Coffee and Bible Time Podcast
Join host Ellen Krause—co-creator of Coffee and Bible Time—as she sits down with authors, pastors, theologians, and everyday believers to explore Scripture, identity, relationships, and how to truly keep Jesus at the center of it all. Whether you're just starting your faith journey or looking to go deeper, this podcast is a space to learn, be encouraged, and draw closer to Christ.
Coffee and Bible Time Podcast
Let the Psalms Take You to Deeper Intimacy with God | Ryan Whitaker Smith
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Today we are going to be talking about “Rediscovering the rich treasures of the Psalms.” The church has long used the Psalms as part of its prayer life, and praying the Psalms is one of the oldest and most powerful ways of learning to talk to God. The Psalms have also inspired many genres of music, poetry, and art that we enjoy today! Our guest today, Ryan Whitaker Smith, co-author of the devotional book, “Sheltering Mercy” is here to share a fresh way of reflecting and praying the Psalms.
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From Ryan:
Book – Sheltering Mercy
Book – Endless Grace
Websites:
danwilt.com
praywiththepsalms.com
IG: @itsryanwhitaker
Bible: ESV
Favorite Apps:
Dwell
Accordance Bible Software
Bear Note-Taking App
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Welcome back to the Coffee and Bible Time podcast. For those that may be listening for the first time, our podcast is an offshoot from our main platform, YouTube. Our channel is called Coffee and Bible Time, where our goal is to help people delight in God's word. We also have a website and storefront with Bible studies, prayer journals, courses, and more. Before we get started, a word from our sponsor. I'm Mentor Mama, and today we are going to be talking to one of two authors about rediscovering the rich treasures of the Psalms. The church has long used the Psalms as part of its prayer life, and praying the Psalms is actually one of the oldest and most powerful ways of learning to talk to God. Well, the Psalms have also inspired many genres of music and poetry and art that we enjoy today. Well, our guest, Ryan Whitaker Smith, co-author of the devotional book Sheltering Mercy, is here to share his fresh way of reflecting and praying the Psalms. Ryan is an author and filmmaker from Nashville, Tennessee. His projects include The Jesus Music, a documentary about the history of contemporary Christian music and film adaptations of the award-winning memoir Surprised by Oxford and G.K. Chesterson's The Ball and the Cross. He has collaborated with his father, Michael W. Smith, on songs, music videos, and concerts. Dan Wilt, who's not able to be with us here today, but also co-author of this marvelous book, is a songwriter, speaker, educator, and author who has his own teaching ministry in worship and spiritual formation through danwilt.com. He has served as pastor, an encourager of creative leaders, and has written several devotionals, including A Well-Worn Path and Songs Are a Place We Go. Wilt is also a contributing author to Perspectives on Worship, Five Views, and an internationally respected communicator on worship and the arts. He lives outside Nashville, Tennessee as well. Well, please welcome Ryan.
SPEAKER_00Thank you for having me. Happy to be here.
SPEAKER_01I am so excited to have you here. And I have to tell you a little bit about the backstory as to how we came to asking you to be on our podcast. So I have a very, very dear friend of mine. Her name is Tracy, and she's actually been kind of like a mentor to me. I actually worked for her on staff at our church and just someone that I really look up to and admire. And so we she lives in Indiana. I live in Illinois, and we so we communicate periodically through text messages. And I always ask her, Tracy, so what are you reading? Because she's an avid reader and just such a godly woman. And she said, Ellen, I'm reading Sheltering Mercy. You have to get it. She goes, It's one of the best books that I have read lately.
SPEAKER_00And I like her immediately.
SPEAKER_01I know she's amazing, but for her, like for her to have such a rave review, I'm like, I know I have to pick up this book. And so I did get the book and was so inspired to look at the Psalms in a fresh, new way. So Ryan, why don't you start out by telling us, you know, you and Dan were both vocational writers, but in different fields. So maybe share with us how you came together to create these prayerful poetic sketches.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so Dan and I have been close friends for years. And as you said, we we work sort of in different fields. I'm I'm primarily a filmmaker, um, writer and director, and um but a sort of freelance filmmaker and author. And Dan, uh, as you mentioned in his bio, is has been in ministry for decades and in in um, you know, both as a pastor and an author and a teacher and a speaker. And um it's a shame he can't be with us today because he's he's so much more eloquent than I am. Uh, you know, but uh no, Dan and I have just been been dear friends uh for for years, and this project really kind of emerged organically out of that friendship of just walking together through life. I think uh we we've tried to trace it back and we've tried to remember exactly how it began. I think it was that I wrote one of these prayers sort of just in a time of of personal devotion and shared it with Dan. And at that point, it was it really was just for me or for the two of us. Um, and he but he responded to it and thought it was interesting. And um, you know, before we knew it, we we'd written a handful of these. And we thought, well, maybe there's something interesting here to explore. And so we put together 20 prayers. We wrote 20 prayers and put uh and and made a little booklet that we shared uh with friends and family over uh the holidays, and got such wonderful responses. And um, one of the friends that we shared it with was um Carolyn Weber, uh, the author of Surprise by Oxford, one of my dear friends, and and um she loved it so much that she sent it on to some publishers on our behalf, and that's that's how this happened. Uh Carolyn was instrumental in in uh in getting this book published.
SPEAKER_01Well, now that you've you've taken it to the point of being published and people have already started to read it, but what is your hope? How how does your book help someone sort of rediscover the Psalms?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, it's an interesting question. I remember Dan and I we weren't sure anyone would really understand what we were trying to do because uh, and we explained this in the introduction because it's not a it's not a new translation, it's not a paraphrase of the text. Uh we say emphatically, neither of us are qualified to do either of those things. Um it it it rather it's these are sort of prayerful lyrical sketches that are written in response to the the psalms. And there tends to be kind of a line-by-line correlation. We tried to really capture all of the ideas in in each individual psalm as much as we could. Um, and so I think ultimately it's um it's it is a prayer book intended for you know times of of private devotion for individuals, um, although we have heard you know of people of churches using it, small groups and things like that, which is wonderful. Um, but I think uh you know ultimately it's um it's not intended to replace scripture um or be read in in place of scripture. Um I think it's uh it's a companion uh to to uh to the original text. And so while it can be used on its own as a as a book of written prayers, um you know, I I think it's it's also something that can be used alongside uh the psalms.
SPEAKER_01Yes, absolutely. And it really has this impact on you of rediscovering the psalms. It has this impact of such a personal depth and level of prayer that I think a lot of times people can't get at that on their own. And so to have someone so eloquently and beautifully lay that out is can be just so helpful. Well, how how can people using sheltering mercy as a guide to personal devotion and meditation?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think you know it's it's you know, we really in the beginning tried to decide what what you know what was the best format for this book. It's not really it's not laid out like a daily devotional, although it can be used that way. You could certainly read a prayer every day. Um there are 75 prayers in this in this volume. We have volume two coming out um uh early next year. Um but you know, I think it's interesting you mentioned um sometimes you don't have the words, and I I think I think you know, sometimes we we put unnecessary pressure on ourselves to try to pray these eloquent prayers on our own. Yeah and um you know, there's a rich history and tradition of of written prayers in the church, and um I think this follows in that tradition. And sometimes it's really nice just to have someone else say the words for you, or to get, you know, and that's in a lot, in a lot of ways, that's what the Psalms are. You know, I think the church has used has used the Psalms in that way. Um, but I think I think that's it. I think, you know, we were really inspired by um, I mean, not just you know, rich, you know, again, the history of of written prayers going back to, you know, whether it's the Book of Common Prayer or something like that in the liturgical traditions, but um, but also something like John Bailey's The Diary of Private Prayer is a is a is a book that I really love and Dan loves. And so that was an inspiration for us um as well. But uh but ultimately I think what it does is it just it provides prayer language for you to use, you know, in your uh in your own times of of private devotion.
SPEAKER_01Yes, it absolutely does, and and it that can be a challenge for many, and I think people will find when when you open this up, whether you take it one psalm a day or even just one chunk and really just meditate on just a portion of one particular psalm, I think can be deeply meaningful. Well, as you were preparing and writing the psalms in this book, what are some of the patterns that you started to see in the psalms?
SPEAKER_00Well, I think that you know what when I think of the Psalms and in terms of patterns, um I think of this uh this constant um you know back and forth between consolation and desolation. Um you know, or you or you might call it you know praise and lament. And you see that throughout the Psalms is that's kind of constantly bouncing back and forth between those things. Um and I think the the brutal honesty of the psalms is is is is one of the reasons why you know we we still keep coming back to them. Uh you know, they they really run the gamut of human emotion and experience. Um and there's just a really naked vulnerability to to the to the writing of the psalms.
SPEAKER_01Yes, and I I think it really demonstrates just how we are so similar to the people back then, right? We still experience all these different levels of emotions and and lament and times when we're we're pray prayerful and thankful. So it's amazing how something that was written so long ago can still be so applicable and that we can learn from. Well, as you went about writing prayers from the psalms, what did you learn about the depths of emotions that were felt by the original writers? And and what do you think that can teach us?
SPEAKER_00Well, I think it's you know, ultimately it the psalms give us permission to be really honest with God. I think I think that's um that's the biggest takeaway for me is that you can come to him with your questions and with your honesty, with your doubts and with your fears. And a lot of times those, you know, that that uh the the consolation, the desolation, the pray, the you know, the praise and lament often happens even in the context of one psalm, you know. You can be borderline nihilistic, and what at one point, you know, all hope is lost, and then you know, but I'll I will continue to praise you. Um, and so uh I I I think ultimately that's it. It's just that you know the psalms give us permission um to to or remind us anyway that we can be completely honest and vulnerable.
SPEAKER_01Do you have a favorite psalm?
SPEAKER_00I would have to say uh if I were to choose a favorite psalm, probably Psalm 91. Which I think the title of the book is sort of a nod to that psalm, although it's not we have a line um in uh I think it's in in our prayer for Psalm 4, is where we got took that phrase sheltering mercy. But when I when I hear that phrase, I think of the imagery from Psalm 91, you know, hiding beneath the shadow of his wings, that you know, that imagery.
SPEAKER_01That's beautiful. I know for me, Psalm 23 has always been one, one that I memorized as a child, and and just truly still impacts me. I always laugh and have told my kids I've used that psalm to to comfort me so many times, even in the dental chair. And I'll just keep, I'll repeat it to myself. Uh encouraging. I actually have an amazing dentist, but I still don't like going. Um all right. Well, you incorporate a rich offering of cross-references to other scriptures throughout the book. And I really, really love that. How can people use these to sort of take what you've provided on the page and maybe dig a little deeper and enrich their quiet time?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I mean, you know, it's interesting. That was sort of an unexpected thing. Um, you know, when we began writing, we didn't expect to be doing that. But, you know, we made a decision that um the only way we could approach this work was was was to approach it from a New Testament perspective, um, to Old Testament scripture. And so because of that, um, you know, you can't help but see Jesus hiding in the Psalms. And so uh all of a sudden we're we found ourselves referencing all of all of these verses throughout, not just the New Testament, but throughout um the scriptures. And I think it's um I think it's you know a reminder that it the Bible's telling one story. And so that was sort of an unexpected joy for us to find a way to sort of connect these prayers to um to other passages of scripture throughout the canon of scripture. Um so I gosh, I can't remember how many are in the book. There's quite a few of the footnotes in there.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, there really are. And I think one one tip I would have for people is just keeping like maybe a side journal as you're going through this and taking the time to look up the passages that you have referenced to give greater context and deeper level of of understanding as to the prayer that you created. You know, in alignment with what you were just talking about there, you indicate that these prayers are unapologetically Christocentric. So tell us what that means and and why that was so important to you.
SPEAKER_00Well, yeah, I mean, I think, you know, like I said, we we realized um, you know, that there's uh a practical perspective there, which is that we are um you know Christians writing this these prayers living today. Um and so we can't help but see uh see these prayers uh on the other side of the cross and the resurrection. And um, and so you know, we can't help but see that the that hope uh in in in the uh the old testament scriptures, because they're all pointing pointing to Jesus. And so um yeah, you know, there is a bit of you know, when when we're writing these um these prayers, uh part of it was trying to contextualize it a bit. Um and so in the in the contextualizing of of um of these prayers, uh I think that was that was one of the ways that we did that, was just sort of anchoring it in a in a New Testament hope, uh for lack of a better term. And um so yeah, I mean that again, that was sort of an unexpected thing, uh, because I think we didn't fully know what we were in for when we started on this uh this project. But um, but again, it's sort of an unexpected joy to sort of see see it all through that lens.
SPEAKER_01Yes, absolutely. And I think so many people aren't as familiar with the old testament and to bring out the Christ-centered aspect of the, like you say, the bigger story and where this is ultimately leading, I think is so important and so amazingly well done in your book. Well, what would you say would be your hope for for readers of sheltering mercy?
SPEAKER_00Well, you know, I think we say it at the end of our introduction in the book, but I think, you know, ultimately the hope is that these these prayers would um would lead you into the presence of God, you know. And um, it's humbling to hear, like your friend, uh, the comments she made, but it's uh it's humbling to hear that it's it's helped anyone or that they found it moving. Um but uh but yeah, I think that's that's the ultimate goal is just is you know um is to provide these uh these written prayers in harmony with scripture to lead you um not not just into the presence of God but back to the back to the scriptures themselves.
SPEAKER_01Absolutely. And in your experience with talking with others who have read your book, what types of impacts have you heard that it's having?
SPEAKER_00Oh gosh, I mean, you know, it's been um as I mentioned, you know, we've heard of people gosh, people not just using it um in a personal sort of context, but we've heard of people using it in a corporate uh setting. Heard of it being used um you know, hospit, you know, hospital bedsides, um things like that. So that's uh very meaningful to us to hear that. That something that we wrote is is uh reaching people in that way.
SPEAKER_01Oh my goodness. I love that you just said that. This would be a phenomenal book to bring to the bedside of someone that you love and who's struggling. Excellent recommendation. All right. Well, I I asked my friend Tracy, I'm like, is there anything you want me to ask them when I'm interviewing them? This is your chance, and she said, Yes. When is volume two coming out?
SPEAKER_00Volume two is called Endless Grace, and it releases on January 24th. Oh, excellent. And the same day there will be a box set available as well with two poems. We're excited about that.
SPEAKER_01Oh, absolutely. That's awesome. Well, Ryan, how can people find out more information about you and the book?
SPEAKER_00Yeah, well, I I would say um I will point people to Dan's website. I don't have a website, but he does, danwilt.com. Uh, we also have a site for uh for the two books. It's praywithesalms.com. And then uh we're both on social on Instagram and Twitter. And I think I'm it I'm it's Ryan Whittaker uh on both Twitter and Instagram.
SPEAKER_01Excellent. Well, we'll put all of those links in our show notes. And before we go, Ryan, I just want to ask you some of our favorite Bible study tool questions that helps all of us learn and grow from each other. So, what is your go-to Bible and what translation is it?
SPEAKER_00I personally like to bounce around a little bit between different translations. I would say I primarily read the ESV, the NASB, and the CSB.
SPEAKER_01Okay. Great translations. Awesome. Do you have any favorite journaling supplies or anything like that that you use to enhance your Bible study experience?
SPEAKER_00So I am infamously bad at journaling, so I need to be better at that. Um, I don't do a lot of handwritten notes, I should, um, but I do take uh I do take notes on my computer. Um I typically use Bear, an app called Bear for that.
SPEAKER_01Oh, cool. Okay. And you've just mentioned a good app. Do you have any other favorite apps or websites that you use for Bible study tools?
SPEAKER_00Yes, I use um accordance. There's an app called Accordance that's a Bible study app, which is really great. I use that quite a bit when we were we were uh writing these books. Um, and then I really like the Dwell app for uh the audio Bible.
SPEAKER_01Yes.
SPEAKER_00I think it's really great.
SPEAKER_01Awesome. Wow, that's two weeks in a row that I've had someone say they like the accordance. So yeah, listeners, check that out. Well, thank you so much, Ryan, for being here today to share with us your beautifully crafted rendering of the psalms. It's just so refreshing and a great inspiration to reflect and engage in the psalms. And and I have no doubt that it will deepen our understanding of God's love and faithfulness. So thank you for joining us.
SPEAKER_00Thank you.
SPEAKER_01And for and for our listeners, you can find the link to sheltering mercy in our show notes. Also be sure to head over to our blog where you can share your comments with us on this podcast. I'd like to thank the team at Life Audio for their partnership with us on the podcast. If you go to lifeaudio.com, you will find dozens of other faith-centered podcasts in their network. They've got shows about prayer, Bible study, parenting, and more. Lastly, head over to the Coffee and Bible Time website for our prayer journals that will help guide and document your prayer life at coffeeandbible time.com. We also have two courses available on how to pray using our prayer journal and prayer binder. Thank you so much for joining us on our podcast today. We love you all. Have a blessed day.
