From CEO to Public Servant ft. Mayor Paul TenHaken

He left his role as founder and CEO of Click Rain to become the 32nd mayor of Sioux Falls, moving from a career in the private sector to the public sector. Mayor Paul TenHaken has a candid conversation with us about his choice to become a public servant and the things that he thinks matter more than money.

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Transcript

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- I'm happy.- [Adam] Mm-hmm.- I'm happy, I don't need anything else, like, I live in the best city in the best state, in the best country in the world. I am so blessed beyond measure.- Yep.- And so, it's all about perspective.[upbeat music]- [Adam] Welcome to "Common Cents on the Prairie," a podcast dedicated to helping you demystify the sometimes complex topic of money. I'm Adam Cox, head of Wealth Management for The First National Bank in Sioux Falls. We're a community bank based out of South Dakota. In this podcast, we share expert insights from around the country, and stories from our local community to arm you with the tools you need to make better financial decisions. Because the truth is, the more we talk about this stuff, the better off we're all going to be.[music fades] Today, I am thrilled to be joined by Sioux Falls Mayor Paul TenHaken. Paul TenHaken became the 32nd mayor of Sioux Falls, South Dakota in 2018, and was reelected in 2022 to continue leading South Dakota's largest city. Through his One Sioux Falls framework, Paul has been a tireless advocate for public safety, housing and ensuring kids and families can live their best lives in Sioux Falls, which was named one of the best-run cities of the country in 2024. Paul worked in the for-profit and non-profit sectors, and most recently, was a business owner of a successful digital marketing firm, prior to becoming mayor. Paul is married to Jill, and is a proud dad to Jade, Max, and Nora. I hope you enjoy my conversation with Paul TenHaken. Paul, welcome to the show.- Hey.- Thanks so much for joining me.- I've listened before. It's good to finally get invited on.- Hey, I appreciate it, appreciate it. I was slow playing the intro, you know, yeah.- All right, you good with starting with an icebreaker.- Let's go.- All right. We pull up your favorite playlist.- [Paul] Mm.- What are we listening to?- Well, I listen to a ton of Foo Fighters. Huge Foo Fighters guy, been to a lot of shows. Big U2 guy. Love U2.- Mm-hmm.- And anything alternative rock.- Yep.- Alt rock. I see you got a Lumineers poster behind us there, I like that kind of music too, so.- [Adam] Yeah, yeah.- No country, though, you won't find any country.- [Adam] No country?- No country.- It's going to be a quick interview.- I know, I'm sorry.- Thanks for coming. Get the hell out of here.- Yeah, yeah, right?- Oh, funny. Well, I'm excited to talk to you.- Yeah.- You've got an incredible perspective as being, you know, a W2 employee at one point. You've been a business owner, and now you've been the mayor of Sioux Falls. So I'm excited to get your perspective, but let's, before we dive into that, let's start at the beginning. So take me back. What are some of your earliest memories about money?- Oh, you know, one of my first memories about money is I built a little treasure chest, this little wooden treasure chest about this big, and it had a compartment in it. And I cut up two pieces of cardboard and I put them in this treasure chest, and I would put all my money in those three slots.- [Adam] Okay.- And one was for the church.- Yep.- One was to save.- Yep.- And one was to spend. And so when I would get money, I would break it up into those, it wasn't really a true tie. I'd drop a dollar in here or drop a, you know, some money into the different compartments, but when I think about money early on, I think of that crusty old treasure box that I created and how that concept of tithing, saving, spending.- Yep.- Was like, not drilled into me, but just something I had at a very, very young age that was probably five, six years old.- Okay. Did you guys talk about money in the house growing up?- You know, not a lot. We lived a, we lived a middle class life. You know, growing up, we weren't rich, but we, you know, we had, you know, lacked for nothing. You know, we had a good life. My parents did though, really stress the importance of giving back, you know, giving back to your community.- [Adam] Yep.- Giving back to the church, of making sure that you're saving, putting money aside.- Yep.- And so responsible, you know, ownership and use of money was always a concept. Was it a huge theme, no. Were we misers, you know, no. You know, we spent money on things we want to spend money on, but--- [Adam] Yeah.- So it was a theme, but was it focused on a ton, not really.- Yeah. Did you rebel against that at any point or did that carry right into--- Dude, I've always been a saver.- Okay.- You know, I was the saver.- [Adam] Yeah.- I got a son Max right now. Max just turned 16. Max is my boy. He's a saver, too. I mean, I can, the kid spends no money, won't go to Burger King unless he has a coupon, like, he just, he's a chip off the old block, I'm so proud of him. And we're Dutch by default, so we're cheap anyway,[Adam laughs] so not only is he cheap, but he also, you know, looks for coupons and stuff, so he's a good kid.- Yeah. I love that. I love that. How have you handled money as a parent? Have you kind of done the same lessons your parents did for you?- Yeah. You know, we have tried to bring our kids into giving discussions, right.- [Adam] Yeah.- So, one thing that we do is, you know, when we give money, a lot of times your kids don't see it. You know, you may be, let's say you cut a check to an organization. It just goes in the mail and your kids never see it. Or we give to our church, it's all ACH, so they never see us put money into an offering plate, per se, versus me growing up every Sunday my parents had an envelope and it would get dropped into this plate. And so I'd see that practice. So, because that practice is not visible anymore, I think it's more important to talk to your kids and say, "Hey, just 'cause you don't see me doing this, we do something called ACH, which means every, you know, every month the church goes into our bank account and grabs some money out of there so that this church can turn the lights on and pay the pastor and do these different things." So we definitely have those conversations. And then several times a year we ask our kids, we're like,"Hey, we're thinking about supporting some organizations, what do you think about this one or that one? Try to let them feel like they're having some input into some of those decisions.- I love that.- [Paul] Yeah.- Hmm, what a cool giving legacy.- Yeah, yeah.- Well, Paul, you weren't always the mayor of Sioux Falls. So tell me a little bit about your career before you entered the octagon--- Yeah.- Of public service.- Yeah, the guillotine, you mean?[Adam chuckles]- So I was in marketing; I'm actually a colorblind graphic designer by background, so it's what every politician goes to college for.[Adam chuckles] So graduated from a college called Dordt University in 2000, moved to Sioux Falls, and I did marketing for eight years before starting a company in 2008 called Click Rain, which at that time was a social media marketing company. And social media wasn't even a term then. No one really knew what it meant. But kind of saw this tsunami coming with MySpace at the time, and like, I think the social media thing is going to be a thing. And it turned out to be a thing. So I did that for 10 years until 2018, but about 2015, 2016 started to just have a little bit of unrest, discontentment with my work, you know, with being an entrepreneur, with making money, with trying to grow a company, which we were doing great and life was good and I loved it and I had freedom and I had income, but it was just really hollow. And it's kind of a tale as old as time. You know, people who, you know, they reach the top of the mountain and they're like, "Is this it?"- [Adam] Yeah.- I reached these goals and now what? Now what do I do? And so I had success, but I didn't have significance and I was looking for more significance. So started to unwind myself from that company to, you know, ultimately ended up, you know, selling it over a period of couple years through some different transactions to run for mayor of Sioux Falls and fully expecting to lose.[Adam laughs] You know, like, "I'll run, I'll probably lose."- [Adam] Yeah.- And then I'll do something else, whatever, you know, God puts in my heart and I didn't lose. So I'm seven years in, got one more year left, and then we'll see what the next chapter holds.- Yeah. So it feels like you chose the path of most resistance.- For sure.- By running for mayor.- For sure.- Of a public office. Why? Like, what was it that called you to do that?- You know, I think the, there's a book called "Halftime" by a guy named Bob Buford.- Mm-hmm.- Are you familiar with this book?- I'm familiar with the book.- All right, the tagline is"Moving from Success to Significance." And you get challenged through that book to think about how you will be remembered, how you want to be eulogized. I, for instance, have written my own obituary multiple times. I just rewrote it a couple weeks ago. And if you really sit down and do that exercise and write your own obituary, do you want to be eulogized as a good wealth management guy? And I'm guessing you don't. Now, now that's not to mean your work's not important and this life's not important, but I don't want to be eulogized as he's a good entrepreneur, had a great social media marketing company. And I felt at the time, like, that's kind of what I am. It's kind of what I'm known for. I want to serve people.- Yeah.- I want to lead people. I want to make this community better. I want to have impact. And I just felt like God had more for me.- Yeah.- And so took a pay cut, a privacy cut, all these cuts to run for public office because I wanted to have an impact on people's lives. I wanted to make the lives better. I wanted to serve. And it's, as corny as it sounds, it's the reason you hope most people get into public service, because they've got no agenda other than they just want to serve and make people's lives better.- [Adam] Yep.- And that's truly why I got into this work. And it's been very hard, it's been very rewarding, but a life of service is really, really rewarding.- Yeah. That decision wasn't made in a vacuum, obviously, that had an impact on your family. So as you thought about taking that pay cut and taking that privacy cut, particularly the money side of things, what were those conversations like with Jill and with your family as you started on that road?- Well, it was, it was a huge decision. And you know, I have, luckily, I have a very super supportive wife, that is her response to most crazy things I come up with is,"Hey, I just want you to be happy."- Yeah.- "If you want to do this, do it." And so the discussion specifically around finances in doing this was, "Hey, Paul, I mean, the worst case scenario is we, we downsize this or we don't do this anymore. We drive older cars or we, you know, we figure out how to make this work."- [Adam] Yeah.- And so as soon as the keeping up with the Joneses mentality flees you, it's very freeing. When you're like,"Hey, I'm, I'm happy, I'm happy. I don't need anything else. Like, I live in the best city, in the best state, in the best country in the world, and I got a piece of plastic in my wallet that can buy me any food I want in this store, like I am so blessed beyond measure.- [Adam] Yeah.- And so when you really put it in perspective, like yes, the pay cut quote unquote, that I took to become the mayor, I'm still getting paid incredibly well.- Yeah.- To be a public servant.- Yep.- And so it's all about perspective. And so did we have to make life changes? For sure, we totally did. But none of them were insurmountable and so big that it made it not worth it. We still said, "Hey, let's do this. And I think God will lead us through it." And he has.- Nice. You mentioned keeping up with the Joneses. So this is Episode 62 of the show. Episode 1 was titled,"Keeping Up with the Joneses."- Really?- Was literally the first thing we talked about in the show.- Really.- Yeah, absolutely. Feels like a lifetime ago. So let's talk about your role as mayor and the perspective that brings. So as a mayor of a large and growing city, you get to see really two different sides of the same coin. You get to see extreme wealth and you also get to see extreme poverty. How has that perspective changed your view on money? Well, it's changed my view a little bit, and I say a little bit because, you know, about 10, 12 years ago, I started to really get engaged in international service work.- [Adam] Okay.- And if you think you have it bad, you need to come with me the next time I go to Haiti or to the Dominican, or I was just in Africa a while back and see what a dollar a day literally looks like. And your perspective will get wrecked. And so people who make minimum wage in the United States of America are still in, probably, the top 5% of earners in the entire world, right? And so that doesn't mean that we're not fighting for them to do more and to make more and to have a better life. But when we look at the grand scheme of things, we are so blessed in our country and it's easy for me to sit here and say that, but we are so blessed. But bringing that down to a local level, there is a big disparity in a city like Sioux Falls between the haves and the have nots, tremendous. And we were talking off air about, you know, some issues I'm having in our community with, you know some people that are living in some living conditions that they're just not acceptable to me.- Yeah.- And they don't have the financial resources to do anything about it. And my heart hurts for them, and I want to do something about it, and I want to help them, and I'm going to do what I can within my control as mayor. But too often I think we get stuck in our bubbles of we hang out with the same people, we drive the same route to work, we go to the same church, we watch the same shows, and we don't get exposed to true poverty in our city and really understand what happens in areas of our city where we never go. For instance, I just saw a community health assessment report. And in Sioux Falls, if you live in the north part of Sioux Falls, North Cliff Avenue area, your life expectancy is like 72 years old. If you live in South Lincoln County, okay, 85th and Minnesota area, your life expectancy is like 82 years old. So there's a 10-year life expectancy difference based on your zip code in Sioux Falls. So that tells you a lot about people that live in that part of our city, don't have access or have been raised very differently, don't have access to the right foods, healthcare, they've just, they've lived a very different life.- [Adam] Yep.- And are going to live a much shorter life because of the opportunities they have or haven't been afforded.- Yeah.- So those are things I, without being a mayor, I never would've had my eyes open to or would've understood.- Yeah. The other side of that coin is the haves, the folks that do have some pretty incredible wealth in this community. One thing I've noticed about Sioux Falls is how generous our business leaders are in this community. And having lived elsewhere, I just, I didn't see that same level of generosity and public-private partnership that we see here. How critical has that private investment been in our community and building a city that we can all be proud of?- I can't foot stomp it enough. I mean, I just, before we recorded this podcast, came from a meeting where we're courting a business and they were asking about kind of the trajectory of Sioux Falls and some of the businesses and industry we have. And I mentioned a couple specific philanthropists and specifically I mentioned a guy that is going to be familiar to most of the listeners, and that's T. Denny Sanford and I said this single guy, I mean, you can't swing a cat without hitting something in this community that he has not been a part of, including our largest industry, Sanford Health. And the job creation, research, and things that that has created. And so you go up and down Phillips Avenue here where your office is and we'll, you know, we can start with Jacobson Plaza and then we can go to Lloyd Landing, and then we can, you know, go all the way up to the State Theater that Denny, you know, put money in to finally get that thing open. And then we can go over to McKennan Park and where the McDowell's have just made some contribution to do some things at the park there. I mean, I could go all over the city and point to things that, but for the private sector contributing, they simply would not have gotten done. And why that's so important is because we live in a very low-tax state. And so in a Minneapolis, okay, where you came from in a state like Minnesota, corporate income tax, state income tax, people rely on the government, government provide this, build this for us, do this for us. You have a bigger tax base to work from. We don't have that. We run very lean. So if people say, "Hey, we want a refrigerated ice skating ribbon and an outdoor, this dog park. And that's great, we only have this much money. And the private sector hears that and they say,"You know what? We know we need this as well. We're going to come alongside you." And so this community has a rich history of public-private partnerships.- Yeah. So let's pivot a little bit. You wrote a book recently, called "The Code of Contentment." So what inspired you to write the book and and why now?- Well, "The Code of Contentment," it's a 52-week devotional, really, and it's just, I journal, writing a lot of things down and I'm like, "You know what? I'm just going to start putting some of these things into bite-sized kind of weekly lessons." And being the mayor of Sioux Falls has been a leadership gauntlet, man, and specifically going through the pandemic. That just chewed me up and spit me out weekly. And I learned so much from that about myself, about our community, about resiliency, about dealing with difficult people, about challenging situations. And so "The Code Of Contentment" is really about what does contentment look like? And if you think contentment is found in money, or in stuff, or in your job, or in your LinkedIn profile or in status, you are going to chase that and never find it. So contentment's just going to come from within. You got to find that outside of these earthly things that you're going to continue to look for. So the real secret sauce of that book is every week there's the six same questions are asked, you know, what's bringing you joy this week? What are you grateful for? What's one thing you're going to do this week to work on your physical or mental health? What's one relationship you need to focus on this week? And I have found that when I write stuff down, I do it. And I just think, yeah, I'm going to maybe try to get to the gym three times this week, will it happen? But if I write it down and then I'm forced to go back the next week and look back at it, I disappoint myself if I don't do it. And I'm like, "Man, I wrote it down, I documented it." And sometimes I'll even show it to other people who will hold me accountable.- Mm.- That's a different level of accountability. That's what the book seeks to do. So that's the reason for writing it.- Yeah, so we're still in January, despite what the temperature might indicate.- Yeah.- Are you a resolutions guy?- Ah, not a big resolutions guy, because if something needs to change, I don't need to wait for January, I do it whenever.- Yep.- So, used to do that, and I found I didn't stick with them, so if something needs to change, if I need to lose 10 pounds, I'll start in May. I don't need to wait for January.[laughs] - Yeah, yeah. One of the things that I loved about "The Code of Contentment" was this idea of contentment over happiness. And something I think about a lot, and I think it startles people when I say it, is by today's measures, I don't think you'd look at me and say, "Well, Adam is a truly happy person," by how we measure happiness today. My pushback would be, that may be true, but I am incredibly, deeply fulfilled.- Hm.- And I'd like to get your thought on that concept and this idea that if, like, what kind of impact would we have if we chased contentment and fulfillment versus trying to chase happiness?- Yeah, man, that's a great point. And contentment and fulfillment is something deeply personal to each individual. And I can't tell, Adam, what's going to bring you contentment. You have to get there on your own. And you have to find that on your own. And for me, contentment meant letting money lose its grip on me. And I know, you know, you obviously talk a lot about money on this podcast. And when I had some transactions with selling my company, I had some cash and Jill and I were looking at the financial ramifications of that and the tax burden of that. It was not pretty. And I'm like, "Man, I don't want to give 30, 40% of this to the government." So we started a family foundation and we dumped it all into there. And it's been such a blessing to be able to rally around giving together through this foundation. Are we rich? We're not rich. If I wanted to go on a$20,000 extravagant vacation right now, that would be hard for me. But if I wanted to cut a big check to an organization, I could do that because I have this foundation. And so money, when you have it and then you release it, it loses its power over you. So I had it in my hands, I'm like,"I don't want this burden. I'm going to put it into this pot, this foundation, and let God use it." Money no longer has its hold on me, that's made me so content with money. So I can go be a greeter at Walmart after this job is over, you know, and make $12 an hour. I think I can be content and I can change my lifestyle to fit that and be very happy with that. And that's a fun place to be.- I bet there are days you wish you had that job.- There's many days I wish I had that job. Today was one of them, today was one of them.[ Both laugh]- Today was one of them. Well, it's interesting about the show, you mentioned, you know, we obviously we do talk about personal finance on the show, but it's weird, when I started the show, it was going to be a really technical-based show. We were going to talk about, you know, Roth IRAs and tax simplifications and things like that. And we talk about some technical stuff. But one of the things I learned pretty quickly was people didn't really want to talk about that stuff and they didn't want to listen to it either. They really wanted to talk about the layer or two deeper than money, the things about purpose and things about contentment and what it's all for. And I don't think, to this day, I don't know that I've asked people about faith, necessarily.- Hmm.- But they sure bring it up, and you've brought it up here today. And so we talk about money, certainly, but we talk about so much else. And I think that's the story about money. And one of the reasons why people enjoy the show so much is because, yeah, it's tangentially about money, but it's also about life and struggle and success and purpose and legacy and all those sorts of things, which is really getting to the heart of it.- Yeah, one of the biggest things, Adam, that fractures relationships, fractures people, fractures our society is usually a topic that centers around money, okay? It's one of the most divisive things in a marriage. You know, when someone passes away, it divides family. It's just, it can be so divisive. Satan uses money, man, as a wedge like nothing else. And so we have to be so cautious with money and to recognize the grip that it can easily have on us and in a negative way. But when you can release that grip and say,"Hey, I'm content, whether I'm rich or I'm poor, whether I have a lot or a little, I've learned to be content in any circumstance."- Yep.- It's a great place to be.- Yeah. Let's finish our conversation talking about purpose. So as you finish your time here, as mayor, you've got about a year or so left. How do you think about purpose and how has that changed for you over time?- Hmm. You know, for me, purpose is really centered around the impact that I can have on other people.- Hmm.- And what really fills my cup and what really makes me feel like I'm having significance and an impact on the world around me is when I can build up leaders, when I can bring people closer to their faith through their work and see the connection between those two. They don't have to exist in a vacuum. That, to me, brings an incredible sense of purpose. In my next chapter, I'd love to find a way to do even more of that.- Hmm.- I have to be somewhat cautious on how I do that, in my current role as a mayor, I'm very outspoken in my faith, but I have to be a little bit, you know, just careful on that because I have to understand not everybody has the same belief system as I do. And I obviously respect that and I lead people of a lot of different faiths in our community. But that's my purpose. I firmly believe that's why I'm on this earth. And it really is what gets me out of bed every morning. And I'm looking forward to doing more of that, whatever that looks like in 14 months.- Yeah. Who's counting?- I am absolutely counting.[Adam laughs] 40, I got 47 council meetings left.- [laughing] I love it. I love it. So I guess last question for you. Someone's listening to this episode and they're thinking,"Ah, you know, Paul's got a sense of peace to him and his contentment and purpose. That sounds really good, and I don't have that." Where do you think a good place for them to start would be?- Well, I mean, I know we've talked a lot about faith, but I would turn to the Good Book first and foremost, you know, and finding peace with yourself first and contentment with yourself and not measuring yourself against other people. When I stopped doing that is when I really started to find some peace. I was constantly looking at, man, that guy has a nicer this or that, or why their career seems to be going a little faster than mine. And when we stopped benchmarking ourselves against other people and just benchmark it against ourselves and who God made us to be, it's very, very freeing. So there's always going to be, Adam, a better looking guy than you, someone making more money than you, someone with a better looking wife than you, more athletic kids than you, bigger, always be.- Yep.- And so that is an endless, endless rat race if you're using that as a way to measure, you know, your own success. So you got to find peace internally and it's got to come from within.- Yeah. Love it. Let's finish there.- Yeah.- Thank you so much for being on the show, this was awesome.- You bet.- Appreciate it.[serene music] I hope you found this helpful. If you did, please subscribe and share with your family or friends. If you have a topic you want us to cover in future episodes, send us a note through our website and if you're at the point where you want an expert opinion on your finances, reach out. We'd be happy to start a conversation. And remember, any comments, insights, or strategies discussed on this podcast are intended to be general in nature and, therefore, may not be suitable for you and your situation, whatever that may be. Before acting on anything we discussed, please consult with your attorney, CPA, and/or your financial advisor.