LBS Legislative Updates and Prosecutors Role Across the Political Landscape

Join host Dayvon Love in this episode of From the Streets to the Statehouse as he discusses LBS 2026 Legislative Updates and how Prosecutors and Ivan Bates Play a Role Across the Political Landscape.

Transcript

SPEAKER_00 1:17

Peace family, this is Dave Unlove, Director of Public Policy, Leaders of a Beautiful Struggle, here for another installment of Streets of the Statehouse during this 2026 Maryland General Assembly. Just want to, you know, first thank everybody who's been following our work, you know, not even just this year, but throughout the years. And this the purpose of this platform is just to provide an opportunity for those who are interested in our work to get a sense of what's happening in the statehouse. You know, giving the name streets to the statehouse, a big part of LBS's work is legislative advocacy. Um, those who are not familiar with Leaders of a Beautiful Struggle or a grassroots think tank, independent black political organization, advocates unapologetically for black people from a revolutionary Pan-African nationalist perspective. And we find this to be unique because very few organizations who have explicitly radical politics are as formidable as LBS has become in the legislative space in Annapolis. Um, and so we're really grateful to have the opportunity to present some of the things that we're working on, um, such that you all can support. One of the things that I'm going to circle back to at the end of this broadcast is just ways that you all can be helpful in supporting the work because really the basis of our ability to be successful and moving policy successfully has been community support. You know, people sending over action alerts, people um becoming sustainers so that we can retain our independence. So those are some of the things that are really important that allows us to be able to, again, be a formidable political force in the legislative landscape in Maryland. Um, and so this is our opportunity to give you all an update as it relates to some of the things that we're working on. So today is gonna be a combination of some general updates on LBS's legislative agenda. And then we're actually gonna end with a conversation with a friend of mine, a brother named Jason Rodriguez, who's been doing work in the community for many years on a variety of different organizational frameworks. Um, but we're gonna talk about just some of the impact of the current state's attorney Ivan Bates on mass incarceration. So that's what we're gonna end with. But we're gonna start with uh just giving a general update on some of our um legislative items that we've talked about during this Maryland General Assembly. And so what I'm gonna do first is I'm gonna start with a bill that, you know, even as we've talked about it publicly, we know we we know is it gonna pass, right? And that's a bill that essentially taxes the endowments of institutions whose endowments are amount to above$2 billion. And those and the funds that are from the taxes on those endowments going into a reparations fund. And again, that bill isn't gonna pass, but really the importance of that piece of legislation is to provide the Maryland General Assembly and also even the general public an example of the kinds of policies that will likely emerge from the Maryland Reparations Commission that was established. Um it was passed by the Maryland General Assembly in 2025, vetoed by the governor, that uh veto was overwritten in December. And so the Maryland Reparations Commission, um, its charge by the end of its time, um, its legislative life cycle, um, its central charge is to produce recommendations on how to implement a reparation, a set of reparations policies in Maryland. So it's one thing to talk about it conceptually. You know, it's one thing to have, you know, general ideas, concepts, but really the purpose of this commission is to provide some very concrete examples of the kinds of policies that will likely come out of this commission. Because as a person, both as an individual and our organization, we see ourselves as legatees of the reparations movement. Um, and those who are familiar with the reparations movement emerges from a black nationalist, revolutionary, Pan-African nationalist tradition. That's the that's where the that's where the demand for reparations emerges from. And one of the things that has been a weakness of the reparations movement has been really on two fronts. The question on where's the money come from, and what's the mechanism for distributing the resources. And so this bill that delegate Malcolm Ruff sponsored, I believe it was House Bill 1271, the purpose of that bill is to provide an example of what it looks like to answer the question as to how it will be paid for. Again, those major endowments, so institutions like Johns Hopkins or Weinberg, right? There are a variety of foundations that have, you know, endowments above$2 billion. And those endowments were established in a landscape of white supremacy and racialized plunder of black people's capacity to practice economic advancement and collective economic empowerment. So the idea here is those institutions that were beneficiaries of the legacy of Chadow slavery, Jim Crow, and other forms of racialized domination should now be in a position to invest in reparations. Again, that's different from investing in social programs. Investing in social programs are good for the most part. But reparations is about investing in black people's ability to practice sovereignty and building the institutions needed for black people to practice a collective ability to meet the needs of our community. You know, whether it's things like transportation, food systems, um, you know, uh waste disposal, telecommunications, transportation, these are all essential um mechanisms for navigating civil society. And as a people, we control none of the major organs that are that are necessary for a people to meet its own needs. And so reparations is about investing in our capacity to do so. And again, this bill, um, the taxation on endowments, it's just an example of the kinds of legislation that we imagine will come out of the Maryland Reparations Commission. Um, and that's really, you know, that's really all there is really to report on that, because again, that piece of legislation won't pass. Second item that I want to discuss on our legislative agenda is re-entry led uh re-entry led by those who are formerly incarcerated. So we were approached by you know a variety of different individuals and organizations, many of them formally incarcerated, um, who wanted more access to people behind the walls. So you think about the historic declines in violence and homicides in Baltimore. And we've argued, and many others have argued, that so much of that is the result of networks of formally incarcerated people who are able to be what's called credible messengers, those that can engage communities that are most proximate to incidences of violence, other kinds of challenges the community faces. And these are folks that are able to reach folks that traditionally many of us may not be able to reach or relate to or engage. And so these credible messengers have been essential in preventing violent incidents, being able to intervene when violence has happened to help ensure or to thwart instances of retaliation. And so it is these networks, you know, organizations like We R Us, organizations like Challenge to Challenge to Change and Tendea Family and the Peace Team, and you know, there's a wide range of organizations that have been crucial to the violence prevention work in Baltimore. And again, many of the folks that are engaged in that work are those who are formally incarcerated. So many of them have told us that an important aspect of re-entry, an important aspect of getting people who are coming out of prison in a place where they can be productive and a place where they can play a role and helping to become part of the solution. One of the things that many of them said is that the work actually starts behind the walls. And many of the folks that I'm connected to that are in that work started their journey behind the walls before they came out. And one of the things that we were told is that they want more access to those who are behind those who are formally incarcerated, to those who are behind the walls because they are best suited and charting a path towards re-entry that is best for that person, their family, and ultimately to be to recruit these folks to participate in the work that again we argue has been so central in the declines in violence and homicides in Baltimore City. And so that bill, um, its House sponsor, Delegate Cheryl Pastor, um out of Baltimore County, and the Senate sponsor, uh Charles Sidnor, who's also uh Baltimore County. Um, you know, both those bills were heard. There was a hearing. Um, it's my understanding that the Senate version of the bill bill actually was voted out of committee. Um, and so it's our expectation that that that bill is gonna pass. Um, it's on track to pass pretty soon. And so we're actually very grateful for that piece of legislation because it provides a basis for those that want to be more engaged with folks behind the walls. It provides a process that is codified in law. Because currently, and I want to be clear, you know, we weren't we were not told that no one who's formerly incarcerated is has been allowed back behind the walls, but that there's just been some organizations who want to have more access have had trouble. And so this bill provides a public, codified process for how that happens, such that you know they can hold Department of Corrections accountable in terms of ensuring that folks that have programs and interventions that are important for those that are coming out, that they have a codified process for doing that as opposed to just um you know, just at the discretion of the secretary. And again, this isn't again a criticism of the Department of Corrections in this regard, but just to say that what's good about this bill is that it establishes a process that is not subjective, it'll be in statute, and it's something that'll be an important tool for those that want to continue to do the work of going behind the walls. So, again, that bill is gonna pass. Again, it passed the Senate Judicial Proceedings Committee the other day, I was told. And so we're looking forward to that bill to make it across the finish line. Um, want to again thank the sponsors of that bill for their hard work in making that move. So that is re-entry. All right, third, so we have a bill, House Bill 101. This is a bill that would require or condition funding, conditioning public funding to public agencies, in this case, Maryland Public Television, that if they convene a statewide general election debate forum, that it will require it would condition their funding from the state on them inviting all of those that appear on the ballot to participate. With the thinking being that what we usually get is the Democrat-Republican. And, you know, as folks who are familiar with LBS as an organization, we are an organization that has criticized the Democratic Party, criticized the two-party system. Because I want to be clear, both the Republican Party and the Democratic Party are part of this corporate duopoly that creates a range of debate and political discourse that maintains the existing system of racism and white supremacy. These two parties are not the same, but they are both systems that are conduits for white supremacy. And the Republicans don't have to care about what we need because their base isn't us. And the Democratic Party, we have an exploitative relationship where the Democratic Party does need us to be electorally viable, but black people don't get the equivalent of what we put into the party out of it. And so we've been critic, we've been critics of the Democratic Party, you know, as a conduit of white supremacy in its exploitative relationship with our community. And so what we have articulated is that it's important to have a credible electoral threat to the left of the Democratic Party. And so having, um, in in the case of Maryland, the Green Party, which is to the left of the Democratic Party, and having the ability for them to be on stage to hold the Democrat, in this case, you know, in the case of 2026, our gubernatorial election, um, where we have Governor Wes Moore, there's a Republican primary that's underway, maybe it's Dan Cox, maybe it's another one of the Republican um candidates in the primary. But we don't expect a Republican to be able to voice the kinds of concerns that those of us with more radical politics are interested in hearing. And so for us, we think it's important to, at the very least, have a person on stage who is able to hold the Democratic Party accountable so that the public can see and see that engagement. Um, and it's and it's difficult to get on the ballot. So this isn't one of those things where it's like anybody who says that they're running in the general is going to be on stage with this bill. Maily, it's just those who, again, who already are going to appear only a ballot. This bill will require them to be invited to participate in the conversation. And again, this is a check to the Democratic Party and the and their exploitative relationship that we've often argued on this platform and many others, that there are things that the Democratic Party should deliver on that should be easy. And in fact, when I get to the next issue on our agenda, I think this is a great example. Um, auto charging, we'll get to in a moment. Um, but there are things that should be easy to pass with a Democratic Party supermajority. Um, but we see that there are limits in terms of where the Democratic Party will go. Whether it's, you know, we had a hard time on reparations, right? On certain kinds of criminal justice policy. So there are a range of things, you know, more progressive taxation. So there are things that the Democratic Party in Maryland, even though they have a supermajority, behaves more like moderate or at best left-of-center Democrats. Um, and so um, and so it's um so for us, it's important to have the capacity to have someone to the left of the Democratic Party be able to criticize the party in public in a way that folks will be able to see. And so um, so that's really the importance of that piece of legislation. So, where it stands now is that it is in a newly constructed committee, this session, um, government, labor, and elections. Um, that committee is chaired by Baltimore City delegate Melissa Wells. Um, and the bill falls under the subcommittee of delegate Chris Fair out of Frederick County. So, delegate Chris Fair, so the way that it works, crossover is next week is on Monday. So this is the week where, you know, by Monday, that if a piece of legislation doesn't make it out of one of the two houses, then in essence that bill dies. This bill doesn't have a Senate cross file, so we're working on the House side of it. And so, in order for this bill to move over to the Senate and to stay alive, we need this to move out of the committee. And the first step is for this to be brought up for a vote in the subcommittee, and that is again delegate Chris Fair of Frederick County. Um, who is the delegate that is the chair of that subcommittee? Myself and Andy Ellis, who is the um Green Party nominee for governor. Um, him and I have talked to delegate fair. Um, you know, we've had you know conversations about the bill. Um, you know, he hasn't expressed to us, he's what he's expressed is that the concern that the broadcasters have is that their argument is that this bill infringes on their editorial discretion. And what Andy and I found um in the case law that they're referencing, um, that is the basis for their opposition, them being the broadcasters who oppose the bill. The basis, um, this the case law that's a basis for their opposition, it says that legislatures are able to impose um neutral standards for participation in the in these kinds of debates. And so ballot access is a neutral standard. It is set, it is not an editorial decision, it is a process by which the Board of Elections um presides over. And if you check all the boxes that the Board of Elections requires to be on the ballot, you're on the ballot. And that's actually a very rigorous and difficult process to appear on the ballot, which is why there aren't very many parties, um, and and especially parties that are particularly viable. And so the so the argument that is being made is that the bill is unconstitutional because it would impose editorial standards. We've argued that these are not editorial standards, these are objective um requirements that we believe the case law that they're referencing um allows for. And so that's that's really in the conversations with delegate fare, um, that's really been the substance of where the hesitation is on moving the bill forward. Um we it is our belief that we're clear that the Democratic Party generally, these kind of things are non-starters. Right? So we were, we were pretty, in terms of percentage of this bill passing, was pretty low for us in the beginning of session, generally because the Democratic Party, not just in Maryland, but across the country, right, go out of their way to ensure that third parties, particularly to their left, are not viable parties. And so it would be consistent with how the Democratic Party is and has been, for it to not want to move this kind of legislation, because from their perspective, it would weaken the Democratic Party supermajority, the hold that the Democrats have in the state of Maryland. So I suspect that there's some of that, you know, happening underneath the surface in terms of the reticence. And so even the most progressive of Democrats, and I would describe Delegate Fair, and I think he would describe himself as a progressive Democrat. But even progressives, this is a place where there are limitations, because again, this could pose an electoral threat to the left of the Democratic Party. And that's one of the places that these two corporate entities, the Republican and the Democratic Party, agree on, is ensuring a limitation of the political discourse. Um, that's our sense of the underlying reticence and hesitance rather behind moving this bill forward. And so, um, so what we're what we want to ask people to do is we're gonna ask people to, and we sent out an action alert the other day. We're gonna ask people to, you know, urge you all to call, send emails to delegate fair, and urge him to put the bill up for a vote in his subcommittee. That's House Bill 101, that would condition state funding to MBT and other public broadcasting entities that if they do a statewide general election debate, that the funding will be conditioned on inviting everybody that appears on the ballot. So again, we just want to urge everybody who's interested, who's listening, and that action alert is on our social media. We also sent one out via email a few days like last week at some point. Um, they give you all the information you need to be able to send a message to Delegate Fair, who's the subcommittee chair of elections of the government labor and elections committee, to urge him to put it up for a vote. If he decides to just not put it up for a vote, then the bill dies. So the action we need him to take is to put it up for a vote. We believe that we have the votes on the subcommittee for it to pass. And so, but what we need is we need him to merely put it up for a vote. Once he puts it up for a vote, then we're gonna need the chair, delegate Melissa Wells, to put it up for a vote in the full committee. And so once we get Delegate Fair to put it up for a vote in the subcommittee, then we're gonna need uh Chair Melissa Wells to put it up for a vote in the full committee. So that's how you all can be helpful in trying to move that along. And even if it doesn't move, just the pressure, support for elected officials to know that there is a desire for this kind of thing. So even if it doesn't move, they need to hear that people care about it so that as we come in future years, they know that there's an interest and appetite from the constituents on this piece of legislation. All right, so that is Hospital 101, our debate election bill. All right, so the biggest lesson. Legislative item that we've been working on is ending or um limiting the practice. Ultimately, we want to eliminate this practice, but this session limiting the practice of automatically charging youth as adults. So Maryland's one of the few states that there are 33 charges that if a young person is charged with it, they're automatically put into the adult system. And I think it's important for me to just explain this a little bit more deeply because I think there's so much propaganda. And um, the brother who's gonna uh join me in a few moments, him and I are gonna talk in much more detail about some of the propaganda. But there's been so much propaganda that I think has confused what the issue is on this piece of legislation. Because the way the Sinclair Media and WBAO Radio have framed this issue, they framed it as a policy that would impair the ability to hold young people accountable who commit heinous crimes. Right? That is the frame that Sinclair Media and folks on WBAL radio have used to characterize this piece of legislation. And it's important that we are clear and that those who are listening are clear that this is this bill does not prevent a young person from being incarcerated or detained for committing a heinous crime. Right? It is a question of where that young person is housed, whether they are housed in the Department of Juvenile Services, whether they're housed in the Department of Corrections in the adult prison system. And what we are advocating for is that young people start in the juvenile system, because in the adult system, no school, no access to school, no access to mental behavioral health supports. Whereas in the juvenile system, you get school and you get access to services. And it's important that young people start in the juvenile system so they have those services because we want young people to try to better course forward. What we have now is we have young people who on average spend 180 days in the adult prison system, and anywhere between 80 to 85 percent of the young people that are charged as adults either have their charges dismissed or weighed back down to the juvenile system. Meaning that, so an example that I've given a bunch, in fiscal year 2024, there were 529 young people in Maryland who spent time on the adult prison system who were weighed back down to the juvenile system. So that's not just all the young people who were charged as adults. I'm saying there were 529 young people in fiscal year 2024 that were charged as adults, that this system either dismissed the charges or deemed that they didn't belong in adult prison. But again, that's after, on average, 180 days in the adult prison system. And the federal guidelines around young people in adult prison is that they're not to be, they have to be sight and sound away from adults. Maryland is such an egregious violator of this federal policy that the federal government doesn't include Maryland's data in the overall data set because it will skew it so much. That is that is how that is how egregious Maryland is an offender of the sight and sound policy. And so what you have in many instances are young people that are in what is functionally solitary confinement. When they are in proximity to adults, these are grown people, right? So think about just the danger and the trauma that youth are potentially exposed to. And so it's just such a traumatizing experience for the young people that are in the system, that are in the adult prison system. And predictably, 80% of the young people that are in the adult prison system are black kids. And so one of the reasons why we're so passionate about this policy is one of the impacts of racism and white supremacy is that there's a way that the suffering of black youth is rendered invisible. There's societal propaganda around notions that black youth are inherently criminal. So just hearing that a young person has a firearm triggers a bunch of racialized beliefs about black youth being inherently criminal, where folks feel comfortable, they just hear a young person has a gun and jump right to, oh, they must be a troublemaker. They must be trying to wreak havoc. And one of the impacts of that dehumanization is that folks don't even consider, well, maybe this young person was carrying a gun because they were afraid, because they know other people have them. Maybe there's a young person who's been dealing with being bullied and they felt like that was the only recourse because the police aren't going to help them, right? Schools are overburdened in terms of the things that they're having to deal with. So this young person took matters into their own hands. This isn't condoning either one of those examples, but this is to say that I don't think anybody would credibly say that that young person deserves to be treated the same as a young person who is wreaking havoc and is carrying firearms for the purpose of harming others, and that those young people should not be treated the same. This is why we're advocating for the policy of not automatically charging these as adults, such that a judge can make a determination based on the evidence as to where it makes the most sense for a young person to start, as opposed to automatically being put into the adult prison system. And it's been quite astounding to see just the level of propaganda pushback from Sinclair. And the kind of basis of the opposition to this legislation has been the prosecutors. So I'm gonna say, I'm gonna say a little bit about prosecutors and the politics of that, and then I'm gonna bring um you know bring my man Jason on. So prosecution, I'm talking about the politics of prosecutors. Prosecutors are elected officials. And when you think, and one of the things that one of my criticisms of Aver DuVenet's documentary 13th from years ago, I talked about mass incarceration. One of my criticisms of it is that it focuses almost entirely on the driver of mass incarceration being about profit, right? Focusing on private prisons and that people making money off of black people going to prison. Now, that is something that does happen, and it is a dynamic. But what I argue, I think many others would argue, in fact, is that the driver of the war on drugs and the incarceration that black folks and people of color arts are subject to is not based in profit motive, but based on societal anti-blackness. That given the societal propaganda, black people is inherently criminal, and and it's coded. So, you know, there was an incident at in White Marsh um last week, a few days ago, um, where that you know they're describing them as link ups, and Sinclair characterizes the link ups, they say things like juveniles convene at a link up, which which that by itself is problematic framing because a quote unquote juvenile is a legal term that talks about a young person who is being adjudicated through the juvenile system. So to even to even even if you're a person that subscribes to calling a young person a juvenile, which I don't, but even if you're a person that subscribes to that, that technically to just say that a bunch of kids showing up at a mall together in a parking lot and hanging out is that they're juveniles, it's just another example of the inherent criminality that is a part of the propaganda on the other side of the issue. And so when we think about societal anti-black, and so one of the coded ways you'll hear it is um in the county, oh, this is becoming more like Baltimore City. And if you know people who have lived in a county, traversed, you know, between Baltimore City and Baltimore County, you'll hear things like that, right? And that and with that, that is a subtle kind of dog whistle that is about inherent criminality of black people, in this case, black youth. That's a part of the logic that makes that even make sense to people. And so when you think about what it is when a prosecutor is getting elected, many of them are using political currency, the political currency of notions of inherent black criminality as an electoral strategy for winning an election. And that is what drives the the heightened levels of incarceration of black people, right? And other folks of color, is the societal anti-blackness that characterizes black people as inherently criminal. And if you can sell to a constituency, we're gonna keep these Negroes away from your neighborhood. If they come anywhere near your neighborhood, we're gonna make sure they get locked up. That is political currency that prosecutors use as a basis for how they get elected, right? It is a part of the larger law enforcement establishment, which includes the fraternal order of police, the association of Maryland, the Maryland Association of Police Chiefs and Sheriffs, that these are institutions for whom the political currency that makes them a political force is societal anti-blackness, it's societal beliefs of notions of inherent black criminality. And so it makes sense for prosecutors to be a major force in opposition to our desire to change this policy that lands so many kids in the adult prison system who don't belong, because it is better for them electorally to talk about young people as inherently criminal, because again, it is political capital that they are able to use as a part of their electoral strategy. And it's shameful that that is in fact the situation that we're in, because black people are collateral damage, particularly working class black people don't have access to major institutions, they don't that they can't make phone calls to make things happen, that it is that that working class black people are collateral damage to this political agenda. And so this brings me, so so what I want to do for the rest of the time, you know, having, oh, let me actually, before I let me give some updates where we are. So the Senate passed a version of the bill that we think actually compromised too much. Um, it reduced the number of charges that are put into a place where young people are not automatically charged. Um, and so we're working to make the bill stronger on the house side. So that's something that we're working to do. Um, and our hope is that we get a bill that again, and I want to be clear and recognize that this isn't an issue of which charges are we okay with. You know, are you okay with robbery? Are you okay with carjacking? That's that that is a frame that unfortunately has been used to interpret the bill that was introduced. The frame that people should be clear about is that the these are charges, these are not convictions. We know that law enforcement and prosecutors engage in the practice of overcharging, because they just throw everything at the wall and then they see what sticks. And so the reason that so many cases end up back in the juvenile system or dismiss is because of overcharging, that they charge, they overcharge and they can't prove. And if you listen back to um one of the previous episodes of Streets of the Statehouse with Bobby Marvin Holmes and Tiara Um Hawks from the public defender's office, she actually, Tiara Hawks actually talks about the process by which a prosecutor will know, oh, I can't prove this, I can't prove this, but I can prove that. And that puts a kid back in the juvenile system. So they've overcharged. So we're not talking about whether we're okay with a young person committing a carjacking. But that's not what we're saying is that if if a young person is charged, if they are alleged to have engaged in that, if they are accused of committing one of these crimes, that they should be put in the juvenile system. And if they committed those heinous crimes, they should be prosecuted like anybody else, right? Prosecuted like anybody else, and term in, you know, in terms of holding them accountable, right? And nobody that is on our side will say that anything different, that they should that that if committing heinous crimes, they should be held accountable just like anybody else. We're saying that they should start in the juvenile system so they have those resources because so many of them end up back there anyway, and the irreparable harm. And I want to say this is that those kids that are in the adult prison system, particularly those that end up getting way back down on their charges dismissed, who spend on average 180 days in the adult prison system, are just as much victims as the person who's carjacked or person who was robbed or beaten. They're just as much, they're both victims. And for us, it is unfortunate that prosecutors would decide that those kids in adult prison are not victims, right? They keep talking about victims, but they don't care about those victims because those are working class black folks, um, particularly kids, those are black kids, and the political cost of advocating for black kids in a political position, unfortunately for them, isn't worth it. And that's something that you know we should see politically as something shameful. So I want to focus, I want to focus the rest of the time on talking about, particularly Ivan Bates, and talking particularly about the impact that a prosecutor can have on a person's life. So I want to do is bring on um Jason, my brother Jason Rodriguez. Him and I go way back, known him a long time. Thanks, thanks for coming on, brother. It's really good to see you. Yeah, it's an honor and a pleasure to be here.

SPEAKER_01 36:07

Can you hear me? Yes, okay. Yeah, you greatly. It's an honor and a pleasure to be here. Um, you've said so much, and you know, just looking at the juvenile uh issue, you know, really quick, you know, we don't understand the mental effects that juveniles or or the classification of someone as a juvenile going through the system goes through. Uh, they are 36 times more risk of committing suicide in the adult system uh than any other system. Uh they can get the attention and the more dedicated care in a more juvenile facility. Um, they are monitored differently. Um there's also the factor of them being put uh kind of in harm's way to be victimized. Um, we had a case that we know of of a mother who lost her child in St. Louis uh and they put the 13-year-old in an adult system. Uh, he was in a cell with two other grown men. Um, and those two other grown men utilized him. Uh he had no other choice. He felt that he had to be underneath these men to be protected. So, of course, he became an underling for these men. Um, and he ended up getting into more trouble in the system in the process because they utilized him and used him for that. Um, you know, so there's just so many arguments against introducing young people into the adult system when the first stop should be that evaluation from licensed professional, from advocates, um, from those who are tasked with those duties to do so, uh, to ensure that we're not causing irreparable harm. That's that's really the problem. And some of the cycles that we see in the community are really caused by irreparable harm. Um, when you talk about repeat violent offenders, well, a lot of these young people have been in and out of the system since they were young, young people, since they were teenagers. And you can see the institutionalism. You can see how sometimes they become institutionalized. Um, and and even the system, what's interesting is the adult system has identified that there is an institutionalism because when you're in there for more than six to 12 months, when you come out, they send you to Time Organization, which is a nonprofit mental health organization, to de-institutionalize you, to kind of bring you home and get you into society, to get you to, you know, to assimilate back into society, because they know just six months or more of a stay is going to change your mental condition. So just the mental health component alone, you know, for me uh alone uh is enough to say that we need to really pump our brakes when it comes to uh charging young people. I know that our emotions sometimes get involved, and especially when I talk about things like violent crime, you know, and and folks who have been victims. I think you know, there's not too many people in Baltimore that haven't experienced the loss of a loved one in a city that is, you know, so violent. And you could hear the, you know, just the the rage and you can hear the anger, you know, from folks sometimes from our people, you know, um how they feel in reference to yeah, well, you you just don't know what it's like, you know, to have your brother killed or you or your mother killed, or your or you know, or whoever killed in your family, and you can hear the pain and the trauma and the the empathy and the compassion, you know, and the level of understanding goes completely out the door, and and all they want to do is see that person buried underneath the jail and not understand you know the systematic and systemic circumstances that may have led you know to this so-called killer, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 39:52

So yeah, yeah. So so let's start. So I want I want to start with because I want to get to where you're going in terms of the granular, like some of the specifics. I want to start big picture for a second. Um, you know, I think it's pretty clear that Ivan Bates was elected on a mandate that's so-called tough on crime. So as a response to the kind of progressive prosecutor, criminal justice reform, Ivan Bates was elected. And if you think about, you know, all the forces that supported him, you know, Greater Baltimore Committee, um, you know, David Smith and Sinclair broadcasting, you know, like many of the major corporate forces were those that funded the campaign both times. Um and so I think it's, I think it is without question to say that he was elected on a mandate in terms of tough on crime. And I think so much of that had to do with a lot of the intentional demonization from Sinclair of you know, the former state's attorney Marilyn Mosby, um, and and just generally criminal justice reform efforts in general. And so I've had the opportunity to, you know, engage Ivan Bates on a variety of occasions, one particular time in public, and it was at the Langston Hughes Business Resource Center in Northwest Baltimore. And so in his presentation, it was it was actually you know interesting because he talked like a person who was like, Yeah, we don't want to just lock everybody up, we don't just want to throw everybody under the jail, you know, we want to hold people accountable, but we also want to make sure that we're dealing with the criminal justice system. And I said to him there in public in front of everyone, I said, this version of Ivan Bates sounds very different than the version we hear every night on Sinclair Broadcasting on Fox 45. And if this, if what you're saying here is truly how you feel, then this is something that we need to hear more of. Now, this was almost two years ago. Now, since then, he's talked about wanting to repeal the Child Interrogation Protection Act, and now he's come out in opposition to change in the policy of automatically charging these adults. And so the conversation you and I had, you were giving me examples of him, his office instituting policies and practices that align with so much of what we know about the mechanics of mass incarceration. So if you can talk just generally about your sense of him politically in terms of his agenda, and then give a few of the examples that you and I talked about in terms of the ways that his office is handling certain kinds of cases that you think is important for the public to know.

SPEAKER_01 42:17

I think what's uh kind of important to point out is that with this administration, I see more of the political optics than I did with Marilyn Mosby. And I tried to explain that to you through text earlier. You know, political optics is when you have a political figure that when you're in a certain room, you know, the optics is gonna be catered, you know, for that room. You know, and then when you leave out of that room, the optics is gonna be totally different for the next group and so on and so on, right? I didn't see Marilyn play a lot of political optics, right? And what I mean is that she stayed on her mission, and her mission was to reform and to transform the system. So she didn't care about, you know, going on talking points. She wasn't favored by Sinclair, so of course she didn't go on there and do all these talking points, you know, and all these, you know, press, you know, press statements. Um, but you see that Ivan is purposeable in that. You see, Ivan is creating the political optics to kind of give you this narrative that I'm tough, that that I'm that I'm uh that you know, there's a new sheriff in town, there's a whole different set of business being conducted. The problem is that the data is showing different. And um, I had an opportunity uh to look at some of the data over the last three months now. Um and then we also uh our program, our radio program, uh Patrick Henderson's Meet the People radio program, actually solicited both the state's attorney's office as well as Commissioner Worley as to their end of year data. Because what we want to do is take that data, compile it into a program, and we want to see where the real reduction in the numbers are because everybody is claiming the throne in reference to public safety, but I think it's all. Yes, right. But when you really look at the data, because you know, Ivan is saying, well, you know, I'm not doing as many pleads and I'm not being as lenient and things like that. Well, the data's not showing that. What the data is actually showing is again, he's he's playing this double optics, right? So for our community, he's making it seem like I'm not doing anything that's harmful or going back to the systematic way of doing things, right? That we know is harmful and destructive to the community. But what we see in the back end of things is we see folks who have been charged by Ivan that in some cases they're not letting off of the prosecutional gas sometimes. They're being overly aggressive in the prosecution. Um, what we're seeing is folks being uh raped through the system. Uh, you know, if you have to keep being postponed and you have to keep coming in and you've been waiting to go to trial, at some point, when somebody offers you a plead, you're gonna take it because you're just tired of just dealing with this mess. And what I'm saying to you is that what we've been seeing with a bunch of folks that have been locked up, some of them have been locked up on gun charges. Uh, one young man was locked up on a gun charge that was coming from the gun range, left his gun in the car, didn't disassemble it, didn't have anything loaded, but it wasn't you're supposed to have the the the clip in one, you know, one compartment and the gun in the trunk or something like that. They're supposed to be separated, all right. So he gets charged with a gun charge. Now the community and several nonprofit organizations and groups came behind this young man, stood behind this young man, contacted Ivan's office, which was the hardest thing to do because if you remember, when Marilyn was in office, she had the community liaisons. She revamped that program, she started that program back up. Bernstein didn't have that program, and Jessemy, uh State's attorney Patricia Jessemy had been uh uh let that uh community liaison, that community outreach kind of go, you know, to the curb. So back in when when Marilyn came into office, she relaunched the community liaison program to build a bridge between the community and the prosecutor's office. And what that did was that when there were cases where the community felt that this young man was a menace to our community, the community could assemble together and go to that liaison. That liaison would take that information to Maryland and Maryland would act on it. And if the community came and the nonprofit groups and other organizations came to Maryland and said, Hey, Marilyn, uh, you know, uh, this young man is a good young man. We have a hold of him, we're working with him. He's in programs, he has a job, blah, blah, blah. Maryland would work with the community and making sure that this young man was sentenced appropriately so that the community can get a hold of him and be able to continue to put the work into that young man. We don't see that in this current uh administration. And when we try to reach out to Ivan in reference to a young man who really and truly was a mistake in reference to the storage of his weapon, he's never, he's never, he's 30 some odd years old, never even had a jaywalking, you know, uh uh spitting on the street or any type of citation, never even had a parking ticket. He's he's been that stellar of a young man, volunteers, nonprofit, uh, you know, goes out and helps the seniors in the community, uh, a stellar young man. Matter of fact, when we went to court at Walbash, he had over 40 people in the courtroom. And the judge said, I've never seen anything like this before, I've never seen someone have this much demonstration, this much presence, this much representation in one room. Obviously, he has to be a good young man if people are standing behind him. But for some reason, Ivan's office didn't see that. And they kept the gas on this young man. They were looking at five years. And even on top of the five years, when we get to court, they were still pumping, you know, still still pumping the pushing on the gas the whole time. When the judge said, Look, this really sounds to me more like, you know, let's let's let's PBJ this. This this sounds like we could PBJ this, we could let this young man go. If he comes back in my courtroom, I'll monitor him, I'll do things, you know, to kind of you know assess what's going on here. But I think this is a uh PBJ. And the state's attorney's office still would not let off on it, even though the judge had identified that this seems like this is an unusual case, right? Make the long story short, they ended up accepting the the plead at the end, the the the the PBJ. But they said that he had to basically sign the conditions without kind of like going through like everything, right? It because what they were doing was they were setting him up for the failure, right? Here's where they set him up at. So after he signs everything, and and he had uh delegate uh uh Malcolm Ruff as his representative, by the way. So he had great representative from Billy Murphy's office. After everything was done, he introduces the fact that we want to put him on the gun registry. So he hasn't really technically been, you know, you know, uh uh prosecuted because it's it's again it's a probation before judgment. So technically, he he's not guilty, he hasn't been found guilty, right? But what you're doing is you're documenting him to be put on this gun registry for the next five years. And what we were finding was was that there was another case similar like that, but you know, uh this person they never found a gun. What was crazy was they they they went in the house, never found a gun, but they still charged her with a gun charge. They did the same thing to this female, they put her on the gun registry on a PBJ, which is really and truly unheard of because again, you know, usually you get on the gun registry when you've been found guilty of violating some sort of gun charge. But again, this is a way of monitoring and in a way of you know, you're gonna mess up, you know, or we're we're we're almost predicting you're gonna mess up and we're gonna be right here waiting for you when you mess up. And I don't think a lot of folks understand the implications of the gun registry. When there's a crime that happens in your community and you are on the gun registry, you have authorized the police within your community to come knock on your door, so they could be a shooting right around the corner from your home. And if you're on the registry, guess what? They're gonna come knocking on your door and they're gonna say, Hello, we're here for a home visit. And you have no rights at that point because, in order for you to get the PBJ and go home, you had to sign this paper for the gun registry. And this is the buffoonery that's going on currently within Ivan's office that we're seeing, you know, quite often. And and it doesn't seem like he's willing to work with the community like Marilyn was when we had issues like this, when we saw these egregious violations of rights, you know, taking place before us. We could pull Marilyn up, we can go to one of the community fairs, you know, she had these summer uh events, pop-up events. We can go to one of those events and touch her and literally go to her and speak to her, pull her to the side and tell her that we have this young man, this young lady, and she would investigate it thoroughly. And either uh Janet Blitzo or one of them will call us back and say, here's the case, here's the situation, here's what we can do, here's what we can't do. We don't get that same cooperation anymore from this office. This office is totally isolated uh from anyone really in the community, unless it's someone who's willing to aggressively stand up for you know overcharging, like you said. Uh, and in this case, these particular cases that I'm talking about uh in reference to the gun charges, they technically were overcharged. Because again, the officer, you know, that that that originally you know uh uh arrested the young man knew that everything was explained. It was a mistake. He he could clearly see that he came from the gun range, he had all this proof and information. The officer said you'll be out within a few days. He ended up staying in there almost a whole month because he kept getting denied bail the whole time. This whole no-bail process system, and and that happened to the female as well. The female ended up with a no-bail as well because even though they never found a gun, because she was you know suspected of a gun charge and was charged as though she had a gun charge. When she got to that bail hearing, she was denied bail. So she sat in there for almost three months, four months, and the other gentleman stayed in there almost 30 days, locked up in the process. And you can lose your whole livelihood, you know, in the process, you know, your home, your your job, you know, and your family in the process. So um it's a it's a very dangerous time right now. I don't think folks realize that under this administration.

SPEAKER_00 52:55

Yeah, I mean, let look, that's that's super helpful context. You know, one of the things that um that in the work that I'm that you heard me mention about auto charging, you know, the the charge that lands the most young people in the adult system is mere gun possession. And one of the things that, you know, I've had to be critical of some of our white progressive friends for whom their description of mass incarceration is focused on like the non-the non-violent drug offender, right? That that's been that was like the trope. And and the problem is that again, you know, America, the most guns in the history of the world, right? And the availability, the availability of firearms is is you know increased. You know, you can get, you know, it's easy to get firearms, relatively speaking, than ever than ever before. And so there's a way that in our community, given our community's relationship to law enforcement generally, right? We you know, we we joke in our community about how we call the police, they take a long account, right? And so a big part of them what we do is we we take things into our own hands, right? And not that that's the best course of action, right? But when you feel like police, you know, someone rob you and the police ain't gonna do nothing about it, right? Then you take things into your own hands. And there's a and so that's a rational line of thinking that I think a lot of folks in our community um take on.

SPEAKER_01 54:21

You you know the saying, you know, the young people say, I'd rather be judged by by by by 12 than to be carried by six. That's right.

SPEAKER_02 54:28

So that's right.

SPEAKER_01 54:29

And and and a lot of the young people out there, especially what's going on right now, you know, and and I keep trying to have this conversation with Warley, you know, the more that we have these police involved incidences, um, the more that you have the community willing to backlash and fight back and resist. And I keep telling them they have to be careful of that because you don't think that these young people, you know, thinking of their livelihood and their safety, wouldn't carry a gun just to keep that officer or keep that, you know, the other gentleman off of him, you know, because they're just afraid of the other gang members or the other street members as they are law enforcement. So they're carrying it for multiple reasons. I'm not justifying it, but I'm saying that we're creating this condition in this environment where they feel empowered and justified to do so, where they feel it's a necessity, you know, it's just like putting on my underwear. I gotta have my underwear on, and I gotta have my my gat too to protect me to make sure that I'm gonna come home at the end of the day.

SPEAKER_00 55:30

Yeah, so let's let me put this to you. So I was on um, and you know, I think he's a good dude. Uh TJ Smith. I was on TJ Smith's show uh a few months ago, um, and we were going back and forth about this. And the thing that, you know, as I'm talking about the auto charging piece, and I would and again talking about gun possession. And I said, and I and I said to him, I said, now there's emerging data nationally that substantiates the claim that the majority of young people that carry and carrying because they're afraid, right? Correct. And I think we can extrapolate that to grown people, right? Where people carrying because they feel like they need it.

SPEAKER_01 56:03

Yeah, that was the reason why I have fought against the bill, not to charge the first charge, keep it as a misdemeanor. Because you might have grand grandma, auntie, unc unk who's out there carrying because he's scared of the young people out there. That's right. And he's not a criminal, but he's carrying it because he fears for his safety. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_00 56:24

So so when TJ, when I said so, what basically a version of what you just said when I said to TJ, his response back to me was they're criminals. Like the fact that they're having guns, that means that they're criminals, right? And and again, I and I find that astounding, but I think that that is part and parcel of the propaganda that the society propagates, where it's like just because a black person has a gun, it's like people automatically go to they must be they must be a problem. And it is my belief, you know, I'm from Baltimore, grew up and went to Forrest Park group in West Baltimore.

SPEAKER_01 56:58

That's right.

SPEAKER_00 56:59

I most of the people that I knew that carry guns weren't carrying them because they were troublemakers.

SPEAKER_01 57:04

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 57:04

But I but what people say to me is they say, Oh, that's just wishful thinking. When it's like, no, I'm from, I know, I know that to be the case. So can you speak to that? Like just in your experience of people who carry firearms, would you would what would you say in that in that in that context?

SPEAKER_01 57:18

Uh uh again, usually it's it's it's multiple reasons. So, you know, usually, you know, it of course it's for their own safety, their own protection. Uh, that's usually one. Um the other one, and I've seen this going back to when we had the jump out, you know, the GTF, and we had them out there. You know, a lot of young people I kept trying to tell them when I would go to these consent decree meetings and I go to these meetings. Y'all don't realize, you know, how close y'all are, you know, to this you know, street up uprising, you know, uh, even before Freddie Gray. I used to warn them, you know, that I I knew of young people that used to stand in Brooklyn. So I I come from Brooklyn homes, right? I know folks that used to stand on Temp Street with with something, you know, hidden away in case somebody like Sergeant Gerzak or Sergeant Murphy or uh uh Spinado, Donato, one of them would come around, which you know, these were the jump out guys, and it and they would come out sometimes challenging you, wanting to fight you. Um, I'll never forget it because a lot of folks who know that whole southern district remembers when Donado and them first came out, they were some little young, thin looking boys, right? They went and bulked up real fast, got some, you know, I don't know uh uh what they call it, the the the the the steroids, and yeah, they went got some roids, and you know, next thing you know, they were bulked up, right? But that also came with an aggressive nature. So I would watch them literally. I lived right there on 10th Street, right across from the rental office. I could watch them, I could roll up my window sometimes and watch them as they would be out there guffing. I mean, all out like MMA fighting the street dudes out there, and the street dudes would get to the point where it was like, yo, if he comes back at me again and I'm under that same circumstances, I'm popping a shot at him. I'm popping a shot at him. So they're just as much afraid as the people that are supposed to protect them, you know. And then look, I lived in Brooklyn Homes for almost 15 years. I'll never forget when I would come outside, the officers would stop me all the time. And when I would ask them why they would stop me, they would say, Well, you're in a high crime community. Look at the sign right here, it says you're in a high crime community. And I say, Well, I might live in this community, but it doesn't mean that I'm causing the crime, you know, and it doesn't mean that I have to be harassed every time I come out, but that was the nature, like you said, you know, uh uh walking while being black, you know, walking while being colored. You walk through the neighborhood and you're automatically suspect. And and the and the folks that would do it a lot of times was the black detectives. Those are the you know, yeah, you get the aggressive nature, and I even had uh Sergeant Gurzak one time told me he would kill me and go do desk duty the rest of his time before retirement, that he would kill me in the streets. He wanted me to buck at him and like lunge at him so he could kill me. He was looking for that. So if you know that that's the nature of those who are supposed to protect and serve, what do you think the mentality of these young people are that are looking at these folks, knowing that they're not gonna protect them? If anything, they're gonna harm them and they're gonna take their lives. So we would see young people that would tell me, you know, I got this for him. He came back, you know, after being beat up by you know Gurzak or Murphy or whoever, yeah, I got something for him when he comes back, you know. And then there was the argument that I used to argue all the time in city council was in reference to our elders, because I know that our elders, unfortunately, you know, I'm an old street guy. So for me, I go up and I go talk to these young people, you know what I mean? Real recognizes real. So when I walk up to them, they know I'm not coming at them any kind of weird way. So we can we can have a conversation, and I'm familiar with the streets, so we can have this conversation about anything guns, drugs, whatever women, money, we can talk about it because I I've been through that that road. I'm trying to show them a different way, right? So while I'm out there outreaching, what I noticed though is a lot of times the the elders and folks that are walking through the neighborhood don't even eye them, don't even look at them. They're so afraid of our young people in the community, and I tell them all the time, just talk to them, say hello to them. You'd be surprised how much these young people will interact and will talk to you. But because our our our elders are so scared of them, I know of a fact that there's elders right now that are outside right now that are packing, and they don't care that they're packing. And I I argued in city council for them because knowing that that is the dynamics in Baltimore City, I didn't want them to be charged with a felony and have to be facing five years because they decided to to pack, you know, because of how the dynamics of the city are, or or if they make a mistake and maybe leave it in their luggage and they get pulled over, you know, they could be held criminally responsible and be charged with a felony. So I didn't want them to see our elders being charged with a felony because I knew there's they're they're afraid of the streets, you know what I mean. And when you have a city that you have over 300 homicides, well, you know, now you know we're we're reducing that, but when you had over 300 homicides, over 700 to 800 shootings per year, you know, I you know, I'm not gonna lie, I might want carry, yeah. You know, yeah. I mean that's real. It's either that or or a vest, you know. But a vest is only gonna protect you so much, and then that's illegal.

SPEAKER_00 1:02:33

That's right.

SPEAKER_01 1:02:33

And I know people have been caught with bulletproof vests, exactly. You know what I mean? So it's just the dynamics of the streets, and just unfortunately, people like TJ Smith, unfortunately, you know, have these blinders on because again, you know, we know TJ's history, we know he's come through law enforcement, yeah, that he was part of law enforcement, but even those that don't come through law enforcement, unfortunately, follow kind of like that same lens that TJ is looking through. They don't see you know the macro of things, you know what I mean? They only see you know what's front and center of them, and it's the gun, that's illegal, they shouldn't do that. But you know, it's just like everything that we're talking about in reference even to the criminal justice side of things, right? Like I'm doing some research now that's looking at the um uh the the the DNA, you know, how uh the DNA can be reconstructed from trauma. You know what I mean? Like you like, for instance, if a child is born, you know, where the mother is always depressed, going through trauma, cortisol is all in the body the whole time during fetal development, we don't realize the epigenetics involved in that, how that alters the DNA and how that child then comes up to live in a world where they're already altered, their mentality, their brain, you know, their their physique of their body is all changed and altered because of that trauma that they've experienced. And when you look at our community, when you look at folks of color in America, we've had 400, 500 years of enslavement, which is trauma. There's nothing happy and joyous and and and fun about that. So you best to believe the epigenetics carried from that, you know, generation to generation, it carried in the mitochondrial DNA and it was passed on to each generation. So each generation had to live with an inherited trauma. And so now you're asking us after 400 years of that, you know, uh another hundred years of Jim Crow and you know, and just all out racism and white supremacy flexing and and exercising itself in America, like you're expecting us to operate and and and and perform normally in the community. And and and when Patrick used to talk about the invisible hand of things, right? He wasn't just talking about the judges and the police, you know, and the politics of things, you know, that invisible hand, but he was also talking about the lead poisoning, you know, that that is messing with our prefrontal cortex, that's not allowing us to develop properly, that's allowing things like our amygdala, you know, a primitive part of our brain to take over and and to control us and and to you know make us, you know, uh act reactionary as opposed to be civilized and tamed because our prefrontal cortex is damaged. Um we don't understand what epigenetics is, but they've done research recently, right, with these mice. Umice that uh actually has a very short life cycle. So you could change the evolution of that animal. A prime example is like dogs, right? They create new breeds of dogs every, you know, so many amounts of years because a dog's life cycle is short. So you can change the evolution of that animal and you can create new breeds. Well, they have this mouse, you know, this mice that they did this research on, where they kept making noises and bringing on like bright lights at a certain time every day, right? And when that mouse then they they they they basically took it away at the same time every day, they took the noise away, they took the light away. At the same time every day, all of a sudden, after a year, the mouse still was reacting same time every day, was jumping, was startled at the same time every day. What's interesting about this, and this is where the epigenetics comes in at, because that mouse lived in such a traumatic environment that when it had offsprings, every day at 12 noon, when the experiment would normally go on, the offspring would jump at 12 noon, like they were anticipating something to happen at 12 noon. And we don't understand that that invisible part of things that happens to us. These are the causes and effects that we are living with in our society. No, we're inept to the trauma that we face. We're inept because of the because of the suffering that we that we've uh uh been through. Um and because we haven't really coped with it and dealt with it, we haven't, you know, been given reparations. You know, we have you know nobody's atoned, you know, for their sins of America. America is still attacking us now. 400, you know, plus some odd thousand women, you know, were let go of the workforce. Black women were let go of the workforce force. We see the attacks going on in our community so prevalent. So we're we live in this hostile, toxic environment. So we never really get the chance to thrive and live that so-called American dream, the pursuit of happiness and liberty and you know, justice. We don't get to live that. We're always under stress and we're always constantly under trauma. And what you see in our community is all reactionary to it. I'm carrying a gun because that's my environment, that's the trauma in my environment. I'm living a certain way because that's the trauma in my environment.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:46

You know, I think that's another, I think another way of putting another way of putting that is a quote that we actually use a lot from Amos Wilson's book, Black on Black Violence, that the phenomena of violence we see in our community is an externalization of a suicidal impulse. That when you're told you're nothing, when you're told you're handling criminal, it's easy to hurt someone like you, right? So part of the work that folks are doing is deprogramming and correct some of that healing of the historical trauma that you're referencing that has resulted in what we see in our community. Yeah. The last thing I want to um ask you about um is if you can say if you can say um what are what are some ways that the community can help with those cases that you're talking about that that Ivan's office has has been unhelpful with. If you can just tell the audience, you know, what is what are some ways that folks can be helpful and also just plug plug your radio program and tell people where they can listen to you.

SPEAKER_01 1:08:39

Uh, I think the way that we help is to register to vote and get ready to find someone again, you know, that will definitely best represent our community um and and not other communities. Um, you know, I I get this whole fight and and and wanting to address crime, uh, but we're not addressing it, you know, addressing it from the back end of things, I always say has always been the problem, you know, in most municipalities, in most urban communities. We're always addressing it at the back end. We never go to the root causes, we never look at those, those, those, you know, uh systematic and systemic things that have been in place, you know, for for decades, for many generations, you know, that has caused these generational curses. So uh for for me, you know, we we really have to look back at uh you know holding and controlling our power, which is at at the polls, um, and making sure that we don't allow folks like a David Smith to come change the narrative because he does have the money to make the message loud. Um, you know, and I always say to folks that we have to figure out how to get above that white noise that they are making so that our message can be heard outside of that, you know, because they're they're always gonna have a platform to do so, whether it's the Baltimore Sun, whether it's BAL and C4 in them. And I know C4 and them's, you know, ancestors have to be turning over in the grave, you know, listening to him and watching over him, you know, and hearing some of the the, you know, just the tonality and you know, and some of the just the the the thinking thought process of him. It's like he's lost the fact that you came from, you know, a family of civil rights legends, of civil rights pioneers, you know. You you you came from folks that have broken the ceiling. But yet here you are in this day and age, really and truly upholding, you know, a lot of the conservative talking points and messages, you know. Um, you know, it it you know, you're you're a sellout to me, you know. And and I hate to say that, but you're a sellout because again, instead of you correcting a lot of these folks on your program, you sometimes kind of play into it. And I don't like that. I think that that's a very dangerous game. And that's what you see with a lot of these media companies, the Baltimore Sun, you know, I tell folks all the time, invest in Urban One. I keep saying purchase stock in Urban One because with the consolidation of media, whether it's print, whether it's you know, uh television, whether it's online, you see a conservative message almost on every platform now, whether it's an iHeart radio station, you know, whether it's you know, whoever. And and it's important that we have our own platforms like this, like you, that are again breaking through, you know, the white noise and allowing the message to be heard loud and clear. Um, but as far as like what we can do in a current state, I mean, besides keep the pressure on Ivan to let Ivan know that we are still going to hold him accountable for reforming and changing the system, even though he wants to play political optics and make it seem like he's being tough on crime and you know, and and and again, that's I told you it's all about the optics because for him, at the end of the day, even if he doesn't get those prosecutions, at least he can say, I never let my foot up off the gas. I was relentless, I was stern, I had no mercy.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:09

And those cases that you talked about are collateral damage, correct, right? Most people's lives are collateral damage for this career.

SPEAKER_01 1:12:16

Correct. So in this particular situation, the only power that we really have, of course, is to keep the pressure on them to let him know that, you know, we we we need you to to also consider these options. Yeah, you can listen to the voices of, you know, Fells Point, you know, neighborhood association, and you can listen to, you know, the Roland Parks and the, you know, and those who are behind David Smith. You can listen to them, but you also have to understand that we're putting you on notice. And if we don't hear, you know, the messaging resonating out of your office that says that you're looking at at least addressing some of these issues, you know, then we'll we'll have no other choice but to, again, exercise our power, which is at that at that poll. You know what I mean? That's that's the only other choice we have at this time. Uh because I think Ivan is still going to be on that same trajectory regardless, because again, he's playing political optics to those who need to see him being stern and tough and and and and the head you know prosecutor in charge, you know.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:16

That's right, that's right. So we'll look with Tom Wind and I want to appreciate you being on, brother. This is important information for the community. Tell tell the people how they can listen to your program and how they can get in touch with you.

SPEAKER_01 1:13:27

I I appreciate it. Uh, so uh a name of our radio program is Patrick Henderson's Meet the Radio, uh sorry, Meet the People Radio Program. Um, we've been on for 16 years. Um, Patrick Henderson was a world-renowned gospel singer uh and composer. Yes, he knows he's known as the Godfather of Praise and Worship Music. Uh, what's interesting is he came to Baltimore and saw such a need to roll up his sleeves and get involved in a lot of the dynamics that he saw in Baltimore. And his family told me that he had never been in any civil rights, had never been in any political realm, had never been in any human rights, you know, uh advocacy. He decided that Baltimore, he needed to plant his roots in here in reference to fighting for the injustices that he was witnessing. He said he'd never saw anything like it before. And you've even heard Dr. Anthony Bat say, you know, that he looked at Baltimore as like the 1950s and reminded him of the segregated 1950s. And Patrick looked at it the same way. You know, he often called us a third world country. And so he felt the need to really roll up his sleeve and really do something in Baltimore. So besides getting involved in the, you know, going and testifying and getting involved in the community associations, um, he was instrumental in bringing back the money to Plymouth so that the Plymouth community and Doefield community could get some reinvestment going on in that corridor. He was instrumental in bringing back millions of dollars to them. Um and so he brought the radio you know uh platform to be able to have a uh forum for us to be able to have these discussions, formulate action plans, and then go out there and implement them, go out there and put them to work. So uh we we're on every Monday, 11:30 to 1 p.m. Uh every Monday, doesn't matter if it's a holiday or not, we still on even during Christmas, if Christmas falls on Monday. Um and we appreciate you know folks tuning in um you know and uh listening. Um and many times we are dissecting a lot of these issues that are going on within our community, um, you know, trying to find ways, you know, to fight back. Uh, but again, a lot of times we find that the stack, you know, the stack is the deck is stacked against us, unfortunately. And what we see is even, you know, like Washington, DC, you know, there's a house of cards being played here as well. Um, I think the the the the the the thing that inspires me the most is knowing that brothers like yourself, LBS, you know, so many others that I know are on the front line of this, are constantly pushing back at the system, are constantly holding it accountable. So I I know I would love for people to tune into me, but I make I would hope that people make sure that they follow you because a lot of times when I'm talking on the radio program in reference to what is going on in our community, a lot of times I'm being enlightened by your group and your organization. And what I'm doing is just being a messenger and passing that message on to the community. So I hope that folks again understand that there's not a lot of soldiers out here that are on those front lines that are fighting against the system. And you see what happens, you know, when you do put yourself out there in the suites, like our dear sister Marilyn Mosby, you see what can happen to you when you're in those spaces. So, you know, I would just encourage that we surround each other, we protect each other, we continue to share the information like we're doing here. If you can tune in to the Patrick Henderson's Meet the People Radio program, I appreciate it every Monday at 11:30. But if not, like I said, let's make sure that we keep you know sharing the communication, keep passing it on, have those conversations with your family so that at least we're mobilized, we have the information and we're prepared. Yeah, that's it.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:07

Appreciate you so much, brother, for being on this program. Super useful. We'll definitely bring you back on in a future episode. You take care, brother. Appreciate you.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:15

Yes, sir. And we got to get you on the program as well. So let me know.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:18

Just how yes, sir, yes, sir, yes, sir.

SPEAKER_01 1:17:20

Thank you again, and thank you to the community.

SPEAKER_00 1:17:22

All right, take care, brother. All right, family. So, um, just as a brief kind of summation, you know, we started at the top with just some of the legislative items, updates on our legislative agenda. Um, I want to reiterate, as I stated at the top, um, HB 101, which is our bill, that would condition state funding to MVT and other public broadcasters. So if you do a statewide general election debate, that they have to invite everybody that appears on the ballot. So I talked about that at the top, but I want to reiterate that if you're interested, if that's something that is of interest to you, um, you can go to our social media, LBS Baltimore, all your relevant social media, and send a communication with an email or call the office of delegate Chris Fair, the Frederick County delegate. He's the subcommittee chair, the election subcommittee chair in the government, labor, and elections committee. Um, and so urge him to put that bill up for a vote in his subcommittee. Again, crossover is on Monday, so this bill needs to pass the House by Monday, by the end of Monday, in order for the bill to stay alive. Um, so for folks interested, you know, check the action alert, send an action alert to Chris Fair to put that up for a vote in the subcommittee and urge that committee to vote for that. Um, as I also mentioned, we're gonna continue to work the bill to uh to reduce the automatic charge in youth as adults to make a stronger bill in the House, and you'll be hearing more from us about that. Um, so please stay tuned to that. I'm gonna again thank again our brother um Jason Rodriguez of the Patrick Henderson Radio program. Um please tune into his program uh Mondays at 11 to 1 p.m., 11:30 to 1 p.m. Um, and we'll make sure that we get that information out um to the community as to how they can they can view that. Um, and my hope is that you all in the conversation we just had see just the mechanics of how some of these things that for some people is theoretical, like really concrete examples of the way that prosecution that is based in a so-called tough-on crime landscape ends up trapping a bunch of people that don't belong in the system. So that's something that I think is gonna be really important context for those who are listening as to why it's so important for us to ensure that we continue to reduce the harm the criminal justice system continues to do to our community. The we can we're able to bring you this perspective. You're not gonna hear this perspective from very many advocacy organizations. We're independent black political organizations that is revolutionary in our worldview and perspective. And so it's important that that you all are clear that the reason that we're able to do this is because of the support of the community. And so there are two major ways, and I'm gonna urge you all to support. One, you can become a sustainer. If you go to lbsbaltimore.com, you go to donate, you become a sustainer. That helps us to maintain our independence. There are over 300 people that donate to us monthly, and this helps us to be able to continue to remain independent. We're not a nonprofit, we're a business, and that gives us more ability to be independent and to aggressively confront the political landscape in ways that other folks are not able to because of how they're structured. When you're a C3, it's just limits. When you're a nonprofit, there's limits to your ability to engage in a kind of political warfare that is needed on behalf of our community. We're able to do that. But it's you all in the community that allow us to continue to be able to do that. So please, if that's one source of support, is become a sustainer. Or if you're not able to do that, or in addition to, is you can sign up to be on our listserv, to get our newsletter, but and more importantly, to be able to get action alerts. So I've referenced some action alerts previously. These are alerts to provide the instructions for who to contact as we navigate the Maryland General Assembly and pushing policy, that those calls make a big difference. That when legislators hear from us, it makes a big difference and hear from you all, right? They hear people reach out because they support what's on our agenda, it makes a huge difference. Our ability to be a formidable political force in the political landscape is predicated off of the fact that the community voices its support for the policies that we're pushing for. So if you're interested in continuing to give this kind of insight and to help to support this kind of advocacy, become a sustainer, and or also um sign up to be on our listserv um and to be able to respond to action alerts to help press um issues forward. Um and um, you know, I think it's important for people to know that, you know, again, it's important for people, you know, when they hear from you, that's the source of our power. And we're really proud of the fact that the source of our power is community. It isn't proximity to those in leadership, right? It isn't proximity to those in power, right? But it is the formidable political muscle that you all fuel and fund that is the basis of our power and our ability to move these kinds of policies forward. So even we think about auto stopping the automatic charge we use as adults, that's something that's been in work for works in me for many years. And we are grateful that that us and many other organizations are in a position to press forward against a policy that has caused such irreparable harm to so many of your young people over many years. And again, you don't get that if you don't have an independent black political voice in order to press that forward. So stay tuned to further action alerts and continue to support the organization. Feel free to reach out if you don't have any questions. Always feel free to reach out either on our social media or on our website. Um, there are ways for you to reach out if you have any questions or want to offer some support. Again, I'm Dave Vaughn, I'm director of public process leaders of a beautiful struggle. Thanks for being with us this evening. Peace.