Halo Infinite Delay - Busted Buttons Ep. 26

Red and I start with the recent big news of Halo Infinite getting delayed. This now means it won't be a launch title for the Xbox Series X. How do we feel about Microsoft's decision?

We then address the first PlayStation 5 (PS5) commercial. Did we like it? What were we happy to see? What do we wish we would have saw?

Afterwards, we dive into a very intriguing topic. With micro transactions and added content (DLC) becoming more of the norm, will we see less new games in the future?

Later, we talk about combat techniques. Do we enjoy them or not? What genre of games are they best suited for?

We end with a discussion on the hour counter in games. Is it something we like to see? How does it affect us while going through a game?

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Transcript

Red: 0:17

What's up gamers Welcome to Episode 26 of the Busted Buttons video game podcast. And before we get into it, I got to give a big thank you, to all our listeners out there, we officially hit 1000 listens across all our platforms, that may not sound like a lot to some of the bigger podcasts out there. But to those of us that we're just getting started, we're very excited. We're very thankful we're having a blast doing this podcast every single week. I hope you guys are having a good time listening. So thank you to everyone who has listened so far. And I hope you keep tuning in. Now, we've spent the last couple episodes talking about individual games. And that's been a ton of fun. We've had a blast going back in like researching those old games, getting to kind of experience them again. But today we are back last

Hick: 1:03

like in one particular way. But we are going back and put in the time to research that's never fun. So it's been fun. But same time, it's been you know, a little time consuming. But go ahead. It's definitely a little more work. But yeah, today

Red: 1:15

we're getting back into just talking about some general video game topics. So on the agenda for today, we're going to talk about Halo infinite. Unfortunately, getting delayed to 2021, the first PlayStation five commercial came out, we're going to talk about that, you know, we're going to spend some time talking about the possibility of less new games in general coming out and you'll get where we mean with that when we get to it. We're gonna talk about combat techniques and action games. We all know Hicks been playing a lot of ghosts, she Yes, we're gonna talk about techniques, the number of hours we spend playing a game. And that's kind of a fun topic. I'm excited for that one. And then just the general concept of like control in video games like controlling the character and kind of how that stacks up versus real life. So I think we've got a pretty good lineup set up for today. I'm personally excited to talk about just more general topics instead of just one game in specific. Unfortunately, we're starting out with I feel every time I make the damn outline, we start out with bad news. Yeah, and I apologize for that. But you know, the big news of recently was Halo infinite, getting delayed till 2021. It sucks in my opinion. But Hick, I've talked enough already. I'm going to throw it to you. What are your thoughts on this delay?

Hick: 2:24

I mean, it's huge news. Because this was supposed to be a launch title, like game delays. We do a game delays all the time. So like getting one of those no big deal whatsoever. But the fact that this was a launch title, I mean, this is what because you don't have any exclusives Xbox, you have hardly any exclusives. So you need that one, you know, or Forza you know I would take him for not everybody's like that. But I would take that one. But like I mean, you're using this game to sell your system. And then you delay which makes sense. games get delayed all the time happens all the cars now no COVID everything that's kind of what pushed this back, you know, makes complete sense. But man, this one hits hard because I mean, you got this huge launch title. It's not going to be a launch title anymore. It's not going to come out until 2021 so I wasn't really upset like I wasn't really shocked. vouches like damn Xbox, this is going to hurt you a lot. Um, you know, I got playing games, I got plenty games, I can play till then. But it kind of makes me You know, I've been up in the air about which system I'm going to buy first, you know, I've been thinking all along is probably going to be the PlayStation five. And now at this news. It's like, if you don't come out with Forza, and I don't even know, Forza would be enough to make me purchase the Xbox series x first, like no need like absolutely nothing on the PS five to still get like, you know, the Xbox series x if they have fours at launch. But thing is I don't think that's going to happen. So now when you come out What do you have in this? I mean, this is huge news. Make sense? Completely. But I mean, this is not gonna be deal breaker, but this is going to affect their sales. What's your opinion on Oh thing? Oh,

Red: 4:09

it definitely hurts. I mean, you're absolutely right. I mean, I will always support delaying a game to get it right or like Microsoft or 343 Studios has come out and said you're they're trying to avoid that video game crunch ya know that it seems like every developer goes through when a lot

Hick: 4:25

of people have been in trouble for like you know, these so called you know, rumors of 100 hours a week like you know, developers working so I'm glad that they did say that

Red: 4:33

same here and then like you know, the COVID of course makes it tougher on everyone we all get that most of us are dealing with that in some form or another in our work lives or even our school lives you know, whatever age our listeners are, so I'm I'm all for delaying a game to get it right. But you hit the nail on the head. Like this was the series x is like flagship, not just for the launch, but I mean, it's their console flagship. They've talked about it being a platform for like the next year. decade of Halo games. And and now it's delayed. And with both systems launching at the same time, I've always sat here and said, I will choose Halo infinite over Spider Man. We don't really know. I mean, we think

Hick: 5:12

they are launching at the same time, but we don't even know that yet.

Red: 5:15

That's true. That's very true. I feel like there's playing a game of chicken right?

Hick: 5:21

There bodega delight both saves. Well,

Red: 5:23

I wouldn't be shocked. But it's just, it does hurt. And it's I get it if it's for the right reasons. I totally support that. But one of the things that kind of caught my interest was this announcement came not that long after their their big gameplay reveal. Yeah, back at the Microsoft showcase a couple weeks ago. And the reaction to that was pretty lukewarm. I'd say it was a much less than enthusiastic the reaction to the graphics especially. And I'm wondering, hey, if they really do in this to avoid the crunch and all that I wholeheartedly support this. But if they're taking this as a chance to maybe polish up those graphics a little bit, because they heard the, let's call it a tepid feedback for lack of a better word, then, you know, I support that too, though, if they're using it as a chance to make the game better, to look better to play better, whatever, then I support that, too. So I'm, I'm all for the delay, it does suck but the big one and you kind of hit on this already. You mentioned that you think it does impact you know, the one you're going to buy first and yes, you're leaning towards a ps4 much harder now. It sounds like yeah,

Hick: 6:31

Bari was leaning towards the ps4. You know already hard but now it's almost like you know, given but here's the thing. Microsoft does great with Halo, they were going to make this game look great graphically. He knew that and now the trees now here's the thing. People want to complain about the graphics. When you're like watching a YouTube video or what however you're watching, like whatever they're doing showing gameplay. It doesn't transfer, like you know, as well. It doesn't look like it actually does when you're like you know, showing through YouTube or whatever. So the graphics Yeah, they're going to look good, but they're not going to look as good as they are on your TV. So absolutely, it's something that doesn't bother me I'm actually more about like how crisp it looks. You know, how Chris and Margo come over great you know the whole graphical you know, impact really isn't going to be great, but that Christmas Christmas, which is graphics, but you know how crisp does it look at how flawless like is the movement stuff that's why pay attention for because I know those graphics won't transfer now a lot dumb asses out there. I know I told you right behind the scenes I'm pissed off. I'm ready to go so you nap a couple of times during this podcast but these dumbasses out there don't understand that graphics are not going to transfer over the internet and look the same way as they will when you're playing on your 4k HDR if you have one you know not everybody has like HDR you know like red red doesn't have HDR, you know, I do red doesn't know they got you know, they got sacrifice a little bit on the graphical you know, the visuals thing gret visuals, graphical, whatever, I was kind of doggy there read but you know, I didn't know it's all good how to go about it. But um, you know, I talked about the next gen console and everything but, you know, reacted to the less enthusiastic response. Okay, here's the thing I thought with the halo infinite, you know, gameplay. I thought it looked like Halo. And then one from Halo. Is it to look like Halo like they showed you know, stuff we seen before? I expected no different really, they showed us that you know from what I think and saw. It might be a little more open world but as far as the gameplay, it's exactly what I expected. And that's okay because that's why what with Halo, I want Halo I don't want them exactly what I've been playing. So first of all this lesson through cx asks, enthusiastic response. That's not a difficult word, but you know, I'm flustered. I'm flustered this week from things outside of video gaming, but he's just before we got started yes, those gamers bitching about dumb shit. Oh, no dude years ago like this Papa Shut up. Nobody cares. The game was great. The gameplay looks great. It's Halo. You probably started hate playing Halo like two three years ago. When you got multiplayer? He probably played a lot. You probably never did the damn campaigns anyways, shut up with Bichon. It looks good it's Halo. That's what we want. So if you're delayed for that reason, I disagree with you Microsoft and I am done with that top

Red: 9:30

Who? Wow I'm Yeah, I got it.

Hick: 9:35

I'm not happy with

Red: 9:37

Hey, sometimes you got to let the fury out. But I will say I mean like when it comes to like said the next gen console, you've been leaving PS five. Anyway, this tilts it even further that direction for at least the first one you're gonna buy because yeah, I mean, let's be honest. We've both mentioned we're going to buy both of them at some point. For me. What this makes me want to do is just not buy either at launch because neither of them has a launch title that is worth me going and dropping four or 500 bucks on a new console

Hick: 10:05

conversation about the financial impact of this.

Red: 10:08

And that for a second that was about to get into that. is one of those words like you brought up a very good point we were texting or tweeting or something on the side. Yeah. And it's like, Yeah, but if you wait till they both get good exclusives, then you're stuck paying for both them at the same time. Yeah. And, and hey, and we do well, but still, if we're talking about dropping a grand on two video game consoles at the same time, that's a pretty big financial lock in the pills, if you know what I mean. Yeah, but you know, so for me, it's like, I'm kind of on the fence now, because I don't think either one is going to have the launch titles worth buying on day one. And when it comes to third party games, the big one that I care about this year is cyberpunk 2077. And I'm going to get that on PC anyway. Because that's where I've played every game from CD Projekt RED, that's where I've loved it, especially it's a first person shooter slash RPG that is like that is what a PC is built for right there. So I'm like, even when you talk about the big third party games that are coming out around that launch window, I'm still getting that for PC. So I'm, you did bring a great point when saying if you wait till exclusives for both games, they might happen at the same time, in which case your credit card is going to hate you and scream at you. But at the same time, like I can't justify dropping four or 500 bucks on a console, that's not going to have something they want. Yeah, and and it's, you know, I missed the old days when frickin Nintendo 64 launched with fuckin Super Mario 64, again, changing a literal revolution in 3d gaming, and we just don't get that anymore. And, you know, Halo could have been that. Now it's delayed. I'm done with this topic too. Because now just like,

Hick: 11:47

go especially not financial impact. Also, the switch had Breath of the Wild when it came out. Oh, exactly. I'm planning on buying both systems like you know, I want to buy them within 12 to 18 months. That's kind of what I'm thinking right now without one yet paid off by the next one. Now, here's the thing, you get that mid console life upgrade that's usually around, I don't know, three to four years, I know that I'm going to buy both systems before that. So there's no point of holding out for that midlife upgrade. So for me, it's like, Okay, if I'm going to buy these within 12 to 18 months, buy one up front, because I'm not going to wait for the upgrades down the road. So I'm gonna go ahead and buy one up front, just so I can pay that one off, before I buy the next one. And I understand you're saying like, there's nothing there you like, you know, no reason to play it. But I'm thinking about this financially. Like if I want to buy both of these systems, which I do, and I'm going to do, like, one out of the way. So when that next one comes out, like you know, I can buy in, that's where I think you are making a mistake. Now you can do whatever the hell you want. You know, I don't I don't care. We'll talk about controlling people later on. Like, you know, me, I'm just gonna buy one, that way I can get out of the way. So you know, if a good game does come out, then I can buy the other system like right then and there, where you if you're waiting, they're going drop like got a vor typically be five God or two, however they want to go about who know or they call it. Yeah, but God of War five, and then Halo, and you're gonna be buying two systems like back to back so you can do whatever you want to financially, if you're going by both systems, I say go ahead and buy one up front so that we can pay it off. And then when a great game comes out for the US system, you can also get that one. But anyway,

Red: 13:26

honestly, just to piggyback on that real quick, I know, we keep bitching about spending too much time on the first topic, but here we are again. But no, like, honestly, if that's the case, I mean, I'd probably buy the Xbox versus because game pass is are you going to port games over to it anyway. But anyway, like you said, we're moving on. Speaking of like the next gen consoles, we did get our very first commercial for the PlayStation five here recently and I'm just gonna straight up saying it was fucking stupid. I don't know if you've had a chance to watch it yet.

Hick: 13:57

I keep on talking.

Red: 14:00

So it dropped it's literally it's a live action video of some actress going through it like just like a standard adventure scene. Like she she's like there's icebergs and yeah, and like she pulls a bow and all this. It doesn't show a single lick of gameplay. It doesn't even show like cinematic trailers from Wow, it's literally just a live action commercial. And, and their focus was on like the, the controllers abilities really like the haptic feedback, you know, like the Yeah, it's like the HD rumble for the pro controller on the switch. So it's like, you know, the feedback on the controller, the triggers the 3d audio, it was really trying to emphasize, like those selling points with the host HD audio, I, you know, I am not an audio expert like in any way, shape or form. I don't even have surround sound in my apartment. People talk about 3d audio. I'm like I get it's supposed to be like, you hear the sounds from the directions. They're really coming from Oh, I don't I don't know how that's any different than just surround sound like, yeah, I'm not an audio

Hick: 15:04

file. I'm just saying like, if you hear a sound from the left, it's going to play more in your left ear than it is. For me. Yes, grab. That's what I would think it'd be.

Red: 15:13

And that's what I think it is, too. I know there's like sound bars and heads, especially headphones out there that really that advertise that now, and they're pretty pricey, if I'm not mistaken. But so I saw this commercial. And I was just the first one. There was no release date, no price, no information on release titles, not even gameplay or cinematic trailers from games. I thought this was a commercial that absolutely 100% missed the mark of a gamer audience. It says, oh, haptic feedback. Adaptive triggers 3d audio. I'm like, those are nice buzz words. Show me a fucking game. Yeah. I know. You haven't watched it. But. But do you have any thoughts on it at all? You know, man, that's my bad

Hick: 15:57

too, because I saw the outline. And what this commercials maybe a minute at most, and I need to watch that commercial before the podcast. And once again, I got busy putting together my kids trampoline. So if you're wondering why I don't watch things, or whatever, it's because it is stupid. It's not stupid. It's for my kids. And I know I'm spoiled. And that's my fault. I'm weak. And when people I got three daughters and I spoil the shit out of them, but you know what? I didn't watch it because I was putting a kid trampoline together. And that's my bad, but um, I mean, is that why you're pissed is look like Homer Simpson. barbeque pit fence, you know about that? anyway? Like, I'm really surprised they didn't show any gameplay trailers. Now if you didn't show any gameplay, I kind of understand that because yeah, if you go back the lay of the latest system that we got was the switch. And the very first commercial that was more of a live action commercial with like people going around kind of shown how you could literally switch all the adapter up to like portable it, but there was a little bit of like, Okay, I guess there was gameplay, but it's kind of show more in like the concept of trailers, but you know, not to have any of that whatsoever. Yeah, I'm really not a fan of that. Okay, I understand kind of shown some things with the controller and stuff. I'm actually showed the system too, didn't they?

Red: 17:11

I actually don't think they showed a picture of the system. Unless it was at the very end, they definitely showed the controller

Hick: 17:16

probably isn't that big. They want anybody to use it to scale to show how big it actually was. Right? But anyway, cuz I've seen some pictures. I don't know if they're true or not. But this thing looks humongous. But both both the systems do. You don't know. And this is why I throw on Discord. The other day, I go, these constants might get delayed, you know, and people thought I was crazy. Oh, no, they put all this effort into them, blah, blah, blah. The fact that we've not gotten any release dates, no price and no information at all. And it's at the end of August. Like I'm not saying these consoles are going to get delayed. But I'm saying like it's kind of training that it could possibly happen because they're just not giving us anything. And I kind of agree with you now. I never thought about it until you said it is kind of you're playing a game of chicken. Like we're gonna show a little bit yeah, we're gonna show a little bit here, but they're not really giving us anything. And you know, here's the thing. If one gets delayed, I think automatically the other one gets delayed because delayed the next day.

Red: 18:09

I think I announce it a day later.

Hick: 18:11

Yeah, for Coronavirus and everything. It wouldn't shock me at all. But anyways, count we were talking about the whole PS five thing. One of the first games that was announced for the during the showcase of the PlayStation five was a poor of Grand Theft Auto five, which you know, the Super Nintendo has had that the Nintendo 64 has had it for a Grand Theft Auto six, no five, five, every system, I believe has now had a report of Grand Theft Auto five, because it games map for like 10 fucking years or something. Oh, it's been tough. Anyways, this kind of got me thinking, like, you know, like, say it was released. I don't know how long ago but it was a while ago, it's been a while and the developer just keep on whoever it is. Rockstar, Rockstar, they just keep on adding content to it. And like, you know, to keep on added to it. And like that got me thinking, is this a concept that we're already kind of seeing this concept, but are we going to see it more into the future where we just see a game release and they just keep on adding content to it. Because really, with updates and DLC or whatever seasons, you know, Matt's skins, you can do stuff like that you can continually add to game, you can even add a whole new game world. And once you bring up a game we don't talk about very often on here, the Witcher three that is a game that never edit I forgot how to say to saying or to song or to sorry, said say Holy fucking continent. But yeah, it was a whole new area. It's like a whole different game. And I really think going forward and I won't get your opinion on this because I've been talking for a while I think, um, like, Are we going to see less games going forward? And like, are they going kind of just keep on adding content to it like with Grand Theft Auto What do you think?

Red: 19:48

I think this is a fascinating topic and I'm really glad when you texted me this one day you were thinking about this and like it's an excellent question because game worlds especially like open world is kind of the rage right now. It has been for the last You know, four or five years, and they've spent so much time building and money, let's be honest money. Yeah, the budget to build these gigantic worlds I don't care if you're talking about Grand Theft Auto five, Red Dead, Red Dead to Breath of the Wild like these games. They spend so much upfront money to just design these game worlds, The Witcher three, of course, Skyrim if you want to go back even further, and to me, I read Skyrim still

Hick: 20:25

getting content today to

Red: 20:27

fucking Skyrim still getting ported, it's probably gonna get ported to the frickin. But it blows my mind that we've seen now like Grand Theft Auto five is going to be on its third console generation, like it was an Xbox One, or I'm sorry, Xbox 360. PlayStation three game originally. And you know,

Hick: 20:47

I bought that game physically. That's how long ago it was man.

Red: 20:51

And I'm torn on this, like a lot of topics we talked about, on the one hand if they build a fantastic world, and it's got good controls, and the gameplay and the graphics can kind of hold up across several generations, or even like, let's say not several generations even like, let's say, okay, we want to drop a title in 2021. Like, let's call it Grand Theft Auto six, just totally hypothetical, and say it's gonna last the entire life of the PlayStation five x Xbox series x. And but every year or however often we're gonna add more to it. Yep, I support that. Even if they want to pay or charge rather an extra you know, 20 bucks. 30 bucks for expansion. If it's substantial. I'm all for it. Because some of these game worlds are amazing. And you don't want to leave them yeah, especially the open world games. Like Grand Theft Auto his world is unbelievable Breath of the Wild World is unbelievable. The Witcher three Of course, unbelievable. Skyrim unbelievable. And if they can keep adding content to that world, instead of having to start from scratch every single time. I say as long as the graphics and gameplay hold up that I am 100% for it now i am i'm a little dubious about Grand Theft Auto five still looking good. It is a bad example

Hick: 22:06

because they will release a game like every seven years which is like a console like Oh, they might release one game well does Grand Theft Auto back I got what you're going for that like if

Red: 22:17

they keep adding to it like it was Rockstar like you mentioned like we've got Grand Theft Auto Online you've got Red Dead online now for Red Dead Redemption. I mean, it's like so they keep adding to it. The Witcher three added to massive expansions. Skyrim had not only the massive expansions, it's also got a huge mod community that helps keep it fresh. So you know, I on the one hand, yes, I want new games. I want the Elder Scrolls six, I want Grand Theft Auto six, I want Red Dead three, whatever. But, you know, if these worlds are that amazing, why not just keep adding to them, instead of having to start from scratch every single time. So yeah, you know, if we have less new games, but developers support their existing games for a longer period, you know what, fuck it. I support that.

Hick: 23:03

I really do. What do you think? I mean, I think it's just a future that we're going towards, I think this is what we are going to see. And first of all, I want to apologize to the people who created it developed a 343 Industries, to the people who created and developed kind of same thing for Halo infinite, I have been bashing your name for quite a while. Now here's the thing, if Halo, which I believe they're going to go with this concept where they're going to release a game, and then it's just gonna be on the system, like forever, they're gonna keep on adding content to it, adding content to it. If that's the case, which I think it is Halo infinite is a fantastic name. Yeah, for your game because you're drying infinitely, you know, not forever, but for a long time. You're just adding content to it. And you're not releasing a new game. So I apologize. The bashment name now that is the concept which I said I believe that is that is a guessing game so 343 you have my apologies if you want to go ahead and send me a free game or something for apologizing. I'm absolutely okay with that.

Red: 24:05

But you won't get it till 2021

Hick: 24:08

Yeah, but like I said, I think this this is the way going forward and this is what we're going to see your linear games. Definitely those are going to come out like they regularly would Yeah, but as far as your big open world, though, you know, it doesn't have to be open world just the chi i don't really know how to describe the concept because a concept can apply differently depending on which genre game you're playing. Like said the last two years I think we will keep on getting new games but if you have like a big map or just a game that you can add you know whatever to like fortnight for nice big map I don't think they just keep on adding these new different multiplayer shooter maps, you know, new skins new way I don't play fortnight so I don't know exactly how it works. But you know, these new maps, new characters, weapon skins, like you know, crap like that. Like it kind of goes back to that microtransactions thing, where Hey, we're gonna keep up releasing all this new stuff, you know, there's no reason you've not seen for nine to four reason, because fortnight one still works, there is still money. And like everybody has seen that fortnight concept. And they're like, Hey, we don't have to develop a new game from scratch, we can just keep on adding stuff to the game we are have. With me, like we said, with Witcher three, you can add a whole new map and everything. Like the one thing that you really had to keep consistent is the game engine, because obviously, it's the game engine that you use. And so in a case like you know, fighting and blah, blah, blah, you know, adding like a tags and techniques, it's probably possible but could be difficult but could be as long as you keep the mechanics like you know, similar, you can update the graphics, you can update the map skins, characters, mods, weapons, you know, whatever. So I do think this is what we're going to we are going to see going forward. Did you have any more you want to say on that one?

Red: 25:53

Or do you think that's a good thing or a bad thing? I guess? Yeah, you say you think that's the future, but I

Hick: 25:57

don't think it matters if it's a good thing or a bad thing. I think it is a future I don't think we have a choice. So I don't think it matters what the hell we think. I think that's good concept on certain games. Like I think it's a concept that Halo can do. Halo can add you know, campaign like, you know, different campaign levels, you can add multiplayer multiplayer, I said right. Now, like I said, I'm flustered from the week, man. But um, I think it's a good concept for certain games, young, you know, you wanna say like, you know, open world, okay, let's say the Witcher four comes out, you know, you had a couple of new things here and there. Here's one thing, okay, you can keep on, here's why I don't think it's good. You can keep on adding to the story. But eventually, you need a new story, you need two characters, and you can't put new characters into DLC or whatever seasons, whatever you want to call it. But eventually, overall, over the whole entire game, you need a new story concept. So at some point, yeah, you know, it's just, I mean, it's really tough to say it was going to work for this franchise, and not this franchise, but I think it's just one of those things that you're gonna have to debt as it goes along. And you can you know, you can do it, you can do it, you can do it. But eventually there's going to become a point where you just like, Okay, this model, I don't think it's really working for us anymore. Yeah, dad's and create a new game. So I, it's the future, I think it's gonna work for some games. At some point.

Red: 27:17

With the technology, the technology is going to advance so far that you've got an engine. I mean, at some point, that's the other big sticking point is, you know, you're outdated. It no longer looks good, or Yeah, as well. So I mean, like that, between people want more story, and also just the general technology. I mean, at some point, yeah, you've got to have to put out a new game. Yeah. But, you know, we've kind of obviously been talking a lot about like the open worlds, especially there with the, you know, continuing to build on those worlds. And one of the hottest, open world games in the world right now is ghosts of Tsushima, which is killing it on frickin user reviews on Metacritic bio, it's one of the highest rated games of this whole generation. That's because it's fucking fantastic. But part of its appeal and why people really love it is like the variety of the combat in the techniques. I think you learn what four different techniques throughout the game dances, or stances stances? Sorry, that's Yeah, I haven't played it yet. So I'm going on what I've read, but you know, so part of its appeal really is the stances. So let's just take a couple minutes here to talk about kind of combat techniques and various techniques that we get in some of these action games. So how would you go out and start with ghosts of Tsushima? And take us from there?

Hick: 28:26

Okay, there's actually techniques to so you have stances? And then you also have a curveball. Yeah. Basically, okay. There's a couple different variants of techniques, but basically, just different ways of fighting, you know, you tap x, hold x, double tap, x, triple tap, tap x, or no, GS Ma, it's a triangle, man, I am so upset with myself, I'm sitting here talking about goshima all the different attacks, it's triangle, it's not x, I can't believe I've made that mistake, because it's like, ingrained in my brain because there's

Red: 28:59

the layout of the buttons on the controller, and I've had a ps4 for a couple years now. So I totally feel you

Hick: 29:05

missed that one. But anyways, um, you know, kind of answering your question, it works for certain games, like the samurai. Now, I don't know a lot about the samurai, but from what I do know, I believe they were very good warriors, and they fought very well. So like, you know, a game like that, like, you know, a samurai. I do believe that is a game that should have a lot of techniques. And those techniques should matter. Like if they had a ninja game, same kind of concept. But if you're playing like, you know, I guess girl from like, you know, the Witcher, yeah, we have a little bit of different techniques. But if you do a lot of techniques in that game, I just don't think it really works that well. So I think the concept has to have some history of those particular people group, whatever, haven't like you know, those kind of talents and abilities. And so, like, it depends on the game, but and that's that's what I love it or don't love it. If you Do a lot of techniques and stances or what, you know, weapons, whatever, in a game, where does it make sense to know it's overkill? But if you throw in a game where it doesn't make sense, or does make sense, then I don't mind it at all. And you here's a, here's the most difficult thing with this is you got to have the right amount in there like, you know, yeah, cuz there's a point out Pat talked about this, you know, these abilities and that was the other word kind of using skills, yes, skills, abilities, meals, whatever, like for God of War, for example, like there was so many that I didn't know how to use, if you're going to use all these techniques, you have to make me use them. And that is something that God of War as great of a game as it was, it did not make you you had to use those skills, and therefore a lot of them I didn't use and they were just a waste so far with ghosts Shima. They make use those techniques, like you know, let's go and talk about the stances. Each there's four states is dead no of so far. And like you're fine a sword in me yet to use one, you don't have to use one stance. But there's a stance that helps you it's probably the sword that he showed me. There's a different stance, a enemy that has a spirit, different states, and then a different stance. Like, they, they're using it so well. And praise goes to Tsushima because like, I don't know exactly how far I am in because there's no our counter, we'll get to that later. But they're using it so well. Like they're not it's not overkill. Like he's just a little bit here and there. And you understand when you're supposed to use these certain techniques or like, you know, stances. And like, you know, I don't remember every tag because there's just too many. But you know, it's a concept opinion on the game, depending on the franchise I like or dislike, and what's kind of your whole opinion on it?

Red: 31:47

Well, you really hit the nail on the head when it comes to it's all about complexity. Like Yeah, what a game to have enough, enough depth and complexity to where you don't get bored with the combat. But you don't want it to throw so much at you that you can't, that you can't remember all of it. Like you mentioned god of war. Yeah, there were a lot of moves I didn't use in that spider man, we talked about our last episode, there were a lot of moves I didn't use in that. I like that you mentioned Witcher three because the combat in Witcher three was so focused on like the potions that you use before the fights that I think if you added more than just the very, very generic like fast versus slow attacks. Yeah, like you're throwing too much. Because Witcher three was all about preparation, like you prepare for the battle you you make the right potions for the right, or mutagens, whatever they call them for the enemies you were going to face. Like that was so much more important than your style or your stance or your technique, whatever. So I think that complexity is such a hard line to walk because you want it to be deep enough and complex enough that you don't get bored with the combat, like halfway through. Yeah, but you don't want it to overwhelm the player either. And one one of the games. One of my absolute favorite games from last year was Star Wars Jedi fallen order. I'm a huge star wars whore. And I thought it was a great game. But like, what they did was you had either the single bladed or double bladed lightsaber. And each one played a little bit different, like the single bladed lightsaber was more geared towards like one on one duels, when you're facing like the elite opponents or the elite troopers. And the double bladed lightsaber is like you're fighting a bunch of like a swarm, like a bunch of grunts, a bunch of stormtroopers or monsters, whatever, just when you're fighting a crowd. So I thought like just having that kind of distinguishing point was it was enough to make you you know, think about it and switch between the two when you needed to, but it wasn't so complex that you freaking forgot all the different options at your disposal. So I do like when games tailor a technique or a stance or a style to the various enemies that you're facing, like, let's say I mean, like even using Zelda, which we're huge Zelda fans, obviously, yeah, but like if you're facing a giant big grunt enemy, one technique or attack might work better than if you're fighting a bunch of little, you know, bokeh blends. You know, it just it's like I like when they tailor what you need to do to the various enemies but like we both said, Just don't over Yeah, wellness. Yeah, don't overwhelm us with so much stuff, that we never use half of it at that point. And they got

Hick: 34:24

a lot of times, that's just for like collection, like, hey, if you collect all these, like you have to have and I've said this many times, you had to have some kind of reward for my collection because I'm not gonna go out and collect things if the reward is not good enough. So they're using a lot of these like, you know, abilities and skills as like, you know, collection reward. So, yeah, like, you know, that can work but use it the right way, like, you know, make it valuable, and make it something that you know, I will use that I know we were sent here, you know, people find different ways in every game. And they might be saying, oh god Ward those abilities were great if you just would have used them but you know, it depends on the game or two. You know, there might be gamers, we're sitting here we're kind of complaining about, hey, can overdo it, you can add a bunch of skills or abilities that we don't use. But then there's other gamers out there that it does work for. So you know, for sure, yeah, there's definitely like, like most of the things we talked about, it's gaming. It's an opinion. Like it's subjective. Everybody's going to feel differently about it. But he was kind of talking about, you know, and continuing on open world games, which we kind of like talking about open world games, because we don't talk about him enough. One thing like you know that you're seeing more in open world games and other games. You know, like The Last of Us Part Two we're also seeing this is they show you the number of hours that you play a game like said Last of Us part two, every time you save it shows how many hours you play. I know I'm playing through Assassin's Creed Odyssey right now. Every time you say it also shows you the number of hours we play origins was the same way. Yeah, origins member original. mispronounce that one, but this is something that, you know, I thought that I liked at first. Like, I like knowing how many hours I'm into a game and like, you know, kind of have accomplished. But now, I don't know if it's something that like, because playing goes to Tsushima. So far, there might be an hour counter somewhere, but I've not found it. It's not right in front of your face. Yeah. And here's why. I think this is a bad idea. Maybe show it maybe make people dig for don't just show like if I save a game. Don't show me the number of hours maybe make right there on our safe slot like yeah, like I know, the Witcher three, you know, given that game praise because I don't think we praise it enough. Right? Like, like, the number of hours wasn't right in front of you. But you could get to it. Yeah. And kind of, you know, going on this whole topic of like, you know why I thought I liked it. But now I don't. I'm gonna bring in like, you know, Assassin's Creed, you're talking about origins, like, you know, you're like 8085 hours in. And then when I hit that point in Assassin's Creed Odyssey, yeah, I started burning out a little bit. And I think you know, not your fault. But I think it was based on what you said, it got in your head at our range. I was kind of like, you know, this game kind of dragging on a little bit. Yeah. And you know, you can also throw out the 100 hour mark, like, you know, a lot of times when people hit 100 hours, they're like, Okay, it's time to finish up this game. Yep. Yeah. And I've been thinking like, I don't know, if I don't like this. I mean, okay, I don't know if I like it or not, I've really not made up my mind on it. As you can see, I'm flip flopping all over the place.

Red: 37:25

That we've never done that before.

Hick: 37:27

I'm kind of like, Liam, you can make a decision, we decided that several of you. So then we also repeat ourselves constantly after that. Like, I'm with you here in a second. But

Red: 37:37

this is something so good. I'm just drinking. It's fun.

Hick: 37:39

Yeah, I don't think I like because when you don't sit there and pay attention to the number of hours you put into a game, you don't know exactly where you're at. So you're not gonna get burnt out because of a certain benchmark. And you just go in, and you just play the game, and you enjoy it. And I think we're kind of like, you know, as we're getting more stats or whatever. And these games, more information, basically. Yeah, like, I think we're kind of getting away from that joy that we just played a game to play. We didn't worry how much time it took, we just, we just play it because we loved it. We just want to enjoy it. So cowboy your whole feelings on this.

Red: 38:13

I'm with you in the end that I'm very torn. Like because yeah, a lot of gamers out there most gamers out there, I would say have a massive backlog of games. And here's where it gets me like, when you have when you know you have five or six games you want to get to. And you read Oh, like let's use the last was part two as an example. It's gonna be about a 30 to 35 hour game. Yeah, you say looking, whatever, whatever ends up taking you, you start looking at that counter. And you keep thinking, Okay, once I beat this, I'm using myself as an example here. Once I beat that I get to go to and try go Tsushima Yeah, or maybe or maybe Paper Mario or gummy King, I don't know, probably goes to Tsushima. Let's be

Hick: 38:50

honest, it actually got a good point I want to mention right here, um, when you like you're talking about like, you know, I don't know if he actually said this or not. But we're getting close to like, let's say, Last of Us, part two took me 28 hours. So when you get when you are playing and you get to 25 hours, you're getting the game get to ensued, and that might drag at the end, which we discussed before. So this guy said I didn't think about so I want to interrupt you, but go ahead.

Red: 39:13

No, but you're absolutely right. But like for me, like I said I in the last couple years I've gotten in an unfortunate mindset where I'm like, I need to beat this game and get to the next one. I didn't need this game and part of that is having a big game log part of its steam sales, summer sales on Xbox or Playstation or, you know the rare Nintendo sale that happens. Never

Hick: 39:34

but you're not enjoying games like you should if you're doing exactly

Red: 39:37

but you keep thinking okay, I just need to get through this game to play the next one. And you look at that counter and Naughty Dog like we talked about with with not only licenses, but the Uncharted games were the same way as well. And you're just like, you know, you look at that and you start looking at that you're like okay, I think I'm almost done with this game. I think I'm almost done with this game and it really does SAP some of the joy out of it like I know Though like the flip side of the coin is kind of this open world games where people actually do like to brag about how long they play the game, especially if you look at something like World of Warcraft that's been going on for over a decade. Now, I, I hope that game has some kind of way to track the hours that certain subscribers because I would be, I can only imagine the thousands of we talked about hundreds of hours that thousands of hours, people have put into something like that. So for open world games, I kind of get it a little bit because you're like, man, I put 200 hours into Breath of the Wild, whatever, I've got three or 400 and Skyrim, according to stem. So I mean, but when it comes, I feel like to just try to get through a single player game or a more linear experience, like a Last of Us or anything like that, then you're like, you see that? And you start thinking, Oh, yeah, I'm just, I'm just trying to get to the next game. I'm just trying to get to the next game. And when you get in that mindset, you're absolutely right, it takes away from the enjoyment of just playing the damn game. And so I've tried to play or tried to pay less and less attention to that stat. I know some games put it right in your fucking face, and you can't avoid it. But you know, you know, on the other hand, I don't necessarily want to know, when I'm getting close to the end of a game, you know, like in a linear game, like, you know, and I know, it's hard to avoid, like, yeah, every review for a game now says, I'll take you about 20 hours to be out. Or if it's an open world or a JRPG, it's gonna take you 100 hours, whatever. But you know, it's just, I'm with you. I find I enjoy the games a little bit more when I don't see that number. Like, maybe show it to me when I'm done. Like after I beat it, like after the credits roll, show me how I did like, I think I've linked to the past, when you beat the game, it shows you how many times you died. Let's do that with ours in games, and that would be totally okay with that. So that's my two cents on it. But you know, it's I do get the one thing I will say sometimes, if you're trying to pick out the next game you want to play, it can kind of be a little bit useful, because you're like, Okay, I don't want to jump into another hundred hour adventure. What's something that's like a palate cleanser, like a little, you know, seven to 10 hour, run through it and be done. So that is one benefit. I do see to it. So do you have anything else on the hours?

Hick: 42:16

No, I didn't have anything else on that when Sally and I want to talk about topics we can be able to control people and video games and why we love it because it's just been a bad week, and people are pissing me off, but we're kind of out of time. So we'll go ahead and push that when I think not next pocket not next episode, because I think we're gonna do something differently. But we'll talk about that subject in the future. Trust me, y'all will not forget it Amelie's. Let's go ahead and wrap up. All the links will be in the description for this, but you can support us on Patreon, or PayPal, Patreon is kind of like a monthly thing, subscription base, whereas PayPal is kind of like a one off. If you can't support financially Feel free to leave a review or rating. They help with our rankings and SEO and people which SEO and rankings are similar. They're sort of same thing. But you know, it helps when people search we show up higher so that's why that helps. Also. Definitely, merchandise our websites, TG PC gaming, and also to guys playing Zelda, those are affiliate shops, so if it tracks correctly, we may earn a commission on purchases through our links. Reggie, can we talk about some of the other stuff we got going on?

Red: 43:23

But we're all over social media first of all on Facebook, we have two groups gaming realm where we talk all kinds of gaming topics. It's a free for all whatever gaming want to talk about. Zelda realm, we dive deep into some Zelda discussions, theories. Both of them are a lot of fun. So if you love games, if you love Zelda, definitely check us out there on our Facebook groups. on YouTube. We've got two guys playing Zelda with a ton of Zelda video series walkthroughs. And then there's our general TGPZ Media aiming channel as well. We have a Discord server, which is an absolute blast. Yeah, go join that go join that we talk video games in general. We talk Nintendo PlayStation, Xbox PC, we talk booth, we talk sports, we talk what ever people will talk about, and you can find us on Twitter, Instagram, and Facebook. So go hunt us down. Look for us. Follow us like us. And everyone out there. Just keep staying safe. Read well hold on what we're gonna do next week, man. or next week. I sorry, I don't wanna say

Hick: 44:18

that because we don't always get to the episode every week. What are we going to do next? I got an idea for Next Episode. I kind of was talking about a game because I've been having fun talking about games. I know you can't have like, Oh, we've been through Nintendo too much. I think you're a little bit right about that. But I'm not really ready to tackle a big franchise right now. I got a lot of stuff going on my life. So I was kind of thinking if you want it to next episode

Red: 44:42

a little Mario Kart eight. Whoo. We do a Mario Kart eight slash Mario Kart eight ultimate next week.

Hick: 44:49

No, look. Don't be putting that bullshit on me. Mario Kart eight. Deluxe is the same. Actually. I think they did add a couple things in the bloxburg. Okay. See now must be all

Red: 45:02

set. Yeah, now we got to research it. Yeah,

Hick: 45:05

we're gonna but next episode I don't know if it'll be next week or not depends if we had time to get to it, though, but next episode, let's talk some Mario Kart eight anyways, y'all stay safe, stay healthy, keep on gaming and we will see you on the next

Red: 45:21

episode. Thank you all 1000 people who've downloaded our podcast we love you