{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":18.99,"endTime":20.94,"body":"This"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":18.99,"endTime":20.94,"body":"is Keeping It 101, a killjoy's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":20.94,"endTime":25.26,"body":"introduction to religion"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":20.94,"endTime":25.26,"body":"podcast. For 2021-2022, our work"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":25.26,"endTime":27.75,"body":"is made possible through a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":25.26,"endTime":27.75,"body":"Public Humanities Fellowship"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":27.75,"endTime":30.39,"body":"from the University of Vermont's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":27.75,"endTime":30.39,"body":"Humanities Center. We're"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":30.39,"endTime":33.45,"body":"grateful to live, teach, and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":30.39,"endTime":33.45,"body":"record on the current, ancestral"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":33.45,"endTime":36.54,"body":"and unceded lands of the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":33.45,"endTime":36.54,"body":"Abenaki, Wabenaki, and Aucocisco"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":36.54,"endTime":39.27,"body":"peoples. As always, you can find"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":36.54,"endTime":39.27,"body":"material ways to support"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":39.27,"endTime":41.28,"body":"indigenous communities on our"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":39.27,"endTime":41.28,"body":"website."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":42.05,"endTime":45.83,"body":"What's up nerds?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":42.05,"endTime":45.83,"body":"Hi, hello, I'm Megan Goodwin, a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":45.83,"endTime":48.29,"body":"scholar of American religions,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":45.83,"endTime":48.29,"body":"race, and gender."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":48.47,"endTime":50.12,"body":"Hi,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":48.47,"endTime":50.12,"body":"hello, I'm Ilyse Morgenstein"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":50.12,"endTime":52.85,"body":"Fuerst, a historian of religion,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":50.12,"endTime":52.85,"body":"Islam, race and racialization,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":52.85,"endTime":53.9,"body":"and South Asia."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":54.56,"endTime":57.83,"body":"Here we go again!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":54.56,"endTime":57.83,"body":"The thing about world religions"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":58.01,"endTime":62.09,"body":"is that there's just... there's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":58.01,"endTime":62.09,"body":"so much world! Am I right?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":62.09,"endTime":64.67,"body":"*giggles*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":62.09,"endTime":64.67,"body":"Yeah! The world is a giant,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":64.67,"endTime":68.66,"body":"maddening place, with so much"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":64.67,"endTime":68.66,"body":"horror-- and beauty!-- And"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":68.69,"endTime":71.45,"body":"uhh... why did we decide to do"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":68.69,"endTime":71.45,"body":"such a big season again??"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":71.84,"endTime":73.76,"body":"Because we're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":71.84,"endTime":73.76,"body":"ambitious motherfuckers?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":76.29,"endTime":79.487,"body":"Like we can't--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":76.29,"endTime":79.487,"body":"we are a problem, is the short"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":76.31,"endTime":76.34,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":79.556,"endTime":83.309,"body":"answer there. But also,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":79.556,"endTime":83.309,"body":"everybody teaches this fricken"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":83.379,"endTime":87.341,"body":"class! And non-professors"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":83.379,"endTime":87.341,"body":"usually think about religion in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":87.41,"endTime":91.024,"body":"this like comparative or world"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":87.41,"endTime":91.024,"body":"religions way. and if"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":91.094,"endTime":95.125,"body":"everybody's thinking in a way"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":91.094,"endTime":95.125,"body":"that is so often myopic, and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":93.55,"endTime":95.05,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":95.194,"endTime":99.643,"body":"limited, and just like... wrong,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":95.194,"endTime":99.643,"body":"that I couldn't just let it go!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":99.712,"endTime":104.021,"body":"Aggghh, this is-- this is me."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":99.712,"endTime":104.021,"body":"This is-- this is US standing in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":104.091,"endTime":105.69,"body":"my truth, so... thanks?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":109.91,"endTime":112.13,"body":"Our last episode"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":109.91,"endTime":112.13,"body":"was all about African Diasporic"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":112.13,"endTime":114.59,"body":"Religions, and we've told y'all"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":112.13,"endTime":114.59,"body":"that this is a catch-all"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":114.62,"endTime":119.03,"body":"umbrella term. It's both useful"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":114.62,"endTime":119.03,"body":"to describe people's lived"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":119.03,"endTime":123.14,"body":"practices, and also it is a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":119.03,"endTime":123.14,"body":"product of imperialism. The"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":123.14,"endTime":128.66,"body":"term. And hey, guess what? We've"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":123.14,"endTime":128.66,"body":"got more of that today! Today,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":128.69,"endTime":132.35,"body":"we're starting a two episode"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":128.69,"endTime":132.35,"body":"dive into Indigenous religions."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":132.8,"endTime":135.02,"body":"Between this episode and the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":132.8,"endTime":135.02,"body":"next, we're covering how"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":135.02,"endTime":137.99,"body":"Indigenous gets talked about,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":135.02,"endTime":137.99,"body":"who counts and who doesn't, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":137.99,"endTime":141.05,"body":"why that matters when we talk"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":137.99,"endTime":141.05,"body":"religion. We'll be helped out by"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":141.05,"endTime":144.29,"body":"guests across these episodes."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":141.05,"endTime":144.29,"body":"And today, we've got Dr. Jolyon"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":144.29,"endTime":146.66,"body":"Thomas coming for your ears."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":147.38,"endTime":149.3,"body":"Dr."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":147.38,"endTime":149.3,"body":"Thomas is Associate Professor of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":149.3,"endTime":151.7,"body":"Religious Studies at the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":149.3,"endTime":151.7,"body":"University of Pennsylvania and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":151.7,"endTime":155.03,"body":"his work broadly focuses on"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":151.7,"endTime":155.03,"body":"religion and the arenas of law,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":155.03,"endTime":159.98,"body":"education, media, and often"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":155.03,"endTime":159.98,"body":"Japan. We're assigning so much"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":159.98,"endTime":163.55,"body":"of him for homework-- you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":159.98,"endTime":163.55,"body":"DEFINITELY want to read whatever"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":163.55,"endTime":166.85,"body":"he's writing, if I'm honest, but"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":163.55,"endTime":166.85,"body":"we'll hear from him a little bit"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":166.85,"endTime":171.44,"body":"later. Listen! We're not just"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":166.85,"endTime":171.44,"body":"doing this for the lesson plan,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":171.47,"endTime":178.7,"body":"we're doing it for a SHIT load"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":171.47,"endTime":178.7,"body":"of lesson plan! *music plays*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":183.53,"endTime":184.19,"body":"Good line read? *laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":184.99,"endTime":187.48,"body":"So good. I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":184.99,"endTime":187.48,"body":"appreciate your commitment."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":190.48,"endTime":193.69,"body":"*inaudible* All right, let's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":190.48,"endTime":193.69,"body":"keep this simple (she says,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":193.75,"endTime":196.6,"body":"again, hilariously on page two"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":193.75,"endTime":196.6,"body":"of a sixteen page outline)."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":197.59,"endTime":197.62,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":197.62,"endTime":200.62,"body":"Don't"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":197.62,"endTime":200.62,"body":"tell them that! *laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":200.57,"endTime":202.61,"body":"We're talking"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":200.57,"endTime":202.61,"body":"about Indigenous religions for"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":202.61,"endTime":206.09,"body":"two reasons. First, because like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":202.61,"endTime":206.09,"body":"we've been telling you for 36"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":206.09,"endTime":210.05,"body":"episodes or so, religion is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":206.09,"endTime":210.05,"body":"imperial. It is about power. And"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":210.05,"endTime":212.6,"body":"second, because we think you"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":210.05,"endTime":212.6,"body":"can't call yourself religiously"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":212.6,"endTime":214.58,"body":"literate without actually"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":212.6,"endTime":214.58,"body":"knowing what these religions"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":214.58,"endTime":217.58,"body":"are, how they came about, how"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":214.58,"endTime":217.58,"body":"they came to be called"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":217.58,"endTime":220.7,"body":"religions, and why they matter"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":217.58,"endTime":220.7,"body":"to scholars, to regular folks,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":220.7,"endTime":222.11,"body":"and to their practitioners."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":222.39,"endTime":223.77,"body":"Uh."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":222.39,"endTime":223.77,"body":"Megan?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":224.25,"endTime":225.06,"body":"Yes, IRMF?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":225.81,"endTime":228.12,"body":"This"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":225.81,"endTime":228.12,"body":"uhh... sounds like the same"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":228.12,"endTime":229.89,"body":"lesson plan as our last"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":228.12,"endTime":229.89,"body":"episode..."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":229.89,"endTime":229.92,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":232.44,"endTime":234.84,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":232.44,"endTime":234.84,"body":"since I'm writing these using my"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":234.87,"endTime":238.95,"body":"very fancy psychic abilities,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":234.87,"endTime":238.95,"body":"it's also the same as the next"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":238.95,"endTime":239.76,"body":"episode..."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":239.85,"endTime":240.0,"body":"Oh-ho!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":240.87,"endTime":242.79,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":240.87,"endTime":242.79,"body":"uhh-- and the one after that."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":243.45,"endTime":246.51,"body":"What gives with this thesis? Am"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":243.45,"endTime":246.51,"body":"I just stuck in a loop? Oh my"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":246.51,"endTime":249.45,"body":"god, Megan. It's time-- Is this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":246.51,"endTime":249.45,"body":"a time travel problem and I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":249.45,"endTime":254.82,"body":"don't know it?? You KNOW I HATE"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":249.45,"endTime":254.82,"body":"time travel plot devices!! What"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":254.82,"endTime":255.93,"body":"the hell is happening?!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":256.26,"endTime":259.92,"body":"Loopers!! No, no,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":256.26,"endTime":259.92,"body":"it's not loopers. It's okay. You"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":259.92,"endTime":262.68,"body":"are not stuck in a loop. You're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":259.92,"endTime":262.68,"body":"not being punked by an"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":262.68,"endTime":265.47,"body":"outlander. Alas, I would sign up"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":262.68,"endTime":265.47,"body":"for that. I volunteer as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":265.47,"endTime":269.82,"body":"tribute. Uh, we're repeating"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":265.47,"endTime":269.82,"body":"lesson plans, because, well,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":270.45,"endTime":274.59,"body":"it's that important! Sorry, the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":270.45,"endTime":274.59,"body":"lesson plan is here, and it's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":274.59,"endTime":275.4,"body":"here to stay!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":276.06,"endTime":277.68,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":276.06,"endTime":277.68,"body":"in that case, let's go to the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":277.68,"endTime":280.74,"body":"101 on today-- *clicks tongue*--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":277.68,"endTime":280.74,"body":"the section where we do"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":280.74,"endTime":281.61,"body":"professor work."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":282.18,"endTime":282.24,"body":"Mhm!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":282.27,"endTime":283.41,"body":"All"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":282.27,"endTime":283.41,"body":"right. I know in this season,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":283.41,"endTime":286.08,"body":"we're talking about the problem"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":283.41,"endTime":286.08,"body":"of world religion because"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":286.11,"endTime":287.07,"body":"imperialism."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":287.1,"endTime":287.37,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":287.37,"endTime":288.87,"body":"Like"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":287.37,"endTime":288.87,"body":"we've said a billion times"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":288.87,"endTime":291.78,"body":"already, we would not have this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":288.87,"endTime":291.78,"body":"model of thinking about"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":291.78,"endTime":295.2,"body":"religion-- thinking that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":291.78,"endTime":295.2,"body":"\"everyone\" has a religion, that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":295.35,"endTime":297.81,"body":"some religions are inherently"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":295.35,"endTime":297.81,"body":"better than others, or more"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":297.81,"endTime":302.43,"body":"logical than others, that there"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":297.81,"endTime":302.43,"body":"are \"correct\" and \"proper\" ways"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":302.43,"endTime":306.66,"body":"of being religious WITHOUT"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":302.43,"endTime":306.66,"body":"EuroAmerican imperialism, with a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":306.66,"endTime":309.48,"body":"side of white Christian"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":306.66,"endTime":309.48,"body":"supremacy just for funsies."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":310.02,"endTime":311.97,"body":"Yes. All of that."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":310.02,"endTime":311.97,"body":"Toxic funsies."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":312.5,"endTime":315.2,"body":"BUT."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":312.5,"endTime":315.2,"body":"I've thought about religion"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":315.2,"endTime":318.56,"body":"since 2009 in some capacity, I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":315.2,"endTime":318.56,"body":"have three degrees in religion"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":318.56,"endTime":321.11,"body":"or religious studies, and I've"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":318.56,"endTime":321.11,"body":"never seen a world religion"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":321.11,"endTime":325.76,"body":"syllabus or textbook front load"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":321.11,"endTime":325.76,"body":"Indigenous religions. So I have"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":325.79,"endTime":326.24,"body":"two--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":326.39,"endTime":328.07,"body":"This just tells"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":326.39,"endTime":328.07,"body":"me you never look at my syllabi,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":328.07,"endTime":329.27,"body":"but that's fine. That's okay."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":329.96,"endTime":333.71,"body":"I-I-"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":329.96,"endTime":333.71,"body":"These are Socratic dialogue"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":333.71,"endTime":335.75,"body":"pieces, Megan. I look at ALL of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":333.71,"endTime":335.75,"body":"your syllabi."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":335.75,"endTime":338.12,"body":"Alright. They're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":335.75,"endTime":338.12,"body":"so pretty! Anyway, what are your"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":338.12,"endTime":338.72,"body":"questions?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":338.99,"endTime":341.84,"body":"Why"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":338.99,"endTime":341.84,"body":"are WE starting here? And, what"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":341.84,"endTime":345.65,"body":"is this catch all phrase? What"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":341.84,"endTime":345.65,"body":"does Indigenous religions mean?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":346.52,"endTime":348.17,"body":"Having deja vu all over again."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":349.56,"endTime":352.53,"body":"Yeah, spoilers to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":349.56,"endTime":352.53,"body":"any of my students from this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":352.53,"endTime":357.99,"body":"semester-- literally EVERY class"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":352.53,"endTime":357.99,"body":"in my world religions course has"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":357.99,"endTime":362.04,"body":"exactly this lesson plan. Hey,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":357.99,"endTime":362.04,"body":"why do we talk about this and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":362.04,"endTime":366.18,"body":"why does it matter? Anyway-- I'm"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":362.04,"endTime":366.18,"body":"glad you asked, Ilyse. I'm glad"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":366.18,"endTime":368.28,"body":"you ask these Socratic questions"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":366.18,"endTime":368.28,"body":"that you know the answer to."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":369.27,"endTime":371.97,"body":"It's really not any different"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":369.27,"endTime":371.97,"body":"than why we kicked off History"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":371.97,"endTime":374.73,"body":"of the World Religions, Part"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":371.97,"endTime":374.73,"body":"One, with African Diasporic"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":374.73,"endTime":377.4,"body":"Religions. If we're trying to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":374.73,"endTime":377.4,"body":"work against the traditional"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":377.4,"endTime":380.97,"body":"world religions model, which, as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":377.4,"endTime":380.97,"body":"you just said, is rooted in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":380.97,"endTime":384.21,"body":"white Christian supremacy and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":380.97,"endTime":384.21,"body":"imperialism (which makes me want"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":384.21,"endTime":389.28,"body":"to work against it), then to me,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":384.21,"endTime":389.28,"body":"there are a few places as rich"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":389.58,"endTime":394.44,"body":"and as exciting to have such a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":389.58,"endTime":394.44,"body":"chat as African Diasporic"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":394.44,"endTime":396.66,"body":"Religions (what we talked about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":394.44,"endTime":396.66,"body":"last time) AND Indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":396.66,"endTime":400.38,"body":"religions (what we're talking"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":396.66,"endTime":400.38,"body":"about today AND next time), but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":400.38,"endTime":403.02,"body":"also I just-- I want to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":400.38,"endTime":403.02,"body":"underline what you've said"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":403.02,"endTime":407.94,"body":"across episodes now. The fact is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":403.02,"endTime":407.94,"body":"SO few classes or introductory"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":407.97,"endTime":411.6,"body":"textbooks or pop culture, like,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":407.97,"endTime":411.6,"body":"PBS/BBC style documentaries,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":411.87,"endTime":416.28,"body":"ever start, or end, or even GET"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":411.87,"endTime":416.28,"body":"to Native peoples (or what we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":416.28,"endTime":418.65,"body":"now think of as Native"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":416.28,"endTime":418.65,"body":"religions). Everybody makes"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":418.65,"endTime":421.44,"body":"choices about what to include"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":418.65,"endTime":421.44,"body":"and what to leave out-- and we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":421.44,"endTime":424.98,"body":"do too!-- But it's important to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":421.44,"endTime":424.98,"body":"both of us, I reckon, that we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":424.98,"endTime":427.38,"body":"not fall into the same traps as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":424.98,"endTime":427.38,"body":"everyone else."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":429.15,"endTime":431.82,"body":"Yeah!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":429.15,"endTime":431.82,"body":"Yeah. We started with African"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":431.82,"endTime":434.82,"body":"Diasporic Religions and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":431.82,"endTime":434.82,"body":"Indigenous religions precisely"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":434.82,"endTime":437.85,"body":"so that our nerds have their"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":434.82,"endTime":437.85,"body":"version of world religions"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":437.88,"endTime":440.19,"body":"upended a little bit, right from"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":437.88,"endTime":440.19,"body":"the jump."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":440.489,"endTime":443.849,"body":"It may"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":440.489,"endTime":443.849,"body":"not be anyone's fault when we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":440.49,"endTime":440.7,"body":"Huzzah!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":443.849,"endTime":447.929,"body":"say \"world religions,\" most of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":443.849,"endTime":447.929,"body":"us have been programmed to think"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":447.959,"endTime":451.469,"body":"some \"big\" ones, like Isl"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":447.959,"endTime":451.469,"body":"m, Judaism, Hinduism, Christiani"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":451.949,"endTime":455.519,"body":"y. It's not our fault, but it is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":451.949,"endTime":455.519,"body":"our responsibility to push back"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":455.549,"endTime":458.099,"body":"ard on that shit."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":457.36,"endTime":461.92,"body":"Indeed! Okay,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":457.36,"endTime":461.92,"body":"but... um... IRMF?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":461.99,"endTime":463.22,"body":"Uhh..."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":461.99,"endTime":463.22,"body":"yes, Goodwin?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":463.96,"endTime":466.75,"body":"Can I add to your"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":463.96,"endTime":466.75,"body":"question of whyyyy we're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":466.75,"endTime":469.84,"body":"starting here with, like, some"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":466.75,"endTime":469.84,"body":"explanations?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":469.87,"endTime":470.59,"body":"You"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":469.87,"endTime":470.59,"body":"know it!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":472.12,"endTime":474.52,"body":"Okay! Okay. So,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":472.12,"endTime":474.52,"body":"obviously, we're talking about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":474.52,"endTime":478.09,"body":"Indigenous religions today AND"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":474.52,"endTime":478.09,"body":"on the next episode, and I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":478.09,"endTime":481.66,"body":"suggested we break this into two"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":478.09,"endTime":481.66,"body":"episodes: one, (today's,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":482.05,"endTime":485.29,"body":"actually) focusing on"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":482.05,"endTime":485.29,"body":"definitions and examples beyond"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":485.32,"endTime":488.47,"body":"what's now the United States,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":485.32,"endTime":488.47,"body":"and the next time, thinking"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":488.47,"endTime":491.77,"body":"about Indigenous religions in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":488.47,"endTime":491.77,"body":"the Americas. And I did that"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":491.77,"endTime":497.41,"body":"because Americans and in, like,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":491.77,"endTime":497.41,"body":"especially white settlers, often"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":497.41,"endTime":501.28,"body":"think about Indigenous religions"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":497.41,"endTime":501.28,"body":"as ONLY Native Americans from"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":501.28,"endTime":504.34,"body":"what's now the United States."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":501.28,"endTime":504.34,"body":"And that is incorrect and does"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":504.34,"endTime":508.27,"body":"not make sense. First, because"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":504.34,"endTime":508.27,"body":"nation-states are historically"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":508.27,"endTime":511.72,"body":"new ideas, and borders are lies"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":508.27,"endTime":511.72,"body":"we tell on maps and then defend"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":511.72,"endTime":514.12,"body":"with bombs. Wow, that's the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":511.72,"endTime":514.12,"body":"t-shirt right there."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":514.18,"endTime":515.77,"body":"Huh. I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":514.18,"endTime":515.77,"body":"know, right? *laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":515.279,"endTime":516.269,"body":"*laughs"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":515.279,"endTime":516.269,"body":"sarcastically* Let's do that one"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":516.269,"endTime":521.549,"body":"again, slower, because it's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":516.269,"endTime":521.549,"body":"important. Borders are lies, we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":521.549,"endTime":525.359,"body":"tell on maps, and then, defend"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":521.549,"endTime":525.359,"body":"with bombs. Or, as we saw this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":525.359,"endTime":532.799,"body":"week, fucking whips. Anyway."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":525.359,"endTime":532.799,"body":"hey-- but ALSO, there are ideas"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":532.799,"endTime":535.169,"body":"peoples, languages, culture"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":532.799,"endTime":535.169,"body":"that are properly Indigenous t"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":535.169,"endTime":538.559,"body":"their own regions. This include"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":535.169,"endTime":538.559,"body":"Europe too, people! Just beca"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":538.559,"endTime":541.379,"body":"se Europe colonized its"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":538.559,"endTime":541.379,"body":"lf thoroughly before doing"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":541.379,"endTime":545.099,"body":"so elsewhere, and we want"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":541.379,"endTime":545.099,"body":"to pretend people like the S"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":545.099,"endTime":548.009,"body":"ami don't exist, that doesn't"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":545.099,"endTime":548.009,"body":"ean that's not-- that that's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":548.819,"endTime":552.599,"body":"true. That we-- again, whi"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":548.819,"endTime":552.599,"body":"e Euro-Americans-- collapse all"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":552.599,"endTime":555.929,"body":"ethnic, religious, linguistic, A"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":552.599,"endTime":555.929,"body":"L sorts of diversity,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":555.959,"endTime":560.609,"body":"into one overarching thing"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":555.959,"endTime":560.609,"body":"s, *blows raspberry* well first"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":560.609,"endTime":566.009,"body":"it's white supremacy and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":560.609,"endTime":566.009,"body":"mperialism in action. And second"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":566.519,"endTime":566.969,"body":"it i"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":566.99,"endTime":569.21,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":566.99,"endTime":569.21,"body":"Yeah, straight out. So, this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":569.21,"endTime":573.32,"body":"seems like a great moment, if I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":569.21,"endTime":573.32,"body":"can, first to define some terms,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":573.32,"endTime":578.9,"body":"right? Like the way we use"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":573.32,"endTime":578.9,"body":"capital-N Native to mean a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":579.08,"endTime":584.87,"body":"people of a place. But we're"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":579.08,"endTime":584.87,"body":"using native in a different way,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":584.87,"endTime":588.14,"body":"right? Lowercase-N native is a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":584.87,"endTime":588.14,"body":"way that folks will often say"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":588.14,"endTime":591.26,"body":"like, \"I'm a New York native,\""},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":588.14,"endTime":591.26,"body":"or \"Hinduism is native to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":591.26,"endTime":593.93,"body":"India.\" And I think, Goodwin,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":591.26,"endTime":593.93,"body":"that both of those statements"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":593.93,"endTime":596.15,"body":"and both of those balances can"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":593.93,"endTime":596.15,"body":"be true. Like, this is how"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":596.15,"endTime":599.54,"body":"language works-- words have"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":596.15,"endTime":599.54,"body":"multiple meanings-- but this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":599.54,"endTime":602.21,"body":"isn't the specificity and nuance"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":599.54,"endTime":602.21,"body":"that we're bringing, and since"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":602.21,"endTime":605.24,"body":"this is an audio medium, we're"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":602.21,"endTime":605.24,"body":"going to have to use the phrase"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":605.27,"endTime":608.39,"body":"\"capital-N Native\" and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":605.27,"endTime":608.39,"body":"\"capital-I Indigenous.\""},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":608.57,"endTime":609.29,"body":"Yes. Good."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":609.75,"endTime":611.4,"body":"So"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":609.75,"endTime":611.4,"body":"when I say that-- capital-N"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":611.4,"endTime":613.98,"body":"Native, capital-I Indigenous,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":611.4,"endTime":613.98,"body":"especially in this context-- we"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":613.98,"endTime":618.27,"body":"are of course referring, in some"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":613.98,"endTime":618.27,"body":"ways, the Webster's dictionary"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":618.27,"endTime":622.2,"body":"style-- which is to say"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":618.27,"endTime":622.2,"body":"intrinsic to an area, born"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":622.26,"endTime":625.14,"body":"there. But we also want to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":622.26,"endTime":625.14,"body":"implicate really particular"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":625.14,"endTime":628.47,"body":"cultures (which are, of course,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":625.14,"endTime":628.47,"body":"not separate from religion) and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":628.47,"endTime":631.56,"body":"of course the impacts of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":628.47,"endTime":631.56,"body":"political influence, power, and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":631.56,"endTime":634.38,"body":"authority on these very"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":631.56,"endTime":634.38,"body":"particular communities and very"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":634.38,"endTime":638.49,"body":"particular cultures. That might"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":634.38,"endTime":638.49,"body":"be different than saying \"I'm in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":638.49,"endTime":641.67,"body":"New York native\" when I can"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":638.49,"endTime":641.67,"body":"trace my family lineage to, say,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":641.7,"endTime":642.57,"body":"Eastern Europe."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":642.9,"endTime":647.46,"body":"Yeah. Well, and,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":642.9,"endTime":647.46,"body":"for me, the capital-N Native,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":647.46,"endTime":650.7,"body":"capital-I Indigenous and the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":647.46,"endTime":650.7,"body":"relationship to place (and I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":650.7,"endTime":653.55,"body":"know we'll do this later) but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":650.7,"endTime":653.55,"body":"it's not just like \"I am from"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":653.55,"endTime":658.35,"body":"there,\" it's a relationality and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":653.55,"endTime":658.35,"body":"accountability. Like, this is my"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":658.35,"endTime":662.07,"body":"place because it takes care of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":658.35,"endTime":662.07,"body":"me and it's my place to take"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":662.07,"endTime":662.64,"body":"care of."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":663.72,"endTime":666.66,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":663.72,"endTime":666.66,"body":"From and of a place, I think."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":667.41,"endTime":670.53,"body":"Okay. So for example, can we"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":667.41,"endTime":670.53,"body":"talk India? Because you know I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":670.53,"endTime":670.77,"body":"gonna."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":670.77,"endTime":670.8,"body":"*giggles*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":671.7,"endTime":673.92,"body":"India"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":671.7,"endTime":673.92,"body":"is a particular nation state in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":673.92,"endTime":674.76,"body":"South Asia--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":674.94,"endTime":675.42,"body":"Yes, I have heard"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":674.94,"endTime":675.42,"body":"of it."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":675.03,"endTime":678.03,"body":"--and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":675.03,"endTime":678.03,"body":"one that I, uh... will talk"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":678.03,"endTime":681.81,"body":"about a lot. Lots of people--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":678.03,"endTime":681.81,"body":"including Hindu nationalists,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":681.81,"endTime":684.72,"body":"but that's for a later episode,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":681.81,"endTime":684.72,"body":"stay tuned-- talk about Hinduism"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":684.72,"endTime":688.53,"body":"as \"native\" to India. It"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":684.72,"endTime":688.53,"body":"originates there, most of its"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":688.53,"endTime":691.8,"body":"adherents can trace ancestry"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":688.53,"endTime":691.8,"body":"there. That seems"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":691.8,"endTime":695.28,"body":"straightforward enough, right?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":691.8,"endTime":695.28,"body":"BUT, in India, there are al--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":694.32,"endTime":699.63,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":695.34,"endTime":697.23,"body":"the nation-state of India--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":695.34,"endTime":697.23,"body":"there are also legal"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":697.23,"endTime":700.83,"body":"categorizations and common"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":697.23,"endTime":700.83,"body":"knowledge about indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":701.04,"endTime":706.71,"body":"communities which are referred"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":701.04,"endTime":706.71,"body":"to as tribes. Legally. So, I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":706.74,"endTime":711.75,"body":"hear you sighing protractedly e"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":706.74,"endTime":711.75,"body":"en though THIS LINE says, \"Be"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":711.75,"endTime":716.13,"body":"ore you sigh protractedly!\""},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":714.36,"endTime":716.49,"body":"We can"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":714.36,"endTime":716.49,"body":"have a moment about that word in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":716.49,"endTime":718.17,"body":"a minute, Megan, I have scripted"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":716.49,"endTime":718.17,"body":"it in--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":718.2,"endTime":718.53,"body":"Fine, fine."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":718.42,"endTime":719.62,"body":"--let"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":718.42,"endTime":719.62,"body":"me just finish this thought."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":720.87,"endTime":721.2,"body":"All right, fine."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":721.89,"endTime":722.91,"body":"I love"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":721.89,"endTime":722.91,"body":"that I know where you're going"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":722.91,"endTime":723.84,"body":"to BREATHE. It's the best."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":723.84,"endTime":726.36,"body":"*laughs* Don't"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":723.84,"endTime":726.36,"body":"police my emotions!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":726.57,"endTime":727.71,"body":"I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":726.57,"endTime":727.71,"body":"not, I'm not. I swear."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":727.74,"endTime":729.0,"body":"I have to breathe"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":727.74,"endTime":729.0,"body":"them! Okay."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":729.03,"endTime":731.25,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":729.03,"endTime":731.25,"body":"In India, despite claims in and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":731.25,"endTime":735.21,"body":"outside of India that Hinduism"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":731.25,"endTime":735.21,"body":"is THE native religion of the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":735.21,"endTime":739.29,"body":"region, and that true natives of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":735.21,"endTime":739.29,"body":"India would therefore be Hindu,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":739.53,"endTime":742.95,"body":"there is also legal and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":739.53,"endTime":742.95,"body":"socio-cultural affirmation of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":742.98,"endTime":745.98,"body":"indigenous-- and I'm putting"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":742.98,"endTime":745.98,"body":"this in quotes-- \"tribal\""},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":746.01,"endTime":750.12,"body":"people, whose cultures,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":746.01,"endTime":750.12,"body":"languages, ways of life, healing"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":750.12,"endTime":753.39,"body":"practices, locations are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":750.12,"endTime":753.39,"body":"sometimes related to Hindu"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":753.39,"endTime":755.43,"body":"mainstream cultures and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":753.39,"endTime":755.43,"body":"sometimes not! But are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":755.43,"endTime":760.41,"body":"nevertheless considered"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":755.43,"endTime":760.41,"body":"different from them. So in THIS"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":760.41,"endTime":763.89,"body":"context, capital-I Indigenous"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":760.41,"endTime":763.89,"body":"does not indicate, like,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":763.92,"endTime":767.52,"body":"mainline, casted Hindus who can"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":763.92,"endTime":767.52,"body":"trace their family roots to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":767.52,"endTime":771.09,"body":"nowhere EXCEPT India; the same"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":767.52,"endTime":771.09,"body":"folks who would say \"Yeah, I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":771.09,"endTime":775.17,"body":"native to India;\" \"Hinduism is"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":771.09,"endTime":775.17,"body":"native to India.\" Indigeneity"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":775.17,"endTime":779.67,"body":"here usually expresses power,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":775.17,"endTime":779.67,"body":"presence, population: \"tribes\""},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":779.7,"endTime":783.6,"body":"(in quotes) in India are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":779.7,"endTime":783.6,"body":"designated as such LEGALLY in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":783.6,"endTime":788.16,"body":"complicated ways. And so to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":783.6,"endTime":788.16,"body":"oversimplify, they're usually"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":788.16,"endTime":791.67,"body":"designated as such because of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":788.16,"endTime":791.67,"body":"how remote they are from these"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":791.7,"endTime":793.92,"body":"Hindu mainstream norms."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":794.77,"endTime":796.81,"body":"Okay! I actually"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":794.77,"endTime":796.81,"body":"did not know that, so I learned"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":796.81,"endTime":800.23,"body":"a thing today. It a little bit"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":796.81,"endTime":800.23,"body":"reflects how we think of tribes"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":800.23,"endTime":803.56,"body":"in what's now the United States"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":800.23,"endTime":803.56,"body":"as having specific legal"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":804.1,"endTime":809.11,"body":"relationships and distance from"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":804.1,"endTime":809.11,"body":"the government of the US. But"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":809.11,"endTime":811.45,"body":"we'll-we'll come back to all of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":809.11,"endTime":811.45,"body":"this. I'm always trying to make"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":811.45,"endTime":813.58,"body":"it about America, I'm the worst!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":811.45,"endTime":813.58,"body":"Okay, we're coming back to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":813.58,"endTime":818.44,"body":"tribes. What I hear YOU saying"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":813.58,"endTime":818.44,"body":"is that Native, capital N, or"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":818.44,"endTime":822.67,"body":"Indigenous, capital I, doesn't"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":818.44,"endTime":822.67,"body":"only mean FROM a place. It"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":822.67,"endTime":826.36,"body":"specifically refers to balances"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":822.67,"endTime":826.36,"body":"of power, and influence, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":826.36,"endTime":830.14,"body":"access. We're also often talking"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":826.36,"endTime":830.14,"body":"about folks who have been"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":830.14,"endTime":832.69,"body":"brutally dominated by"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":830.14,"endTime":832.69,"body":"imperialist systems-- usually"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":832.69,"endTime":836.5,"body":"European, if I'm honest, but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":832.69,"endTime":836.5,"body":"also by other dominant empires,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":836.5,"endTime":839.2,"body":"like Han Chinese, Ottoman,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":836.5,"endTime":839.2,"body":"Mongolian, there's-there's a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":839.2,"endTime":841.84,"body":"whole list. Russia's got a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":839.2,"endTime":841.84,"body":"figure in there somewhere right?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":842.65,"endTime":844.78,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":842.65,"endTime":844.78,"body":"definitely! So there's-there's a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":844.78,"endTime":847.9,"body":"whole-- Yes. Let's talk about"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":844.78,"endTime":847.9,"body":"this word tribe, though."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":847.9,"endTime":850.27,"body":"We've-we've kicked the can a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":847.9,"endTime":850.27,"body":"little bit, I think it's time."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":858.22,"endTime":860.83,"body":"Okay, okay. Let"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":858.22,"endTime":860.83,"body":"me be clear that there are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":860.83,"endTime":863.65,"body":"groups-- and again, Americanist,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":860.83,"endTime":863.65,"body":"so this is what I know-- that"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":863.65,"endTime":868.57,"body":"name themselves tribes. And in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":863.65,"endTime":868.57,"body":"what's now the United States,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":868.57,"endTime":875.11,"body":"that's specifically about legal"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":868.57,"endTime":875.11,"body":"nationhood outside the US. Um..."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":876.52,"endTime":877.69,"body":"so much talk about there."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":877.9,"endTime":879.13,"body":"We're"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":877.9,"endTime":879.13,"body":"gonna get there next episode, I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":879.13,"endTime":879.31,"body":"promise."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":879.24,"endTime":881.7,"body":"I know! Haudenosa"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":879.24,"endTime":881.7,"body":"nee passports, though, they're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":881.7,"endTime":885.21,"body":"so interesting. But alright. N"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":881.7,"endTime":885.21,"body":". So, for right now-- *clears th"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":885.21,"endTime":887.79,"body":"oat* We listen to those folks"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":885.21,"endTime":887.79,"body":"we respect their naming pract"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":887.79,"endTime":891.06,"body":"ces, and honor how they cam"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":887.79,"endTime":891.06,"body":"to that decision, because t"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":891.06,"endTime":893.31,"body":"at's a choice that they're mak"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":891.06,"endTime":893.31,"body":"ng now, regardless of the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":893.31,"endTime":895.08,"body":"omplicated, fraught histor"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":895.89,"endTime":897.78,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":895.89,"endTime":897.78,"body":"Good. We believe people, we call"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":897.78,"endTime":900.57,"body":"them by the names they tell us"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":897.78,"endTime":900.57,"body":"to use, that's super simple..."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":900.66,"endTime":902.94,"body":"What's the problem, then, with"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":900.66,"endTime":902.94,"body":"this word?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":902.0,"endTime":908.18,"body":"Mmm. Well, it's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":902.0,"endTime":908.18,"body":"just that... tribe, and tribal,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":908.18,"endTime":911.51,"body":"and tribalism, and all the other"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":908.18,"endTime":911.51,"body":"grammatical iterations we can"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":911.51,"endTime":918.38,"body":"make were not always a choice..."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":911.51,"endTime":918.38,"body":"like, at all?? Like, hello..."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":919.04,"endTime":924.47,"body":"imperialism, is it you we're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":919.04,"endTime":924.47,"body":"looking for? Yeah. Tribe is this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":924.5,"endTime":927.98,"body":"non-distinct word that got used"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":924.5,"endTime":927.98,"body":"anywhere Europeans and later"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":927.98,"endTime":931.97,"body":"Americans colonized. Tribe and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":927.98,"endTime":931.97,"body":"tribal carry with it echoes of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":931.97,"endTime":934.82,"body":"how that word was originally"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":931.97,"endTime":934.82,"body":"used, which is to say as a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":934.82,"endTime":937.94,"body":"synonym or in tandem with words"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":934.82,"endTime":937.94,"body":"like \"savage,\" \"backward,\""},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":938.39,"endTime":943.46,"body":"\"uncivilized,\" \"uncultured,\""},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":938.39,"endTime":943.46,"body":"\"heathen.\" And you hear that,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":943.97,"endTime":944.84,"body":"yeah, Ilyse?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":944.84,"endTime":944.96,"body":"Oh,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":944.84,"endTime":944.96,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":945.02,"endTime":947.93,"body":"You-- yeah? You"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":945.02,"endTime":947.93,"body":"hear \"uncivilized\" and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":947.99,"endTime":952.55,"body":"\"uncultured?\" We know savage is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":947.99,"endTime":952.55,"body":"a shitty word unless we're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":952.55,"endTime":956.51,"body":"talking about a sick burn on a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":952.55,"endTime":956.51,"body":"drag race reading challenge. And"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":956.51,"endTime":958.58,"body":"even that I'm trying to stay"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":956.51,"endTime":958.58,"body":"away from, obviously. That feels"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":958.61,"endTime":962.45,"body":"obvious in 2021. But"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":958.61,"endTime":962.45,"body":"\"uncivilized\" and \"uncultured\""},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":962.45,"endTime":964.85,"body":"sound EXACTLY like what we're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":962.45,"endTime":964.85,"body":"talking about in History of the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":964.85,"endTime":968.3,"body":"World Religions! They're words"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":964.85,"endTime":968.3,"body":"that literally describe what"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":968.3,"endTime":970.97,"body":"white European Christian"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":968.3,"endTime":970.97,"body":"colonizers imagined Native and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":970.97,"endTime":973.76,"body":"Indigenous peoples to be."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":970.97,"endTime":973.76,"body":"Without culture, without"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":973.76,"endTime":979.1,"body":"civilization. There's too many"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":973.76,"endTime":979.1,"body":"ethnographic books about tribes"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":979.1,"endTime":982.85,"body":"of Africa, Asia, America,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":979.1,"endTime":982.85,"body":"Oceana-- the \"tribes\" are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":982.85,"endTime":986.36,"body":"different, but the overarching"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":982.85,"endTime":986.36,"body":"idea is the same: these backward"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":986.39,"endTime":989.81,"body":"Black and brown people the world"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":986.39,"endTime":989.81,"body":"over are more or less the same,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":989.84,"endTime":993.2,"body":"all of these horrible, racist"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":989.84,"endTime":993.2,"body":"books are saying. And they need"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":993.2,"endTime":997.16,"body":"converting, and ruling! So"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":993.2,"endTime":997.16,"body":"unless a specific indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":997.16,"endTime":1001.57,"body":"group uses tribe as part of its"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":997.16,"endTime":1001.57,"body":"own name, we do not. It's too"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1001.57,"endTime":1004.21,"body":"loaded to obviously part of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1001.57,"endTime":1004.21,"body":"imperialist history that we're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1004.21,"endTime":1006.94,"body":"trying to highlight, but also,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1004.21,"endTime":1006.94,"body":"just... let's just shut it the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1006.94,"endTime":1011.29,"body":"fuck down. And please, please,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1006.94,"endTime":1011.29,"body":"if you are a person who is not"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1011.35,"endTime":1015.01,"body":"Native or Indigenous, please do"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1011.35,"endTime":1015.01,"body":"not use the word tribe to refer"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1015.25,"endTime":1019.93,"body":"to folks who think like you do."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1015.25,"endTime":1019.93,"body":"That is a gross thing that"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1019.93,"endTime":1020.95,"body":"happens a lot on the internet."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1021.14,"endTime":1023.33,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1021.14,"endTime":1023.33,"body":"Yeah, no. I'm struck-I'M struck"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1023.33,"endTime":1026.99,"body":"personally by the language of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1023.33,"endTime":1026.99,"body":"\"uncultured\" every time because,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1027.41,"endTime":1030.59,"body":"like, you and I teach about"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1027.41,"endTime":1030.59,"body":"religion, a lil bit, and we"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1030.59,"endTime":1035.48,"body":"cannot divorce religion from"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1030.59,"endTime":1035.48,"body":"culture, and culture is often--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1035.51,"endTime":1038.81,"body":"quite frankly, especially in the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1035.51,"endTime":1038.81,"body":"imperial moment-- a stand-in for"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1038.81,"endTime":1043.49,"body":"the word religion. So to say"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1038.81,"endTime":1043.49,"body":"someone is uncultured also often"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1043.49,"endTime":1048.44,"body":"means something like, without a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1043.49,"endTime":1048.44,"body":"history, because cultures are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1048.44,"endTime":1051.68,"body":"things that are passed on and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1048.44,"endTime":1051.68,"body":"down through generations, right?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1052.07,"endTime":1056.18,"body":"So a lack of history, a lack of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1052.07,"endTime":1056.18,"body":"culture, I mean, OOF. That's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1056.18,"endTime":1059.63,"body":"heavy! And part of what I think"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1056.18,"endTime":1059.63,"body":"we're doing in this critique of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1059.63,"endTime":1062.63,"body":"terms, before we even get into"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1059.63,"endTime":1062.63,"body":"the thing that we're doing, is"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1062.63,"endTime":1066.62,"body":"letting our nerds hear how"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1062.63,"endTime":1066.62,"body":"imperial assumptions work. That"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1066.62,"endTime":1070.49,"body":"assumption that native folks"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1066.62,"endTime":1070.49,"body":"have no culture, no history. Or"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1070.49,"endTime":1074.09,"body":"that their culture and religion"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1070.49,"endTime":1074.09,"body":"is generalizable, portable,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1074.09,"endTime":1077.93,"body":"nonspecific. Like, ever wonder"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1074.09,"endTime":1077.93,"body":"why indigenous people everywhere"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1077.93,"endTime":1082.19,"body":"were (and sometimes still are)"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1077.93,"endTime":1082.19,"body":"called Indians? Cause this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1082.19,"endTime":1084.26,"body":"dumbass white man couldn't tell"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1082.19,"endTime":1084.26,"body":"their ass from their elbow in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1084.26,"endTime":1086.99,"body":"the mythical quest for spices"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1084.26,"endTime":1086.99,"body":"and riches. For real, for real!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1087.56,"endTime":1091.61,"body":"So everywhere they went-- \"This"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1087.56,"endTime":1091.61,"body":"here is India, and these people?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1091.64,"endTime":1096.53,"body":"Indians! Wrong? Oh, fuck it."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1091.64,"endTime":1096.53,"body":"This is just the West Indies."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1096.53,"endTime":1099.89,"body":"Y'all are-- you other Indians,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1096.53,"endTime":1099.89,"body":"the real Indian, uhhh, East"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1099.89,"endTime":1101.36,"body":"Indies!\" Or something."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1102.11,"endTime":1104.81,"body":"Not \"mythical"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1102.11,"endTime":1104.81,"body":"quest for spice and riches.\" I'm"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1104.81,"endTime":1106.52,"body":"going to need to make so many"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1104.81,"endTime":1106.52,"body":"t-shirts. That's so tragic."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1107.15,"endTime":1109.22,"body":"I was"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1107.15,"endTime":1109.22,"body":"really, so upset when I was"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1109.22,"endTime":1111.14,"body":"writing this episode. *laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1109.22,"endTime":1111.14,"body":"Anyway--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1111.0,"endTime":1137.4,"body":"Yeah. Yeah. These"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1111.0,"endTime":1137.4,"body":"are--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1111.14,"endTime":1111.35,"body":"Straight up!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1111.23,"endTime":1113.36,"body":"You"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1111.23,"endTime":1113.36,"body":"know what? When imperialists and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1113.36,"endTime":1116.39,"body":"supremacists reduced every"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1113.36,"endTime":1116.39,"body":"single indigenous population to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1116.42,"endTime":1121.16,"body":"a conglomerate of backward"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1116.42,"endTime":1121.16,"body":"tribes, who didn't have a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1121.16,"endTime":1126.2,"body":"history (like children without"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1121.16,"endTime":1126.2,"body":"pasts) or a culture (like blan"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1126.2,"endTime":1129.89,"body":", child-like slates who ne"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1126.2,"endTime":1129.89,"body":"d proper rearing, often throu"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1129.89,"endTime":1133.88,"body":"h force), it became really easy-"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1129.89,"endTime":1133.88,"body":"and you hear this in my"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1133.88,"endTime":1139.46,"body":"tone already-- We expect thing"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1133.88,"endTime":1139.46,"body":"like devaluation, dehumanizat"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1139.08,"endTime":1144.3,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1139.08,"endTime":1144.3,"body":"it's all tied up! It's all tied"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1139.67,"endTime":1143.51,"body":"on, and-- of indigenous folks w"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1139.67,"endTime":1143.51,"body":"olescale. So, yes! Infantilizati"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1143.51,"endTime":1147.32,"body":"n, but also genocide, ethni"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1143.51,"endTime":1147.32,"body":"cleansing, cultural, religiou"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1147.35,"endTime":1153.89,"body":", historical ongoing erasure."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1147.48,"endTime":1153.99,"body":"up. Go ahead, sorry."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1155.94,"endTime":1158.7,"body":"Yeah. No,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1155.94,"endTime":1158.7,"body":"it's-it's just-it's-it's a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1158.73,"endTime":1162.33,"body":"horrible Rice Krispie treat of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1158.73,"endTime":1162.33,"body":"white supremacist, imperialist"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1162.36,"endTime":1165.99,"body":"violence. They're horrifying"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1162.36,"endTime":1165.99,"body":"histories, and frankly, far too"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1165.99,"endTime":1170.76,"body":"often, presents. I mean, just"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1165.99,"endTime":1170.76,"body":"this summer we saw so much"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1170.76,"endTime":1174.33,"body":"heartbreaking news come out"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1170.76,"endTime":1174.33,"body":"about indigenous children stolen"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1174.33,"endTime":1176.97,"body":"and taken to residential schools"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1174.33,"endTime":1176.97,"body":"(which we will talk about next"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1176.97,"endTime":1181.41,"body":"time). *sighs* But these are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1176.97,"endTime":1181.41,"body":"important histories, these are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1181.41,"endTime":1187.65,"body":"important presents, and we need"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1181.41,"endTime":1187.65,"body":"to name those and start dealing"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1187.65,"endTime":1191.49,"body":"with them. They're also, though,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1187.65,"endTime":1191.49,"body":"obviously not the only or even"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1191.49,"endTime":1193.83,"body":"the most important thing to know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1191.49,"endTime":1193.83,"body":"about indigenous peoples or"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1193.83,"endTime":1197.55,"body":"their cultures or histories. But"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1193.83,"endTime":1197.55,"body":"the politics of naming is really"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1197.55,"endTime":1202.29,"body":"crucial here. The word tribe,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1197.55,"endTime":1202.29,"body":"when used out of its proper,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1202.35,"endTime":1207.15,"body":"political context is trash."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1202.35,"endTime":1207.15,"body":"Don't do that. But, Western"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1207.15,"endTime":1210.27,"body":"European colonizers and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1207.15,"endTime":1210.27,"body":"missionaries often imposed brand"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1210.27,"endTime":1213.0,"body":"new names or mangled phonetic"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1210.27,"endTime":1213.0,"body":"spellings of indigenous names."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1213.33,"endTime":1216.27,"body":"They didn't just, like, add the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1213.33,"endTime":1216.27,"body":"word \"tribe\" to people's title."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1216.27,"endTime":1220.26,"body":"They just-- they just made shit"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1216.27,"endTime":1220.26,"body":"up! *sighs* We know, from"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1220.26,"endTime":1222.78,"body":"historical records the world"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1220.26,"endTime":1222.78,"body":"over, that many indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1222.78,"endTime":1226.53,"body":"groups simply called themselves"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1222.78,"endTime":1226.53,"body":"\"the People,\" often of a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1226.53,"endTime":1229.59,"body":"specific area. In some parts of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1226.53,"endTime":1229.59,"body":"the world, the name for the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1229.59,"endTime":1232.98,"body":"languages that people were"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1229.59,"endTime":1232.98,"body":"speaking was also the name for"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1232.98,"endTime":1235.41,"body":"the people themselves. So"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1232.98,"endTime":1235.41,"body":"language, and culture, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1235.41,"endTime":1237.93,"body":"religion-- all of this gets"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1235.41,"endTime":1237.93,"body":"encoded in how people talked"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1237.93,"endTime":1239.88,"body":"about themselves. And talk about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1237.93,"endTime":1239.88,"body":"themselves! This is still"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1239.88,"endTime":1243.66,"body":"happening. But regardless, as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1239.88,"endTime":1243.66,"body":"scholars, we use the name"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1243.72,"endTime":1247.56,"body":"Indigenous people use to refer"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1243.72,"endTime":1247.56,"body":"to themselves. If they use the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1247.56,"endTime":1248.97,"body":"name, we use the name. The end."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1249.15,"endTime":1250.23,"body":"We're"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1249.15,"endTime":1250.23,"body":"going to call people what they"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1250.23,"endTime":1252.24,"body":"want to be called here (and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1250.23,"endTime":1252.24,"body":"let's be real, in every"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1252.24,"endTime":1255.87,"body":"situation). Not doing so is some"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1252.24,"endTime":1255.87,"body":"bullshit! I have one other"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1255.87,"endTime":1256.59,"body":"question."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1257.52,"endTime":1258.12,"body":"Hit it!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1258.84,"endTime":1260.28,"body":"Since"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1258.84,"endTime":1260.28,"body":"we're still talking broadly"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1260.28,"endTime":1262.8,"body":"about indigenous religions,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1260.28,"endTime":1262.8,"body":"perhaps especially as we see or"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1262.8,"endTime":1266.1,"body":"understand them beyond the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1262.8,"endTime":1266.1,"body":"Americas, are there any big"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1266.1,"endTime":1269.37,"body":"picture ideas that we might use"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1266.1,"endTime":1269.37,"body":"to categorize them? I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1269.37,"endTime":1272.55,"body":"honestly, I'm hesitant to even"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1269.37,"endTime":1272.55,"body":"ask this question because how"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1272.55,"endTime":1274.89,"body":"are we gonna say there are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1272.55,"endTime":1274.89,"body":"commonalities across the literal"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1274.89,"endTime":1278.01,"body":"whole world? But at the same"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1274.89,"endTime":1278.01,"body":"time, since the world religion"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1278.01,"endTime":1281.28,"body":"models names \"indigenous"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1278.01,"endTime":1281.28,"body":"religions\" as a thing, I guess"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1281.28,"endTime":1283.62,"body":"I'm asking... what the fuck does"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1281.28,"endTime":1283.62,"body":"that mean?!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1283.0,"endTime":1286.15,"body":"Yeah, yeah,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1283.0,"endTime":1286.15,"body":"yeah-- okay, well, \"What the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1286.15,"endTime":1289.99,"body":"fuck does that mean?\" is ALWAYS"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1286.15,"endTime":1289.99,"body":"a great question. AND, obviously"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1289.99,"endTime":1291.94,"body":"one of the parts here is our"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1289.99,"endTime":1291.94,"body":"refrain! It's named that way"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1291.94,"endTime":1295.72,"body":"because world religions paradigm"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1291.94,"endTime":1295.72,"body":"comes from imperialism! I know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1295.72,"endTime":1297.76,"body":"you love joking that the answer"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1295.72,"endTime":1297.76,"body":"is always imperialism, but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1297.76,"endTime":1299.41,"body":"like... it a little bit is!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1299.77,"endTime":1301.6,"body":"I knew"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1299.77,"endTime":1301.6,"body":"it. I fucking knew it."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1301.03,"endTime":1305.35,"body":"*chuckles* But"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1301.03,"endTime":1305.35,"body":"also, there ARE some things we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1305.35,"endTime":1308.89,"body":"can say which make the category"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1305.35,"endTime":1308.89,"body":"legible today, and sometimes,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1310.15,"endTime":1313.21,"body":"uhhhhhhh, scholars and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1310.15,"endTime":1313.21,"body":"practitioners argue about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1313.21,"endTime":1320.29,"body":"whether or not these are useful"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1313.21,"endTime":1320.29,"body":"or accurate. So, okay. First and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1320.29,"endTime":1322.63,"body":"foremost, most indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1320.29,"endTime":1322.63,"body":"religions have a connection to a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1322.63,"endTime":1326.47,"body":"specific place. And not like,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1322.63,"endTime":1326.47,"body":"oh, you know, like \"Paris, je"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1326.47,"endTime":1330.85,"body":"t'aime,\" or \"Majorca is a bit of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1326.47,"endTime":1330.85,"body":"me.\" It's a deep, traditional,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1330.85,"endTime":1335.08,"body":"often sacred connection to a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1330.85,"endTime":1335.08,"body":"specific place. It can be as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1335.08,"endTime":1337.96,"body":"small or as large as we can"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1335.08,"endTime":1337.96,"body":"imagine, frankly, because ideas"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1337.96,"endTime":1340.3,"body":"about land might be really"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1337.96,"endTime":1340.3,"body":"specific, like a particular"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1340.3,"endTime":1340.75,"body":"mountain--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1340.96,"endTime":1342.79,"body":"Ooh!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1340.96,"endTime":1342.79,"body":"Yeah! A good example there might"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1342.79,"endTime":1346.24,"body":"be Mount Kailash in Tibet, which"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1342.79,"endTime":1346.24,"body":"is sacred to a HOST of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1346.24,"endTime":1349.39,"body":"religions, including Hinduism,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1346.24,"endTime":1349.39,"body":"Buddhism, Jainism, but also Bn,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1349.6,"endTime":1351.73,"body":"an indigenous religion of Tibet."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1349.6,"endTime":1351.73,"body":"Like that? Is that what you"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1351.47,"endTime":1353.24,"body":"That IS what I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1351.47,"endTime":1353.24,"body":"mean, and I love it when you"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1351.73,"endTime":1352.06,"body":"mean?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1353.27,"endTime":1357.02,"body":"come up with examples! So, yeah!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1353.27,"endTime":1357.02,"body":"It can be particularl like a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1357.02,"endTime":1359.78,"body":"mountain, or it can be vast and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1357.02,"endTime":1359.78,"body":"expansive, like the notion of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1359.78,"endTime":1364.52,"body":"land and place for Maori in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1359.78,"endTime":1364.52,"body":"Aotearoa (also known as New"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1360.79,"endTime":1406.66,"body":"In"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1360.79,"endTime":1406.66,"body":"episode 104, in fact."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1364.52,"endTime":1368.3,"body":"Zealand). In short, big or"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1364.52,"endTime":1368.3,"body":"small, vast or rooted, many"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1368.3,"endTime":1372.08,"body":"indigenous traditions have a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1368.3,"endTime":1372.08,"body":"deep connection to land-- being"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1372.08,"endTime":1375.32,"body":"f it, caretaking for it, the lan"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1372.08,"endTime":1375.32,"body":"taking care of them, them takin"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1375.32,"endTime":1377.84,"body":"care of the land, an"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1375.32,"endTime":1377.84,"body":"understanding their community"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1377.84,"endTime":1380.99,"body":"their family, thei"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1377.84,"endTime":1380.99,"body":"relationships to and with the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1380.99,"endTime":1386.33,"body":"land. Sometimes it's also tied"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1380.99,"endTime":1386.33,"body":"to or mixed up with notions of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1386.33,"endTime":1390.29,"body":"Gods, or spirits, or ancestor"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1386.33,"endTime":1390.29,"body":", not quite humans, more th"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1390.29,"endTime":1393.92,"body":"n humans, different than huma"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1390.29,"endTime":1393.92,"body":"s, who are also tied to, loc"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1393.92,"endTime":1397.94,"body":"ted with, from within that lan"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1393.92,"endTime":1397.94,"body":". We also saw this a little b"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1398.0,"endTime":1401.33,"body":"t in African Diasporic Religion"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1398.0,"endTime":1401.33,"body":". We saw this way back when we t"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1401.33,"endTime":1403.79,"body":"lked about Native religions"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1401.33,"endTime":1403.79,"body":"s an example of what coun"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1403.79,"endTime":1404.3,"body":"s as rel"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1407.42,"endTime":1408.47,"body":"Still love a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1407.42,"endTime":1408.47,"body":"callback!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1409.04,"endTime":1411.29,"body":"Alright."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1409.04,"endTime":1411.29,"body":"So, land, and that can be"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1411.29,"endTime":1414.71,"body":"specific, like a given tree,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1411.29,"endTime":1414.71,"body":"perhaps, or a mountain, like"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1414.71,"endTime":1418.85,"body":"Kailash, or vast, like the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1414.71,"endTime":1418.85,"body":"conceptualization of ALL lands,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1418.88,"endTime":1423.98,"body":"or OUR lands, or THE water. I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1418.88,"endTime":1423.98,"body":"wonder if we might also talk"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1423.98,"endTime":1427.58,"body":"about orality, story, myth,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1423.98,"endTime":1427.58,"body":"practice, as a part of what we"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1427.58,"endTime":1432.83,"body":"might expect to find in this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1427.58,"endTime":1432.83,"body":"category of Native or Indigenous"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1432.83,"endTime":1433.67,"body":"religions."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1432.83,"endTime":1437.63,"body":"Yes! So stories,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1432.83,"endTime":1437.63,"body":"and myths, and art-- all of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1433.72,"endTime":1434.29,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1434.71,"endTime":1457.81,"body":"So, MOST religion"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1434.71,"endTime":1457.81,"body":"have those components, at leas"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1437.63,"endTime":1442.37,"body":"those are ways that native"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1437.63,"endTime":1442.37,"body":"people have and do encode"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1442.37,"endTime":1446.12,"body":"history and culture. So when"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1442.37,"endTime":1446.12,"body":"Western European folk showed up"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1446.12,"endTime":1447.77,"body":"nd were like, \"You don't have"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1446.12,"endTime":1447.77,"body":"ny history, you don't have any"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1447.77,"endTime":1450.29,"body":"ulture because you didn't write"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1447.77,"endTime":1450.29,"body":"anything down,\" it was just a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1450.29,"endTime":1453.32,"body":"inability to see, frankly, wha"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1450.29,"endTime":1453.32,"body":"was right in front of thei"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1453.32,"endTime":1456.95,"body":"faces."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1457.81,"endTime":1461.35,"body":"in part, but the specifi"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1457.81,"endTime":1461.35,"body":"contours of European religion"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1461.35,"endTime":1463.66,"body":"and especially Protestan"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1461.35,"endTime":1463.66,"body":"Christianity, starte"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1463.66,"endTime":1466.12,"body":"emphasizing text as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1463.66,"endTime":1466.12,"body":"requirement to be a rea"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1466.12,"endTime":1469.42,"body":"religion-- to get a spot in th"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1466.12,"endTime":1469.42,"body":"world religions paradigm, like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1469.42,"endTime":1476.62,"body":"seat on the world parliament o"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1469.42,"endTime":1476.62,"body":"religions in 1893, and also, yo"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1476.62,"endTime":1481.15,"body":"know, to count as a religion t"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1476.62,"endTime":1481.15,"body":"avoid being enslaved, o"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1481.15,"endTime":1485.5,"body":"captured, or forcibly converted"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1481.15,"endTime":1485.5,"body":"So a lot of oral cultures-- eve"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1485.5,"endTime":1488.92,"body":"in Christian practices!-- ge"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1485.5,"endTime":1488.92,"body":"lost due to the way tha"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1488.92,"endTime":1491.65,"body":"Christian imperialism ha"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1488.92,"endTime":1491.65,"body":"developed. This wasn't a given"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1491.65,"endTime":1494.56,"body":"though, so it shouldn't surpris"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1491.65,"endTime":1494.56,"body":"us that other ways of knowin"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1494.56,"endTime":1498.22,"body":"and practicing flourish, like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1494.56,"endTime":1498.22,"body":"again, storytelling"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1498.22,"endTime":1504.58,"body":"performances, dance, art. Just"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1498.22,"endTime":1504.58,"body":"ways of passing on who a peopl"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1504.61,"endTime":1507.64,"body":"is, and what they know, and wha"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1504.61,"endTime":1507.64,"body":"they value, and where they'v"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1507.64,"endTime":1510.7,"body":"come from, and where they hop"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1507.64,"endTime":1510.7,"body":"they're heading. All of tha"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1510.7,"endTime":1513.67,"body":"gets encoded, just no"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1510.7,"endTime":1513.67,"body":"necessarily in textual ways"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1514.98,"endTime":1517.56,"body":"Or--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1514.98,"endTime":1517.56,"body":"yeah. Like, what we would expect"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1517.56,"endTime":1520.83,"body":"as text, like text equals book"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1517.56,"endTime":1520.83,"body":"as opposed to text equals this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1520.83,"endTime":1523.74,"body":"narrative that people have"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1520.83,"endTime":1523.74,"body":"memorized and there's like, you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1523.74,"endTime":1527.25,"body":"know, 400 oral text books, but"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1523.74,"endTime":1527.25,"body":"because you memorize them, they"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1527.25,"endTime":1528.06,"body":"don't count as much."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1528.0,"endTime":1530.76,"body":"Right. That's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1528.0,"endTime":1530.76,"body":"true! Dr. Castro talked to us"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1530.76,"endTime":1533.64,"body":"about that last time with"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1530.76,"endTime":1533.64,"body":"Lukumi! Yes."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1534.03,"endTime":1537.48,"body":"Exactly."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1534.03,"endTime":1537.48,"body":"Okay! So. We've got land and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1537.48,"endTime":1544.65,"body":"connections to it, we've got"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1537.48,"endTime":1544.65,"body":"orality, storytelling, myth, as"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1544.68,"endTime":1547.65,"body":"number two, and I think the last"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1544.68,"endTime":1547.65,"body":"sort of commonality I'd like our"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1547.65,"endTime":1549.84,"body":"nerds to hear about is"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1547.65,"endTime":1549.84,"body":"conversion."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1550.5,"endTime":1550.83,"body":"Uh huh."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1550.84,"endTime":1552.97,"body":"We"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1550.84,"endTime":1552.97,"body":"often think about religious"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1553.0,"endTime":1556.84,"body":"being religious as one thing--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1553.0,"endTime":1556.84,"body":"like, you are a Jew, you are a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1556.87,"endTime":1560.47,"body":"Muslim, and these are singular"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1556.87,"endTime":1560.47,"body":"categories. So maybe you move"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1560.47,"endTime":1567.16,"body":"between them, but only formally,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1560.47,"endTime":1567.16,"body":"you convert. Or, maybe you are a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1567.16,"endTime":1570.34,"body":"person being raised in an"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1567.16,"endTime":1570.34,"body":"interfaith family, but there's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1570.34,"endTime":1572.95,"body":"still that understanding of two"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1570.34,"endTime":1572.95,"body":"separate things combining in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1572.95,"endTime":1575.83,"body":"your house to be a third and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1572.95,"endTime":1575.83,"body":"separate thing."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1576.4,"endTime":1576.46,"body":"Mhm."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1577.71,"endTime":1579.12,"body":"Anyway,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1577.71,"endTime":1579.12,"body":"also, that only works sometimes"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1579.12,"endTime":1581.58,"body":"because of racialization"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1579.12,"endTime":1581.58,"body":"(callback all of season two)."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1581.7,"endTime":1582.33,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1582.6,"endTime":1583.8,"body":"Here's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1582.6,"endTime":1583.8,"body":"what I want our nerds to know."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1583.8,"endTime":1586.11,"body":"For Indigenous religions,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1583.8,"endTime":1586.11,"body":"broadly speaking, there's not"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1586.11,"endTime":1589.65,"body":"really this understanding of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1586.11,"endTime":1589.65,"body":"conversion, or converting. This"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1589.65,"endTime":1593.16,"body":"isn't A religion claiming"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1589.65,"endTime":1593.16,"body":"universality for all people in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1593.16,"endTime":1597.24,"body":"all the world. Rather, we often"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1593.16,"endTime":1597.24,"body":"see its claims of universal"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1597.24,"endTime":1601.41,"body":"truths for a specific people in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1597.24,"endTime":1601.41,"body":"particular ways and with real"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1601.41,"endTime":1604.86,"body":"emphasis on particular"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1601.41,"endTime":1604.86,"body":"relationships. Conversion's also"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1604.86,"endTime":1607.68,"body":"a great place to think about the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1604.86,"endTime":1607.68,"body":"limits of \"Indigenous religion\""},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1607.68,"endTime":1611.31,"body":"as a category because it is"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1607.68,"endTime":1611.31,"body":"about what we think of as a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1611.31,"endTime":1615.3,"body":"religion, and it also isn't! I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1611.31,"endTime":1615.3,"body":"can't convert to a culture."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1615.51,"endTime":1616.02,"body":"Yeah, no."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1617.04,"endTime":1618.63,"body":"I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1617.04,"endTime":1618.63,"body":"can't convert to a racialized"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1618.63,"endTime":1619.35,"body":"category."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1619.98,"endTime":1620.31,"body":"Nope."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1620.34,"endTime":1621.69,"body":"So"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1620.34,"endTime":1621.69,"body":"you, white hippies with"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1621.69,"endTime":1624.24,"body":"dreadlocks, thinking you'll find"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1621.69,"endTime":1624.24,"body":"an authentic connection in a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1624.24,"endTime":1626.88,"body":"Brazilian rain forest with"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1624.24,"endTime":1626.88,"body":"Native practitioners... Your"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1626.91,"endTime":1627.87,"body":"appropriation is showing."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1628.59,"endTime":1630.36,"body":"My god, did you"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1628.59,"endTime":1630.36,"body":"just come from my sister? I love"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1630.36,"endTime":1631.83,"body":"it. Love it! Yeah--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1631.83,"endTime":1633.57,"body":"No, I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1631.83,"endTime":1633.57,"body":"didn't. I don't-- I don't know"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1633.57,"endTime":1634.38,"body":"Erin, but..."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1634.36,"endTime":1637.3,"body":"*giggles* She"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1634.36,"endTime":1637.3,"body":"doesn't have dreadlocks... but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1637.3,"endTime":1640.42,"body":"she does have opinions about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1637.3,"endTime":1640.42,"body":"Ayahuasca. Anyway! Yeah, no, you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1639.82,"endTime":1640.3,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1640.42,"endTime":1643.09,"body":"can't convert to being born"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1640.42,"endTime":1643.09,"body":"Lakota. That's not how that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1643.09,"endTime":1646.6,"body":"works. And this is a big global"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1643.09,"endTime":1646.6,"body":"issue for native folks:"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1646.75,"endTime":1651.49,"body":"appropriation. *secret word of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1646.75,"endTime":1651.49,"body":"the day!* The taking of someon"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1651.49,"endTime":1655.18,"body":"'s culture, religion, way of bei"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1651.49,"endTime":1655.18,"body":"g, and using it without permi"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1655.18,"endTime":1658.63,"body":"sion for their own good, and i"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1655.18,"endTime":1658.63,"body":"portantly, without any of the r"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1658.63,"endTime":1663.07,"body":"sk, or accountability, or ack"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1658.63,"endTime":1663.07,"body":"owledgement about the way tha"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1663.07,"endTime":1667.84,"body":", say, their ancestors, or like,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1663.07,"endTime":1667.84,"body":"let's make it about my ancestor"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1667.96,"endTime":1672.61,"body":"-- my white European ancest"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1667.96,"endTime":1672.61,"body":"rs might have participated in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1672.67,"endTime":1677.35,"body":"he violent attempted destruction"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1672.67,"endTime":1677.35,"body":"of the ancestors of Native peop"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1679.63,"endTime":1681.13,"body":"Another major"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1679.63,"endTime":1681.13,"body":"issue, I think, is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1679.63,"endTime":1683.29,"body":"e."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1681.13,"endTime":1683.29,"body":"discontinuity. There's a lack of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1681.13,"endTime":1683.29,"body":"information, or often a lack of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1683.29,"endTime":1688.27,"body":"information considered to be"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1683.29,"endTime":1688.27,"body":"credible, about indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1688.27,"endTime":1691.69,"body":"histories all over the world. So"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1688.27,"endTime":1691.69,"body":"real talk-- scholarship on"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1691.69,"endTime":1695.05,"body":"indigenous religions began"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1691.69,"endTime":1695.05,"body":"hundreds of years after contact"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1695.41,"endTime":1697.24,"body":"(especially if we're talking"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1695.41,"endTime":1697.24,"body":"about indigenous communities in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1697.24,"endTime":1700.63,"body":"the Americas, Oceania and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1697.24,"endTime":1700.63,"body":"Africa), or just hundreds of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1700.63,"endTime":1703.15,"body":"years later, because scholarship"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1700.63,"endTime":1703.15,"body":"is a modern concept, full"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1703.15,"endTime":1706.21,"body":"fucking stop. So for us, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1703.15,"endTime":1706.21,"body":"sometimes for practitioners"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1706.21,"endTime":1709.39,"body":"themselves, it's hard to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1706.21,"endTime":1709.39,"body":"determine if practices and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1709.39,"endTime":1713.56,"body":"beliefs predate contact with,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1709.39,"endTime":1713.56,"body":"again, like Western European"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1713.56,"endTime":1721.24,"body":"colonizers, predate imperialism,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1713.56,"endTime":1721.24,"body":"or if, uhhh, practices and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1721.24,"endTime":1725.35,"body":"beliefs have changed radically"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1721.24,"endTime":1725.35,"body":"over time. Often, and frankly"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1725.35,"endTime":1728.65,"body":"usually, it's a mix of knowing"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1725.35,"endTime":1728.65,"body":"and not knowing, but it's not as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1728.65,"endTime":1734.92,"body":"simple as the records kept about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1728.65,"endTime":1734.92,"body":"like, Jews. *chuckles* I mean,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1735.01,"endTime":1737.56,"body":"when did things ever get to be"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1735.01,"endTime":1737.56,"body":"simple for the Jews? But, we can"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1737.56,"endTime":1741.22,"body":"trace debates and heterodoxies"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1737.56,"endTime":1741.22,"body":"and orthodoxies around Judaism,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1741.22,"endTime":1744.7,"body":"not because Judaism was or is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1741.22,"endTime":1744.7,"body":"consistent (because it's not, at"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1744.7,"endTime":1746.56,"body":"all. I know all your people love"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1744.7,"endTime":1746.56,"body":"to argue)--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1746.92,"endTime":1747.73,"body":"So"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1746.92,"endTime":1747.73,"body":"much."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1747.03,"endTime":1750.9,"body":"--BUT records"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1747.03,"endTime":1750.9,"body":"work differently in places where"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1750.9,"endTime":1754.11,"body":"Jews lived and within Jewish"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1750.9,"endTime":1754.11,"body":"communities. We can never know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1754.11,"endTime":1756.48,"body":"everything, of course, but we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1754.11,"endTime":1756.48,"body":"can see how things changed over"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1756.51,"endTime":1760.89,"body":"a-a HUGE, long period of time."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1756.51,"endTime":1760.89,"body":"Through violence of all kinds--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1760.95,"endTime":1763.65,"body":"murder, enslavement, genocide,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1760.95,"endTime":1763.65,"body":"forbidding Native languages to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1763.65,"endTime":1767.46,"body":"be spoken, learned, or read,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1763.65,"endTime":1767.46,"body":"taking of Native children-- we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1767.46,"endTime":1770.55,"body":"don't usually have that kind of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1767.46,"endTime":1770.55,"body":"privilege with indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1770.55,"endTime":1771.36,"body":"religions."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1773.28,"endTime":1774.39,"body":"*sighs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1773.28,"endTime":1774.39,"body":"Yeah, so I take this to be a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1774.39,"endTime":1776.76,"body":"place for our little"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1774.39,"endTime":1776.76,"body":"catchphrase, \"religion is what"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1776.76,"endTime":1781.08,"body":"people do,\" is really, really"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1776.76,"endTime":1781.08,"body":"crucial. I cannot believe I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1781.08,"endTime":1784.44,"body":"gonna say this, me, our"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1781.08,"endTime":1784.44,"body":"historian who bugs out regularly"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1784.44,"endTime":1789.15,"body":"about fiction being incorrect"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1784.44,"endTime":1789.15,"body":"about history, but: focusing on"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1789.15,"endTime":1792.42,"body":"how indigenous religions are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1789.15,"endTime":1792.42,"body":"practiced now, irrespective of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1792.42,"endTime":1796.05,"body":"history, I think is the ticket."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1792.42,"endTime":1796.05,"body":"We should account for things"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1796.05,"endTime":1799.56,"body":"like mass conversion, historical"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1796.05,"endTime":1799.56,"body":"legacies of violence, and the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1799.56,"endTime":1803.25,"body":"rest of it. That's inexcusable,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1799.56,"endTime":1803.25,"body":"and we need to think about it."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1803.64,"endTime":1806.61,"body":"But that shouldn't make the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1803.64,"endTime":1806.61,"body":"surviving, real, and current"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1806.61,"endTime":1811.59,"body":"practices any less important, or"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1806.61,"endTime":1811.59,"body":"primary, or \"authentic,\" in big"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1811.59,"endTime":1812.28,"body":"quotes."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1812.55,"endTime":1816.42,"body":"Yes. Exactly."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1812.55,"endTime":1816.42,"body":"Now-- a thing that I appreciate"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1816.42,"endTime":1819.63,"body":"about you is that you keep"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1816.42,"endTime":1819.63,"body":"trying to explain linear time to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1819.63,"endTime":1822.96,"body":"me, even though it is a lie, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1819.63,"endTime":1822.96,"body":"also a concept my brain cannot"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1822.96,"endTime":1827.1,"body":"make any sense of-- is this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1822.96,"endTime":1827.1,"body":"where I get to talk about 10"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1827.1,"endTime":1829.47,"body":"indigenous religions from every"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1827.1,"endTime":1829.47,"body":"corner of the globe so we can"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1829.47,"endTime":1831.6,"body":"highlight commonalities, but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1829.47,"endTime":1831.6,"body":"also fiercely talk through how"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1831.6,"endTime":1835.59,"body":"unique every SINGLE set of these"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1831.6,"endTime":1835.59,"body":"cultures, and traditions, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1835.59,"endTime":1838.77,"body":"often linguistic histories are?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1835.59,"endTime":1838.77,"body":"Is that-- is that time?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1839.28,"endTime":1841.89,"body":"No,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1839.28,"endTime":1841.89,"body":"it's not, Megan."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1842.1,"endTime":1844.53,"body":"I want to do it,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1842.1,"endTime":1844.53,"body":"so there is time for it!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1845.25,"endTime":1846.57,"body":"I've"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1845.25,"endTime":1846.57,"body":"been telling you since we"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1846.57,"endTime":1849.42,"body":"conceived this season, we get"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1846.57,"endTime":1849.42,"body":"one argument and one example."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1849.42,"endTime":1852.75,"body":"And then we get loooooong"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1849.42,"endTime":1852.75,"body":"homework sections so our nerds"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1852.75,"endTime":1856.65,"body":"can do more learning. You are..."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1852.75,"endTime":1856.65,"body":"God, you're serious, right? You"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1856.65,"endTime":1858.36,"body":"think that there's time? To do"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1856.65,"endTime":1858.36,"body":"all of it?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1858.69,"endTime":1860.97,"body":"If I want to do"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1858.69,"endTime":1860.97,"body":"it, there's time to do it. Yes."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1861.36,"endTime":1865.17,"body":"I have so many things to say!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1861.36,"endTime":1865.17,"body":"And also, YOU have many things"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1865.17,"endTime":1866.16,"body":"to say and--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1866.0,"endTime":1867.74,"body":"Alright,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1866.0,"endTime":1867.74,"body":"alright, alright. Can you just"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1867.74,"endTime":1871.13,"body":"pick one? One example that helps"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1867.74,"endTime":1871.13,"body":"us highlight how indigenous"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1871.13,"endTime":1874.28,"body":"religions works (and doesn't) as"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1871.13,"endTime":1874.28,"body":"a category?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1874.37,"endTime":1877.55,"body":"Fine, fine, but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1874.37,"endTime":1877.55,"body":"time is a lie! But also, I know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1877.55,"endTime":1880.43,"body":"you'll murder me if we waste too"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1877.55,"endTime":1880.43,"body":"much of it. Soooo, that also"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1880.43,"endTime":1883.34,"body":"seems like a fake concept, but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1880.43,"endTime":1883.34,"body":"FINE, fine. Okay. Let's dive"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1883.34,"endTime":1887.45,"body":"into a set of practices that is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1883.34,"endTime":1887.45,"body":"often thought of as indigenous--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1887.48,"endTime":1892.52,"body":"but also doesn't entirely fit"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1887.48,"endTime":1892.52,"body":"that model-- which I basically"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1892.52,"endTime":1896.06,"body":"point out this season. I pick"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1892.52,"endTime":1896.06,"body":"Shinto! Let's talk about that."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1896.57,"endTime":1898.28,"body":"Thank"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1896.57,"endTime":1898.28,"body":"you for believing women, or at"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1898.28,"endTime":1900.92,"body":"least this woman, when I say"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1898.28,"endTime":1900.92,"body":"that time is both good construct"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1900.95,"endTime":1904.1,"body":"and real. Either way, Shinto it"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1900.95,"endTime":1904.1,"body":"is, way to pick it."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1904.1,"endTime":1904.25,"body":"Huzzah!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1904.25,"endTime":1906.65,"body":"Good"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1904.25,"endTime":1906.65,"body":"choice, though there are so many"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1906.65,"endTime":1908.87,"body":"others, this will be absolutely"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1906.65,"endTime":1908.87,"body":"great. Let's do our thing."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1908.87,"endTime":1911.63,"body":"Megan, let's start basic. What"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1908.87,"endTime":1911.63,"body":"is Shinto?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1912.17,"endTime":1913.79,"body":"That's a big"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1912.17,"endTime":1913.79,"body":"question from a little lady."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1913.79,"endTime":1913.82,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1915.91,"endTime":1919.21,"body":"But yeah, okay,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1915.91,"endTime":1919.21,"body":"let's define! Shinto-- *'secret"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1919.39,"endTime":1923.11,"body":"word of the day*-- is often"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1919.39,"endTime":1923.11,"body":"understood as an indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1923.11,"endTime":1926.71,"body":"Japanese set of traditions-- but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1923.11,"endTime":1926.71,"body":"the word, and you're going to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1926.71,"endTime":1928.96,"body":"love this, IRMF, because I know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1926.71,"endTime":1928.96,"body":"you love a thing about naming a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1928.96,"endTime":1933.64,"body":"language-- comes from the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1928.96,"endTime":1933.64,"body":"Chinese shen dao, or \"way of the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1933.64,"endTime":1936.91,"body":"gods.\" It's also known as kami"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1933.64,"endTime":1936.91,"body":"no michi, which is Japanese for"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1936.94,"endTime":1940.93,"body":"\"way of the kami.\" And kami--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1936.94,"endTime":1940.93,"body":"*secret word of the day*--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1942.01,"endTime":1946.21,"body":"K-A-M-I, are spirits or natural"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1942.01,"endTime":1946.21,"body":"forces, and I definitely want to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1946.21,"endTime":1948.13,"body":"talk about them more in a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1946.21,"endTime":1948.13,"body":"minute. They have a lot of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1948.13,"endTime":1952.48,"body":"really good stories. But-- let's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1948.13,"endTime":1952.48,"body":"start with the Shinto name, or"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1952.48,"endTime":1957.28,"body":"the calling it Shinto, which"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1952.48,"endTime":1957.28,"body":"emerges in the sixth century CE,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1957.67,"endTime":1960.01,"body":"as a way to distinguish between"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1957.67,"endTime":1960.01,"body":"indigenous practices and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1960.01,"endTime":1964.6,"body":"beliefs, uhhh, and Mahayana"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1960.01,"endTime":1964.6,"body":"Buddhism, which is becoming"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1964.6,"endTime":1967.69,"body":"popular in Japan at the time."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1964.6,"endTime":1967.69,"body":"There are a number of other"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1967.69,"endTime":1971.56,"body":"terms for Shinto, but this term"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1967.69,"endTime":1971.56,"body":"becomes popular, uhhh, IRMF, do"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1971.56,"endTime":1972.19,"body":"you want to guess when?"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1973.54,"endTime":1974.77,"body":"Alright,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1973.54,"endTime":1974.77,"body":"I actually do really want to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1974.77,"endTime":1975.55,"body":"guess. I'm gonna guess--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1975.03,"endTime":1975.06,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1975.06,"endTime":1977.49,"body":"I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1975.06,"endTime":1977.49,"body":"gonna have to guess that it"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1977.49,"endTime":1980.43,"body":"deals with two kinds of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1977.49,"endTime":1980.43,"body":"imperialism-- Japanese internal"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1980.97,"endTime":1984.93,"body":"imperial politics and global"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1980.97,"endTime":1984.93,"body":"European imperial politics? So"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1984.93,"endTime":1987.75,"body":"maybeeeee, during both"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1984.93,"endTime":1987.75,"body":"construction of the world"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1987.75,"endTime":1990.51,"body":"religions paradigm AND"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1987.75,"endTime":1990.51,"body":"consolidation of Japanese"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1990.57,"endTime":1993.87,"body":"ethnonational identities and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":1990.57,"endTime":1993.87,"body":"power, I'mma guess 18th century?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1994.23,"endTime":1996.66,"body":"Oh damn! I know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1994.23,"endTime":1996.66,"body":"you love the 19th century, but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":1996.66,"endTime":1997.86,"body":"you're right! Yes!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2000.41,"endTime":2000.47,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2000.47,"endTime":2002.36,"body":"Love a history"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2000.47,"endTime":2002.36,"body":"guessing game. So most"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2002.36,"endTime":2007.19,"body":"historians see Shinto starting--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2002.36,"endTime":2007.19,"body":"Shinto being named as Shinto,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2007.46,"endTime":2011.09,"body":"starting early as the 15th"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2007.46,"endTime":2011.09,"body":"century, but it really IS the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2011.09,"endTime":2012.83,"body":"18th century. Ding, ding, ding,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2011.09,"endTime":2012.83,"body":"ding!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2013.7,"endTime":2014.66,"body":"Yay!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2013.7,"endTime":2014.66,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2015.98,"endTime":2017.63,"body":"So we don't have"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2015.98,"endTime":2017.63,"body":"space for the really important"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2017.63,"endTime":2021.02,"body":"historical bits here, but the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2017.63,"endTime":2021.02,"body":"short version-- Shinto is a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2021.02,"endTime":2026.09,"body":"Japanese religious system. It's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2021.02,"endTime":2026.09,"body":"named as Shinto to distinguish"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2026.09,"endTime":2028.97,"body":"it from Buddhism for complicated"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2026.09,"endTime":2028.97,"body":"reasons that more or less boil"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2028.97,"endTime":2033.56,"body":"down to Japanese ethnonational"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2028.97,"endTime":2033.56,"body":"identities. A big piece of this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2033.86,"endTime":2039.08,"body":"is trying to formally divorce"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2033.86,"endTime":2039.08,"body":"Shinto from Buddhism, keeping"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2039.08,"endTime":2042.32,"body":"the Japanese indigenousness"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2039.08,"endTime":2042.32,"body":"central. In other words,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2042.32,"endTime":2045.74,"body":"imagining Shinto as STRICTLY"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2042.32,"endTime":2045.74,"body":"Japanese and Buddhism as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2045.74,"endTime":2051.14,"body":"strictly not, which is a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2045.74,"endTime":2051.14,"body":"political argument. Surprise!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2051.92,"endTime":2055.46,"body":"Religion is political, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2051.92,"endTime":2055.46,"body":"politics are religion yet again."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2057.38,"endTime":2058.28,"body":"Who"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2057.38,"endTime":2058.28,"body":"woulda thunk?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2058.73,"endTime":2062.15,"body":"I know!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2058.73,"endTime":2062.15,"body":"*chuckles* Religion was the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2062.15,"endTime":2065.78,"body":"politics we made along the way."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2062.15,"endTime":2065.78,"body":"But in practice, it's hard to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2065.78,"endTime":2068.63,"body":"separate these allegedly (and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2065.78,"endTime":2068.63,"body":"sometimes actually) distinct"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2068.63,"endTime":2071.27,"body":"religions, and as lots of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2068.63,"endTime":2071.27,"body":"scholars have argued, that's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2071.27,"endTime":2073.67,"body":"maybe not the most productive"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2071.27,"endTime":2073.67,"body":"question we can ask about it."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2073.7,"endTime":2074.09,"body":"So."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2075.68,"endTime":2077.0,"body":"Alright,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2075.68,"endTime":2077.0,"body":"well, so let's expand on that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2077.0,"endTime":2080.27,"body":"then. Shinto is, like you said"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2077.0,"endTime":2080.27,"body":"before, a set of practices that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2080.27,"endTime":2083.69,"body":"rests on relationships with the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2080.27,"endTime":2083.69,"body":"kami, who are natural spirits"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2083.69,"endTime":2086.63,"body":"and forces, and claims to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2083.69,"endTime":2086.63,"body":"indigenousness are both"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2086.63,"endTime":2089.54,"body":"political and, for lack of a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2086.63,"endTime":2089.54,"body":"better phrase, kind of obvious."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2089.6,"endTime":2092.93,"body":"Yeah, yeah."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2089.6,"endTime":2092.93,"body":"Definitely. But, do you know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2092.93,"endTime":2096.74,"body":"what? As we're thinking about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2092.93,"endTime":2096.74,"body":"how Shinto was practiced, how"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2096.77,"endTime":2101.36,"body":"\"Japanese\" it is (Japanese in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2096.77,"endTime":2101.36,"body":"quotation marks because there's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2101.36,"endTime":2104.87,"body":"a lot of conversation about,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2101.36,"endTime":2104.87,"body":"again, an ethnonationalism and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2104.87,"endTime":2108.29,"body":"its relationship to Shinto), and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2104.87,"endTime":2108.29,"body":"how all of this fits into"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2108.29,"endTime":2111.68,"body":"indigenous religions. I think"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2108.29,"endTime":2111.68,"body":"that this is a great moment to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2111.68,"endTime":2114.83,"body":"hear from our guest expert, Dr."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2111.68,"endTime":2114.83,"body":"Jolyon Thomas, who has written"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2114.83,"endTime":2117.86,"body":"so much about Japanese religion,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2114.83,"endTime":2117.86,"body":"what counts, and how we think"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2117.86,"endTime":2119.0,"body":"about Shinto specifically."},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2121.37,"endTime":2123.41,"body":"My name is"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2121.37,"endTime":2123.41,"body":"Jolyon Thomas, and I'm an expert"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2123.41,"endTime":2127.97,"body":"on how religion intersects with"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2123.41,"endTime":2127.97,"body":"media, law, politics, education,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2128.03,"endTime":2131.57,"body":"and the economy. I care that"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2128.03,"endTime":2131.57,"body":"students, and scholars, and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2131.57,"endTime":2135.11,"body":"policymakers, and my mom know"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2131.57,"endTime":2135.11,"body":"about what I study because I"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2135.11,"endTime":2137.3,"body":"think the distinctions we"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2135.11,"endTime":2137.3,"body":"intuitively draw between"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2137.3,"endTime":2140.63,"body":"religion and other aspects of"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2137.3,"endTime":2140.63,"body":"social life often determine what"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2140.63,"endTime":2143.66,"body":"gets taken seriously and what"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2140.63,"endTime":2143.66,"body":"doesn't. that can have life and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2143.66,"endTime":2148.31,"body":"death effects. Japanese people"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2143.66,"endTime":2148.31,"body":"generally adopt nonexclusive in"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2148.31,"endTime":2151.19,"body":"situational approaches to"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2148.31,"endTime":2151.19,"body":"religious practice, and may"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2151.19,"endTime":2154.7,"body":"therefore engage with multiple"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2151.19,"endTime":2154.7,"body":"religious institutions, or even"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2154.7,"endTime":2157.07,"body":"use various virtual services"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2154.7,"endTime":2157.07,"body":"without ever thinking of"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2157.07,"endTime":2160.64,"body":"themselves as religious. In"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2157.07,"endTime":2160.64,"body":"fact, if you ask 10 people on"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2160.64,"endTime":2163.97,"body":"the street in Japan, if their"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2160.64,"endTime":2163.97,"body":"religious, only about 2 in 10"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2163.97,"endTime":2167.63,"body":"would say yes. But according to"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2163.97,"endTime":2167.63,"body":"official government statistics,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2167.69,"endTime":2170.57,"body":"the total number of religious"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2167.69,"endTime":2170.57,"body":"adherence in Japan equals about"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2170.57,"endTime":2174.29,"body":"1.4 times the entire population"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2170.57,"endTime":2174.29,"body":"of the country. Japan is"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2174.29,"endTime":2177.68,"body":"therefore both minimally and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2174.29,"endTime":2177.68,"body":"maximally religious, depending"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2177.68,"endTime":2181.07,"body":"on who you're listening to, and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2177.68,"endTime":2181.07,"body":"how you're counting. Okay, if we"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2181.07,"endTime":2183.68,"body":"go by official government"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2181.07,"endTime":2183.68,"body":"statistics, there are"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2183.68,"endTime":2189.2,"body":"approximately 182,000 distinct"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2183.68,"endTime":2189.2,"body":"religions in Japan. In a nation"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2189.2,"endTime":2193.16,"body":"of approximately 126 million"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2189.2,"endTime":2193.16,"body":"people, that amounts to roughly"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2193.16,"endTime":2196.88,"body":"one religion for every 700"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2193.16,"endTime":2196.88,"body":"people. Now, most of these"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2196.91,"endTime":2200.42,"body":"discreet organizations happen to"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2196.91,"endTime":2200.42,"body":"be associated with larger"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2200.42,"endTime":2203.93,"body":"denominational or sectarian"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2200.42,"endTime":2203.93,"body":"institutions, like Buddhist"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2203.93,"endTime":2207.26,"body":"temples and Shinto shrines. But"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2203.93,"endTime":2207.26,"body":"in addition to those, there are"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2207.26,"endTime":2209.78,"body":"also a number of Christian"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2207.26,"endTime":2209.78,"body":"denominations, and there are"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2209.78,"endTime":2212.72,"body":"miscellaneous other movements"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2209.78,"endTime":2212.72,"body":"with eclectic doctrines and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2212.72,"endTime":2216.92,"body":"ritual practices. So there's a"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2212.72,"endTime":2216.92,"body":"tradition called hot Sumo day,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2217.22,"endTime":2219.83,"body":"in which people visit Shinto"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2217.22,"endTime":2219.83,"body":"shrines on the first day of the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2219.83,"endTime":2222.71,"body":"year to petition the deities for"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2219.83,"endTime":2222.71,"body":"good fortune. Some of the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2222.71,"endTime":2226.19,"body":"biggest shrines in Japan, like"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2222.71,"endTime":2226.19,"body":"Meiji Jingu in Tokyo, will see"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2226.19,"endTime":2229.58,"body":"upwards of 3 million distinct"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2226.19,"endTime":2229.58,"body":"visitors in the first few days"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2229.58,"endTime":2232.97,"body":"of the New Year. Now, although"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2229.58,"endTime":2232.97,"body":"these New Year's visits appear"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2232.97,"endTime":2237.44,"body":"to derive from ancient Japanese"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2232.97,"endTime":2237.44,"body":"practices, in fact, they emerge"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2237.44,"endTime":2240.71,"body":"out of promotional campaigns"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2237.44,"endTime":2240.71,"body":"conducted by rail companies that"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2240.71,"endTime":2244.52,"body":"aim to boost ticket sales in the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2240.71,"endTime":2244.52,"body":"early 20th century. So this very"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2244.52,"endTime":2247.28,"body":"traditional practice actually"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2244.52,"endTime":2247.28,"body":"emerged from corporate ad"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2247.28,"endTime":2252.38,"body":"campaigns. Dictionaries and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2247.28,"endTime":2252.38,"body":"encyclopedias often describe"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2252.38,"endTime":2256.22,"body":"Shinto as \"the indigenous"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2252.38,"endTime":2256.22,"body":"religion of Japan.\" On the one"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2256.22,"endTime":2258.92,"body":"hand, this makes sense because"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2256.22,"endTime":2258.92,"body":"the veneration of deities known"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2258.92,"endTime":2262.25,"body":"as kami seems to be an"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2258.92,"endTime":2262.25,"body":"exclusively Japanese practice."},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2262.82,"endTime":2265.49,"body":"But on the other hand, scholars"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2262.82,"endTime":2265.49,"body":"have shown that many of the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2265.49,"endTime":2268.79,"body":"deities associated with Shinto"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2265.49,"endTime":2268.79,"body":"are actually of non-Japanese"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2268.82,"endTime":2272.48,"body":"origin, and most of the ideas"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2268.82,"endTime":2272.48,"body":"about Shinto's indigeneity have"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2272.48,"endTime":2275.66,"body":"been created in the context of"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2272.48,"endTime":2275.66,"body":"Japanese people trying to assert"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2275.78,"endTime":2278.6,"body":"Japanese uniqueness or"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2275.78,"endTime":2278.6,"body":"superiority, visa v other"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2278.6,"endTime":2282.23,"body":"nations and cultures. Another"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2278.6,"endTime":2282.23,"body":"crucial point about indigeneity"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2282.23,"endTime":2285.56,"body":"and Japanese religion is that"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2282.23,"endTime":2285.56,"body":"the classic texts of the Kojiki"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2285.56,"endTime":2288.56,"body":"and the Nihon Shoki, the texts"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2285.56,"endTime":2288.56,"body":"that are typically seen as the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2288.56,"endTime":2291.89,"body":"primary sources for Shinto"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2288.56,"endTime":2291.89,"body":"mythology, are actually settler"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2291.89,"endTime":2294.98,"body":"colonial texts that both"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2291.89,"endTime":2294.98,"body":"literally and metaphorically"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2295.16,"endTime":2298.7,"body":"depict one powerful clan"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2295.16,"endTime":2298.7,"body":"subduing other clans in"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2298.7,"endTime":2301.73,"body":"eradicating the indigenous"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2298.7,"endTime":2301.73,"body":"inhabitants of the Japanese"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2301.73,"endTime":2305.84,"body":"archipelago. The conventional"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2301.73,"endTime":2305.84,"body":"wisdom is that Japan had an"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2305.84,"endTime":2308.69,"body":"indigenous, quote unquote"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2305.84,"endTime":2308.69,"body":"\"ethnic\" religion called Shinto"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2308.69,"endTime":2311.45,"body":"that predated the arrival of the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2308.69,"endTime":2311.45,"body":"universal, quote unquote,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2311.45,"endTime":2314.66,"body":"\"world\" religion known as"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2311.45,"endTime":2314.66,"body":"Buddhism. But the earliest texts"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2314.66,"endTime":2317.81,"body":"associated with Shinto postdate"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2314.66,"endTime":2317.81,"body":"the arrival of Buddhism on the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2317.81,"endTime":2321.71,"body":"archipelago. And for most of"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2317.81,"endTime":2321.71,"body":"Japanese history, Buddhism, not"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2321.71,"endTime":2324.65,"body":"Shinto, form the dominant way of"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2321.71,"endTime":2324.65,"body":"understanding things like"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2324.65,"endTime":2329.27,"body":"cosmology, time, political rule,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2324.65,"endTime":2329.27,"body":"and personal salvation. Scholars"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2329.27,"endTime":2331.25,"body":"like myself therefore"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2329.27,"endTime":2331.25,"body":"distinguish between kami"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2331.25,"endTime":2334.37,"body":"worship, and ancient practice of"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2331.25,"endTime":2334.37,"body":"venerating powerful ancestors"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2334.37,"endTime":2338.48,"body":"and natural forces that predated"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2334.37,"endTime":2338.48,"body":"Buddhism, and Shinto, a"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2338.48,"endTime":2341.6,"body":"post-Buddhism concept of a"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2338.48,"endTime":2341.6,"body":"discreet ritual protocol that"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2341.6,"endTime":2344.48,"body":"really only emerged in the 15th"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2341.6,"endTime":2344.48,"body":"century when shrine priests were"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2344.48,"endTime":2348.11,"body":"trying to distinguish themselves"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2344.48,"endTime":2348.11,"body":"from Buddhists. This question of"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2348.11,"endTime":2350.51,"body":"world religions came up in my"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2348.11,"endTime":2350.51,"body":"research on the allied"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2350.51,"endTime":2353.45,"body":"occupation of Japan, which was a"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2350.51,"endTime":2353.45,"body":"military occupation and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2353.45,"endTime":2356.36,"body":"democratization project that"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2353.45,"endTime":2356.36,"body":"marked the end of World War II."},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2356.72,"endTime":2360.26,"body":"Briefly, the Americans that were"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2356.72,"endTime":2360.26,"body":"in charge of setting occupation"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2360.26,"endTime":2363.05,"body":"policy thought that religion was"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2360.26,"endTime":2363.05,"body":"specifically to blame for"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2363.05,"endTime":2366.74,"body":"Japan's imperialist expansion"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2363.05,"endTime":2366.74,"body":"and military aggression. They"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2366.74,"endTime":2369.47,"body":"thought that the, quote unquote,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2366.74,"endTime":2369.47,"body":"\"ethnic\" religion of Shinto"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2369.47,"endTime":2372.44,"body":"drove Japanese militarism, and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2369.47,"endTime":2372.44,"body":"they also assume that the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2372.44,"endTime":2375.5,"body":"positive influence from a, quote"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2372.44,"endTime":2375.5,"body":"unquote, \"universal\" religion,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2375.5,"endTime":2378.41,"body":"like Christianity, or Buddhism,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2375.5,"endTime":2378.41,"body":"would naturally contribute to"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2378.41,"endTime":2381.05,"body":"more democratic governance."},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2378.41,"endTime":2381.05,"body":"These presuppositions were"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2381.05,"endTime":2384.89,"body":"clearly indebted to the world"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2381.05,"endTime":2384.89,"body":"religions paradigm, including a"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2384.89,"endTime":2387.71,"body":"version of that model that was"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2384.89,"endTime":2387.71,"body":"favored by local Japanese"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2387.71,"endTime":2391.58,"body":"religious studies scholars. So"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2387.71,"endTime":2391.58,"body":"along with recent work like Mike"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2391.58,"endTime":2395.45,"body":"Graziano's great new book on"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2391.58,"endTime":2395.45,"body":"religion in the CIA, my research"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2395.45,"endTime":2398.87,"body":"has shown that when policymakers"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2395.45,"endTime":2398.87,"body":"imagine causal relationships"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2398.87,"endTime":2403.85,"body":"between religion in geography,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2398.87,"endTime":2403.85,"body":"and race and ethnicity, they"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2403.85,"endTime":2407.96,"body":"make decisions that oversimplify"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2403.85,"endTime":2407.96,"body":"very complex phenomena. So in"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2407.96,"endTime":2411.53,"body":"the case of the occupation, the"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2407.96,"endTime":2411.53,"body":"Americans made United States"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2411.53,"endTime":2414.56,"body":"religion and politics appear"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2411.53,"endTime":2414.56,"body":"normal and natural, while"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2414.56,"endTime":2418.07,"body":"rendering Japanese religion and"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2414.56,"endTime":2418.07,"body":"politics as weird. That's a"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2418.07,"endTime":2421.49,"body":"pattern that the US has repeated"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2418.07,"endTime":2421.49,"body":"time and again since, with"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2421.49,"endTime":2424.22,"body":"really devastating effects for"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2421.49,"endTime":2424.22,"body":"lots of different populations,"},{"speaker":"Dr. Jolyon Thomas","startTime":2424.22,"endTime":2425.87,"body":"both domestically and abroad."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2428.57,"endTime":2431.18,"body":"What I hear Dr."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2428.57,"endTime":2431.18,"body":"Thomas saying, is thinking about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2431.18,"endTime":2435.83,"body":"Shinto as indigenous is limited."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2431.18,"endTime":2435.83,"body":"It's not the whole story. What I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2435.83,"endTime":2438.65,"body":"hear him saying, A.) is that the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2435.83,"endTime":2438.65,"body":"textbook that I assigned a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2438.65,"endTime":2442.34,"body":"million years ago and have been"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2438.65,"endTime":2442.34,"body":"using ever since, is uhhh..."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2442.37,"endTime":2446.66,"body":"wrong. *laughs* And that we want"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2442.37,"endTime":2446.66,"body":"to take seriously the imperial"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2446.66,"endTime":2450.23,"body":"contours of how Shinto gets read"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2446.66,"endTime":2450.23,"body":"as indigenous in the first"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2450.23,"endTime":2457.01,"body":"place. What are the stakes in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2450.23,"endTime":2457.01,"body":"claiming indigeneity for Shinto,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2457.61,"endTime":2460.97,"body":"and why we should care! And if"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2457.61,"endTime":2460.97,"body":"we're thinking about big picture"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2460.97,"endTime":2464.06,"body":"issues, like how does world"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2460.97,"endTime":2464.06,"body":"religions even work, then Shinto"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2464.06,"endTime":2466.85,"body":"seems like a place that we see"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2464.06,"endTime":2466.85,"body":"claims of indigeneity tied up"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2466.85,"endTime":2469.85,"body":"with nationalism and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2466.85,"endTime":2469.85,"body":"ethnocentrism, and yes, quote"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2469.85,"endTime":2472.58,"body":"unquote, \"worl--\" \"real world"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2469.85,"endTime":2472.58,"body":"religions\" like Buddhism."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2472.87,"endTime":2474.76,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2472.87,"endTime":2474.76,"body":"all of that. I think that Dr."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2474.76,"endTime":2478.42,"body":"Thomas is pushing us to hear"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2474.76,"endTime":2478.42,"body":"that this stuff is complicated,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2478.45,"endTime":2482.62,"body":"and the stakes aren't as cute as"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2478.45,"endTime":2482.62,"body":"labeling. This isn't just, \"What"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2482.62,"endTime":2486.37,"body":"list might this go on?\" It's,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2482.62,"endTime":2486.37,"body":"\"Here's how we're making claims"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2486.37,"endTime":2489.7,"body":"about belonging, identity,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2486.37,"endTime":2489.7,"body":"nationalism, empire.\" So this is"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2489.7,"endTime":2492.22,"body":"anything but, like, simplistic"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2489.7,"endTime":2492.22,"body":"list making."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2492.37,"endTime":2492.82,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2493.02,"endTime":2494.61,"body":"And"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2493.02,"endTime":2494.61,"body":"I'm really appreciative of that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2494.61,"endTime":2498.09,"body":"intervention for us, Goodwin. I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2494.61,"endTime":2498.09,"body":"think that I want to talk to our"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2498.09,"endTime":2501.96,"body":"listeners more about the what of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2498.09,"endTime":2501.96,"body":"Shinto so that when they put"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2501.96,"endTime":2504.96,"body":"their laundry away, they can"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2501.96,"endTime":2504.96,"body":"say, \"Huh! Indigenous religions"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2504.96,"endTime":2507.51,"body":"is more complicated than we"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2504.96,"endTime":2507.51,"body":"thought!\" And two, \"Here's a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2507.51,"endTime":2509.88,"body":"thing I learned about Shinto,\""},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2507.51,"endTime":2509.88,"body":"which I'm assuming most of our"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2509.88,"endTime":2512.28,"body":"nerds have not thought about"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2509.88,"endTime":2512.28,"body":"critically before."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2512.64,"endTime":2515.28,"body":"Yes! I love when"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2512.64,"endTime":2515.28,"body":"we learn things, especially when"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2515.28,"endTime":2516.09,"body":"we're putting away laundry."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2517.56,"endTime":2518.4,"body":"That's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2517.56,"endTime":2518.4,"body":"what I do when I listen to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2518.4,"endTime":2520.83,"body":"podcasts, so I just assume"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2518.4,"endTime":2520.83,"body":"that's what everyone does when"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2520.83,"endTime":2523.77,"body":"they listen to podcasts. Dishes"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2520.83,"endTime":2523.77,"body":"and laundry."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2524.07,"endTime":2525.96,"body":"I don't ever"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2524.07,"endTime":2525.96,"body":"actually put laundry away. I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2525.96,"endTime":2529.62,"body":"don't think that's real either."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2525.96,"endTime":2529.62,"body":"But it's a neat fantasy, and I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2529.62,"endTime":2530.67,"body":"love it when we learn things."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2531.27,"endTime":2532.29,"body":"Alright,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2531.27,"endTime":2532.29,"body":"well, let's learn some things"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2532.29,"endTime":2532.92,"body":"about Shinto."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2533.04,"endTime":2533.4,"body":"Okay!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2534.62,"endTime":2537.23,"body":"In"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2534.62,"endTime":2537.23,"body":"Shinto, there are shrines in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2537.23,"endTime":2540.56,"body":"public spaces, like out in the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2537.23,"endTime":2540.56,"body":"world, and private spaces, like"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2540.59,"endTime":2546.41,"body":"homes. So, everywhere! Most"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2540.59,"endTime":2546.41,"body":"practitioners, particularly in"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2546.41,"endTime":2550.22,"body":"Japan, engage in some Shinto"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2546.41,"endTime":2550.22,"body":"practices, in part because"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2550.22,"endTime":2553.88,"body":"they've become so entwined with"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2550.22,"endTime":2553.88,"body":"mainline Buddhist practices and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2553.88,"endTime":2556.85,"body":"in part because these are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2553.88,"endTime":2556.85,"body":"expressly and perhaps uniquely"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2556.85,"endTime":2560.72,"body":"Japanese ways of engaging with"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2556.85,"endTime":2560.72,"body":"the world and yet,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2560.75,"endTime":2564.26,"body":"interestingly, very few Shinto"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2560.75,"endTime":2564.26,"body":"practitioners would call"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2564.26,"endTime":2565.85,"body":"themselves religious."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2566.2,"endTime":2569.83,"body":"Yeah, very true."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2566.2,"endTime":2569.83,"body":"So like, lots of Japanese people"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2569.83,"endTime":2573.04,"body":"keep a kamidana-- a, like, God"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2569.83,"endTime":2573.04,"body":"shelf, as it's been translated"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2573.04,"endTime":2575.32,"body":"in their houses-- but they"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2573.04,"endTime":2575.32,"body":"will-they will say to you, it's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2575.32,"endTime":2577.39,"body":"like something like 90 plus"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2575.32,"endTime":2577.39,"body":"percent of Japanese people will"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2577.39,"endTime":2579.82,"body":"say, like, \"I'm not religious,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2577.39,"endTime":2579.82,"body":"but yeah, I interact with the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2579.82,"endTime":2584.92,"body":"kami in this way, I make"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2579.82,"endTime":2584.92,"body":"petitions for things to go well,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2585.19,"endTime":2588.76,"body":"I mark seasons, I connect with"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2585.19,"endTime":2588.76,"body":"my ancestors and the spirits of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2588.76,"endTime":2591.16,"body":"this place in these ways.\" But"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2588.76,"endTime":2591.16,"body":"that's not religion, because"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2591.16,"endTime":2596.47,"body":"religion, as you know, is not a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2591.16,"endTime":2596.47,"body":"native term. So it's a moment"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2596.47,"endTime":2600.1,"body":"where \"religion\" and \"religious\""},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2596.47,"endTime":2600.1,"body":"doesn't really capture what"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2600.1,"endTime":2604.36,"body":"folks are actually doing. And"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2600.1,"endTime":2604.36,"body":"when folks do Shinto, often they"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2604.36,"endTime":2608.02,"body":"are doing it without texts or"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2604.36,"endTime":2608.02,"body":"formal institutions, and without"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2608.02,"endTime":2610.12,"body":"calling themselves like,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2608.02,"endTime":2610.12,"body":"Shintoists or something-- god,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2610.12,"endTime":2613.09,"body":"that's terrible. Doing Shinto"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2610.12,"endTime":2613.09,"body":"looks like having a relationship"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2613.09,"endTime":2616.72,"body":"with a kami, which can be"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2613.09,"endTime":2616.72,"body":"casual, can be intense. Dr."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2616.72,"endTime":2621.7,"body":"Thomas talks about it as like a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2616.72,"endTime":2621.7,"body":"just in case, wink, wink, nudge,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2621.7,"endTime":2625.84,"body":"nudge, sort of relationship,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2621.7,"endTime":2625.84,"body":"Like, it can't hurt. It doesn't"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2625.84,"endTime":2628.09,"body":"matter for our purposes here,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2625.84,"endTime":2628.09,"body":"honestly. This is how it gets"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2628.09,"endTime":2629.5,"body":"done, so that's what we're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2628.09,"endTime":2629.5,"body":"talking about!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2630.43,"endTime":2631.9,"body":"Okay,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2630.43,"endTime":2631.9,"body":"so I have another question."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2631.9,"endTime":2631.99,"body":"Okay!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2632.68,"endTime":2635.92,"body":"What"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2632.68,"endTime":2635.92,"body":"are-- what are kami? I know Dr."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2635.92,"endTime":2638.65,"body":"Thomas made mention of these"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2635.92,"endTime":2638.65,"body":"already, we've kind of glossed"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2638.65,"endTime":2641.17,"body":"it, and I feel like this is"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2638.65,"endTime":2641.17,"body":"directly up your alley and you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2641.17,"endTime":2643.72,"body":"won't let me take this part. So"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2641.17,"endTime":2643.72,"body":"why don't YOU take it?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2643.99,"endTime":2646.54,"body":"This is-- it's--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2643.99,"endTime":2646.54,"body":"the stories are so good, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2646.54,"endTime":2650.53,"body":"they're so interesting. I am so"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2646.54,"endTime":2650.53,"body":"glad that you asked me. *secret"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2650.74,"endTime":2656.08,"body":"word of the day* The kami are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2650.74,"endTime":2656.08,"body":"powerful, natural and spiritual"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2656.08,"endTime":2659.02,"body":"forces. And they truly are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2656.08,"endTime":2659.02,"body":"almost countless. There's so"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2659.02,"endTime":2663.34,"body":"many. Most are connected to like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2659.02,"endTime":2663.34,"body":"special places (like forests, or"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2663.34,"endTime":2666.31,"body":"mountains, or waterfalls) but"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2663.34,"endTime":2666.31,"body":"some are connected to like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2666.31,"endTime":2670.36,"body":"natural phenomena (like wind, or"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2666.31,"endTime":2670.36,"body":"thunder, or lightning). And just"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2670.36,"endTime":2672.67,"body":"to complicate things, some kami"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2670.36,"endTime":2672.67,"body":"are associated with like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2672.67,"endTime":2675.73,"body":"ordinary places (like a kitchen,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2672.67,"endTime":2675.73,"body":"or like specific roads, or like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2675.73,"endTime":2679.72,"body":"a given school). Some kami are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2675.73,"endTime":2679.72,"body":"especially influential or"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2679.72,"endTime":2684.4,"body":"successful living people. Like,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2679.72,"endTime":2684.4,"body":"famously, until fairly recently,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2684.4,"endTime":2689.2,"body":"the Japanese emperor was a kami."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2684.4,"endTime":2689.2,"body":"And some are mischievous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2689.26,"endTime":2693.22,"body":"elements (like fox spirits, tree"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2689.26,"endTime":2693.22,"body":"spirits, tanuki, about whom I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2693.22,"endTime":2696.55,"body":"shall talk more later). And I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2693.22,"endTime":2696.55,"body":"assume our listeners are feeling"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2696.58,"endTime":2699.43,"body":"utterly bewildered so I'm going"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2696.58,"endTime":2699.43,"body":"to lay more on, make it worse,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2699.73,"endTime":2700.75,"body":"ehhh, before we make it better!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2701.44,"endTime":2702.37,"body":"That"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2701.44,"endTime":2702.37,"body":"checks out. Keep going."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2702.03,"endTime":2706.11,"body":"*cackles* Shinto"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2702.03,"endTime":2706.11,"body":"is so tied to relationships with"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2706.11,"endTime":2708.63,"body":"the kami-- again, like, it's in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2706.11,"endTime":2708.63,"body":"the name; Shinto is the way of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2708.63,"endTime":2713.34,"body":"the kami. Kami themselves,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2708.63,"endTime":2713.34,"body":"however they appear, are usually"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2713.34,"endTime":2715.98,"body":"pretty chill, especially if you"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2713.34,"endTime":2715.98,"body":"stay in good relationship with"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2715.98,"endTime":2718.95,"body":"them. But like, some are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2715.98,"endTime":2718.95,"body":"tricksters (it will not surprise"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2718.95,"endTime":2720.33,"body":"you to hear that these are my"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2718.95,"endTime":2720.33,"body":"faves)."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2720.42,"endTime":2721.47,"body":"No,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2720.42,"endTime":2721.47,"body":"not at all."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2722.73,"endTime":2724.5,"body":"And the concept"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2722.73,"endTime":2724.5,"body":"here is that the world and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2724.5,"endTime":2728.07,"body":"people are basically good, as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2724.5,"endTime":2728.07,"body":"indigenous religions across the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2728.07,"endTime":2731.52,"body":"board tend to be world"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2728.07,"endTime":2731.52,"body":"affirming. And Shinto does share"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2731.52,"endTime":2735.9,"body":"that characteristic. But some"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2731.52,"endTime":2735.9,"body":"folks (and sometimes some kami"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2735.9,"endTime":2739.14,"body":"themselves) can be led astray"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2735.9,"endTime":2739.14,"body":"by, like, evil spirits. So"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2739.14,"endTime":2743.85,"body":"humans-- that's us-- we need the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2739.14,"endTime":2743.85,"body":"kamis' goodwill for success--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2743.88,"endTime":2745.86,"body":"whatever that might be (so like,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2743.88,"endTime":2745.86,"body":"financial, personal,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2745.86,"endTime":2747.3,"body":"agricultural, etc, etc.)."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2748.32,"endTime":2750.12,"body":"Alright,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2748.32,"endTime":2750.12,"body":"so walk me through what this"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2750.12,"endTime":2752.49,"body":"might look like from a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2750.12,"endTime":2752.49,"body":"practitioner standpoint, if you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2752.49,"endTime":2755.55,"body":"can? If, like you said, there's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2752.49,"endTime":2755.55,"body":"not like, A prayerbook, there's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2755.55,"endTime":2759.81,"body":"not SOME singular, holy text"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2755.55,"endTime":2759.81,"body":"telling me which kami is THE"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2759.81,"endTime":2763.02,"body":"best that I need to prioritize"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2759.81,"endTime":2763.02,"body":"above all others. If I need"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2763.02,"endTime":2764.46,"body":"something, like, wha-- what do I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2763.02,"endTime":2764.46,"body":"do?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2764.93,"endTime":2768.44,"body":"Okay! Well, so"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2764.93,"endTime":2768.44,"body":"kami are specialists. They"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2768.44,"endTime":2771.08,"body":"respond to individual concerns"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2768.44,"endTime":2771.08,"body":"and requests and like as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2771.08,"endTime":2775.31,"body":"individual spirits, their power"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2771.08,"endTime":2775.31,"body":"and their knowledge is limited."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2775.46,"endTime":2777.77,"body":"There's not like a Bible"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2775.46,"endTime":2777.77,"body":"equivalent. But there are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2777.77,"endTime":2781.67,"body":"stories-- like myths and moral"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2777.77,"endTime":2781.67,"body":"tales, and fables and anecdotes"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2782.36,"endTime":2785.39,"body":"(your grandma might have a story"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2782.36,"endTime":2785.39,"body":"about how she interacted with"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2785.39,"endTime":2787.76,"body":"tanuki one time, which is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2785.39,"endTime":2787.76,"body":"guaranteed to be a good story),"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2787.94,"endTime":2790.64,"body":"again, gonna come back to it--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2787.94,"endTime":2790.64,"body":"all of those traditional sets of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2790.64,"endTime":2795.56,"body":"knowledge help inform how"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2790.64,"endTime":2795.56,"body":"individuals do ritual, which is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2795.62,"endTime":2799.13,"body":"a major way folks engage with"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2795.62,"endTime":2799.13,"body":"the kami. Like, doing things"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2799.13,"endTime":2801.89,"body":"ritually is how folks maintain a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2799.13,"endTime":2801.89,"body":"good relationship, and good"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2801.89,"endTime":2805.07,"body":"relationships is what you need"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2801.89,"endTime":2805.07,"body":"to be successful! So in other"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2805.07,"endTime":2807.83,"body":"words, if you, a practitioner,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2805.07,"endTime":2807.83,"body":"are doing ritual and find"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2807.83,"endTime":2810.59,"body":"yourself in harmony with a kami,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2807.83,"endTime":2810.59,"body":"that's the same thing as a good"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2810.59,"endTime":2811.58,"body":"moral practice."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2811.97,"endTime":2812.27,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2812.96,"endTime":2816.08,"body":"But, this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2812.96,"endTime":2816.08,"body":"relationship isn't like, popping"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2816.08,"endTime":2818.78,"body":"into a shrine and saying like,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2816.08,"endTime":2818.78,"body":"\"Hey, yo, kami! What's good? I'm"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2818.78,"endTime":2821.81,"body":"good. Cool, talk to you soon,\""},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2818.78,"endTime":2821.81,"body":"and then going about your day."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2822.47,"endTime":2826.4,"body":"It requires work, especially the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2822.47,"endTime":2826.4,"body":"work of maintaining purity. So"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2826.4,"endTime":2829.37,"body":"you want to eat and drink"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2826.4,"endTime":2829.37,"body":"correctly, demonstrate honesty"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2829.37,"endTime":2832.25,"body":"and courtesy and consideration."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2829.37,"endTime":2832.25,"body":"Usually, when I'm talking about"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2832.25,"endTime":2835.04,"body":"this in class, I talk to my"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2832.25,"endTime":2835.04,"body":"students about the weekend that"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2835.04,"endTime":2838.82,"body":"I spent in Tokyo and how I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2835.04,"endTime":2838.82,"body":"learned to apologize like six"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2838.82,"endTime":2841.82,"body":"different ways, because very"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2838.82,"endTime":2841.82,"body":"concerned about not giving"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2841.82,"endTime":2846.8,"body":"offense to other people (and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2841.82,"endTime":2846.8,"body":"also, I'm just very, very large"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2846.8,"endTime":2847.37,"body":"in Japan)."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2847.37,"endTime":2851.6,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2847.37,"endTime":2851.6,"body":"You're huge in Japan."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2852.11,"endTime":2853.4,"body":"I'm huge in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2852.11,"endTime":2853.4,"body":"Japan!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2853.93,"endTime":2855.4,"body":"Keep"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2853.93,"endTime":2855.4,"body":"going. *laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2855.31,"endTime":2859.57,"body":"Like Tom Waits sa"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2855.31,"endTime":2859.57,"body":"d, I'm big in Japan. Uh, you"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2859.57,"endTime":2862.3,"body":"ee this continuing even i"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2859.57,"endTime":2862.3,"body":"a secularizing, contempor"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2862.3,"endTime":2865.63,"body":"ry Japan, where some folks"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2862.3,"endTime":2865.63,"body":"do Shinto as like a \"just in ca"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2865.63,"endTime":2868.63,"body":"e, wink, wink, nudge, nud"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2865.63,"endTime":2868.63,"body":"e\" religion. It's not that they"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2868.63,"endTime":2871.96,"body":"re super devout, or super pious,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2868.63,"endTime":2871.96,"body":"or even big believers! It's like"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2871.96,"endTime":2875.05,"body":"an insurance policy! Like, it ca"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2871.96,"endTime":2875.05,"body":"'t hurt. Many households, a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2875.05,"endTime":2879.88,"body":"I said, keep a kamidana, or k"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2875.05,"endTime":2879.88,"body":"mi shelf, and if you watch Japan"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2879.88,"endTime":2883.93,"body":"se TV or movies, you w"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2879.88,"endTime":2883.93,"body":"ll definitely see a lot of Shin"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2881.4,"endTime":2893.85,"body":"Yeah!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2881.4,"endTime":2893.85,"body":"Yeah, we watch a lot of Studio"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2883.93,"endTime":2887.59,"body":"o, particularly the torii, that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2883.93,"endTime":2887.59,"body":"arch thing. The red arch. There'"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2887.59,"endTime":2890.83,"body":"even a-- what do you call"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2887.59,"endTime":2890.83,"body":"t? Like, an emoticon"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2893.85,"endTime":2896.28,"body":"Ghibli with our kids so it's a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2893.85,"endTime":2896.28,"body":"whole thing, really. Alright,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2896.31,"endTime":2898.8,"body":"Megan, I think we've been"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2896.31,"endTime":2898.8,"body":"prattling on long enough."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2898.8,"endTime":2899.04,"body":"How dare you."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2898.8,"endTime":2899.04,"body":"*giggles*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2899.04,"endTime":2900.15,"body":"Do you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2899.04,"endTime":2900.15,"body":"care to sum up?"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2901.35,"endTime":2904.29,"body":"Sure, I guess."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2901.35,"endTime":2904.29,"body":"Enough. What does that even look"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2904.29,"endTime":2907.65,"body":"like? Alright, so the category"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2904.29,"endTime":2907.65,"body":"of Native or Indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2907.65,"endTime":2910.92,"body":"religions is both problematic--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2907.65,"endTime":2910.92,"body":"because look at all the people"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2910.92,"endTime":2914.46,"body":"the world over we're lumping in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2910.92,"endTime":2914.46,"body":"here-- but the category of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2914.46,"endTime":2917.76,"body":"Indigenous or Native is also"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2914.46,"endTime":2917.76,"body":"helpful as we think about all"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2917.76,"endTime":2920.4,"body":"the people in the world who,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2917.76,"endTime":2920.4,"body":"without it, get left out"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2920.4,"endTime":2924.45,"body":"entirely! In short, this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2920.4,"endTime":2924.45,"body":"category is wildly imperfect,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2924.81,"endTime":2927.72,"body":"and its imperfection shows us"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2924.81,"endTime":2927.72,"body":"how complicated \"religion\" and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2927.72,"endTime":2929.64,"body":"\"world\" religion is."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2930.03,"endTime":2930.69,"body":"Check."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2931.47,"endTime":2935.19,"body":"Alright. Shinto"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2931.47,"endTime":2935.19,"body":"is one of those, \"is it or isn't"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2935.19,"endTime":2938.55,"body":"it\" labels. We're putting in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2935.19,"endTime":2938.55,"body":"here as part of our indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2938.55,"endTime":2941.22,"body":"religion set of episodes. Dr."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2938.55,"endTime":2941.22,"body":"Thomas encouraged us to think"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2941.22,"endTime":2945.87,"body":"more critically about who uses"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2941.22,"endTime":2945.87,"body":"this term to describe"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2945.9,"endTime":2950.16,"body":"traditions. These labels are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2945.9,"endTime":2950.16,"body":"(shocking nary a listener)"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2950.73,"endTime":2951.3,"body":"political."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2952.47,"endTime":2953.04,"body":"Check!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2954.53,"endTime":2957.11,"body":"Third and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2954.53,"endTime":2957.11,"body":"finally, Shinto is a group of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2957.11,"endTime":2960.14,"body":"practices that we might want to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2957.11,"endTime":2960.14,"body":"see people know more about--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2960.17,"endTime":2963.56,"body":"it's old! It's in pop culture,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2960.17,"endTime":2963.56,"body":"it's identity marking, it's tied"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2963.56,"endTime":2966.23,"body":"to Empire (because of course it"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2963.56,"endTime":2966.23,"body":"is), it's political! It's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2966.23,"endTime":2968.9,"body":"practical, it is... all the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2966.23,"endTime":2968.9,"body":"things."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2969.14,"endTime":2972.32,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2969.14,"endTime":2972.32,"body":"I love that. Which brings us"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2972.32,"endTime":2974.36,"body":"to... A Little Bit, Leave It."},{"speaker":"A Little Bit Leave It","startTime":2977.24,"endTime":2977.87,"body":"*Little"},{"speaker":"A Little Bit Leave It","startTime":2977.24,"endTime":2977.87,"body":"Bit Leave It*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2981.32,"endTime":2982.31,"body":"In A"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2981.32,"endTime":2982.31,"body":"Little Bit, Leave It, we're"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2982.31,"endTime":2984.53,"body":"letting you know what WE think"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2982.31,"endTime":2984.53,"body":"is the most important, most"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2984.53,"endTime":2988.49,"body":"interesting, or most challenging"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2984.53,"endTime":2988.49,"body":"part of the topic is-- it's a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":2988.49,"endTime":2989.78,"body":"little bit to leave you with!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2990.2,"endTime":2992.96,"body":"In this segment,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2990.2,"endTime":2992.96,"body":"we are telling you why you care"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2992.96,"endTime":2996.2,"body":"about world religions and, this"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2992.96,"endTime":2996.2,"body":"time, Indigenous religions-- as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2996.2,"endTime":2999.11,"body":"content, as ideas, or as"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2996.2,"endTime":2999.11,"body":"evidence as to why the \"world"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2999.11,"endTime":3002.2,"body":"religions\" model just falls"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":2999.11,"endTime":3002.2,"body":"short. For my part, second"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3002.2,"endTime":3005.65,"body":"verse, same as the first. If"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3002.2,"endTime":3005.65,"body":"your understanding of religion"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3005.68,"endTime":3008.53,"body":"doesn't include or center"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3005.68,"endTime":3008.53,"body":"Indigenous religions, it is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3008.56,"endTime":3013.93,"body":"incomplete and incorrect. Thank"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3008.56,"endTime":3013.93,"body":"you, next. I just... all the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3013.93,"endTime":3016.45,"body":"things that we've been saying,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3013.93,"endTime":3016.45,"body":"far too many textbooks, far too"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3016.45,"endTime":3020.35,"body":"many classes, far too many"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3016.45,"endTime":3020.35,"body":"syllabi don't include Indigenous"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3020.35,"endTime":3024.76,"body":"religions in their consideration"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3020.35,"endTime":3024.76,"body":"of what religion is, and that is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3024.76,"endTime":3029.68,"body":"a way of continuing imperialist"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3024.76,"endTime":3029.68,"body":"violence. So, please stop that!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3031.4,"endTime":3033.26,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3031.4,"endTime":3033.26,"body":"Excellent. I don't know how to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3033.26,"endTime":3036.44,"body":"follow that but I'mma try? My"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3033.26,"endTime":3036.44,"body":"little bit leave it's kind of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3036.44,"endTime":3040.19,"body":"simple? Indigenous religions are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3036.44,"endTime":3040.19,"body":"not just North American, nerds"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3040.19,"endTime":3043.34,"body":"who are mostly based in North"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3040.19,"endTime":3043.34,"body":"America, and they don't need to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3043.34,"endTime":3047.09,"body":"be \"pure,\" in quotes, or"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3043.34,"endTime":3047.09,"body":"\"without influence\" in order to"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3047.09,"endTime":3049.64,"body":"be legit. Religion is what"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3047.09,"endTime":3049.64,"body":"people do. And I think that"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3049.64,"endTime":3053.03,"body":"that's really important to hear"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3049.64,"endTime":3053.03,"body":"both the legacies of, say,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3053.06,"endTime":3057.05,"body":"British imperialism, in, say,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3053.06,"endTime":3057.05,"body":"India's treatment-- ongoing,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3057.05,"endTime":3060.26,"body":"contemporary treatment-- of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3057.05,"endTime":3060.26,"body":"\"tribals,\" in quotes (it's a"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3060.26,"endTime":3064.25,"body":"legal category again), or"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3060.26,"endTime":3064.25,"body":"Adivasis, as well as the ongoing"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3064.25,"endTime":3067.94,"body":"internal pseudo-imperialism,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3064.25,"endTime":3067.94,"body":"definite-bias, horrific"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3067.94,"endTime":3073.04,"body":"violence, against Adivasis from"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3067.94,"endTime":3073.04,"body":"mainline, casted Hindus. Both of"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3073.04,"endTime":3076.97,"body":"the British"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3073.04,"endTime":3076.97,"body":"imperialism and the ongoing,"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3077.12,"endTime":3082.22,"body":"mainline casted Hindu abuse of"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3077.12,"endTime":3082.22,"body":"tribal communities in India."},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3082.43,"endTime":3084.86,"body":"They both tell us something"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3082.43,"endTime":3084.86,"body":"about the ability to practice"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3084.86,"endTime":3088.34,"body":"distinctive, local cultures as"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3084.86,"endTime":3088.34,"body":"well as those cultures"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3088.34,"endTime":3093.08,"body":"relationships to power, whether"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3088.34,"endTime":3093.08,"body":"that's imperial power or, for"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3093.08,"endTime":3095.81,"body":"local communities, indigenous"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3093.08,"endTime":3095.81,"body":"communities, Native communities,"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3095.81,"endTime":3099.62,"body":"to cultivate and wield power (as"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3095.81,"endTime":3099.62,"body":"is some movements, like among"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3099.62,"endTime":3102.98,"body":"the Naga of northeastern India"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3099.62,"endTime":3102.98,"body":"or northwestern Myanmar). So I'm"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3102.98,"endTime":3105.92,"body":"just trying to globalize us some"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3102.98,"endTime":3105.92,"body":"more, confuse our nerds in the"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3105.92,"endTime":3109.94,"body":"last minute, because that seems"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3105.92,"endTime":3109.94,"body":"important. It's not as simple as"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3109.94,"endTime":3114.44,"body":"even we've tried to make it in"},{"speaker":"those matter","startTime":3109.94,"endTime":3114.44,"body":"like, what, an hour? Jesus."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3114.44,"endTime":3117.89,"body":"*laughs* Again, I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3114.44,"endTime":3117.89,"body":"keep telling you, time is fake."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3118.74,"endTime":3119.97,"body":"Well,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3118.74,"endTime":3119.97,"body":"if you don't know, now you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3119.97,"endTime":3120.39,"body":"know--"},{"speaker":"If You Don't Know, Now You Know","startTime":3120.99,"endTime":3122.67,"body":"*If"},{"speaker":"If You Don't Know, Now You Know","startTime":3120.99,"endTime":3122.67,"body":"You Don't Know, Now You Know*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3122.67,"endTime":3124.17,"body":"--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3122.67,"endTime":3124.17,"body":"this is the segment where we get"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3124.17,"endTime":3128.04,"body":"one factoid. Favorite fun fact"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3124.17,"endTime":3128.04,"body":"we couldn't squeeze in about"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3128.04,"endTime":3130.74,"body":"indigenous religions in the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3128.04,"endTime":3130.74,"body":"whole world, Goodwin. It's your"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3130.74,"endTime":3131.82,"body":"turn-- take it away."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3132.3,"endTime":3136.86,"body":"Tanuki!! I love"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3132.3,"endTime":3136.86,"body":"them so much. So, they are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3137.01,"endTime":3144.24,"body":"raccoon... dogs? Slash, uh, kind"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3137.01,"endTime":3144.24,"body":"of badger... type... things? The"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3144.24,"endTime":3148.29,"body":"reason I'm bringing them up is"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3144.24,"endTime":3148.29,"body":"because Tanuki are also"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3148.29,"endTime":3153.63,"body":"sometimes manifestation of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3148.29,"endTime":3153.63,"body":"trickster kami spirits? And the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3153.63,"endTime":3155.76,"body":"reason that I love them is 1.)"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3153.63,"endTime":3155.76,"body":"because you know I love a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3155.76,"endTime":3158.34,"body":"trickster, but 2.) they're"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3155.76,"endTime":3158.34,"body":"hilarious and they have giant"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3158.34,"endTime":3158.82,"body":"balls."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3160.32,"endTime":3160.95,"body":"I-I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3160.32,"endTime":3160.95,"body":"sorry, what?! *laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3161.97,"endTime":3163.02,"body":"They have giant"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3161.97,"endTime":3163.02,"body":"testicles."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3163.68,"endTime":3163.71,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3165.06,"endTime":3168.9,"body":"So if you go to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3165.06,"endTime":3168.9,"body":"Shinto shrines were Tanuki are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3168.96,"endTime":3173.82,"body":"being, uh... acknowledged,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3168.96,"endTime":3173.82,"body":"and-and built relationships"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3173.82,"endTime":3177.09,"body":"with, the statues are raccoon"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3173.82,"endTime":3177.09,"body":"dogs with giant balls, and I"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3177.09,"endTime":3177.87,"body":"think that's funny."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3181.11,"endTime":3181.23,"body":"*laughs*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3181.11,"endTime":3181.23,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3181.23,"endTime":3181.44,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"If You Don't Know, Now You Know","startTime":3183.33,"endTime":3185.25,"body":"*If"},{"speaker":"If You Don't Know, Now You Know","startTime":3183.33,"endTime":3185.25,"body":"You Don't Know, Now You Know*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3185.31,"endTime":3187.02,"body":"Don't"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3185.31,"endTime":3187.02,"body":"pack up yet, nerds. It's time"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3187.02,"endTime":3187.8,"body":"for homework! *laughs*"},{"speaker":"Simpsons","startTime":3187.8,"endTime":3190.26,"body":"*What Homework??*"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3191.34,"endTime":3192.87,"body":"As"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3191.34,"endTime":3192.87,"body":"always, you've got citations,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3192.87,"endTime":3195.51,"body":"references and other goodies,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3192.87,"endTime":3195.51,"body":"and transcripts stashed at"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3195.51,"endTime":3198.33,"body":"keepingit101.com for every"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3195.51,"endTime":3198.33,"body":"single episode, so check it out."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3198.33,"endTime":3201.66,"body":"Listen, I said last time, I'm"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3198.33,"endTime":3201.66,"body":"going to say it again-- the"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3201.66,"endTime":3206.28,"body":"homeworks for these episodes are"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3201.66,"endTime":3206.28,"body":"going to be robust. So, if you--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3206.28,"endTime":3209.97,"body":"I'm not the boss of your fast"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3206.28,"endTime":3209.97,"body":"forward button, but even if"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3209.97,"endTime":3212.25,"body":"you're fast forwarding through,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3209.97,"endTime":3212.25,"body":"I really do urge you to go check"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3212.25,"endTime":3215.49,"body":"out what we've got stashed-- but"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3212.25,"endTime":3215.49,"body":"not yet. Don't fast forward yet."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3215.49,"endTime":3216.96,"body":"Megan's got a good list. Go"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3215.49,"endTime":3216.96,"body":"ahead."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3217.02,"endTime":3219.45,"body":"I do have a good"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3217.02,"endTime":3219.45,"body":"list! I have the honor of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3219.45,"endTime":3223.74,"body":"telling y'all what Dr. Jolyon"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3219.45,"endTime":3223.74,"body":"Thomas has suggested that we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3223.74,"endTime":3226.5,"body":"read! So we're just gonna"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3223.74,"endTime":3226.5,"body":"honestly just link to his"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3226.5,"endTime":3229.32,"body":"website. He has talks, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3226.5,"endTime":3229.32,"body":"podcasts, and articles, and we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3229.32,"endTime":3232.35,"body":"just adore him and his work, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3229.32,"endTime":3232.35,"body":"he's super smart. He was also a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3232.38,"endTime":3236.97,"body":"2021 Public Scholarship Fellow"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3232.38,"endTime":3236.97,"body":"with Sacred Writes, but here are"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3236.97,"endTime":3239.91,"body":"the major pieces of writing we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3236.97,"endTime":3239.91,"body":"think you need in your brains."},{"speaker":"So, \"Drawing on Tradition","startTime":3240.21,"endTime":3243.99,"body":"Manga, Anime, and Religion in"},{"speaker":"So, \"Drawing on Tradition","startTime":3243.99,"endTime":3248.55,"body":"Contemporary Japan;\" \"Faking"},{"speaker":"So, \"Drawing on Tradition","startTime":3243.99,"endTime":3248.55,"body":"Liberties: Religious Freedom in"},{"speaker":"So, \"Drawing on Tradition","startTime":3248.58,"endTime":3251.73,"body":"American-Occupied Japan,\" which"},{"speaker":"So, \"Drawing on Tradition","startTime":3248.58,"endTime":3251.73,"body":"was Dr. Thomas's book, which I"},{"speaker":"So, \"Drawing on Tradition","startTime":3251.73,"endTime":3253.95,"body":"believe won an AR Book Award--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3253.98,"endTime":3255.75,"body":"Sure"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3253.98,"endTime":3255.75,"body":"did. It's a great book."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3255.81,"endTime":3259.05,"body":"It's so good. Um,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3255.81,"endTime":3259.05,"body":"\"Why Scholars of Religion Must"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3259.05,"endTime":3262.41,"body":"Investigate the Corporate Form,\""},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3259.05,"endTime":3262.41,"body":"which was co-authored with Levi"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3262.41,"endTime":3266.52,"body":"McLaughlin, Aike-- I don't know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3262.41,"endTime":3266.52,"body":"how to say her name-- P. Rots,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3266.58,"endTime":3271.32,"body":"and Chika Watanabe, which was in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3266.58,"endTime":3271.32,"body":"the JAR (highly recommended,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3271.98,"endTime":3275.19,"body":"really, really smart); and then"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3271.98,"endTime":3275.19,"body":"\"The Buddhist Virtues of Raging"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3275.19,"endTime":3277.68,"body":"Lust and Crass Materialism in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3275.19,"endTime":3277.68,"body":"Contemporary Japan.\" I mean,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3278.16,"endTime":3280.95,"body":"that's-that's a great title. And"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3278.16,"endTime":3280.95,"body":"that's in Material Religion,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3280.95,"endTime":3284.13,"body":"we'll link you to that as well."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3280.95,"endTime":3284.13,"body":"And then on Shinto specifically,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3284.16,"endTime":3287.16,"body":"\"What is Shinto?\" This is a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3284.16,"endTime":3287.16,"body":"great, short, public-facing"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3287.16,"endTime":3290.91,"body":"piece that I use in my class."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3287.16,"endTime":3290.91,"body":"And, \"Big Questions in the Study"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3290.91,"endTime":3293.73,"body":"of Shinto,\" which is on H-Net"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3290.91,"endTime":3293.73,"body":"Reviews. Very good for teachers"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3293.73,"endTime":3297.27,"body":"to just kind of get a sense of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3293.73,"endTime":3297.27,"body":"the state of the field. I will"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3297.27,"endTime":3299.55,"body":"add only two-- I'm only allowed"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3297.27,"endTime":3299.55,"body":"to have two, it says on the"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3299.55,"endTime":3302.82,"body":"script-- that you should check"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3299.55,"endTime":3302.82,"body":"out the work of Kaitlyn Ugoretz,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3302.85,"endTime":3307.62,"body":"who is a grad student at UCSB"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3302.85,"endTime":3307.62,"body":"and was also a 2021 Sacred Write"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3307.65,"endTime":3311.16,"body":"public scholarship fellow. She"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3307.65,"endTime":3311.16,"body":"did a whole series of videos"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3311.16,"endTime":3314.25,"body":"about Shinto for Religion for"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3311.16,"endTime":3314.25,"body":"Breakfast, which is a fun"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3314.25,"endTime":3319.44,"body":"YouTube series about religion"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3314.25,"endTime":3319.44,"body":"basics. And she also has her own"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3319.44,"endTime":3322.44,"body":"YouTube channel called Eat Pray"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3319.44,"endTime":3322.44,"body":"enemy which you should ALSO"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3322.44,"endTime":3323.85,"body":"check out. The end!"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3324.09,"endTime":3326.04,"body":"Fabulous."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3324.09,"endTime":3326.04,"body":"This is a long ass episode,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3326.04,"endTime":3328.35,"body":"y'all, so I'm gonna keep it"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3326.04,"endTime":3328.35,"body":"short. I'm going to focus on"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3328.35,"endTime":3331.74,"body":"India because, hello?? That's"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3328.35,"endTime":3331.74,"body":"actually where I know things"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3331.74,"endTime":3332.28,"body":"about--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3333.0,"endTime":3334.53,"body":"Yeah. You're gons"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3333.0,"endTime":3334.53,"body":"to talk about India."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3334.32,"endTime":3336.27,"body":"Yeeeeah."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3334.32,"endTime":3336.27,"body":"Okay. So, there's a Pew study of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3335.56,"endTime":3367.3,"body":"So cute. They're just--"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3336.27,"endTime":3338.94,"body":"religion in India that's okay,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3336.27,"endTime":3338.94,"body":"it came out pretty recently."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3338.94,"endTime":3342.06,"body":"It's worth looking at if you"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3338.94,"endTime":3342.06,"body":"want some data on things that I"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3342.06,"endTime":3344.76,"body":"talked about, like scheduled"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3342.06,"endTime":3344.76,"body":"castes and tribes, and I'm going"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3344.76,"endTime":3348.69,"body":"to link it in the show notes, of"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3344.76,"endTime":3348.69,"body":"course. I will absolutely name"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3348.72,"endTime":3354.51,"body":"out loud that you want to read"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3348.72,"endTime":3354.51,"body":"Kanato Chophy's \"Constructing th"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3354.51,"endTime":3357.69,"body":"Religion and World View"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3354.51,"endTime":3357.69,"body":"of a Naga Tribe in North-East I"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3357.69,"endTime":3362.58,"body":"dia,\" which was recently out. Na"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3357.69,"endTime":3362.58,"body":"rata Goswami, \"The Naga ethic--\""},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3362.58,"endTime":3365.85,"body":"sorry, \"The Naga Ethnic Moveme"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3362.58,"endTime":3365.85,"body":"t for a Separate Homeland: Sto"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3365.85,"endTime":3370.05,"body":"ies from the Field,\" which w"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3365.85,"endTime":3370.05,"body":"s just out last year. Super g"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3369.46,"endTime":3378.13,"body":"He loves it."},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3370.05,"endTime":3375.3,"body":"eat, lots of really intense ethn"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3370.05,"endTime":3375.3,"body":"graphic work. And finally,"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3375.3,"endTime":3378.57,"body":"m, I guess I'll point you t"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3375.3,"endTime":3378.57,"body":"an independent journalist outle"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3378.57,"endTime":3383.34,"body":"called scroll.in, it's Scroll I"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3378.57,"endTime":3383.34,"body":"dia. They have a series on"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3383.34,"endTime":3391.23,"body":"\"tribal rights,\" in quotes. The"},{"speaker":" Divine","startTime":3383.34,"endTime":3391.23,"body":"'re following abuses of Adavas"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3384.37,"endTime":3465.1,"body":"They're just nice"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3384.37,"endTime":3465.1,"body":"movies. Yeah. Big thanks to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3391.23,"endTime":3395.58,"body":"s and uncasted, or Dalit, co"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3391.23,"endTime":3395.58,"body":"munities. And so, under that"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3395.58,"endTime":3399.42,"body":"like tag, there's quite a lot t"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3395.58,"endTime":3399.42,"body":"read about. Some of it has to"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3399.42,"endTime":3402.75,"body":"do with issues of religion a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3399.42,"endTime":3402.75,"body":"d issues of being included in"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3402.9,"endTime":3404.76,"body":"ainline Hinduism, but I want"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3402.9,"endTime":3404.76,"body":"to give you all a trigger war"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3404.76,"endTime":3408.06,"body":"ing before I just put that on t"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3404.76,"endTime":3408.06,"body":"e internet: quite a lot o"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3408.06,"endTime":3413.34,"body":"these news items contain sexua"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3408.06,"endTime":3413.34,"body":"violence, sexual violence a"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3413.34,"endTime":3416.25,"body":"ainst minors, and murder--"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3413.34,"endTime":3416.25,"body":"since many of these attacks tha"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3416.25,"endTime":3420.54,"body":"make the headlines are-ar"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3416.25,"endTime":3420.54,"body":"just, are brutal in nature. S"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3420.54,"endTime":3423.03,"body":"I want to highlight that bec"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3420.54,"endTime":3423.03,"body":"use it's independent jour"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3423.03,"endTime":3425.79,"body":"alism from India and usually b"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3423.03,"endTime":3425.79,"body":"Indians, and they've got more t"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3425.79,"endTime":3431.61,"body":"an you could possibly want f"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3425.79,"endTime":3431.61,"body":"r really contemporary, like curr"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3431.61,"endTime":3434.82,"body":"nt event stuff. Oh! And last"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3431.61,"endTime":3434.82,"body":"hing, I swear, our family favori"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3434.82,"endTime":3437.01,"body":"e things about Shinto are oldi"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3434.82,"endTime":3437.01,"body":"s but goodies but if you miss"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3437.01,"endTime":3441.12,"body":"d this cultural moment and have"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3437.01,"endTime":3441.12,"body":"BO Max, do check out Studio G"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3441.12,"endTime":3445.62,"body":"ibli's hub and especially \"Spiri"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3441.12,"endTime":3445.62,"body":"ed Away,\" (2001) film-- it's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3445.65,"endTime":3449.16,"body":"Miyazaki classic that draws h"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3445.65,"endTime":3449.16,"body":"avily on Shinto imagery. Many of"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3449.16,"endTime":3453.21,"body":"you teach that when you teac"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3449.16,"endTime":3453.21,"body":"about Asian religions. And my"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3453.21,"endTime":3456.48,"body":"our year old would legit freak o"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3453.21,"endTime":3456.48,"body":"t if I didn't mention th"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3456.48,"endTime":3458.94,"body":"ever popular and his personal"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3456.48,"endTime":3458.94,"body":"avorite, \"My Nei"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3465.1,"endTime":3467.98,"body":"those of you writing reviews on"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3465.1,"endTime":3467.98,"body":"iTunes, Spotify, Amazon and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3467.98,"endTime":3471.94,"body":"Google-- it really helps! So our"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3467.98,"endTime":3471.94,"body":"Nerds of the Week-- those few we"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3471.94,"endTime":3475.0,"body":"want to shout out and send some"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3471.94,"endTime":3475.0,"body":"love just directly to-- are:"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3475.03,"endTime":3481.54,"body":"BabaKristian (hey, I know him!),"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3475.03,"endTime":3481.54,"body":"Nik5579-- truly an unreadable"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3481.54,"endTime":3483.61,"body":"string of emojis we're just"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3481.54,"endTime":3483.61,"body":"gonna put on the interwebs; it's"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3483.61,"endTime":3488.08,"body":"like, star eyes, blue face"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3483.61,"endTime":3488.08,"body":"*gasps* face, okay sign, heart"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3488.08,"endTime":3491.89,"body":"smile-- AND, The Fandom Menace."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3488.08,"endTime":3491.89,"body":"And I love that one best of all"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3491.89,"endTime":3495.73,"body":"because it's both reviewing us"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3491.89,"endTime":3495.73,"body":"and trolling Ilyse because she"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3495.73,"endTime":3496.3,"body":"hates Star Wars."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3497.62,"endTime":3500.62,"body":"Thanks,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3497.62,"endTime":3500.62,"body":"nerds! Join us next time for"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3500.62,"endTime":3503.26,"body":"more HISTORY OF THE WORLD"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3500.62,"endTime":3503.26,"body":"RELIGIONS, PART I, when we chat"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3503.26,"endTime":3506.35,"body":"more about Indigenous religions,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3503.26,"endTime":3506.35,"body":"and are helped out to do so by"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3506.35,"endTime":3508.21,"body":"our rad guest, Dr. Abel Gomez."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3508.33,"endTime":3510.82,"body":"Yay! I love him!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3508.33,"endTime":3510.82,"body":"Shoutout to our research"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3510.82,"endTime":3513.49,"body":"assistant, Alex Castellano,"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3510.82,"endTime":3513.49,"body":"whose transcription work makes"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3513.49,"endTime":3516.91,"body":"this pod accessible, and"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3513.49,"endTime":3516.91,"body":"therefore, awesome! Need more"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3516.91,"endTime":3519.7,"body":"religion nerderie? You know"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3516.91,"endTime":3519.7,"body":"where to find us! Twitter. The"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3519.7,"endTime":3520.36,"body":"answer is Twitter."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3520.78,"endTime":3522.01,"body":"You"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3520.78,"endTime":3522.01,"body":"can find Megan on Twitter"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3522.19,"endTime":3531.4,"body":"@mpgPhD, and me @ProfIRMF, or"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3522.19,"endTime":3531.4,"body":"the show @KeepingIt_101. Find"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3531.4,"endTime":3535.12,"body":"the website at keepingit101.com."},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3531.4,"endTime":3535.12,"body":"Peep the Insta, if you feel like"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3535.12,"endTime":3538.33,"body":"it, drop us a rating or review"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3535.12,"endTime":3538.33,"body":"in your podcatcher of choice and"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3538.33,"endTime":3541.93,"body":"be a Nerd of the Week! You know,"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3538.33,"endTime":3541.93,"body":"maybe! And with that-- peace"},{"speaker":"Ilyse Morgenstein Fuerst","startTime":3541.93,"endTime":3542.8,"body":"out, nerds."},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3542.98,"endTime":3544.96,"body":"Do your homework!"},{"speaker":"Megan Goodwin","startTime":3542.98,"endTime":3544.96,"body":"It's on the syllabus."},{"speaker":"Bonus Ending","startTime":3582.82,"endTime":3583.03,"body":"*Totoro theme"},{"speaker":"Bonus Ending","startTime":3582.82,"endTime":3583.03,"body":"song*"}]}