a lot of that.

You know, like, keep your mouth shut, show up on time, you know, do everything everyone expects of you and then go the extra mile and never complain. Like if you can nail that and then on, you know, as a bonus, don't be socially awkward and be a good hang like Sean has been saying in other episodes. I mean, those are all the pieces to the puzzle right there.

[00:14:02] Sean Walker: Yep. was funny, I was, uh, chatting with a friend of mine yesterday and was like, you know, it's pretty interesting how like everybody's story is the same story. And he was like, what do you mean? I was like, literally everybody who's successful, this is the same story. I wasn't a dick, I was in the right place at the right time, and I earned that shit through the whole way.

And they were like, man, that is kind of everybody's time. Like, be cool, work hard, and it will all show up. It'll be fine, you know.

[00:14:32] Brian Frost: Yeah. I mean, there's so many people in our industry that are technically skilled, right?

[00:14:37] Sean Walker: Sure. Totally.

[00:14:38] Brian Frost: you know, but who can not be weird and weird out corporate clients and you know, be, this guy smells weird. He didn't, he didn't shower. Or he's wearing 25-year-old, faded black clothes and looks like, you know, a two bit stage hand.

Like, do we want him on show site talking to the client?

[00:14:58] Sean Walker: be human. Don't be a pirate. Step two.

[00:15:04] Brian Frost: A hundred

[00:15:04] Sean Walker: C step one. Oh my God. That's funny. That's awesome, dude. So now you're freelancing, ripping, flying all over the world.

[00:15:15] Brian Frost: Freelancing. Yep. Yep. Um, you know, I, I would say the big transition for me from primarily being, uh, you know, a union guy to the freelance world was right around the pandemic. Everything changed for me, you know?

[00:15:31] Sean Walker: every for everybody, man, that that was everybody.

[00:15:34] Brian Frost: I mean, previous to that, I had started freelancing. I would say maybe 60% of my work was local union, and it was ramping up to maybe 40% freelance, maybe 16, 17, 18, 19, around there.

And then, yeah, when the pandemic came, it, it all changed. Um, you know, for all the reasons that I'm sure everyone has gone over a hundred times. But, um, you know, when, if the rug gets pulled out from under your feet and you don't know if you're gonna be able to pay your mortgage next month, but then five, six months go by potentially without any work.

And I'm like, honey, we're, we haven't been evicted and we're still here if we can do this, like, why can't I just make a leap of faith and become a freelancer? I'm like, yeah, I, you know, I won't have that for sure, you know, calendar that I had been used to, but if we can make this hurdle, then I should just go for it.

And she encouraged me. Yeah.

[00:16:29] Sean Walker: That's awesome, dude. That's awesome. And then you proceeded to mix more video calls than you ever thought you'd mix in your life

[00:16:35] Brian Frost: Hundred percent.

[00:16:36] Sean Walker: 18 months.

[00:16:38] Brian Frost: Oh man, I felt so.

[00:16:39] Sean Walker: didn't, I didn't realize I was gonna be a baller broadcast video freaking teams mixer guy for 18 months out of nowhere, like the next day.

You know what I mean?

[00:16:49] Brian Frost: there were so many jobs where I was the A one, the comms guy, the A two and anything else you could throw at it. I mean, when you're in the studio and there's only like four people in there, it's like, you're everything guy. You're doing it all.

[00:17:02] Sean Walker: dude. A hundred percent.

[00:17:04] Brian Frost: But,

[00:17:05] Sean Walker: was, that was definitely crazy times. 'cause you were like, we were at Microsoft when we got that call, we were literally on campus and they were like, cool man. So, uh, something's going down to everybody out. And we were like, what? What do you mean show starts in like freaking 12 hours, dude?

And they were like, no, no, no. Pack this shit up. Get out. We're like, okay, cool. And then like, I don't know, 48 hours later, like, so we're gonna set up broadcast. Dude, you guys can mix that shit virtually. We're like, what?

[00:17:27] Brian Frost: Yeah, it was weird. I did some weird stuff during then I, I had a buddy who, uh, was in installs or worked for a company that had install division and he's like, Hey, I know the rate is less and it's not what we normally do, but if, if you're willing to put on a hard hat and steel toe boots, we're doing this install at a college music.

And I was like, okay, let's do it. And it was awesome. Did it for like, well it was awesome in that I had a paycheck. Um.

[00:17:54] Sean Walker: say,

[00:17:54] Andy Leviss: that's what got me through the pandemic.

[00:17:56] Sean Walker: I don't know how to do that, but this mort ain't gonna pay itself, so fuck yeah. I'll be there on Wednesday, bud. See you. You know

[00:18:00] Brian Frost: Yeah, that was my first experience in, uh, gelling up cable to pull it through conduit and Wow, that's not fun. Yeah.

[00:18:09] Sean Walker: right.

[00:18:10] Andy Leviss: see, I, I was like, I ended up in the slightly nerdier side of the install world when I was there, so I didn't have to do too much of, I still had to do the hard hat and like purchase my laptop on a, on an overturned, you know, five gallon bucket in the middle of a construction zone to like commission stuff.

[00:18:23] Brian Frost: Right.

[00:18:24] Andy Leviss: but yeah, that's like, I've, I've told the story before, like I, it was, I mean, it was February of 2020, so it was like a month before the pandemic. I was this close to saying no to an installs job. 'cause I was like, oh man, I don't know if I wanna like, and they gave me just enough flexibility to do other shows that I was like, okay, let's see how it goes.

And then like a month later, like everything else went away and I was like, oh my God. Thank God I.

[00:18:46] Brian Frost: Yeah, totally. I was super thankful and eventually they realized, they're like, okay, he's just not some guy in a hard hat. And I got to, uh, tune like 10 little, uh, self-starter studios with that were running on sys, brought out my smart rig, and they're like, okay, you, you, uh, you know, come away from pulling the cable.

You can go do that. I was like,

[00:19:08] Sean Walker: yes,

[00:19:09] Brian Frost: yes, I'll go do that.

[00:19:12] Sean Walker: 'cause this cable gel's getting weird. My wife's wondering if I've been someplace else, still at work all day and I don't know, like I, I gotta figure something else.

[00:19:19] Brian Frost: I, I give credit to those guys too, though. I mean, I ended up losing like 20 pounds over those four months. 'cause construction guys are not allowed to sit down. I'll tell you that right now. You get, you get yelled at. Um, yeah. Yeah. Um.

[00:19:34] Andy Leviss: yelled, barked, uh, whatever, whatever description we want to use.

[00:19:39] Sean Walker: Yeah, yield's a good description. That, that, that's what's up. Alright, so

[00:19:42] Andy Leviss: may. Maybe the barking is more New York thing.

[00:19:45] Sean Walker: There you go. So now you're freelancing pandemic's over, you're totally ripping corporate shows. And the thing that I've been waiting for is, and now you're talking shit on the internet. Tell me all about it. I'm here for the shit. Talking on the internet part bud.

[00:20:00] Brian Frost: Here for the shit talking. All right. Uh, well, okay. Fast forward, fast forward. Uh, yeah. I start gigging around and yeah, it was again, uh, referring back to this leap of faith. It was like, okay, I'm changing my whole dynamic. And honestly like, you know, not gonna lie. Like part of it was like I need to somehow organically market myself that isn't like, you know, a blatant Facebook post of here's my front of house and then I'm traveling to this city.

'cause I feel like, you know, I still do that and everybody does that, but I feel like I needed something more to engage people to, you know, get people to maybe come check out my side or read about what I do. And I thought, you know what I'm always interested is like learning and I love when people, you know, tell stories that are also have technical, you know, influences or background.

That's something that keeps me engaged. So I was like, you know, I've got tons of stories and things that like. I tell people on show site, like, you know, always have conversations and we'd get into it, but I was like, what if I, what if I put this on a blog on my site and then posted a link to blogs and tried to like, engage with people?

And I was like, eh, what, what, what do I have to lose? You know, I was, I had fun in creative writing class in, in high school, so I was like, all right, I'm gonna start writing. Um, and sent the first one out and yeah, I got some traction, so I just, I, I kept going, I guess.

[00:21:30] Andy Leviss: Yeah, well listen, you've got like three or four now and like, I think though, one of them just, just ended up in the print edition of Live Sound, right?

[00:21:38] Brian Frost: Right. Um.

[00:21:39] Andy Leviss: So, so you're, you're officially a part of the whole Live Sound ProSoundWeb family now too.

[00:21:44] Brian Frost: Yeah, which is awesome. I mean, you know, it's funny, uh, when you asked me to come on the show, I referenced, uh, or remembered back when from you first kind of like dropped a little hint of it. I think I was, you know, talking shit on Facebook or something on a post and something like, uh, you know, I've been listening to your show, like, great job guys.

And you said something like, you know, if you ever want to be on the other side of the looking glass and come check it out, please do. And I was like, I was like, oh my God. I'd have to practice sounding super smart before I came on because, and then, and exactly, you chime in. Well, that hasn't stopped us. And I started laughing.

I was like, all right, fine. Um, that sounds cool. You guys sound like guys I'd hang out with, you know, during work and after work. So why not?

[00:22:33] Andy Leviss: Well, I, I dig it in and like, I think I said on, on LinkedIn when you posted. I'm like, if you're doing the, the barista championships, I'm like, we got, we gotta hang on that gig at some point. That's like that perfect van intersection of the kinda gig, the kinda gig I would get into trouble at.

[00:22:48] Brian Frost: Yeah, no, that was, uh, that one was a lot of fun. Um, and also of course wrote a blog about it. Check it out. Um, but uh, yeah, that was pretty technically challenging. I dunno if we could talk about that. Um.

[00:23:01] Andy Leviss: let's do it. Like, tell, so, I mean, a lot of folks are like, what the fuck is a barista championship?

[00:23:05] Brian Frost: Which is pretty much the same exact thing.

[00:23:08] Sean Walker: Oh my God.

[00:23:08] Andy Leviss: like me, me and and Ryan, John were like the two folks who like knew who were immediately like, oh shit. Yeah, that's, we know exactly who you were talking about. Like, we knew these people.

[00:23:17] Brian Frost: Uh, yeah. So, uh, I got hit up from, you know, a new client of mine said, Hey, we got this show for, for Starbucks. It's called, it's a Barista Challenge and Cord. I, well what is that? And he's like, well, it's gonna be this giant in the round, uh, you know, expo kind of slash show for Starbucks. Uh, you know, their main keynote was in an arena, uh, on the other side of town.

And this was, you know, a customer facing and, uh, internal people where, uh, they were gonna go attend this arena for 5,000 people in the round. And they were gonna set up basically a barista challenge where they would make coffee, right? So it'd be like, who could make the best cappuccino or, or the most, or the best cappuccino art or flavorful latte?

And they'd have two stages and they'd, you know, how exciting can making coffee be? I mean, I don't know.

[00:24:13] Sean Walker: when you volunteer to be the taste tester.

[00:24:15] Brian Frost: Right. Um, so, you know, they're trying to figure out ways to hype it up like a, a sports broadcast show, like, you know, okay, over on this stage, you know, Joe Smith is making his latte. Oh, oh, it's over steaming a little bit.

And like you could see his technique as he slowly rotates the cup and gets that perfect leaf. And, you know, we set up boundary mics around the espresso machine, it'd be hissing. And, you know, I'm trying to blend that in. And, um, most of the, uh, the competitors, uh, were foreign speaking so. Um, during production pre-pro and meeting, they were saying like, okay, well predominant crowd that is gonna be there is gonna be all English speaking as well as, you know, the, the audience they were targeting online.

So they were saying, um, we need to find a way to where we don't like totally squash the foreign is, but that we give prominence to, you know, English in the house and on the broadcast. And I was like, all right, well what if we did like some this auto broadcast duck kind of thing where, you know, say someone started speaking in Korean and they'd get maybe, I don't know, three or four words out, and then the translator would come in and start translating and, you know, the Korean speech would softly duck right under it as, uh, you know, the translator would speak, uh, the translator would then be piped, uh, via IFB into the competitor's ear so that, you know, uh, they could hear when the judges were talking back to them, what they were saying.

Um, there was also, yeah, judges on the stage. They'd also have all have IFPs. Uh, we had two like ringleader type hosts on handhelds. Um, and then also too, like, uh, hosts would run out into the house and, you know, find the barista's parents and be like, what do you think mom? Like how your daughter's doing great.

And they, you know, speak in their foreign language. It was just this huge translation game. Um.

[00:26:14] Sean Walker: how fun.

[00:26:15] Brian Frost: Yeah, it was, uh, it was a lot of fun, a lot of work. Uh, there was two stages going si, you know, A and b. So as soon as one was done, the next would go. I mean, backstage looked like a circus of, you know, nonstop people.

I think we had at least 24 RF on that show, probably another 24 Axio PSMs. Um, but it was great. Um, local support, uh, in Vegas from our RS audio, they were great. Uh, buddy Brent Dunn and Zach Larson, also great engineers, uh, really nailed that show. So, uh, client was happy. And you know, they said next time it comes around, they're giving us a call back.

So, hey, guess we didn't screw it up and enough to get invited back anyway.

[00:27:00] Andy Leviss: That, that's always the sign.

[00:27:02] Brian Frost: Yeah.

[00:27:03] Andy Leviss: And so I mean, that, that, that's, uh, that's what Sean and I do every week on this show is hope we didn't screw it up enough that we get invited back the next week.

[00:27:11] Brian Frost: Right.

[00:27:11] Sean Walker: I mean, I'm just trying not to say something so stupid they cancel me. You know what I mean?

[00:27:15] Brian Frost: Yeah, which

[00:27:17] Sean Walker: it hasn't happened

[00:27:18] Andy Leviss: every week.

[00:27:18] Brian Frost: It's just easy to do these days. Mine, those P's and Q's, right?

[00:27:23] Sean Walker: Right. I'm not, I'm not good at that. That's not a, that's not a specialty of mine.

[00:27:29] Andy Leviss: So, I mean, I don't know, Sean, if you have any, any questions on that or if not, we can dig into more so, 'cause I know there's, there's some stuff Brian's blogged about that I'd love to kinda get into and give.

[00:27:37] Sean Walker: Dude, let's go. Let's go into it.

[00:27:39] Andy Leviss: 'cause like I said, you, you did a really good job in a, in like a couple of the articles you've had up of kind of peeling back that curtain on like how, you know, these larger corporate events go and, you know, 'cause like a lot of the folks listening are like, you know, they're used to like a smaller keynote or, you know, breakout rooms and it's like the leap from that to like, when we're doing these, these large, you know, gss where, you know, like, I mean like, I think, I think it was like one of, uh, notwithstanding that barista article, I think it was your first article, was that one on kind of like outgrowing consoles and like digging into, you know, how, how quickly you can eat up so many different mixes for thing.

And obviously

[00:28:17] Brian Frost: Sure. Sure.

[00:28:18] Andy Leviss: that's on the blog. And we'll, we'll link to that in the show notes and that's what's in the magazine too. So I don't wanna, like, we don't necessarily read to rehash the whole thing, but I'd love to give folks a little bit of peek into that and that process and like how those shows work broadly and, and you know, your workflow on those and kind of give folks an idea of like.

Part of what makes corporate work a lot more interesting and challenging than folks necessarily think it is.

[00:28:40] Brian Frost: Uh, yeah, so, well, the name of my, uh, my blog that time was, uh, the Quiet Signs, like, you know, when it's time to Upgrade your console and, uh, to go back to the CL five. 'cause as a corporate guy, you, that's your workhorse. 90% of the time, that's what you're on. Or at least from 2010, 12, all the way up until at least the pandemic or so, right.

[00:29:05] Sean Walker: That was your weapon of choice for so many years, dude. Totally.

[00:29:07] Brian Frost: So, so many shows and you know, it was great. Um, you know, it served me well, uh, you know, learned how to master a digital console, uh, routing infrastructure, you know, grouping mics together and you know, really learning control and how to mix. Um, but yeah, as time went on and shows got more complex, it was always.

How can I do this, the least shitty way on this console, rather than, how can I set this up? So no matter what they throw at me, I'm already routed and ready, like show call. Like I need my mic to make an announcement in the foyer, you know, to call people back into the room and I need it with like 30 seconds notice.

And even if we had never talked about it, it's like, boom, I'm ready to go. And they, it's just like, I need it over there, but not in the house. Okay, no problem. Or

[00:30:04] Sean Walker: dude. That's how that rolls. Yeah, a hundred

[00:30:06] Brian Frost: yeah. Or you know, uh, you know, they're, they're setting up a translation backstage and it's like, boom, already got a bus for it and you know, or we need program to come.

It's like already have it. Having all those matrices, you know, it, it's demanding of the console. And if you were on a CL five, knowing that you only have eight matrices and you know, you, you know, mistakenly start assigning too many of those to the PA and realize, you know, an hour before rehearsals, all of a sudden you have to change your entire architecture because now you have to have like seven feeds leave the desk that you can't afford to be all pa.

So it's some of the signs like that where, all right, I need 20, 30, 40 mix buses and at least 12 matrices just to manage a normal corporate show these days.

[00:31:07] Sean Walker: Those two comments you just made are literally why people like us all get hired to do corporate shows. 'cause you're like, cool, this is a good place for a front end drive processor. 'cause I don't have the matrices anymore. And also you get your D rate 'cause you said, yep, no problem.

[00:31:25] Brian Frost: Right.

[00:31:25] Sean Walker: On a rock and roll show, you can be like, no man, or uh, this or that, like on a corporate show.

Yep, no problem. I'm on it. That's it. That's your only answer. It's the only choice you got, you know.

[00:31:33] Brian Frost: Yeah, I mean, at the end of the day, I mean, we're a service industry first. Audio and audio engineers, way second down the line,

[00:31:42] Sean Walker: percent.

[00:31:43] Brian Frost: you know?

[00:31:43] Sean Walker: percent. They can get fricking black or brown boxes anywhere in the world they brought you because you said, yep, no problem. I'll take care of it.

[00:31:50] Brian Frost: Yeah, well, I mean obviously you have to have the follow through and be able to, to make it all happen, um, with, with a smile, right? And a friendly nod. But, um, but yeah, just designing a workflow on a console with every routing option in mind is, I think, key. You know,

[00:32:11] Sean Walker: So instead of CL five, what's your, what's your platform or choice right now that gives you the tools you need to do?

[00:32:16] Brian Frost: Well, um, as a corporate guy, I live, die, and, uh, you know, breathe the Yamaha world. It's, you know, the gospel and doctrine, right? Um,

[00:32:25] Sean Walker: Totally

[00:32:26] Andy Leviss: I, I did not pay him to say that.

[00:32:29] Sean Walker: It's true. It's true though, dude. It's true. You don't have to pay it.

[00:32:32] Brian Frost: yeah, I mean, you get thrown at any show in any city or metro, and there's 20 cl fives available to rent in any market. Um, but my, my console of choice these days, I will say is, uh, I'm totally hip to the DM seven. Love it. Um, whenever, you know, the budget doesn't allow for a ravage, that's my other favorite guy to, to mix on.

Um, I'm a fan of the PM five. Uh, yeah, if the budget, you know, can't be justified for that, then I ask for the DM seven, and they're starting to show up in rental markets around, so they're not too hard to get, you know.

[00:33:11] Sean Walker: And there are a lot of firepower in a little itty bitty desk.

[00:33:14] Brian Frost: They are, they really are. Uh, what is it? It's 48 mixes, right? And,

[00:33:19] Sean Walker: I don't know off the top of my head,

[00:33:20] Brian Frost: and some like 12 matrices. Yeah.

[00:33:22] Sean Walker: what we all wish the CL five was.

[00:33:25] Brian Frost: Yeah, a hundred percent. Like if I had that thing back, you know, pre pandemic, ugh, so many shows would've saved me from pulling my hair out, you know? So yeah, it's, it's a great platform. Um, I love the flexibility and you know, what it can do.

Um, that's not to say that there isn't other comparable consoles out there that are just as good, but this is what I

[00:33:52] Sean Walker: the one you run into on

[00:33:53] Brian Frost: Yeah, totally. A hundred

[00:33:55] Sean Walker: you find Digi Co and Avid on music. You find Yamaha in corporate.

[00:33:59] Brian Frost: Yeah, and you know, Yamaha, Dante go hand in hand and native Dante just makes everything super easy. I mean, there's plenty of shows I do these days where literally the only analog or XLR on the show is the backup 58 coiled at the stage. The audience mics and maybe the lectern at most. Oh, and the, the VOG mic for the show call. And the rest, everything is just click and sub subscribe, right? So.

[00:34:31] Sean Walker: totally. Dude, that's awesome.

[00:34:33] Andy Leviss: and, and mentioning like the VOG and the show call is, that's one of the things I thought in like that particular article you did a great job of explaining for folks that we kinda, like, we were talking through like how we eat up mixes so fast. But like the thing that I think folks don't always realize is that a lot of those mixes is not just about like processing or balancing stuff and it's like, yeah, for like, you know, streaming or record mixes we're, you know, obviously like compressing it a lot more to get that loudness going that we need.

But a lot of what does it in, like I said, you explained really well and a lot of what makes the folks who are really good at this particular niche on the market, good at what they do is what you take out of different mixes. For example, like one of the things you talk about is like for the, for the show callers, VOG, or if there's a VO announcer, giving them a program mix that doesn't include their own mic, which, when you say it sounds really obvious, but when folks are just used to like, no, we just throw program out to everybody, you know, then suddenly you're either getting like feedback echoes or you've got a show call or sitting there having to remember.

To turn their own speaker off, you know, right away. And it's like we can take care of that for them. Um.

[00:35:38] Brian Frost: Yeah, a hundred percent. Um, yeah, a mix minus to front of house time delayed. You know, some show callers don't even know to really ask for that. You know, you put that in front of 'em and you turn it on and they're like, whoa. It, it's all time delayed. And my own voice isn't even coming out of it. Perfect.

Like,

[00:35:57] Sean Walker: They don't even know how to, they don't even know how to articulate that. It

[00:35:59] Andy Leviss: Yeah, sometimes they don't even know. They just know. Yeah, I was gonna say, they just know like when Brian's there, it's just it, it's easier. I don't know why. I don't know what he is doing different, but it's.

[00:36:08] Brian Frost: Yeah. Or another one that, you know, people don't think about that I do now in most shows is like the main video playback operator backstage, right? They're constantly running their stuff and testing it backstage, but how do they hear it unless they unplug the sound device and either let it play on their local laptop speakers or plug in their headphones and I'm like, oh, I'll just give you a pre fade mixed minus of yourself and you can, you know, cue your own stuff to your heart's content and, you know, not have to constantly, you know, disconnect your, your audio device.

So things like that, they're just like, oh, I didn't even know that was possible. I'm gonna ask this for the A one, like on every show now.

[00:36:49] Sean Walker: And then every in-house guy goes, what do you mean?

[00:36:54] Brian Frost: He did what? No, I can't give you reverb back in your own monitor that doesn't work.

[00:36:59] Andy Leviss: Like it's a 1642. There's only four and two.

[00:37:04] Brian Frost: Yeah. So yeah, just creative solutions like that, you know, I mean, they're small in the grand scheme of things, but you start adding 'em all up and, you know, they eat up mixes and, but they, they make the show happen, right?

[00:37:20] Andy Leviss: Yeah. Or like, I'm trying to think of like other examples of things like that. Or would we like, like, like streaming music and whether it's royalty free or if like, you know, if we're, you know, checking off the Bingo card and playing happy by Pharrell, like we might need to split that out so we can hear it in the room, but we can't let it go out to the stream and that kind of thing.

[00:37:37] Brian Frost: A hundred percent. And you know, to make it even more complicated, I've had scenarios where they want to hear Pharrell in the house, but they want, you know, the royalty free to go to the stream at the same exact time. So, you know, you're building, uh, redundant pipes in your Q lavs deck to where, let's say outputs one and two hit the house where three and four hit the stream and they all fire off the same go button.

So the one thing you do have to remember to do though, is during the, uh, the play on, you gotta duck the ambient mics to the stream so that they don't hear ambient Pharrell going out to, to YouTube, to then, you know, have the AI flag in NICU and you know, take you down. So it can get complicated pretty quick.

Um, yeah.

[00:38:29] Andy Leviss: and like, like getting nut nuts and bolts on that, is that, so are you riding those, those amb yourself or are you using any sort of like ducking and gating to do that sort of thing for you? Or like somewhere in between?

[00:38:39] Brian Frost: Um, I guess I've tried both scenarios. Um, you know, I guess it depends on my comfort level that day, or if it's just one time that that's gonna happen or not. But, uh, there's been plenty of times where, yeah, setting up an auto deck, like, you know, uh, if, you know, Q lab stream one and two are heard in the ducking mix, then, you know, duck audience mics, you know, create some logic like that, um, you know, otherwise, or do it the old fashioned way and just pull down some faders, wait for it to, to finish and then bring it up way after the song is done.

And, you know, it's a, it's a little dry to the, uh, stream, but better safe than sorry. Right.

[00:39:27] Sean Walker: Totally.

[00:39:29] Andy Leviss: That, uh, Sean's lips moving. I'm like, you're muted. You're muted.

[00:39:32] Sean Walker: No, I know that. I just forgot to hit the space bar.

[00:39:36] Andy Leviss: Um, yeah, I'll say, you know, it's funny 'cause I've, I I've, I've played with like, just while I'm thinking about like ducking the ambiance, Mike's a bunch before, and I'm trying to remember who I wanna say it was in the Discord, unless maybe it was on Facebook. Somebody the other day, you know, was, was calling out the, the trick that I think we all figure out at the point that we try that of like, we start ducking it and then suddenly it's like, well trying to get the like ratio of that in so that it's like, it comes in sounding naturally is like never happening.

And the trick I, I think we all eventually discover if we don't discard it, is double patching it. So you've got a set of ambiance mics that like kind of get ducked by programs. So just when there's nothing going on, they fill in a little bit so that the, the stream isn't dead. But then also having a second copy of it that you can then write up manually in between stuff when you need to.

[00:40:23] Brian Frost: Yeah, no, that's, uh, that's a smart way to go about things. Um, yeah, I think, uh, since we're on the topic of ambient mics, I think I remember scenarios where, you know, I didn't want to have to write it the whole time. I've got tons of stuff going on. I'm hitting cues. Um, you know, I think I did something like, uh, all laugh mics, like key to a duck mix.

And if anyone's on stage and starts talking, then you know, the ambient mics come down slightly so that, you know, they can get on top of it for the stream. Um, so that seems to work well, stuff like that. But, you know, I, I feel like most times at front of house more than anything, or the thing that eats up most of my time is just becoming a Q Lab dj, I mean.

You know, here's 37 VOS that we need to record. And you know, we, we told all the CCC C-suite executives that they were allowed to pick their own songs. And I was like, oh, we did. Okay. Um, that sounds good. Do we have all.

[00:41:25] Andy Leviss: got those songs on a drive, right?

[00:41:26] Brian Frost: But do you guys have all that media? Well, not really. And I was like, okay, great. Um, I will go and try to get as, as much as I can.

When, when does all this need to happen by? Well, we've got about 45 minutes and I'm like, okay, all right. Um, I'm gonna go start buying a bunch of songs on iTunes and start furiously editing. And then, you know, of course executives start emailing in like, oh, you know what? We changed our minds. Like, I don't want that song anymore.

I want this other song. And can you start it around 19 seconds? Oh, perfect. I have totally nothing going on right now. I would love to do that for you.

[00:42:05] Sean Walker: Hundred percent.

[00:42:06] Brian Frost: yeah, so

[00:42:07] Sean Walker: like I said before, of course I can.

[00:42:09] Brian Frost: of course I can.

[00:42:10] Sean Walker: Of course I can. And in your mind, you're going, fuck, fuck.

[00:42:15] Andy Leviss: Oh man, I, I was doing a, I was doing a, a gig a couple years ago with, I'm trying to, I think I know which a one it is, but I'm not gonna, I'm not gonna blow his shit up by naming him particularly. 'cause I'm not a hundred percent sure if I'm, I'm

[00:42:24] Sean Walker: I said I was sorry.

[00:42:26] Andy Leviss: know. But it was somebody who had, like, his, his stepdaughter was like working a little bit on a side hustle as a VO artist.

And so what he started doing was, instead of like having a like, you know, improv or like, I'm gonna have to go in his VA one and record Vos, he would just on a gig where he knew he was gonna have a lot of views, make sure she was available, pop her on to like either payroll on here or his invoice and he could just text over, Hey, record this and upload it for me real quick.

And I was like, you know, that's a solid business. Like if we got like two or three folks who could do that and just a whole bunch of us corporate a ones teamed up and just, we put them on a retainer and just, you're our, you know, on the fly VO person. Like that could be a baller little niche for a couple folks.

[00:43:05] Sean Walker: that would be totally gangster for somebody with a podcast studio that could just like had a face for radio, I mean a voice for radio. You know what I mean? That could do it for us.

[00:43:14] Brian Frost: Well that, uh, although

[00:43:15] Sean Walker: to a folder.

[00:43:16] Brian Frost: AI is coming for that job though, I would say that's the first audio job.

[00:43:21] Andy Leviss: I feel like the hardest part there is just learning how to like, prompt it both for pronunciation, especially for like pharmaceutical and, and, and, uh, VC company names. And like, the punctuation gets weird. Like I've, I've had such mixed results with it. Um, though it's getting about like 11 lavs particularly, but there's a couple others I

[00:43:39] Brian Frost: Exactly. That was gonna be the one I was gonna reference.

[00:43:42] Andy Leviss: I gotta, like, I, somewhere in my screenshots, I have somebody on threads recently posted that they basically got like frustrated with the, both the, the like rights and the costs of 11 lavs and, and, and started putting together an open source version that's supposedly pretty similar quality.

And I'm kind of curious to poke at that too.

[00:44:01] Brian Frost: Okay.

[00:44:02] Andy Leviss: yeah, like, I mean, I feel like we could almost do like a whole episode deep diving into just tricks to get, to get, uh, those AI voices to actually sound human.

[00:44:10] Brian Frost: Yeah, and don't get me wrong, I mean, if your entire show was consisting of like, you know, Jack Smith and John Doe, then you know, it's pretty good at handling that. But as soon as you get like five or six consonants, you know, in the last names, oh man, it's, it's over. Like it's better just to have a human.

[00:44:28] Andy Leviss: Uh, yeah, it's, it's funny, I was actually digging into our, the phone tree path that customers go through to get to support at, at my day gig in Yamaha the other day. And, you know, some, some of those are, you know, AI voice generated and it's fun looking in at, like, you see that, oh, somebody actually sat here and spent a little time figuring out how to get it to like, oh yeah, I guess if they type a ravage, the computer probably kept saying Ravage for a while, so they ended up smelling it as like, you know, RIV, you know, AJ or uj or whatever it was, and

[00:44:57] Brian Frost: phonetically spelling it out. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A hundred, a hundred percent. Yeah. That'd be a little, a little embarrassing. Hi, you've reached Yamaha. You want press two for Ravi?

[00:45:10] Sean Walker: Right, totally.

[00:45:13] Andy Leviss: I think my, my favorite was I was doing a theater show and I used, um, one of the Siri voices to just like, with an Apple script to spit out a bunch of, like output ident so I could fire through all the speakers in the rig real quick.

[00:45:24] Brian Frost: yeah,

[00:45:24] Andy Leviss: after a while we got bored and, and I figured out that you could download the, like alternate language, uh, uh, voices.

[00:45:31] Sean Walker: And so in Australia, she starts spitting out things.

[00:45:33] Andy Leviss: well, well, you, you get the Dutch voice, uh, doing English words and you end up with up left up. Right. And it's just, it's, it's fantastic.

[00:45:43] Brian Frost: Uh, you, you need to like, get in the, the Snoop Dogg voice or something like that. He is like, you know, I, I can't do a

[00:45:49] Andy Leviss: who's

[00:45:49] Brian Frost: impression, but.

[00:45:50] Andy Leviss: I'm trying to remember who the, who, the NBA

[00:45:52] Sean Walker: Upstage busy for my.

[00:45:54] Brian Frost: Yeah, got a little bit of drizzle on input six.

[00:45:59] Andy Leviss: For a while. Waze had, I'm trying to

[00:46:01] Sean Walker: in. Where's that voice package? I am in, dude.

[00:46:04] Andy Leviss: Yeah, well, who, who's the, it's, there's the NBA announcer with the really thick Slavic accent, and I'm totally blanking on his name right now, but he was like, it was probably like 10 years ago or so that like Waze put him out as a celebrity voice for a while, and it was just the best thing ever.

Having this like thickly, accented, NBA announcer, just like calling off your exits and turns on the highway.

[00:46:23] Brian Frost: right.

[00:46:23] Sean Walker: my God, that's great. No, I want, I want Snoop Dogg doing maps, dude. You know what I mean? Yo man, you take a left.

[00:46:32] Andy Leviss: he has to like, I feel like ways has to have done that at some point.

[00:46:35] Sean Walker: I did totally.

[00:46:36] Andy Leviss: Like either Snoop or Flava Flav, like, you know, one of them has definitely done it.

[00:46:40] Brian Frost: And then it would have to like, it would probably dis you if you like miss your turn. It's like, oh man, you just missed that.

[00:46:47] Sean Walker: Oh

[00:46:47] Brian Frost: around.

[00:46:49] Sean Walker: Come on. Fu

[00:46:51] Brian Frost: Too much fun.

[00:46:53] Sean Walker: Right. That'd be great. I, I'm into it

[00:46:55] Brian Frost: Nice.

[00:46:56] Andy Leviss: the most squirrel we've gotten on a while. Yeah.

[00:46:58] Brian Frost: Forgot. Yeah. We're doing a show here.

[00:47:00] Sean Walker: Squirrel. What are you, what are you working on now that you're excited about? What's, what's the next thing that you're like, dude, this is gonna be sweet.

[00:47:09] Brian Frost: Um,

[00:47:11] Sean Walker: Ballroom nine

[00:47:11] Brian Frost: yeah, really like, honestly I don't have a whole lot of bandwidth to think about that. I just think about like, okay, I gotta fill the calendar. I got five humans to take care of. I got a mortgage to pay, like I need, you know, week 3rd of May filled 'cause something canceled. So while it's really awesome to work on big, exciting shows that are technically challenging, like honestly I'm just an average working guy that needs that money to keep coming in.

'cause break.

[00:47:42] Sean Walker: Starbucks in an arena next week. Breakout tech number three, like

[00:47:45] Brian Frost: A hundred percent. Oh, dude,

[00:47:46] Sean Walker: the day rate, I'm there dog.

[00:47:48] Brian Frost: I have no shame whatsoever. And actually, um, I'm actually going on a three week, a two run right now. Um, one thing I will say is if you're trying to get into this game, learn all the jobs and learn them all well, 'cause dude coming up, uh, in this game, like, you know, only the oldest a ones with the long ponytails like got to mix, right?

It's like you could almost, you know, count people's experience by how long their ponytail was. Um, what was that, uh, that scene in Game of Thrones, like the, the doth racks, like they were, you know, the more battles they won, the longer their hair was. Same kind of thing. So I was like, how do I get on

[00:48:29] Sean Walker: Maddox has won all the battles then,

[00:48:31] Brian Frost: right?

Totally. A hundred percent.

[00:48:33] Andy Leviss: the beard and the Yeah.

[00:48:35] Brian Frost: So I'm like, how do I get on these really long shows where, you know, I can get paid? And I'm like, well, the old guy is at front of house 'cause they're not gonna let somebody as young as me out there. So what's the next like, best job I can learn really well. I'm like, okay, hey too.

Learn how to do mics really well or learn in it. Learn intercom. I mean, who's the first person on site that day and who's the very last person to leave Intercom? You can't do any kind of rehearsal or anything without comms. So, you know, learning calm is key. I always tell people if you, if you want to do something like learned calm like you, that would be very lucrative for you.

[00:49:17] Sean Walker: Totally

[00:49:18] Andy Leviss: everybody's best friend.

[00:49:19] Brian Frost: A hundred percent.

[00:49:20] Sean Walker: and the basics of calm, like with free speak or whatever, like it is not rocket science to learn. Like if you already know how to do most of the audio engineering stuff, learning to be a passable calm engineer is not like a huge undertaking. To be great at it is is different, right? That's another level.

But to like go rock 10 to 15 channels of free speak in a ballroom someplace and everybody thinks you're a genius. That is not like, now I need this whole other life set of skills for years of training. It's like, cool man, let me show you how to do this and let me show you a few tips and tricks and you'd be great and people think you're a wizard.

[00:49:52] Brian Frost: Yeah, and I mean, um, the, the stress factor or, you know, the level of hot seat, I guess is in reverse of being front house, right? Because as a comms guy, you know, your, your big moment is the first day of tech rehearsal when everybody puts on their headset for the first time. And, you know, 13 people start shouting at you for requests at the same time.

Or I can't hear, tell the teleprompter or our back channel and camera is like, it's not working right?

[00:50:21] Andy Leviss: Yeah. Hey, can I get five point to points to so and so, so and so, so and so.

[00:50:24] Brian Frost: Oh man, as soon as, as soon as reel came out and everyone knew you could start doing that, it just blew up the whole game. Oh, man. It just made,

[00:50:32] Sean Walker: you're back at a free speak rig and you're like, how am I gonna do all these point to points?

[00:50:35] Brian Frost: yeah, a hundred percent. Um, but yeah, uh, you know, hot seat in reverse, like the first stressful days, the first, you know, day of tech rehearsal. But honestly, like, you know, an hour or two into it, people kind of like, you know, they're figuring out their side tone or you know, what channels they want. They're starting to settle in and then come show you're just kind of like sitting there making sure it's on, you're on Amazon, like, or reading articles and you know, meanwhile the A two is like out there sweating with his, like finger on the go button, making sure and

[00:51:07] Sean Walker: already spending your paycheck on Amazon and they,

[00:51:09] Brian Frost: yeah, and like the a two's running around to the green rooms, like putting on mics.

[00:51:15] Andy Leviss: the comms tech, you're on Amazon buying yourself another portable external monitor. Let's be real about it.

[00:51:19] Sean Walker: Yeah.

[00:51:20] Brian Frost: sure.

[00:51:20] Sean Walker: Dude, if I could start all over again, like start fresh with a company from like, what am I gonna do? I would fully just be a comms company, just me and a pile of pelicans flying around the country. Like dealing them shits out for, you know,

[00:51:33] Andy Leviss: that, that's pretty much what, what Kyle Vandergriff does, and he is frigging awesome at it.

[00:51:37] Sean Walker: does that?

[00:51:38] Andy Leviss: Like Kyle Vandergriff, uh, what's it ins and outs in Nashville?

[00:51:41] Brian Frost: Oh, nice.

[00:51:42] Sean Walker: Because

[00:51:43] Andy Leviss: That's, I, I hope I'm not mixing up

[00:51:44] Sean Walker: racks, you're out, you're like, cool, let's go. Let's fucking, let's smash 20 to 50 fricking belt packs in a bell rub someplace without having to tip a truck like I'm in.

[00:51:52] Brian Frost: Right. But again, you know, who has hopes and dreams of being an audio guy and then you know, says, oh, you know what I really want to be, is an intercom technician. Says. Says no one ever, and.

[00:52:06] Sean Walker: up thinking I was gonna do front of house for cool rock bands, and here I am in a ballroom shopping on Amazon being the comms guide.

[00:52:12] Brian Frost: Like, honestly, when I was coming up in, uh, you know, in I ozi in Local 16, I was doing sound support for a lot of rock shows and all the rock and roll houses, you know, always had to have some kind of calm and like, you know, eventually there'd be, you know, the, a bigger aspect than just, uh, you know, the rock show itself.

There'd be like a backstage or maybe there's gonna be a little production element to the show, and none of them wanted to do the calm, nor did they know how. And, you know, you find a niche and fill it, right. So I was like, all right, I'll, I'll handle that, I'll master it. And you know, I ended up getting a bunch of work that at Rock Houses being the comms guy.

[00:52:52] Sean Walker: There you go, Andy. You just did that not too long ago too, right? Didn't you fly down some ways to go be the

[00:52:57] Andy Leviss: that was, uh, a, a year ago now. Yeah, that's how I got to New Orleans Jazz Fest was a last minute. Um, we're, we're gonna, we weren't gonna take our comms package. Now we are. And we can't get a visa for the guy from London who, you know, tours with the show. So we just need somebody who knows Reel who can be in New Orleans next week.

[00:53:12] Sean Walker: You're like, cool man. I'm on a plane. Easy.

[00:53:14] Andy Leviss: Yeah. And so I, I double checked myself quickly 'cause as soon as I said it, my brain was wrong so that nobody yells at me. Uh, Kyle, Kyle is live wire in, uh, in Nashville and he's awesome. I've like any, any Gigamon with Kyle. That's, there's a couple gigs where like, I've done comms and then the next year I've come back and like been like, are you gonna a two?

I'm like, oh, who's doing comms this year? They're like, Kyle's on. I'm like, understood. Totally right.

[00:53:35] Sean Walker: understood. Yeah. Got it. You got the A team. Got it. Check. Yeah.

[00:53:40] Brian Frost: Yeah. I mean, you know, soon as a production finds a comms person they like and trust and that can handle and scale a huge Joe. I mean, they've got work forever,

[00:53:49] Sean Walker: A hundred percent dude. A hundred percent.

[00:53:52] Brian Frost: um, let's see, what else? Uh, learn how to be a semi-decent RF coordinator or know enough to at least like get your yourself out of some jams, you know, as you're coordinating the, the keynote ballroom.

Like, you know, you could do a handful of breakouts as well and start from there and, you know, learn that craft and skill because, you know, other than the corporate A one and the comms guy, I think probably the, you know, the Sitewide RF coordinator is the next one killing it dollars wise.

[00:54:24] Sean Walker: Totally, dude.

[00:54:25] Andy Leviss: Yeah. And like, I mean, and, and I, and don't sc yeah, and don't scoff at like a two, like, you know, it's easy to be like, oh, the A two could be like any local, but like, there's a difference between like, you know, like that average level of A two and like the high profile, like C level, you know, keynote A twos and like, that's the folks who are really good at that and can make those folks feel really comfortable and make the crews feel really comfortable is important.

And I think it's important to be willing to like bounce between, like you said, you're doing this three week run as an A two now. And like, that's, don't think of it as like, you know, like a downgrade or like, you know, oh, I'm settling for a two work like this week. It's like, these are all important positions.

[00:55:01] Brian Frost: A hundred percent.

[00:55:02] Andy Leviss: having done all the other seats may like the best. A twos on our corporate gig are the folks who also know how to live in that a one seat and know what's important and know what information needs to be communicated. Now. One, information can wait. One information needs to be communicated now, but also needs to be re communicated right before it becomes important.

[00:55:21] Brian Frost: Yeah, and I mean, you're kind of a defacto assistant a SM as well. I mean, if you really know what you're doing, um, you know, you're herding cats back there, right? Getting the, the C level suite people to, you know, be where they're supposed to be. Uh, you know, you maybe give 'em a lint roll on their jacket, um, you know, pat 'em on the, the backside and say you're gonna kill it.

[00:55:44] Sean Walker: Totally dude. Bottle

[00:55:45] Andy Leviss: Oh, hey. Come here. Your collar's flipping out. Gimme a second.

[00:55:48] Sean Walker: Yeah, dude, you are like, you're literally the one that's touching all the talent all day long and you gotta make 'em cozy, dude.

[00:55:54] Brian Frost: Yeah, the last thing you want in an A two is someone who's gonna go up to the, uh, you know, the VP or the CEO and like, start shaking as they're putting on the lab, like all nervous and, you know, awkwardly trying to run the cable down their, you know, their, their shirt and, you know, meanwhile all their, you know, six or seven handlers are just like looking at the stage manager and then looking at, you know, the A two.

Like, are you serious? You guys can't do better than this. Um. Yeah, they want, you know, they want just a, a person that can give them confidence. Like go up to 'em, maybe tell 'em a short little joke. Say, Hey, did you, did you get to eat in any cool restaurants while you've been here? Like we, the guys, and I went to this one last night.

It was really great, you know, and before you know it, the lab's all done. They're like, whoa, I'm done. Okay, great. And you're like, talk, I'm dead. You're gonna do great. So I think, um, you know, conveying that confidence and just keeping everyone at ease is just as important as having technical skill and prowess.

[00:56:57] Sean Walker: A hundred percent. Maybe more important. 'cause then

[00:57:00] Andy Leviss: in the theater world. I, yeah, in the theater world. I heard somebody once describe the A two as the audio department's PR rep, and I dunno that I've ever heard a better description.

[00:57:08] Sean Walker: So good.

[00:57:09] Brian Frost: A hundred percent. Yeah. I mean, you have more

[00:57:12] Sean Walker: the audio company's PR rep, if you're doing corporate shows, right? Like you're the face of the company, dude, the guy sitting in front of house, only a few people see the A two is who the entire client list sees and interacts with and they touch your entire client list, right?

So having a somebody who's a bang in front of house a one also be a great A two is so helpful. 'cause you get like the personal touch. And also, like Andy was saying and you were saying too, Brian, like, then they also know what the A one needs. So you're like, you're literally the, the traffic controller for the whole thing and making sure everybody on site is cozy,

[00:57:48] Brian Frost: Yeah. And you know, thinking of the things that, you know, other people might not think about. Like, oh, we, we have a panel coming up. Okay, well we're on lab mics today. What chairs are everyone sitting in? And well, why does it matter? Well, if the moderator is sitting on stage left and everyone else is sitting on stage right, and they're not wearing the most lavalier friendly clothing, then you probably want to put their lavalier for the person sitting stage left on their right side.

So as they talk to their hosts, they're leaning into the mic and not away from it. I mean, it's, you know, these, these are big important shows for these clients and. You know, if, if their entire segment that they've been practicing for six months, you know, they go up there and then the deliverable after the fact, like the recording, they hear it and you know, they're talking like, okay, and what did you say over there?

Oh, that was great. And level two, they're, and you know, they talk back and forth to the mic and just panning in front of it. As they turn their head, they're like, well the sound was horrible. And you know, as much as you wanna explain physics to them and be like, well yeah, you keep turning your head 180 degrees as you talk.

[00:58:59] Sean Walker: They don't care.

[00:59:00] Brian Frost: So things like that, you know, we do need to be looking out for them. Um,

[00:59:05] Sean Walker: A hundred percent, dude.

[00:59:05] Brian Frost: yeah.

[00:59:09] Sean Walker: Yeah. 'cause you're not, you're not gonna explain physics to the client. They don't wanna hear it. They don't care. They just want it to sound good and be easy and be comfortable. It's like their wedding day every day, right? It's just a Tuesday for us. It's, we're just at fucking work, but they blew six or seven figures on this show, and they want it to be perfect.

Like it's their wedding day. You know what I mean? So let's give 'em, give the people what they want, you know?

[00:59:29] Brian Frost: Yeah. Speaking of physics, I think that phrase came up on a, a show I just did, uh, maybe two shows ago to where, you know, you get a panel of six coming on the stage, you know, all at the same time. And let's say, you know, you might creep the moderator's mic up to like 80% while you have everyone else like hovering around 60% wait for those first words.

And you just kind of ease into it maybe like four or 5, 6, 7 seconds. 'cause it's better to slowly raise that volume than to like, you know, have someone come in and just go and feedback start to take off. But I had this, uh, you know, one producer that immediate turn it up. I'm like, listen, I, I get you, you gotta give me three or four seconds at least to work.

As you know, all these mics come on stage. I, I wanna do the best I can for you, but I cannot break the laws of physics. I could bend them pretty well, but, you know, just, just give us a second. We'll get there. But conveying that. Patience. And you know, of course you gotta say it with a smile and you know, thank you.

But, uh, yeah, physics, you can bend it, but you can't break 'em.

[01:00:38] Sean Walker: Totally.

[01:00:39] Andy Leviss: I like it. And I was gonna say, that's a bumper sticker. Yep.

[01:00:42] Sean Walker: like a pretty, pretty good place. We're in an hour. Is there anything else we didn't ask that we should have asked Brian?

[01:00:48] Brian Frost: Um, I, no, I can't really think of anything, but, uh, I did want to shout out my kids if I could.

[01:00:55] Sean Walker: Absolutely.

[01:00:56] Brian Frost: All right. This, uh, shout out to Tyler, Lucas and Dylan. My three little, my three little guys. They're 11, 14, and 16. Uh, dad, three boys and

[01:01:06] Andy Leviss: not so little anymore.

[01:01:07] Brian Frost: Yeah. And, uh, shout out to mom for maintaining, you know, the WWE atmosphere at home at all times while I'm on the road.

[01:01:15] Sean Walker: stabbing you when you get home.

[01:01:16] Brian Frost: yes. Uh, you know, I could not do this without the misses and the family, so, you know, I always give mad credit to, to her for holding down the house.

[01:01:28] Sean Walker: Hundred percent.

[01:01:29] Brian Frost: wanted to make sure I gave, gave her a shout out.

[01:01:31] Andy Leviss: of all flavors.

[01:01:32] Sean Walker: Hundred percent. Same. Same here. Brian. I'm, I'm in the same shoes for sure.

[01:01:37] Brian Frost: So, but, uh, yeah, you guys are great. Been listening to the pods, um, all week kind of gearing up for this. And I feel like, you know, we've been working together for years and, you know, we could, we could hang out just immediately after work, like we've known each other forever.

[01:01:52] Sean Walker: I'm in. Speaking of that, where are we gonna dinner? Where, where are you based outta these days?

[01:01:56] Brian Frost: Uh, just moved to Salt Lake City from the Bay Area.

[01:01:58] Sean Walker: Cool, man.

[01:01:59] Brian Frost: Yeah.

[01:01:59] Sean Walker: where are we gonna dinner in Salt Lake. Where's the, where's the place where you're like, oh dude, you gotta try this place.

[01:02:03] Brian Frost: Uh, there's this cool little speakeasy we found. Oh, what's the name of it? Uh, I gotta remember. I think it's called Hide and Seek, um, downtown. Yeah. It's, you know, one of those o open the bookshelf and then you walk through the secret entrance and kinda speakeasy, but it's like,

[01:02:18] Andy Leviss: very on point for Salt Lake.

[01:02:20] Brian Frost: yeah. Really. Exactly. Um, but really nice, uh, food there as well.

That's a, that's a spot we found.

[01:02:26] Sean Walker: Cool. That sounds fun. We'll check that out next time we're at Salt Lake. Dude, that's great. Well thanks for coming Brian. Thank you Frost family for supporting Brian and making, you know, making sure he is getting it done. Thanks to Allen and Heath and RCF for letting us yap about audio for another week.

That's the pod y'all.

[01:02:42] Brian Frost: Awesome.

[01:02:42] Andy Leviss: wanna point out, we made it through the entire hour without saying, stay frosty.

[01:02:47] Brian Frost: well almost thank you.

[01:02:51] Andy Leviss: It doesn't count when you say it. In that context, though.

[01:02:53] Sean Walker: Are.

[01:02:54] Brian Frost: You know, growing up, uh, obviously having last name Frost, always tease on the playground, like, get Frosty the snowman. You know, I'd be like, oh, the kids are teasing me. But like, as you get older, man, you're just jealous. I got my own theme song, bro. Like.

[01:03:07] Sean Walker: Brian, I'm, I'm sending that to your A two for next time. They're just gonna play that shit in a Bluetooth walking around during setup, and you're gonna be like, what is this bullshit?

Music: “Break Free” by Mike Green