Mike Holmgren - NFL Legendary Coach

What does it take to lead at home when your day job means leading a locker room under stadium lights? We sit down with Coach, Mike Holmgren—legendary coach of the Packers, 49ers, and Seahawks—to talk about love, honesty, and what it really means to leave work at the door. From meeting his wife at 12 to raising four daughters and now cheering for nine grandkids, Coach Holmgren opens up about rhythms that kept his family grounded through late nights, missed holidays, and cross-country flights.

Coach shares vivid stories: walking through Lambeau’s tailgates, learning to respect a whole state’s passion without letting it rule the household, and choosing faith over a city tennis final as a teenager. He breaks down the “coach-to-dad” switch with simple practices—family dinners, a five-minute huddle with his wife before the kids pile in, and a commitment to listen without turning feedback into pressure. We dig into youth sports, the infamous car ride home, and a better script: “I love watching you play.” Along the way, we revisit the sting of injuries and the quiet courage of getting back up when dreams bend, not break.

If you’re a parent trying to juggle ambition and presence, this conversation gives you a clear playbook: lead with love, tell the truth, ask better questions, and let your kids choose their passions. 

We also highlight causes close to Coach Holmgren's heart—the Salvation Army’s community work and Circlewood’s blend of faith and care for the land on Camano Island. Enjoy the stories, steal the habits, and pass them forward. If this resonated, follow the show, share it with a friend, and leave a review to help more families find tools that work.

Transcript

Meet Coach Mike Holmgren

SPEAKER_03 0:00

Coaching, I did it my whole life, loved it. But I always thought there were things certain things are more important. And uh that kind of kept me going all the time. When I was in Green Bay as an example, uh I was asked a number of times, uh I know the pressure of coaching, it must be just get to you after a while. And I said, you know what? I really love my job and I love teaching, I love coaching. That's not it. But in Wisconsin, as an example, yeah, honestly, I felt responsible for the mood of the entire state because that whole state is involved with the Packers. And that was the thing, that was the thing that I would think about every once in a while. And uh that was that was a little harder of the coaching part of it. I could I could handle.

SPEAKER_02 0:49

Hi, I'm Riley.

SPEAKER_06 0:50

And I'm Renner. And this is my dad, Joe. And I'm Casey Jaccox, the host of quarterback dad cast. Everybody, I started this podcast to truly understand how I can be a better father myself. I did it because I wanted to learn from dads just like you. I wanted to learn how you were raised, I wanted to learn what your current family looks like, I wanted to understand what you learned from your parents now that you're a dad. I also wanna learn what you did not learn from your parents. I wanted to understand how your parents helped you. And lastly, with all that information, how are you using it with those experiences to become the ultimate leader or quarterback of your household? I am more than fired up now. It's through Craig Olsen is the um offensive coordinator of the Oakland Raiders.

SPEAKER_05 1:29

And people say, well, what did football teach you? Well, you know, teaching a lot about this one is a little bit of a better father, you know. Every twice a year I try to be outlooked my family up and get the house. Everybody gets up there. And let's talk about where we're at right now and what the plan is going for over the next six months. As the father, look at myself as a quarterback in my family.

SPEAKER_06 1:52

Our next guest is that the voice of the elevator is Rick Rizz.

SPEAKER_02 1:56

Yes, that was the story of my life. We had a fan left behind my house. My dad would come out there after a long day of work and play baseball with us. He coached, he also painted all the fence signs for the sponsors. He painted all those signs, he painted the logos of all our teams and uh even upright some games.

SPEAKER_06 2:17

After listening to each episode, I'm sure you will laugh. You might even cry, but you will definitely learn something from other dads. I guarantee that you will walk away with actionable tasks that you can apply to your life right now to become that ultimate quarterback and leader of your household. Renzo Romart is the head coach of Cover9. He's married with three daughters, and they're gonna gain wisdom from him.

SPEAKER_01 2:37

When someone that we've coached comes back and has their kids with them, tell coach what I tell you all the time, and he'll say something that we used to tell his dad. When you see that they're successful and they want to share that success with you, that's more important than any wins and losses to me.

SPEAKER_06 2:55

So step back, relax, and subscribe now to the Quarterback Deadcast. All right, everybody, welcome to the Quarterback Deadcast. This is Casey J. Cox. We are at the start of season seven, and I could not be more excited to uh to bring our next guest on. Um, and you might have heard of him. He he spent time at USC, but that's probably not maybe you heard of him if you're a hardcore Trojan to fight on. Uh he met his wife, I believe, at age 12, which I have that in common if I have my info right. He spent time with the San Francisco 49ers, the Green Bay Packers from 1992 to 1998, uh, the Seattle Seahawks, my squad from 1999 to 2008. Went to the Browns. He's also a 2026 finalist for the Hall of Fame, which is going to get my vote. He spent time with some people you might have heard of, guys like Steve Young, Brett Favre, Joe Montana, and Maddie Hasselbeck. Um, but more importantly, that's not why we're having this gentleman on. We're having Coach Mike Holmgren on to learn about how he's working hard to become or has worked hard to become that ultimate quarterback or leader of his household household. So without further ado, Coach Mike Holmgren, welcome to the quarterback dot cast.

SPEAKER_03 4:00

Uh Casey, thank you very, very much. I I appreciate it. And uh when I heard you were gonna give me a shot a shot, I I I got excited myself. So you know why, you know why? Because, you know, and you said it, coaching, I did it my whole life, loved it. But I always thought there were things, certain things are more important, and uh that kind of kept me going all the time.

Gratitude And Family Foundations

SPEAKER_06 4:25

Well, uh it's it's it's you had a heck heck of a run, and um we gotta give love to to the one and only Richard Fain uh for making today's uh episode possible. Dickie Fain, thank you, sir. Um, but coach, we always start out each episode with gratitude. So tell me, what are you most grateful for as a dad or grandfather today?

SPEAKER_03 4:44

Well, today, particularly around Christmas time as we're talking, um I get a chance to be with family. I have four daughters, nine grandkids, and uh a beautiful wife of 54 years. And we get a chance to be together. You know, I for years, Casey, I I I missed, and I've said this, I miss stuff because you work like a you work crazy hours when you're coaching, and and now since I've stopped, um, and and actually during the time, I always tried to put family first if possible. And uh uh, you know, that's I'm very grateful for that. I'm grateful for the people in my church growing up. As a little kid, they prayed for me, they kept praying for me the whole way. And so uh I appreciate that.

SPEAKER_06 5:34

Love it. Well, what I'm what I'm grateful for is I got I similar answer. I got I got the family home. I have a I have a 19-year-old son in college, he plays golf in college, and my my 17-year-old daughter, she's a senior in high school. She we got a high school basketball game tonight, so I'm grateful I get to go watch her compete. And um, it's just it's fun having the all the all the crew at the at the house. And my son is a like a psychotic Seahawks fan, almost like we may need therapy. Like he reminds me of myself when when you know, because I know like when I had a bad day at work, I don't think you guys cared when you guys were coaching the Hawks, but God, when I when you guys would lose, it'd be like, like my wife's like, hey, settle down. I'm like, I don't know, but I love them so much.

SPEAKER_03 6:14

You know, it's it's and and I understood that when I was in Green Bay as an example, uh, I was asked a number of times. I I know the pressure of coaching, it must be just get to you after a while. And I said, you know what? I really love my job and I love teaching, I love coaching. That's not it. But in Wisconsin, as an example, yeah, honestly, I felt responsible for the mood of the entire state because that whole state is involved with the Packers. And that was the thing, that was the thing that I would think about every once in a while. And uh that was that was a little harder. The coaching part of it, I could, I could handle.

SPEAKER_06 6:58

Yeah, I can't even imagine that. Uh I would weigh on you, but you did it and you did it well. And I think even before we we before we record, I mentioned we spoke last week. I was one of the coolest moments of my fan life is um you coached a former teammate of mine, John Kitna, and I I watched you guys play your return to Monday night uh in Lambeau. Um and uh what a what a fantastic I think we got Hawks got the win that night too.

SPEAKER_03 7:25

Yeah, yeah, we did. That was uh, you know, there's certain things you you work for a long time or coach for a long time, you don't remember everything, but that night, um I it was my first time going back to Green Bay. Um my kids had gone to school and were going to school in Chicago, and um I said, and they know they'd always come up to the games in Green Bay. I said, Don't I don't want you to come to this game. I'm not sure how they're gonna react to me, and I don't want you there. If it's you know sketchy, I don't want you there. But I will say this. I I walked onto the field and and a few people teased me a little bit, but all in all, they were wonderful. I mean, the fans were there wonderful. And uh and John played a really fine football game. We won the football game, and and uh we got off to a pretty good start.

Green Bay Pressure And Fan Culture

SPEAKER_06 8:17

So cool. Yeah, the thing that blew me away about Lambo was just walking up to um the game and like walking through a neighborhood, and there was like I remember vividly a semi-empty semi-trailer in a guy's front yard with furniture and extension cords to the house, and they were like, that was they couldn't, they couldn't get seats. They're like, We're gonna pretend we're at Lambo, we're gonna sit in this trailer, tailgate outside my front yard in a semi.

SPEAKER_03 8:43

Couldn't believe it. Yeah, no, they're the fans there they they on occasion and in the parking lot. If you remember, everyone's cooking something. There's barbecues everywhere. And the head of public relations for the Packers, after not long after I was there, said, After the games, why don't you just walk through the crowd and then just you know, that'd be really cool. Well, I did okay, I said, Oh, okay, I'll try that. I was unaware of what would happen, and then I went through and I I couldn't get 10 feet without having a hot dog given to me or a beer or whatever, whatever they were doing. And so I realized, well, as much as that'd be fun, I can't do that. So I tried it one time, that was it. You need to ride home. That's right.

SPEAKER_06 9:28

Um, well, bring me inside um the the the core huddle of you got you and I believe your wife's name's Kathy. Yes. So you and Kathy, talk about your your daughters, um, what was life like growing up growing up for them, and what what was like you know, things that that um light lighted them up.

Raising Four Daughters On A Coach’s Schedule

SPEAKER_03 9:46

Well, you know, uh I have four girls, and one's an attorney, one's a doctor, and two teachers. So yeah, they're they're doing great. And and uh when they were little, you know, we had the twins first. And then Emily came four years later, and then Gretchen four years after that. But I was a high school coach and teacher in San Francisco at a school Sacred Heart. And as much as I love that, uh I was only making six hundred bucks a month. And and our apartment or the house we rented was like three hundred dollars, and my car was a hundred, so we had to it was financially it was tough in the beginning, but the kids they were awesome. And and Kathy is was a nurse, had been a nurse for a long time, and to supplement whatever we do to help us get through the week, she was working like one night a week. And so that was that was the start. And they went everywhere with us. We have a the for good fortune of having a a cabin in the Santa Cruz Mountains, that's between San Francisco and Carmel, for those people who know California a little bit, and it's in a Christian conference center, and that's our where where summers were. And you saw them grow up. I taught them to swim, all that kind of stuff. And so as they grew up, then they got very interested in football and what was happening. They go to the games all the time. And um no, it was it it was I appreciated them so much to the point where we reached a point sometime at the cabin years later. I was doing things with the grandkids. And uh Kathy said, You you know, you're really with the grandkids a lot. I said, I think I'm trying to make up for lost time. With my own children and coaching, I'd miss some things uh that I would have enjoyed going to. Sports events, things they were involved with. And and uh and one of the girls came over to me, one of the older ones, and said, Dad, we knew we knew you don't have to apologize for anything. We knew you'd rather be home with us, and and uh so that was the atmosphere around our house. We had dinner together, that was kind of a a thing. Everyone had their own places to sit. How's your day? Everyone got to voice their opinion, and now that they're older, sometimes I regret that I let them voice their opinion because now they have a lot of opinions on what I do, right? But no, it was it was a we had a great start, and uh everyone was healthy, and it was a good start for us.

SPEAKER_06 12:28

Very cool. Well, and I I think what you said, right, it's gonna speak to a dad at home because you don't need to be an NFL coach to have that feeling of whether you're traveling, whether you got to go to a big meeting, and you and you miss something, and you just that's I mean, we're all human, we we feel that that guilt wherever you want to say, it's like, oh I got I wish I could be there. And I mean, I'm gonna experience it this year. I I'm gonna miss two of my daughters' basketball games because I do like executive coaching and I I s speak at like conferences, and I didn't mean to do that, kind of like this job found me, but it's like I just I gotta do it, and you know, and uh there's other stuff I've said no to, so I I I appreciate you you said that's gonna uh I think speak to people. Did I have my research correct? Did you and Kathy meet at age 12?

SPEAKER_03 13:14

Yeah, we did actually in this place. Okay, it's called Mission Springs. It's a covenant church, it is the church we go to, and it's a conference center. It has uh probably 105 uh leaseholders, uh leaseholders. The church owns the land, you have the you own the house. But uh the summer camping for kids. And in the Bay Area, San Francisco Bay Area area, the the kids would come there for the summer. A lot of kids. And uh a lot of people met their spouses there. They you know they so anyway, uh Kathy was there and she's the cutest girl on campus. And I was afraid, but yeah, that's when we met. And uh she says that I proposed when we were 13. I don't quite remember the exact details of that, but she said, no, we're 13. So I was so then, but then 10 years later, we wound up getting married when we had both graduated from college.

SPEAKER_06 14:20

Very cool. Well, I I'd never said I never thought I would say I got something in common with Coach Holmgrid, other than we both played quarterback back in the day. It's an Uncle Rico moment right there. But uh my wife, I've married me and wife have been together 27 years. We met um at age 12 in seventh grade. Yeah, and uh started dating. She doesn't think we dated in eighth grade. I I thought we did, but uh, but yeah, we went to separate college. I went to Central Watch where I met John, and then my wife went to um UW and we got married. Literally, I my last year of playing was fall of '98, and then we got married in February. Wow. Been married ever since.

SPEAKER_03 14:55

And well, that would that's the interesting thing because it's similar. Kathy went to school in Chicago, yeah, North Park University, and I went to school in Los Angeles. So for four or five years, you know, we'd see each other in the summer then. And back there at the summer as we got older, and then after she graduated, she went to Africa as a nurse for a year. And I had my pro football thing try out and all that for a year, and then when she came back, that's when we got married. So we had been apart for a long time, and we each did our own thing for a while, and but then it worked out well for me. She she kind of saved me. She she's really good. I'm kind of a knucklehead at times. So she it was good that we hooked up.

SPEAKER_06 15:41

Well, I always call you this this podcast I've been doing now for we're on seven years, and I can't believe I mean it was just a fun project, and it's it's now a it's a way that I always joke with people, but I mean it. It's it's like free therapy for me as a dad. It helps me stay grounded, helps me stay curious, helps me be a better listener. And um it just it's it's just crazy this journey's on because we're all I'm all we're all of us are dads trying to be our best version of our of ourselves. And um, you know, one question I was gonna ask that I always like asking people is like, talk about what was life like growing up for you and the impact that mom and dad had on you.

SPEAKER_03 16:15

Yeah, I I grew up uh my my I'm I'm Swedish Swedish and Swedish heritage. Uh I'll start with my grandparents. They came over from Sweden, and my father was the only child. And uh they came to San Francisco, they've been involved in the Salvation Army, and they they bought a home and then they started the Swedish American Bakery in San Francisco, which was not a huge bakery, but a very popular place. At Christmas time, I remember there were lines down the street to get in there and and buy what they were making there. And we lived upstairs uh in a in a little apartment above the bakery. And uh bakers' hours are worse than football hours. They're they're they're opening up at three and baking the stuff. And at any rate, we were there and uh uh I have a uh brother and two sisters. Uh and so we had four kids and and and and uh my mom and dad, we we were very involved and at in the church in San Francisco, the Covenant Church. And uh I what I remember is that we there wasn't a lot, but you didn't know that. We didn't know, I didn't know the financial situation of the family. There was just a lot of love and and uh people cared one another, and you knew that. With that having said, my dad was a was a very big guy. He's one of the first linemen, football linemen of big size. You know, he's six three, about two ninety. And uh they called him tiny when he played. And and he was he was firm with me with his sons. And unfortunately, he you know, he passed away at 48 and uh never got to see his grandkids very much. But and my mom was a beautiful woman, and and you know, there's just a lot of love in the family, and you knew that. You felt that as as a kid growing up in that family.

SPEAKER_06 18:22

How did your dad pass, don't you ask him?

Faith, Honesty, And Early Life Lessons

SPEAKER_03 18:25

Well, of course, he you know, they they didn't know all as much as they know about hearts in those days, so he had a heart attack, originally had a heart attack, and at the age of 15 I drove him to the hospital. Uh and then he ten years later, or about ten years later, then he had the second heart attack and that was it. Um But he was just a big, big guy. They he probably you know they didn't have heart, they didn't have the stuff they do now. If they had it now, he'd he would have lasted longer, but um that's that's what happened.

SPEAKER_06 18:57

How how did Pops fill as a lineman letting his son play quarterback?

SPEAKER_03 19:00

Well, he was you know, he was at every high school game I had. Uh he went out of USC to all the games and um he just you know when I got I remember it distinctly, this is after when I got cut finally from the New York Jets, he picked me up at the airport uh when I flew home from New York. And I and I said, because he was uh he was such uh a good fan and and uh so encouraging to me about everything in sports while not being overbearing. Um and I I told him, and I'm sorry, I didn't make it. He goes, Hey, you did everything you could. Thank you. You know, and it was it was just one of those things. So the the there there was no big pressure, but I knew that uh they loved going to the football games. My grandparents went with them, the people from Sweden, high school games, and And they had to tell my grandma which number I was. Who is he? Which one is he? You know. And they said, the tall one. He's the tall one out there.

SPEAKER_06 20:10

That's so funny. Was when you when when football came to an end for you as a player, was it harder on you or your dad?

SPEAKER_03 20:18

Uh I think it was harder on me. It took it took me a while. He just he just enjoyed every minute of it and was proud of me. And uh, you know, things happen on injuries or whatever happens, and then it it didn't work out. I thought I thought I was gonna be an NFL star, you know. And I went to UFC. I thought I was gonna be kind of in the movies, too, you know. So when none of that happened, then all of a sudden, what do I do now? That's what I went through. You know, I did my life goal was to do these other things. That didn't happen. So what do I do now? So I went through a time there of of searching, I would say, about what's next.

SPEAKER_06 21:02

Yeah, it's it's I asked that question because like when I got done, um it was like almost like a relief. I I try I got teased in the arena league, I had a chance to go play overseas, and I just I was like just I would think I was ready to make football my next, make business my next football. And I remember like when I got done our last game, I came back and it was me, my girlfriend at the time, and then my wife, and my guard, my tackle and my running back, and we went to went to a bar grab beer, and I remember just like it hit me. I was like, and I like cried for like probably 45 minutes. And it was like, I'm done. Yeah, and I remember my dad, I think it was really hard on him, and my dad too he passed away December 29th, 2021. So we're coming up on his anniversary. And uh, but like I the thing that I remember about him is you know, every game, and he almost bankrupt himself my senior year in college, going to these random towns and you know, watching us play. Even when I was a freshman John senior year, I was just the number three. So all I did was warm up and then give signal, yeah, be a goof off the kitten. And my dad flew down to Texas to watch us in the playoffs. I'm like, what are you doing? He's like, I want to watch you warm up. Nice. Like, so it's like those are the things that like I as a dad now I reflect on that, you know, I love just like trying to create those memories for um, as you know, you showed the story with your dad made made me think of that. What what were the values that mom and dad taught that really impacted you uh in life and later as a dad?

SPEAKER_03 22:25

Well, I think I think they talked a lot about honesty and uh respecting each other, respecting other people. Uh as I said, we grew up in the church, and so there was there was some feeling there of of of uh you know knowing knowing who Jesus was and how he reacted to people, how what he did for people. And they wanted our lives to be similar. And uh there was no um they were party. If that ever didn't happen on occasion, if for example, uh I w didn't treat my younger sister the way my father thought I should treat her, then that stopped right then. Boom. You know, now this is why. And then I listened, I learned to listen, which was probably a good thing. And no, they just uh they they set a really good example for for all of us. Um, you know, he was the chairman of a of the church, he was the chairman of Mission Springs Conference Center, he was the chairman of the California real estate. He he he was a leader in a lot of things, and really very much a leader at home. And so, but he worked, uh, you know, I he he was not there all the time because he had all these other things. It reminded me a little bit of what I went through when I got older as far as with the family. And so I just tried to be like that with my kids because I believed he he did it correctly. Now, did mom work too, or did she stay home? She stayed home for the most part. Uh, she worked as a secretary in in medical offices at times, but uh she she stayed home most of the time.

Choosing Family Over Spotlight

SPEAKER_06 24:19

Relating it to honesty and respect. I mean, obviously, two. I mean, I when you said that I had like stories of my own learnings of my own immaturity growing up. For you, coach, is there a story that really cemented those values to you that maybe you can you can draw and share this?

Switching Gears From Coach To Dad

SPEAKER_03 24:35

Well, I had a um I was going through confirmation. You're 13 years old, and in our church, you go through this like a year of teaching and and so on and so forth. At the same time, for Christmas one year, they my dad gave me a tennis racket for Christmas, and I hadn't played tennis, but I was so I started hitting the tennis ball. In San Francisco, they have a system, playground system. So districts have playgrounds. And you know, there's there was West Portal Playground. That's where I hung out with a bunch of guys all the time. There was another one up here, there's all over the city, a different diverse groups, you know, but that's where we hung out. And then the system, they would play sports. So you'd play softball playground system, basketball playground system, and they played tennis. So my park director gave me the I said I got a new record. He goes, let's let's try this. So the long and the short of it is I'm I made it to the city championships, and I I just had Levi's and a t-shirt. I didn't have any of the cool stuff that John McEnroe wore or anything like that. So it turns out I'm going through confirmation at the same time. The finals for confirmation or for the tennis was Saturday at Golden Gate Park. If you've ever been to San Francisco, they have a huge tennis facility in the middle of the park. That's where the city championship finals are gonna be on Saturday. Well, that was my confirmation day. And so I went to my dad and I said, Would you mind talking to the pastor and telling him that I've got this tennis thing I gotta go to? And he goes, he looks at me and he goes, You're the one playing tennis. You go talk to the pastor. And I knew they were good friends, but I thought it'd be the easy way out. And I said, Dad, come on. He goes, No, you you have a talk with him, tell him what it is, and so on and so forth, see what happens. So I go, Oh, I don't want to do this. So I went and talked to the pastor, and he was a very he had a very deep voice and very, very, very pastoral. And he goes, Michael, Michael, Michael, I can't tell you what to do. I want you to go home and pray about this and then make your decision. I go, okay, no one, no one's helping me with this. Right. So I get home, I tell my dad, he goes, Okay, go ahead. I mean, do what you have to do. But it reminded me of a little bit of honesty and and then respect I had for for the pastor. So I did, and I said, Okay, I gotta, I'm confirmation is important, I gotta do this. So I go and tell my playground director. I said, I gotta be at church on Sunday or on Saturday. And he goes, What? You're playing for the championship, you know? You can go to church on Sunday. I said, I'm in confirmation, I gotta do this. I'm sorry. So okay, I I go through, I go back to the playground on Monday afternoon, like I always did. And I go up to him and go, who won that thing? And he goes, the city commissioner, they had a little vote and meeting. They moved your championship game to this next Thursday. Nice, you can play in it. I go, wow. You know, it was the answer to prayer. Wow. So, but then I go to the championship game and I'm playing against the guy who was a country club guy. He had the white outfit on, the white tennis shoes. I had it were rackets. I had my one racket in my hand and my Levi's. And uh uh the the guy who was the referee, I remember, came up to me and goes, I don't know if you have much of a chance in this one. And uh he was right. I was it was 6-0, two sets. He beat me 6-0, but then it was 7-6. I came back in the second one, nice, almost, almost beat him. So, but that's that's a story, that's a crazy story about I respected my father and I respected uh the pastor, and they were very honest with me. And it it ended kind of the way I hoped it would end, but I didn't I didn't think it would.

SPEAKER_06 29:21

Yeah. Oh, what a cool story. So now I have this vision, and and I don't know if the quarterbacks you coached, um, coach, but like most of the quarterbacks I know, we have a screw loose and goofy, just real goofy. And so, like, and as you're saying that, I got this vision in my head, and you and like, you know, jean shorts, Levi's frayed, and this guy's in like just all white, tight, got a headband, afro, wristbands, maybe some goggles. You got them all. So good. Um, as you think about like the your journey as a coach, and you mentioned this in the beginning, we kicked off about you know, sometimes you had had to miss things. Um maybe talk talk about the just the mindset as like being present as a as a coach, but also being present as a dad when you had to kind of flip the switch.

SPEAKER_03 30:11

Well, yeah, and that and I think when I have talked to young coaches or you know, had an opportunity to talk at different clinics and things like that, sometimes this comes up. And I I think it's a good opportunity too. So I go to work, and when I was at work, I was at work, and I committed that. I thought to be the best teacher I could be, to be the best coach I could be, and to help these kids, and then later on, the big little kids be the best they can be. That was my job, and so I was committed and focused on that. Having said that, then when I'd go home, I switched gears and I was able to do that. I think I was able to do that. If Kathy was part of this thing and you asked her, I think she would say that too. You know, so I said we all sat down for dinner at a certain time and it it just switched over. So I thought it was very important to be the father at home, not necessarily the coach at home. And so, and to this day the kids talk about that. And and I told you earlier that I did miss some things and I had to be gone sometimes. But they they knew, and they told me this, they knew if I had a choice that I they want, I'd like to be at they knew I'd want to be at their tennis match or their game or whatever, and I would go when I could. But early on, I learned that and I tried to do that. You know, as you well know, the pro hours are are it's kind of crazy, actually. Yeah, you know. We schedule I'd Monday I wouldn't get home until 11 o'clock at night, Tuesday, 11 o'clock at night, Wednesday, 9 o'clock at night, Thursday. I got home for dinner. Friday, I got home for dinner. But then if you traveled for the 49ers, you left on Friday. So I was gone three days, had one night for dinner with the kids, then you're gone and you're back at it on Monday. And you do that, you know, you miss Thanksgiving, you miss Christmas, you miss all sorts of stuff. Yeah. So, but having said that, I tried, and they knew they knew I was trying.

SPEAKER_06 32:33

Yep. Well, and I think I mean now coaches have FaceTime, they got Zoom, they got all these tools. Back then you had a phone with a long cord.

SPEAKER_03 32:42

That's right. I mean, it was uh a lot of things had changed, and that's certainly one of them. And uh, and now we didn't have computers doing stuff then. I remember getting a game ready and he had Super 8 film, and I had to learn how to splice it together, do stuff. And now you look at a game and they have they have for years I was on the competition committee, and they didn't want any electronics. They didn't want any electronics. Now I see everyone has one of those uh iPads on the on the field, on the sideline. You know, so things have changed.

SPEAKER_06 33:19

Yeah, and it's even getting down to even high school level. I mean, I have buddies I played with that, they're high school coaches, they have iPads on the high school. Oh my god.

SPEAKER_04 33:26

Oh no, I know, I know.

Youth Sports: Joy, Pressure, And Perspective

SPEAKER_06 33:27

It's crazy. Yeah, it is. How um, you know, a lot of the episodes I've had on with dads, we talk about youth sports, and which has at times gotten crazy with, you know, you know, there's a lot of great things through sports. I mean, I have I'm so grateful for sports taught me. I'm grateful for the journey my kids have enjoyed sports. But as a parent, sometimes it's it's we get we find ourselves really wrapped up. Um as you reflect back on the games or events that your daughters were involved with, like maybe talk about what what sports they played and how did you balance being dad versus NFL coach?

SPEAKER_03 34:02

Yeah, it's uh the the girls, you know, people ask me all the time, are you disappointed you had girls? Because you know, you you wanted a football player. I said, No, I love having girls. And what I told the girls, because people would talk to them about it too. I said, and I'd gather them up. We'd get together and I said, Okay, now listen, you're gonna get these questions. Here's how we're gonna do this. You think about it, but choose something. I would like you to be active after school, but choose something you love, choose something you want to do. Not for me, for you. So they wound up playing soccer, field hockey, uh, in sports, tennis. Um, and I was able to go to those games because they were kind of it was kind of in the offseason, and I had a little little better time schedule. And um it was fun for me. The thing that would bother me on occasion, and you maybe have seen this, is you have parents that look at this really differently. That you get them getting a little emotional, a little bit. I said, You're putting too much in my mind, I didn't say to the person, you're putting a lot of pressure on that young person there. You know, it's it's they're young, they're learning. Part of this learning is not only being a good field hockey player or the your best field hockey player you can be, but also a teammate, a good sport, you know, with the other team. All those kinds of lessons that I think sports teaches you. So I got to do that. As but as you pointed out, now my grandchildren, my kids' children, they they didn't used to have things on Sunday. They didn't have now, they have that's a big deal. And they used to have things mainly tied in with the school, now they have club sports and things that you not only play, but you travel. I mean, travel distances go play. So it's changed now. But what I've tried to instill in my kids, and I think what they've tried to instill in their children is the things we talked about. Sportsmanship, you know. Uh if you get knocked down, get back up. You know, learning learning those types of things. And uh I'm very proud of the way that the the I haven't been able to see many things with them. Lately, I've been seeing the grandkids a fair amount, so that's kind of fun. But in the past, when I'd walk in to see my daughter, youngest daughter, play basketball as an example in Green Bay, I had to come in after the game started and sit way up in the corner because otherwise it be I became a distraction. Sure. I can't imagine. Yeah. So but so you learned to deal with that too. And she knew I'd have to talk to her, but this is what I have to do, and she got it.

SPEAKER_06 37:09

Did your daughters well, we're gonna give love to Grandpa Tiny. Did did they did he did they get any of his toughness or your toughness, or maybe from Kathy? I think they did. I have a I love my daughter plays hoop. She's 5'4, maybe 5'5 in the program, maybe not, uh, but scrappier than hell and feisty. And I I like I always thought I get inspired watching that. Like you, you're not as tall, and she's actually gonna go play basketball where I played football at Central, Washington, which is like the coolest selfishly for me. It's like I can't believe if you'd have told me years ago, because I got actually got hurt my senior in high school, didn't play football, kind of impacted where I was end up playing, got a chance to play at Central, thankfully. And then, but if you'd have told me back then, hey, you yeah, you got hurt, yeah, that ruin ruined you up. Actually, best thing ever had to me, then you're gonna play football and your daughter's gonna be there in 30-something years. I'd be like, what? How's that gonna happen?

SPEAKER_03 38:02

No, I know. Um that's that's so that sounds so cool. The uh, and it's fun. I mean, we have as you get older, uh like I said, it I was accused of trying to make up time with my grandkids, but it is fun for me, really is.

SPEAKER_06 38:19

I think it's a great thing you're doing that. What what a that's like an ultimate compliment, I think, when I hear that. How how is it watching grandkids play sports?

SPEAKER_03 38:27

Oh, I well, I'm I'm I try to be quiet, I try to be encouraging. Um both my I have I have four grandsons, five granddaughters. All the grandsons tried their tried football, and little by little they they've kind of there one's a senior in high school, one's two are seniors in high school, but it didn't it didn't work for them. I mean they played, they loved it. I think part of it, I think they tried to play, because they're not big guys, they tried to play, I think, they won't admit this, because of me, because sure I should do this because grandpa played, you know. And I when I watch them play, I thought they did fine. I thought they did well. But, you know, that maybe the the coaches, it's it's different now. And so it didn't hit. But then they go into something else. They go into soccer or they go into music, or they, you know, pick something that you love, and then that'll carry you, you'll you'll carry that for the rest of your life.

Handling Injury, Disappointment, And Belief

SPEAKER_06 39:36

Yeah, I think I think a lot of dads uh unfortunately make that mistake. A lot of parents, and I was guilty of sometimes you get you just you're what you're trying to create this like you want to protect them, you want to make it perfect, you want to help them, but it's like that's how you don't help them by doing all those things, and you have to let them, you have to celebrate mistakes. You have to because all the mistakes I made, yeah, was some bad ones. Like, what are you doing, dude? Like just like an interception, did you watch film? Like, what were you doing? Uh I didn't mean to fill the cover too flat. My bad. That's on me.

SPEAKER_03 40:05

You know, you know, one one quick story, Gretchen, who is my youngest, who's a prosecuting attorney in in Kent County. And so she she's she's tough. Oh, yeah. And she always was. But the first time the things I got to watch her play, T ball. You know what T-ball is. Oh, yeah. Yeah. So, and she was the youngest kid on the team. So I got to see her play, and it was a it was a playoff game or something. And I'm playing, I'm standing next to a writer, the sports writer who covered the 49ers, Mark Purdy for the uh San Francisco newspapers. And his daughter was playing, so we we were talking. Well, Gretchen gets up in the last last out in the inning. They're down by one. There's three men, bases are loaded, she's up. And and T ball. Um no, it wasn't T-ball. She had graduated from T ball, so it was pitching. At any rate, she strikes out, and everyone jumps up and down. Fortunately, her teammates go over to her and console her. The coach did. It was very nice. She comes in, she's she's not gonna show anybody any emotion. She gets about 10 feet away from me, walking over to me, and just starts crying her eyes up. And I did too. Yeah. I said, Oh, you know, I know this feeling, I know your feeling right now. So we uh and Mark Purdy was he was great too. He's in the Writers Hall of Fame down there. And we hugged for a while and then and then we just didn't say anything, got in the car, then started talking about you know how much how important it was for her to do this and be strong and try. And the outcome, heck. We're past that right now. Let's go, let's go get some an ice cream cone or something. You know, and I forget what I said, but um you go through those emotional things, and I think it's important when it happens that you think about maybe reflect back on some of the lessons your parents taught you. And hopefully there's a carryover there. And hopefully then now there I know this. There's a carryover with Gretchen as an example, and her young kids. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 42:35

Well, you hit on something that we we've talked about a lot with our dads. Um, are you have you ever came across the gentleman by the name of uh coach Bruce Brown? Uh I'm not sure. I don't think so. So he's a local guy, been around a long time. He used to he's been um spent time with John Wooden, Dick Vermeel, um um, who else? Um just a couple that come to mind. But he he wrote an article and spoke at many of these big coaching conferences on the car ride home. And he interviewed uh interviewed thousands of high school college pro athletes, and they said that the number one answer of um frustration was the car ride home because mom and dad used to always just light them up. And the the people they loved watching them play was grandma and grandpa, because grandma and grandpa would always say, Man, I love watching you play. Yeah. And so with this article and the advice he gives is he kind of challenges if your kid cares and it's what they want to do and what they're about to do and what they let them bring it up to you. It's kind of like when you have a, let's say you had a bad day at coaching, or I had a bad day in business. And my I made this joke before, like my kids when they were six and seven are gonna say, Hey dad, you're you know, you usually type 43 words a minute. You're you seem like you're down a little bit, and you didn't that voice money left at 1045 really sucked. It was not your normal good business document. Like they wouldn't say that, but like, but we get them in the car as the seniority person, just get on them because we have this expectation that they're supposed to do all these great things. Well, that's their life. Yeah, and it was such a powerful thing that I read that I've shared multiple times with people. And I hope if there's someone listening that's never heard of it, they'll research it and I can even link it in the show notes. But it's amazing when you just say, Hey man, love watching play, love watching, love watching compete. Try your best.

SPEAKER_03 44:19

I know, I know. I just to me that makes too much sense, you know, and and maybe it's it's it's from the disappointments I had in my own playing career. Like you said, you were hurt your senior year. Same thing happened in my senior year at USC. That we were gonna play Nebraska the week before, for some reason, we had a scrimmage, and in those days the quarterbacks got hit. They didn't wear red jerseys. And my own guy hit me, blows out my shoulder. And I'm a quarterback. And then I I miss my senior year because of that. And so then you try and overcome, get up off the ground, overcome. Then it didn't happen. So those were little lessons I think, not little, but they're big lessons I learned from my dad, and hopefully it allowed me to get on to the next step, yeah, and then teach my children that. What did your injury teach you? Well, I was d so disappointed. I you know, I sat in the training room and I actually the coach came up to me and uh I started crying. I said, I've worked so hard for this, this was my time. What why? Why? And uh he he didn't know what to say, but what it taught me is that you will have lessons in life. How you handle disappointment is is a huge part of I think how you develop and move on. And so that was one of the big ones for me right there. But as I said, and then Kathy was really helpful in helping me recover uh mentally, but uh I think that was that was the thing I take away took away. It was I was I was crushed, but then I go, okay, now what am I gonna do?

Tools For Better Conversations With Kids

SPEAKER_06 46:23

And so yeah, that's it. I mean it's like goosebumps you're saying that because it's like I I remember it like yesterday, I'm I'll be 50 this year, and I uh my I was um I was getting like low D2, D3 guy, and then I went to the University of Washington football camp because my uh my buddy was getting recruited by him. Well, I go and end up winning quarterback of the camp. And I didn't I was shocked that like they announced my name. I'm like, what? You got the same guy? What the hell? How's this happen? Well, then they're like all of a sudden, like, hey, you're you're you're on our radar, we're gonna come to your game, do all these things. And I was like, wait, what? Oh my god, a UW? This is my cousin played for UW back in the 80s, and so then I'm like, this is great. Well, same thing. Fast forward to that last play of a Jamboree. I break my foot in four spots. Um, I have surgery two hours later. The guy beat out my junior year. He now has to, he was playing tight end for us. He has to go in and play quarterback. World moves on, coach. Yep. He would go on to take, he would set our single season passing yardage record. He would be named second team all league, and he would um take us to state playoffs first time in 20 years. Wow. I had to watch.

SPEAKER_03 47:25

I know.

SPEAKER_06 47:26

And I say the best thing ever happened because like Kathy and my wife Carrie, super supportive. I remember crying, feeling sorry for myself. But I my high school football coach, guy named Marty Osborne. I uh I actually had him on the show back in a few years ago just to thank him because I remember going to him and I said, I uh I'm miserable. This is the worst freaking day of my life. And he's like, I'm I'm hoping Shane plays bad. I hope you guys stink. I'm thinking the worst things possible. I need help. And I remember he just looked at me, he goes, Man, I'm so proud of you. I'm like, how could you be proud of what I just told you? Yeah, he's like, Because you're asking for help. And this is what vulnerability is about. And I'm a and he goes, You know this playbook better than me. Why don't you go up in the booth, help me call plays? I was like, wait, what? And I became like a quarterback coach. And I was like, it was like a vacuum. I get goosebumps telling the story. You get the vacuum sucked all that energy out of me. Now I had purpose. Now I had belief. Now I had someone like and I was back. And so I I love now that my kids are older. I've shared that story with them because that's why this word behind me, everybody, it's belief. I think it's one thing that parents don't do enough of is teaching belief. Like believe before you do anything, believe in yourself. Yeah, yeah. No, it's it's uh that's a great story. Well, good for you. Yeah, it's uh I still remember it like yesterday. And yeah, I I was the 12th quarterback at walk on at Central. Um, I remember calling Dick Baird. Any of you remember that name? Oh, I know Dick, yeah. Yeah. So I remember he was he was recruiting me and my other buddy named Kevin Chiles, and I just called him. I said, I left him a voicemail. I said, Hey, if if you could do anything, I I'm not gonna walk on at UW. I was like gonna be a preferred walk-on for them. I said, just my high school football coach played at Central. I think it's a better spot for me. I'll have a chance to play early. And um, if you could just put in a good work because I had no film. Yeah, none. And then slowly started chipping away, end up end up being a you know, two and a half year starter. Uh uh, but yeah, and it's like the memories I had and the buddies I made, even this podcast was started from a my old and my receiver. Shout out to Ty Nunez, who he now he's coaching high school. So it's just yeah, you member those things for life.

SPEAKER_03 49:27

And um well, then you you know, you look back, you know, I think it's important to look back on some of those things, kind of relive the pain just a little bit, but then it makes you realize how fortunate you are and what that did for you look now. Grounded.

SPEAKER_06 49:46

Yeah, grounds me.

SPEAKER_03 49:48

Yeah. So good for you.

Causes, Legacy, And Giving Back

SPEAKER_06 49:50

It does. Yeah. What um, as we kind of get ready to wrap up here, as you think about your journey as a dad, um you this can sometimes be a tough question for people. I always say, what would be an area of your dad game that maybe wasn't where you always wanted it? But as you reflect, or maybe you had to like kind of like watch film and make a couple tweaks, but you were able to kind of improve, that might speak to a dad at home struggling with an area of his dad game.

SPEAKER_03 50:15

Uh I think it's something we talked about a lot already, but it was the the time. And then when I'd come home after, you know, and switching gears, I talked about switching gears to not just that's not just uh talk. It's something, and and it, and you I had to be deliberate. Let's just say as an example, we had a poor practice. You know, in in anyone, the sea hawks, anybody, poor practice where I had to you get fired up about something. You come home and to flip the switch, it just couldn't be talk about it. You had to do it, and at times that was very hard. At times it was hard, but it's so important, I thought it was so important to make sure that your kids know that they know the the the girls knew how stressful and how how I had to work. But then when I came home to they had to know that I cared about what they were doing as well, and then to talk about it. And and it did two things. One, I think it showed them I loved them, two, it helped me get over my anger or whatever whatever was there when I walked in the door. And uh, and then of course you you talked about your wife and that Kathy is she was the superstar, and then we had an interesting thing uh that we do when I come home from practice. We had a room, uh uh kind of a family room type thing. And for the first five minutes I was home. I go in there and she and I would talk. And the girls knew, okay, that's mom and dad. We gotta give them their time. As soon as that was over, the door would open, boom. Then I went and then I had to get into what they were doing. But that was and that was kind of a discipline, but it and it seems kind of quirky, but it really was good for us. Oh, I can only imagine. Absolutely. It it helped in my transition because my wife's a stud, you know.

SPEAKER_06 52:36

Yeah, most well, the good the good quarterbacks at home, we we uh we got great general managers, and that's right. We've we it sounds like we both outkicked our coverage.

SPEAKER_03 52:46

Um that's I've said that many times. So yeah. People that know her have said that to me many times.

SPEAKER_06 52:53

So if you were to summarize what we've talked about, coach, that maybe in like a theme, you know, two or three themes that dads can take from our conversation today to say, hey, these are these are things that I have control over, regardless of whatever my job is, that I can, I can, I can be this, this, and this to become that ultimate quarterback or improve as a leader of my home. Uh tell me what comes to mind.

Lightning Round And Closing

SPEAKER_03 53:13

Well, the first first word is love. I mean, you have these you have these young people, and wherever you are in your in your development or your age, you they have to know that you love them. That's the first thing. Second thing is that we talked about I talked about honesty. That's the second thing. Be I think no one's kidding anybody here. Let's just sh shoot straight with one another and listening to each other instead of just shutting somebody down. That was another one. Um and then coming to I I think coming to a place at the end of any discussion or any time together, coming to the place and then making sure that everyone was heard, that I would tell them, they would tell me, and that's where the honesty thing comes in. So that worked for us. I I you know, I I tried not to make it too complicated. Um, you know, and and I watched them deal with their own kids now, and there has been a trickle-down effect, so I'm proud of that.

SPEAKER_06 54:25

It's awesome. Yeah, the one thing I've learned is man, they're they're watching more than we think. And um there you go. You know, one of the one of the things I was a corporate guy for 20 years in sales, sales leadership, and then I now I work for myself, but didn't mean to, that kind of happened on accident, which is another story. But um one of the things I learned at age 41, which is the power of what um really being curious, which is something I'm obsessed with. And so, like there's a curiosity framework that I got taught and now I teach called TED-based questions. It's I've actually was meant for business, but I actually use it now for dads and myself, which is stands for tell me, explain, describe. And so those sound like simple things, but it's actually really hard because most people put a modifier, they say, Can you tell me more? Which is a that's a close-ended question. Sure. And so I think about when dads, if there's a dad listening, you got young kids, kid comes home from school, and kid goes, um, dad goes, Hey, how was school, buddy? Good. What'd you do? Nothing. Did you have fun? Yep. Well, it's not the kid's fault. Those are bad questions, dad.

SPEAKER_03 55:20

No, I know.

SPEAKER_06 55:21

But if I say, hey, tell me two things that made you smile school today. Yeah, tell me more about that. Uh well, describe what would make school better. Not going, great. Well, tell me why. I mean, I could ask questions all day long, which is why the you know, the three-year-old or four-year-old always gets a lollipop. They keep asking. Yeah. So uh it's I I'm obsessed with, and now it's funny, my son, who's 19 and um just seeing him become more curious, and even him, I see him now talking to people and saying, Yeah, my dad always says you got to be curious. I'm like, Yes, it's working. Yeah, no, you did a good job. Yes, you did. So far, so far, you know, we got we got some time left. Um, is there anything that you're involved with that um we can make sure we try to link or or promote or let people know more how to get involved, whether it's your church, um things you're excited about, maybe make sure we vote for you and the influence of voters. We got to get you in the hall of fame, coach.

SPEAKER_03 56:16

Well, you know what? I I think Bill Belichick is a lock this year. So, you know, it's uh maybe next year. Not here in Seattle.

SPEAKER_06 56:23

Maybe we just agree, disagree on that one.

SPEAKER_03 56:26

Well, I thought I had a good chance last year, you know, because I was the only coach nominated, but they had changed the rules just a little bit. So, but uh I I'd say the number one thing that right now we and and uh where this goes, don't worry, no one has to worry about anything. Yeah. But you know, we're there's a couple three things that we're we're very involved with. We're involved with the Salvation Army because they do a lot of great things. Uh, and and people people have to know about that. Some of them know, some of them don't. Then the other thing is my son-in-law, who was a pastor of our church, then left to start his own uh business or a nonprofit up at Camino Island called Circlewood. And it's a combining of of your faith and how we take care of the the land and how we take care of what what's there for us. And I think it's a that that's uh that's a very beautiful thing that people can really understand. And the young people now that uh maybe don't go to church, you know, you know, they that's not a big thing, but they do care about their environment and they care about so it's combining two, and he's he's done, he's got a great work, and it he's working really hard at it. So circlewood is the is one thing I'd like people to even think about.

SPEAKER_06 57:46

Yeah, it's awesome. Anything else or those top two? The top two. All right, coach. The now uh the last part of this journey we're gonna be on. I'm so grateful for your time, is what I I take people through what's called the lightning round. And I'm gonna show you that the the hits, the effects of taking too many hits in college, not bong hits, but football hits. And uh my job is to ask you questions that might make zero sense and you hopefully get a giggle out of you. Your job is to maybe just answer them as quickly as you can.

SPEAKER_03 58:15

Okay.

SPEAKER_06 58:16

Uh, true or false, I was me and my friend Kelly Hansen were the only two Seahawk fans in Toledo, Ohio for the 2006 Super Bowl against the Pittsburgh Steelers. True. Too many yellow tails. Yes. I was there. I was there, and I had a it was like treated like a celebrity out there, and they're like, what are you doing here? I'm like, this is my freaking childhood squad. I wouldn't miss this for a and uh yeah, we had the time of our life, and I I don't want to go into that one because we still we still got that was not a holding penalty, by the way. I'm still gonna never let that one go. Um if I went into your to your uh to your phone, uh what what would be maybe one genre of music that might surprise people you listen to?

SPEAKER_03 58:59

I listen to Josh Grobin. Okay, yeah, I love his voice. I wish I could sing like he he sings.

SPEAKER_06 59:05

Okay, love his music. What would be your one go-to karaoke song if you sang one?

SPEAKER_03 59:11

Well, I used to be on a group, you know. I used to sing in a group, Big Bop and the Choppers when I was in high school. That's good. Yeah, did you know that? No, yeah, Big Bop and the you remember Sean Anna? Oh, yeah. It was like that. Okay. I was one of the choppers, and uh and uh my big hit single was Puppy Love by Paul Anka. Okay, there we go.

SPEAKER_06 59:36

We raised a lot of money for Oak Rove High School. So cool. What's your favorite comedy movie of all time?

SPEAKER_03 59:43

Uh uh The Russians are coming, the Russians are coming.

SPEAKER_06 59:50

Okay. Uh if there was um you and Kathy are gonna take a vacation. Sorry, kids, sorry, grandkids, you can't come. It's just you and Kathy. Tell me where you're taking her.

unknown 59:59

The

SPEAKER_06 1:00:00

Big island of Hawaii, uh uh Wallawai. I love that area. So nice. Um, if I was to come to your house for dinner tonight, what would what would we have?

SPEAKER_03 1:00:09

We would have uh chicken cordon bleu, some rice, and some uh uh zucchini.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:18

Okay, there we go. Um, if there was to be a book written about your life, tell me the title. Um Stand Up After Getting Knocked Down. Love it. Now, coach, stand up after getting knocked down, believe it or not, it's sold out. I tried to go to the airport, tried to go to Barnes and Noble, tried to go to Amazon, sold out. No one's got copies left. So Hollywood's found out they're gonna make a movie out of it. Um, we've now made you the casting director. I need to know who's gonna store coach Coach Mike Holmgren is critically acclaimed hit new movie on Netflix.

SPEAKER_03 1:00:51

Oh, would I I think I I've told I've told this to the kids and gets it gets a good laugh. It's uh Hemsworth.

SPEAKER_06 1:00:59

Okay, yeah. I think they're gonna say like the big Lebowski or something, like someone big taller.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:04

No, no, is it this I he's gotta be more glamorous, I think.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:08

Nice. Um, okay, and then last last and most important question. Tell me two words that would describe Kathy.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:16

Beautiful and sensitive.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:27

Love it. Lightning rounds over. Um, I I didn't really give you a giveaway. I was actually gonna go randomly. Actually, I one last question. I will not one last question. True or false? My senior year, I made our freshman quarterbacks wear neck rolls for a day during two days.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:43

False.

SPEAKER_06 1:01:44

True. My coach was not happy. He's like, J. Cox, what the hell is wrong with you? I'm like, coach, safety never takes a haul. They want to keep the guys safe. There you go. We were we got a lot of, we joked around way too much. Coach, you know, you ever met Coach Bo Baldwin? No, I haven't. No, he was he was kitting his coach, my coach used. He was always like, get out of here. I can't wait till you graduate. But anyway, lightning rounds complete. This has been an absolute honor talking to you. I'm so grateful. Um, I wish you and your family the best with this holiday season. Stay safe. I wish the grandkids all the success, your family all the success. And um, like I said, just truly an honor to speak to you. I really, really appreciate it.

SPEAKER_03 1:02:18

You know, thank uh honestly, thank you for having me on. And and uh uh your stories are great, really good, better than mine. No, I don't know about that. I appreciate that. All right, thanks a lot, coach. Take care, bud.