The Real Dad Podcast
Each week, these four fathers cover a wide range of "Dad" related topics, from the joys of watching your child grow up to the challenges of balancing work and family life. With their unique blend of humor and authenticity, Dave, Joey, Brian, and Mark provide a refreshing perspective on what it means to be a dad in today's world.
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The Real Dad Podcast
What Dads Should Expect When They’re Expecting, Revisited
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Expecting a baby doesn’t hand you a script; it asks you to improvise with heart. We went back to our most-downloaded topic and pushed further into what new dads actually face: the dizzying pivot from being self-focused to being genuinely needed, the way plans crumble in the delivery room, and the small, steady moves that matter more than grand gestures.
We talk candidly about fear—watching your partner labor, trusting a midwife or nurse when you feel helpless, and staying grounded when NICU stays, stalled latches, or conflicting advice pile on. You’ll hear real tactics that lower the temperature: stocking bedside snacks and water, bringing your own pillow and blanket to the hospital, ordering dinner on the nights no one can think, and asking the magic question, How can I support you right now? We also dig into boundaries and expectations—who’s in the room, which visitors help or harm, and how to handle family dynamics without making your partner manage your side.
If you feel shut out or second-guessed, we’ve been there. The move is quiet competence: change the diaper, reset the room, prep the next feed, and stop keeping score. Bonding doesn’t always land on day one, so create rituals that invite it—witching-hour walks, skin-to-skin, narrating your day, and finding your unique dad sleep routine for each child. Your scenario is yours; filter advice, keep what fits, and choose the path that protects your partner’s wellbeing and your family’s bond, whether that’s nursing, pumping, or formula.
Come for the humor, stay for the hard-earned calm. If you’re a new or soon-to-be dad looking for grounded guidance, this one’s for you. Subscribe, share with a friend who needs a steady voice, and leave a review with the best tip you wish you’d heard sooner.
Well one thing I was gonna say was because I think Brian had said it earlier about like just jump in.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:But what if your spouse doesn't let you jump in? What if they don't want you to jump in? What if they're nervous with you with the baby?
SPEAKER_05:The phrase how do I support you right now is like completely saved us because sometimes it's I don't know. Sometimes it's there's nothing you can do. And that's why I'm saying it. If you take time to really kind of get to know your wife, at least maybe you go down and get like fill up a yeti full of water and like leave it on the bedside table or something for her and not for you. And for some people it takes practice.
SPEAKER_03:If you got some time to relax your mind, come out with this. The real dad podcast. Welcome to the real dad podcast. I'm Dave.
SPEAKER_05:Hi, Dave, I'm Joey. Hello, Dave and Joey. I am Mark.
SPEAKER_04:I wasn't sure where you hello, Dave and Joey, and Mark. I'm Brian. Excellent. Let's dad, everyone.
SPEAKER_03:Let's dad indeed. Um, so we wanted to revisit an episode that we have done in the past. This episode has done extremely well with over 7,000 downloads. So thank you all for the new dads clicking on this and listening. It is our what dads should expect when they're expecting. So it's been almost three years since we recorded that episode. Holy. So the four of us went back to have a listen to it. One to see if we still agree with the things that we were talking about. And two, what things were we missing there that dads need to know?
SPEAKER_06:Right.
SPEAKER_03:Because one thing's for certain babies are still being born.
SPEAKER_06:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:And dads still don't know what the fuck they're doing. Yep. Very true. So we're revisiting that to get into it. But before we jump into that, I have another random thought with Dave.
SPEAKER_04:Okay. Let's do it.
SPEAKER_03:So you make a sandwich. Let's say grilled cheese. So this is a sandwich made with two pieces of bread.
SPEAKER_05:I'm passionate about bread.
SPEAKER_03:It's on. It's okay.
SPEAKER_05:This is turning into a problem.
SPEAKER_03:Very carb-heavy diet. Make a sandwich. Yeah. Two pieces of bread, right?
SPEAKER_02:So there's a difference between grilled cheese and a sandwich. Sorry to keep cutting you off. No, no, no. Don't apologize. Are we making a sandwich or a grilled cheese?
SPEAKER_05:But it's not a grilled cheese. Listen though, we've toasted. We've talked about toast too much. Yeah. That's okay. I love toast.
SPEAKER_02:You can't overdo toast. It's a universal food that makes you happy. This is such a new tab of day.
SPEAKER_03:So you've got a sandwich that's been made with two pieces of bread.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Um first off, are you cutting that sandwich or are you leaving it to Do you need two pieces of bread for it to be considered a sandwich?
SPEAKER_05:What would you call it? Is this a stupid question? An open catalogable bamboo.
SPEAKER_03:And it's just an open category.
SPEAKER_05:What if you take a piece of bread and you put an egg on it? What's that? That's an egg on a piece of bread. No way! No way! What if you put a take a piece of bread and then you put a fucking half a half a uh what's the green? What's a green fruit? What's the green fruit?
SPEAKER_02:Avocado.
SPEAKER_05:Thank you, everyone, all at once.
SPEAKER_04:Avocado toast. Yeah. Okay. Avocado toast? Yeah. Delicious.
SPEAKER_03:If you put another piece of bread on it, then it would become a sandwich.
SPEAKER_02:It depends if you toast it. Yeah, that's true. What a few. Alright, let's let Dave finish his.
SPEAKER_03:Are you gonna cut the sandwich or are you leaving it full?
SPEAKER_02:I'm a full sandwich guy. I want the whole thing.
SPEAKER_04:It depends on how big the bread is that I'm using.
SPEAKER_03:You guys and all your goddamn variables in the storm.
SPEAKER_05:I don't use the health. I don't use brown bread.
SPEAKER_04:Sour goat.
SPEAKER_05:I'm like out of the boat.
SPEAKER_04:I would never go brown bread. I'm going to chili bread. I'm going white bread. I'll chili white bread. Right? Good for wonder bread. I don't know. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:First off of a single cutting it. Okay. Hold on, wait. If it's wonder bread, I'm not cutting it. What type of sandwich is it? I mean, fucking. No!
SPEAKER_05:Because I cut all of my peanut butter PB and J? You're cutting that shit. PB and J. Because I I loved shut up. I loved to bite into no crust first. A little bit of crust.
SPEAKER_03:See this.
SPEAKER_05:Shut the fuck up, David. You ask the question, you wait for the answer. That's how questions work. Okay. Give me your answer. I cut my PB and J's, okay, but my tunas, no. Okay. Tunas, you you can't waste time on it. Because tunas are messy. Unless you got the mayonnaise in there to hold it together. You don't want it fallen out. It's gonna flake and fall everywhere. Okay.
SPEAKER_03:So context is important. I hear you. So we're gonna assume it is a sandwich that hasn't been cut. Okay. My question was what was what would be your first bite?
SPEAKER_02:Okay, first bite of a sandwich.
SPEAKER_03:You've seen the picture on social media.
SPEAKER_04:I would never bite the bottom of the bread first. No. Why? Heel first.
SPEAKER_02:Right where the circles are. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:No, no, no, no, no. You save those for last and you fold them over, and then you what do you mean? You eat corner? Corner? Bottom corner? Bottom corner? He's going bottom corner. Bottom corner. You take both the corners off, and then you're left with this like weird mushroom-looking thing. Yeah. Bunch, you might you bite on that, and now you have half the thing. You take another half, half of the half, and then you now you have the same sort of thing. Okay.
SPEAKER_03:Bottom up.
SPEAKER_05:And then you go there. And then now you've got the two folded like curves. Bite in the middle of that and fold it over, and now you're eating all this.
SPEAKER_03:I absolutely love trying to understand what people do for normal shit. I don't know why, but it excites me. And this was literally me sitting down to eat bunch. It was an egg sandwich, so it was an egg with some cheese. Yeah, you don't cut an egg sandwich. No. It was full, and I took my bit top right corner. No. And that was my dome first. Dome first. I go top top down. Yeah. That's too much. That's too much.
SPEAKER_05:The corners are the crustiest part.
SPEAKER_04:The dome is the bottom anti-toasty over here. The bottom crust, the bottom of the bread is the hardest part. Yeah, so you eat it first. You eat the hardest penny first.
SPEAKER_02:Enjoy your first bite. I think I work around it. I think I go top, but then I think I go around the horn. You say the middle. Oh yeah. My last bite is always like some crust, but mainly middle. It's like a crusty middle. That's a good bite.
SPEAKER_05:That's a good bite. See, when we make our kids' sandwiches, they ask us to cut the crust off.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:And I get pissed. It's the bane of my when Robin throws the crust into the bin. I eat that, I eat the crust all the time. It's one of my favorite things.
SPEAKER_03:See, I don't yell at my kids when they don't eat the crust on grilled cheese because if it's still got cheese, then I'll eat that crust. I'll come in as cleanups.
SPEAKER_05:Here's my dad's secret. Here's a dad's secret. When you make the grilled cheese, I overdo the cheese so it goes into the crust. And then I kind of cheat. I take a dad tax and I cheat in and I cut their sandwiches a little bit too small.
SPEAKER_02:You're grabbing 5% of the real bread.
SPEAKER_05:100%. I get a little bit of real bread on there. So much respect to that.
SPEAKER_04:See, bigger bread would go a long way for you. That's true. Sourdough sourdough.
SPEAKER_03:Do you know what sourdough would do to his mouth? The hard crush of a toasted sourdough? What is wrong with my mouth? Lightly toasted toast. I don't like toast. Sourdough when it's toasted? That shit's brittle. That will like destroy your mouth. I can't chip a tooth.
SPEAKER_05:Or my gums are there.
SPEAKER_03:Brian sourdough on a number four burning.
SPEAKER_05:Number four, man. That's sacrosancy.
SPEAKER_03:Back to parenting. Just have to get that out there. Just random thoughts with Dave. It's the new segment we're gonna start off the show with.
SPEAKER_05:No one asked for that, by the way.
SPEAKER_03:Nobody did. I'll save it for later.
SPEAKER_05:I have never received more text messages about people clapping than I did in the last days.
SPEAKER_03:Insane! Insane! Everyday shit. How do you do it?
SPEAKER_05:I just saw somebody clapping. I'm like, oh fucking did it.
SPEAKER_04:How many ceremonies are you going to for crying out loud, anyways? I got a little too close to somebody watching them eat a hot dog. I got stared.
SPEAKER_05:Did you make eye contact? You did. What are you eating the dog?
SPEAKER_04:I just wanted to see, you know? Close up view. How did it go for you? Did they get someone on their nose? They were a little uncomfortable. As they should be. Oh shit. Amazing.
SPEAKER_03:Okay. So all of us have many children at this point now. Our children are fairly grown. More than one. We're a little bit away from the newborn stage. Yeah. So we need to travel back in time to those first days.
SPEAKER_02:Some would say a little older, a little wiser.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Maybe.
SPEAKER_03:Some things I loved about that previous episode that really stuck with me was the not necessarily sticking to a plan because all three of my births went very differently. And I think there are things that you can do to prepare yourself and have best made plans. But being able to be flexible is one of the key ingredients to the whole process. I'd say like start to finish, even. Hey now. Flexibility homes. But yeah, that is one of uh one of the things that like really stuck with me from that.
SPEAKER_02:One of the things that stuck with me, and I'm paraphrasing, but it was when Dave said if the wife decides that she's gonna breastfeed, then she has to suck it up all night and do it herself.
SPEAKER_05:I realized that Dave was a bit of an asshole.
SPEAKER_06:In the first episode.
SPEAKER_05:The response to that was just so good. Absolutely do not then I yelled abort. And I instantly regretted choosing that or something. I think you were good. You were good. I felt such an asshole.
SPEAKER_03:But that's how our like our journey through the first few um weeks or whatever, or even first year of having our kid, my wife would breastfeed them in bed with her.
SPEAKER_06:Yep.
SPEAKER_03:So there wasn't like a getting up to go do things or rock or like the baby is often falling back asleep.
SPEAKER_02:The check-in was like the big like if you can wake up or if your partner wakes you up, having that moment to check in.
SPEAKER_05:So just to be like, you need it. Here's what I will lead with. I think that episode is fantastic in terms of all the advice that we give. I think we checked a lot of boxes. So coming back to it to be like, hey, let's do a part two, it's very challenging because between the four of us, we definitely hit a lot, I feel. One thing that like kind of while I was listening back to it, I really now with like the hindsight, I really wish I could go back, or I'll start over. The best advice that I would give, or a tip that I would give, is especially if it's your first, it's very it was challenging for me to come out of a season of being selfish and going into a season of being needed, right? And I didn't take that it took me a very long time to get used to being needed. Yeah, I feel like males, for the most part, assuming that you have like a good relationship with your parents and all that sort of stuff, you're taken care of. Like my grandmother took very good care of me growing up, and so when I'm when I was with Robin in the beginning, I she took very good care of me. I was her number one priority. And then now when you have a a baby introduced to it, there's a lot of confusion because, like we said in the episode, they go through so much stuff, and then we're we're all of a sudden like, hey, what is it that you need? Assuming that they know when they have no idea what they need.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, good point.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, so now we're relying on them, and it's it's up to us to this would be my tip, during the pregnancy, just deep dive into what you're what makes your wife tick. What is she what's her what music does she like? Who would she call if it weren't for you? Like make notes of all the like her favorite meals, like different snacks, different things like that that can kind of offset things. And what I would do in hindsight now is I would just kind of do whatever I could knowing that it's not about you, and your season now is to is to basically be needed, and you just need to take some of the pressure off. She's gonna be going through so many emotions, there's gonna be so many hormones and all sorts of stuff that sometimes it could just be as simple as she opens up the cupboard and her favorite cereal is there, right? And it's I think for for my wife in particular, I'm not gonna speak for all of them, but I think those little random acts of kindness and thoughts would go a lot a long way because I used to do them all the time, and I and now I do them a lot more, but I think during her pregnancy and post post mortem, I think, postpartum postpartum, sorry. Trying to sound smarter than I actually am. No, you may have. But I think I think those play on the emotions because there's so much confusion for them and and they're like doubting themselves. So then when you come in, you're like, what do you want? What do you need? What do you think? It's it's it would have been much easier for both of us if I was just like, hey, did you want me to get you you know, and you make those suggestions you want me to get you so like a frozen water bottle? Do you want me to get you an ice pack? Do you want me to get you a heated blanket and like and just start saying all those things? Yeah, and just basically show up and be there.
SPEAKER_04:That was uh one of my wife's uh I asked her to give me a couple like things that she would say to like a new dad. Yeah, and that was one of her major things was like don't wait to be asked to do things, yes, like hop in there, take the kid when he the kid's crying, yeah. Like don't wait for like me to give him to you, or like change the diaper immediately, like just hop in and get involved as as soon as you can. And yeah, like you're saying, like be in tune with your partner. That's obviously a really fluid thing that like is going to change their wants and needs are going to change like along the way because, like you said, they don't really know what they need, yeah uh especially in the first little while. Um but yeah, it's it's taking the initiative that goes a long way.
SPEAKER_05:And I think that there's there's nothing wrong with during the actual pregnancy, there's a lot of excitement and there's a lot of like planning for baby. You're there's a lot of roaming around. I don't know what it is now, but like Toys or Us used to go around and like these are the car seats and these are the things, and everything is about like nursery and baby and this, but it's it's really, really important, I I think now looking back, of like really focusing in on getting to know her specifically. Again, you're getting it out of the season of being selfish and into the season of being needed, and you're you're basically saying, like, this is cool, but like what like what you know, I don't know, what's your favorite, or who is who's the person you like to hear from the most if it weren't for me, or like if I wasn't here right now, who would you bring with you? Knowing so that like to tie into your point that you mentioned in the last episode, like I don't want to get emotional, but like I listening to that was very difficult for me because it seemed like the three of you have like a community and like and like a village, and and Robin and I don't have that, right? And it's it's so it's like I almost feel like a black sheep because I'm like I feel I feel like we were alone and I feel like I let her down. Oh, okay, because it isn't it is very much like that. Like, who would you who would you want to hear from if it weren't for me? And the answer for her was like you. So it's like it's us against the world in that situation, right? But if they do have somebody that's supportive of me, let's say it's a sister or a friend or a mom or anything like that, put them on the reserve and then don't be afraid, again, assuming that you have the relationship, or even if you don't, but don't be afraid to reach out and say, you know, mother-in-law or friend or whoever, I really think you know, my I'm gonna just use Robin, but I really think Robin could use you right now to check in. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:I really like those that those two pieces of advice. I think they're really great things that um don't require them to even acknowledge that you've done something. You're not doing it to say, like, oh hey, thanks for changing that diaper. You're not looking for that acknowledgement.
SPEAKER_05:But some people are, and it's important to know that you're not gonna get that that recognition. Right. And you can't keep those those tabs that's out the window.
SPEAKER_03:But it's like if you are going out shopping to pick up some diapers and all that stuff, you know that they don't want to really be left alone and they're kind of nervous about you leaving. Call in that friend, call in that family member to come, like, hey, I gotta go shopping. Can you come stay with them for a little bit while I go do that? They might be like, hey, let me do the shopping for you. What can I pick up? And you'd be like, No, no, no, no, no. I I wanna, I need, I wanna go, I want to go shopping. Like, please let me go shopping. Like, I need out of here for a bit to go catch my breath and figure out life. You come stay with them, please. And like they can come stay with them while you go out shopping. But one of the pieces of advice my wife had was to have snacks in your bedside table. So my wife would wake up in the night to breastfeed and she would get hungry because you're feeding and doing something and awake all of a sudden. So if you had snacks in the side of the bed, right? I never did this, I never thought of this. She obviously didn't think of it either because we didn't have it for the three kids, but she wished she did. But if I had stocked her bedside table with some of her favorite snacks to be able to have when she woke up to feed, get a little bit of nutrition in herself as well. I that's something that I definitely could have done that I would have never thought of doing that would go a long way without needing recognition of what I've done. It's just like you just plant a little seed.
SPEAKER_02:Right. And if you are a new to become dad who's in a young relationship, these are things that are gonna carry you throughout your entire relationship. So, yes, this is a great practice and a need when you are start having kids, especially if you are early on in your relationship with your partner, but trust us that this is gonna stay with you too because next time your partner happens to be ill, you can put this stuff right back into practice. And now you've already learned how to do it, how to properly take care of your partner, if obviously time and place allows for it.
SPEAKER_05:It's interesting because I waited until I was 30 to have kids. So I was out of that like 20-ish kind of mentality. I was very selfish in my 20s. And the thought of having a kid that young, but you're right, like people do have that, and the thought of it would scare the shit out of me, if I'm being totally honest, right? So I think something to remember is guys often joke about like their wives being crazy, or like, oh, you know, she's parenting, so she's fucking she's loopy or she's you know what, you know, whatever. It I think I a it starts with respect. You gotta respect if you're listening to this podcast, odds are you do respect your you know, you are a on the right track. Um but I do think that I lost my train of thought and I'm trying to find it. You'll get there. What were we talking about?
SPEAKER_02:You had kids a little later, you need to respect your partner.
SPEAKER_05:It's temporary. So what I would say is that I remember thinking Robin was batshit crazy, and I'm like, what did I sign up for? She's gonna be crazy for the rest of her life. This is insane, and I don't know what to do. Right. And you just step up in the moments, you're you're just kind of going all over the place and it it goes back to normal. It in some cases, in my case, in the three of your cases, it's almost better than normal because you get to grow when you go through something crazy and you come out on the other side. I don't want to speak for everybody because it's not always like that for some people, and and I'm grateful that it you know it was for me, but there are there is weight and support knowing that it's only temporary and they don't have control over any of the shit that they say or do or any of that sort of stuff.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, and if you're somebody who has just listened to the first what to expect when you're expecting, now you're listening to this one. There is another one that we did that we had our sister-in-law Laura on, and she talked about postpartum and the depression that kind of came with that, and how she was able to seek help through that through her first, um, and how she was able to make it much better for her second kid's situation. So if and that is a very real situation for a lot of people, um, where it isn't all just sunshine and roses, and it can be really, really challenging. Um so we do have an episode with an actual woman describing her experience with it, um, because I am not well versed in that subject. Um I am very grateful that my wife really crushed childbirth, the whole process of it from carrying to birthing to the first few years after, and she's continuing to crush it as a mom.
SPEAKER_04:Um not to say that women who get postpartum don't depression aren't crushing it. You just haven't experienced it.
SPEAKER_03:I'm just like sharing my experience.
SPEAKER_04:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:Um but yeah, it's it can be very hard and it can be very challenging. Um but one thing I was gonna say was because I think Brian had said it earlier about like just jump in.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:But what if your spouse doesn't let you jump in? What if they don't want you to jump in? What if they're nervous with you with the baby? Um, because that can be a hard thing. And that's where I think the advice of supporting in those little ways is good because it doesn't meet a wall. Where sometimes if you're trying to help somebody through a hard situation, sometimes you can run into a wall where they're like, I don't want your help, like leave me alone right now. But by doing those little behind-the-scene things, those aren't things that can cause anything to jump up.
SPEAKER_02:You shouldn't theoretically get pushback if you're just doing little things to support. I was thinking about this as well because we have a connection to people where that became the scenario where I don't know the full scope of it because we're not that super close with them, but from what I've heard, that became the case where mom was very, just leave it, I'll handle it. And I don't want you to do this, that, or the other thing. And it became this point of tension where now there's some resentment because she's having to do everything, but she's not letting the partner step in and help. But it's because he had never shown a willingness or a want to be a part of it as much as maybe she had hoped. It's a very confusing scenario, but I can understand how that would get there, especially if there wasn't communication leading up to what is your part gonna be. And that's why I think that's so important to have those conversations. I think you alluded to it, Mark, where it's just on the lead up. When you're going through pregnancy, don't just get so caught up in preparing for the baby being there. You also need to prepare for parenting. Yes. You need to prepare for what that's gonna look like for you and your partner and have these types of discussions of hey, let's get on the same page when it comes to the simple things of like diapers. Are we doing diapers or cloth diapers? Like, I know there's a thousand little things, but make sure that you are on the same page or at least understand where each other are at with a lot of those different scenarios.
SPEAKER_05:But see, so like my I don't want to throw anybody under the bus, but a very close friend of mine uh is having a baby. Okay. So they're they are uh she's very close to taking her time off, she's taking 18 months, but the language that he chooses to use is very much like it like, well, she wants this, so we're doing this, and she wants that, and we're gonna do that. So, like, that's what I'm trying to say. I I tried to give it as much thought as I could on the way down. It's like it's not about you, and you really need to be careful with if you want to be uh an involved partner, then and I'm assuming you do if you're listening to this, you like the phrase how do I support you right now is like completely saved us because sometimes it's I don't know, sometimes it's there's nothing you can do, sometimes it's you know, this, that, and the other thing. And that's why I'm saying it if you take time to really kind of get to know your wife, at least you can, you know, when those things go up, or like, I got this, like just go whatever. You're not going down and to bed and then sleep, and then now she's upset because you're doing the thing she desperately wants to do, but she can't, because she's forced to be in this situation. Maybe you go down and get like fill up a yeti full of water and like leave it on the bedside table or something for her and not for you. Because what I find in those moments, it's like they don't really know what it is that they want, but they just want that moment to be over.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:And so by you doing something like a random act of kindness or a thoughtful thing, again, in my experience, it helps to kind of ease that for them. But it starts with being on the same team and not like not downplaying the the other side of them. Like, and and for some people it takes practice. Like you're not, you don't want to villainize your partner even when you're talking to like buddies and that sort of stuff, you know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_03:Right, which is very much the dad lingo or the dad, like the typical dad conversation type thing.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, and it's like it's very like you know, you talk to the buddies, like, oh, she wants to do Montessori, so now I gotta figure out a way to do Montessori school. I don't like that. Well, like if you don't care, then that's a different situation than what she wants to do it. Because if she's done the research and she's looked into it and she's made the suggestion and you don't care to do those things, then that's completely different. That's not a that's not a we, that's that is a her thing, but you still are a united front, you still have to present it as a we, yeah, in my opinion. Yeah, unless you're going to do your own research and you disagree. That's a different story, right? Yeah, I don't know. Um yeah, I I I think it really does start. I know we said it before, but I'll say it a hundred times again. It the communication is key, especially going into such a terrifying thing. But you really have to remember that like you are a united front in this because God willing, you're gonna you're gonna be doing it together forever. Right. You know what I'm saying? So you just yeah, you just have to be there.
SPEAKER_02:One thing I wanted to touch on quickly, because you mentioned it a couple of times about being selfish. One thing humans are all selfish, that's in our nature. But one thing that I've learned about myself is it like it's it's a learned self-sufficiency. So I don't know, you and I are similar in some ways with this, Mark, where I feel like it's you learn to be self-sufficient and you come out of that to now, like you said, being needed. Where my version of um helping Meg for a period of time, I thought was being self-sufficient. If she doesn't have to worry about me and I'm taken care of, then I'm one less thing on her plate and she's more freed up. But she took that as being isolated. Exactly. I'm isolating her and I'm not being as involved. Where that was something where up until then, that's what I thought other people needed from me was for me to be self-sufficient so that I wasn't on their plate. That's the thing from childhood up until adulthood. And I think that is from talking with my therapist, that is a common theme with men where you go through these stages, you're a troublemaking kid, you're always too much energy, you're way too much, and then at some point you kind of learn, wait, if I am just reserved to myself and I figure my own crap out and I'm nobody's problem, then I'm gonna I'm left alone and I'm not a burden on anybody. And then you take that into adulthood. But then when that gets introduced into parenthood, now it's a now it's an issue because this is the spot where you need to be vulnerable and overly involved. This is the part where you need to be able to initiate conversation and help your partner and be the one who's um taking that initiative, like Brian said, and figuring out what they need before they even know that they need it, which is very counterintuitive to I'll stick to myself and make sure I'm taken care of. Now it's okay, I need to make it all about these other people.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, yeah, it's and I think communicating that, even your actions, communicating it helps them digest it a little bit. So that's where I like I came up with the how do I best. Support you right now. I don't know. Just leave me alone. Okay, well, I'm just gonna go get you a glass of water and then I'll be back. So that they don't think I'm over there, even if I am doom scrolling on the counter and like you know, have taking a second of myself, they don't think I'm down there doing something or like you know, just ignoring them or anything like that. There is that they know that I I am coming back or I'm doing something for them or I am you know doing whatever.
SPEAKER_04:Being a mom, especially in the early stages, is just super isolating and lonely and can be super lonely, even if there's people surrounding them, like because often they can feel like they're on their own journey by themselves, and there's so they they doubt themselves so much. Yeah, they're figuring everything out just like you are, yeah. Um they even though it feels like for us, like it feels like wow, this a lot of this comes naturally to you because you're so good at it. Yeah, they don't feel that way inside. No that's not what they're telling themselves, right? Um so yeah, uh getting uh I forget what I was gonna say. I was gonna make a point. Yeah, it's true.
SPEAKER_05:Around the isolation piece when they're feeling isolated. But to touch on that, one of the scoring, I'll come back to it. Do you got it? No, no, no. No, you go ahead. You go.
SPEAKER_03:I'm trying to remember what I'm talking about. So I'll come back to it. What do you need right now?
SPEAKER_02:We best support you.
SPEAKER_05:One of the scariest things. Sorry. Got it. I'm butting back in.
SPEAKER_04:Um, so helping them feel seen. Yes, and and uh yeah, doing all of those things that we talked about. It's really just about them feeling seen and and not alone. Absolutely. Uh that's that was my point. So that was good. Great point.
SPEAKER_03:I'd recommend buying a house with Joey and having your first kid there so that his wife is there for your wife as well. Worked out quite well forever.
SPEAKER_05:We're available, I guess. Yeah, reach out. Do you have me? Um one thing I think is overlooked a lot is how scary it is for. I'm just gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna stop saying our wives because it sounds weird to me, and then I keep pausing. My wife was terrified when I went back to work. And there's always a conversation before the baby comes. It's like fucking boomer parents, how much time are you taking off? Right. And then now all of a sudden there's a clock and there's this unitedness, or there's this team effort, your tag team in this thing together, and then all of a sudden it's like you're on your own, doomsday, I gotta go. And one of the most dreaded decisions about when you become an adult is what to do for dinner. So if I could go back in time, I would skip the dishes or order whatever I needed to order or make the meals myself to take that load off of her plate. Because even when even when you have a friend that just had a baby, one of the best things you can do for them is to like make them a meal or have pizza delivered to their house or something like that, so that they don't have to think about what they're gonna do for dinner because life's continues to happen. Yeah, and when you're sleep deprived and you're going through all this stuff, little things like that can go a crazy, crazy long way.
SPEAKER_03:And if you are making a meal for somebody, just check what their preferences are, you know, like find out how much onion they love and stuff.
SPEAKER_01:You put onion in there?
SPEAKER_03:No, we we just had a few meals that were made that we were very grateful for. Um, just made very differently than how we would have made it.
SPEAKER_05:See, I love shit talking people's cooking. It was great. Like, I like going to other people's Thanksgiving, like, oh my god, that turkey was awful. That was so bad. So that would be like when we did it, our neighbors like cooked us meals and stuff like that. And I was like, oh yeah, but we're going to their house for dinner for regularly.
SPEAKER_03:So, on the practical hospital side of this, assuming that you are having a baby in a hospital, um, my advice and my wife's advice would be to make it as comfortable of an experience that you can afterwards. She wished she had like a big cozy blanket. The blankets and the sheets that they have on hospital beds are not very comfortable. And she said that she experienced um extreme like coldness after having the baby. Yeah. Because you go through this like very um traumatic experience to your body. Your body is put under a lot of stress, and then afterwards, your body's trying to process everything that happened. And she said she had this like uncontrollable chill and she just couldn't get warm from it, kind of thing. And she wished she had like just a big blanket to be able to like cozy into. Bring your own pillow if you have your own pillow to make it a little bit more comfortable, and then bring snacks to the hospital because what did you need to do stores? Gotta have snacks. Snacks need to be everywhere.
SPEAKER_04:Maddie was big on that too.
SPEAKER_03:She said, keep me hydrated and keep me fed. Yeah, like because the shops and the stores that are in the hospital close. Right. So, like we had our son and like midnight type thing, like it was middle of the night. So it's not like you can grab food easily. Um, so she was saying, like, make sure that you have that stuff. So, kind of like if you are going to a hospital, try to make it as much of your living room as you possibly can. Like, we brought a mus like a stereo so we had music playing, right? And then like bring your comfort things so that you can. So, this is for like even after the baby. So, like when like we had to spend an extra day in the hospital because my son's um, I think he I forget what it was, he was jaundice or something like that. Like he was looking a little pink. Oh no, and they had to check his blood um because my wife had some like pre-diabetes with some of the pregnancies. So they had to check and monitor his blood, and we had to have, I think it was like three good checks before we were allowed to be discharged. So we had to spend like the night and then another full day and another night at the hospital. So just making sure that like if you do have to spend a prolonged period of time there, that you can make it as cozy as possible for your wife, but also for you as well.
SPEAKER_05:No, no, that's where I was gonna because my mind, you've ruined it. No, because my mind I was. I was like, I can be uncomfortable. I can fucking be, I don't need the anything you just said. I was like, I don't need any of that shit. I can be uncomfortable for a couple of days, but then I clicked, I was like, oh no, for her. For her, these things make make total sense, but you fucking need that. No way.
SPEAKER_03:Why would you choose to be uncomfortable? You're already not like, No, no, no, no, no, that's a little bit more.
SPEAKER_05:Bro, bro, don't picture this, okay? You just go through the craziest vasectomy of all time. You get an infection in your vasectomy, and you look over, and your wife is just sitting there all cozied up with a blanket and a pillow. Get out of here.
SPEAKER_03:Be uncomfortable. It's not gonna be comfortable. No, it's okay.
SPEAKER_04:Don't have to make it on the floor. You need to. Solidarity mark over here. No, first.
SPEAKER_03:They're comfortable first. Make yourself comfortable. They need terror.
SPEAKER_05:They need to feel like you are suffering.
SPEAKER_01:That's what it is.
SPEAKER_05:It is what it is.
SPEAKER_02:You can't bear a number. You need to break that down. You can't be fucking like, have you seen the fucking view of this window?
SPEAKER_04:I mean, use common sense though. Oh my gosh. Another bit of preparation you can do uh is uh everybody's family dynamics are different. Yep, good point. So when it comes to uh talking to family about what expectations are around like when you can see the kid or if you're coming to the hospital. Very good point. Uh and especially you have to take care of your side of the family. Bare minimum. Uh your partner should not have to deal with your family really at all. Yeah, especially. You need to step up to the plate and uh figure out any of those uh hiccups if there are gonna be any. Uh hopefully you have wonderful families and there's no issues. But we know that's not always the case.
SPEAKER_05:I would say the statistics are in the favor of it's not gonna be that way. And I would prepare like a you and your partner versus the world type of mentality. Yeah, because the key to happiness is low expectations, and if you're expecting those grandparents to be the grandparents you had, just have low expectations. That's all I'm gonna say. May not be the case.
SPEAKER_03:I challenge that to in those conversations let your expectations be known. Yes, I don't think that it's clearly communicated. I don't think that it's bad to say like I want you there. Like I'm then I don't think it's bad to say I don't want you there. Yeah, like maybe I think sometimes we manage people's feelings too much without just saying the shit that we want to say, which then can cause conversation, good or bad, but it can get the ball moving in a direction because like I think like if it is important to you or the your wife to have her parents there or her mom there, especially, then it's like we want you to be there. We want this to be a priority that you are there for us in this time. How can we make that happen together?
SPEAKER_05:See, the in the room conversation tends to be a stressful one, right? But we had our kids during COVID, so we got we got lucky with that because we didn't know. So I wouldn't even know where to start with that now. If you're if it's even a thing or if you're allowed to, but I put that on the radar.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, yeah, again, if the scenario is like it if your dad and your partner, your wife is going to be having the child, it's her call. Whoever she wants in the room should be in the room. Again, it's it is a tricky one, I will say, because I mean I'm kind of checking myself on that because it still is your kid. You can express it. And you can put it out there, but also there's a matter of body autonomy, privacy. You're gonna see some shit if you're in that room. Literal shit. So yeah, literal shit. So then there's a portion of that as well. So if she's very uncomfortable with someone being in there that you want to be in there, I would say leave it to suck it up, yeah. Suck it up, leave it out. But if you want somebody there, again, I think what we're doing here is communication and expectation.
SPEAKER_05:Your mom doesn't need to be in the room. Like, if you're if you're like, I don't know. That's what I was trying to figure out. Who would you like to do that? Do you have a momager? Like, if you're one of those dads that have or like super close to your mom, maybe I get some hate for this. I don't know. But like my opinion, your mom doesn't need to be in the room. I'm sorry.
SPEAKER_03:Like your mom or your wife's mom?
SPEAKER_05:The wife's mom can.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, okay. That's more what it was.
SPEAKER_05:That's more of like a comfort there, but dad's mom doesn't need to be in the room.
SPEAKER_02:But if there's a scenario of maybe dad's mom, this is gonna be her only grandkid.
SPEAKER_05:Well, and mom's mom's got plenty of grandkids. Don't care.
SPEAKER_04:In my scenario, like my wife and my mom uh have like bonded and developed a really good relationship. Context is important. It came to the point where she was like, Yes, I absolutely want her there. So like, and that was amazing, but yeah, never my expectation.
SPEAKER_00:Perfect.
SPEAKER_03:I'll also offer up my wife's sister, she should be a midwife, but she's also doing well at what she does. Nice. But she was in our room and she was just one of those. She has had at that point, she had had five kids already. Oh, so when my wife was having her first and having both of her sisters in there, but mainly this one sister was a very big calming presence, not only for my wife, but for me, because this is my first run at it. My wife got to be there and witness some of these other births. She'd been in there and experienced what childbirth is like. Um, I hadn't, so I didn't know what's going on, what I'm expecting, other than what you've seen on TV, but you don't know how it's gonna go. You could end up in emergency C-section like Mark, you could end up at home in home birth like Brian, or you could end up having a vacuum sucking your kid out of your wife like me. And it can be very scary experience for the husband, for the dad in that matter. Um, I know we talk a lot about the wife and making sure they're comfortable, and I think we're doing our due diligence here to make sure that they are seen and heard. Um, but I also want to like talk about the dad experience in what you feel and what you see and what you experience in that room because I remember wanting to be helpful, but also not wanting to do something that's gonna get in the way or hurt. I ended up drowning my wife a little with her water bottle trying to clean. So having a straw, that wasn't a big clue for the next ones. Um, but having my wife's sister there was very calming and balancing for me because you see your wife in pain. There's nothing you can do to help. You're trusting the person in charge to deliver this baby and keep both of these people alive and healthy, and you can't do anything but stand there. You can hold an arm, you can hold a leg, you can be a presence in the room, but that feeling that I was feeling is very hard to describe, but being able to look over and see my sister-in-law, who's been through this and look at me, and like she's managing both of us at this point. She's looking at me, it's gonna be okay. It's gonna be okay. It's like it's gonna be okay. We're gonna get through this together. It's like, okay, like I'm getting emotional just thinking back to that. So that's why I say, like, as much as like, yes, it is your wife's room, it is her body, she's going through this, but you you also, as a dad, won't know what you need until you go through this. Yeah, but I would just say, like, a calming presence goes a long way, whether that's the midwife, whether that's the doctor, whether that's uh sibling or whatever it is, somebody who can kind of help balance you equally in that situation.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, I didn't I didn't get that experience, obviously. Like my wife was high as shit. We have pictures of her just like, hey. Um for me it was like prayer. Like I was scared and just I just felt there's a room full of people, and I was I I I don't think I've ever felt more alone. And I just prayed that Robin made it out okay, and that this was gonna be a good thing, yeah, and that we didn't get this far just to get this far. Right. And when the doctor pulled the baby out, it's a di it's not what you expect. It's a different color than what you think it's gonna be. It's it doesn't really look the greatest. But when you hear that voice for the first time, it's indescribable. It's like it's just but the fear is almost blinding because you don't really realize the severity of situations, and even if it's a regular natural birth, like it's it could be it could be very scary. And I would be not I would not be telling the truth if I thought I was like a really scared that I was gonna be a single parent for a minute there when they're trying to operate and she's just like passed out. And once in one birth we had her sister there, who is a nurse. I don't know if she helped because she's very much like listening to the language and like and like engaged in on that. And I think there were times where I was really excited and I wanted to see, you know, what was going on, but I just also wanted to like just not be there. I was very, very, very, very, very scared. Yeah, and I don't think people brace you for that. Um, but on the like coming again, coming out on the other side of it is like it's the most magical feeling that you're ever gonna get. So just try to like live in it as long as you can.
SPEAKER_02:Um, there's no relief like that moment. Like that is it's like oh your partner's okay, and you know that the baby is alive, breathing.
SPEAKER_05:It's like uh yeah, it's like again, you've waited so long to get to this moment, and you're just like, fuck, I just want it to be. And I think I think more I think I needed to know that that was normal. Right. Like that feeling in that moment, yeah, you're not alone, it is very normal, and you just have to trust the process and they're in the best hands they can be in, whether it's mid with a midwife or a doctor or whoever.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that's what was hard with for my wife to experience as well, because her first niece, so like the first child being born into her family from her sister, didn't make it. So to one, have that anticipation and excitement of the first niece or nephew, the first grandkid, your sisters having the first this is your family now growing, and to not make it through that experience and the tragedy and sorrow that hit the family through that um was really hard for a lot of people. Then uh when the next one came, everything was okay, but the fear was there because you've seen it happen and you know that experience of what happened. You're almost waiting for it. Yeah, yeah. What do we have? 23 kids now in the family. So you go through it a lot. And for Joe's mom, especially, but also um his sister who lost the baby, that's 24 other or 22 other times that you're terrified that that's gonna happen again, right? Yeah, so there definitely was a lot of nervous energy from my wife's mom in the room because of that experience and the fear that came along with it. We had um my wife had these baby heart rate monitors on her belly while we were waiting to go into labor.
SPEAKER_05:Well, this is from like the 70s, right? Like you had a big baby ago. 18 years ago. 18 years ago, yeah. AI wasn't even a thing.
SPEAKER_03:So they were monitoring his heart rate, and you've got the machine going beside you that's like doing the little ticker alongside of it. Yeah, and then comes my my wife's mom thinking she knows what all of the things mean, and her anxious energy. She's like, Why isn't it, why isn't it moving as much? Like, what's going on? And like looking at the thing, and like all of a sudden, just like you can see the terror kind of build up. Nurse comes in, moves them around, walks out of the room, everything's fine, you're good. And it's like there are those people in those rooms that can bring the nervous energy, there's the ones that can bring the calming energy. I remember, and I don't know if I told this in her one of the birth stories, but the they were trying to get an IV in for my wife, and I think this was during contractions, so she's actively like her body's going into like convulsions while they're trying to get an IV in. And the nurse, God bless her, just could not get this IV to hit. She's trying multiple times. My wife's starting to get pissed. Then another nurse was like, Let me maybe let me try this one. And she came in and she timed it, she had that calming energy. She spoke to my wife, helped her like find her zen spot, got the IV in, and everything was okay. It's just like the ups and downs of a delivery are so crazy you experience. Um, but it's something that like you you never forget. Like we talk about our kids growing up and trying to remember those memories and being a present dad and being there for those moments. And I think back to those delivery rooms, and I'm like, I'm feeling like I'm right back in there, like I can remember the sounds, the smell, like everything about that experience, like it sticks with you. Yeah, it does stay with you.
SPEAKER_02:And like you can think that you're not going to get scared, but you are, yeah, and like just be prepared for that. I think that was a good point, Mark. Like, nobody really prepares you for that. Like, I'm someone who pushes away fear, like I did that so much throughout my life, where I'm like, I don't want to be afraid, but that's gonna be a moment for you, especially the first one, yeah.
SPEAKER_05:Even like like doctors and stuff would like look at and be like, Well, you're you're handling this pretty well, and be like, Well, on the inside, I'm fucking dying.
SPEAKER_03:So there's a level of like religiousness that I find for myself that causes you to try to not think of the fear because then it means that you're not being faithful that lack of faith.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah, fuck and if you don't have faith, then that's how that's gonna happen.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, so like that's just something that I would say to like allow yourself to understand what those feelings are. Because I'd say like I was scared from like conception, like it feels like this gift that can be taken away at any minute, right? Because it is very fragile, yeah.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, yeah. I was I think I was most scared like early on in the pregnancy, right? Yeah, uh, just and I just didn't want to get my hopes up too much because I didn't want to get my heart broken, right? Right, absolutely, but yeah, I feel like in like the delivery room and stuff like that for us, I was just always focused solely on like Maddie and the midwives, yeah. And like they they gave me calm. It's like especially the midwives. Maddie is like freaking out because she's like, she's not really sure if she's gonna be able to push this baby out. Yeah, I'm like, I'm not really sure if you are either, but they say you're gonna, so let's trust them. They've seen this a few times, so uh all my faith faith and trust in that.
SPEAKER_03:This is a horrible correlation, but like I get the same feeling when they go on a flight. Like the flight attendants, they've done this so many times, they're gonna be okay. If they're not freaking out, we're gonna get it. Yeah, exactly.
SPEAKER_02:You see them sit down, buckle up, and look and sweat. Yeah, buckle up. It's about to go down. It's pretty, yeah. I would say the same. It's a good correlation.
SPEAKER_05:Yeah, it's like when you get on the flight, you're like, oh my god, oh my god, oh my god, oh my god, wait a second. Yeah, these guys do this all the time. There's millions of flights. Yeah. And it's true.
SPEAKER_02:A good nurse or midwife can like honestly make or break that experience. Yeah. Or like if you have someone, and you gotta remember too. If you are having a tough experience, one, that sucks. I'm sorry. Or if you had a bad experience, but two, they're humans too. You don't know what their day was like, you don't know what they just came from. Yeah, they see a lot of shit in what they do. Um, so also don't give them too much of a hard time for it. But I yeah, I will say that for like for us, we did midwife for both. Uh, she was incredible. She very much brought that sense of calm, that sense of understanding, that sense of, yeah, watch me as long as I'm chill, you be chill. Because that means everything's going exactly how it should.
SPEAKER_05:So, one thing that I'll say to that is yes, but also like fuck the nurses at the same time. Not actually, but like um I'm interested to see where you're going here. They cause so much trauma and stress for Robin. Oh, really? Because they would conflict their both our kids were in the NICU. Yeah. So Robin wanted to breastfeed, and Aubrey, my daughter, was like four pounds and like couldn't breathe and swallow at the same time. So that's not an option. She's not latching.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:And one nurse was like, it's totally okay, it's fine, like you're good. You can pump. The next nurse is like, the nipple confusion, and this and the this, and like you have to get out of the thing. And then another nurse was like, if your baby doesn't like take milk from your breast, you're going to develop like a like a uh basically like a trauma bond or whatever. So now we've got like three different things, all stressful, and like now Robin's like super, super stressed. She can't even produce the milk because she's so like overwhelmed with it that we had to have like a serious conversation about like what's more important. You're like the fact that the baby's getting the milk from a bottle, or the fact that you're so stressed out that every time you hold the baby, now it feels like you're stressed out. Right. So let's just do what we need to do to get the fuck out of here.
SPEAKER_06:Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:In my I mean, I said it in a nicer way, but like those nurses caused us so much thing that for the second one, we basically walked in and we're like, this is what we're doing. We're gonna try it, and if it doesn't work, we're going to pump, it's gonna be in bottle. We need the number one bottle or the number zero nipple, and we're the thing, and then you get the not your first time, okay. Yeah, yeah, we'll do it. And then they it's like when you walk in as and you're the like a first-time parent, every single person tries to tell you factually how it's going to be, and no one knows what the no one knows what the fuck they're doing.
SPEAKER_02:Like no one. Yeah, well, they they knew what they were doing for one scenario, but that's not your scenario. No. And that's like I think that we touched on that so well, I think, in the first go around with this. What you can you expect is just that. Your scenario is yours. Nobody else has had that. Your kid has never existed before. So nobody can tell you with certainty that this is the way that you should parent or this is the decision you should make. So I think that's why I love that we circled around so much of like you can never be too prepared. So prepare yourself, read the books, do the thing, do the thing, but also realize that all that preparation can go out the window at any moment.
SPEAKER_05:Like that's dude, you can formula feed a baby. Like, I formula fed a baby in the 80s. I'm pretty sure half that shit was cocaine. I'm fine.
SPEAKER_06:Totally fine.
unknown:I'm totally fine.
SPEAKER_03:It's very true. Yeah, it's very true. You know what I'm saying?
SPEAKER_05:Like, it doesn't, if it makes your life easier, it's the most important. Totally, yeah. It's just like, and I remember now that we've we've talked about that, like I remember being there and fighting with Robin's like, no, they say that there's a connection, and then they say there's nipple confusion, and then they say that babies that are are uh you know, breastfed perform better better, whatever. I'm not proving my point, Margaret cocaine formula. But like breastfed babies, there were statistics that they're much smarter or whatever, that they have a better 401k or some shit. I'm just like, it doesn't fucking matter. And how are you gonna measure that shit out? Like, who cares?
SPEAKER_02:Just just get the baby growing and let's get out of here. And that's how that nurse knew that it wasn't your first time when you got sweaters. Because you have that understanding when it isn't your first, that it just doesn't matter.
SPEAKER_05:I have a resting bitch face, and when I don't like you, it's very hard to like remove the bitch from the resting face. So it was just kind of like I walked in and I was like, fuck you, fuck you, fuck you. Give me the fucking nipples. I'm I'm not dealing with your shit. We got it from here.
SPEAKER_02:Um scrub me up. But honestly, that's your nurse. No, please don't.
SPEAKER_05:Speaking of scrubbing, okay, one of the things that I remember terrifying me the most was bathing the baby. Yep. How do you guys bathe a baby?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I remember the nurse doing it the first time.
SPEAKER_05:And I was so grateful for that nurse.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, it was wild. And for me, it was like seeing how they handled the baby gave me more confidence that this baby isn't fragile. Yeah.
SPEAKER_05:They handle it like one of Brian's sourdough sandwiches. They flip it over and around and they fucking pause it in the air. It's crazy.
SPEAKER_03:The video online where it's like bathing your first baby and it's like so calm and then it's like bathing the second, and it's this like orangutan just man-handling it's young. It's so wild. Yeah. I we uh uh when we had the baby at home, we had um like a bath seat type thing. It was like a little baby rocker that was mesh, and it would go in the bath, and then we would use like a cloth. I've always found it super cute because I would get the cloth, like one of the little tiny tables. Get it wet and just like put it on their belly, and it's so cute. Yeah, a little warmer memory.
SPEAKER_05:Also, a tip if you sorry to cut you off, but tip if you have a male uh baby, get one of those face cloths, and while you're bathing him, put him put the face cloth over top of the the bits and bits and nuggets, and that will you won't get peed on. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:You're just you're also just gonna get peed on. It's not a good thing. No, no, no.
SPEAKER_05:You get peed and puked on. I'm still getting puked on. Like three weeks ago I sent you a picture covered in puked.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah. It's gonna happen.
SPEAKER_02:Get used to it.
SPEAKER_04:This is good memories. I we had our we had a small apartment and there was only a stand-up shower in our apartment. So we had a portable like tub that we would put on our kitchen island. And then we'd just bathe them in there. And it was and he would always make like a huge like the kitchen tile was always just covered in water. It was great. That's adorable. Just good memories.
SPEAKER_05:I remember seeing pictures of like us. Our parents used to bathe us in the sink. Oh right, yeah, yeah. And that was that was like the picture to get in the 80s, I guess. Was like you in the sink. Right. I'm like when I think about it now, it's so fucking disgusting. The amount of we put in the sink, and I'm like, okay, mom.
SPEAKER_03:And soap can't take care of. I had a follow-up question for you two who I think you might have all mentioned it having a uh not having that connection right away with the baby. I was curious on a follow-up from that, listening back to that. Um, if you have any advice for somebody going through that or experiencing that, or if you're able to look at it from an outside view now, was there something that caused that?
SPEAKER_05:I think living vicariously through Joey's therapy, I have a lot of like childhood trauma that I haven't touched. And I have this like I I think that I have this particular like wall up that I don't let anybody into. And I think when Aubrey and I were like when we bonded the most, is I would just literally talk to her and tell her like what what I was like, like tell her all my secrets, tell her like basically just opened up, and it felt like the first time I had ever like broken down any barriers.
SPEAKER_03:Opening up that wall to yeah your baby.
SPEAKER_05:And then with my son.
SPEAKER_03:I love that. Sorry, I really love that. I think that's yeah, I think the way you described that of like I think there's a lot of people that have that wall up, and you just think that because it's a baby and because it's yours, that you're gonna put that wall down. But I think that wall is protecting so much of you and so much of the fear and everything that's wrapped up in that.
SPEAKER_05:I remember specifically we I wanted her out of that box so bad because she was in there for a long time, it felt like forever. And then we had a rocking chair in her nursery, and I used to sit on it, and she would be on like my chest, and then I would tilt back and I would just kind of like rock. And I remember singing the Fresh Prince of Bel Air theme song because that was the only song I knew that I knew all the words to, so I would just sing that to her all the time. And I just remember then like the one day saying like my real name's Mark, but you might call me dad. And then I was just saying, like, I was born in November 1986, and I would just like basically started from when I was born to every childhood memory, and then like it's weird saying it now, but like I would pick it up the next night, I would talk about where we left off, and then I would just and it was weird because maybe Robin was listening in on the over the monitor or some shit like that, but that's when I think I because I I was listening to the back on the episode and I was like, really? I don't know, I don't know. And then I started thinking about it. I'm like, I remember those nights, and I like I started looking forward to like my turn to put her to bed because I think I didn't have that experience with Maverick, it was like completely different and like the same sort of thing. I remember I remember Robin Robin, I don't want to put her on the on the spot or anything like that. Maverick was in NICU, and Robin was more so worried about Aubrey and like having to like she's like, We're your parents to her too. Yeah, so there was a conflict there where I was like, I want to be here for him as much as we were here for Aubrey. She's like, we literally can't, yeah, right, because we haven't we have Aubrey at home. Um so it was hard for me to then like leave the hospital. Whereas with Aubrey, we were staying in the Ronald McDonald house, we were there all the time. Yeah. And then with him, I think there was just so much guilt that when we got him out, it was like dude, this is like I can't wait for you to meet your sister. Yeah, I can't wait for you to do this and that, and like, and then it yeah, it was like uh she was such an amazing big sister right off the hop that it was like it was it was a great thing to feel like your family was complete. Like you just I just knew that it was complete.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, man, baby therapy though, that's a that's a thing, like that talking to your baby, tell the baby all your secrets. Every secret. I can't say shit. Nothing. They're not gonna remember that unless they're one of those freak babies that ends up remembering when they're older. But that's if that's the dice you get dealt, then sort of that's just bad luck. Yeah, I remember looking forward to that as well, though. Like that that witching hour, yeah, and that being my turn, because that's the way that we set it up where I think Meg's Last Feeding was usually around nine, and then I would be with the whichever kid it was until midnight, because then we were usually around three hours. So I remember that, always looking forward to that. And I think for me it wasn't about the connection piece because that wasn't there yet for me with the kids, it was just the simplicity of that time, even though it's the witching hour, and even though that's when both of our kids cried a lot and were up most of that time. It was just us, and like there was a sense of simplicity in that where I could just I knew my ways to rock them to get them to kind of chill out. I knew that's when we could sit and just watch a show. There wasn't any outside expectation, there wasn't anything that needed to be done other than you've got three hours together. Like as long as the nine o'clock feeding went all right, I just know I'm here to act and react.
SPEAKER_04:And the routine makes it easier for dad. Yeah, you know the game plan. That's it. It's like it just makes you it's it's easier to fit into that that pocket.
SPEAKER_05:And it does it, I know like there's lots of scary things. Like, there's lots of scary things, but like when you get dialed into the routine and like you get over those three first three months, it's probably the best time of your life, and you you won't realize it because you're so tired, but like those moments of just the stillness in the house of just you and the baby, and it's like yeah, it's just love. Like, that's what love like that is that is it, and it's so hard to get that experience again, right? Like, yeah, because once they start moving and running and stuff, like you just don't get that still quietness unless they're sick or like so, like in total transparency, we my wife and I have done laydowns with both our kids for their whole lives, right? So we didn't have the like it was always uh like rock them till they fell asleep, put them in their crib, we would go do their thing, we would lay with them until they fall asleep, and then we would go and do our thing. And last night, so for Aubrey just turned to seven, eight, eight, thank you very much for that. I got you um last night I was doing laydowns and she was like, Tomorrow, can I can I try sleeping by myself? And I was like, Absolutely not. Fuck that's wild. It went by so fast, and you think about it, you're like eight years is a long fucking time. That's two high schools. Like I can become like a doctor. That's a master's degree, right there. And it's like I don't think she's I don't think she's ready, you know? Yeah, she's not ready. But I she I hate that I hate that she's she's willing to experience it. Do you know what I mean? So it's like now I'm thinking, like last night I remember when she asked me, I was like kind of scrolling on my phone, I put my phone down and I was just like, I just fucking held on to it. And then I'm like, fuck, like I should be like this is what I should be doing every single night. And then it's like, but when you're in it, you're like, fuck, I just want to, I got so much shit to do, I gotta go fucking do this, I gotta do that. But that is that's what it is. Like if you're a first-time parent and like your things like take those take those nighttime type snuggles and those like things, like that's that's what it's all about.
SPEAKER_04:That's what I was gonna say. It's like I yeah, I didn't I don't think I would say anything to Brian before he was like, I don't think I would do anything differently because like I don't I didn't anticipate that being an issue for me. Right. Um yeah, struggling to bond with Leo in the beginning. Um, but it's basically the exact same thing you guys are saying, like just hold your kid as much as possible, smell your kid as much as legit. Literally like listen to all the noises he makes or they make. Um and yeah, once you're once you're you figure out like the the laying the putting your kid to sleep is a big thing. Yeah, like once I figured out the way that I because it's not gonna be the same way that your wife puts them down, yeah. You have to figure out your the dad way to put your kid down, and it's gonna be different for each kid. Like, you can fucking DDT them. Like my first was like he liked a firm bum pat in his like that was the thing that made him yeah. And then the second was like she I had to be standing and like rocking in a very specific pattern for her to fall asleep. And then the third was just he was just easy easy. He just like you just hold him and he just like passed out of it. I remember there's nothing that makes you feel like more connected to your kid than like physical contact uh and yeah, it's just the best. Getting them to sleep.
SPEAKER_03:I remember running my finger over their like eyebrows and their nose, and the kids still like if I'm tucking them in bed and I do that, they're like, Oh, it's like a little muscle memory for them.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, pass them right down and enjoy if you're fortunate enough. We had it with both of our kids where the first two weeks back were so chill, and it's like one, if you get that, enjoy it so much. Two, don't get faked out by it. Yeah, it's about to get weird.
SPEAKER_05:It's so funny you say that because I remember bringing the kid home, and there's this moment of like, what the fuck do we do? Yeah, like we don't have the nurses here anymore, like we don't have the things, nobody's calling, everyone's leaving us alone. Yeah, it's like it's weird, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:Especially when they're sleeping, you're like, we should be doing something. Like, what are they doing?
SPEAKER_05:And then I remember Robin, Robin's best friend, Brooke, had her baby a couple couple months after Mav, I think. And that was her first. So she calls and she's like, Oh my god, like I have the best baby of all time. Like, we've got her home, she's asleep. Like, this is fucking amazing. This is easy. And Robin's like, I don't have the heart to tell her. I was like, I'll fuck her. Sleep regression, colic, fucking all the shit. All the things.
SPEAKER_02:It's coming.
SPEAKER_03:It's around the corner.
SPEAKER_02:So if you have those two weeks, enjoy them.
SPEAKER_03:Are any of you guys gonna go get your vasectomy reversed? Or are we having more babies?
SPEAKER_04:Before I got mine, I told her that I would be willing to have a fourth if she wanted to. Yeah. Which it was a nope. It was a nope. Still a nope. Which is fine. But I was like, I came around to the idea. I was just like, I just love little kids.
SPEAKER_03:Oh my god, I am having such like baby, what's it called? Fever, fever, yeah. Um, at my son's basketball game, there was this little, like super smooth, super small little girl walking and like dribbling this little basketball. But like, she was so small, there's no way, I don't know how her body was walking, it did not make sense, but she was just so cute, and I'm like, I miss that so much. Nope. So cute. I don't have any of that.
SPEAKER_04:I don't have it either, but no, we're almost 100% out of diaper. Like we just have like nighttime pull-ups for crew, and then we're done, and we're so close, so I couldn't go back now.
SPEAKER_03:Oh, go ahead.
SPEAKER_05:It's funny that you say that because my son's four and he has nighttime diapers. So he like this is the if you're just getting we're talking about babies and the things, but like the fucking magic of toddlers, this fucking asshole the sharp turn and nose. And I'm like, I I had said to Robin, right? I was like, he shit in his diaper, and I was like, this could be the last shitty diaper that they ever changed. And I said it within earshot of him.
SPEAKER_02:That was a mistake.
SPEAKER_05:This asshole is like, hey dad. I pooped. You you fucking the the toilet is right there. He goes, I know. And I told my mom to change my diaper. I don't want you to do it. You are old enough to change your own fucking diaper.
SPEAKER_02:I want you to do it. This could be your last change.
SPEAKER_05:I'm not making this up. He has done this three days in a row. Tomorrow morning he's gonna be like, dad, dad, you got this, bro. I pooped.
unknown:Damn it.
SPEAKER_05:I will not be sleeping with you until you're eight. I promise you that, kid.
SPEAKER_03:On the other side of things, we had our first date night out without a babysitter. My son was babysitting. Wow. Saved so much money. It's fantastic. But it was crazy. We got back for bedtime. Did you just pay him? Um, we gave him 20 bucks. Okay. I don't know if we gave him to actually, I don't know if he's checked in on that or not. Maybe, maybe we don't say anything. I don't know if we've paid up or not.
SPEAKER_05:Bring him on Uncle Mark, I'll tell him how to send a voice.
SPEAKER_03:But it was great. We they we got some text messages at the very beginning that there was a little bit of conflict, and I was just like, figure it out, man. Like this is up to you. You gotta figure this shit out. And he's like, okay. And they had a good rest of the evening. Thank you. Got home after dinner. Everybody was happy still, put them in bed, and we got our date night out. Awesome. It's magical.
SPEAKER_02:That's not too far away, folks.
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SPEAKER_05:What one of the best things you can do for them is to like make them a meal or have pizza delivered to their house or something like that so that they don't have to think about what they're gonna do for dick. Because life continues to happen. Yeah. And when you're sleep deprived and you're going through all this stuff, little things like that can go a crazy, crazy long way.
SPEAKER_03:If you are making a meal for somebody, just check what their preferences are, you know? Like find out how much onion they love and stuff.
SPEAKER_01:You put onion in there?
SPEAKER_03:No, we we just had a few meals that were made that we were very grateful for. Um, just made very differently than how we would have made it.
SPEAKER_02:Didn't need another Liz on your shepherd's pie that was made very differently than another one. See, I love shit talking people cooking.
SPEAKER_05:It was great.