No Sanity Required
No Sanity Required is a weekly podcast hosted by Brody Holloway and Snowbird Outfitters. Each week, we engage culture and personal stories with a Gospel-driven perspective. Our mission is to equip the Church to pierce the darkness with the light of Christ by sharing the vision, ideas, and passions God has used to carry us through 26 years of student ministry. Find more content at swoutfitters.com.
No Sanity Required
Choosing Commitment Over Comfort
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In this episode, Brody and JB sit down with Carter Warn, a new voice on NSR but an integral member of the Snowbird family.
Carter shares how God led him from media ministry to discipling students at Snowbird, using unexpected opportunities, uncertainty, and anxiety to shape his path along the way.
Together, they discuss analysis paralysis, honoring commitments, the influence of social media, and what it looks like to trust God's direction one step at a time. Through personal stories, practical wisdom, and reflections on Psalm 1, Carter encourages listeners to stay rooted in Scripture and keep moving forward in faith.
Please leave a review on Apple or Spotify to help improve No Sanity Required and help others grow in their faith.
Click here to get our Colossians Bible study.
Welcome And Why Carter Is Here
SPEAKER_00Hey, I'm excited about this week's episode. We've got Carter uh on with us today, and I think we're probably gonna start having Carter on more frequently. Um we want to continue to grow, not just the podcast in terms of scope and volume, but also just bringing more voices to it, especially uh generational voices and then people that are um from different backgrounds. I don't know. I'm excited about the way the Lord's growing in SR. Um it really is, it's already gone beyond what I ever thought it would. And so I'm excited to continue to grow it. And um so I'm excited to have Carter start to join us. And so he's gonna be here today. We'll talk a little bit about uh his background, where he came from, and then also um we're gonna have a cool discussion on some things that I think are really pertinent specifically for um Gen Z, folks that are in the college sort of phase of life or the entering the trades, the workforce, if you're not going to college trying to figure out what's next, you're going to the military, going into the trades, whatever. Um we get we have a lot of conversation surrounding that. Um and then people that do know they want to go to college or I want to, I don't want to go to college, but then you don't really have good clarity on direction. We're just gonna talk about that. And I'm excited about it. I think it's a really um applicable discussion to have for this generation. Um, and so I'm excited. This is gonna be a lot of fun. I'm excited about this conversation. Welcome to this week's episode of No Sanity Required.
SPEAKER_01Welcome to No Sanity Required from the Ministry of Snowbird Wilderness Outfitters, a podcast about the Bible, culture, and stories from around the globe.
SPEAKER_03Okay, I gotta start off by giving Carter kudos. NSR would not be where at the level that it is without Carter. He helps me so much with editing, coloring, lighting. Carter's together.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so you're if you're tuning in and you're like, wait, Carter, they just threw this guy in there. Yeah, true. We didn't y'all hear from me and JB, you see me and JB. There's a whole team. Um, Chris is behind the camera now. We've got a couple of other folks that are that are super involved. Carter plays a vital role. Um I want you to start to meet these people and uh and realize what a big effort it is. You know, we've chosen to this point not to really push for NSR to be monetized. We we just want to keep it super uh personal and with within it's it's first and foremost a ministry to the people that are snowbird partners. And whatever's uh, you know, however the Lord uses it outside of that, that's awesome. We're excited about it. But um, that's the the primary thing is everything we do. We talked about this in the Duke and Paco episode. Everything's gotta be driven by the mission statement. And this is, and so yeah, I'm excited for y'all to start
From Media Work To Ministry Tension
SPEAKER_00meeting some new people, but you're gonna hear more and more from Carter. And Carter, you're seeing him for the first time, hearing from him for the first time, but he's been been heavily involved in NSR for quite a while now. So um basically what happened was JB, you were running the um the panel discussion at our recent staff orientation. Carter was on the panel. I was like, oh, somebody in this generation that I forgot it's unique for someone to be able to communicate so well and articulate.
SPEAKER_02I mean, I have a couple years on the other guys up there.
SPEAKER_00You do, you're a little older, but still it's like uh I don't know, man. Yeah, like being able to talk.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Wait, I kind of want to start there because Carter, you are 28. Yep. And Carter gets grief and a lot of jokes. Unk. He gets called Unk a lot, but I do kind of want you to start there because a lot of times the people that apply and work at camp are fresh 18, 19 years old. Yeah. So will you walk us through how you found a camp, why you decided to apply, everything like that?
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Do you have a minute because it's yes, we got a minute? So I'm 28. Um, I did some college, uh, mostly just community college, all community college, actually. So I did dual enrollment and stuff, but I dropped out of that because I'm like, I don't really think I want to be doing this. I don't know what I want to do long term. Doesn't make sense to put money into this. Uh, and I ended up doing media work for ministries. Um, I'd done video and stuff like that uh for throughout high school just for fun. And then uh got a job working at a ministry in Michigan called Life Action, um, doing video work for them. And I was with them for about four, four and a half years, ended up going to Moody Bible Institute to work there. I didn't go to school there, but I went and did some podcast specific work there for a couple of years, and then it was from Moody that I ended up coming here. Um, and throughout that whole kind of span of doing video work, even for ministry, I kind of struggled with the tension of like media in and of itself isn't bad. Um, but I would wrestle with like, is what I'm doing really worth it? Um, is this making a really big impact for eternity or not? Um and when I was this was probably 23, 24, some friends of mine convinced me to help uh lead small groups at my church's youth group. And uh I wasn't really sure about it at the beginning. I'm like, I don't know if I'm gonna connect with these students. I don't really have like a massive heart for like students or anything, but I'm gonna give it a shot. So I ended up doing it and I did it for four years. And the way my church does it is you get assigned a group of guys. So I got put with the freshman guys. Okay, and then every year you work with the same group of people.
SPEAKER_00You move with them till they graduate, exactly. And then you would start back exactly with a new freshman. Okay, I like that.
SPEAKER_02Which was all it was so fun working with these guys all the way through high school. Um, and about two years into that, I started realizing, oh, this is the most fun, fulfilling thing that I get to do, like every week. Yeah. Um, so fast forward to that fourth year. So I'm with the group, they're seniors now, we're kind of rounding everything out. And I'm really wrestling like, do I want to keep doing media? Do I want to try something else? This is the most fulfilling thing I get to do. And there was a guy from my church who was planting a church out in Hawaii. He's Tongan, so he's from the Pacific area, so he has a heart for those people, and he's doing this church plant. I'm like, I'm single, I got nothing tying me here. Church plant in Hawaii sounds kind of crazy. So I prayed about that for a while, met with him. We kind of talked about what it would look like, and it kind of fell off. I didn't like lose interest, but I think I just got distracted. Um, and there was a lot of time before he actually went out to Hawaii. And you'll pick up on this as I keep talking. I can get pretty anxious about things, especially big life things. But there was this short period of a couple months where I got really anxious about some health stuff, and um I didn't end up having anything actually serious going on, it was just all in my head. But by the time I went into the doctor to get it checked out, um, I was asking myself the question of like if I died in like two months and I'm standing before God and I'm accounting for my life, like what what's that gonna be like? And I'm like, well, I'm not concerned because I'm like, I'm I'm saved, I know I'm saved, but I feel like it my life is a shell of what it could be, like there's so much more that I could do. And so by the time I figure out, oh, this health thing is nothing to worry about, I remember leaving the doctor's office finding that out, and I'm just like, I gotta do something. Like, I can't keep doing what I'm doing. I either have to like go to this Hawaii church plant or find something else or like do something. So I'm talking to my roommate about it, and we're just processing, and he asked me, if you could do anything, money's no object, like anything with your life, what would it be? And I told him, which is funny that I said this, um, because I had never gone to camp, like a snowbird camp before. Um and I just told him, if I could do what I do at youth group, but at a camp, that would be awesome. And like I think I think I probably said that because that summer I went with my senior guys to our youth camp that we did that summer with youth group. I'm like, this is awesome. But I think that was the reason I said that. And I didn't think anything else of it. Um, I didn't start Googling camps, I didn't start looking into that. This was in December of 2023. Okay. Um, actually, no, 2024. January of 25. I go with my youth group, again, with my youth guys to CrossCon. Um, which if you guys aren't familiar, actually, do you can you explain what CrossCon is?
SPEAKER_03Yeah, so it's if you guys are familiar with like the Passion Conference, it's very similar to that. It's normally aimed for upper high school to college and young adult. Um, and they'll have really cool uh speakers and preachers like John Piper, Rosario Butterfield, like pretty household names. Um, and it's just a conference, it's uh during college's Christmas break, so in that January time. And then a lot of times camps or colleges will come and set up like booths. So Snowbird sets up a booth and will recruit essentially.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and it and it was a lot of those speakers used to speak at passion. Passion, yeah. But passion started to sort of lose their identity, lose their way, I think. And I will say CrossCon is really faithful in terms of how they teach the Bible, it's very expository. Um so there's a lot of likened-mindedness between Snowbird and CrossCon, where there's not so much between us and passion.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And it's very missions heavy, very missions-focused heavy. Yeah. Um, but I like, I didn't even think I was gonna be able to go with my youth guys, but then I find out like two weeks before that I can. So I'm like, hey, I talked to my youth pastor. I'm like, can I can I go? I just I just want to hang out with my guys. This is our last year together. They're gonna graduate. I just want to hang out, it'll be a fun trip. And uh, so he's like, sure. He lets me go. Um, and we're just hanging out in the middle of CrossCon, walking around that exhibit hall with all the booths. And I'm kind of like, whenever I come to conferences and stuff like this, I hate walking through this area because everyone's giving them yourone's trying to pull you into their booth. I'm like, I don't, I'm not a super social person with strangers, so I don't enjoy walking up and talking to new people. Um, but I got my youth guys with me. It's like a pack of four seniors, and I'm like, we gotta walk up to one
CrossCon And The Door Opens
SPEAKER_02of these booths because who knows, maybe one of my guys finds like a school he wants to go to or some cool opportunity, and I want to help him do that. So I led the charge and we walked up to this booth that I'd noticed before because it was big orange and had the nerm name, uh had the word outfitters in it. Let's go. I'm like, I don't even know what an outfitter is, but this sounds really sick. And we walk up, and this is this is two weeks after I told my roommate I want to do what I do at youth group and do it at a camp. Um and we walk up and Sam Merman just starts giving us the spiel, and I almost have an out-of-body experience because I'm just like, oh, this is an important conversation. This is like, this is ordained, like this is this is supposed to happen. Um so I pray about it for a couple of weeks afterwards and then I apply, go through the application process, and I get the call while we're on a our our youth's winter retreat. Um, I missed Jake's call to hire me because I was playing dodgeball with everybody. So I walk out and I call him back and I'm like out of breath from dodgeball. It was just fun. Um, but yeah, so I got hired and then I came out and worked last summer and ended up interning. And so that's how I ended up here. Yeah. And it's uh it is a little bit different because I am older than everybody else. But it was kind of unmistakable the way the Lord just dropped it into my lap.
SPEAKER_03Well, I want you to kind of talk about, and you mentioned this on the panel um about you came to orientation. That's the first time, right? Orientation or stop training?
SPEAKER_02Orientation was my first time in North Carolina.
SPEAKER_03Wow. And so first time stepping foot at Snowbird and talk about how you were kind of like, uh I might back out. Like, I'm scared. I don't want to do this. And like that will lead to our more of our conversation topic.
SPEAKER_02But even for fuller context, you go through the application process, which is this awesome process of answering all these doctrinal questions. And I'm waking up like early every morning for like two months, or not two months, two weeks, just so I have time to actually dig into the stuff and have like good answers to these questions. Um, but I had told my employers at Moody, I told my boss, I'm like, hey, I'm doing this camp thing this summer. This is basically like my two weeks, but it was like a month and a half out. Um, so by the time I came to orientation, I was already locked in. I told my boss I was leaving. I'm like, I'm doing this. I drove out for orientation. I was super nervous, got here, super nervous, because I didn't I didn't know anybody. Everybody was super welcoming. Um, it was huge, but I didn't know anybody. It was different than I imagined. I don't even know what I imagined, but it was different. And over orientation, it was like, I really don't know anybody. We had all these tournaments like volleyball and basketball, and I didn't know anybody, so I wasn't on a team, and everybody had teams formed already. And I was ordered, I ended up on like the Z team of Frisbee Golf, which turned out to be fun, but um, or ultimate frisbee. But yeah, like orientation hit, blazed through it, and I was driving home and I'm like, I'm so scared. Like, I don't know if this is the right move. I don't even remember all the thoughts going through my head.
SPEAKER_03Right. But I'm also like we said, majority of people that are on summer stuff are 18 and 19. So I'm sure that also crossed your mind of like, oh yeah, am I even supposed to be doing like is this for me? Yeah.
SPEAKER_00When you're 27 at the time, when you're that age, you are closer to a 50-year-old in in terms of maturity and worldview than you are to a 20-year-old. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, um, that's a big deal.
SPEAKER_02It was a factor for sure. And I remember uh just coming back and people asking me, like, how was it? How was it? And I was just kind of like trying to give like a positive response, but in the back of my mind, I'm like, this is scary, man. I don't know. Um, and I remember my roommate, the same one I had talked about, and he was telling me, he's like, Well, it's not too late to back out. But I was kind of like, No, it is too late to back out. I've signed a thing, I've committed, I'm I'm gonna go. Um, and I kept coming back to two, just the unmistakable fingerprint of sovereignty on it, where it was just like the way it was dropped into my lap, like the Lord had let me come to the conclusion of this is what I wanted to do, and then he just drops it in my lap two weeks later. I'm like, I can't ignore that.
Orientation Fear And Sticking With It
SPEAKER_02Um so it was a mixture of that and then just honoring my commitment. But got through, drove down, and then two days into staff training, all my fears were like evaporated. It was just, oh yeah. No, that quick. Yeah, yeah. I was concerned I wasn't connect with people going to connect with people, but I did, had friends, um, felt super welcome. And I remember feeling too attention of like, I don't think I'm as spiritual as some of these guys, which is a weird feeling being a 27-year-old, and there's like 20-year-olds, 19-year-olds who are talking in a way that feels more spiritual. Like, this isn't how I talk, this isn't how I think. Like, I don't know if I'm cut out for this, but I do remember during orientation, John Roulot gave a message, and uh it was super helpful to me in the time of just um like the Lord's brought you here, even if this is your first time at camp. Um, like he's brought you here, this is where you need to be. Um and so by the time I got into orientation or actual staff training, it all just kind of melted away.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Yeah, I think two things you hit on first with working anything, whether it's ministry or not, whether it's going overseas for a mission trip or working at a summer camp, I feel like there's always a thousand and one reasons why you shouldn't. Like even the people that I talk to on as we're hiring, there's a million reasons why not to. You have a beach trip, you have this, it will whatever, you have an internship. But I think like maybe the one or two reasons that you should overshadows those a thousand reasons, like like Carter was saying, like just so much. So that's kind of off topic. But if I can encourage you guys, if you're on the fence of like doing something like this, do it. There's always gonna be a million reasons not to.
SPEAKER_02But and I mean, it might not feel like it in the moment, like it might not feel like the positives outweigh the negatives. Um, but if you really trust the Lord, and especially at the age a lot of these people are at, for me, it was like it's a little scarier because I have sunk my life into a career a little bit. Um, but I'm I'm telling people who are thinking about element and summer staff. I'm like, this makes so much sense. If I was your age, I'd be all over this. It it doesn't make sense not to.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. And then the second thing that you hit on that I really want this conversation to kind of steer towards is honoring the commitment that you make. And I think on a large scale, yes, even on a small scale, I've seen so many people, especially in our generation, flake. They're just flaky people. Like if you say you're gonna go have dinner with someone and then you're feeling, oh, I'm tired, I don't want to go anymore, they'll flake, you know? And it's like I've seen just people get so comfortable with their limits that they'll just become a flaky person and not an honorable person of their commitments, big or small. So I'd like you to, if you have a word on that, I would love to hear from you.
SPEAKER_02I mean, it really just comes down to um let your yes be yes and your no be no. Um, that's something I remember going into high school, throughout high school, I was the social guy of the group. I'd always be putting together plans and I'd always and it to the point where I'd get double booked on stuff. Yeah. I'd tell somebody I was doing this, and then I'd tell somebody else I was doing this, and then I would end up having to choose, like, I've told both of these people I was gonna do it. Now I have to tell one of them I can't. And throughout high school and then into my college years, it was kind of like the Lord was just really showing me like your yes be yes, you're your no be no. It's just a it simplifies your life so much. Um, especially in situations like even big situations like this where you have a big decision to make. Um, once you've made the decision, you're just committed to it. Um yes, and yes, be yes, no be no.
SPEAKER_03And I think also I might be,
Let Your Yes Be Yes
SPEAKER_03I don't know, using this verse out of context, but I think it's in Matthew 26. It's when Jesus is at the Garden of Gethsemane praying, he tells the disciples, stay awake, comes back there asleep. And at one point he says, uh, the spirit is indeed willing, but the flesh is weak. And so sometimes I think about that, it's like I'm taking control of like, like I just said, oh, I'm uncomfortable, so I'm not gonna do this commitment that I made, or like, I'm tired, so I'm not gonna do this commitment. And that in my brain, it makes sense of like, okay, my flesh is weak, so I'm basically not allowing the spirit to work or like enter into my life, not enter into my life, but like use me and work in this, even if it's just dinner with another couple or working at Snowbird or going out on the mission field. So I think that's also crucial. Like, yes, let your yes be yes and your no be no, but also think like it is me being flaky and denying this, denying a really cool opportunity that the Lord is wanting me to wanting to use me in, you know. So I think of of that and that scenario as well, too.
SPEAKER_02But I remember even um I would go to a small group uh from church every week, and some of the weeks that I just didn't really want to go, I was tired, I was busy, whatever. I really didn't want to go, but I made myself go anyways, and I'd always feel so full at the end of it, just after the fellowship we'd had and the spiritual conversations, um, and not even just being poured into, but also being able to pour into other people. So I think you're dead on.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I agree.
SPEAKER_00Have you ever heard that phrase paralysis or no analysis paralysis? Yep.
SPEAKER_03I don't know if I have.
SPEAKER_00So it's it's a lot of times you'll hear somebody use it when they're talking about shopping. You go to get a new pair of Nikki.
SPEAKER_03There's so many options.
SPEAKER_00And you three hours later you're going off. I'm way worse off than I was when I'm still no closer to and then but analysis paralysis is where you analyze and analyze and overthink and overthink, and then you do nothing. And I think people people have the tendency to do that. And I always I always use the analogy making this type of decision. Um and we're we're gonna get into the topic now. It's a good point.
SPEAKER_04Yeah, yep.
SPEAKER_00Because I I I'm busting with a couple of thoughts here. One is you know how have y'all ever gone cliff jumping around here? Yeah, you know, when somebody that's a little bit uneasy, they go to the edge, and if they don't go quick, they won't go, they're not going. Yeah, yep. They and they analyze, they overthink, they look, they step back, they look. So I'll tell somebody new hey, when you get up there, you've just watched everybody jump, so you know it's clear down here. We'll give you the thumbs up. As you come up to the edge, walk to the edge, plant your foot and jump. Don't think about it. I was talking to uh I was talking to a special teams coach that my son played for, he's a punt returner, and he was explaining to me, he said. He said the the punt return position is so unique because only true fans of the game understand what this I heard Urban Myers say it's the hardest position in sports. He's like people say quarterback on the football team or the pitcher on the baseball team, he's like, the punt returner is the highest stress position in sports. And so, you know, you're catching a ball that's in the air for five and a half to six seconds. It's 90 feet up. You're in a stadium with 80 or 90 or 100,000 people. It's loud. There's lights if it's a night game. You've got to decide am I going to catch it and run or am I going to fare catch it and down it? While guys that weigh 220 and run a 4440 or barrel in it. And he said, there's this unique skill set that about one in 500 football players has. And it's the ability to make a decision, and he used this terminology: plant your foot. He said, stick your foot in the ground and go vertical. And he said, very few guys can do it. And that's what Tuck is really good at doing. And he, and I think that's it. Can you make a decision, plant your foot and go? The point I'm making is to be able to make a decision, plant my foot, get momentum and go, that is almost like non-existent in y'all's generation. Yeah, for real. People are just paralyzed with inactivity. Like, but they want to do something, and then they don't do anything. And it's like, go make a mistake. Yeah. Go run off the cliff.
SPEAKER_03True.
SPEAKER_00Go break your arm, bust a collarbone, do something stupid, and then learn from it and just be okay with that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Um, and and I think I think that's critical. There, the other, the other picture that I think of is I imagine a father with a child, the child's standing on the edge of the front porch, scared to death to go into the yard. In the yard, there's a sandbox with toys, there's a swing set, there's a
Analysis Paralysis And Plant Your Foot
SPEAKER_00bicycle, and there's a frisbee over here or a ball or whatever, and there's a big yard, and the kid just stops and goes, What am I supposed to do? Am I supposed to play in the sandbox? What if I go play in the sandbox and I'm really supposed to go play with the frisbee? It's like, no, you got there's a there are gonna be seasons in your life where the Lord gives you freedom, yeah, and then he works through your desires. Yeah, you know.
SPEAKER_02And that was really cool to see in my specific situation, because again, going into helping up my church's youth group, I didn't have like if you if you had told me when I was 23, uh, do you want to go work at a camp, a youth camp? I'm like, no, I would have said no. But the Lord changed my desires throughout that time and then fulfilled those desires with with coming here. And it was just crazy to watch how he shifted my desires off of where I was at when I was 23, which honestly was probably pretty self-centered, to where I was ready to go, like do ministry at a camp. It was crazy.
SPEAKER_03Yeah, I see, and I've even done done it like been so like you said, paralyzed of like what's the Lord's will for my life? Like, what's the Lord's will for my life? So you're just like frozen in fear instead of I love the analogy of just like uh barreling through. Like if there's a door and it's unlocked, barrel through and just go, go, go. And then it once you hit a door that's locked, okay, you hit it, turn around, keep going, find the next door, and just like just keep going with every opportunity that the Lord has given you. I can't remember what um session or like what even book of the Bible it was in during Red Oak. It was a few right before the summer, I think two years ago or something. And I can't remember, it might have been Daniel, I don't know, but it was talking about what a blessing time and youth is. Like that is truly it was Ecclesiastes. Ecclesiastes, yes, thank you. Um, and like I think for me in this season of life, it's like truly I have health, I have uh time, I have energy, and I have opportunity. Like that is the biggest bl blessing. I'm young, like you know what I mean. So see that as a blessing, and like Brady said, give everything, everything you have, and then if you get up with a bloody nose or a slap on the wrist, oh, okay, learn from the mistake and keep going.
SPEAKER_00And yeah, you can't, I think in that in that talk, in that message, I said we have, I think I I said we have there are 70 and 80-year-old people in this church or in this world. You meet an 80-year-old who's a millionaire, if you say a multi-multi-millionaire, and if you said to that person, would you be willing to empty yourself of all earthly possessions and have your youth again? 100% of them would say yes. Now, I want to be careful, like I would I don't have regrets. We all have regrets. I don't have regrets in terms of like I don't want to go back and do this again. I feel like when you follow the Lord and you live aggressively, you're gonna make mistakes, but that's part of it. And so I want to live my life. What I want to say to young people is live your life in a way where when you're my age, you can go, yeah, I made some mistakes, but I don't want to go back and do it all over again. I'm happy, I'm satisfied. This is the trajectory God has me on. Get on that trajectory now. Because as much as I miss being 25 and 30 and 40, I miss those seasons and periods in life. If you said to me, Hey, would you want to go back today and read, I would be like, No, no, I'm I'm following a sovereign God and I'm taking chances at times and I'm trusting the Lord to correct the mistakes. And man, I wish, I wish I, you know, the older you get, the more you want to be able to put that into young people's minds. Um, just go for it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_02There is a uh a passage in scripture that's helped me in this area recently. Uh, so it's in Deuteronomy when the Israelites are about to cross into the promised land. So God takes them, you know, up to the promised land the first time, and they see all the giants on the other side, they get freaked out, and then God reprimands them. Um, and in his reprimand, he says, I've carried you this far as a father has carried a son. And that verbiage is so powerful to me because he's like, I've carried you from Egypt tenderly and lovingly, and like he's reprimanded them along the way because they're the Israelites and human. But he's like, I've carried you this far as a father's carried a son, and basically you still don't trust me, so I'm taking you back out to the wilderness. And then he comes back, brings him back around 40 years later, and they actually have the faith to step out, like he's commanding Joshua to be strong and courageous and step out. Um, and then they step into the greatest blessing that they've experienced as a nation. Um, but it was that fear of standing basically on the edge of the Jordan River the first time, and they did not have the faith to step out, even though he had carried them up to that point. And that's just encouraging to me because it's like the Lord has carried me throughout life, he's carried us throughout life to this point. So why would we not charge through that next door?
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, and I do I love the kind of one of my go-to analogies is the open door analogy, because um young people will say, I don't know if the Lord's opened that door. I'm just trying to look for the right the open door. And I'm like, Do you think God's sovereign? Yeah. The answer is always yes. You know, everybody will say that, but then when you test that, it can be scary. I'm like, if he's sovereign, he's not gonna just say, Lord, I'm gonna try to crash through this door. If that's not what you have for me, then don't let it open. And he's he can handle that. I like that uh I like that picture from Deuteronomy though. Um there's not I don't think there's a better case study than the children of Israel. Case study, like the way the Lord provided for them, and then they would go like like I just read when Moses goes on the mountain to receive the
Open Doors And The Gift Of Youth
SPEAKER_00the law, the covenant of God on Mount Sinai. He stays gone too long, and so they give all their jewelry to Aaron and he melts it down and makes a cow. A metal cow.
SPEAKER_02His excuse is my favorite.
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah. We just threw it in the fire. It threw it in the fire and it just came out, and then and then and then but this is also a representation of Yahweh. Like it's it's so messed up. So yeah, we just I I took it, I threw it in the fire, and then out came this this cow. And he says that like literally the chant, the cry is the gods who brought you out of e the god who brought you out of Egypt, this cow that we just made out of melted metal. And I and I watch it. I I mean I read that and I go, that's just crazy. But it's it's very, I think it's it's a study in human nature to forget what God's done. Oh, yeah, and to take control of yourself.
SPEAKER_03For sure.
SPEAKER_00And to and to kind of take over. And and I think that's part of the problem is living by faith can be unsettling.
SPEAKER_03Sure.
SPEAKER_02I think there there's probably something psychological there too, just remembering the failures and the bad things over the things that have worked in the blessings. It's just like a survival thing, probably. But I think that's why in scripture it there's so much call back to like even reading through the Psalms, David calls back and talks about he's like reminding himself in the songs he's writing how the Lord has carried him through. Um, but it is, it's like an intentional, it seems to be an intentional discipline of actually reminding yourself of how the Lord has done that.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, that's good.
SPEAKER_02Has I have a I have a question for you regarding this? Um, so my generation, like you said, is like plagued with this analysis paralysis. Um did you notice that at all growing up in your generation? Or was it not as much? I remember hearing, I think it was probably from the generation before yours, like my grandparents, um, talking about how, oh yeah, you know, you just graduated high school, you found a job in town, uh, you worked that job for 40 years or whatever until you retired and you found uh uh you found a wife, settled down, had kids, and there was like no analysis to it at all. It seemed it seemed just very straightforward and way less anxiety that way. But I'm just curious, did you actually see that like a difference?
SPEAKER_00I think my generation would be a representation of the exact middle between those two extremes. Uh I think what was what intensified in my generation was the pressure to get a college degree.
SPEAKER_03So there was a push towards a lot of first gen college. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yes. And um it almost became, it had never been this way before, but it became and now I think we've come back to where it's not expected, but almost like this cultural expectation. You get you get done with high school, you go to college. Um, no, I think my generation, what what was different in my generation was um the willingness to not stay in the town you grew up in, go to the factory that was open in that town. There was more of a um branch out and go chase the American dream somewhere else or see where, you know, like my parents, everybody they went to school with in high school in the 60s is all still in the same area. But like if I was to try to track down my graduating class, they're all over the they're all over the country, you know. But you didn't have as much of that analysis prowess. People get out of school and they man, here we go. Everybody's like building businesses or going to college or um pursuing pursuing their dreams where uh I think I think that is what's lacking now. Um sort of the I also uh you cannot downplay the effect of social media and technology.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_00You can't, man. It's I don't think we understand. I don't I don't understand. I can't even speak to it. People ask me all the time, what do you think the impact of smartphones and devices at in middle school and kids having them? Like, I don't know. I don't even think you can quantify it. I just know there's a correlation. Every generation changes, right? Um, you know, the the old saying, it's a really famous saying, hard times make strong people, strong people make good or easy or stable times. Stable times make soft people, soft people make hard times. Yeah, and that's the cycle. And uh, and so like my my grandparents, y'all's great-grandparents, that generation came through World War II after having sub survived the Great Depression. They went to fight a war, not even asking, is this just or not? It was like, no, we're not gonna let we don't, they didn't own anything. They had no possessions, but they had they had this appreciation for freedom and I and and ideals. So and fall. In my parents' generation, their kids reaped the benefit of they they established the world in the mid 20th century, came home, and there was an industrial revolution. They built factories, they brought electricity to every town. I mean, that was an industrial generation. Their kids then questioned authority, questioned the government. That was the movement of the 60s.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Okay, watch this. Coming out of that movement, 1971, the military draft ceased. So men were no longer, you didn't have to worry about am I gonna get drafted? Up until 1971, every generation of dudes, whether there was a war or not, certain number of guys got drafted. Elvis Presley got drafted. That's one of the big parts of his story. That was in 71. The next year, it was either 72 or 73, Roe v. Wade. So you look at the effect of men no longer being asked to serve and women being given autonomy over their sexuality. There was a shift that happened in that era. And then my generation is the one that grew out of that, where there was that's where the assault on um, I think, gender, marriage, redefining certain things that um that I think previous generations had accepted, even if they weren't Christian. And so my generation was the generation that grew up questioning everything. And now, so now I think y'all's generation is it's it's in that cycle. Hard times, strong people, strong people. Then you follow it, and we live in this really soft, easy society where it was interesting. Wasn't it interesting when Paco and Duke said uh their kids don't want to? Yeah, yeah, they're like, I don't want to do it.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Well, I think also it's like I've seen this a lot. So millennials are the generation. Are you millennial? I'm like right on the line. Cusper. I'm just kidding. But it's millennials and Gen Z. And like millennials are now at the point where they're starting to have kids and they're all about like gentle parenting and participation awards, and like, no, it's okay, like you're fine, you're fine. Because I think their parents were a little bit more harsh on them. So then they're like, like you said, it just goes with the cycle.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_03And I think Gen Z, I feel like Gen Z is kind of split. Some of them I think can be in that way, and then some of them can be cutthroat.
SPEAKER_02Like, yeah, it's a really interesting combination.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Well, the thing that is true is that in every single generation, I think the Lord will always have a remnant of faithful people that aren't shaped by culture. 100% that bring the light to the darkness. My grandparents' generation, the Depression, World War II generation, you have people doing that. My generation, you have people doing that. Y'all's generation, you have people doing that.
SPEAKER_04Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Uh, that will always be true. And that's what Snowbird exists to to engage the darkness and to raise that remnant, train,
Technology Dependence And Lost Initiative
SPEAKER_00equip. Um yeah. But but I'll I mean, I'll be honest. I don't want to be critical. I love the people that serve here, but I will say it is a much greater struggle than it's ever been, especially with the young men that come to the institute, to just be able to sit down and have a conversation and not be like to be able to go past the surface. It's hard. Yeah. And it's something that we are committed to try to train and to try to train and shape these guys. But um, that was something that if you go back in other generations, it I think it happened more organically, just in the flow of well, I think that's the big hindrance of social media.
SPEAKER_03You don't have to. If you go anywhere on a train, on a plane, on an air airport, like wherever everyone's just here and no one's speaking, you know. Like I'll I'll speak to someone and they'll literally look at me sideways, like, why are you talking to me? Like today, I was just at the post office and like me and this girl got there at the same time. I was like, Oh, you want to go, I go. And she literally was like, What are you doing? And just walked past me. I was like, Okay. Joke didn't land. That's okay.
SPEAKER_00Uh yeah, everything's connected. I drove from here to Boca Raton, Florida, 13 hours last week. And what I did was I looked at a map, memorized my route, and never turned my phone on. I was like, I just want to make sure I can still do this. Yeah. Because that's my whole life, that's the way you got from point A to point B. You kept I used to keep a big roadmap book.
SPEAKER_02An atlas.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, an atlas in my in my truck. And I'm like, ah, and I can remember whoever, if you're two of you, somebody's driving, somebody's got the highlighter, and they're like, oh no, I think we ought to be coming up. You're you're looking at the gate, you know, the the coat, the whatever the thing is, the little pass key, and you're trying to figure out, okay, I think it's six miles.
SPEAKER_02You were navigating.
SPEAKER_00You're navigating, you're the navigator. And so uh, yeah, there is a dependency to receive information right here, right now. Sure. How many times you're sitting around and somebody says, Hey, who was it that I don't know? Let me Google it. Yeah. Happens all the time. Yep.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. I've had to start intentionally not doing that of just, oh, I wonder if blah, blah, blah. It's like, I don't know. And then try to talk about it for a little bit. And then if we're really still curious, look it up.
SPEAKER_00Then we go look it up. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Somebody, somebody said, uh, oh, I know it was like got down there, me and and and I watched Tuck's first practice, and then afterwards, uh, he's got a teammate. We jump in the truck. This guy is a tight end, he's 6'7, 265, like massive human. And I think if there's anybody that ought to be able to take care of themselves, it's this guy. And I realized this dude, he's awesome and he's really fun, but he's like a 14-year-old. He said, Tuck drives us, he was like, ah, we're gonna eat, we'll go to such and such. And here we go. And the guy's like, Well, you know how to get there? Tuck's like, Yeah, yeah, what do you mean do I know how to get there? It's in our town. Like, what are you talking about? So I told the guy, I was like, hey, dude, what if I told you I just drove from Andrews, North Carolina here?
SPEAKER_03Without using without using a phone.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. He was like, my no way, that's not possible. So I think there's a a weird dependency that is inhibiting. So then back to the heart of this conversation, we make a big decision, go into the unknown.
SPEAKER_03That is like you haven't done it your whole life. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Yeah, it it's very like destabilizing.
SPEAKER_02Oh, yeah. And there's a one part of my story I forgot to mention that I wanted to bring up, especially toward the end of the conversation here, because I think it's it's just how the Lord has sustained me through it. Um, it was during orientation. I walked out of my cabin that first morning, and I was kind of just in, I had had a good habit of reading my Bible every morning. But that morning I just walked out of my cabin. I'm like, I don't know what's going on, but I got my backpack, I'm ready to jump into whatever we're doing. And I walked out of my cabin probably 30 minutes before session or whatever started, and I started looking around, and everybody was out reading their Bibles somewhere on campus. And I was kind of like a little convicted, like, I should stop and do this too. I have 20 minutes, I can do this. Um, so I sat down on a bench, one of those stone benches across from Ariel Park next to the creek. And I opened up and I read Psalm one, which has spoken to me pretty heavily throughout my life. Um, but I just read through it again, and it's talking about And you're by a stream of water. By a stream of water, exactly. So I'm reading it, and it's you know, uh, blessed is the man who does this, the wicked are not so, all that. But it says, um, blessed is the man, you know, who uh meditates on scripture. I I'm forgetting the exact wordage of it right now.
SPEAKER_00Um meditates on it day and night.
SPEAKER_02Meditates on it day and night. Here I'm just gonna read it. Just give me a second.
SPEAKER_00On this law, he meditates day and night. He's like a tree planted, brings forth his fruit in season, and whose leaf does not wither.
SPEAKER_02And as I'm reading that, um Um, it just felt like the Lord was telling me, like, okay, we're here, we're here now. This is what we're doing. Um, but you need me, you need to be in your Bible, you need scripture. Um, but if you do, like you are gonna be this tree planted by streams of water bearing fruit in season. And he's encouraged me that way with that verse before, but it just hit sitting next to the creek at the cusp of this new chapter. Um, and it's been true. Like he has, it has been an integral part being in scripture, relying on him, trusting him. And throughout my entire time
Psalm 1 And Being Sustained Daily
SPEAKER_02here, whatever situations I'm going through, like he'll speak into it through scripture, and it's been huge. So, again, just with the the life decision thing, the big decisions. Um, at the end of the day, charge through the door, but you need to rely on on Christ in the midst of it every step of the way. He's the only one that's going to sustain you.
SPEAKER_00Yes. I'd like to say something to parents. I think the I've waited till last to say this. I think the biggest problem is parenting. A kid that's scared to to take that step or that's unstable without their you know, connection to technology, or that just doesn't have drive and motivation, you know, they say that that like in males, testosterone levels are all time low because the things that generate generate that growth, they don't do it the hard things physically, the hard things mentally. Yeah, don't do it. And the as a as a dad and now a granddad, what I've learned is parents are either the greatest enabler or the greatest uh disabler. You can enable and empower your son or your daughter to do hard things like, but you know how many times we're talking to a kid whose parents don't want him to be here. And I'm like, and they're and and a lot of times Christian parents, Christian parents, they don't want him to leave home, or they convince them they need to make money, or there's a host of reasons. It could be I don't want them to leave home, I want to hang on to them, or it could be, now you can go up there and not make any money, just have a good time play at a camp. Like, because there there are a lot of stereotypes that go with the word camp. You can go work at a camp. A lot of times I don't even use that word when I'm talking to somebody because of the stereotypes associated with it. But the we're watching, watching that extraction reality show, and there's two seasons, and we watch, we've we've been into it as a family. We watched one episode, I mean the one season and now we're on the the other one. Both episodes, there is, and I won't go into the synopsis of what the game is, but there's two different scenes in both seasons in episode one where these 18, 19-year-old young men talk to their parents like they're dogs. And the parents just enable and facilitate and bail them out of a not even a hard situation. A little uncomfortable, these boys in this reality show get put in this little bit uncomfortable situation, and their parents just and they and I thought, man, those parents have just set those boys back a decade, if not more, if not change the course of their life. Best thing you do is push them to do go do something hard and um and and let them fail and let them fall. And I think what I would challenge parents to do is help your kids fail well or they'll fail poorly.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Because everybody's gonna fail. You're gonna make mistakes, you're gonna fail, you're gonna fall on your fa on your face. If you try to keep them from failure, then they'll end up failing ultimately. If you teach them how to fail good and learn from it and get up and grow and and and uh become a better person because of it, um, then they're gonna be better off. And that takes letting them make some mistakes and feeling the repercussions of that too.
SPEAKER_03That's right.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. Yep.
SPEAKER_03That's good.
SPEAKER_04Something else. I'm good.
SPEAKER_03Yeah. Or grateful for Carter. Well, actually, one more thing about Carter, and this kind of plays into the conversation, but not really. It's me just hyping Carter up. But I think it there is stuff to say that Carter is 28. He's older than some of the people over him. Like, technically, I'm over Carter. He's older than me, but he is such a humble guy and just works hard regardless. Like, I think I don't think many guys could do that and work so hard and so humbly. And you're such an asset to our team. And so I also want to encourage you in that way because there's so many guys that, you know, if a woman or I don't even know, not even a woman, just a guy that's younger than them, or like, you know, and he just works without even batting an eye and just works so hard. So that's definitely has stuff to say about your character. And, you know, you see the mission of Snowbird and you're on board to work, whether whatever position you're in and wherever you're placed. So thanks.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, it's a good team to be a part of.
SPEAKER_00It is, and that's why I want people to be encouraged by that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_00That we're there's a lot of people here that if if you're discouraged with where this generation's at,
Parenting That Teaches Kids To Fail
SPEAKER_00there's always gonna be a remnant. Yeah, and Snowbird gets to see the fruit of that. Yeah, and there are young men and young women who are men and women in their 20s that are getting it done here. And I'm just yep, I'm proud to be associated with it. Somebody asked me the other day, are you getting old? And I was like, I'm not gonna say I'm old, I'm not young. But I'm surrounded by 25-year-olds and 22-year-olds, 30-year-olds, and um, it doesn't keep me young. It reminds me that I'm not young, but it keeps me from having a mindset of, well, I'm old, I need to start to let off the gas. Because my generation, where we're at, the season of life that we're now in, people start coasting, man. Start coasting, dealing with the family right now where the dad is my age, and I went and met with him the other day. And I was like, what are you doing? What are you doing? And so every generation is gonna face unique challenges and the same challenges as the previous generation. There's always gonna be those that are unique to this generation, there's always gonna be human human behavior. It's it's another thing, another principle from Ecclesiastes. There's nothing new under the sun. Right. There's literally, I mean, in ancient Israel, there was some of the same struggles we see now. But then also every generation has completely new struggles. And yeah, both of y'all are like motivation for me every day to get up and get going. And our listeners, JB, how many grown men have come up to you? Yeah, whether it's at a camp, uh, a youth camp where they're a leader or at a men's conference and be like, You're JB?
SPEAKER_03I always joke and say, Be strong is my biggest event. It's crazy. Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But it's because um we are hungry for young men and women that are like give us encouragement to know, okay, we're leaving this thing in good hands. Every generation, God's gonna shape uh with a remnant who's gonna impact that generation with the gospel.
SPEAKER_04Right.
SPEAKER_00Um that's part of our mission statement. Yeah. Equip the church in this generation. It's timeless in that sense.
Final Encouragement And Closing CTA
SPEAKER_00Cool.
SPEAKER_03So yeah, thanks, Carter, for coming on.
SPEAKER_01Thanks for listening to No Sanity Required. Please take a moment to subscribe and leave a rating. It really helps. Visit us at swoutfitters.com to see all of our programming and resources. And we'll see you next week on No Sanity Required.