The Writing and Marketing Show

Mindfullness for Writers

October 06, 2021 Wendy H. Jones/Eileen Rolland Episode 90
The Writing and Marketing Show
Mindfullness for Writers
Show Notes Transcript

Today I am talking to writer Eileen Rolland about using mindfulness techniques both for focus and also enriching your narrative. 

Wendy Jones:

Hi, and welcome to the writing and Marketing Show brought to you by author Wendy H. Jones. This show does exactly what it says on the tin. It's jam packed with interviews, advice, hints, tips and news to help you with the business of writing. It's all wrapped up in one lively podcast, so it's time to get on with the show. And welcome to Episode 90 of the writing and Marketing Show with author entrepreneur Wendy H. Jones. Wow, Episode 90. I never thought I would actually see the day that would happen. But here we are. It's a magical number. But an even more magical number will be Episode 100. But for Episode 90, I have a cracking show for you again today with we're going to be discussing mindfulness with author Eileen Rowland. And we'll get to that in a moment. Before that, what have I been up to? Well, I had an absolutely brilliant, brilliant time at Chatham dockyard last week, and I learned so much there and got to got so much information from it, I just cannot tell you how useful it was. And I would highly advise you to go and do research physically. Now that we've opened up again, I really would because you get so much from it. I've also been to the welcome museum. And although that was a little less useful, I still managed to get a lot from it. I've also been to the naval museum down in Greenwich, and I was at the old Naval College and was able to do some research there. So it's been extremely, extremely helpful this week. And so if you can't go out and do some physical research, I've got some more things lined up later in the week, I'm going to be going to the War Museum. And I'm hoping to go to the old operating theatre on terraced gardens in London as well. And then on Saturday, I will be at the Association of Christian writers writers day. And I'm very excited to be going to that because I'll be meeting up with a lot of friends that I haven't seen for the last two years. So it's going to be amazing day really. So if you're, if you're listening to this, and you're from the Association of Christian writers, hello, and I will see you on Saturday. And I'm very much looking forward to it. And so let's get on with the show. But before we do, I would just like to say it's an absolute pleasure to bring you this show every week. I do so willingly. And I love doing it. But it does take time out of my writing. If you would like to support this time, you can do so by going to patreon.com that's pa t ar e o n.com. And you can support me for just an hour for just three or $3 a month, which is the price of a tea or coffee. And it will let me know that you are very grateful and you enjoy the show. And I will certainly be very grateful. And it will help me to continue to do it because it will let me know that you're enjoying it. So what have Eileen, well Eileen has written her bio in the in present tense first, first person, and I've left it like that because I thought it was brilliant the way it was written. I have a very clear memory of the day I knew I was going to be a writer. It was in third grade, I grew up in Vancouver, and for the first time we were given a pen to write with. I loved the feel of it in my hand and I loved the magic is what flowed from me through my pen and onto the paper. Since then, I've always written but as I've worked with a number of voluntary organisations and community groups, most of my writing was work related. I wrote some poems and stories too, although I didn't really do much with them. I belong to a number of writing groups over the years and it was a homework assignment. 600 words on finding something that was lost. That started me off writing my first novel, I wrote about a mustard seed necklace a true story. But as I was writing, I began to wonder what would happen if something more precious was lost? What was person lost part of him or herself? Those 600 words turned into a trilogy and I've recently completed a fourth separate novel. Be careful what you wish for. And that's the best advice I've ever heard for a writer. Be careful what you wish for because it could come through. And it's exciting when it comes to because I've wished I could write one book and look what's happened. But without further ado, let's get on with the show and hear from Eileen and we have Eileen with us.Hi, Eileen

Eileen Rolland:

Hi Wendy. How are you?

Wendy Jones:

I'm very well Now am I pronouncing your name correctly because you know, I could be doing it wrong.

Eileen Rolland:

I answer to just about anything but it's usually Eileen

Wendy Jones:

or Eileen. Okay, so I've got it wrong from the get go. And I only asked you last night how to pronounce your name and I've forgotten already. That's about par for the course for me, I have to say. So are you sitting comfortably today? are you?

Eileen Rolland:

I am Wendy. We're back and I'm feeling good.

Wendy Jones:

Excellent, sun shining? Where are you in the world? Where are you?

Eileen Rolland:

I just outside Dundee just north of Dundee in a little place called Monikie. So I'm just in a village. Not much to it. But it's lovely. Love it here.

Wendy Jones:

Oh, Monikie is lovely. I went there for a meal with a friend of mine. Very nice.

Eileen Rolland:

Yes. Yeah, their food's really good. We've got a coffee shop just at the top of the street, which is very handy.

Wendy Jones:

Marvellous, we need to meet up there and do some writing.

Eileen Rolland:

That's not a bad idea. That sounds like a plan.

Wendy Jones:

Anyway, talking of writing, we're here to talk about writing. But we're also here to talk about mindfulness and mindfulness in writing. And I'm very excited about this, because I think it's something that's becoming increasingly important. And so first of all, we better really put a cleaner colours to the mast, you know, because we're probably all got different ideas of what it is. So we're all on the same page. Can you let us know what exactly is mindfulness?

Eileen Rolland:

I think you're right, I think most people have some kind of idea about mindful what mindfulness is. You might be mindful about your health, for example, what you're eating and stuff like that. So you're aware. So if you want a dictionary definition, it's about bringing your awareness to something. And keeping that in your mind and using that process in whatever you're doing in your life. Like, for example?

Wendy Jones:

No, I think that's a great explanation really, that you are focusing your mind on something. You know, I think that's something that we find very difficult in this day and age, because, for example, my mind's all over the place. You know, I'm like a squirrel. One minute, it's like, oh, yes, there's not them. The next minute, there's nuts there. You know, I've got an idea for a book here an idea for a book there an idea for books somewhere else, which one do I write? You know, so mindfulness? Hey, that's why I'm glad this is, we're talking about this, because I really need to be more mindful about what I'm doing. So yeah, great answer, really. So I can hear people saying, you know, I'm an author, I don't need to worry about that sort of stuff. Why would an author find mindfulness techniques useful?

Eileen Rolland:

Well, I think it can be useful across the board. But if you're an author, particularly, because you're kind of doing this automatically, you're probably not even aware of it. You're kind of picking up on nonverbal communication, you're watching people how they react in a situation, watch how you react in a situation, what your language is, like in a given situation. And you're using that in your writing. So, you know, why would you not do that? Why would you not sort of pay attention and help to produce more credible and believable characters and situations?

Wendy Jones:

Yeah, I mean, I've never really thought of it that way To be honest, that you can use it. As a writer, I've mainly thought about it as helping to calm you down. But I'm fascinated by the fact that you can use it to bring more depth to your writing. And we're going to be talking about that in a minute. And I think that's amazing. Because the minute anybody talks about mindfulness, I think about meditation, and everybody goes, Oh, it's meditation, you know, and I'm the same. But obviously, this way I want to do the podcast, because obviously, we need to widen our scope as to what it is, you know, and to use it more effectively.

Eileen Rolland:

Well, it's not just meditation, but I think it needs some aspects of meditation to work.

Wendy Jones:

Yeah. No, I agree. Yeah. So at the moment, and I the amount of authors I hear saying, I'm so stressed and I don't know why. Why do you think it's so stressful for authors at the moment?

Eileen Rolland:

I think there's a lot going on, generally, you've got all the you know, sort of pandemic stuff going on, and all the political stuff going on. And it's, it's anxious, a lot of people are anxious generally. But authors particularly maybe because, you know, they're trying to get their books out there. They may have problems with getting things published, getting things distributed, if the sales aren't going as well as they thought they might. So all this preys on your mind and it's not really very much you can do about it. So if you if you can calm yourself down and she say, if you can use mindfulness to say, Okay, this is the situation. I'm a glass half, full kind of person. So I kind of see the good in in things. Maybe you're meant to just stop for a minute. Maybe I'm just to catch my breath. And then you refresh yourself, and then you go again.

Wendy Jones:

No, I think you're right. There's so many stressors at the moment because of the pandemic has brought up, I think, because you're right. publication dates have been delayed for many people. And you know, income is down because, you know, people are not going out buying bookshops was shot, you know, and also we've got all the pandemic issues as well about where even though we don't feel we're anxious about our health, I would say that most of us are subconsciously, would you agree with that? Or?

Eileen Rolland:

Absolutely, because you know, this, there's talk of, you know, food shortages and things like that, and people thinking, well, how am I going to get rid of one. And I think maybe you have to be aware of what we're eating and reading and stuff like that, maybe make some changes, I don't know, whatever works for people. But there are things that you can't change. So there's no point in stressing about things you can't change. So think about the things that you can change to make life a bit more positive for yourself. Maybe that's the way forward.

Wendy Jones:

That's a really good tip, actually, because if you can't change something, worrying about it isn't going to help. So focusing on the things you can't change is as important. Great tip.

Eileen Rolland:

My mum used to say you die if you were in your day, if you don't, so why worry.

Wendy Jones:

It's very good. I like that. I'm going to pretend that about my seriously I'm going to take that out and pin it up above my desk when I get home because I'm currently in dundies in London, so I can't do a lot about anything while I'm here to break in and do it for you to do notice. But when I get back to Scotland, I'm going to put that above my desk because I think as a great tip you're going to die if you want to in David don't So why was he fabulous? Hey, that this is a great podcast. But is it perfect just for that if nothing else,

Eileen Rolland:

you should interview my mum, she had lots of sayings like that

Wendy Jones:

would have been great. Yeah, I know, this is a podcast and there's no video. So it may be a bit difficult to show us but can you give us a couple of techniques we can use easily each day. And that's to help us you know, perhaps focus better or relax or

Eileen Rolland:

there's loads of things you can try and everybody you know what works for one person might not work for someone else. So you've got to kind of play about and try different things. But breathing is really important. If you know what I mean? How you breathe is important. Okay, so if you want to kind of if you ever heard of belly breathing, no. Okay. And it's sweet baby speech. It's the way we breathe when we're sleeping. Really it's your tummy that goes up and down, not your chest. So if you breathe in and expand your tummy, and breathe out and let your tummy push in, that helps your breathing that helps to regulate breathing, if you're breathing is regulated, then your heart rate is regulated and your blood pressure is regulated so that can really help people to calm down. Okay, and there's this other techniques as well gentle exercise if you like dancing or singing or you know doing things like that, creative pursuits, colouring books, you know, I love colouring books Actually, I've got these pencils that are watercolour pencils, and they actually colour pink you get particularly water and a little bit of blue, blue gel pens, gel pens, gel pens with sparkle in them nice you can go around the edges with that gives you honestly like a child again these things are brilliant, but yeah, it's just finding what works for you.

Wendy Jones:

Yeah, I mean I I love adult colouring books and to be honest, I'm feeling more relaxed just talking about watercolour pencils and gel pens. But buying stuff like that makes me relax very well I have to say, I'm using it.

Unknown:

I'm in London purchases. Usually gel pens to start off your next novel.

Wendy Jones:

Alright, I could do I've got a notebook with me so that's where I'm going wrong. I'm using a pencil to write the notes for my next novel I need gel pens. So this podcast always goes off p stuff to say if sparkly gel pens help people relax, then I'm all in favour of them. So I know why not. I agree. I don't call it and can be so calming And every time I haven't brought it this time, because I was a bit worried about weight because I've got a sword back. But I always if I go away, I usually take gel pens with me and not gel pen, sorry, colouring pencils, and, and an adult colouring book and I do some colouring. And I do that on the plane, not that I'm nervous on the plane, I'm not at all. But I just think there's something so calming about flying and nobody can get in touch with you. And doing a bit of colouring it just is so calming.

Eileen Rolland:

You hit the nail on your end, because it's about people getting in touch with you. We've got information coming at us from all sides. Yeah. And sometimes you just need to help find a way we assess for yourself.

Wendy Jones:

Yeah. And I would agree that, you know, we do need time because we've got this, this information age, we, I think a lot of the stress comes from the amount of information we're getting thrown at us every day. So this is I'd say, this is why I was really keen to have this session because it's really good. And you've given us some good tips there. I'm going to try the belly breathing, unless it gives me backing. I doubt it.

Eileen Rolland:

If you know before you go to sleep at night or something where you're comfortable. And you know, just try it and don't force it. Just try it. If it doesn't work, try it again the next day or something.

Wendy Jones:

Yeah. I think that's another important point that if you don't think it's for you, try again the next day and the next day, don't just give up the first time and go this is a lot of rubbish. Because someday I would Richard, do you say that? Some what would you say that some of these techniques take time to not master but time to relax into?

Eileen Rolland:

I think people find them difficult if they're new techniques to them. Yeah. And they're a bit sceptical, which is your bad thing? You know, you should question things. But if you try it, what what? I've always said to my kids when they were growing up, but don't knock what you don't understand. Yeah. So if you can try something and get a more complete picture of what it is you're trying to do, and then decide whether it's for you or not, if it's not, Oh,

Wendy Jones:

yeah, yeah, that's true. Yeah. But you do have to give it time. It's a bit like when you try something new, when you eat at the sea, you have to try it 13 times before you can dismiss the fact that you don't like it. You know, that's what it is. So, you said earlier, you touched on this earlier that there are mindful mindfulness techniques we can use it will help to make our writing richer. And can you give us a couple of examples of those?

Eileen Rolland:

Well, one that I've done, I've used actually in a story was, if you imagine a chair in front of the unit chair, and you can put whoever you want in that chair, and you can ask them questions, or you can have a conversation with them. And it could be a character from your book, and maybe they can give you because they have their own subtext. And they can self tell you no, I'm not going now. This is what I'm gonna do. And yeah, I've got twin sister, no. system, Where would she come from? Oh, I know. Um, so that's something that you can do, because you can have a really interesting conversation. And it's all kind of going on in your mind, but you're creating, and we as writers create all the time. And you want that creative ability to be manifest in some way. Another another way you can do it is something called automatic writing. I don't know if you've heard of that. No, it's when you write if you have a question, I don't know what to do with this situation or whatever. And you write the question down on a piece of paper with your gel pens. And, and then you just relax, you slow down your breathing, you relax your back and relax your muscles, relax your jaw. And you just hold a pen in your hand and wait to see what comes up. And the first thing that comes into your mind, just write it down. So whenever you calm your mind down, and you get rid of all the all the clutter, or all the stuff that you really don't need at this point in your life. You can new ideas can come up, because there's nothing to block them. Does that make sense?

Wendy Jones:

Yeah, no, it does. I think that's a great idea. What is that code sorry.

Eileen Rolland:

It's called automatic writing automatic, kind of letting things come up automatically and spontaneously, and you just spread it out. You might use it you might not but it gives you a bit of insight into what your characters doing or what the situation In the screen to unfold into something else, you know, and it helps you with, with the actual plot perhaps, or the dialogue or whatever it is you're struggling with.

Wendy Jones:

I think that's a great tip. I love that one. I'm going to try that. Because it's true very often we can't move on because we've got far too much clutter in our minds. Yeah, get rid of it, then the plotter. I think that's why people say, oh, when I go for a walk, things go, they comes to me the next plot twist. But I mean, I would say that's probably because you stop thinking about it.

Eileen Rolland:

When people do that, I had a lady in a writing group promise up before and she has to walk along the beach. And she always, always every time, came back and wrote something for the homework that we had set. And it was fantastic. And she says, If I sat down to think about that, I wouldn't, I wouldn't have got what I've got, yes, along the beach, just looking at the water and during the sun on your back or whatever. And I'll write about that.

Wendy Jones:

No, it sounds that's a good idea. Walking along beaches is always very pleasant, except my mind would drift to the fact that a dead body would float up.

Eileen Rolland:

But that works for you.

Wendy Jones:

For me, I write crime books. So that's good. If I was writing a romance, it wouldn't help much with it, really.

Eileen Rolland:

But water energy is really good in terms of, you know, elements and stuff. Water energy is about creativity. So beaches.

Wendy Jones:

Right? So good. Excellent. I like the sound of that concept. I'm in London at the moment. I don't think there's many beaches around me. But hey, I'll try it when I get home.

Eileen Rolland:

When you get home?

Wendy Jones:

Yes, absolutely. So some people might be sceptical that mindfulness actually works. There's always people who are naysayers, and what would you say to them?

Eileen Rolland:

I think it's good to be sceptical. I think I said earlier, you shouldn't sort of question things. But don't knock it till you've tried it. So try it. If it doesn't work for you, that's fine. Try something else. I can't imagine it not working for people. Because you find the technique that best suits your lifestyle or your thought processes. And you use that, and what I might use might be different from what someone else uses. So there's no, there's no wrong way to do it. If you know what I mean.

Wendy Jones:

Yeah, yeah. And I think that's the thing that that is not fair to remember that there is no wrong way of doing it. Yeah, you know, and find a technique that works for you. I've been, I'm hoping to interview someone from this programme for the podcast. And it's a programme called brain FM. As far as I can gather, it's different types of music and sounds that helps your brain go in different ways. Now, to be honest, I put a couple on nothing against brain FM here, by the way, because it seems to be an outstanding programme. But I put a couple on, it didn't resonate with me at all. And I thought, Oh, my goodness, and then I found one that did, but they've got so many, there's something's going to resonate with you. You know, what is the vide given up after the first tune gone? off, this is a load of rubbish, I wouldn't have found something that worked for me.

Eileen Rolland:

I was in a similar situation when I was trying meditation, you know, sort of start. And someone lips CDs, and that just isn't working for me. And then I found one track on one CD that just clicked everything into place. And now I've, I know what I'm looking for. Yeah. So I can go to a CD or a book, I could get a meditation out of a book for a specific thing. One that will focus on a health issue, for example, or one that will focus on you know, sort of get rid of headaches, or back pain or something like that, or what I'm doing in my book, what my characters do. Like I say, characters are pretty good at telling me what what to do.

Wendy Jones:

All my characters are always telling me what to do and don't want to do I tell you, they're struggling to say this, they're not even meant to be in the book, and they stroll in boulders, brass and plant themselves. So hey, it's always fun. It's fun. Yeah. I mean, I must be letting my mind wander for that to happen. So obviously, I'm doing something right.

Eileen Rolland:

That sort of means sometimes you're doing these things without even thinking about not even calling it mindfulness or meditation or

Wendy Jones:

anything. Yeah, yeah. So I'm curious, Eileen, how do you use mindfulness techniques in your own writing?

Eileen Rolland:

Well, I've used some of those exercises we talked about, like the empty chair and my last book, it was kind of about Finding an island, we were talking about finding an oasis for yourself, oh, yeah, finding an island, you know where you can go. And just everything was different. It's whatever we want it to be. So I use a lot of techniques. And I found a couple of books that have some suggestions in it. Like, you know, writers books that writers ideas and things like that. But he can pick up on one or two and just say, yeah, I'll go with that one. You know, and you can use that. And it's just about calming your mind. It's just about saying, right? Here I am, got a pen in my hand, ready to go and just let it flow. I think that's, that's what I liked about writing way back at the start. When I first started writing, I was yellow. I just loved the magic of it. I just love the magic that inside you, that allows these ideas to come up bubble up like champagne, and flow down through your arm into the onto the page. I know. I know, why not?

Wendy Jones:

You should be a writer, you're good at this. I might try I love that description is brilliant. I love it. I'm going to be thinking of champagne coming up my fingers. No one a type. They're probably problem is if you type there's no glitter pens involved? No, that's true. I'm missing a trick. So moving on from that, can you tell us something about your book your own books?

Eileen Rolland:

Um, well, my books, I tend to write things. Like similar to what we've been talking about really. The first, the first book was written from a piece of homework from writing 600 words on finding something that was lost?

Wendy Jones:

Yeah.

Eileen Rolland:

And I thought, what about something more than just a thing? You know, what, if it's part of you, that was asked, how would you find it again. And I started writing, and it turned into a trilogy, and I just used some of the stuff we've been talking about techniques like that, to kind of take the story forward. And to help the character to discover herself and who she really was, and what her life was meant to be like. And I loved that. It just, it just flowed for me it just

Wendy Jones:

work. Yeah.

Eileen Rolland:

So the last book that I've written is separate from the trilogy. And as I say, it's about finding an island. It's about the lady who has a recurring dream. And she's she's really into dreams. And she's, why am I having this dream all the time, what's going on? And she gets dream books and things. And they kind of give her a bit of information, but she can't make sense for and her friend. And ask your questions, or what about this? What about that? And she goes, Yeah, sometimes you just have to find an island, you just have to go away and think about things and find a space for yourself. And it's called Island somewhere because in the dream, she goes to an island and she finds purchase. And that's all I'm saying.

Wendy Jones:

There sounds great. What was your trilogy called? What are the titles

Eileen Rolland:

I called it the chrysalis trilogy. And the first one is called friends in high places. And it's about having help from the angelic realms. And it's about tapping into that kind of energy, if you like, Yeah, I love using that to make your life better. The second one is called the chrysalis effect, which is the transformation that happens when a caterpillar becomes a butterfly, you change from this person that you were into the person that you're meant to be. And the last one is called travelling late, which is about letting go of the baggage basically. Right? So they all kind of fit it together. I didn't know when I wrote the first book that I was going to have two more. So I seriously didn't, I thought I've written a book that I've always wanted to read. And read a story is not finished yet. So that's what

Wendy Jones:

Hey, that often happens.

Eileen Rolland:

We all start out writing one book and before you know where you are, you've got four characters who keep telling me what to do.

Wendy Jones:

Precisely they keep leaping into your head and going right about me. Are you zactly Exactly. Right. My very final question because all interviews have to come to an end eventually. Where can my listeners find out more about you and your books

Eileen Rolland:

and they can find out about them on online on Amazon are available there and if Phillips look Li D, they can find them in very, very in the book house, In brief, very, and they're also in the design project and wealthy

Wendy Jones:

and you're going to be doing Christmasfair somewhere.

Eileen Rolland:

Yes, going to be doing Christmas fairs around about

Wendy Jones:

You've got a list of book fairs. Well, there we go. So people can find you and they can get nice signed copies for their Christmas signed copies. That'd be fine. Yeah. Excellent. Well, it was a pleasure to chat to you. Thank you for taking time out to speak to me today.

Eileen Rolland:

Thank you for having me, Randy. It's been brilliant. You're welcome.

Wendy Jones:

And I hope but you know, you'll get back to writing now that we've stopped interviewing you.

Eileen Rolland:

Yeah, I've been writing with the whole time while you were talking to me. Actually. My fingers have been going mad.

Wendy Jones:

Believe it gone mad with a gel pen. I don't blame you. You're probably writing a book about this mad interviewer No.

Eileen Rolland:

No, here's an idea writethat down.

Wendy Jones:

Well, thank you very much. Once again, have a great day.

Eileen Rolland:

You too, Wendy Thank you

Wendy Jones:

That brings us to the end of another show. It was really good to have you on the show with me today. I'm Wendy h Jones. And you can find me at Wendy H jones.com. You can also find me on Patreon where you can support me for as little as $3 a month which is less than the price of a tea or coffee. You go to patreon.com forward slash when the H Jones. I'm also went to h Jones on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram and Pinterest. Thank you for joining me today and I hope you found it both useful and interesting. Join me next week when I will have another cracking guest for you. Until then, have a good week. And keep writing. Keep reading and keep learning