Money Is Neutral, Value Is Chosen with Linda Hunt

We explore how to price with clarity, sell outcomes with confidence, and rebuild a healthy relationship with money so your business supports your life. Linda Hunt shares a simple pricing formula, mindset tools, and ways to lead without apology.

• Money as neutral mirror and relationship
• Minimum aligned price to stop burnout
• Packages that sell results not hours
• Counting non‑billable time and time off
• Speaking with authority through process and clarity
• Evolving your ideal client and niching
• Journaling to unwind money stories
• Peace as proof of alignment and worth
• Boundaries that protect quality and energy

Connect with Linda below:

https://www.sumsolutions.com/

She also has a book coming out! 

Are you ready to streamline your business and elevate your client experience? Right now you can get 30% off with my discount code: https://share.honeybook.com/shannastar

You can try Pic Time for free with my code and get an extra free month when you upgrade to a paid plan: head to the notes and click the link to start your beautiful galleries today

https://davistaphotography.pic-time.com/referral

Transcript

Welcome And Why Linda Matters

Shanna Star 0:07

Hello, all you fabulous people, and welcome back to the Shine Podcast. I'm your host, Shauna Star. Now I know every single guest that I have is so wonderful and fabulous, and I learn a lot. But today, Linda Hunt has been just monumental in the conversations that have come after the conversation with her, and she doesn't even realize this. But she spoke some life and words into me about things forthcoming in my life around money and business and what I should be doing. And so before I start this conversation with her, I just want to say thank you to her because it means more than she knows. I've had multiple conversations after of the words that she breathed life into me have now changed some trajectory of how I am handling some business in the future. So thank you, Linda. Aside from having incredible discernment and the gifts of seeing something in others that we might not see, she is also the founder of Some Solutions and the author of the forthcoming book, Money Conversation. Speak the Truth, Set the Standard, Get Paid Without Apology. She has a background in corporate and an early pioneer of remote accounting services. She brings decades of financial and operational expertise paired with a deep understanding of how structured clarity and the nervous system capacity shape sustainable business success. Yes, we are going to be diving into a few more things all around finances. But this is not just a normal conversation. We're going to speak about why entrepreneurs wobble in these conversations, why setting your prices is also a nervous system and not just using the spreadsheets and numbers, although those are important. And also what we can do to speak with authority and lead with authority. I'm so excited for you to hear this conversation with her. She has the most wonderful, soothing, amazing voice. So let's get right to the conversation. Welcome, Linda, to the Shine Podcast. I'm so excited to have you here. And we've been connecting already. So lovely to see your face.

SPEAKER_01 2:09

Same here. Thank you so much for having me. I'm super excited to be here and talk about my favorite subject, which is money, which I'm learning is also yours.

Shanna Star 2:18

Yes. I did not know that until the last few, I'd say eight years, where I found I have a real passion for it. Um, even when I had absolutely zero, I still had that passion for it as I was learning. So I'm excited to chat. All things money. Same here.

SPEAKER_01 2:33

I I think when we have um so money uh is a mirror, right, of ourselves. And we all have struggles. You know, some of them show up in relationships, some of them show up for money. For me, it was through money. And I think that when we learn and we get through that trauma, like we just want to share that with somebody else and say, hey, here's what I went through. Hopefully you won't have to either.

Shanna Star 2:57

So right, yeah. And in mine came from somebody an interesting place. I was previously married and he took care of the money. And then when we got divorced, it was like, oh shoot, I need to learn money. Uh and he handled it well, but I needed to learn to handle it well. And once I started learning it, I was like, this is actually fun. Um and more fun as it grows, of course. Of course, of course.

SPEAKER_01 3:19

Yeah, it's all about being in relationship with money. Money is has a neutral energy, and it's all about being in relationship and trusting the flow of money.

Shanna Star 3:30

And that's especially, I feel like 2025 has and was a tricky year for a lot of people. Yes. And it didn't flow as naturally as it has in the past for many businesses, including my own. It was a little bit lower than I expected. And um, so it's good to then look back and see it's neutral. But what did that money do for me that I can say, it was good. These are the things I was able to do.

SPEAKER_01 3:54

Right. Acknowledging it, right? It likes to be in partnership with us. And you're absolutely right. Business this past year was it's just unpredictable, it's unpredictable. And it does require us to have a little bit more faith, but acknowledging, like you said, what it does for us, it does a lot. Um, I'll share. Uh back in August, I had a um, I had a fall. I had a, I'm actually 100% healthy, but I had a fall. I had a uh what they call a vacal vasal um response. I was not feeling well. I had like the flu.

SPEAKER_02 4:26

Oh my gosh.

Survival Mode, Rest, And Feminine Energy

SPEAKER_01 4:27

And I ended up falling. Um and you know, ended up with I have this beautiful scar now on my face. Um, but what happened was my body stopped me because I was not listening right to I was I'm this has been a huge transition year for me. And um, what ended up happening is I left a job where I was no longer seen. I was working with a company and I was not, I was not seen there. And I made some very big moves. And there's some other personal things in there that I won't belabor this with, but anyway, my body stopped me. And money actually stopped flowing for a bit for me. And and it was because I was in survival mode, right? So when you're we're in survival mode, we have to trust that you know, we are supported, we are taken care of, we are worthy just the way we are. And that can be hard, especially for us women, right? Because we're we hustle, we think that we have to earn our worth through working hard. And alignment, what what has this has shown me is that alignment is really about being in alignment with ourselves, but allowing for rest, allowing um, we're women, we're supposed to receive. We have to we need to start operating as women business owners in our feminine energy. There's too much patriarchy going on, right? So anyway, yeah. Um, yeah. So that was a huge, you know, every time you think you're learning about money or or just your relationship where you have to improve yourself, self-improve yourself, um, you learn something new. You learn something new about it and it deepens. And yeah, I'm I'm actually even surprised I just shared that, but that's okay. I feel very good.

Shanna Star 6:23

And it's so interesting talking immediately about value, and I see, and I'm sure you've seen this too, so many women. First of all, it's never enough. It's our value is in how busy we are, or that's how we view it at first until that mind shift can change. Um, but also even we don't value ourselves in time. And so when we first are structuring a lot of our businesses, we might see cost of doing business or goods, but the service part, the time part we kind of put to the side because we don't we don't value our time enough and charge that.

The Perfect Pricing Formula Explained

SPEAKER_01 6:59

Correct. And and there's also maybe some money stories going on, right? So it could be, you know, I have to do more to prove my worth. Um, so that is why I actually developed um, and it's a free resource on my website. So if this resonates with you or your readers or your listen our listeners or whatever, it's called the perfect pricing formula and it teaches the minimum aligned price. And the beautiful thing about this is it is a very, very simple formula that helps you um calculate the price that you need to live and sustain your business. And it takes into account the number of hours you truly want to work and what you need to earn. And this formula is so customizable. So if you're a mom, right, and you can only work during the hours when your kids are in school, you just say, This is my time, right? This is this is my time available for work. But then we apply a factor to that that says, okay, this is my billable time, right? So that speaks directly to whether you have a product or you have a product and a service, you definitely want to make that allocation because that starts to untangle the worth from the what you're doing, because our worth has nothing to do with what we're doing. Our services, like you know, do being a photographer, it's a service-based business and you're delivering a result. And I have looked at your photographs, and I can see you're able to make that person on the other end of the camera comfortable. So you're seeing their essence and you're bringing that essence out. That is the result you deliver. So people aren't buying your time, they're buying that result. Yeah. So I want everyone to think about that and don't get nervous about the math. It's a super simple formula, I promise.

Shanna Star 8:56

First of all, thank you for that. It's um, you know, we talk about vulnerability within business and how important it is. And I found for me as well, and something, and I'm sure you find this too, to make people feel comfortable. It's I have to be willing to be vulnerable first. And it's the last thing we want to do. I think Brene Brown says that, and it's the first thing we want to see in people. And so I found if I am willing to be vulnerable, whatever that looks like with that particular client first, it gives permission to for other people to do that as well. It does. And you were right away vulnerable by sharing a little bit of your story, and that was beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 9:34

Thank you.

Shanna Star 9:35

Something else you said that I loved in your perfect pricing formula is the minimum aligned price. And I wrote that down. And that is such a lovely like sentiment. Will you talk about that? What is the minimum aligned price and what does that mean?

Result Over Time And Packaging

SPEAKER_01 9:50

Sure. So minimum aligned price is is specific to your life. It's that's specific to me. And it comes up a couple of different components. One component is what are the expenses that are in your business, right? What tools, subscriptions, training do you need to run your business successfully? Okay. So you add that all up. Then the next thing you do is you figure out what you need to live on. So for me, I was single for many, many years. I was an entrepreneur, I had to support myself. And this wasn't just about getting by. This was like, I want to live, I want to take vacations, I want to save. So it is about figuring out, and I have I actually have worksheets. So, you know, I have worksheets. So it walks everyone through this, but it's figuring out exactly what you need to live on. You add those two things together, and then you divide it by, and this is where most service providers actually go off, where the formula goes awry for them. They divide it by the number of hours that they can work, but not all of that is billable or client-facing time, right? So let's just say, just for simplicity's sake, a thousand hours, right, is what they're available to work in a year. And we say 80% of that is client-facing. So we take that 80, 800 hours and we divide it into, and let's just say our business expenses were, you know,$20,000 and we want to make$100,000. So you take$800 and you divide it into$120,000. And that dollar amount that you come up with, that is your minimum aligned price. And what that means is if you charge less than that by hour, right? So now I am starting at an hourly rate and I'll talk a little bit in a minute about I don't believe in hourly rates. Um, but if you charge less than that, you are actually paying your clients to work for them. You are working in burnout. And so that's why I call it the minimum aligned price. So it does not mean that's what you're going to charge. It means that is the base that we're going to leapfrog from. And that once I figured that out, my whole life changed because I had a corporate career. I was a corporate dropout. I left, I basically got annoyed with my boss and left, um, which was probably not the best plan, but I don't regret it. And um, I was working harder and harder because the more efficient I got, the less money I was making. And I was like, what is going on? It's like I'm creating a jail for myself because I'm working harder and I'm making less money because I'm better at what I'm doing. And none of that made sense to me. So finally I was on the edge of burnout and I stepped back and I said, What's going on here? And I started looking at it from a different perspective. And I realized, I realized two things. One, my body was not letting me receive more money because I going back to that worth, right? And then the second thing is I didn't understand what I truly needed to support myself in a way so that I could show up in a in a quality way and deliver a quality service.

Shanna Star 13:26

So you said a couple things. It's it's the it came up right away for me about, you know, the more experienced you are, then you're technically making less because you're becoming more efficient. And I think that's something we forget in the service or product industry is that when we're starting these businesses, we need to continue to price for that as well. They're not paying you necessarily for the product, but also your experience. So just because you can do it quicker doesn't mean it's cheaper.

SPEAKER_01 13:57

Or that's right. Yes. That's absolutely right. And that's why I like to um help people figure out what result, what train what transformation, what's the result you're providing? Because that's really what people are looking for. They're looking for that feeling. They're looking for, they're looking for, okay, you're gonna save me time, but what does that allow me to do? Right. So they're looking for that emotional resonance. And they're also looking to say, hey, you have a process. Like you've done this before. Even if you're starting out, you can do this. Like I want to talk to those gals who are just starting out their business and you're like, well, I don't have that experience. You're good at what you do. Otherwise, you wouldn't have started your business. You're good at it. I know you're good at it. And think if you don't know what the result is you're getting for your client, ask your friends. Like, give your service to your friends. Um, get a couple, if you have one or two clients, ask them, you know, because how they see what you're doing for them and how you see it are two different things. Because personally, for me, I know it's very hard for me to see how I help people. Yeah. Because it's natural to me, right? It's it's it's my gift. And that's why we're in the service businesses that we're in. It's our gift, right?

Shanna Star 15:14

So yeah, so it's ask people immediately when you said that, I had to write down the zone of genius because so often we think, and even so, I do a lot of graphic design as well. And so it's interesting. I'm like, well, that's easy. Why would you pay me for that? It took me three seconds. And then I had a client be like, I spent an hour on this and I couldn't figure it out. And so sometimes the things that we are natural at or a skill we've built over time, we we don't value those as well because to us it's easy. Uh to us it's fast. And uh, that's because we're in our zone of genius. And so asking friends what we provide or things that we do is so helpful because sometimes we don't understand how those skills or talents, how important they actually are. Yes, yes.

SPEAKER_01 15:58

And it we assume everyone else, well, I could do it in three seconds. You had like I love the the recognition, like, wow, that took them an hour. Like, yes. Exactly, exactly. Yeah, trust me, it would take me two.

Shanna Star 16:15

Okay, okay. And let's go back to something else you said, which is you don't like our hourly rates. I wrote that down. I want to come back to that. Talk about that a little bit.

Selling With Authority And Clarity

SPEAKER_01 16:24

Yeah. So when we charge by the hour, we are actually capping our income. Okay, because we are basically trading dollars for hours. And if we're going to do that, let's go get a job, right? Let's let's go back to being hourly workers. Um and there are, don't get me wrong, there are salary positions out there and you're getting paid for the result, but it's still a you're trading something for something else. When we provide a service, yes, we have to start with knowing what our minimum aligned price is, right? Because we have to know what we should be charging by the hour. But that is our base. And then what we want to do is layer on top of that, well, what results am I getting for my client? What transformation? And the clearer we are on that, and the clearer we are on the process that allows us to create that transformation, that is how we start to formulate packages. Okay. And whether it's a recurring package or a one-time package, it is you're selling the result. You're selling the transformation. And that includes all of the things that are seen and unseen, meaning it's all of the client-facing time in that package, but it's also the things like you may have a very interesting shoot coming up. I don't know, somebody wants you to shoot them on top of the Empire State Building. Perfect. Right. So you've now got to think that through. You've got to like spend time figuring out how you're going to make that happen, how you're going to get the best angle, how the sun's going to, whatever it is. But you're that's all of that mental time that you're putting in there. So that is why if you just charged by the hour, you couldn't necessarily include that, right? In your in charging the client. Because the clients would be, well, I wasn't with you. Like, what are you talking about? But when you have packages and you're building all of that in there, you're you're just you're selling the result. And uh again, time is not a replenishable asset. Money is. And our time, the time factor of that is very valuable.

Shanna Star 18:43

Yeah, that's that still speaks to me because I I still am guilty of that. And I'm sure so many listening still do that, where we think, oh, well, this is the fun creative part. Let me just think through this, and we're not being paid for technical work that we're correct.

SPEAKER_01 18:58

Correct. Right. So again, I'm gonna again, this this is a free resource on my website, and I do hope if it speaks to you, go listen to it. But it does show you how to um account for that information so that you can get paid for it, right? Because that becomes part of your non-billable time.

Shanna Star 19:18

Yeah, absolutely. So I know for so many starting, uh we kind of talked about a few mistakes already then when packaging their services would be not to calculate that time. Are there other mistakes while packaging services that you see? Yes.

SPEAKER_01 19:36

So a couple things. Um one of them is oftentimes we forget to include time off for ourselves. So that's a big one, right? So we want to make sure that we do that. The other thing when we're packaging our services is we want to have it so that we are creating a package that delivers our brilliance. So I learned this actually. When I was teaching, uh, I used to teach bookkeepers on the business behind bookkeeping. And one of the gals came to me and she's like, Well, the client wants me to do A, H, F, and G, and they're going to do the other things. And I'm like, Yeah, but wait a minute, you can't give them a quality, you can't guarantee a quality service because they're doing things or they want to do things or they don't want to hire you to do things that would guarantee your quality product. And that taught me that your base, your core package, whatever it is, is, you know, say, say, for example, you're trying to get to someone's essence. So it the maybe that takes you two hours, a two-hour shoot, right? So no matter what, you're gonna have a two-hour shoot. So your minimum package accounts for the technical setup, a two-hour shoot, you know, the time you spend editing on the back end. Um, I mean, I'm just trying to, you know, I'm kind of yeah, okay. So but you want to make sure that you're including all of the things that go into that incredible result. So that is another mistake I see that happens at the beginning when we first start out.

Shanna Star 21:15

Wow. So something I know you've talked about is then how can leaders with authority, rather than feeling like they're shouting or maybe trying to constantly teach their clients online because so much we're not listening, right? We we don't listen to all the noise sometimes. There's so much of it going on. Right. Um, how can we feel then and that we're getting through to our client without being pushy or shouting at them or discounting ourselves?

SPEAKER_01 21:44

So you're talking about in this situation, I just want to clarify you.

Shanna Star 21:47

So when the client's getting ready to hire you, yeah, whether they're, you know, watching you and starting to trust, starting that process, how can we sell with authority then?

Evolving Your Ideal Client And Niching

SPEAKER_01 21:57

Sure. So I I think the best salespeople are not salespeople at all. I think they're selling the solution and or they're selling the result, right? So you when you're talking to your client, say you can say, Well, I know a lot of people are nervous behind the camera. And one of the things that I strive to do is I strive to make you comfortable. And here's how I do that. Um, you know, so so it's more about talking about your process, talking with clarity, right? With conviction, with confidence, because you know how to deliver that result. And you have to, and if you trust yourself in how you deliver your service, your clients are going to as well.

SPEAKER_02 22:38

Yeah.

Shanna Star 22:39

Do you think that's I was going to ask if how do we speak to our ideal clients that are so often after we're in business for more than a year, are no longer us. Our ideal clients are willing to pay more. They're not going to pay what we want. It's or what we would pay for that service or product. And how can we then learn to shift how we speak to our ideal client to attract them? And it's a comfortable place. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 23:04

Yeah, that's a fabulous question. You're right. You're absolutely right. Because who you start out with is oftentimes we start out taking just about anybody, right? Because we're trying to figure out. We're trying to figure out does this resonate with us? Are we in congruence with this particular type of client? I think one of the things to do, especially if you're in your first year of business, is to audit. Like every time you've worked with somebody, write down what you loved about working with them. And then what's going to happen is over time, you're going to start to clarify an elevated, a more mature client profile. And then what you want to do is like like on my accounting services division, right? We are not, we do not work with startups. We don't. Although I am going to, you know, I'm thinking about how I can service them because I do love startups. But when I talk to my clients, I say, if you have been in business X number of, I tell you, I actually explain exactly what I'm doing, what I'm who I'm working with, who I'm best to serve. We are best when we are, you know, working with you as your accounting department. We are lockstep with you, talking to you two, three times a week. Um, if your business has three million dollars or more, like I actually explain who that is. And the more I talk about it, the more I embody it. But then the clients also start to see themselves because you want them to self-select. So, so don't be embarrassed, right? About like, and don't, and please don't make the mistake of saying, I'm for everybody. We are not for everybody. No, we are not meant to be for everybody. So you want to say, here's what's going to be interesting. Let's just say I only take pictures of dogs, right? I only take pictures of dogs. But then somebody who has a cat comes to you and says, I just love your pictures. Will you take my cat? And you're going to be like, of course I will, right? Because if it's an alignment for you, if that if it feels right, you're going to do it. And you will find that the people, no matter what you're saying, if they feel aligned with you and you feel aligned with them, it's a mutual, it's a two-way street. So, so yes, get specific about who you help and how you help them.

Shanna Star 25:24

It's so interesting you say that because I've had so many conversations. And I was guilty when I first started 15 years ago. The same thing is you think I'm for everybody because I want all the clients, which at the beginning, like you said, you just need it coming in and you need to see where it's going to go. And that's totally fine. But as you move forward, I have found, and I'm sure you have too, the more you niche down, the more it actually allows others to come even outside of that niche. So maybe I showcase these, these women and these situations, but it actually still attracts other people because they love the look of it, they love the feel of it. And um, and it's interesting because you think that you're actually um pushing away those clients. And what it does is find and attract the right clients. So I love that. It does. It does.

SPEAKER_01 26:11

And a natural byproduct of that is what you said earlier, is that these clients will meet you energetically and pay you a different rate. Yes. Yeah.

Shanna Star 26:22

Yeah. And also for me, when I when people are like, Well, you're not for everyone, I'm like, new. I want people to be like, heck yes, I love her. I want to repost her. I want to share, talk about her, or I want to, ew, I never want to see her again. I don't want the lukewarm because they're not going to send you clients, they're not going to hire you again. You either want them shouting from the rooftop or not giving a crap about you. And that's okay. They're not for you.

SPEAKER_01 26:49

They're not for you. And and they will find who they're supposed to work with. Yeah. Right, right. No, I that you're that's exactly right. That's that's that's being in alignment. That is, yeah.

Actionable Steps To Refine Offers

Shanna Star 27:01

Maybe what are some actionable steps? I know people are listening and they're like, that sounds nice, but what are some actionable steps then that we can take that leap and change our prices or change how even we work through some of those mindset um sticking points to move forward?

SPEAKER_01 27:16

Yeah, that's um, yes. Um we have to get it, we may have to make this practical now. So, okay, so when you're starting out, like you said, we're working with everybody. And I think the first place to start is asking yourself, what is it I actually like to do in my business? Because when I first started out, we were working with um, there was a service called historical. I I only had an accounting services business when I first started. And um, there was a group of clients called historical write-up clients, and those are the clients you did after the fact. I took those clients at the beginning because, like you said, you're taking everybody. But what I recognized in about six to nine months is I didn't like working with them. And it wasn't because they weren't nice people, it was because we had to constantly chase them for information. So there were things about working with them I did not like. So ask yourself, who do you like working with? Why do you like working with them? Okay, and then, and because it all starts with you. And then it's like, okay, well, how do I then? Then the next step is how do I find more of them? So is it a particular industry? Is it a particular um age group? Is it a particular, is it women? Is it moms? Is it, is it men? Is it dads? It whatever it is, whatever the common denominator is, and then think about what it is you want. Then you ask yourself, okay, so this is the result they're looking for, and just on just refine what you're offering, and then you can start to refine your copy, your messaging to them. If you start with those three questions, I think that's going to put you well on your way into morphing that ideal client.

Shanna Star 29:02

Yeah. I think about, I follow a lot of bakers because I just get sucked into it on TikTok and online. That's so interesting to me. And one fabulous lady makes all these beautiful like cake pops and pretzels and whatever that looks like. And even she is so niched down that she's like, I will no longer take animal prints. It's going to be pretty, light pink, light yellow, light colors. And people are like, you're getting away from your clients. And she's like, No, I'm attracting the correct ones. It's not saying I'll never do that, but these are the people that I want because I love it and I'm good at it. And uh, I think that helps some of our burnout as well when you figure out yes, what you love. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 29:40

I love that example. That I love that example. Yeah, because you know, and but it's also about saying it in a way that's open, right? Right. It's not like I'm never gonna work with you or having that energy, right? So it's all about our energy. So you want to just make sure that you're it's flowing. It feels like it's flowing, right? Because it if it's it's a natural extension of who you are and who you want to work with.

Money Stories, Journaling, And Learning

Shanna Star 30:06

Yeah. And kind of going back to pricing too, I know this is so tricky because so many people will hear it and go, well, that's that's great, but I don't need to price more. I don't want to be greedy. This is enough. Money, I it's a very touchy subject and it's a very scary subject for a lot of people.

SPEAKER_02 30:25

Yes.

Shanna Star 30:26

And how do you start to talk to specifically women to get out of that mindset of wanting more money and making more money is okay and it's good and you can do good.

Neutral Money, Attention, And Behavior

SPEAKER_01 30:37

Right. Yes. Money is such a charged, it's a charged subject for a lot of people, but especially us women, right? Um, we we are taught or we perceive, you know, at very young ages that we have to do more. We have to take care of people, we're the nurturer. Um, and we don't get recognized or paid for that, right? You know, a lot of times. I mean, you can make dinner and no one says thank you, right? But you expended time and energy. So one of the first things is we have to kind of look at our own money story, right? So what is it? Um, well, it for me, uh let me let me talk to how it showed up for me. Yeah, I'd like to. And um, and then maybe we can we can get some some points out of that. But um when I first started out, I mean, here I am, I have an MBA. I I I have um I'm a business owner and I'm charging$25 an hour for you know consulting work, right? And I I know, right? This is back in the day too, and uh because my business has been around for a while. And I remember working with men. And and this is I love men, so please I'm gonna cave this. Like I we love men, but we can have issues too. So exactly. Um, but I remember feeling yucky because men were taking advantage of the fact that they knew what the information I was giving them was valuable. And but I was coming from the place of people pleasing. Like I'm like, okay, if I give enough information and if I show them that I'm gonna, you know, do this job super well, they're gonna hire me and I'm gonna get, you know, I'm gonna get recurring work from this and it's it's gonna it's gonna work out for me. Well, I had probably three situations in a very short period of time after I started my business where I and I was just so surprised by it, right? This is how I'm showing up. So I'm keep, I'm, I'm in my people pleasing. I'm, you know, try, I'm, I'm hustling to show them my worth. And they turned around and took my information, took what I did that they got very, very inexpensively, and they went and hired somebody else. They hired a man, you know, so that happened. And I remember being like, okay, there's something, there's a common thread here. So one of the things is, you know, for me was people pleasing and wanting to be liked because I wanted to be seen. So we have to first thing we have to do is kind of figure out like what's what's driving our what's driving us from not allowing ourselves to receive money. So so that's one of the first things to do. And and what I would say to you is journal, you know, the like uh journal about it. Don't be afraid. So and the question that I would start with is what am I afraid of if I had more than enough money that I knew what to do with? What what would that what would that mean? What would that do? Right. And then what's gonna happen is if you just free right from that, other questions are gonna come up. But I would ask, that's what I would ask, what am I afraid of? Because at the end of the day, for me, it ended up being um not that I I was afraid of I was afraid of not being seen as smart. I was afraid of not being like if I wasn't taking care of situations, no one would see me. Like I was afraid of being invisible. And um, and that's what it got down to for me. But there's some there are definitely some common themes, right? So freeform, journal, write about that. Um as women, learn about money, right? And and I'm not talking about there's energy, there's energetics of money, money is energy, everything is energy. Um, there are some great resources out there, people talking about nervous system regulation and money and energy that specialize in those kinds of breakthroughs. Listen to podcasts, you know, just allow yourself to um just listen, right? Because we think, you know, as women, that we're like you said in your first marriage, your husband took care of the money and you had to learn about it. And you did. It wasn't hard. It's not hard, right? We don't have to become Warren Buffett, right? We don't have to become Warren Buffett investors, but we we should know what's coming in, what's going out. And money is your relationship with money is a self-reflection of it's a mirror, it's a mirror of where you are in relationship with yourself.

Shanna Star 35:38

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Scarcity, Flow, And Balance

SPEAKER_01 37:50

And but that's okay. It's okay. And none of us were taught. I mean, I think just now they're starting to teach children about money, like the fundamentals of money. You were none of us were taught this. None of us. Um, it was I was at the dentist just the other day, and he said to me, um, he was graduating dental school, and he said they had a class on how to take student loans and what it meant with your credit score. He goes, We're graduating. This this class, you know, there's nothing about business. He said there was nothing about business. He said, Dentists are not really good at money. This is this was his words, not mine. Um, but anyway, it was just it's just fascinating to me that here we are, all highly intelligent people. We are, we're highly intelligent people and no one's taught us about this. And we've also observed our parents, right? So I was in a I was raised in a middle class, you know, family. We didn't want for anything, but we my parents live paycheck to paycheck. So you pick up those silent money cues and without realizing it, we carry it into how we interact with money. And then we go and get married, and then we're dealing with our husband or our you know, wives or whomever our partner is, and they're bringing their history of money, right? So we all have all these money beliefs is that we're bringing in their gut, and we're getting energetically, this is why it's such a big issue in marriages and relationships, right? Because our money's money is emotionally charged. All money's neutral, and if we can look at it neutrally, right? Without like, like when I was not making any money, you know, when I first started my business or I wasn't making enough, I started, I was avoiding my own bookkeeping, right? I wouldn't do it. But then I said, okay, no, this isn't good. Money wants attention. So I would go in and I would look at it. And the first thing I would do is I would just observe. I'd be like, oh, and then it'd be like, oh, look at this came in. Oh, I got this refund. It was Just acknowledging it in a very non-emotionally charged way. And if something emotionally charged me, I would then go right about it. Like, why did that upset me? You know, and and then I remember one time I was chastising myself for spending money on, I'm like, I shouldn't have, I shouldn't have jumped and spent that money. So I got mad at myself. But then it was, it was more about learning about how to put the pulse on making a decision. The this the decision ultimately was correct, right? But I was chastising myself because I jumped the gun and I, you know, I should have waited, whatever, whatever, whatever. It was all a story. It was all a story. So yeah, it's it's emotionally charged.

Shanna Star 40:44

Um it's it's so interesting hearing some of that. So I've had to deal with that. You know, we all do therapy. I've had health issues. So because of that, they sent me to therapy and we ended up talking about money, right? And so um growing up, mine derived mostly from my biological dad. And I remember he made enough money. We were fine. You know, I if I wanted a toy, I got a toy. There was nothing, you know, we were good. But he was so negative about money that it was, it's never enough. Buy the cheap thing, don't buy the door handle that cost$20. And instead he'd buy the cheap one and it would break, you know, things like that, where it was just it, it was from a place of it's just never enough. And scarcity. Yes, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 41:28

Yeah, but I I can guarantee you he was probably a depression era baby. He was probably the child of a of parents from the depression. Yes, and that's probably how he was raised.

Shanna Star 41:37

Yes, and they they were his lovely parents loved them, but um, they were cheap till the day they passed as well. So I totally yeah.

SPEAKER_01 41:45

I mean, did you there was a story about these millionaires in the Midwest and these this couple, they lived so miserly, right? Like they they people thought they had nothing when they both died within like a couple months of each other. They had millions of dollars that they never spent. Money is meant to flow, it's meant to be enjoyed, it's meant to, you know, give, receive, save, invest, whatever it is you want to, you know, whatever it is you want to do with it. It's it is meant to be in flow. It is not meant to be hoarded, it is not meant to be overspent, it's meant to be in balance.

SPEAKER_02 42:23

Yeah.

Stop Shrinking: More Money, More Impact

Shanna Star 42:24

And that's so wonderful thinking about, like we said, like 2025 has been difficult. And so just to start, I journaling has been huge for me too. So I'm such an advocate of it. And just realizing like, why do I feel this way? Why do I feel stuck? And just writing through some of those things so that maybe we can say, okay, money is still, like you said, neutral. And moving forward, these are the things I can do. Um, these are the things I struggle with and I can shift that. And I know for women, a while ago we were talking about it brought up that we make ourselves small because that's part of why we don't think, quote, we deserve that money, because we are grown up to be like, well, don't be high maintenance, don't do this. Right. And who whatever you want to be, totally fine. Uh, but like I think about high maintenance. I'm like, but I was single for a long time. I maintained myself, so I can be as maintenance or high maintenance as I want to be. And I still have friends that are like, oh no, I'm chill, I'm super cool, I'm super low maintenance. I'm like, it's okay to have needs, it's okay to not make yourself small. Um I love that. I love that. Yeah. Um and the other thing is we were talking about what we can do with more money and why it feels scary to want more money or to say it's okay and good. And I know for myself is the more money I have, the more I can actually give back. And maybe not just monetarily, but then we can do things like podcasts and speak to thousands of women rather than just those one-on-one. And so seeing it as when you have more, you can give more.

SPEAKER_01 44:02

Yes, yes, I love that. That is absolutely why heart-centered people, women, they need to stop making themselves small because you know we sometimes we think people with money are bad or you know, they're unethical. But guess what? So are people without money. Absolutely. Right. So the thing is, this is why we want the heart-centered people. You want to succeed. We want you to succeed. We want to succeed so that we can start to change that persona and help more people. And like you said, it doesn't have to be monetarily. It can be in different, it can be in different ways.

SPEAKER_02 44:43

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 44:44

Um, yeah, but no, don't dim your, you know, do not dim your light. Uh, I was single for a very long time and I remember thinking, okay, you know, every time I was going out with someone, they're like, oh, you have your own business. Oh, you have your own house. And I was just like, okay. And then I started getting to the point I'm like, no, you know what? If you can't meet me where I am, then no. Fair enough. You know, and and then I finally the my husband, who I did not get married very young, but um, he accepted me exactly how I was. And I have to tell you, ladies, if you're holding up for love, hold up for that because it feels really, really good. And I know there was times where I was just like, I'm never gonna find anybody, but but you do I hold my standard. But again, money, so it's all about relationship, right? It's about it's really about the relationship with ourselves and money, how you think about money and how you think about love, you don't have to bring the money part into love. Like, look about look at meeting that person, right? Like, look, um, what if you're dating and you're trying to get to know the person, right? Don't don't uh and if and if they get intimidated by something that you don't think they should be intimidated by, that's on a match for you. And that's okay. And that's okay. Yeah.

Worth, Rest, And Boundaries

Shanna Star 46:09

So is there something maybe that's been on your heart lately that you feel just called to share? It can be personal or business. I know you've shared so much. But I would love to hear if there's been something that keeps coming up for you.

SPEAKER_01 46:23

Yeah, I mean, I think what comes up for me a lot and and what I really hope to help people with is you know, so many high achieving women are exhausted, right? And it's not because they're doing too little, but it's because they're trying to earn their rest. So worth doesn't increase worth doesn't increase with busyness. Okay. I I hopefully people are hearing that worth does not increase with busyness. In fact, it's peace is often the greatest sign that you're aligned with your value. So when you feel peaceful, to me, and that's and that's what I hope uh, you know, someone takes that away from from our conversation today. But yeah, when you know your worth internally, you stop negotiating it externally, but your boundaries become stronger with your clients, with your family, with yourself. And you increase your self-care.

Shanna Star 47:22

Yeah, that's really beautiful because most of us start businesses to not be busy around the clock, to have time with family, to enjoy the sunshine. If they never get to see the sunshine because they're always at the office, and so often, especially right away, we take that away from ourselves because now we have to continue to earn that worth, like you said.

SPEAKER_01 47:45

We do, we do, yeah. And there is this is about us designing our own, our own way, yes, and living in our feminine energy.

Shanna Star 47:55

Yes, that is hard to do sometimes. So yes, you're absolutely right. It is so how can we find and follow you? I know you have a book coming out soon-ish as well. So tell us how we can find you.

SPEAKER_01 48:09

Um, well, you can find me at my website, um, sumutions.com, S-U-M-S-O-L-U-T-I-O-N-S dot com. I'm also on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook. Um, and I do have a book coming out called The Money Conversation, which I'm super excited about. It is for the servicepreneur, it is for women, it is about setting the standard, speaking your truth, and getting paid without apology. It has a lot of practical things in it, but it also talks about that nervous system alignment. And um, it's a it was a book 15 years in in my head and finally wrote it and it's got it out. Yes, we got it out, yes.

Shanna Star 48:52

I will be getting it. You said pre-order is going to be starting. So that is fabulous. I told you I read all the money books because that's how I first started learning without feeling like I didn't know enough. So I think that's wonderful. I'm so excited for that. Thank you. Yeah, it was such a pleasure. Yes, you too. It was so beautiful to see your face and just get to chat with you. So thank you so much for all your wisdom. And it went even a little bit direction where a different direction where we got to talk some personal things. So I appreciate that and appreciate you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 49:22

Yeah, same. Thank you so much.

Where To Find Linda And Her Book

Shanna Star 49:24

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