No Sanity Required
No Sanity Required is a weekly podcast hosted by Brody Holloway and Snowbird Outfitters. Each week, we engage culture and personal stories with a Gospel-driven perspective. Our mission is to equip the Church to pierce the darkness with the light of Christ by sharing the vision, ideas, and passions God has used to carry us through 26 years of student ministry. Find more content at swoutfitters.com.
No Sanity Required
Is LMNT Worth It?
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In this episode, Brody and JB interview Avery Colvert as she shares her journey from camper to L.M.N.T. to summer staff shows how service, Scripture, and mentorship can reshape a teenager’s faith and leadership. We unpack what L.M.N.T. is, walk through a day-in-the-life, and explore how real responsibility, intentional rest, and close mentorship form durable habits that last beyond camp. This conversation makes the case that ordinary work, like serving meals or cleaning toilets, done with clarity and purpose can become deep spiritual formation and a pipeline for future leaders.
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Let's okay, let's talk a little bit about um when you started coming to camp. Because you're you came with your you came with South River, right? Yeah, I did. That's your home church. So where'd you grow up?
SPEAKER_02:I grew up in Statesville, North Carolina, and I started coming to camp when I was in sixth grade. I came every summer from sixth to tenth grade.
SPEAKER_01:Sixth grade. I would love to go back in time and see little sixth grade ivory.
SPEAKER_03:Wait, do you remember like counselors?
SPEAKER_02:Um okay, so Olivia Townsell was my pastor's daughter. So for like probably three years, however many summers she worked, she was my counselor then. Um Morgan Fridley was my counselor one year too. Um and I was really afraid of her. I was really intimidated by her. Um I don't remember who Oh, actually, I didn't. My first counselor was a girl named Ruth. She was like 18 and she just got married, but she her husband was like in South Korea or something. He was in the military. And then it was really scary. Not scary. It was really like foreign to me that an 18-year-old was married.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:I didn't think I was that much younger than her, and I was like, that's so strange.
SPEAKER_01:She married and he was overseas and she was here working.
SPEAKER_02:That was crazy to me.
SPEAKER_01:What year would that have been? Like 2019?
SPEAKER_02:18.
SPEAKER_01:18.
SPEAKER_03:Dang. So you've seen camp change like so much.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I remember you also did like jump in the house in the coop before the services started. My first summer as a camper was still um, it was still in the coop, and y'all did like the rodeo and everything. That was a lot for me, I'm gonna be honest. I wasn't like a super shy kid, but I just hadn't, I don't know, I that kind of thing was really out of my comfort zone. So it was cool to like come to camp and be able to do those things.
SPEAKER_00:That was that was crazy to a lot of people.
SPEAKER_01:I remember coming up. And I'm like, we're doing this drama that if you don't have context for, yeah, it's gonna freak people completely out.
SPEAKER_03:It goes from like rodeo immediately into the scale. Yeah. Start off. It was crazy.
SPEAKER_01:Which when we say rodeo, some of you came back in those days, some of our listeners, but when we say rodeo, we mean it was more like a carnival feel with goofy games, people dressed in costumes. You guys behind the camera, did all y'all come up grow up coming and doing that? You two? Okay. Okay. And it was like it was we go from this carnival setting to doing this really intense drama. Now, don't get me wrong, the rev skit was intense. I loved it.
SPEAKER_02:Awesome.
SPEAKER_01:And I mean it really impacted people. But always I I have a saying within our leadership team saying we don't have any sacred cows here. We'll we'll stop doing something. We're not gonna just do it because we've always done it, you know.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And we did that, we did that rev skit for 20 years. And it was time. And it was partly time because people kept breaking collarbones and getting concussed. People had people people that if you were in the rev skip for more than a couple summers, you might have CTE, you know, from so many concussions. Honestly. I mean, it was brutal. Yeah. Because trying to choreograph those fight scenes, especially people that were less coordinated. Um okay, so were you in the first element team?
SPEAKER_02:Uh yes, I was the year that they switched from servant team to element. Okay. So it kind of was like both, I guess, but it was the first year of Element.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it's it's interesting, and we'll get into for our listeners, we'll get into what the whole goal of this is well, twofold in this episode is to introduce people to you, Avery, because you're here at SWO, and people are gonna be seeing more of you if they come on stage. You did a great job the other time. Um because you're joining the team, the media team, um, the production team. And then um I want folks to understand what the element program is because people are gonna be familiar with it. But a little background is that prior to Element, we had something called servant team. And for one, I wanted to change the name because if you're not a Christian, the word servant team, it just sounds like and for years I was like, I don't like this. People see this or hear this, it sounds weird. Servant? And uh, but for as believers, it makes sense, it's a beautiful word. You know, dulos, bondservant, slave to Christ, and that was where it came from. And and what is one of our core values? Servant-hearted, servant-hearted, and so it's it's it fits, but start thinking about how do we, how do we what's the verbiage we use that a non-believer is gonna hear that as well?
SPEAKER_03:Especially with it growing so rapidly. I can just imagine kids going home to their high school friends and being like, I was a servant all set, like I was on the servant team education camp, you know, like we already have a like uphill battle to be accepted culturally, you know.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, there's so many stigmas and yeah, I don't know, weird associations. Um let's okay, let's let's define what the element program is. Um, and then let's talk a little bit about because both of y'all are very connected to element. You haven't done it, JB working in it um as one of the leaders in the element program. So let me let me give from my side and my perspective why it exists. There was there's always been a desire to have a program where students that are in high school that show leadership potential, they show a real desire to to grow and be discipled more than for just the one week that they're at camp and more than the the weekly discipleship that they're experiencing at church. So if a kid comes out of a church where maybe they're attending youth on Wednesday and it's a solid program, but they're only getting at that one night or maybe one other time with a small group, and then but they want more. They want more, they want to serve, but they also want to be invested in that's the goal behind servant team. Um, it's to give students an opportunity to serve and work and labor for something that's tangible, um the day-to-day operation. So our that that team does a lot of work at camp to keep camp running. So they're a big part of our workforce.
SPEAKER_03:And to give staff the opportunity to pursue their students wholeheartedly, not have to worry about like cleaning a bathroom or serving a meal.
SPEAKER_01:So the servant team will do food service, trash pickup, some of the grounds work, clean bathrooms. It's a lot like housekeeping at a hotel or um food service at a restaurant. That's kind of the world you're living in. But every single day, there's a lot of time set aside throughout the day for discipleship, small groups. You're really being invested in. And for years it was it was a very small program where we would bring in six or eight, and then it grew to like ten girls and six, eight, or ten guys. And there was this point where we realized we're having a hard time recruiting summer staff, but we're turning away a ton of applications for this high school program. Because to be in the to be in the element program or the old servant team program, you have to be in high school. And and so there was a point where we realized we can recruit people for this program a lot easier than we can rec recruit summer staff. So the the idea was let's take servant team, let's let's grow that program where we double at least the number of people that are coming through because it's such effective. Oh, one other thing, servant team is a feeder into our summer staff. So most people that would come and be on servant team is about 18 to 20 people every summer would come back and serve on summer staff. So why not double that? It's such an effective program. Why not grow it? And then every year we've got this feeder program that's feeding our summer staff. And so we rebranded it, and Element is an acrostic, L M N T, which it turns out there's some kind of a supplement.
SPEAKER_03:Electrolytes. I drink them.
SPEAKER_01:That's the same thing. But is it an acrostic or is it?
SPEAKER_03:I have no idea. I don't think so.
SPEAKER_01:I think it's just the word element chopped down. This is an acrostic.
SPEAKER_03:Work on branding to make it look different than element electrolytes. That's funny.
SPEAKER_01:That's really funny. Uh ours is way better.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, totally.
SPEAKER_01:That's not just like there's a snowbird ski resort in Utah.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But when we first started, that was big, and now I'm like, that's JV. Um we're the real snowbird.
SPEAKER_02:Obviously.
SPEAKER_01:Um what does element stand for?
SPEAKER_02:Leadership, mentorship, next gen. Okay, is it team or training? I think it's training.
SPEAKER_01:Training.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, that's what I thought. I think a lot of times the summer I did it, people said team. They'd say element team, and we were all like, well, it's got team in the name. But training makes more sense because that's a lot of what we're doing.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, so it's element team. And so, but either way, yeah, training, team, either one would work. So leadership, mentorship, next generation. So leadership in that if you're in the element program, we've identified you, your youth pastor has identified you as a potential leader among your peers. Mentorship, you're gonna come here and really be invested in. Next generation, meaning you're the next generation of leadership at Snowbird.
unknown:Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_01:And then training. It's it's a training program. There's discipleship, there's on job work training, and so um so there's 20 girls now and 20 guys. It's funny, you came in the transition year where it was going from servant team to element. And I remember we went to lunch. I took all of the team at the time. Austin Scott was on the guy's side, Nikki on the girl's side, Morgan, I think was on the girl's side. We went to Burger Boy in Murphy. Went to lunch, and I rolled out this idea. I wanted to double it. But it was late in the year. Typically, when we're gonna do something new, we're planning it over a year out.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:This was like in March.
SPEAKER_03:I was like, okay, yeah, I think I gotta.
SPEAKER_01:But that year, we were way short on staff applications. I was like, what if we what if we just grow this program, the servant team program? I've been wanting to rebrand it anyway. Let's change it, let's add some staff to to help facilitate it, which is where JB and and the folks that lead it came into play. Because prior to that it was it was a smaller staff team leading. And then um let's expand the program to where we have more people that come and serve. So anyway, where we're at is if you're a girl or a guy in high school and you're interested in serving in a ministry where you're gonna be developed as a leader, you're gonna be mentored in ministry, um, you're gonna get a lot of opportunities to serve in a ministry that you believe in, um, and you're gonna be the oversight is super solid with the team that oversees you. Then Element's something for you to look at. And the goal of Element is to prepare people for the next season of life, but also one of the goals is to get them back here the next summer to serve.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And this year I've been on the hiring team, and it's cool to see like actual numbers of the like return rate of element, or even like last year we had so many girls apply, probably the same for the guys, and we can only take 20. And so a lot of times it literally comes down to like super specific stuff, like, oh, she's a sophomore, maybe we'll hire her next year. So it's really cool to see the return rate of that too, of people that maybe got turned down because of age or like something that we had to like really weed them out for, come back and then work another summer and then work on summer stuff. So it's really cool to see those like numbers. But I want to hear why you wanted to do element or like kind of what got that ball rolling for you.
SPEAKER_02:Well, in all honesty, I really didn't want to work at camp. I loved coming to camp in the summer, but um, I was just pretty adamant that I'd never work here. I don't know why. I don't know, I have no idea. But I came to Pierin Holy that year in 2023, and Anna Ramontus was my counselor. And she had worked with my church a ton, but she had never worked with me specifically, but we didn't bring a very big group. So I think it was just her. Um, and she asked us like why we believe what we believe. And I had like thought about that before, I guess, but I hadn't really wrestled with it. So I was asking like my pastor, um, the other staff, like working with our church, if there were any uh just other staff at camp, whoever ran my rec that day, I would just kind of talk to them about it. And um, I don't know, just having us wrestle with that, I think really made me think like, why do I actually believe what I believe? And um, is it just because this is what my parents have said, or like I've been raised raised in church or things like that. Um, and then she really encouraged me to apply for element that year. And the application was due in like less than a week. So I was kind of like, I don't know, I don't know about this. I talked to my youth pastor a ton. Um, and he really encouraged, he had been like um encouraging me to do that for probably a year at that point. And I was just like, I don't really know. I don't know if this is for me. I don't, I have no idea. But I sat down and I filled out the application and I did it in like two days because there was no time left to do it on the game. Yeah, that's a our application, isn't it? And it was before the like new system of it's in different sections, it's just all at once. So yeah, yeah, it was crazy. But I did it and I was kind of like, well, I don't know, this taught me like, well, I believe what I believe, but if I don't get in, that's okay. I'll try again next year if that's something I really want. And then as it came down to like um interviews and like hearing if I actually got accepted, I was like on the edge of my seat. I wanted to work here so, so bad. Um and I was a junior at that time, so I could have applied another year if I didn't get in that year. But Nikki called me while I was at school. And she called me while I was at school, and I stepped out of my class and I answered the phone and she was like, Hey, do you want to come work at camp? And I was like, Yes, I think, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I like said yes, and then I immediately left school and I went home during the middle of the day. Immediately went home because I was so excited I had to tell my parents. Um But I think just realizing that there's more to my faith than just going to church um and believing what I had been told, um, but realizing that like the Lord saved me and I don't have a part in him saving me, but I have a responsibility um to faithfully work out that my salvation and like do what he's called me to do. And I think that was working at camp.
SPEAKER_01:So do you think you said that when you first started you weren't that excited about it? And by the time you got the call, you were very excited. Do you think the process of applying and going through because it's a pretty intense application, going through that and then the interview process, do you think that built your excitement? That's that's like something that grew your excitement?
SPEAKER_02:I think so. And definitely talking to the leaders on the phone because they did phone interviews then. I guess you guys probably still do that. That really grew my excitement because Nikki like explained what day-to-day um element would look like, um, what we would be studying through the book of James. And that she didn't really tell us we'd be working right, because I don't even know if that was fully like decided at that point. But just thinking about what I could be doing every single day. And she talked about the discipleship of it. And I think that's what excited me the most in like the close-knit relationships.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I kind of want to walk through kind of like a what a day in the life of an element. Because I think sometimes they're like, Well, I'm gonna be cleaning toilets and serving, okay, like whoopdoo. But I think like in easiest terms for people to understand that have at least been here or been a camper, I sometimes like to describe it as like you're half a camper, half a counselor, like or like half a staff member, I'd say. So yes, you you wake up, you serve breakfast, and then clean the meal buildings, the bathrooms, everything like that. And then sometimes we'll go to service. Sometimes you said you went through James. This summer we're going through First Peter. So, like on the leadership side, we'll kind of divvy up the teaching and have like really intimate teaching time. At least once or twice a week, Brody or Rob or Zach or um, some of like our full-time guys will come in and speak to Element. And so you're getting sometimes like two to three devotional times or like um, I don't know, I guess for lack of a better word, devotional times with people on staff. And then uh this isn't like promise for everyone, like it just kind of depends. But we also want to train you guys up, like Bertie was saying, to come back and work on staff. So, did you have the opportunity to work with students ever?
SPEAKER_02:Yes, I did. I worked with students three times. So the first like two weeks, they were just kind of training us everything to do. Yeah. And we'd have sessions with Nikki and Morgan. They were the only two girl leaders in my element year that would teach us kind of how to work with students. But I think that you can tell us as much as you want, but like once you're sitting in share groups, that's I think when you really, really learn. Um, so whenever I worked with students, I would still do a little bit of like my servant team or element duties. Um, but usually I wouldn't serve meals and I would only help clean a little bit. I don't know if things have changed since then because it's been almost three years since I did element, but um we'd usually go to meals with our students the weeks that we had students and then maybe help clean if they needed it, and we'd always go to service. So we'd just catch a ride with our church, go hang out with our students at service, um, and then come back and like I said, help meals and cleaning if we needed, but we'd be paired up with an older staff member. So someone who had usually worked another summer before, and we'd be in share groups with them, like co-leading with them, um, which was really cool experience because I wasn't sure if I wanted to come back and work on staff. I had no context for what that would look like, but it really helped me like get an idea of what my days would look like and if that's something the Lord was calling me to, if that was a desire I had. So we just like sit in share groups with them and usually they would lead and give us an opportunity to talk if we had something to say. It wasn't like just sit there and be quiet and listen, but like learn from what we're doing. Um, and I get to have like one-on-one conversations with students, especially if they were struggling with something that I had struggled with in the past. Yeah. Just being able to use my experience to like speak into whatever they were going through.
SPEAKER_03:And I think it's so cool for normally we try to put element in a sugar with middle schoolers so they're not just leading their peers in a way. But I think it's cool for campers to see. Wait, she's actually not that much older than me. And she's already working here and she's all already have like this much knowledge of you know, scripture and such a great relationship. So I think that also plays a huge role. I think it's really cool for campers to see that.
SPEAKER_01:I want to walk through um like what, like, okay, this summer, 26. What is a day look like in the element schedule? Because it has changed a little bit. We were joking with Josiah on the break. Boy's schedule looks a little different than the girls' schedule. Your summer looked different than that meeting at Burger Basket. I remember Morgan was like, Nikki was like, Austin was like, like, no, it's gonna be great. Yeah, anytime you roll something new out and you start to mix it up and shake it up, it can be unnerving.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But I think element is pretty dialed in now.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:So let's walk through what what would a normal day be like and then how I'd like, see how this sounds.
SPEAKER_03:Okay.
SPEAKER_01:Has it changed much? So now what would it look like?
SPEAKER_03:So, like we said, the a majority of like their service to camp is serving meals. So wake up, serve breakfast, um, and then after immediately after breakfast, while all the campers kind of load up and head over to North Campus for service, we will clean the coop in the metal building. Those are our meal buildings that we have meals in. So we'll tidy that up, wipe tables, sweep, and kind of help the kitchen crew get that set up for lunch. So instead of like a yogurt or oatmeal bar, switch it out for like salad bar, stuff like that. And then since there's so many of them, it's nice that we can have like half of them doing that and then the other half kind of dispersed around campus cleaning bathrooms. Um, and so, like I said, it kind of depends on the day. Sometimes we would stay back and have a session. Like I mentioned earlier, uh, we're going to First Peter. But before we even get into First Peter, the first like two to three weeks is we've talked previously about staff training. So we kind of have like a miniature version of staff training for element. So we go through core values, we go through mission statement, we go through things like how to lead a share group. And so it's basically like a miniature version of the things that we cover in staff training. And so, um, like I said, that's like pretty much the first one to two weeks. They'll stay back and just like hear all of those sessions. And then after that, we gradually move on to our sessions. So, like James, um, Ephesians, First Peter. Um, and then, like I mentioned before, at least once or twice a week, Brody will come in and speak to them. So that morning session is kind of a revolving door. So after campers leave and go to service, we'll either have a session, Brody will come and speak to them, or Zach or Rob or somebody like that, or we'll all load up in a van and come to service and listen to the services, like the main sessions and stuff. Um, and then we come back immediately, start rocking and rolling for lunch. So, like I said, get the celibar set up, uh, make sure everything's tidy, make sure everything is set up, serve lunch, and they all have positions. So if they're not even on the main serving line, they're gonna be refilling utensils. If they're not doing that, they're refilling condiments. So they're always gonna be doing something different, pretty busy during mealtimes. Um, and then same thing after mealtime, they'll clean those buildings, clean the bathrooms. And then similarly, sometimes we'll have a session. Uh, but I would say for the majority of days, you guys had free time. We would always encourage you guys to read your Bible and like have a set time. We would say an hour before dinner, come back to the metal building or the coop or whatever and read your Bible, have your time because, like I said, we're up pretty early in the morning for breakfast. So a lot of times they don't get a chance to read before, but we have that time intentionally for them. Carved out, no other responsibilities, no other excuses per se. Just like sit down, read your Bible. But for the majority of like the rec time for a camper, they can also do wrecks. Like a lot of them will like go up to the pool or I don't know, like hang out, go to the snack shack, like just kind of do fun stuff, almost like the life of a camp kid almost. Like they kind of have freedom on campus to kind of hang out, do whatever they want. Um, I know for the guys, a lot of a lot of times they're it looks different, like we said. So during rec, a lot of times they'll be doing groundswork or helping out maintenance or uh stuff like that. But would you say that's pretty much the same as yours?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, that's very similar. I think one of the biggest differences, maybe the only difference, is that we didn't clean after breakfast and lunch. We only or breakfast and dinner, we only cleaned after lunch. Uh, because that summer the staff still served and they still cleaned. Yeah. So we didn't serve every single meal. We only served some, but we still did the same. Like everyone had their own task during a meal time. And we also had a couple less girls than you guys do now, but not a lot.
SPEAKER_03:Both of my summers that I worked on summer staff, it was crazy looking back, juggling. We served meals and cleaned bathrooms because there was only like eight element or servant team. And so looking back, that was like so stressful. And now it's so nice that staff doesn't have to worry about, oh, I have to leave eating early with my campers to go clean a bathroom. And then I have to like, you know. So it's nice that element takes all of that pressure off of staff to just sit down, have a meal with their campers. Um, and then let's talk about Fun Friday. Okay. So I feel like this is not, I don't think a lot of people know about this. Probably not. I didn't know about it until I worked here. Yeah. So on Fridays, we have so they work hard during the week. Definitely. Element works hard, getting hands dirty, like up early, staying up late at night. Like it's it's a definitely like a hearty task. But on Friday, we normally uh the first part of the day looks the same. Breakfast, serve breakfast, clean, all that stuff. But then right after lunch, we have um hospitality crew. So it this year it'll be Allison Yates and Ashley. I almost said Rinfro. Ashley Fitzpatrick. Um, and they so generously will clean for us so we can go down the river, or we can go to Lake Santila and basically just like have a good time. We kind of like we'll debate, or not debate, but be like, what do you guys want to do? Sometimes we'll go catch a movie or just like something fun. So every Friday we do something going off campus, um, going to the lake. I know in the past they've gone to like a water park or a skating rink. Yeah. So just fun stuff. And then I think my favorite is at night, me too. We go to Nikki's house and she cooks for us, and it's good stuff. Like, I mean, Andy has has good cooking, but Nikki's is like, it's just it's different from camp food. Yeah, and she cooks good normally on the Blackstone. We watch a movie and just kind of like hang out. Half the girls are knocked out. There's like 20 girls deep on one sectional couch falling.
SPEAKER_01:Most people don't make it through the movie.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, no, never.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, little known fact those Friday meals at Nikki's, um, so I never eat before I speak. So in the summer, I usually just end up not even eating supper because I'll eat lunch, maybe have a snack in the afternoon, but I don't like to eat before I speak. And so, and I'm usually speaking in the evenings. Friday night when I walk off stage, there's a there's a to-go box of that food full of the house. Nikki's got my name on it. Yeah. And man, I I look so forward to that. And I'll and it's it's always more than I can eat. Nikki's a good cook. Yeah, and Andy, Andy's team, it's shocking what they're able to do. Yes. But but there's something about someone cooking in the kitchen at the house. Even like if you go to Andy's house and eat, yeah, it's different. It's different than eating at Metal Building or the Coop. It's just a home cooked meal. Yeah. And there's something about the that's good.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. And so it's like, in a way, formatted similar similar. Oh my gosh. Similar. Similarly. Thank you. Similarly. There you go. To like a camper. But instead of just going to all the services, a lot of times we'll stay back and have our own private session. We share testimonies. So that's like a really growing moment. Would you say that was growing for you?
SPEAKER_02:Definitely. I think it teaches you a lot about the people that you're working with. Right. And it teaches you how to share your testimony and like be vulnerable and what the Lord is.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. So, like the first, like I said, in that first two to three week range, all the girls share their testimonies, all the leaders share their testimonies, guys separately, girls separately. Um, and then uh I just lost my train of thought.
SPEAKER_01:I will say this about the element program while Jabby's trying to remember what she was to say is if there is a trophy program at Snowbird, if there's anything that produces hate to use the word produce, but I think y'all know what I mean. That produces a person like like that puts out a product if uh you know, like what a person has become after 10, 12 weeks in that, 10 weeks in that program. Um the the it produces more growth and more fruit in a person's life, I think, than anything else we do. Just just uh what it's producing in you in terms of growth and maturity and experience and what comes out of that is very powerful.
SPEAKER_02:Definitely, yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, if I if I like I would take one of your girls out of element, I'd take Avery or one of the girls from last summer and send them, or Josiah, one of the guys from the guy's side, and send them to represent Snowbird to a group of pastors and be like, hey, take this young man or this young woman, put them in a seat, fire away, ask them all the questions you want to ask about snowbird, about doctrine, about the Bible. And I would trust them to represent this organization. You know what a crazy thing that is? Yeah. To say, yeah, uh a 17-year-old person, and that they can represent I'll hang our repu our repetit reputation on this representation. And that's how much I believe in this program.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And this summer, you and Nikki, Nikki, and Laylee. Oh, cool. Yeah, yeah. I'm stoked about that. That's so exciting. Um, yeah, my daughter will be one of the leaders. And really, the whole element program comes under Nikki. So the guy side, um, the guy team leaders and the girl team leaders all answer to Nikki Smith, who um who is the director over that whole program, and she does a phenomenal job.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, I was actually about to say the thing that I lost my train of thought of is it's one been really, really growing and cool to be under Nikki and Morgan and like kind of like follow their lead, especially my first year. You know, I didn't know what I was doing, but it's been super growing to be under someone like Nikki, who's just such a boss. I love her. But um, and just see like how intentional she disciples. But uh what I was gonna say earlier is we try to get one-on-one with not necessarily every girl, but let's say I have a group of five girls that I'm gonna meet with them one-on-one. And then same goes for Nikki and Morgan. So, yes, like group settings, but also one-on-one settings. We make them do like evaluations. Do you remember that? Yeah, we did that. And it basically just like it's I want to say week nine or 10. So right before they go home. And it's just like evaluating themselves about like personal holiness and discipline and like all of these things. And then we kind of shift it and say, Okay, how are you gonna do this when you go home? So I feel like that's pretty cool, too. Of like just so many different levels of discipleship and ministry, and then even like gearing you guys to go home and not just being like, all right, it's been a fun summer. See ya. Cause wait, I want to hear about because you went home. Yeah, I was I did after my junior year, so I went back to high school afterwards. Yeah, I'm curious. How did that go?
SPEAKER_02:Was that a struggle? Was it definitely where'd you go to high school? I went to North Iradow high school.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, public school kid.
SPEAKER_02:Um, yeah, it was definitely strange. So I did an element with one of my closest friends from home. So we both had that experience together.
SPEAKER_01:So the Townsville kid? Who was it?
SPEAKER_02:No, her name is Claire Page.
SPEAKER_01:Okay, okay.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Um, so we both went back to school together. And I feel like I had good community at my church. I wasn't super close to a lot of them. Um, but at school, obviously that was super, super hard. And it was, I went from this really tight-knit community of believers, like pushing each other towards Christ and towards personal holiness all the time. And I just sat under so much teaching and so much like personal discipleship, which was really, really cool. And I think that I grew so much in my faith more than any other season of my life at um when I was on element. But then I went back home and I was like, okay, this is so weird. Like, I don't have that anymore. Yeah. Um, and my parents like raised me in church and they're strong believers and faithful, but it's just not the same as being surrounded by like, I think it was 16 other girls just working towards the same goal. So it was really hard whenever I went home to um like stay connected, I think. Um and I was kept in touch with a lot of those girls and we're still really close, but it just wasn't the same as having them around. So I really had to fight for like time in the word and for my own personal holiness and not letting like being surrounded by the things of the world and being in public school like cause me to drift or fall away, or just like almost forget the teaching and like the experience that I had over the summer.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. I want to also I want you to talk about okay, so element, they're high schoolers, so it's kind of weird on insurance because like I said, they're like half camper, half staffer.
SPEAKER_01:The status legally on our side is that you're a you're a student, you're like someone who has registered to come to camp.
SPEAKER_03:Right.
SPEAKER_01:That's on paper for in terms of uh insurance. Right. But then the way we see you is a staff, right?
SPEAKER_02:And so sorry. No, you're good. We can't have our cars and can't drive.
SPEAKER_03:So I think that's what you wanted me to say. Yeah. And I want you to kind of talk. I know a lot of that leads into our actual summer staff that gives them almost like an alley oop to take you guys to laundry or to get lunch. So I want you to talk about that aspect too of like, was it cool, like people you looked up to, like how did the summer staff handle that? You know what I mean? If that makes sense.
SPEAKER_02:So all of the element girls are like split into housing with the staff girls, which I think is helpful, but also we can't have our cars or anything like that. So on the weekends, you have to rely on the summer staff to take you to do laundry or get lunch, like you were saying. And it taught me one to like ask people for things because I think that at least in the world, it's not super common to just ask someone to take you to lunch with them or like impose on their plans almost or like invite yourself somewhere. Um, but I kind of had to get over that really quickly, or like maybe I wasn't gonna have lunch or like do my laundry. Um, but two staff girls that just took care of me all summer were Hannah Jackson and Riley Blue. And Riley Blue still comes around. I love her, she's great. But if it weren't for those two, maybe I wouldn't have had my lunch every week. They were so intentional to ask me immediately at the Saturday meeting, like, what are you doing? Do you want to go to the lake? Do you want to get lunch? We can go do your laundry, like all the things, and just took care of us so well. And I'm sure there were a ton of other staff girls, but those were the two I think that invested in me so much and made me want to come back. Um, I mean partially, but like we're part of the reason I wanted to like come back and be able to do that with other element girls or just like see the community they had and how much they cared about us.
SPEAKER_01:Hadn't Hannah been on servant team previously? She was on servant team the year before. I think element girls and guys really understand the value of investing in the next generation of element girls and guys, and that's where it it it creates like a brotherhood or sister. You know, you you meet somebody, there's a there's a college called VMI, Virginia Military Institute, and I knew a guy that went there, and if and it's a military school, it's like going to the Naval Academy or West Point on a smaller scale. Real hard school to go through, and they get a ring, and I was with this guy that that was a friend of mine, and he had his ring on. We were at a restaurant, and a guy picked up our tab, and he comes over and he says, I'm a VMI cadet. He saw his ring, he saw his ring, and it's a very unique ring. And there's this brotherhood, it's a small school in the but it's very prestigious. But there's just this brotherhood or sisterhood that comes with having been there. And I think people that have been through element just have a different bond, even if it's not the same year, you've had a shared experience that um it's special, it's very special.
SPEAKER_02:Definitely.
SPEAKER_01:Are there the the last question I had for you is are there patterns in your life that you still see that you still sort of like patterns in your life today that you go back to your summer on element that are influenced?
SPEAKER_02:I think so. Well, I was joking with you guys the other day, but I didn't know what the word discernment meant really until I lived here, which is crazy because I did grow up in Germany. But it was like the first time I had thought, oh, maybe like everything that comes to my mind I don't have to say out loud. So that was definitely growing, and that's something I still have to like. Oh yeah, discernment's like a thing that needs to happen in every part of my life. But one of the biggest areas of struggle in just my walk, my walk with the Lord up until that point, and even still now sometimes, was just being in the Word every day, um making it a priority and making time for that. And like JB was saying, um, every afternoon we met in the metal building, I think at 4 45 or 5, and we would all read our Bibles together. And they gave us that like set amount of time to do that. And that just instilled a habit in me because every single day at that same time I knew where I was gonna read my Bible and like with all the girls that did Element with me. So even as I went back home to high school, it was still a struggle, but it instilled like such a good habit and reminder of that I need to be in the word every single day and be consistent. Um, so I think that's probably the biggest one.
SPEAKER_01:That's good. That we put such a I don't use the word emphasis, value. We put such a value here. And our dis our mentality and process of discipling and mentoring somebody, probably the highest value is placed on time in the word because we believe the word of God is living and active. And I tell I tell guys even at Be Strong in our men's conference, there's guys here that are in their forties and fifties or twenties or whatever. I meet a guy and I'm like, I know real quick where this guy's maturity is, where his discernment is based on how much time he spends in God's word. And it's it's all things pertaining to life and godliness. And even like you know, I told I was talking to someone I I met with this morning that we were talking about when we were offline, met with this person. He's a very uh influential ranking person in the world, and he had reached out and we had a conversation, and I said, Man, what how much time do you spend in a word every day? And he's like, to be honest, I I get up and I get distracted by my phone, and I'm like, I'm telling you, man, if you open God's word and realize that when you open God's word, God's word opens you if you submit to it. And it'll change your life, and every day it'll change your life a fresh and a new. And that is an emphasis that we place on not just element, but on any anything you do at Snowbird. I want my guys that work in maintenance full time. It's like, hey, you can go make money somewhere else doing the same job. What what's important here is that you're working in Christian community where there's a like-mindedness and an accountability and and where we're all working for the same prize or the same goal, which is to build a kingdom.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, you know. I love the maintenance guys, they meet every Tuesday morning or something and have a little Bible study. I was actually talking with Austin, I was like, I want to start doing that with our media department. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Yeah. So cool. I think it's easy for the other departments to to not see the need for that because you're doing ministry constantly. And I think those guys a lot of days, they're not doing ministry.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:They're keeping this thing going and uh behind the scenes. And so I don't know, there's a value that I think they appreciate that we can all learn from. Um yeah, but uh that's that's encouraging to hear you say that.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, so now you element went back to high school, then what?
SPEAKER_02:Then I was on summer staff in 2024, right after I graduated high school. And then I applied to intern that year, and I interned um 24 to 25, and I'm in the institute again this year. So it's your second year.
SPEAKER_03:Yes.
SPEAKER_02:Then you work another summer.
SPEAKER_03:Yes. And I think it's cool now. Like, I I can't remember, it might have been Brody talking about like having veteran staff, and he mentioned you and was like, she's got an element summer on under her belt, um, two summers, two intern years. Like, it's crazy to think about that. Like you truly are like a vet staff, like you've been through pretty much every stage, you know. Like, so that's really cool. So I didn't know you're your element year, I wasn't here, but it's cool to just see that progression, and that's common, you know. Like a lot of I'm trying to think of who else, like Hannah Nicholson, Katie Hayes was on element year year. It's cool to see like the progression of man, you started as Mongous High Schoolers, and then now you're, you know, like super discerning. Look at you. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:I mean, we have two high-level guys at Snowbird that started there, and uh, I want to say a couple high-level girls. Austin Scott was on.
SPEAKER_03:That is crazy, isn't that wild?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, as a student. He's now a director over all of media and production.
SPEAKER_03:Landon was on element. Harry McSween started. No way.
SPEAKER_01:Harry McSween started there.
SPEAKER_02:On Element?
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, 2005.
SPEAKER_02:So did Madeline Strickland.
SPEAKER_01:Madeline Strickland did. Yep. So we have people in these really high ranking, I don't, I don't know the terminology, like leadership positions. They've been here. They like, you know, I heard somebody say one day, uh I was talking to someone who said that they were talking to a guy that had worked here for a while and now he's moved on. He's working in his family business, and he's he brought someone up and it's like, wait, he still works there? I'm like, yeah, this is yeah, like I can't think of a better thing. Like I've I have a I have we have a board member who ran the same company for 36 years, and now his son's running it. And I'm like, well, why is that acceptable? And it's not acceptable to plug in and do what Austin Scott's done, you know, to do what Rob Conti's done. And I think element is is is one of those things where our staff that started there are some of our most solid leaders, but then also the the majority of people do it and move on to something else in life. And those people tend to be well equipped, more well equipped for whatever God takes them to next.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. It's not like what you learn is just helpful at Snowbird. They equip us to like also go into the world and be faithful believers there and like hard workers, but it's also obviously super helpful if you stay here.
SPEAKER_03:It's also encouraging for me to see how many high schoolers are wanting to sign up to clean a toilet. Like, and I know we just talked about it's so much more than that, but it is crazy. Oh, it's a huge part, but it's crazy for me to be like, man, when I was in high school, you cannot catch me doing that. And it's very encouraging to see like just the culture. And sometimes we have people sign up for Element that have never even been here, that's crazy, which is mind-blowing to me. It's like that is crazy. Like, that is really, really cool and encouraging.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it was somebody last summer or the summer before, and I remember I'm in one of those meetings, those weekly meetings. I'm like, all right, I want to hear kind of when like when I asked you when did you start coming to camp? You're in a middle schooler. This kid was like, Oh no, I haven't I never been here until three weeks ago. And I was like, Well, the world, yes, what are you thinking? Yeah, what did you sign up for? I'll tell you something crazy. Um something that I I want to make sure that element understands is the value y'all bring or that they bring to the operation. And something crazy to think about is so JB was mentioning how the summer staff used to have to do serve meals and clean bathrooms and do all the behind-the-scenes stuff, but still guide down the river or run whatever recreation you're running, but also be in the worship services and the we have two a day, morning and evening, lead a share group after that. But then also I'm I'm on breakfast duty tomorrow. When we started Snowbird, Little and I would get up in the morning, get breakfast squared away, serve breakfast, clean up, take people into a worship service where she would play the guitar and lead courses and I would teach, break up the girls and guys into share groups. And all right, you guys go have some free time. We'd run, get lunch ready. After lunch, we'd load them up and drive them to the river. We would guide them down the river, come back, all right, you guys go get sh go get showers, hang out, whatever. We gotta get supper ready. We get supper squared away.
SPEAKER_03:That's crazy.
SPEAKER_01:After supper, everybody move over to the chairs, we're gonna have a service and we would do a Bible serv a Bible study or a worship service teach. All right, everybody gather around, we're gonna go do share groups, and we go do a night wreck. And then everybody go to whatever, and we would clean up. And it would be us, it'd be little and I and a staff of about six people. So then the original need for this program was we need help, but we need help as we grow, we need help where people don't have to break away from this to go lead a share group. And so it really is a cool like the roots to the program are there's a need that needs to be met here. Why not meet the need with people that we can invest in for future. Ministry is such a cool like cyclical thing where 'cause I mean you could we could pay people from the community twelve bucks an hour or whatever.
SPEAKER_03:Janitor or something.
SPEAKER_01:Yeah, you could pay people a s a a wage and fifteen bucks an hour. People come out here, line up to get a job, and but at the end of the day, they've go home and they've not invested in what we're about, you know.
SPEAKER_03:And sure.
SPEAKER_01:Um it's a phenomenal program. And I commend parents that support their kids being here for the program. And I did it with Kilby um with a program in another ministry when she was 15. I little and I sent her, supported her. It was a missionary program, and she spent part of her summer in New York City ministering cross-cultural communities and then part of her summer overseas with an I and B team. We supported that, but it's critical that parents get behind it.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:Um, to make it work.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Okay, I have one last question for you, and I'm kind of putting you on the spot. Okay. But if let's say someone's listening to this and they're on the fence to apply to element or do element, what would you say to them? You can take a second to think about it, because I know that's a that's okay. Hard question. Um it's about applying, you said yeah, applying or doing element or even like I guess it goes hand in hand with staff, but specifically element.
SPEAKER_02:Um, I think I would say that you should at least fill out the application because it's very growing. You'll have to um think about and wrestle with why you believe what you believe, kind of like what I was talking about earlier. Um, and then I think on element, you will grow so much, so, so, so much and learn a lot from really wise teachers. Um, but also you'll be invested in in a way that you probably haven't been before, maybe, but for me, it was something totally new, like one-on-one discipleship um by just women who were further along in their faith and were able to pour into me in that way. And also, I was just surrounded by so many faithful believers that pushed me towards Christ. And some of them are still my best friends, and it's been almost three years, and a lot of them don't live here anymore, but yeah, really close with them. So I think it will just push you to pursue Christ and grow in your personal holiness and your walk with the Lord and also bring some of your closest friends.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, that's good. I think kind of adding on to that too, there's always gonna be like a million reasons not to do element or staff because we understand it's a big commitment, it's three months of your life. But also for element, I think sometimes kids will just use, I don't want to say the excuse because I understand sports is a big deal, but they'll just use like, oh, I have sports or I have this mission trip or like whatever. I'll say this we strive to work with high school students. Like this past summer, Meg Miller now plays collegiate soccer. And so she would have to get a workout in or a run-in, or she would have to go early for college orientation. So we understand that you guys are still in high school and still have, you know, a lot of stuff going on. So we're willing to work with you, but also, like you were saying, like kind of weigh your options here. Like, okay, I could go to football camp and then that's kind of it. Or I could just spend a whole summer like not only learning like physical trades and discipline, but also like spiritually grow so much more than spending a summer going to football camp and playing video games or whatever. You know, no hate to football camp, guys. But just sad.
SPEAKER_01:I don't think anybody that's done the element program regrets doing it.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:But I d I think there's a lot of people that are on the fence and ah, maybe I should. And they talk themselves out of it and then they're like, man, they miss out on a blessing. I think that happens.
SPEAKER_03:Sweet. Well, thanks, Avery. Yeah, thank you guys.
