What's the Point?
What's the Point?
Standing on Business!
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What if the grudge you’re holding is the very thing slowing your growth? In this episode, we take a real look at offense, why it feels justified, how it spreads, and what it steals from your calling. We talk about how offense masquerades as righteousness, and how pride makes it easy to cling to things God is trying to free us from.
From there, we shift the focus to revival, not as a hype moment or a stadium event, but as a personal fire built in the quiet places: your altar, your habits, your unity with others. We unpack how the enemy doesn’t need to take your anointing if he can hijack your attention.
Jesus’ mercy in John 8 anchors the conversation. He didn’t ignore truth, but He also didn’t weaponize it. He chose restraint instead of retaliation, and that same mercy is what keeps our hearts soft when the world tries to make everything gray. Following Jesus means alignment, not image… action, not vibes.
We close with the Micah 6:8 blueprint: do what’s right, love mercy, walk humbly. If you’ve felt drift, distraction, or the sting of offense, this episode is a roadmap back to clarity, courage, and a tender heart.
Contact What's the Point?
- Email jonathan.walton@point.church
- Watch live or recorded services at https://www.point.church/
Please take a moment to leave us a rating and review the podcast! Thank you!
What's up everyone? Welcome back to the Five Kids in a Calling Podcast. I'm your host, Audrey Angeau. With me is Hudson Walton.
SPEAKER_04Hey guys.
SPEAKER_00Andrea Crader. Hi. Nancy Pavlou. Hey, and Lincoln Society.
SPEAKER_04Hey guys.
SPEAKER_00Just letting you guys all know that this is going to be the second to last episode of this semester, but we will be back in January. So, for the opening question. Would you guys rather be famous for something stupid like a meme or never be known at all?
SPEAKER_04I'd rather never be known at all because that's just chill. And I'd rather be chill. Like, why would I want to be known for something in the first place? Um, even more so, why would I want to be known for something silly? Like, I'd rather just live a chill life, bro. I'd be known. I agree.
SPEAKER_02I'm an agreement as well. Yeah, like I wouldn't want to be like the yodeling girl that's known for yodeling.
SPEAKER_04Like, is that the type of silly thing we're talking about here? Like what type of silly meme?
SPEAKER_00I guess something like that. I guess yeah, something like like goofy, nothing embarrassing like you threw up on yourself and it's all over the internet. Like nothing crazy. Or like the little girl that's like, we got cows, there's a cat farm outside.
SPEAKER_02You know there's a little girl that says that. That was from a movie, but she says it.
SPEAKER_04I've never heard that. Really? Really? Hello.
SPEAKER_01I've heard it a lot.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, I think I I know when I heard that, I was thinking, like, like, what are we talking about? Like embarrassing?
SPEAKER_00Like, I thought you guys would make up your own silly scenario to get famous for and be like.
SPEAKER_04You just heard my silly scenario, and I don't I don't want to live through that one.
SPEAKER_02Linking, what would be your silly scenario?
SPEAKER_06No, I'm just gonna stay undercover. Like, I don't want to be famous.
SPEAKER_02No, stay in my head.
SPEAKER_04You're gonna want to think about it.
SPEAKER_00No, Audrey, would you have a silly scenario? Hmm. Or stay unknown. No, I think my no, I definitely probably will one day end up getting known for something absolutely atrocious. Just because I'm so stupid. You're not stupid. Silly? You're so silly. Silly? Okay, guys.
SPEAKER_02So let's talk about the sermon from Sunday. Sunday, we heard an amazing message from Pastor Jonathan. The title of his message was The Stumbling Block of Offense, and it was incredible. If you haven't listened to it already, you can go watch it on YouTube or Facebook. It's awesome. Um, the first point that I want to discuss is offense is a spiritual trap that leads to spiritual drift. And offense always, most of the time will always feel like it's justified.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think we've all been offended at least once in our life, and we know that it causes a separation between you and that person.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And it just causes resentment in your heart. And you could you could feel that, you know? It just makes you naturally, because it's our human instinct, to want to veer away from things that have hurt us, things that situations that we don't like to be in. And if you have resentment in your heart, how can you love?
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_00You are called to love, but if you have anger and hatred in your heart, then how are you going to love your neighbor and how are you going to approach everyone in every situation with the love that you're supposed to? You simply can't. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04I agree. Offense is like you guys just said, really dangerous. Um especially in today's culture where people are constantly talking about each other. It offense is is very dangerous. It can sneak in so easily, especially because, like you said, it can feel like it's justified. Yeah. Uh you could feel like you're doing nothing wrong at all and you are on fire for God and and you think you're killing it, but you've let offense sneak into your heart and you don't even know. Yeah. And it is it causes a divide so easily, sometimes before you recognize it. And it's just it's very dangerous. And the enemy knows it's dangerous. So when God tries to realign his people or take you or your church to the next level, the enemy is going to start spreading his lies, making people offended with each other, dividing.
SPEAKER_00Exactly.
SPEAKER_04Then you're back at square one.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, because hatred and love cannot dwell in the same place together. Yeah. And one of them will have to cave. And most of the time it's going to be love that's going to cave. And you're going to automatically just default to the hatred and the resentment and judging.
SPEAKER_06I feel like sometimes it could be easier to be mad at somebody than it is to love somebody. Oh, 100%. Oh, very much so. Not even sometimes.
SPEAKER_00Because love requires so many things, like patience and just like unconditional love, truly, just to look past what that person's done to you, done to you and you know, move past it. Yeah. I really liked when he had said that revival never begins around us. It has to begin in us. That is one of my favorite things because I think we've all been to NAYC, right? Um, you know, whenever you're at NAYC and you have that moment and you're like, this is amazing. We're gonna go back and it's gonna be the best thing ever, and we're gonna start revival in our church from the youth and all this and that. And I think we come back and then you know it kind of dwindles down and the excitement's gone. And then we're wondering, like, what happened? Why is there not this crazy fiery revival happening in our church? And I think that this really hits on that feeling because revival is not supposed to be something that you wait for. Yeah. Not something that you're like, okay, God, where's it at? Like, bring it. It has to start with you. You have to be the change that you want to see. You have to start the stuff that you want to see, the revival. Yeah, I really like that.
SPEAKER_04Like, revival won't happen if everyone has that mindset. Like we're all just waiting around, like, man, yeah, it's been a long time since we had revival. God, uh, where's the revival? Our city needs it. Come on, God. Yes, like my classmates need revival. What are you doing, God? Like, no, like it starts in you.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, we have to build the altar first before God will ever send the fire. Yeah. Because God won't send the fire to where there's no altar.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, He just won't do it. Someone has to stand up and say, I want more of God, and I will do whatever it takes to get it and to make it happen and to see my city changed and my my friends and my family change and have revival happening.
SPEAKER_06And I think it's really easy to feel like, oh, I want revival when you're on that spiritual high, like NAYC. But yeah, when you come back to the normal life, are you are you gonna stay consistent enough to where revival comes? Like the heartbeat of revival is prayer. I heard Brother Taylor Fish say that, and that has really stuck with me because in order to have revival, you have to you have to pray and truly seek God, and then that's whenever revival comes. It starts in us.
Revival Begins In Us
SPEAKER_02And unity. Unity is a big part. I read a lot of missionary books, and one of them, I forgot which one, but one of them that I read, um, it said that we never prayed for revival. This was a missionary speaking. They said we never prayed for a revival, we prayed for unity within our city and within our country that we are called to. And once we prayed for unity in our city and in our country, that is when revival broke out. Because revival is centered on unity because we can't be disunified and then have a great move of God. It's just not possible.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, and and Pastor Jonathan talked about that on Sunday. He said that he believes that God is calling our church to a higher level and 100%. The past like five or six weeks, every single person ministering here has hit on pride. Yeah. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Or humility.
SPEAKER_06And you need God wants humility before he sends revival because he does he can't stand pride. Yeah. So you you have to you have to really be humble.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and that ties right into the the topic of offense, like we were just talking about. It's so much easier to be offended if you if you've let pride creep in. I'm so much more likely to be offended at my neighbor if I feel justifiably that they have wronged me. Yeah. And because that's pride. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, I think it's it's just really important to back to the mindset of revival, like that a lot of people have, you know, like when is it gonna come? Rather than let me make it happen. It's really dangerous because a lot of people, they're gonna focus on what everyone else is doing and they're gonna wait for everyone else to move before they move. Exactly. And if you are not willing to move with the slightest presence of God, even if no one else is doing it, then you are part of the problem. Revival will not come when everyone refuses to move. Exactly.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, it's uh I agree. It's a lot easier to get caught up in the winds of revival than to be there when it's just starting. Let me think about it at N A Y C. Um, anyone could walk up in there and feel God. Yeah. Like it's impossible to go there.
SPEAKER_03Because we're getting the Holy Ghost and getting baptized.
SPEAKER_04It's impossible to go there and not feel God, but like in our city, it's a lot harder. Like we have to be more intentional about it. You can't just walk in there and then God's just all around you, lifting you up, making you drunk in the spirit, like Britain.
SPEAKER_02I'd be carried out. Um, if you don't know what NAYC is, it stands for North American Youth Congress, and it is where over 30,000 young people from across North America and the world gather for about half a week of services. And we see signs, miracles, and wonders. So if you don't know what that is, for what we've been talking about, that's what that is.
SPEAKER_06I would definitely advise to go at least once.
SPEAKER_02You have to go at least one time in your life. And if you go that one time, you're gonna go.
SPEAKER_06You're never gonna want to miss an event.
SPEAKER_02It's so good. Yeah, like this time they were they were baptizing people um in the stadium that we were in in Indianapolis, Indiana. And like once they would baptize them, they would put them on the screen, and then the whole place would just erupt. Like it was so cool. But back to the message of back to offense.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, back to back to our topic. Um, I really like when Pastor Johnson said you can't carry a cross and carry criticism. I thought that was a really good point. I'd never heard it put like that, but like that's a beautiful way to say it. Yeah, you can't say that you want to walk like Jesus and carry the cross that Jesus carried when you're criticizing all the other believers who are trying to do the same thing. It just doesn't work like that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, no, it doesn't.
SPEAKER_00That's a really I really liked how he said that. Yeah. Um, I really liked when he said that if he was talking about the like the devil, if he can twist your perception, he will stop you from participating in the thing that will set you free. The devil's main goal is to try to make you blind to the good and make you only focused on the bad and make you hyper-fixated on everything going wrong rather than the few things or even the multiple things that are going right. Because if he does that, then he can convince you that people and everything is against you, and he will give you that victim mentality of like woe is me, everyone's doing me wrong, everyone is like hating on me, the situation sucks. Yeah. Um, and it's just things aren't always for the worst, things aren't always against you. Most of the time, nobody's against you. Yeah, it's yourself, yeah. Your mind plays tricks on you, makes you think that, but that's the devil. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04It was it was really powerful when he said the enemy he can't take your calling, but he can definitely change your perception of your calling. And if he does that, he basically took it. Yeah, like if you're if you have a war perception of the calling of God in your life, then it's it's it's null, it's void, and that's a lot easier than the enemy just taking the calling.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, that's really good. Uh, he also said the enemy doesn't need to take your anointing if he can take your attention. Yeah, it's so same thing. It's so good. It's it's so true. The devil oftentimes he tries to get in our head, and like we've been talking about, he shifts our focus away from God and the calling that he's called us to do. Um, and if we aren't careful and he does fully take that attention, our minds can become the devil's playground. Yeah, yeah. And that really isn't a good spot to be because when the devil when the devil distracts you ultimately, he's also influencing you. And you gotta really be careful in that situation.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04Because think how ineffective the enemy can make you if he convinces you that the church of God's people that you go to is wrong and that you are justifiably offended at your church.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Your walk with God is gonna stagnate if you believe you can't even trust the body of God.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, exactly. That's true. Yeah, and then the devil oftentimes will try to distort your perception to where it changes what you see long before it changes what you say. And so once you start seeing differently, then those thought patterns will become more and more normal for you. And so eventually, just like Hudson said, you won't trust the body of God anymore. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, because that's not a good spot to be in.
SPEAKER_04But because you'll start seeing what you think is wrong with your church before you start saying what you think is wrong with your church. And it's it's all in the head. That's what the enemy does. It's in what you see.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And you just have to watch out for that and and pray about that constantly because it happens.
Pride, Unity, And Humility
SPEAKER_00Thoughts are powerful. Super powerful. The more you linger on something or an opinion you have about the the bad things that you're seeing around you, the more that's gonna linger in your head, and the more things you're gonna. You know, like whenever you have like an a little disagreement with someone and you always like practice like what you wouldn't say to them. Yeah. It's like it's it happens like that. You you get offended, and then you think of like all the bad things that are happening, and you just start letting that creep into your mind day after day after day, and all you think about is the bad, and all you want to do is speak out against it and just bring it to the light.
SPEAKER_01Then you could even start bringing like building it up in your head way bigger than it ever was because you're thinking about it constantly.
SPEAKER_04It can start out so small, just a C, just one tiny opinion, like Audrey was just saying, like you go to your church and you don't like how the greeter greeted you in the morning. Just that that one thing that you can dwell on that and that can build, and then three months later, you hate the whole greeting staff. They all it keeps on going, and you're like, these people they don't love people, and it can stem all from the one experience, and now you don't like your church, like you don't trust your church, and you're an outcast from your church, and it can all start because of fence crept in, and you let your opinion become genuine criticism, yeah, and you just let that fester, and it's dangerous.
SPEAKER_02It is dangerous. I really liked when Pastor Jonathan said, When the devil can't crush your ministry, he'll destroy your motives or he'll mess with your motives. And that links back to what we were just talking about, because everything you do has a motive behind it, whether you know it or not, right? Like everything you do, you do it for a reason. And if the devil can't get to your ministry or to your faithfulness, um, he's going to try to distort why you do what you do. Yeah. Why are you singing? Why are you preaching? Why do you minister to your friends at school? And he'll try to twist it to where you're doing it for your own glory. And eventually, once you start taking the glory for things and you're not giving it to God, that is such a dangerous spot to be in. Like you do not want to be definitely in that pride situation. Exactly. Definition of pride. Yeah. You don't want to be there.
SPEAKER_00I loved when he talked about how appearance without presence is pointless. I think that was super good because it's like showing up to church is not enough if you aren't worshiping and you aren't being present with the Lord. And if you go to church just to wear your cute outfit and just to play the part and be like, oh, look at me, like I'm so cute. You're not accomplishing anything because that does not get you closer to God.
SPEAKER_02No.
SPEAKER_00You have to show up, like Pastor Jared always says, you have to show up expecting, expecting better things, expecting new. And you will see the change that you're looking for. You have to worship and be in the presence. And if you're at church and there's like the presence and you could feel it, and everybody there is worshiping but you, re-evaluate. Why am I here? Why am I doing this? If I'm if you're gonna go to church and you refuse to be moved, then why are you there at all? You have to go expecting and being willing to move when the presence of God is wanting you to.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, and by uh by us not expecting uh from God, I feel like we're limiting a limitless God. Exactly. And that's you you there's no need to limit him because he's like I said, he's limitless. Like he can do whatever you even can think or imagine he can do times I don't even know a number to think of because it's just he can do anything. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Like God has no limits, like, and we can't comprehend that in our human minds because we are limited. Like us human beings are limited. We've been limited since the beginning of sin. Um, and whenever we think about a limitless God, we're like, there's no way that he could be limitless because all we understand is limitation.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02But once you get the revelation that our God is limitless, then you you can and will come to church expecting a great move of God or expecting miracles.
SPEAKER_06Uh Pastor Jonathan also said, God is not calling us to divine amnesia, he's calling us to divine restraint.
SPEAKER_03That's good. Oh yeah.
SPEAKER_06This means that God isn't calling us to just magically forget all the wrongs and all the pain that somebody has caused you. Um, He's still calling us to remember what happened, but and then to remember all the pain and the hurt that was caused to us, but you see, he wants us to make the right decision, and it's still to get rid of offense and to forgive. Yeah. And I know there's been times in my life where I could have very easily have prayed on the downfall of the people who have who have broken me and who have hurt me. But instead, I I prayed and I was I I never I never wanted vengeance because vengeance is not mine.
SPEAKER_02That's good. Vengeance is the Lord.
Cross Versus Criticism
SPEAKER_04Pastor Jonathan talked about that in the Bible. How in Genesis 8 1 it says God remembered Noah. Yeah. Like remembering God isn't holding himself to divine amnesia either. It isn't a lack in his omnipotence. Yeah. If he chooses to, in quotation marks, forget. He doesn't literally forget our sins. Like God doesn't forget, but it's it's perfectly explained in 1 Corinthians 13. Love refuses to keep a record of wrongs. Yeah. So when we say don't remember their sins, it's not when someone does something to offend you, you're not literally making yourself forget that they ever did anything wrong to them. It's loving them and not keeping a record of what they've done to you because you love them. Yeah. Like you can't just snap and make yourself forget what they did. That's not how we work.
SPEAKER_02That's not how it works.
SPEAKER_04But you can love them enough to overlook it and treat them like that didn't happen.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I really love how Pastor Jonathan put it. He read um a verse in Isaiah 43, 25, and it says, I, even I, am he that blotteth out thy transgressions for mine own sake, talking about the Lord's, and will not remember thy sins. And so in this verse, the the Lord is meaning that he will not let our actions cause him to violate his own character because love and forgiveness is rooted in his character. Because he's not gonna let our sin and our shortcomings dictate how he treats us. So that's kind of what the Bible means whenever it says God remembers. Because remember, in the Bible means to put action behind what's been brought up to mind. So whenever God remembers something, he's gonna get ready to respond.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, when he remembers, he's reinstating his promises to Noah when he remembers him.
SPEAKER_02And Joseph too. Whenever Joseph, after um his brothers had lied and cheated him, thrown him into slavery, sold him there, and he had been thrown into prison and mistreated and accused and all these different things. Whenever his brothers appeared to him, once Joseph was in second in command over Egypt during the famine, Joseph remembered his dream. He didn't remember, I mean, he remembered the pain, but he wasn't focused on that in that moment. He re what he remembered and what he was about to act on was the promises that God had given him all those years ago.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because Joseph, out of like anyone, he had a reason to hold a grudge. He had a reason to be offended. He was very wrong. But like Andrea said, he remembered the promise. Yeah. Just like how God remembered Noah's the promise he gave Noah. Joseph, instead of being offended, instead of choosing to criticize, if that's how you want to put it, he chose to remember the promise of God in his life, and he chose the calling instead of letting the circumstances, instead of letting the people who wronged him take that from him and corrupt his character. And that's what we should strive to live like.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, and Joseph, he had the power to have literally sent his brothers away without any grain. They were in the middle of Yeah, they were in the middle of that seven-year famine, and they came to him for food, and they didn't even recognize him. And he could have very easily used that or had a grudge and said, No, I'm not giving you the food because of what you've done to me. But he forgave. And when you forgive someone, the peace that you get from forgiving is really is indescribable because you're you're you're letting go of that weight that that per that harm has caused you and you're giving it to God.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and make no mistake, forgiveness, it is it's not easy. Not at all. It's not uh um the enemy, he will try to warp your perception. He may make you think that forgiveness is being weak as well. On the other side of it, being easy, he may make you think that it's weakness, like you are letting them get the upper hand on you because you're forgiving them when you shouldn't. You should still forgive because it's not weakness, it's it's warfare.
SPEAKER_02Yes, I really loved how we put that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
Perception, Attention, And The Enemy’s Tactics
SPEAKER_02Um, so we're gonna give a trigger warning right now. So naturally, when we are talking about topics like forgiveness, some of these topics are harder to address than others. We know that forgiveness can be rough for some people because we understand that some people are facing or have faced all types of abuse like physical, mental, emotional, or sexual abuse. Most people will not understand the weight that that kind of situation can bring onto your mental, physical, or emotional being. And these situations can leave you feeling broken, lost, or with no good possible outcome. But God is our redeemer, and He and when you fully surrender, you give all that pain completely to God, and that act alone can lead to complete restoration and redemption. And our God, like the Bible says, is a very present help in times of trouble. Yeah, and when you ask for his help, he will answer. Whenever you invite him into a situation, he's not gonna tell you no.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, and the Bible talks about knock. All you have to do is knock. You just have to knock. And um, I don't remember where I was at. It was uh it was a like a convention or something, and one of the preachers said, Uh, when you get really desperate and you just look up and say, God help me. Yeah, and when you really cry out for help from God, from God, He answers that and He will help you and He will restore you and redeem you.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because forgiveness, especially for some people, depending on their circumstances, their past, it can be very hard. Um, some harder than others. It's it's warfare. Like we stated, it it hurts. It's it's not easy. God, He created you, He understands what you're going through, and He will understand how hard it is for you to forgive. Um depending on what happened to you, depending on what wrongs were done to you, you can look at a situation like that and be like, I'm expected to forgive this person. How could I ever do that? Like, there's no way God can't expect me to forgive this person. I can't forgive this person. But you have to remember that you are not forgiving whoever it is, you're not forgiving them for who they are, you're not forgiving them for them. You're doing it for you and for your salvation and for your wholeness. You will never be truly whole if you cannot let go of a situation that happened, no matter how deep it is, no matter how hard it is, you can never be whole again unless you truly give it to God, truly let Him take it and truly forgive. And I won't ever understand the situations that some people go through, but I know the principle still remains the same that yeah, yeah, we will all be made whole if we forgive.
SPEAKER_06And uh I think it's important to not um overlook the wounds that you have. Yeah, yeah. Like I know oftentimes um we can think that our wounds have healed by just completely disregarding them. Yeah, and then one event will happen and then it's just it tears those wounds even deeper than they were before.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because you can't just ignore them, that's not how it works. Yeah, like it's it's easy to to look away from them and just ignore them and feel like, okay, uh I'm doing good, and you just you don't focus on them, and you may convince yourself for a bit that, oh, I'm past this, I haven't thought about this in a couple months, a year, uh, I'm past this, I'm good. And like you just said, something can happen, it can come back up. That's because that'll keep happening continuously unless you fully give it to Jesus, and it may still happen even after, but it it just it won't be the same until you do it with God because God is the only thing that can restore some hurts in this world. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And it might take some time for you to be able to forgive whatever was wronged of you, but as long as you invite God into it, it's okay. Like it because healing is a process. Um, some people can be instantly healed and instantly restored, but we find that in the Bible. But then sometimes in the Bible, healing is a process, and so and it can be painful, healing can be painful, and so that's okay if it is a process rather than just immediate healing. But by the end of that process, you will be immediately not immediately but completely restored and completely redeemed once you ask God into that situation.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because you have to understand that God He loves you more than you will ever know. And like I had stated earlier, He understands, like Andrew was just saying, if something horrible happened to you, he isn't just gonna expect you to wake up the next morning and be like, I forgive this person, just like that. Like realistically, that's that's not how it's gonna happen. It's it's gonna be a process, but like Andrew is just saying, as long as you stick with God and trust in him through that process, you will reach wholeness and you will reach fulfillment.
SPEAKER_06And ultimately, God does mend the brokenhearted, yeah. Um so uh I mean you just have to you have to fully surrender and let go of it and let go. You need to let go and let God. I mean, that's yeah, that's like the only that's the only way I can describe it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, so what is biblical forgiveness now that we've kind of went over that topic, what do y'all think? What what did Sunday say? Um He first talked about Matthew 6, 14, where he said, if you forgive men of their trespasses, your heavenly father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgive men of their trespasses or their shortcomings, neither will your father forgive you of your trespasses. So it's a biblical mandate that we have to forgive regardless of our situation. It's biblical. We have to, it's a command.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_02Um and I love how Pastor Jonathan put it. He said, Part of me has to die in order for grace to live.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, that's really good.
SPEAKER_02Whenever he said that my eyes got disbeat on the world.
SPEAKER_06This be.
SPEAKER_04Yes. And it just it has to die. Make it die.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, you have to forgive again and again and again, as many times as it takes, as many times as you are wronged, because ultimately you have to do it because it's too dangerous for you to stay where you're at. Yeah. And to stay offended.
SPEAKER_06And um when when I mean when you talk about part of you has to die, I think that the part of you that's dying is the flush part of you. Because the flesh part of you is gonna want to see the downfall of that person. Yeah. Or want to get back. Uh I know when I was in school, you would always hear, Oh, they got me, I gotta give my get back. Like that's not that's not the right way to look at it. Um because I l I was looking up earlier, and there's three spots in uh the Bible where God talks about vengeance is his. He makes it very clear. He talks about it in Deuteronomy, in Romans and in Hebrews. So the vengeance is not, it's not ours. It's not ours to deal with. Yeah, we are supposed to forgive, but we're not supposed to get back at that person. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02That is God's job. He sees everything and he sees things that go on that we don't even see. And so for us to want to get vengeance back and us to want to judge that person is wrong because he is the ultimate judge. And vengeance is his. And if you try to take it, well, that might not work for you.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. And it might not happen how you want. God's vengeance for that person.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Don't keep checking socials to see like, did they get in a car crash? What did God do to them? Yeah.
SPEAKER_06I was just about to clarify that. I'm like, no, we're not praying that God destroys that person, but He will handle the situation how He sees it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Like letting God handle the vengeance isn't you being like, God, please let them step on a Lego in the middle of an eye. Just let them stub their toe or something.
SPEAKER_06Let them go to bed with both sides of the pillow hot.
SPEAKER_02Literally, like, that's not what we're saying. What we're saying is the Lord will deal with that person in that situation, how He sees fit and not how you see fit. Because our version of fairness and God's version of fairness is completely different.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, and past Pastor Jonathan talked about that. He said, um, humility is is looking at uh somebody and or pride is looking at somebody and saying, Oh, they don't deserve grace, but humility is saying, Well, neither did I. Yeah. Yeah. So it's it's very important to give grace because we don't deserve God's grace and we still get it.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because if you truly approach every person with that mindset uh and lifestyle ingrained in you, and your heart is like that, then you probably won't criticize or really be offended at anyone like ever. Yeah. Because that's living like Jesus.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And a character trait of God is forgiveness and love no matter what. Yeah. He gives us love and forgiveness unconditionally, and that ties back to him remembering, not remembering our sins. Because he won't let our shortcomings um dictate how he treats us. And I think that's wild. Like whenever he said that and he explained how like what remembrance truly means, yeah, I was shocked because I had never heard that before. And I was like, that is so cool.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and I think it it ties back to a matter of focus. Like we're talking about offense. If you magnify your offense, you're just gonna stay broken. Like if that's what you focus on, if you get offended and you magnify that you're gonna be stuck on that for a while. Until you move past it, that's where you're gonna stay. Yeah. And if you don't move on and that's all you do, you'll just remain broken. But if you let go of that and you magnify Jesus, your savior, you'll be healed. And you didn't even have to focus on the offense. Yeah. You just gotta focus on your savior, and then it'll all see itself out. I like how you put that. Focus on your savior.
SPEAKER_00I like that. It's really easy to make yourself the victim and to see and to like think, oh, that person's an I mean, obviously, if I think we've all made ourselves a victim at one point. I had a little phase of it, and but now I'll look back and I'm like, girl, what were you on about? It was not that serious.
SPEAKER_04Yes.
SPEAKER_00But that's all right. The Lord forgive.
SPEAKER_04And like if you need an example or a guy to look to, literally look at Jesus. Look what he did. He he had every right to be offended. Um for anything, everything spit on his he was he was getting crucified by his own people.
SPEAKER_02Like he was mocked, uh falsely accused, plucked his beard, yeah, he whipped all the things.
SPEAKER_06Like could have casted fireballs at people, like smited them down like he did the whole world, but no, he just said forgive them.
SPEAKER_02For then know not what they do, like and that's powerful. That's so powerful. Yeah, um they yeah, and because Jesus didn't forget the cross, he conquered it. And so God is not calling us to forget each each other's shortcomings, but he's calling us to remember them through mercy and forgiveness. So saying, I won't let that person's sin against me dictate how I'm going to treat them. Because if we truly want to be like Jesus, and then we truly have to forgive how he has forgiven us and say they don't deserve like whenever you say they don't deserve mercy. Well, I don't either. And so whenever we forgive someone, we have to completely not disregard their sin, but remember that we have received mercy, and so we will give mercy because we have received it. And who are we to not give mercy if we received it?
SPEAKER_04Yeah, it it goes straight back to love. Like you were just saying, if you truly love someone, you're not going to view them and talk to them and look at them through the lens of all the wrongs they've ever done. Yeah. I mean, think about it. If you're young, if you have a best friend, like you guys are besties.
SPEAKER_03Y'all are tight.
SPEAKER_04How horrible would your relationship be if every single time you talk to them, you only talked to them or looked at them or acted towards them through the lens of everything wrong that they've done to you. Yeah. That wouldn't be for a friendship. Yeah, every insult they ever did to you, every time they accidentally hurt you or intentionally hurt you. Can you imagine how strained that relationship would be? You'd become toxic. And then on another level, yeah, if you're older and you're married, your spouse, I mean, imagine if you only ever talk to your spouse through the lens of everything wrong that they've done. I mean, the longer the marriage goes on, both sides of that marriage they're gonna have a longer list of things that they've done wrong. No one's perfect. Can you imagine like how how quick we would speed run the divorce? Yeah. That's how we looked at our spouse every single time. Like I say, we like any of us are married, but common people. Well, like listeners that are married. Imagine how strained that relationship would be. Yeah, that's all how you ever looked at them. Like you don't look at your spouse through that lens.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. That would completely crush your relationship. And that's the same thing when talking about people in your life or God, which God's never done anything wrong to you, but you could be mad at God for some reason.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
What Biblical Forgiveness Requires
SPEAKER_02And so we have to look through that lens of mercy, and we have to love mercy. And even though they don't deserve it, and even though, yes, they have hurt you, they have wronged you, we're not disregarding that you are hurt, but we are saying that you have to forgive them for your own spiritual, emotional, and physical well-being. And then forgiveness is not just a one-time thing. We have to do it over and over and over again. So in the Bible, um, one of the disciples came up to Jesus and he was like, How many times do we have to forgive? And Jesus said, 70 times seven. And they were all like, What? Because back in the day in Jewish culture and during that time, some rabbis, Jewish teachers, would teach that you had to forgive three times a day. Like that was the limit. You could only forgive three times because they were trying to um keep their people emotionally well, like they weren't trying to make them hurt. Or some rabbis would teach that you could only forgive max seven times a day. So whenever Jesus came at that and he said 70 times seven, he completely erased the scoreboard of forgiveness, like he completely wiped it out all of the previous ideas and teachings that were being falsely taught at that time because there's nowhere in the Bible that says you can only forgive three times or seven times. There's nowhere. And so Jesus completely erased the scoreboard.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because like according to that time, like she was just saying, um, if you forgave someone seven times at a day, you were like, you were that guy.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, you were like epitome of a person.
SPEAKER_04Like you were whole, like you were you were basically basically right under God. Like if you forgave seven times, like you had it going. And Jesus was like, actually, you're wrong, and that's not how you should look at it at all. Like it shouldn't be a number.
SPEAKER_06I'm very thankful, very, very thankful that I don't only get forgiven three times a day.
SPEAKER_04Because buddy, I'd be uh Could you imagine if God looked at us and he was like, All right, 490 times, if you sin again, you're out.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, like we can only forgive you three times a day. And we sin so like a lot we sin more often than we ever will know. And sometimes only God can reveal to us our shortcomings because some sins we are aware of. We are aware that we are sinning in that moment, and then other times we we aren't aware of it in that moment.
SPEAKER_06Unintentional, yeah.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I have a question. I don't I actually wonder this every day. So when I'm driving, like I'm not gonna lie, I do speed. Is that a sin? Because it's going against the law. I'm gonna guess yes. Yes, guys, that's true about it.
SPEAKER_02You're going against your authority, and so in the Bible, in the Bible says following. We are subject to our authority, and so that br that kind of is like whenever they ask Jesus, should we pay taxes to Caesar? And Jesus said, pay to Caesar's what is Caesar's, but pay to the Father what is his. And so, yes, we still have to obey our local government, and so we have to follow the speed limit, guys. We can't speed it, we speed it to sin. But then we also have to follow the Bible and what the Bible says.
SPEAKER_06Well, I ran out of my three times on the way to the no more forgiveness today, bro.
SPEAKER_04That's a tough pill for me to follow. I'll have to pray about that one.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's okay.
SPEAKER_04So, how do you guys feel about the message we heard on Wednesday?
SPEAKER_02It was so good. I loved it. Pastor Jonathan preached on the stumbling block of a modern context, and that related to culture and our culture today.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um, and he talked, he read Micah 6, 6 through 7, and I'll read the end portion. And it says, What does the Lord require of you but to do do justly, love mercy, and to walk humbly with your God? And so in this portion of scripture, um six, seven, okay guys, they're all doing it sad to say so. In this scripture, um, the people of Israel were doing everything outwardly correct. Yeah, they were giving their sacrifices and their burnt offerings, and um, they were giving oil and they were giving their firstborns for their transgression. They weren't giving their firstborns, they were blessing them and things like that. Goodbye. Yeah, you in Jewish culture, you you would bless the firstborn. And so they were doing everything correctly on the outside, but inwardly something was off and something wasn't right at all.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And Pastor Jonathan said that we read the Bible today and we understand it based off of our own culture. Because let's be real, none of us are Jewish, or if you are Jewish, then you understand the Jewish culture. But a lot of us, a lot of us um in our town or in America, I know there's Jewish people in America, but there's um not a you know, like some people aren't Jewish. Like I'm not Jewish, just some.
SPEAKER_04I'm not Jewish, it's a minority. Disclaimer, guys.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, yeah. And so we understand it through our own culture, and we don't understand it through the Jewish culture in which it was actually written in. And that can be kind of dangerous because then we we view the Bible as an um as an American version, and it's you're gonna miss the context. Yeah, it's a much lesser version than what was actually meant.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, it's very dangerous because according to culture, you can be doing church completely right according to culture, like meeting all the marks. Your numbers, your numbers can be going up. You can be getting more guests, you can be building bigger buildings, uh, you could be reaching more people. And according to culture, you may be absolutely thriving, but you still could be missing God's heart.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
Appearance Without Presence
SPEAKER_04And that's that's the danger in it. That's why we have to pay attention to how we are seeking after the heart of God and make sure we're not just doing this thing, doing this Christianity thing, doing this following God thing, doing this church thing through the lens of culture. We have to make sure that we are connected to God and to his heart throughout it all.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, and I I feel like um modern culture has turned Christianity into how can it benefit me? Exactly. And that's that's not what it's meant to be. Um at all. Like you some people think that, oh, I want to go to church because Jesus is gonna make my life better. Like Yeah, he's gonna bless me. According to scripture, Jesus says to deny yourself, take up your cross and follow me, which clearly shows that the walk with God is not gonna be sunshine and rainbow.
SPEAKER_02Exactly.
SPEAKER_06Like the cross is not it's not light, it's heavy, it's not pretty. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_04Like, can you imagine if you went back in time and told Paul that? Dude, he'd probably punch you in the face right there.
SPEAKER_06Greetings from Paul.
SPEAKER_02Like you would be getting a letter.
SPEAKER_04Like, I want to follow God because of what God can do for me.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, that's slapings from Paul.
SPEAKER_02I would like to inform you.
SPEAKER_04You are justified and holy, slap on the face. You would deserve it.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Um, I really love whenever Pastor Jonathan said that when can when conviction becomes uncomfortable, we like to edit God. And that leads to a complacent and distracted Christianity. So let's think about it in our world today in a modern context. There are many, many, many, many different versions of Christianity and denominations that are Christian, but I'm not pointing out any denomination when I'm saying this either. That some or certain belief systems cher will cherry-pick certain verses of scripture. Yeah. And we cannot cherry pick verses of scripture. We cannot just say, I like this one because it benefits me, but then completely disregard whenever God says to love mercy or to be humble or to give or something like that. We cannot pick and choose the Bible because it benefits us, and that is something that's going on in our world today, right now. So we don't we can't edit God because what God has said in the Bible is true and it is fixed, and it will be true until the end of time.
SPEAKER_06And it's still alive, and it is still alive.
SPEAKER_02The Bible is very powerful.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because when you start viewing the word of God and reading it and applying it to your life through the lens of culture, like there's multiple, there's so many different things wrong with that. Like, if you're if you have a soft culture and you're reading like the word of God through a softer culture, the conviction that you feel will feel harsh. And you'll yeah, you can be like, Well, we shouldn't have to do that. That's like that's that's just too much. That's too harsh. Like, God wouldn't expect that of me. He loves me.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Or a corrupt culture, if your culture is corrupt and that's how you're viewing the Bible, then can uh truth starts to become optional. Yeah, yes. Um, it can be what do I feel is the truth for me? What do I feel like following my heart? Like, what's the best for me? What makes me happy? Uh-huh. Instead, like we have rules in the Bible, like these are 100% truth. You can't make up your truth or just agree with that and be like, this is true, but this isn't. So culture is dangerous.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04It's very dangerous.
SPEAKER_02Um, like Hudson was saying, you can't cherry pick and you can't say your truth. So let's take love, for example, in our current culture. In our current culture, love is a feeling, it is not an action. I feel love. This person makes me feel loved. Oh, let's get married because I feel love towards you, right? We can't, we are, we are not made to act off of our feelings. Love in the Bible is an action. You do it. You don't feel love, you you love someone through your actions. And so culturally and biblically, love are completely two different things. So if you are reading in the Bible and you come across John 3.16 where it says, For God so loved the world, and you think, oh, God has funny little feelings towards me, and it makes his butterflies in his stomach. No, God loves you in the terms of action, He's He's provided for you, He died on that cross because He loves you through action. Yeah. I hope that makes sense.
SPEAKER_05That's a good way to put it. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Um and God's word doesn't follow culture, it never changes. That's another thing that Pastor Jonathan said. And I was like, that is so true. Because Christianity should not reflect the world at all, but it should only reflect the word of God. And reflecting the world can be easy. Like it can be hard to resist the world. Yeah. But we are called to be in the world but not of it. We're called to be set apart. Um, and we're we we are called to be set apart but sent out. Yeah. So we are supposed to be in the world, but trying to actively let others know hey, this is the God that I've served. This is the God that can and will change your heart if you're willing to listen to him.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Something that ties into what he said, like what you were talking about, he doesn't change. Yeah. He said, I loved this. He said, when the world goes gray, the Bible speaks in black, white, and red. That was good absolute bar. He was because whenever everything around you is it's dark and it's confusing. And there's no lines. Yes. There the lines are blurred and your opinion or your views are skewed. The word is the word. God is God and He does not change. He's the same yesterday, today, tomorrow, forever. He will not change. What he said is what he said. Yeah. He stands on it. And it that won't ever change.
SPEAKER_04Stands on business.
SPEAKER_02Stand on business.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I loved also whenever he was talking about this. It's like one of the first things he said. Um, how our faith is like Wi-Fi. We use it all the time. So we don't realize when it's there, but we we know when it's messed up. We know when we're doing it. We realize it right away. Yeah. I think we don't we don't cherish every second that God is in our lives providing for us, watching over us. But the second um things get tough and the situation is hard, we run straight to him like he's a spiritual emergency kit. And we're like, oh Jesus, help, help. But we didn't want to talk to Jesus or care that Jesus was there when he was providing for us when life is going great.
SPEAKER_02So we can't just run to God in the bad times whenever our lives are falling apart. I mean, yes, run to God whenever your life's falling apart. Yes, yes. But run there too whenever he's providing for us. Yes, but whenever God wakes you up in the morning and protects you on your way to school or work or protects you at your house or anything like that, be grateful. Like acknowledge that he's there. Yeah.
SPEAKER_06And also don't make don't make running to God your last resort. Like I feel like I feel like I know for me, whenever I've had struggles in my lifetime and I wasn't very close to God, um, that would be my last option, would be, oh, maybe if I pray about it, it'll get better. And that's that's the wrong way to look at it.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_06Because the same God on the mountain is the same God in the valley. Amen.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. That reminds me of one of the things he said is that the problem may not be that you don't love God, but it's that you love him when you want to, and you don't love him, and you ignored him when you want to try and do it on your own and think you don't need him. And I think that ties back to what y'all were saying pretty well.
Modern Context: Culture And Compromise
SPEAKER_04Yeah, you can love him when it's convenient for you. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02You can love him whenever it's comfortable for you.
SPEAKER_04Like, it's it's a lot easier to love God when things are going good for you. Yeah. Like you just got a new job or you just got a raise.
SPEAKER_06Like loving God has never been easier. But what happens when you get fired and lose that nice card or laid off or is God still good?
SPEAKER_04Like, it's easy to love God when you start a relationship with this brand new person. You're like, oh my gosh, we're gonna get married. Like God is good. This is what I've been looking for. But what happens when you break up?
SPEAKER_03Exactly.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Or if. Yeah, yeah. Let me not be a pessimist here.
SPEAKER_02You could, you could get married. Um and the modern context can make us look polished on the outside, but inwardly we're poisoned. Just like Ramsay was saying, we can love God, but do we love him based on our own comfort? And this brings to mind Judas in the Bible, one of Jesus' disciples. He walked, Judas was one was one of the 12 disciples, so he walked with Jesus every single day for around three years. He was with Jesus all the time. He saw him pray, he saw him do miracles. I I believe that Judas loved Jesus, but I think Judas loved Jesus based on his own comfort because whenever Judas was offered with silver, was it 30?
SPEAKER_0630 pieces, yeah.
SPEAKER_02With 30 pieces of silver, he sold Jesus, he sold his relationship with Jesus for money for 30 pieces of silver. And he betrayed our savior with a kiss. And because he betrayed him, he died, which he died to save the world. So, like, yeah, it you know, it worked out. It worked out, but you know, Judas, don't look at it like that, guys. But Judas loved Jesus based on his own comfort, and he didn't love him unconditionally. Yeah, like like and that led to Judas killing himself.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And so that's that's not good. No, yeah.
SPEAKER_06That's definitely not good. Yeah, well, the Bible talks about when Judas betrayed Jesus that the devil entered, yeah, entered into Judas, and Jesus said, The person who will betray me is better that he was not even born. And uh another cool thing about well, not cool thing, but it's a fact about Judas is I'm pretty sure that out of all the disciples, he's the only one who didn't profess that Jesus was his Lord. He always referred to him as just rabbi, but all the other ones considered him Lord, like yeah, they would call him Lord. What do you want? But he would just refer to him as rabbi. So you need to make sure that that that love, like, do you really love him as your Lord, or do you just love him as somebody who's done something for you?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, true. And because a lot in our modern context, we call God God all the time. But God is just what he is, he is God, God is not his name, God is not his attribute, right? His name is Jesus, and his attribute is Lord of all or creator or something like that. And so sometimes we can get that kind of mixed up too.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I liked when you said that revival starts when we start to go back to God. It's in your secret place with God, it has to be personal. So, like modern gen the modern generation likes to make everything broad, likes group things. But your relationship with God has to be personal. You it's in those one-on-one moments when you can really be vulnerable with God and you could say things that you can't say when you're in a group setting. And you can't tell God knows what you've done and He knows your deepest thoughts and your deepest desires, but you you have to tell them, you have to say them. And a lot of times when we're in group areas, you don't want to say those things out loud because you're ashamed. So it's really important that you go back to you go to a prayer closet, you find your personal one-on-one time with God, and you make things you make things personal between you two because you have to speak those things, you can't just think them. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. Like we were saying earlier, like we talked about earlier, uh revival, it does start individually. And it won't start individually if you don't, like you just said, have a prayer closet. I mean, look at Jesus himself. Before the crucifixion, he went and prayed.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_04He had his own prayer garden. Prayer garden.
SPEAKER_02He literally had a prayer garden. Yeah, but he was in the garden.
SPEAKER_04I didn't even realize that he had a prayer garden. He went and prayed. And he did go with his disciples, but they were a bit sleepy. So he ended up praying by himself. By himself once sleeping.
SPEAKER_01They were a bit tired.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, so even Jesus himself, he he prayed alone before the the the cross, and that's like that's kind of what this all points back to. So before revival, like you're just saying, it has to be intentional and personal. Yep.
SPEAKER_02And your prayer closet has to be intimate, right? It has to be just between you and God. So don't have a moment in prayer and then go tell all your best friends or post on social media, like, the Lord just met me in my prayer closet. Don't do that every single day. Because then it's no longer intimate. Yeah. Right? You are no longer having intimate moments if everyone knows about them. Yeah. You know?
SPEAKER_06Now don't be, don't feel like you can't share your testimony.
SPEAKER_02Yes, you can definitely do that. Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, just don't, don't, I don't think it's good to post every time you pray and and God ministers to you.
SPEAKER_00Hour-long prayer for the morning. Yeah, exactly. God bless you.
SPEAKER_04But I think that's there's a difference between being like after the fact and being like, you guys won't believe how good God is, what he's done in me, yeah, versus pulling out Instagram live mid-prayer and be like, exactly. Look at these tears.
SPEAKER_00Guys, there's mascara running down my face right now.
SPEAKER_04Like there's a big difference between that.
SPEAKER_06Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. So just keep it intimate, guys.
SPEAKER_06Another thing Pastor Jonathan said was holiness is isn't about appearance, it's about alignment. Yeah. Um, this stuck out to me because I feel like we can get caught up or we can get so caught up in making sure our outside image looks apart that we forget what like we we don't focus on our inside being holy as well. Um, we are a hundred percent called to stand out, like Andrea pointed earlier, but the only thing that separates us from the world shouldn't be clothes and long hair. It should be um our character, it should be love and compassion. Um, what our attitudes are like are we slow to anger? Are we gentle? Um, do we treat outcasts like their family? Yeah, like that's it's really important. And especially in a world where um like clothes and stuff, like people wear some of the craziest stuff ever. Oh, yeah. So dressing differently doesn't exactly mean you're standing out now. So um it's important to make sure that you have the right characters of a true Christian at the end of the day.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And Matthew 23 and 27 says Jesus was having an interaction with the Pharisees at this time, and he says, Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites. Yeah. For you are like whitewashed tombs, which do indeed appear beautiful outwardly, but inwardly you are full of dead men's bones and all uncleanliness. And so this points back to holiness, just like Lincoln was saying. Yeah, you can look the part, boy or girl, holiness, whatever. You can look put together and holy on the outside, but your inward man can be full of grossness and death and deceit.
SPEAKER_06Absolutely.
Love As Action, Not Feeling
SPEAKER_02And so we can't be hypocritical in these moments, right? We can't be quick to point out other people's flaws without first looking at ourselves. Because my holiness, while looking at other people's flaws and pointing them out, is hypocrisy 100%.
SPEAKER_06Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's why it's so important to focus more on relation than you do on religion.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because it's inward, it starts inward.
SPEAKER_06Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, I was about to say that the truth of it all is that it shouldn't, like, for lack of better words, this way you look should be a side effect of how your relationship with God is and if you want to honor Him.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, because if you go if you go about it the other way around, that's when you start to imitate holiness. If it if it isn't starting from within and you're trying to manufacture from the outside, that's deception.
SPEAKER_03Exactly.
SPEAKER_04And that's imitating it. I mean, I can go and buy the freshest Chris suit you guys have ever seen. I could put that on. I can go to a youth service, whatever, N A Y C, any event, and I can go to the front, I can jump up and down, hoot and holler, call everyone brother and sister, spit your top hand and shake the top. I mean, on the outside, on the outside, if you saw me doing that, you'd be like, this dude's on fire for God.
SPEAKER_00Like, yeah.
SPEAKER_04He's crazy.
SPEAKER_00But if you're doing it for the in inwardly, you can't but I could be corrupt.
SPEAKER_04I could be the whitewash tomb inside. So it's not about the I and like I'm not saying that that's wrong. I mean, like that's awesome. No, that's not wrong. Like, I look at that guy and I'm like, that dude's on fire for God. I want to be you.
SPEAKER_06You just need to make sure that you're the image that you're making yourself is who you really are. Because uh like like you're saying, if you're jumping in the front just because you want people to think that you have it together, that you've got it twisted. You need to be jumping in the front because um of what of like what's God brought you through.
SPEAKER_04Oh yeah, it's a it's exactly what Ramsey was saying, that it should be coming from within. I shouldn't be using jumping at the front as an example. Yeah, you shouldn't be jumping at the front because that you want to give off that image. You should be jumping at the front because that's how you worship. Yeah, it should be coming from that from within.
SPEAKER_00And y'all talking about that just like that kind of goes into the the way modern things modern things are. A lot of people, especially in like today's you know, society, we like to compare ourselves. Yeah. So don't ever compare yourself to what another person's walk with God looks like. Yeah. Because sometimes I'm not saying always, but sometimes things look a lot different than they really are. And anyone can put on a mask and look how they want to look, act the part, and everything like that. But don't think that that's because they're so much better than you. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And outward holiness correlates directly to your alignment with God, right? Because inward holiness aligns directly to your alignment. And so, just like y'all were saying, your outward holiness needs to stem with your inward alignment. Because if I am inwardly aligned with God, I'm gonna want to make him happy. I'm gonna want to please him with the way that I look and the way that I dress and the way that I speak and act. Because holiness does not just refer to what you look like, it's who you are. Yeah, it is your character, it is how you speak and all these different things. And holiness was meant to protect us. It was never meant to separate us or make us refuse anyone who does not look or act like me or put up a wall between me and the other person because I quote unquote don't think deem them holy. Mm-hmm. You know? You have to remain approachable. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01And talking about how the way we look on the outside it goes back to what we were saying about the um we're never f that we have to be different than the world. And another thing that he said was God never follows culture and To be so we're all people and we have human nature and what we do is we want to follow the culture and do what everyone else is doing and blend in, but we can't be doing that with the way we dress and the way we act and the way we talk. We have to be different because the danger in doing what everyone else is doing is we're most likely not doing what God wants us to do. Exactly. So we have to watch what we're doing.
SPEAKER_06Yeah, definitely don't follow the crowd. And I think that whenever um, well, I know when you start walking closer with God and you truly get a relationship with Him, you start to love what He loves and hate what He hates. Exactly. And um that dictates your every move. Everybody's gonna have their personal convictions and whatnot. Um, I would definitely suggest to follow those personal convictions because that's what God is laying on you. Now, those personal convictions, somebody else might not have it, so you can't look at that and say, oh, they're wrong for not doing it because you feel that conviction. That's not the right way to look at it.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, yeah. It all comes from boundaries. You know what you should set as a boundary, and it kind of comes from that.
SPEAKER_02And he used um a story in the Bible where um they brought a woman to Jesus who was caught in adultery. And I'll read a little portion of it in John 8. And it says, Then the scribes and Pharisees brought to him, Jesus, a woman who was caught in adultery. And when they had set her in the midst of them, they said to him, Teacher, this woman was caught in adultery in the very act. And now in the law of Moses, he commanded that such a person would be stoned. But Jesus was like, Oh no. And then they asked Jesus, but what do you say, kind of all coffee? And Jesus they said this to Jesus testing him because they wanted to accuse him of things. And Jesus looked at them and he said, He who is without sin, let him throw the first stone. And then he stooped down on the dirt and he wrote something. And then those who heard it were convinced by their conscience, and they went away one by one, beginning with the oldest, and then they ended at the last one. Then Jesus raised himself up and there was no one around this woman accusing her anymore. And he said to the woman, Where are your accusers? Has no one condemned you? And she goes, No one, Lord, and Jesus said, Neither do I condemn you. Go and sin no more. The standards of the religious people, because the religious people were the ones condemning her. Yeah, they had pulled back the law, they were they were not showing mercy. They were like, Lord, this is what she did. She deserves to die because that's what the law of Moses said, which the law of Moses was true at the time, but Jesus was there to show mercy. Yeah. And Jesus had to remind them to show mercy, and he had to, and he he forgave that woman because forgiveness is not just for the, you know, our modern context of forgiveness, it's going past their offenses of you towards you, and saying, I'm not gonna act differently towards you because of your offenses. Yeah. So I thought that was really cool.
SPEAKER_06That's really good. And we really have no room to judge anyone. Yeah, yeah. We're all completely imperfect and we all have our own flaws. So um is it's important to make sure, yeah. I mean, I wouldn't promote sinful behavior. Yeah, don't but also like don't condemn them.
SPEAKER_02Exactly.
Intimacy, Prayer Closets, And Revival
SPEAKER_06Like, if if I messed up, I wouldn't want Hudson to look at me and just say, Oh, you're going to hell because you did this. No, he would help correct me and help out of love. Me go in the right direction, yeah, out of love. I think that's the right way to handle it. Because be for real, we've all messed up.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. If you don't plenty of times, more than we would like to admit.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and if you don't acknowledge that, then you're lying like a lot because we've all messed up. We're all sinners. And just like it says in the Bible, he who cast the first stone, yeah. We can't cast the first stone because we've we're all sinners. And so it it's really silly if you judge another believer and condemn them for sinning when you sin all the time. It's like you're kind of a hypocrite when you do that. It's not really a good look, but not joking biblically, it's not a good thing to do. Like you don't want to be judging people because you deserve to be judged. We all do. Uh-huh. And you gotta recognize that.
SPEAKER_02That's good. I like that.
SPEAKER_04I think back to um going back to talking about appearances and outward appearances, I've been thinking about how it can be easy to be like a polished believer, but your inner disciple be malnourished. And what I mean like that is we were talking about appearances earlier, like from a holiness perspective, like how you portray yourself, how you look, how you dress, just your outward appearance. But uh in this in a similar vein, if you apply it to the church itself, it is possible for you to be efficient and effective in the church and in the movement and not be aligned with God and not be close with God. Uh-huh. And that is another dangerous thing that ties in with culture. Yeah. Because according to the way that you do church, according to your current culture, you could be serving a church and you could be killing it. You could be doing everything that you need to do, but your heart isn't aligned with God, and that's dangerous.
SPEAKER_02At that point, you are working for God and not with God. Yeah. And the whole purpose of serving God is to work with him. Because I want God to use me for his glory, right? I just don't want to work for him. I don't want to be his servant. Well, we are servants of God, but you know what I mean? Like his slave. Yeah, I don't want to be his slave and have to think that I have to do X, Y, Z. No, God wants us to willingly serve him.
SPEAKER_06Um and to humbly serve.
SPEAKER_02To humbly serve him.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. And that's actually something that uh Pastor Jonathan said in his message. He was talking about King Saul. Yeah. And he said that exact line. Saul, when he was talking about offense in the contact, Saul he was offended. And that is kind of what led to his downfall. But he was offended and he acted on it. And the danger was he thought he was justified. Yeah. Because he believed he was working for God. But like he just said, he wasn't working with God.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Saul kept his crown, but he lost his covering because he got offended and he threw spears at someone that used to bring him peace. Yeah. And whenever Pastor Jonathan said that, I was like, that is so true. Because we can still be in a position in the kingdom, in our church, where we are serving God, but we lose the presence of God. And Saul lost the presence of God, and that led to his downfall and to the point where he was giving the sacrifices that only um uh a prophet should give, or he even contacted a medium, so like a witch, a sorcerer, to bring back Samuel from the dead so that he could talk to him. Like Saul completely lost sight of what he was supposed to be doing and what God wanted to do through him. And that is so dangerous, especially if we bring it back to today. You could be so effective, you could still have your position, but you have lost your intimacy and your connection with God.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, and I just think that again, it's important to state how dangerous that is because you may not realize that that's happening. Um your big moment of realization won't be you going out and sinning in the street, or you've committed some great sin and you're like, Oh my gosh, I'm so far from God, I need to get back. It won't be anything like that. You'll think that you're fine, but you're slowly drifting and your heart starts to slowly change.
SPEAKER_03Yep.
SPEAKER_04And then eventually you're just so separated and you don't even know how you got there. Yeah. Yeah. And that's that's the danger of it.
SPEAKER_02Once you realize it'll be way too late. I mean, God, God can still redeem you, and He will seem still redeem you if you ask Him to and invite him into that situation. But don't why would we even want to go there? Like, I wouldn't even want to be there in the first place. And so we just have to be really careful to not do that.
SPEAKER_01I also think that it's really important to realign your priorities to make God and his kingdom first and not yourself. Amen. Because God didn't call us to build walls to block people out, but to build bridges to bring people in and to help them. And when you are trying to build walls and block people out because you look at them and see and you judge them, and or not judge, but see that they're sinning or not doing what you think they should be doing, and you build a wall to stop them, you're not gonna be helping them.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Going back to what we were saying.
SPEAKER_02Because Jesus didn't build no, Jesus didn't burn bridges, he he built them.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_02And so it's like, do we know how to build bridges to bring people in and to not force them out with being hi hypocrites or judgmental or something? We have to be loving to build these bridges like Jesus did. It's very good.
SPEAKER_04Yeah. And I think we can't finish this out without talking about a point that Pastor Jonathan brought up about the blueprint that God gave us in Michael 6.8 with Michael. Did I just say Michael?
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I was like, Michael.
Holiness As Alignment, Not Image
SPEAKER_04Who is that guy? I thought the book of the Bible, in Micah 6.8, in his in Micah 6.8, God lays out a blueprint, and this can be important because we've been talking about culture and how if we follow our culture, it can misconstrue how we live for God, how we view the Word of God. So with that going on, it's important to have a blueprint where basically in Micah 6.8 it says, do what is right, love mercy, and walk and walk humbly. If you do those three things and you follow that blueprint, do what is right, align fully with God, love mercy, refuse the stones like we were talking about. Choose grace in every situation. Always approach everyone with grace, like God does with you, and then walk humbly, get your eyes off of yourself, what you're doing, and focus on God. Then you'll figure this thing out, and you'll be a pretty effective believer.
SPEAKER_01I love when he said loving mercy, meant I hold the truth in one hand, but I also hold grace in the other, meaning that he knows what is true, but he also knows when to give grace and to help people.
SPEAKER_02Yep.
SPEAKER_05Yeah.
SPEAKER_02You don't compromise either one of them, like you don't weaponize one or the other. You are choosing to do both of them grace and truth or grace and mercy.
SPEAKER_04Yep. And as a as one more closing thought, I just want to bring out that if you have slipped, if you do notice that contact or culture has gotten a hold of me, I've lost sight, I've drifted. Anywhere along those lines, that there's always an invitation for you. God's always been there, He's not gonna shun you. Yeah. Um, you just have to start walking with Him again. But we've talked about a lot today. We've talked about both of the incredible messages from Pastor Jonathan. We've talked about the danger of offense, of criticism, of not being able to forgive, of how dangerous all three of those can be. And we've also talked about, you know, culture.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04How that can change how we sh how we view God, how we live for God, how we practice church, how we practice our faith. It can shift things, it can change, and before we know it, uh, it could separate us from God.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And I just want to I just want to challenge the listeners. Just do some self-analyzation over all that we've talked about. I know we've talked about a lot. We have been yapping, but but really think. Think about offense, think about criticism. Are there things in my own heart that I am holding against others? Are there things that are happening in my life, be it people that I love, people in my church, um, leadership in my church? Are there things that I'm offended at? Yeah. Are there things that I'm criticizing? Do I hold some of that resentment in my heart? Yeah. And analyze. It's hard to say this without me looking like a holier than thou statement, but analyze your heart and walk with God. Yeah. Um, just try to make sure that you are not doing it for appearance, you're not following the culture around you. Just make sure that your heart is aligned with God. So just do some self-analyzation. That's my challenge because we can all get closer to God. We can all strive to be closer.
SPEAKER_00Well, guys, we got some good topics today. Um, thank you so much for listening. Just a reminder that this is our second to last podcast of the semester, so we have one more after this. Um, thank you so much for listening, and make sure to tune in next week.
SPEAKER_02Bye, bye, bye.