Policy, BBQ and Comedy | Autumn 2021 | OUTLOOK

In our first episode, Sam learns how to cook meat, tell jokes, and introduce life-changing legislation with special guests Dianne Rogers, Taryn Banks, Andrew Law, and Josh Davies. 

Transcript

THIS TRANSCRIPT HAS BEEN AUTOMATICALLY GENERATED AND MAY CONTAIN ERRORS

Sam Smith  0:04  

Hello, and welcome to Outlook, a podcast brought to you by Blind Low Vision NZhighlighting some of the awesome people doing great things out there in the blind community. I'm Sam Smith. And today we are talking accessibility barbecues and comedy. I recently talked with Diane and Taryn, from the policy and advocacy team at blind low vision NZ, who told me about the great work they've been doing behind the scenes sorting out the legislation to ensure a safe, informed and fair New Zealand for everyone. I just read that one in four people live with a disability in New Zealand. And surely that's too high. That's That can't be right.

Dianne Rogers  0:44  

In fact, that's an understated number because that doesn't take into account people really, with the whole neuro diverse experience going on as well. In fact, it could be as high as 2 million people. And then there's the ones that are waiting to have a disability, Sam, so that's people such as myself, I'm, you know, hitting getting older, and I use glasses and my hearings slightly dulled. So, you know, in time, you know, we're all either living with a disability or impairment or we'll have a disc, we're waiting to have one. So there's the disabled community, but there's also seniors, there's also people with, you know, temporary injuries, that families with young children in prams and you can also think about, you know, much bigger group, including those who have language, you know, whose first language isn't English, you know, it's a much bigger group. That's why this question around obstacles for that group of people is, is something that we really need to sort of change the game on other countries have done it years before us,

Sam Smith  1:51  

Both of you work in the policy and advocacy part of the blind foundation. Taryn, can you tell me a little bit about that? What is it that you guys do?

Taryn Banks  1:59  

Historically, in New Zealand, we have taken a piecemeal and kind of compartmentalised approach. So in the policy and advocacy team, what I guess, you know, and a big, a big general sweeping statement, we're about trying to take a systematic approach, by working with government to effect a change, that means that instead of all these little weed battles, we actually take it to a higher level, and really kind of actually cut to the chase and save time with all that all the very small, you know, the individual level

Sam Smith
 not too many of us can text Jaicnda and ask if they can get a ramp installed somewhere. 

Taryn Banks
 Yeah, that is exactly what's happened historically, is that it has been and it still ends right at the moment. With access, it is very much the end of the complaints based system. So the individual has to, you know, restart that process. And the process can be long, arduous, expensive, emotionally taxing, and you're also asking people that are that are fighting, or experiencing, you know, several barriers a day, and it's exhausting. And and quite often what ends up happening is maybe there's a settlement that also comes with perhaps a nondisclosure agreement.

Dianne Rogers  3:23  

I mean, at the moment, Sam, the system so unfair, it relies on people with access knees, disabled people being the watchdogs of a system that's failed over decades. And that's really unfair. So the cost is borne by disabled people. We're running two campaigns, the biggest one is the accessibility legislation campaign as part of a collective called the Access Alliance and we do all of the the backroom work to to get where we've got to in terms of working with the government today. We also are constantly looking at, you know, getting the stories out. John Maulker is our keenest and most strongest advocate and he's been doing a lot of work as people come to him with individual matters. We're campaigning for a new law to make the country fully accessible right now,

Sam Smith  4:18  

Forgive me, for my ignorance about this is the no legislation at the moment about keeping the world accessible to everyone?

Dianne Rogers  4:26  

There's bits and pieces in very old legislation, and none of its really relevant for 2021.

Sam Smith  4:33  

You must put your cutlass away when you're leaving a pirate ship?

Dianne Rogers  4:37  

Yeah exactly. But here's the thing. So countries like America, Europe, all of the major continents have some form of accessibility legislation. Unfortunately, little island New Zealand doesn't have it sitting in one piece of legislation. We've managed to get this government the government of the day to agreed to you know, have some legends That creates accessibility for the future. Fundamentally, we're trying to get some new accessibility standards that are fit for purpose for New Zealand. And they want those designed by people with disabilities. And then the other, you know, obviously government and industry like they did in Canada many years ago. So we're basically saying, look, draw a line in the sand, this old system isn't working, we want something that's stronger. It's got to be enforceable. We want new standards that all organizations understand their obligations. And then for those that don't do the right thing, there'll be some penalties. But we're hoping that through education, information, standards that are realistic for New Zealand that everybody can understand. And that over time, organizations make changes. All we want is to come on the journey, get it done, let's just not just have a few of the willing doing it. We need everybody to get with the program.

Sam Smith  5:56  

It's actually blowing my mind right now, the fact that these things aren't in place. Woman. First of all, here we are the first man up Mount Everest. And still we we don't have legislation, the fact that we're behind America seems crazy. Those guys are super backwards. 

Dianne Rogers  6:16  

Australia is ahead of us. I mean, the irony is, I mean, it's so silly, but Australian architects and Australian building companies are here in New Zealand right now using Australian building standards for access in New Zealand, because ours is so out of date. I mean, it's just unbelievable. Yeah, that's very good overseas example. So we're not sitting, you know, in the dark. We've we've learned a lot from Canada, the United States and other countries, we want to make as the Best New Zealand legislation to create a fully accessible to New Zealand the best.

Sam Smith  6:48  

And Taryn, I wanted to ask you, you, I know you have history working with the the open gift society. That's That's right, isn't it?

Taryn Banks  6:54  

Yep, that's right.

Sam Smith  6:56  

So what are some of the things that that specifically apply to our deafblind community that we can do to

Taryn Banks  7:04  

help them out is a big challenge for people who have sensory disability be deaf blind, or both? As access to information, the deaf blind community are these they're they're quite a diverse community, there's quite a range of communication needs within their community. Some may have been born deaf and the for the sign language users, and they've lost the immersion later in life, or the opposite, whereby spoken English written English as the first the first language. So it really depends on what kind of you know where they're set on that spectrum. But one of the things that we experienced in 2019, was that some of the critical information when it was released, was not accessed an accessible format for people in through disabilities. And your event. That's, that's where it becomes pretty important. Obviously, you know, New Zealand signing, which has, I suppose, you know, the profile of it has been elevated by the use of it, and all the briefings, the one o'clock briefings that we were having, with Dr. Ashley Bloomfield and the Prime Minister. But in reality, there is still a fraction of the information that is available to the general population.

Sam Smith  8:26  

And that's something we're trying very hard to do with this podcast as well. We've moved from a printed medium to an audio podcast, and we're going to transcribe it. And we're going to get it delivered in a way that they can hear these messages as well. It's obviously a very important thing for us.

Taryn Banks  8:43  

Yeah, absolutely.

Sam Smith  8:45  

Could you give us any specific examples about what these obstacles are that you see in the workplace,

Dianne Rogers  8:49  

you know, you're walking down the street, you've learned how to navigate an accessible journey. But you know, even though there is a bylaw that says you shouldn't put sandwich boards out and you know, create cafes on the pavement, there should be an area on the footpath that's accessible. It doesn't happen. So every day, we've got people with vision loss and older people and others bumping into stuff, sometimes causing, you know, themselves injuries. Another one is the buses. If you've got a white cane or a guide, dog bus drivers don't naturally pick you up. You can't see the oncoming bus. But you don't. And you can't signal the bus. If you're standing at the at the at the bus stop on your own. You can't get to study or work on time. Yeah. In terms of work, and even just the whole question of, you know, I mean, people don't want to reveal they've got a disability. We want to get to a place where you apply for a job and it's it's okay to say look, I've got a visual impairment. Yeah, but I can I can overcome that impairment. I can still work like everyone else. But I'm going to need you know, a little bit of equipment and a little bit of understanding, but I think Get I can be productive really quick. In fact, I'm probably going to be a more loyal dedicated anyone else because I really, really, you know, I'm committed to this workplace and my employer and the job that the Miss we have right now is because we don't have clarity on what's regulated in the building code, the building act, it's 2021 years out of date for a start. So there's a lot to be done. But we're not saying we have to tackle all of this at once. We do have to have legislation first. And we believe it's long overdue, and it's just so unfair to make disabled people. The watchdogs of the of the system that's failing them.

Sam Smith  10:40  

Diane, you're speaking to my heart, my friend. It's so encouraging to hear people with your passion talking about this and looking out for everyone like this. It's great. What is your aim with this? What? Where are we going to get to where you'd be? Oh, yes, good. We've achieved this. We're happy now.

Dianne Rogers  10:59  

We've actually got a piece of legislation called the accessible Arturo, our Act, passed by Parliament. And that act sets up a brand new system to accelerate accessibility in Arturo New Zealand, it'll be passed in 2022. If not before to spend it, depending on how quickly we can get government to make a decision on it. But then it will set up the architecture for a new function, ideally, an independent crown entity, a bit like the Commerce Commission, or the Privacy Commissioner that has some teeth. And then that new accessibility commission, or let's say Accessibility Standards Agency, it's actually mandated under the accessible arterial act to function and standards, you know, we probably say from our community, we need a Public Information and Communication standard, long overdue, like they have in other countries. And of course, let's say the RTA or our Accessibility Standards Agency, as a, you know, an idea it would then call committees together of mixed committees of people with access needs, industry and government to sit down and start work, roll up the sleeves and start work on that brand new RT raw Information and Communication standard. Everybody applauds this new standard, and there's an education process, there's some money, therefore, education and information around how to implement this standard. In your business, the basically, there's a date that it's required to fully come into force. And from that date, the expectation is that everyone does it. So we're no longer battling access formats, we're no longer battling, access to captioning or audio description, were no longer backlinks, you know, you know, ineffective signage, or, also web sites, and my applications are all of a sudden going to be designed right from the get go, or when they're refreshed, to be accessible,

Sam Smith  12:58  

I cannot wait for that to happen.

Dianne Rogers  13:01  

How it's gonna look, and ideally, that happens at least 18 months after the new entity set up, it's gonna take a bit of time, same thing is worth getting right, if it doesn't have the power in the teeth. And obviously, if people don't, if organizations don't fulfill their obligations under it, then there'll be funds. The legislation we reviewed every five years, there'll be a report on the impact of the legislation and what the regulator's achieved or not. So those things are transparent. It's no longer hidden and private. And we can't use the learning to improve the system. Say, for goodness sake, there was another major crisis in New Zealand everybody would know, irrespective of what their exes need is going on. That's great. Do you know what you're just fighting for things to be fair?

Sam Smith  13:48  

It seems it's, it's a quality. And it's wonderful that you guys are timeless.

Dianne Rogers  13:53  

But we've also got a really cool tool that we set up in 2018 called the parliamentary champions for accessibility legislation. It's a cross party group, we're looking for unanimity, we want cross party support. So this won't be something that will be a football, it'll be changed. If a new government comes in, it will be something that is sustainable and long lasting. But it's got to start with a rule being made a law being made that sets out what this new system will do, and how it will benefit New Zealanders. And that's every New Zealand,

Sam Smith  14:26  

there are two things you see and that that really excited me. One was the fact that websites are going to be easier to read because there are some absolute Shockers out there.

Dianne Rogers  14:34  

The other thing he said was about buses, I mean, it's long overdue that you know, there's no public transport, mandatory standard around accessible public transport in New Zealand. There's a lot of best practice and nice guidelines, but they're not really worth the paper they're written on because it doesn't translate into bus companies doing training. And for us, as you know, those who are the you know, I suppose the stakeholders in this having some money input into that training and making sure it's the best we can offer. So, you know, there's a lot to be done, but we see it, you know, one area of life at a time. So you know, as I said, information communications would be a top priority for our community. But public transport might be the second cab off the rank. And you can't just do this. Because it's a good idea, you've actually got to do it. Because it's the law. It's regulated, it's required, because it has not happened up to now. And we've got to get to the tipping point. So the public funds aren't being wasted on creating more barriers for people. public funds are being used to create a more accessible, fairer society where everybody can get to work, they can do what they need to do in their lives without

Sam Smith  15:44  

barriers, or very wise words from Diane and Tara Lee, thank you so much for your good insight into the wild world of policy and advocacy. It sounds like you're doing super fantastic work. And if you'd like to find out more about it, you can visit the website Xs alliance in Zed. Now, when I lost my vision, about four years ago, now, I've been using it as an excuse to not do things around the house. But Andrew Lord down in cutting edge, he is really putting me to shame with his cooking and building skills. What sort of sparked to this idea that you were going to build a barbecue,

Andrew Law  16:21  

I suppose it started a couple years ago, and I started looking around, and all of a sudden I saw these Hello girls with with Wi Fi. Also, you can control it with your phone. And all that sounds great. So I know that the barbecue was a bit of outside the budget. And I am. So I talked to them. And they actually lowered the price to make it come into the budget. And so I got that and I started using that all the time. And we do a low si barbecue. That's for me that's accessible. Yeah, so low temperature cooking. You can't burn yourself on it. You can touch the top of the barbecue, you can touch the meat with your bare hands.

Sam Smith  17:01  

The food is delicious

Andrew Law  17:03  

and Neptune. But of course you're looking at nine hours sometimes for coming. You know sometimes even more. So you got a guarantee you got nine hours without rain. Yeah. Which is always tricky.

Sam Smith  17:15  

You're gonna go wrong, Andrew, thank you. So you'd be you'd have that most days.

Andrew Law  17:19  

But then again, with my wife and Katie, Katie, it can be raining there and then not raining and tear on.

Sam Smith  17:23  

All right, right? Yeah,

Andrew Law  17:24  

it's a little bit sort of varied. So I decided to need some sort of covering and sort of looked into covering our concrete area. And that was going to be a bit difficult. So I'll just extend it out and put poles up and put a roof on and everything and all developed from there. So I took about a year I'm designing it in my head, each little issue I came across, so I sort of just spent, you know, a couple of hours going while I'm lying in bed thinking of solutions. planned it out on a spreadsheet. So I did a bit of a geeking out there. Good man. Yeah, but uh, geeking out with calculating angles and everything like that. So if I change measurements, I need that sort of change one box and that would do change all the other calculate

Sam Smith  18:09  

it on there or something so satisfying about a good spreadsheet, isn't there?

Andrew Law  18:14  

Yeah, formulas. Oh, I

Sam Smith  18:15  

love that. We need to hang out more outside of this. Angie, this is great. Yeah. And um, so how does this so on with your phone? Like how you can you can teach to barbecue to turn it on? Is that Is it what this

Andrew Law  18:28  

what this is? So that first model I had, and it's one that started me, it's he opened up the the app on the phone. And there was a there was a button to turn that on, actually, so you could power it up. But the thing, what you do is then as you can adjust the temperature, there's also a probe that plugs in. So that goes in through into the barbecue and it's stuck in your meat. So you can actually check the temperature that you meet it and then and then you can just monitor it. And yeah, you can tell now I think we were going we're falling a bit behind schedule here. I need to turn it up a little bit. And yeah, and so moved on to that. And that sort of sort of started the project of building the barbecue area for taught myself a bit of cabinet making. So sit next to it as a cabinet with drawers and doors Anna and a stone benchtop sort of pull the meat off, wrap it up and stick it back in storage cabinet for all the pellets that goes off to the other side. So with the gap in between is actually built to fit this particular barbecue, which is the next model up from from what I had. So because I got so into it, I'll get this one next one. And that one is that you can connect it to your Google Home and Alexa, but once it's going, you know just walk in and I will say yeah, okay, Google Now of course. I've called it the barbecue, Lord of the ribs, basically because to be a distinctive name. So yeah, I tried to call it iron wood because it's the model is Yep. But then it kept giving me the temperature of a place called iron within the state. Sure, it's hotter than that. Tell me it's Yeah, it's currently 74 degrees. And I'm, no it's not. I can say sit Lord of the Rings to 225.

Sam Smith  20:16  

I love the idea, Andrew, that you're going to one day sit down to watch one of the Lord of the Rings films. Yeah, it's actually on a tsunami seeking barbecue going and you're halfway through, you'll have a delicious snack to eat. Well, in

Andrew Law  20:27  

the four hours long. You can probably actually cook some ribs in the time that you're watching the movie. So that's

Sam Smith  20:33  

right. What I want to know is how do you keep everyone away from it? Because this sounds like a place that if I if I was down and told on it, I'd be over at your place having ribs with you as often as I could.

Andrew Law  20:45  

Yeah, it's called living in Katie. Katie.

Sam Smith  20:47  

Yeah. Smart. Now I love the fact that you've made this entire setup. There were lots of saws and drills and hot things, and building your own barbecue and doing your own cabinetry. How did you do this in a

Andrew Law  21:01  

safe way better, better, better research and just shaking things out. Google and YouTube are the right one my tools, I've got all the tools that I can pretty much lock the materials into place and then just use the handles to cut or draw. Yeah, I think yes, there it is got a big long stained with rollers on it and the big sliding miter saw it locks into place. So you can actually know your angles just by counting the amount and not just talking tape measure, put out the tape that you want lock it into place and move your hands away in cut and the other one is a regular sore. So that's like that's what I use in replace of just the other skills or try the skills or and use I've got a line there. Yeah. So you can measure out if you're talking tape measure, put a couple of pins in the board. Lay your rail up next to the pins and lock them lock the rail into place. Take the pins out, put the sore on the rail and and cut drill is a really powerful drill but it's got automatic kickback control. You just know it just in case you don't know if these your hands got something sharp next to it you don't notice that Nick jaw kicks back and my neighbors are always every time they hear the sword go off with a knife expecting me next on the same either of me missing a finger we hit every all the neighbors over for New Year's, they're all and we put all chairs around or underneath the canopy and the lights were on music was playing so to speak. That sounds

Sam Smith  22:29  

fantastic and heavy. Have you finished now indoors the more to your plans

Andrew Law  22:34  

and next stages. I've got this outing an eerie link for in some water tanks. So that's going to collect all the rainwater off it amazing. And then that can feed them the gardens, a strawberry garden box with doors and everything on it so that the birds can get it save us from having to get the hose out.

Sam Smith  22:57  

We've just had a declutter right now. And now you're making me think

Andrew Law  23:02  

I'm getting in a bit of trouble with some of my other mindset. I'm blind. As you can tell, they're like, their wives are like, well, he can do it and he's blind.

Sam Smith  23:12  

And if you have any questions for Andrew, you can contact him directly. He is set up to Google Groups at Google groups.com. If you search for barbecue at blind x BBQ at blind or building it blind, you will find those groups and you can contact him. He said he's happy to answer any questions. We still have wonderful stuff down there. Now if you'd like a laugh, you might be interested to know the international Comedy Festival isn't May this year. And Josh Davies, who was a blind comedian is nominated for one of the big awards. And so

Josh Davies  23:44  

the Billy t award is named after some guy whose name I don't remember. quite famous in New Zealand comedy. Anyone who's read the stuff comment section will have heard of them.

Sam Smith  23:57  

Very good reference the fact that a lot of comedians, I remember even the politician Peter Dutton once said that the term New Zealand comedian is an oxymoron.

Josh Davies  24:06  

Yeah, that I think there's I think there's been an article written about a New Zealand comedian where someone hasn't written they're not as funny as Billy tea. Yeah, so it's Yeah, it's an award named after Billy tea. And it's basically every year the comedy festival, pick the five people there's a big there's a big application process where you perform, and the festival and some judges pick the five people they think are gonna be good, essentially, I guess, the next, the next sort of next generation of pro comics, and then they perform a show and the comedy festival and that as judged and whoever has the show they like the most or the best show who's to say it could be objectively the best shot. That's right. You would hope so. Whoever Yeah, whoever ends up winning wins the award and they get some some money and some glory in it. yellowtail and

Sam Smith  25:01  

di Hayward's wanna Rosemount? afos wanna go Williams is one at all these comedians that have gone on to great things ever.

Josh Davies  25:08  

Yeah. Lots. Lots of tea. Yeah. All the all the kiwi grapes and have have one at all been nominated for it.

Sam Smith  25:15  

Yeah, going back you and Gilmore cow Wilson. Justin Smith. So many, so many.

Josh Davies  25:22  

Yeah, some great.

Sam Smith  25:24  

How did you get into it?

Josh Davies  25:25  

Basically, I was at uni and uneaten and 2014. Yeah. And I was very depressed. It wasn't enjoying it at all. I really wanted to do comedy. And my plan was to do a student exchange to the UK because I'd been on the engineer's like, okay, all the famous comedians are from England or America. And America has guns and is scary. And so I basically I didn't end up doing comedy while I was an Indonesian, because it was terrifying. I am a very anxious person. And the thought of standing in front of people was horrible. So I dropped out after a year and then I entered the role comedy quest in 2015. And was that there was an wailing mountain. Yeah. And that was and that so my, like, my first two gigs were two 120 people at San Fran and yeah, even though the first time I did, okay, but it was to 120 people. So I was like, well, this is amazing. This is great. And then I got through the semifinals on my second game. I was like, okay, maybe I'm good at this. And then my third gig was at a much smaller audience went horribly as I Oh, this is okay. This is a reality check. And then yeah, and then I sort of kind of went on from there. And I was I was getting the bus from Levin to Wellington, like once or twice a week to do open mics, and then sleeping on friends couches and getting the bus home in the morning.

Sam Smith  26:41  

Oh my god. That's the comedy. That's the bottom.

Josh Davies  26:45  

Yeah. Yeah, I mean, I'm I moved up to Auckland with a couple of other comics. It was me, Ryan, Larry, Ben mcgugan, Savannah Carlton, and Johannes, B, we all move together.

Sam Smith  26:56  

Those are five wonderful comedians who are all also really nice people.

Josh Davies  27:01  

Yeah. And that was that was in 2017. I think.

Sam Smith  27:04  

What was that? Like? Is that when you guys just working on things all the time, and

Josh Davies  27:08  

it's very fun when we weren't working on anything. Cuz we were comedian. Yeah. We'd have lots of ideas and then never do anything.

Sam Smith  27:18  

So Josh, what is your show about?

Josh Davies  27:21  

My show is loosely about growing up blind, or low vision. Technically, I say blind on stage. Because, as you all know, most people don't know. There's no there's no difference between you're either like fully sighted or blind from control. So no one knows the word low vision. Like I don't know what that means. Yeah. So I just say blind and people get adjusted. I can see a bit. Okay. But yeah, so it's grayed out. Because I've been I was born with a rare genetic disorder. And it's done all sorts of nonsense to my eyes. I've had basically, since I was about five years old, my vision has been pretty stable at totally blind in one eye, and then about 20% vision and the other. Yeah, right. So it's just stories based around that and sort of like interactions I had with certain people trying to incorporate I guess the perspective of other people on blindness more than anything as well, totally. But it is mostly it's mostly a vehicle for lots of very tasteless blind jokes.

Sam Smith  28:20  

As someone who I lost my vision a couple of years ago, it's so good talking to someone else about it, you're going through those exact same things. I don't talk about being blind on stage because again, I don't feel like I'm blind enough to do that. But you just saying that it's made me gone. Oh, yeah, maybe

Josh Davies  28:39  

I can I would say as you know, as someone who thinks that should be talked about more Yes, you definitely should as as a comedian who relies on it, no doubt. Very good joke. Right. Okay. Go like me have to bring up my standard.

Sam Smith  28:55  

I love this. We've talked about this for a while doing a show called three blind mics. We just need to find one other person who's blind. Yeah, we

Josh Davies  29:01  

need to get a friend and Nazi color Noah back over from Australia.

Sam Smith  29:05  

Lovely comedian who moved away roughly a couple of months after. Yeah, let's that guy we should call me is great. So if anyone listening out there is a

Josh Davies  29:14  

working comedian. Let's blind Jeremy Corbyn was someone with a bit of stuff.

Sam Smith  29:19  

Yeah, that's that's a great idea.

Josh Davies  29:21  

And people with disabilities love my darker jokes. And so it's all that able bodied people that lie Oh, that's a bit that's a bit much of a disabled people like yeah, go harder UK Oh.

Sam Smith  29:34  

And just when when do you find out about the validity of wings wings that

Josh Davies  29:38  

we find out at Last Laughs which is on the 23rd of May, where we perform sky city, then they reveal that they reveal the winner on the night in front of everyone, which is terrifying.

Sam Smith  29:53  

You can catch Josh show. Look, I'm blind, which is a great title for his show. And Wellington and Auckland. In May tickets from Comedy Festival Dakota in Zed, and they are also cheaper tickets for people with disabilities. So he's looking out for us good, man. Well, that's our show for this week. Thanks so much to all my guests. Do you know anyone doing great things in the blind community? Please send me a message let me know. You can email podcast at blind low vision.org dot indeed. Thanks for listening to Outlook. I'm Sam Smith and I'll see you next time.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai