Real Estate Development Is a Bit Like War Planning with Ian Jones MRICS

Born in Glasgow Scotland, resides in Toronto, Ian Jones MRICS, President of BGI Group, https://bgigroup.ca/projects-1, comes with 50 Years of Real Estate Development and has Survived 5 Recessions.

Now, Ian is focusing on the "Forgotten Middle" and is building Senior Living for a nonprofit.

"Real Estate Development is a bit like War Planning."

With Ian Jones MRICS

You can follow Ian on LinkedIn at https://www.linkedin.com/in/ianjonesmrics/

His website: https://bgigroup.ca/

Ian has 50+ years in Construction and Development of large scale RE Projects - Canada and USA

Specialties: Development of large scale Real Estate projects from concept to completion
1) Land; 2) Planning & Design; 3) Sales & Marketing; 4) Legal & Financial; 5) Construction; 6) Asset Management

BGI are Developers, Development Managers, Development Advisors, Project Managers, Construction Managers. https://bgigroup.ca/

PODCAST appearance on BoomerLiving.tv at https://podcast.boomerliving.tv/real-estate-development-is-a-bit-like-war-planning-with-ian-jones-mrics/ 'Real Estate Development is a bit like War Planning...', also available on YouTube via https://youtu.be/LVQjYO1X4kA uploaded Oct.10, 2019

"​Make no little plans. They have no passion to stir men's blood and probably will not themselves be realized" Architect Daniel Burnham 1907.

Need help or advice.. - Ian Jones MRICS, President - mailto:ian@bgigroup.ca

Quora - https://www.quora.com/profile/Ian-Jones-185

Transcript

Hanh Brown: [00:00:00] Welcome Ian. Thank you so much for being here.

Ian Jones: [00:02:04] Well, thank you very much and a pleasure to be with you today and, uh, give you a brief overview just about over 50 years involved here in this journey, but I’m going to try and cover it in five minutes.

[00:02:20] So I basically, as you can probably tell by the accent, I came from Glasgow, Scotland to Toronto Canada, the 1960 with family. Uh, I was 15, so I went through the turbulent, sixties 15 at the beginning and 25 in 1975. I was involved in it knee deep. I went to school here for three years, Toronto, uh, finished grade 12, but I could not walk a university.

[00:02:48] Uh, cause I had to support my mother at the time. And basically what that was. I started working for a general contractor in Toronto, who is building the Toronto subways and raised express. I got a job in their mail room, about four weeks into that job. I got to know all the managers. So I asked the manager of the estimating department, if I could be transferred in there.

[00:03:10] And he said, yes, and one condition that you take night school courses. And if you pass them, And stay with us for a year, we’ll pay for them. So I jumped at that chance and I did that for a total of four years, uh, four nights a week. And, um, I ended up a get British profession is called the charter quantity surveyor.

[00:03:30] And what that is is we design the economics of large scale construction projects and basically, um, Contract administration and things like that. So I worked for that major general for a couple of years, and then start with another major general built the CN tower and a few other mentionable that sort of nature or large scale contracts.

[00:03:57] Uh, so the, um, I then went to work for an architect for four years as their head office, a quantity surveyor dealing with all of their budgeting and contract management and overviewing, the general contract types I used to work for. They built, uh, study, they designed the Toronto general hospital and said Mike’s in Toronto.

[00:04:19] So, uh, again, large scale projects. After about four years of that, I went to work for a construction management company and we built two five-star hotels and Toronto after that, that was a bit of 15 years. So I guess I woke up one morning and figured the I’d done as a developer does. So I formed my development company in 1980.

[00:04:44] And been developing ever since. And I’m right up today. I think in writing figures, there’s a bit 23 million square feet in my, uh, journey, uh, both development and construction. We did all our own construction till about five years ago. And, uh, with the usual way 30 bed packages to the trades. So that was basically, um, the five minute overview of the, how I started in the business right up to date me develop more.

Hanh Brown: [00:05:19] You’ve been through five recessions, five decades in the real estate development. You have many lessons learned to share from LA land acquisition, entitlement financing, construction into disposition. You develop a wide gamut of real estate assets, including hotels, the Hyatt Hilton Sheraton. Condos hospitals, townhomes, retail, and now senior living.

Ian Jones: [00:05:45] Thank you. Yeah. Does it include the condominium apartments and various types of residential? We generally stay away from large scale, a large track single family housing for a few reasons, but frankly, it’s really difficult to get. To as you call it an entitlement here, municipal approvals through can just take too too long.

[00:06:11] What you do end up getting over the market. I’ve been through a bit four or five recession, thankfully, no bankruptcies and incidentally on that, we’ve get to base particularly three firewalls that we try and build an every project. First being the added value on the land. We try and double if not triple the value of the land.

[00:06:31] Before shovel was in the ground and then, uh, or normal development fees and then the development profit. So usually it takes a major major before really get sent a real financial problems or acts, which help protect us against any bankruptcies in the past.

Hanh Brown: [00:06:50] I’m sure there has been many memorable milestone for you.

[00:06:55] So please tell us some of those memorable project.

Ian Jones: [00:06:58] the milestones, which just would be the transition from working for a general contractors to architects, to construction management companies. And then onto development, those would be the journey milestones as regards the types of project milestones to particular ones standard in my mind, which are in Toronto.

[00:07:24] And again, I know you’re in the U S and we’ve dabbled there 2004 to 2007, mainly in Dallas. We had the, uh, the 600,000 square foot building on our V street next door to Dallas city hall under a option, you know, and then to the, to seven began to happen. So we did not exercise that option on it. We had 75 million TIF discussion with a, say, a Dallas to make a 350 condominium in a convention center hotel.

[00:07:58] Right next door there. But thankfully we bailed out if you like and to wait happened. So again, we dodged a bullet there financially, but the, uh, the two, the two major milestones for the Toronto area, one is, um, literally two blocks from the center and it was, um, basically a hundred thousand square foot.

[00:08:21] And then there was looking for a home. Otherwise they were going to move out to the suburbs and the city didn’t want them to. So we proposed to the city that we could accommodate them. If we got approval for the 450 room hotel of where none existed in that area of Toronto at the time, which was the late eighties.

[00:08:40] So the city approved a lightening fast approval, which they’ll have to jump through all the hoops, but we’re good. Paramedics within nine months and that included the zoning amendment. So they’re standing there today is the Hyatt hotels and top at 200,000 square feet of fashion showrooms at three 70 King street.

[00:09:01] Right. So that was a pretty major milestone. The other one was in Toronto suburb and it was 30 acres of land, our church on that. They didn’t know what to do with it. So the approach does, and we gave them a comprehensive master plan for 700 condominiums. 160 bed long-term care, some retail and a church. So basically the project is there today.

[00:09:29] Nine two eight one Gore. We drive and Brampton, Ontario. And, uh, that was a challenge. We did it. Hey through the usual, a city approved. And then we sold out the first 200 units. We built them as condominiums and, um, the long-term care get built by an operator and the first phase of the church. So. And we had awarded all sorry, trade packages and all of them, except one from the former contractor, not they wanted another million dollar.

[00:10:03] So we told them we’d get back to him in a couple of weeks. And we looked at four different ways of building buildings and we get back to him and said, we wouldn’t need them at all. So, uh, we built them a completely different way, uh, structure wise, but nobody knew the difference really in the buyers ended up with a better product.

[00:10:26] So crisis averted. So those two, you know, on the large scale for us, um, we managed to get through them. So those, I guess would be the two physical case study milestones.

Hanh Brown: [00:10:39] So, how do you go about assessing supply demand land zone or not? What are your strategy to successfully integrate between design, construction, operation and so forth?

Ian Jones: [00:10:52] Sure. Well, we always try and choose, well, number one, it’s demand. We won’t touch anything unless there’s a demand for it. And that demand has to be fairly deep. So we always look for the path of progress and, uh, any land that we’re looking for, we prefer land.

[00:11:15] just because of time and cost, et cetera, and maybe missing the market that we’re aiming at. So basically the path of least resistance is try and a gap. And in every level, whether it’s the city or the construction end or whatever, we try and make sure that, um, the solution Fernandez and that we touch ends up, uh, a win-win solution.

[00:11:40] And we will, um, we’ll design or band or Val, you engineer, whatever we have to do and not there to maintain a fair bottom line. And again, we’ve got our three firewall, et cetera. So we do have some, uh, extra flex stability, but we won’t overpay for land a landowner, you know, a one stage. Called the profit of the land and doesn’t need any room at all.

[00:12:07] We’ll just bypass it in one of my favorite sayings is there’s always another deal. And so basically that’s, that’s how we approach any project. And if the, if for years, their antics byline is we seek to achieve a perfect balance of aesthetics economy and Mark appeal within the environment. Central and that, um, we try and do that on every single project and 2.0 every project, you know, hundreds and hundreds of items attached to it.

[00:12:39] And we just, we just approach each one of those line items. Um, she can not balance. And eventually as a developer, but as a detail guy and that’s for the chart on the B surveyor comes in because we are trained to look at every nut and bolt that goes into a project.

Hanh Brown: [00:12:58] The team is all in-house, it’s a private multi-disciplinary real estate development company, and you folks provide all facets of the real estate development process from concept to completion.

[00:13:11] So, what are you and your team doing to be so successful?

Ian Jones: [00:13:15] Well, we, uh, we like distinct, we look over the horizon and again, it gets us back to a demand always, but it’s not necessarily a current demand cause that can be fleeting, you know, within 12 months over, over. And, um, so we try and look at trends over the horizon for all demographics, whether it’s seniors or millennials, et cetera, et cetera.

[00:13:41] And they would build into that, you know, show a, when we introduced the past items up mentioned to you regarding, uh, the land, the United value, other items like that, the, for a specific market segment and that demand that we’re building into does for us what we really aim for. So I think, uh, part of, uh, the success, if you call it like that.

Hanh Brown: [00:14:09] Your team is a high performance work team.

[00:14:12] Your people are very goal-focused with specialized expertise that compliment each other’s skillset together, you and your team collaborate, innovate, and produce consistently superior results. So is that how you stayed in the business over the past 50 years? Is that right?

Ian Jones: [00:14:27] Yeah, and that stuff has to be a loyal and honest and a share.

[00:14:33] And the success will make sure that, you know what I mean, where you can only have so many shirts and shoes. So that isn’t what drives us to get a bigger one. Then a bigger one as to make sure that the gills of it. Do are successful. And when I say that, number one is construction land just goes without saying, we know they’ll get the security, but it goes without saying they have to be made good.

[00:14:59] And whole is number one than any investors. Number two. And then number three.

Hanh Brown: [00:15:05] So the lender always gets paid before the sponsor and the equity investor. If the returns are greater than expected, the share flows to the sponsor. But if the returns are lower than expected, the share flow is go to the equity investors.

[00:15:18] This allows the risk and return to be distributed in a more equitable manner is always lender always gets paid before the sponsor and the equity investor.

Ian Jones: [00:15:29] Yeah, yeah, yeah. Everybody has to leave the project and, you know, feeling good about it. There’s too many end up in litigation, et cetera. And we literally never get any litigation.

[00:15:43] There was once. When, uh, you know, we sold out to another developer or one of the projects and they tried to not pay as they were legally required to as, so we exercised a lot of GM, not a lot of people know about it. It’s a Latin, it’s less pendants in that slide, 10 for certificate pending litigation. And we registered that on day on where the bank, you know, their bank holds up.

[00:16:11] Any funds issues, as soon as they got a copy and we were paid the next day.

Hanh Brown: [00:16:15] So what advice can you give to college graduates that want to enter into this space?

Ian Jones: [00:16:20] Okay. Well, a couple of years ago, I, uh, I presented a talk at one of our local college GS and it was two, 350 graduate in engineering and architectural students.

[00:16:33] And, um, basically we’re all similar history, what I’m describing here and just who development works and how their degrees coupled with, uh, chartered quantity, surveyor degree would make them very formidable and, and by the me, and that is true. The Royal Institute of chartered surveyors. Headquartered in London, New York office and around the world, there’s about 120,000 at ICS property professionals around the world, mainly in the Commonwealth for them, not widely spread than the us, but I think they’re starting to make an approach.

[00:17:13] All the banks use our ICS members as loan monitors, you know, who they check. Contractors, monthly billings, et cetera, and the level and percentage of work completed, et cetera. So I was basically presenting the qualification as an add on to there and what they were going through. And everybody obviously knows what an architect energy meters, but the ACS is mainly known through the British Commonwealth.

[00:17:47] So a to add that as a lab to me, and I know I’m biased here, but then it makes the basis for the developer because we have, we have to pass 21 shot objects, everything, and all the categories of development from land rates through to asset management. So that’s what I would suggest to any student that, and I’m actually mentoring some through like that have shown interest and the passion, the passion is important.

[00:18:17] Not just, I’d like to be a developer, but you need that same passion. Um, you know, until you go in the night school for four nights a week for a couple of years. So that’s basically what I would suggest then. You know, looking back I’ve saved, followed the shame, uh, become a developer.

Hanh Brown: [00:18:39] Very good advice. What are the characteristics of a successful developer?

[00:18:44] I mean, I can think of a few adaptability tenacity, so please share with us.

Ian Jones: [00:18:49] Well, um, most, uh, you better be ready for challenges. One of my other things is, uh, development is like war planning, your guy grants strategy that changes by the hour. And you have to be very nimble and be able to, you know, say when everybody’s going to zag, you know, so, um, these are, uh, some of the qualities that just off the top of my head here, honesty, integrity, fairness, passion, and tenacity is a much knowledge and experience.

[00:19:28] Obviously being a student and frugal, but not selfish. It’d be inflexible and have been a serious hope is grounded in faith. And as Winston Churchill once said never, never, never give up. So that’s basically in a nutshell projects.

Hanh Brown: [00:19:46] Are you working in the senior living world?

[00:19:50] Ian Jones: [00:19:50] Okay, well, that brings, uh, that brings me to topic on our play on our very much front burner today, as I mentioned about looking over the horizon and trends and all the rest of it, as you can tell a joke and say arrived 1960, at 15 years old, I’m in the leading edge of the boomers.

[00:20:11] As a matter of fact, I like to claim Bremer ship because in the U S the boomer category starts in 1940. It’s like being after the war, but the war in Europe in may of 1945, even I was born in July of 45. I claim I claim boomer ship. So needless to say, then I’m in the leading edge of the boomers and I’ve been watching, you know, everything that’s been unfolding just about every other day, about the boomer demographic and everything that I’ve seen from that.

[00:20:46] You need the affordability crisis waiting less than five to 10 years for the seniors housing, et cetera.

Hanh Brown: [00:20:55]What is the forgotten middle. And why are you focusing on that demographic?

Ian Jones: [00:20:59] So we are very much concentrate, none that to market and not the, not the market that most developers are aiming at. And when I say that most developers that we see are an a U S that either imminent section eight housing or the high-end four or five 30% a month retirement homes.

[00:21:22] So somebody in the USA gave the. Balanced for the market, the type fatal, the forgotten middle, and that’s exactly what we’re going to be targeting and so much. So we’re basically blended all of the years that I’ve described to you here and to a unique new product, which should be getting introduced in the next two or three months, just as a pre-launch.

[00:21:49] And these are aimed squarely at the forgotten metal and were the retirement homes. And incidentally, I believe the retirement home developers are building obsolescence.

Hanh Brown: [00:22:00] So you’re a baby boomer developing with a mindset of how boomers want to live.

Ian Jones: [00:22:05] Is that right? As a boomer? I don’t want to know, but then at noon each day or lunch five each day, Then R and M first used the most, the salmon we’re getting here is so basically the product that we are going to be introducing is such a different project, a product of cooperative and Canada and the us.

[00:22:29] And since both of those countries are signature-based at the Berne convention. That also covers an 150 odd countries. No, I’m not suggesting that we have the depth to satisfy the demand, which is going to get exponentially worse as the next 10 years unfolds, but we’re willing to cooperate to license the cooperate to other build up developers.

[00:22:54] Because what we’re putting together as an entire, a different paradigm, which will include furnished suites with these services as required, et cetera. And these will be from 1300 a month. Look for 5,000 a month. And, uh, not only that we’ve accommodated the, uh, the design absorbed the, the same for the tape of better than lead, actually the lead classification as so much.

[00:23:24] So these will be on the leading edge of. Production of carbon footprint type projects. The projects themselves will aim 55 to 75 and dependent active boomers to have within them labs will allow the, uh, the boomers to keep learning. And

[00:23:49] last thing a lot longer, these stays and very, um, lots of experience. So we’re going to have in the building, not like we work, you know, they’ll get their ownerships right now, but that type of thing, where it would be an expanded business center with classes, even to the point of online university degrees, that type of thing.

[00:24:13] So that’s where we’re heading.

Hanh Brown: [00:24:15] So how are you serving the seniors in the forgotten middle to after construction? Are you offering to a non-profit housing provider?

Ian Jones: [00:24:22] I could elaborate a lot more, but I, I can, I’ve been prohibited by the PR company until it gets out there, but we will be doing that under a nonprofit type foundation.

[00:24:36] We’re in the middle of forming right now, so that we don’t want to own the finished building will be built and will be. Building them filling them, stabilizing them, and then turn them in the more to charity, like a church group or a non-profit housing provider. That’s having problems getting housing belts.

[00:24:56] So that’s the intention, the purpose that we’re actually unfolding as we speak. So that’s basically the big picture. These will be able to be absorbed and okay. Communities with, uh, over 30,000. Population because in a 55 to 75, that demographic male and female, it’s usually a bit 20, 25%. And that will be growing.

[00:25:23] We see this as, uh, a much, much better investment as student housing. Cause again, going all over the horizon with CA the price of tuition prices of students, student tuition, et cetera. And they’re being continually strong note financially. We see more online degrees. Which would negate as much demand for student housing.

[00:25:51] So that may have another five to 10 years that they couldn’t returns, et cetera, but they re they’re being built. It just concerns me. It concerns me as much as the don’t don’t try and nor with the forest, the condominiums that are going on right now. Because half of those units as improvement go Airbnb and re notice in front of the courts, because the condominium boards are up in arms with these strangers walk up and down their hallways and the courts to say against the Airbnb, those condo projects can stop overnight.

[00:26:25] So this is show, this is the sort of things we look at and trying to anticipate, but not always correct. A few bloody noses.

Hanh Brown: [00:26:34] I know there’s some confidential information that you’re not ready to share. And I’d like to have you come back in a few months to share the specifics of your senior living project for the forgotten.

Ian Jones: [00:26:46] Yeah. And I’ll have to revisit that was here a few months down the road, because again, um, uh, uh, um, uh, committed the entire team to, to T DS, et cetera, so that it’s not going to go before a, B, C it should. And that’s, uh, you know, a couple of months a week. Cause obviously we want you to talk a bit specific sites at the time, as I mentioned to you, we’ve got an offer and then some Detroit property.

[00:27:11] And, um, I have an affinity for Dallas and we have been talking to some people in Houston. So there are plenty of, uh, properties that can comedy describing incidentally, these buildings where they’re going to be three to six story. Maximum six story from now. So they’re mainly suburban and one to two acres, maximum five acres.

[00:27:36] We will also build seniors rental bungalows on the same site, you know, and they’ll be able to get the same programs, et cetera. But the ideal is a three to six 30 buildings depending on their local demand. And, uh, you know, in a near suburban area. But the, the Kentucky fried chicken formula to keep under wraps as we speak.

Hanh Brown: [00:27:58] So what are some significant differences you see developing between the US and Canada.

Ian Jones: [00:28:04] except maybe California, because of the regulatory? Uh, Levels there, which are similar in Toronto, frankly, they say, if you can get something built in Tron or you can get a belt in California, so they’re more or less equally cool.

[00:28:19] But the landing communities in the us are more entrepreneurial than Canada. That’s pretty safe Canadian financial systems. So when the us went through the meltdown, But it can be frustrating to actually get a speculative construction launch. Whereas it’s a bit easier than the U S it’s not as easy anymore.

[00:28:43] The product is right. The much prefer being in the U S and part of that reason is in Canada, we have this gym called development charges, and I’ll just give you an example of a condominium. Condominiums these days, a you have to pay the city 40,000 a unit in order to get your paramount, you know, so if you’re building 200 units, I say million dollars, plus your permit fees and the city, uh, uses that for the additional services or build a library or whatever.

[00:29:15] Well, in the U S you know, the levy is nowhere near that until the development charges act here. So between that and the, uh, you know, the bonds and everything that can be done in the U S the U S looks for ways to get projects built Canada, it’s the opposite. They try and make sure that they be so conservative that sometimes the thing never gets built.

[00:29:43] Well, I will see you as you know, usually tries to find a way. So it’s just a whole different mentality. And, and just to touch on a low battery here, the Scotland had what was called the declaration of our bras and 1320, and that became the U S declaration of independence, you know, so there was a lot of freedom.

[00:30:07] Lots of Scott’s laugh. Scotland. They come to America and that DNA is still there. I know there’s other nationalities, but that’s basically the big difference that you can do attitude. Whereas in Canada is conservative. Make me believe it 110% agree.So that’s it.

Hanh Brown: [00:30:31] gotta be doing something right with regard to your health, physically and mentally to make it through five recessions, you are an active boomer.

[00:30:39] How do you keep your mental attitude and mental agility going strong?

Ian Jones: [00:30:44] Okay. Well that starts with healthy eating a major part of it, not just a fucking plug, the, uh, the low carb diet, you know, like, cause that, you know, with all his fresh vegetables and everything, cook dinner, stir fry, I don’t like fresh vegetables cooked in a stir fry.

[00:31:03] I have that basically once or twice a day. And I’ve been having up for, you know, a couple of years. So healthy eating is one of the major ones. The other is an incidentally that comes with a little exercise. I just don’t like exercise, know no one at the gym at five. And if I’ve been on and you know, I totally dislike running the mile a day school.

[00:31:29] So. It came from that, I guess. And addition to that, I, uh, you know, I pray every morning, you know, and the 30 minute quiet time and then read a wide range of real estate publications, mainly online, clearly emails, no TV, you know, I consider 99% of the rubbish and aspire to be content or whether it’s all or with much.

[00:31:55] So. It’s just, um, uh, I like to, I like to enrich other people’s lives better. What drives me?

Hanh Brown: [00:32:04] So what do you see on the horizon for senior living? What are you concentrating on?

Ian Jones: [00:32:09] This is a part of the reason why we’re concentrating on the forgotten metal that I described to you. And incidentally, I will see we’re calling the joy concept.

[00:32:19] That’s what you’re going to see when it gets introduced, then. The reason for that is that we want AI instilled joy and people are going to be living in these because so many of them are living in loneliness or financially burden. The whole thing is basically to try and instill joy and to them, I’ve got a playlist already of about 80 songs from the sixties and late fifties that are going to be playing in the background so that when people come out of their unit, they’re gonna hear, um, whether it’s the beach boys or Moton.

[00:32:51] We all know there’s a major, major problem right now, because there is no government funding to speak of direct funding other than through section eight, et cetera, which is all subsidized and anything that’s subsidized. These days is very difficult to acquire. So it’s not helping reduce these major waiting list of five or 10 years are only going to go worse.

[00:33:15] We’re looking at new financing or tax break for the affordable seniors housing that’s needed. And on the other end of it, you know, you’ll get the expensive.

Hanh Brown: [00:33:28] In senior living community. You start with some upfront costs, assisted living communities and independent living communities generally have a monthly rate from 1500 to 6,000, perhaps.

[00:33:38] And offers certain hospitality for care services available for additional monthly fee. Remember the typical home ownership, cause for, let’s say taxes, insurance, utilities, repairs, and so forth are all covered by the senior living monthly service fee.

Ian Jones: [00:33:55] And even the independent living within those communities are pretty expensive too.

[00:34:01] And incidentally, those units are even more difficult to finance because they get. They got assessed and appraised there’s business. So they’ve got a much higher cap rate than normal apartment building, you know, and that’s part of how we’re going to be able to answer this. So there’s, there’s less and less of them.

[00:34:20] Yeah. Model get built, but it takes a bit, three years. They fully fell. One of those to the stabilization.

Hanh Brown: [00:34:27] So lending is tighter. Some developers are finding it a little bit more difficult to get money, to build new senior housing projects, issues like construction, labor costs, supply government regulations are causing some lenders to be less inclined to lend money.

[00:34:41] These regulations for banks limit the amount of real estate loans they can make for construction based on their capital. It used to be that if you want to be a developer and you own land, you can contribute the land into the venture and get credit for that land. When you get the loan, it’s a bit more difficult.

Ian Jones: [00:34:58] So they’re very difficult to get financed. Unless of course you’re financing them yourself. But if you’re using any bank finance, it’s difficult. So the, the demand is nowhere near going to be getting met in the States. Within 10 years, there’s going to be like 18 million in that senior category. And there’s only about four or 5 million in Canada, but it’s the same in proportion in the U S.

[00:35:27] What’s the challenge of the financing and the governments are strapped in or with a major Def. So reluctantly, uh, really building social housing. Think-tank, that’s one thing that in Glasgow than the early sixties, 60,000 social housing units, and within 10 years, I think it was Robert Moses, us express. We, uh, type thing is what’s needed.

[00:35:53] I don’t see it coming. No, because the us has now 23 trillion deficit and all the rest of it in Canada, similar in proportion. So the governments don’t see helping the high end of it. It’s just a portion of the market. And there’s lots of people, seniors that could have afforded a sale in their houses, but their houses took a hit and then great recession.

[00:36:18] And they’ve been helping their kids with these expensive tuition. The whole mid market is trapped. Lots of them. That’s why they need a lesser expensive option. That’s what we are going to be.

Hanh Brown: [00:36:33] What calculations have you come up with in determining how much the forgotten market is currently paying and how much they can afford to pay for senior housing?

Ian Jones: [00:36:43] We did, we did some, uh, also some quick numbers and for a typical house, the seniors, the, their house, the movement is 5,000 a month that our money in 12 years. And it was nothing left in the bank. With our product there after 19 years of getting, um, quite a few hundred thousand left, I’ll take a typical one in Toronto, just for a quick, quick explanation.

[00:37:10] If I seen it for a senior couple who sells the Toronto home mortgage-free for $800,000 and moves into a 5,000 a month, third place in 14, 19 years, the total money was nothing less than the bank. Our product that we’re going to be bringing out. The use the funds and investments obviously, and that more or less pays for the 1300 and at the end of the 19 years of 500,000 left in the bank, you know, so these are the, the sort of approaches that we taking.

[00:37:44] Uh, the product has to be delivered the, in finance, So 1500 a month. And part of the reason doing it the way we’re doing it. And I won’t say this, and a lot of other developers would just bypass it with the failing all the profit for 10 years, that the project is financed. And that second mortgage that we’d put in place we’ll have ventures differ for that same.

[00:38:11] 10 years until the mortgage is paid down on the first mortgage. These are all the areas that we’re trying to make sure that not only does that address the forgotten middle, but it basically gives some, um, a much, much more affordable option and incidentally the quality and a resin that these buildings will be every bit as good as the, you know, the retirement homes eco.

[00:38:32] There may not have leased clothes and salmon or steak every other day, but we don’t think the boomers in general are looking for that. We’re looking for an affordable place to stay.

Hanh Brown: [00:38:46] Well, thank you so much for your time. I know it is short to squeeze in 50 years. 50 years of development in a 40 minute conversation, I look forward to having you back next time to share with us your joy project, senior living.

Ian Jones: [00:39:01] Okay. Well, our website is a BGI group. That’s boy, girl, India, BGI group.ca for Canada PGI group.ca. And my direct email is ian@pgigroup.ca and. I mean, John’s a president and owner of BGI group. So that’s how they could do it. No gladly answer any calls I can answer and keep them up-to-date.

Hanh Brown: [00:39:33] Best to you, Ian, that was Ian Ian Jones from Bridgeton group incorporated, who has lived through five recessions, 50 years in the real estate development constructing over twenty-five million square feet of real estate in the U S and Canada.

[00:39:51] What a wealth of knowledge that you’ve shared with us. And thank you so much for being here.